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denime
01-23-2012, 06:41 AM
Mornin`




TFC TV (http://torontofc.neulion.com/tfc/console.jsp)



Fletcher: Filling the holes (http://www.sportsnet.ca/soccer/2012/01/22/fletcher_blog/)


Canada faces tougher test against Costa Rica (http://www.torontosun.com/2012/01/22/canada-faces-tougher-test-against-costa-rica)




TFC related blogs ! (http://www.redpatchboys.ca/forums/showthread.php?t=29582)




SUNSHINE (http://www.torontosun.com/sunshine-girl)


_

J .
01-23-2012, 06:59 AM
Wowing @ the Fletcher article... Soolsma steady? Ok lets have another embarassing season in the attack...Avila... ready to start? Can he score? Nope. Did he rack up assist? Not that I recall... so another embarassing season in the attack... check x2.

When will we have someone in the news finally print the truth. TFC are still woefully underprepared, lack depth, lack quality depth and still remains the team that last season was an embarassing disaster in the back end, didnt score enough and was embarassed way to many times to be considered competitive.

Ossington Mental Youth
01-23-2012, 07:47 AM
because not everyone believes that to be the case.
You watched teh second half of the season last year right?

Oldtimer
01-23-2012, 08:33 AM
Avila is actually quite important in stretching the defense. Could there be an upgrade? For sure, but with every MLS roster you need to make compromises. That's the reality of the cap.

ensco
01-23-2012, 08:36 AM
I have no idea why anyone would think that Soolsma starts over RJ.

Darlofletch
01-23-2012, 08:52 AM
I have no idea why anyone would think that Soolsma starts over RJ.

right wing was the one position where johnson didn't impress last year. a pity really as that's the one out of the 4 attacking spots where there's really an opening.

and as for soolsma being steady? yes, that's exactly what he is, which isn't really good enough, thus let's give lambe a chance to claim that spot. If he turns out like Martina or Marosevic, and too inconsistent, we can fall back to the default of soolsma, it's not perfect, and I'd rather not have to, but he's a reliable, just about good enough, option.

ensco
01-23-2012, 09:11 AM
right wing was the one position where johnson didn't impress last year. a pity really as that's the one out of the 4 attacking spots where there's really an opening.
.

I don't recall that. He played everywhere in SJ.

I think we can get hung up a bit on position/formation arcana. He is a waaaaay better football player than Soolsma, and should play ahead of him.

Greatest Ripoff
01-23-2012, 09:18 AM
Wowing @ the Fletcher article... Soolsma steady? Ok lets have another embarassing season in the attack...Avila... ready to start? Can he score? Nope. Did he rack up assist? Not that I recall... so another embarassing season in the attack... check x2.

If you look at the stats from last year, Soolsma has the exact same as Plata but with less games played. Avila got 1 goal and 1 assist in 9 games. But I do remember his getting at least 1 MOTM.

PopePouri
01-23-2012, 09:29 AM
Wowing @ the Fletcher article... Soolsma steady? Ok lets have another embarassing season in the attack...Avila... ready to start? Can he score? Nope. Did he rack up assist? Not that I recall... so another embarassing season in the attack... check x2.

When will we have someone in the news finally print the truth. TFC are still woefully underprepared, lack depth, lack quality depth and still remains the team that last season was an embarassing disaster in the back end, didnt score enough and was embarassed way to many times to be considered competitive.

Plata didn't score much in the league. I doubt Moneyball works for football.

Canary10
01-23-2012, 09:35 AM
Wowing @ the Fletcher article... Soolsma steady? Ok lets have another embarassing season in the attack...Avila... ready to start? Can he score? Nope. Did he rack up assist? Not that I recall... so another embarassing season in the attack... check x2.

When will we have someone in the news finally print the truth. TFC are still woefully underprepared, lack depth, lack quality depth and still remains the team that last season was an embarassing disaster in the back end, didnt score enough and was embarassed way to many times to be considered competitive.


Wtf? What world are you living in? The one thing we won't have is an "embarassing season on the attack." This team is built back to front to score goals. We'll score lots of them.

