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ginkster88
01-05-2012, 10:55 AM
Just received this message:

"Hi Gavin,

I tried reaching you earlier as your name has come up on our season ticket waiting list.

For the 2012 season we decided to expand our season seat base which presents a unique opportunity to grab seats that in previous years were never available. With that said, tickets are very limited and are going to move quickly this week.

If interested in getting off that waiting list and joining us for 2012 please respond to this email or call me directly at 416-360-4625 x5397. From there we can discuss the options to see if there is a fit for you.

Thanks,"

It's January.

Kickoff is in two months-ish.

What are they doing still hawking seasons?

Huyton
01-05-2012, 11:19 AM
Last chance to get them, perhaps, before partial packs are sold to the Gold and Red lists?

ginkster88
01-05-2012, 11:24 AM
^In previous years this would never have been a problem, and they'd have tried to force a partial/ransom pack down my throat.

Captain
01-05-2012, 11:27 AM
Speaking of partial packs, when will they be available? Last year I had to make the first payment before Christmas. It's January and no contact yet. Do they really not want my money?

ginkster88
01-05-2012, 11:28 AM
Soon they'll be calling/emailing you trying to sign you up for seasons a la me.

Oldtimer
01-05-2012, 11:41 AM
They should have cut prices. Their greed is biting them back.

mastermixer
01-05-2012, 12:42 PM
They should have cut prices. Their greed is biting them back.

Even more hind site... instead of cutting prices now, they should have never jacked up the prices the way they did. Way too much too soon. We've all said this a thousand times on here. They underestimated the fan base, but overestimated the price the fans would pay.

sloangraham
01-05-2012, 12:42 PM
Just received this message:
For the 2012 season we decided to expand our season seat base which presents a unique opportunity to grab seats that in previous years were never available.

I was curious and put in a phone call. This is just the north stands. Apparently they have about 200 left. Yikes.

I still don't understand why they won't open up the accessible seating on top of the south end to SSH. Surely they don't need that much accessible seating.

ginkster88
01-05-2012, 12:49 PM
I was curious and put in a phone call. This is just the north stands. Apparently they have about 200 left. Yikes.

I still don't understand why they won't open up the accessible seating on top of the south end to SSH. Surely they don't need that much accessible seating.

Very interesting.

Looks like they've completely abandoned saving the North for walk-ups and just want to lock the revenue in.

Makes sense seeing as they were basically giving them away last year; better to gouge more SSHs by making them pay upfront.

Roogsy
01-05-2012, 12:54 PM
Even more hind site... instead of cutting prices now, they should have never jacked up the prices the way they did. Way too much too soon. We've all said this a thousand times on here. They underestimated the fan base, but overestimated the price the fans would pay.

This...

Does someone feel like sending Paul B and Tom A a definition of "Supply and Demand" given that this was their philosophy when it suited them?

prizby
01-05-2012, 03:10 PM
i use to get emails...now i get none...

Huyton
01-05-2012, 03:24 PM
The North End seats aren't too bad.

If you actually want season tickets, and perhaps they presume that if you're on a waiting list, you'll probably want seasons tickets, then it's a lot cheaper going there than to the Reds.

It gets you into the relocation event next year, too.

And Cupholders!


If there's only a couple of hundred seats left up there, then they've done a reasonable job of pricing them. Not perfect, but a lot better than the previous year.

glaze
01-05-2012, 03:39 PM
I agree. Plus the stadium will look and feel alot better with a full north end. Would have preferred they priced it a bit lower, maybe at the same level as light grey. But it still is a better option of getting your foot in the door as an SSH than reds or dark greys.

nfitz
01-05-2012, 03:46 PM
I agree. Plus the stadium will look and feel alot better with a full north end. Would have preferred they priced it a bit lower, maybe at the same level as light grey. But it still is a better option of getting your foot in the door as an SSH than reds or dark greys.It's a cheaper option than medium-greys. I thought that the new low pricing on the North End was quite a deal ... a bit more than light-grey, but the views are a lot better than most of the light-grey seats.

Huyton
01-05-2012, 03:53 PM
If there are enough fans in the north stands who can make noise, it'd be great to see/hear The Massive done with NEE and the North Stand taking one side, and 111, 112 and 113 taking the other.

Blizzard
01-05-2012, 06:38 PM
It's a cheaper option than medium-greys. I thought that the new low pricing on the North End was quite a deal ... a bit more than light-grey, but the views are a lot better than most of the light-grey seats.

And better than the south end seats too. That additional height forced by the presence of the beer garden makes for a great viewing angle. It's like the end red mezzanine at the old Maple Leaf Gardens.

BeachTory
01-05-2012, 07:38 PM
I'm in the North side this year. I was told just before Christmas that not all the North end would be Seasons. When i went through the reallocation, they were very very options to expand my ticket package.
FWIW

BeachTory
01-05-2012, 07:41 PM
This...

Does someone feel like sending Paul B and Tom A a definition of "Supply and Demand" given that this was their philosophy when it suited them?

Well, just how elastic is your demand curve? You actually feel qualified to lecture them considering they have all the data ?

Brave

ensco
01-05-2012, 08:12 PM
There is nothing new to say about this, other than that they are slowly (very slowly) moving away from the "wannabe nightclub" model (where you make people stand behind a velvet rope and wait, but when you go inside the place is pretty empty), to something more reasonable.

Right now their biggest problem is that there is not enough differentiation between SSH and regular pricing in the more expensive seats. 20-25% isn't enough. It's cost them big money from their best customers, I (and several others I know) went from 4 to 2 seats in the reds and dark greys. To get me back to 4 seats, they will have to address this.

Chris Wren
01-05-2012, 08:27 PM
Just received this message:

"Hi Gavin,

I tried reaching you earlier as your name has come up on our season ticket waiting list.

For the 2012 season we decided to expand our season seat base which presents a unique opportunity to grab seats that in previous years were never available. With that said, tickets are very limited and are going to move quickly this week.

If interested in getting off that waiting list and joining us for 2012 please respond to this email or call me directly at 416-360-4625 x5397. From there we can discuss the options to see if there is a fit for you.

Thanks,"

It's January.

Kickoff is in two months-ish.

What are they doing still hawking seasons?

What am I missing here? They want to sell season tickets and they still have a couple months. What is the issue?

There is deserved negativity at times towards this club, and then there are other times when I'm not sure what the complaint is.

Klinsmann
01-05-2012, 08:28 PM
It's a cheaper option than medium-greys. I thought that the new low pricing on the North End was quite a deal ... a bit more than light-grey, but the views are a lot better than most of the light-grey seats.

Here's the view from my new Light Greys

http://a1.sphotos.ak.fbcdn.net/hphotos-ak-snc7/381665_10150978299800301_539170300_21570450_122923 5168_n.jpg

glaze
01-05-2012, 09:21 PM
Here's the view from my new Light Greys

http://a1.sphotos.ak.fbcdn.net/hphotos-ak-snc7/381665_10150978299800301_539170300_21570450_122923 5168_n.jpg

I think I saw you select those. My heart broke a bit, as I watched from the waiting area as someone selected the pair I had my eyes on in the previous appointment.

Faced with a choice of a pair of light grey in level 200 west stand, and a single in that corner, row 4, I took the single.

nfitz
01-05-2012, 09:24 PM
Here's the view from my new Light GreysLooks like near the first row of light-greys in 105, quite near 106. But those seats across from you in 106 are dark-grey! Yes, those are very good light-greys! I had a seat near the front of 220 near 221 last season, and they too were good light-greys. But compare to 104, 227, 219, the upper parts of 220, 226 ...

ginkster88
01-05-2012, 10:26 PM
What am I missing here? They want to sell season tickets and they still have a couple months. What is the issue?

There is deserved negativity at times towards this club, and then there are other times when I'm not sure what the complaint is.

There are two things:

1. Three years ago they would have called me in December to say "Hi TFC fan! We've partnered with the Marlies to give you the ultimate fan experience!!! Oh, but wait, there's more! You don't have a choice! If you want to go to see TFC you'll have to buy one of these price-inflated ticket packs!"