Canary10
01-23-2012, 09:39 AM
Btw, I'd play Johnson mainly in the number 10. He looked very good there last year. I think people are rating Soolsma a little low. He's not the kind of player that runs at defenders like Plata (and probably Lambe), but he makes his space, puts pretty good crosses in and defends very well. He's a different type of option than Plata or Lambe.

scooter
01-23-2012, 09:42 AM
mornin d

Ultra & Proud
01-23-2012, 10:21 AM
Btw, I'd play Johnson mainly in the number 10. He looked very good there last year. I think people are rating Soolsma a little low. He's not the kind of player that runs at defenders like Plata (and probably Lambe), but he makes his space, puts pretty good crosses in and defends very well. He's a different type of option than Plata or Lambe.


+1 for all of the above. Dead on.

Roogsy
01-23-2012, 10:23 AM
Wtf? What world are you living in? The one thing we won't have is an "embarassing season on the attack." This team is built back to front to score goals. We'll score lots of them.


And give up a ton as well.

Canary10
01-23-2012, 10:33 AM
^ That may be. We'll see.

Yohan
01-23-2012, 10:41 AM
Don't get the hate on Soolsma. Yeah, he's not flashy, but his stuff has substenance. His MLS stats are same as Plata's, 3 goals 5 assists. One of his underrated skill is that he seems to catch opposition off guard with his positioning on offence, esp making himself available for cross field passes. (and he still beats his defender 1v1 with that simple trick of his most of the time)

The lad is only 24, and he's got a season of MLS under belt, so he's adapted to the league now. I think the lad deserves more credit and chance.

Ageroo
01-23-2012, 10:41 AM
And give up a ton as well.

His post was referencing attack....don't go off topic Roogs......:D

Whoop
01-23-2012, 10:56 AM
Don't get the hate on Soolsma. Yeah, he's not flashy, but his stuff has substenance. His MLS stats are same as Plata's, 3 goals 5 assists. One of his underrated skill is that he seems to catch opposition off guard with his positioning on offence, esp making himself available for cross field passes. (and he still beats his defender 1v1 with that simple trick of his most of the time)

The lad is only 24, and he's got a season of MLS under belt, so he's adapted to the league now. I think the lad deserves more credit and chance.

I think a lot of it has to do with how he doesn't look like a player especially with his lack of speed.

I mean it's like watching molasses but somehow he gets the job done effectively along the wing.

At the end of the day though, he's still a bench guy not a starter.

__wowza
01-23-2012, 10:59 AM
I think a lot of it has to do with how he doesn't look like a player especially with his lack of speed.

I mean it's like watching molasses but somehow he gets the job done effectively along the wing.

At the end of the day though, he's still a bench guy not a starter.

it's stuff like this i don't understand.
soolsma, in less games, has the exact same stats as plata. he's got 3 goals, 5 assists AND a higher pass completion rate. what constitutes him as a bench guy compared to a player we had our nuts in a vice trying to sign?

Whoop
01-23-2012, 11:05 AM
You have to dig deeper under the surface for the stats.

They might have the same number but when were the goals scored? When were the assists made? Was it crucial times or were games out of reach at that point?

Not all stats are the same.

starter
01-23-2012, 11:13 AM
If Soolsma continues to develop, as he did last season, he will become a core player at the club.

Dv23
01-23-2012, 11:19 AM
Soolsma is one of those tricky players that I continue to oscillate between like and dislike towards. Sometimes I think he provides a great presence on the field, other times I ask what the **** he's doing there.

JonO
01-23-2012, 11:24 AM
I think we have to accept players with their flaws or else, to be honest, they would be plying their trade in a better league. Soolsma continues to be an enigma to be. I've spend a few games watching just him and, while he seems slow and plodding, more often than not he beats his man and puts in a decent cross. If he manages to improve on his shot, I will be happy with him. He gives us a nice option on the wing and seemed to work well with Eckersly.

Ajax TFC
01-23-2012, 11:30 AM
You have to dig deeper under the surface for the stats.

They might have the same number but when were the goals scored? When were the assists made? Was it crucial times or were games out of reach at that point?