Now that they can't do that anymore they've come crawling back in January to say "Would you please buy some season tickets from us??"

2. Last season the North End was unavailable as season seats. The idea was that a walk-up crowd could purchase seats on gameday. This demand proved to be non-existent, and these seats and others were often offered at steeply discounted rates, some at or below what existing SSHs were paying or sat empty. This was not only a slap in the face to long-time SSHs, but a problem for MLSE. Now, rather than offering these seats at a discount or hoping that the walk-up demand will materialize out of thin air, they are stretching their waiting list to the max to add new SSHs who will purchase these seats and guarantee revenue.

In short, MLSE can get fucked.

glaze
01-05-2012, 10:51 PM
There are two things:

2. Last season the North End was unavailable as season seats. The idea was that a walk-up crowd could purchase seats on gameday. This demand proved to be non-existent, and these seats and others were often offered at steeply discounted rates, some at or below what existing SSHs were paying or sat empty. This was not only a slap in the face to long-time SSHs, but a problem for MLSE. Now, rather than offering these seats at a discount or hoping that the walk-up demand will materialize out of thin air, they are stretching their waiting list to the max to add new SSHs who will purchase these seats and guarantee revenue.



The flip side is there were many on the waiting list, such as myself, who waited years to get the call that they could become an SSH.
Last year I had a half-season, and was one of the people who for almost every game looked over at a half-full (if that) north end, wondering why those weren't available to potential SSH's.
While your points are 100% correct. There are many people, such as myself, who are pleased with the change of mind from MLSE, to allow more of us a chance to get in.
Considering last year I attended 85 per cent of the games, with half being the season seat, and the rest bought off the ticket exchange, I'm happy to get in at a much more affordable rate this year.
I think we'd all rather be sitting in a full stadium, and who better to fill it that new SSH's?

Chris Wren
01-05-2012, 11:05 PM
There are two things:

1. Three years ago they would have called me in December to say "Hi TFC fan! We've partnered with the Marlies to give you the ultimate fan experience!!! Oh, but wait, there's more! You don't have a choice! If you want to go to see TFC you'll have to buy one of these price-inflated ticket packs!"

Now that they can't do that anymore they've come crawling back in January to say "Would you please buy some season tickets from us??"

2. Last season the North End was unavailable as season seats. The idea was that a walk-up crowd could purchase seats on gameday. This demand proved to be non-existent, and these seats and others were often offered at steeply discounted rates, some at or below what existing SSHs were paying or sat empty. This was not only a slap in the face to long-time SSHs, but a problem for MLSE. Now, rather than offering these seats at a discount or hoping that the walk-up demand will materialize out of thin air, they are stretching their waiting list to the max to add new SSHs who will purchase these seats and guarantee revenue.

In short, MLSE can get fucked.

Okay.

phonzo
01-05-2012, 11:24 PM
There are two things:

1. Three years ago they would have called me in December to say "Hi TFC fan! We've partnered with the Marlies to give you the ultimate fan experience!!! Oh, but wait, there's more! You don't have a choice! If you want to go to see TFC you'll have to buy one of these price-inflated ticket packs!"

Now that they can't do that anymore they've come crawling back in January to say "Would you please buy some season tickets from us??"

2. Last season the North End was unavailable as season seats. The idea was that a walk-up crowd could purchase seats on gameday. This demand proved to be non-existent, and these seats and others were often offered at steeply discounted rates, some at or below what existing SSHs were paying or sat empty. This was not only a slap in the face to long-time SSHs, but a problem for MLSE. Now, rather than offering these seats at a discount or hoping that the walk-up demand will materialize out of thin air, they are stretching their waiting list to the max to add new SSHs who will purchase these seats and guarantee revenue.

In short, MLSE can get fucked.

then don't buy them..they aren't forcing you to. Ya the renewal rate is rumoured to be similar to last years and now they have a whole new section to sell and had left over seats. They were also holding back quite a few seats at relocation events that you figured were for partial pack sales.

I don't disagree the pricing model probably will need even more tweaks as we move along and demand changes - and sadly at some point they will need to start making SSH feel important. That there upfront commitment is worth it.

Fort York Redcoat
01-06-2012, 07:49 AM
So to get a feel for this thread:

It's for those who haven't had Seasons, wanted them or wanted them in a certain area or for cheaper than they were and now that MLSE is changing their strategy to better suit the demand you're saying "too late" to them?

OK

See you when I see you.

It seems there are still those that will take them. Enough that MLSE is content.

BTW I do agree with those that prefer a packed stadium to a half-full but fully-paid-for stadium.

ginkster88
01-06-2012, 09:19 AM
So to get a feel for this thread:

It's for those who haven't had Seasons, wanted them or wanted them in a certain area or for cheaper than they were and now that MLSE is changing their strategy to better suit the demand you're saying "too late" to them?

OK

See you when I see you.

It seems there are still those that will take them. Enough that MLSE is content.

BTW I do agree with those that prefer a packed stadium to a half-full but fully-paid-for stadium.

I agree that a stadium full of SSHs is better than not.

But think about the guys like Huyton (and sorry to use you by name since we've never met or interacted, but you were quite vocal about relo on the boards when you purchased, if you'd like me to remove your name I will) who bought Reds on the hope that he could relocate to something more affordable.

MLSE gladly took his money and he had to go through the anxiety of not knowing if he would get the seats he wanted/could afford.

Now two months later they're calling/emailing me and offering me the seats he wanted straight up because they didn't have enough guys like him who were willing to gamble up front.


How is that taking care of your customer??

I have shown zero loyalty, turning down half seasons two years ago, full seasons last year and would have turned them down again had they called me in the fall, yet they're now going to go and offer me the opportunity of buying very reasonably priced seats (if I were more liquid I'd definitely buy these) with no risk? That just seems wrong.

MartinUtd
01-06-2012, 09:44 AM
Well, just how elastic is your demand curve? You actually feel qualified to lecture them considering they have all the data ?

Brave

Considering the difference between year 2 and year 5 I'd say quite elastic. Maybe you can blame outside influences like the economy tanking, but they should have known that. Instead they chased away long time season ticket holders in pursuit of that extra dollar. Pretty sad considering they were expecting 12-14k prior to 2006. Then add on the extra revenue from the Edu sale and the Real Madrid game and it paints a pretty ugly (or inept) picture.

Fort York Redcoat
01-06-2012, 09:48 AM
^I did that as well. Bought somewhere I didn't want to get where I am. Did I prefer it? No. Did I know the risks? Yes.

The difference is the comfort level of having empty seats from our POV to their POV is an ancient ocean apart.

Huyton
01-06-2012, 10:42 AM
Not a problem using my name.

I look at it the same way as taking a number at the deli counter. People were looked after in order. It's tough to do it any other way.

MLSE was quite straightforward with me. They could not state, categorically, that certain seats or price levels would definitely be available.

I hate to gamble. I'm much happier knowing exactly what the risks are and then doing my best to manage them. It's part of my nature. By taking the seats as originally offered by MLSE I was waaay outside my comfort zone.

In the end, they were precisely right...they had strongly indicated that there would be tickets available at a price point I could afford somewhere in the stadium. In my case, I really lucked out as I got into a supporters section so I can stand all game.

Apart from last year (well documented elsewhere), I feel I have been dealt with quite fairly by MLSE, generally.

My entire problem was was a result of completely underestimating the demand for tickets prior to Season 1. It's taken 5 years to rectify that.

Many people prior to me stated that you had to get the high priced tickets and suck it up for a year until you could relocate. This board is rife with people who had to do that for more than one season.

So, ultimately, I have little complaint this year.

Chris Wren
01-06-2012, 10:52 AM
^I did that as well. Bought somewhere I didn't want to get where I am. Did I prefer it? No. Did I know the risks? Yes.

The difference is the comfort level of having empty seats from our POV to their POV is an ancient ocean apart.

Where are all these empty seats I am reading about? I'm just confused about that.