Not all stats are the same.

don't remember all of Plata's, but Soolsma's first goal was a game winning penalty (which he had to take twice) against Vancouver a couple days before the NCC final. His second goal was the go ahead goal vs the Crew. His third goal was the go ahead against the Revs in the last game of the season.

I don't remember all the assists, but I do remember him setting up Koevermans a few times including the cross to put TFC up 2-0 vs Colorado. He also assisted Johnson's tying goal vs Phily
there was also that assist for Santos *shutter* against Vancouver to tie up the first leg of the NCC final.

sure he's not fast, but his movement is intelligent and his crosses are good

TFCREDNWHITE
01-23-2012, 11:31 AM
Until something better comes along, soolsma will have to do. In winters 4-3-3 possession is paramount, and soolsma is capable of holding on to the ball and not kicking it away like a little bitch! He stands tall and isn't afraid of no punk mls players, and for that he gets a tip of the hat.

Yohan
01-23-2012, 11:33 AM
You have to dig deeper under the surface for the stats.

They might have the same number but when were the goals scored? When were the assists made? Was it crucial times or were games out of reach at that point?

Not all stats are the same.
Nick Soolsma
7 May: 2-1 W vs Houston, 1 assist (won a PK that Plata converted)
14 May: 2-2 D vs Chicago, 1 assist (assist on Plata goal for 1st goal)
25 June: 3-1 L @ RSL, 1 assist (assist on Santos consolation)
29 June: 1-0 W vs Vancouver, 1 goal (PK)
10 Sept: 4-2 w @ Columbus, 1 goal (First goal of the match)
17 Sept: 2-1 W vs Colorado, 1 assist (assist on Koevermans 2nd goal)
15 Oct: 1-1 D @ Philadelphia, 1 assist (on Johnson game tying goal)
22 Oct: 2-2 D vs New England, 1 goal (first goal of the game)

Except for 1 assist vs RSL, all of Soolsma's goals and assists were 'meaningful'.

If you observe Soolsma closely, he doesn't do a lot of fancy stuff, but his basic technical skills are very solid. He's comfortable with the ball. He does the basic things well. He pops up at right place at the right time. Despite his only average pace, he can beat a player 1v1 (see assist on Johnson goal vs Philly). TFC can do a lot worse for starting winger in MLS. In fact, I will say that if he stays in MLS, he will have a very solid career in this league. (see van den Bergh, Dave)

Roogsy
01-23-2012, 11:35 AM
Nick Soolsma
7 May: 2-1 W vs Houston, 1 assist (won a PK that Plata converted)
14 May: 2-2 D vs Chicago, 1 assist (assist on Plata goal for 1st goal)
25 June: 3-1 L @ RSL, 1 assist (assist on Santos consolation)
29 June: 1-0 W vs Vancouver, 1 goal (PK)
10 Sept: 4-2 w @ Columbus, 1 goal (First goal of the match)
17 Sept: 2-1 W vs Colorado, 1 assist (assist on Koevermans 2nd goal)
15 Oct: 1-1 D @ Philadelphia, 1 assist (on Johnson game tying goal)
22 Oct: 2-2 D vs New England, 1 goal (first goal of the game)

Except for 1 assist vs RSL, all of Soolsma's goals and assists were 'meaningful'.

If you observe Soolsma closely, he doesn't do a lot of fancy stuff, but his basic technical skills are very solid. He's comfortable with the ball. He does the basic things well. Despite his only average pace, he can beat a player 1v1 (see assist on Johnson goal vs Philly). TFC can do a lot worse for starting winger in MLS

I think Soolsma is a very serviceable player. Nothing flashy. Steady-eddy. Gotta have this type on an MLS club. Not expensive, not going to win you games on his own, but he's not supposed to.

And he's a big boy. His physical attributes are needed in this league.

AlanO
01-23-2012, 11:43 AM
I think Soolsma is a very serviceable player. Nothing flashy. Steady-eddy. Gotta have this type on an MLS club. Not expensive, not going to win you games on his own, but he's not supposed to.

And he's a big boy. His physical attributes are needed in this league.

Yeah exactly.

I also like how he brings a different dimension to the forward line. Plata (and probably Lambe) takes on defenders 1-on-1 and tries to beat them, whereas Soolsma usually just tries to get enough separation from the fullback to deliver a cross into the box. He's reasonably effective at it too.

Soolsma's no superstar, but he's not a bad option, and was linking up well with Koevermans last year. Winter can switch him up with Lambe on the right wing to give defenders a different "look".

ManUtd4ever
01-23-2012, 11:49 AM
Ideally, Soolsma will be a solid option off the bench on the wings, and he also demonstrated last season that he can fill in admirably as an occasional starter.

jabbronies
01-23-2012, 02:02 PM
Soolsma is slower than molasses, but somehow he manages to move the ball quiet efficiently.

Yohan
01-23-2012, 02:27 PM
Soolsma is slower than molasses, but somehow he manages to move the ball quiet efficiently.
he's got an average speed. he just looks deceptively slow

at least he's not like rohan ricketts who beats a player but the defender catches up to him and he has to beat the same player again

denime
01-23-2012, 03:14 PM
^This

mowe
01-23-2012, 04:02 PM
People keep saying Soolsma is slow, but he's shown that he can consistently beat his defender and get crosses into the box. What else do you need pace for? Seeing as he's one of the best crossers in this team I don't mind him starting. Although ideally him and Lambe would be pushing each other in practice every day.

__wowza
01-23-2012, 04:39 PM
People keep saying Soolsma is slow, but he's shown that he can consistently beat his defender and get crosses into the box. What else do you need pace for?

we need pace because danny k is incredibly fast (in case you forgot), he can beat any defender to the ball with ease!! soolsma is more of our style right now until we get someone with legs up front. yes, plata does provide for a wicked counter attack, but at the speed he's going there's no one up there with him.

and we wonder why he tries to beat defenses 1-v-1 and score?

DangerRed
01-23-2012, 04:46 PM
I've crawled out of my troll cave to remind everyone of one thing that seems to get forgotten, year in, year out, in every offseason discussion...

It is the definition of stupidity to repeat the same actions, with the same variables, and expect a different result.

We've dropped a lot of dead wood between the end of the season and now, but the guys who are charged with most of the heavy lifting at TFC (ie putting the ball in the net, and keeping it out of our own) are still largely the same.

Barring any unforeseen signings between now and April -- or some seriously strident LEAPS in the development of our players -- I'd say our 2012 season will not look tremendously different from the second half of the last one...

pdogg
01-23-2012, 04:53 PM
It is the definition of stupidity to repeat the same actions, with the same variables, and expect a different result.

I think for the most part our status quo has been to turnover a large portion of the team in the off-season. This year we have a large number of our key players returning and many of the supporting players who are now familiar with our system coming back as well (at least in the front 6). The defence is getting some fresh names and we are hopefully adding better players than the ones we let go.

prizby
01-23-2012, 04:57 PM
we need pace because danny k is incredibly fast (in case you forgot), he can beat any defender to the ball with ease!! soolsma is more of our style right now until we get someone with legs up front. yes, plata does provide for a wicked counter attack, but at the speed he's going there's no one up there with him.

and we wonder why he tries to beat defenses 1-v-1 and score?

frankly, if you re-watch the goal he scored against NYRB...Tim Ream top speed was similar to Koef's...and now Ream is going to the epl...he's gonna be eaten alive by any half decent paced attacker

Yohan
01-23-2012, 05:05 PM
GG-jMjvnua8&f

oh dear lord

Greatest Ripoff
01-23-2012, 05:09 PM
Barring any unforeseen signings between now and April -- or some seriously strident LEAPS in the development of our players -- I'd say our 2012 season will not look tremendously different from the second half of the last one...


And if you look at August, September and October, Toronto player 18 matches. In those 3 months they went 7w, 4l, and 7d. That would amount to 28 points. If they could keep up that form up all season long then they would end up with 56 points. KC finished in first place in the east last year with 51 point.