Beach_Red
01-06-2012, 10:57 AM
So to get a feel for this thread:

It's for those who haven't had Seasons, wanted them or wanted them in a certain area or for cheaper than they were and now that MLSE is changing their strategy to better suit the demand you're saying "too late" to them?

OK

See you when I see you.

It seems there are still those that will take them. Enough that MLSE is content.

BTW I do agree with those that prefer a packed stadium to a half-full but fully-paid-for stadium.

The last thing anyone wants is a content MLSE ;).

Huyton
01-06-2012, 11:25 AM
The last thing anyone wants is a content MLSE ;).

Absolutely correct. They should be stiving for better players, more goals for, fewer goals against. Frankly, anything short of total and utter world domination and staying there should be acceptable.

I want to hear Barcelona or Independienta fans saying that there's no point in winning the Champions League/Copa Libertadores because they'll only have to play Toronto FC in the Final, and they stand no chance against them.

Fort York Redcoat
01-06-2012, 12:03 PM
Where are all these empty seats I am reading about? I'm just confused about that.

During the season, the last couple in fact, there have been empty seats at games. Enough so that it would seem that there were a considerable amount of folks buying seats that they were not intending to use for every game.

Klinsmann
01-06-2012, 12:06 PM
Looks like near the first row of light-greys in 105, quite near 106. But those seats across from you in 106 are dark-grey! Yes, those are very good light-greys! I had a seat near the front of 220 near 221 last season, and they too were good light-greys. But compare to 104, 227, 219, the upper parts of 220, 226 ...

Yes, I believe row 21 is the 2nd row of light greys and I'm about 5-6 seats in from the aisle on 106. I relocated down 7 rows from my previous pair in 105.

Canary10
01-06-2012, 12:41 PM
There are two things:

1. Three years ago they would have called me in December to say "Hi TFC fan! We've partnered with the Marlies to give you the ultimate fan experience!!! Oh, but wait, there's more! You don't have a choice! If you want to go to see TFC you'll have to buy one of these price-inflated ticket packs!"

Now that they can't do that anymore they've come crawling back in January to say "Would you please buy some season tickets from us??"

2. Last season the North End was unavailable as season seats. The idea was that a walk-up crowd could purchase seats on gameday. This demand proved to be non-existent, and these seats and others were often offered at steeply discounted rates, some at or below what existing SSHs were paying or sat empty. This was not only a slap in the face to long-time SSHs, but a problem for MLSE. Now, rather than offering these seats at a discount or hoping that the walk-up demand will materialize out of thin air, they are stretching their waiting list to the max to add new SSHs who will purchase these seats and guarantee revenue.

In short, MLSE can get fucked.

I first got my season seats last year and the north end absolutely was available as season seats.

moralis
01-06-2012, 03:40 PM
2012 Season Ticket renewal rate is at 85%. Not sure if the cap is at 16k or 18k. Can someone calculate that for both 16lk and 18k.

@LukeWileman (http://twitter.com/#%21/LukeWileman) Luke Wileman

Paul Beirne says @torontofc (http://twitter.com/torontofc) renewed "around 85 percent" of season seats for 2012 season

5 hours ago (http://twitter.com/#%21/LukeWileman/status/155306537747873793) via Mobile Web (http://mobile.twitter.com/)

What do you guys think of this? Is it about the same as last year or worse?

Mark in Ottawa
01-06-2012, 04:10 PM
Where are all these empty seats I am reading about? I'm just confused about that.
At all of the games I attended last year (that was about 5 given the expense of travelling and accommodations) the North Stand stand always seemed to have a lot of empty seats and I believe that is what is being alluded to here.

Of course a lot of those seat holders could have been in the beer garden or squeezing into standing areas elsewhere but visually (and that included the games I watched on TV from BMO) the north endzone never looked full.

nfitz
01-06-2012, 05:38 PM
At all of the games I attended last year (that was about 5 given the expense of travelling and accommodations) the North Stand stand always seemed to have a lot of empty seats and I believe that is what is being alluded to here.Much of the north stand was single ticket sales last season. Some games it was all sold. Some games the top was pretty empty.