Yohan
01-23-2012, 05:18 PM
PnT79EWRxsE&

prizby
01-23-2012, 05:22 PM
GG-jMjvnua8&f

oh dear lord

i can't believe i just wasted 2 mins of my life watching this

Blizzard
01-23-2012, 06:01 PM
don't remember all of Plata's, but Soolsma's first goal was a game winning penalty (which he had to take twice) against Vancouver a couple days before the NCC final. His second goal was the go ahead goal vs the Crew. His third goal was the go ahead against the Revs in the last game of the season.

I don't remember all the assists, but I do remember him setting up Koevermans a few times including the cross to put TFC up 2-0 vs Colorado. He also assisted Johnson's tying goal vs Phily
there was also that assist for Santos *shutter* against Vancouver to tie up the first leg of the NCC final.

sure he's not fast, but his movement is intelligent and his crosses are good

.... and that wonderful assist on the Santos goal in the NCC final doesn't even appear in the stats quoted here as those stats are only the league. Of course, Plata scored four goals in the CCL that don't show in the stats either.

In any case, I appreciate what Soolsma has been able to do. His wheels may not be the fastest but he seems to have a good sense of the game and he is making the most of his abilities.

DangerRed
01-23-2012, 06:06 PM
And if you look at August, September and October, Toronto player 18 matches. In those 3 months they went 7w, 4l, and 7d. That would amount to 28 points. If they could keep up that form up all season long then they would end up with 56 points. KC finished in first place in the east last year with 51 point.

You and I define "half" differently, it seems.

But anyway, I'm hoping for the best. Just not really expecting it.

brad
01-23-2012, 06:08 PM
You have to dig deeper under the surface for the stats.

They might have the same number but when were the goals scored? When were the assists made? Was it crucial times or were games out of reach at that point?

Not all stats are the same.

I do agree with this, and it's interesting if you dig deeper into the limited data we do have.

Soolsma - 2 game winning assists, 1 game winning goal
Plata - 1 game winning assist, 1 game winning goal

prizby
01-23-2012, 06:12 PM
I do agree with this, and it's interesting if you dig deeper into the limited data we do have.

Soolsma - 2 game winning assists, 1 game winning goal
Plata - 1 game winning assist, 1 game winning goal

not counting CCL contributions though

ag futbol
01-23-2012, 06:21 PM
I've crawled out of my troll cave
Back to you're troll cave on whore island!

But seriously, you have a point. Even when we were winning I dreaded the thought of trying to find goals without Koevermans on the field. Not really sure what would help with that... set pieces could definitely be take up a notch or two, they were terrible last year.

Otherwise better support play from the mid or more danger from someone is the order of the day.

brad
01-23-2012, 06:40 PM
not counting CCL contributions though

Nope, but it doesn't detract from the point at hand - he was comparably effective in the league.

ensco
01-23-2012, 08:34 PM
I agree that Soolsma has some skills.

But when you compare him to the wingers on good teams ... Will Johnson, or Rosales in Seattle for instance (that is a guy I would love to have here btw) ... Soolsma's footspeed is so awful, that I don't think he can be play serious minutes for a winning team.

Greatest Ripoff
01-23-2012, 08:37 PM
You and I define "half" differently, it seems.

But anyway, I'm hoping for the best. Just not really expecting it.

18 matches is exactly half a season. I just counted the last 18 matches they played.

Yohan
01-23-2012, 08:42 PM
I agree that Soolsma has some skills.

But when you compare him to the wingers on good teams ... Will Johnson, or Rosales in Seattle for instance (that is a guy I would love to have here btw) ... Soolsma's footspeed is so awful, that I don't think he can be play serious minutes for a winning team.
bit unfair to compare Soolsma to Rosales IMO

but I think Johnson is faster, but Soolsma has better technical skills. IMO Johnson's crossing and passing skills aren't very good

jloome
01-23-2012, 09:56 PM
bit unfair to compare Soolsma to Rosales IMO

but I think Johnson is faster, but Soolsma has better technical skills. IMO Johnson's crossing and passing skills aren't very good

I think the notion that Soolsma is slow is nonsense to begin with. Number of guys he beat on the wing, he's got a good first gear. Plus, he's a smart player. And you're right, Will Johnson is not a consistent player.

rocker
01-23-2012, 10:15 PM
There was a game near the end of the year where Soolsma played well and I particularly noticed that he wasn't slower than the opposition. He was fine in that regard.

He's useful. His ball control is excellent, much better than the typical MLSer full of athleticism but short on ball skills.

ensco
01-23-2012, 10:37 PM
OK. Soolsma played 1,578 minutes last year. I'll wager any of you guys a pint that he gets less than 1,200 minutes in 2012.

Yohan
01-23-2012, 10:39 PM
OK. Soolsma played 1,578 minutes last year. I'll wager any of you guys a pint that he gets less than 1,200 minutes in 2012.
you're on

ArmenJBX
01-23-2012, 10:52 PM
Soolsma will get more than 1200, if for no other reason than the fact that he is a solid backup on either wing

ag futbol
01-23-2012, 11:42 PM
Wtf? What world are you living in? The one thing we won't have is an "embarassing season on the attack." This team is built back to front to score goals. We'll score lots of them.
Well actually....... despite the sales pitch on the design the stats say we scored the second fewest goals in MLS all of last season. While I agree the attack isn't likely to be embarrassing, it will have to improve.

Roogsy
01-23-2012, 11:51 PM
And if you look at August, September and October, Toronto player 18 matches. In those 3 months they went 7w, 4l, and 7d. That would amount to 28 points. If they could keep up that form up all season long then they would end up with 56 points. KC finished in first place in the east last year with 51 point.

That's interesting math considering we played 34 games in 2011 not 36.

Selective sampling can always prove anything you choose. Since Frings and Koevermans arrived we also moved down in the table. How do we interpret that?

Waggy
01-24-2012, 12:01 AM
That's interesting math considering we played 34 games in 2011 not 36.

Selective sampling can always prove anything you choose. Since Frings and Koevermans arrived we also moved down in the table. How do we interpret that?

The giving up on the MLS season to concentrate on CCL/see what existing players potential was/what roles they were suited for? When the A team was out there the offense was dangerous consistently.

Whoop
01-24-2012, 12:14 AM
OK. Soolsma played 1,578 minutes last year. I'll wager any of you guys a pint that he gets less than 1,200 minutes in 2012.

I can see that.

As the team is being built, you figure it should be improving, if it's improving, he'll get less minutes than last year.

Question:

Is Soolsma a core piece to build around? On this team who is?

Ultimately Soolsma will be a very good player off the bench when Winter needs to change things up. But not a starter.

If he's a starter, the team isn't improving really.

ensco
01-24-2012, 07:41 AM
you're on

Done

Fort York Redcoat
01-24-2012, 07:51 AM
OK. Soolsma played 1,578 minutes last year. I'll wager any of you guys a pint that he gets less than 1,200 minutes in 2012.


you're on

witnessed. Now which of you will remember this in 10 months time:D

brad
01-24-2012, 08:56 AM
I can see that.

As the team is being built, you figure it should be improving, if it's improving, he'll get less minutes than last year.

Question:

Is Soolsma a core piece to build around? On this team who is?

Ultimately Soolsma will be a very good player off the bench when Winter needs to change things up. But not a starter.

If he's a starter, the team isn't improving really.

Improving the team is about juggling limited resources. They could, for example, choose to invest resources into improving the backline instead of improving Soolsma's position, and that could very well improve the team.

From what I recall, Soolsma's performances started to improve near the end of last season and I also recall hearing about it being around an attitude re-adjustment. I'm curious to see what he can bring this year.

J .
01-25-2012, 03:27 AM
Soolsma is at best a player to come off the bench and last year we had no one else who could really play that position. Martina was shockingly worse than Soolsma and that doesnt mean Soolsma was good enough. Eventually with all the minutes he played he was going to get some assists and in his position he has to score goals.

We need four players who can score, the two wingers, the attacking mid and the central forward. Its not enough to count on DK to score. As it currently stands we will have a problem scoring or we will push so many players forward we will leave our defense exposed like we did all last year and that meant we gave up the most goals we ever have.