Town Halls, Round 2

[WestStandGeoff]

Did anyone else get an invite to the town halls next week? I got it about 40 minutes ago, and am signed up for the 7:30 Wednesday group.

[MG42]

is there a list of what MLSE said would change last time? It would be nice to see if they kept their word. I have a feeling this is just a big joke to them.

[Red CB Toronto]

I just signed up myself, does anyone know if they will be doing sessions for the supporters group again. I was quite interested last year to see the contrast in the difference of theopinions between the what supporters thoughts were compared to the everyday season ticket holders.

[DichioTFC]

I'm debating whether or not I should go. I don't have faith that the FO cares about our opinions, that this is nothing more than a glorified sales pitch to season ticket holders.

From people that were there last year, did they implement the changes they said they would? If so, I'll make the trip. If not, then I'll know this town hall is as bullshit as last year's.

[Phil]

There will be a supporters town hall, just awaiting confirmation.

[Furtado91]

I am sorry but i do not understand this whole town hall meeting. does mlse have a meeting where everyone can attend and make suggestions on what to change or add?

[Suds]

I am sorry but i do not understand this whole town hall meeting. does mlse have a meeting where everyone can attend and make suggestions on what to change or add?

The basic format is they invite fans down. Anyone can attend on a first-registered first-served basis. (space is limited) TFC will have a selection of coaches and management there to talk about plans, future, vision, etc. Then they open the floor for feedback and questions.

Last year most of the attendees hung around after the formal part was over and chatted with people. This is good because not everyone likes getting up in front of a room and asking a question or giving there opinion.

The SG's have their own session as they could have specific items to discuss that may not be relevant to other TFC fans (ex. logistics of flags, drums, banners, etc.)

[Furtado91]

^^^^ ok Thanks a lot Suds for the explanation.



Matt

[London]

no thanks

[kodiakTFC]

I'd love to go and rant about how supporters need the freedom of their own designated section in order to return to our past atmosphere. God knows they won't listen.

[Wagner]

No mention of Anselmi being there...
will they release the ticket prices after the sessions??? (to avoid the heat)

How about the same 30% discount the Raptors gave.... ;)

[Roogsy]

Loose cannon Anselmi? LOL! Probably best he not be there so as to not promise something else that his team scrambles to try to fulfill.

[Kooper]

I went last year but this year I feel like I don't care enough. Maybe it is because it seems like they don't really give a shit about what we think.

The only question I want to do is "What is your strategy for next year when the stadium is only 1/3 full." You have to think that a lot of people are only going because they already paid for the tickets.

[Kooper]

And is it just me or did anyone else notice that they had 4 sessions last year for the season ticket holders yet this year they only have 3. Is it because they don't expect that many or because they couldn't stand 4 hours of abuse this year.

[menefreghista]

I don't think Anselmi will be at these town halls. From the sounds of it on Beirne's twitter feed it will be Winter, De Klerk, Mariner and Beirne at these town halls.

Which is probably a wise move considering how loved the on field management team is among the hard core fan base.

My speculation is that they will plead for more time and use the recent results to sell hope for next season. They will feed us some bullshit about why ticket prices must remain stagnant. Try to sell us on their 'price freeze'.

[prizby]

i think we really need someone more than paul beirne to answer behind the scenes (off the field issues)...PB can say some things, but he has ppl to answer to that won't always agree with him. There needs to be an off the field decision maker present

[Fort York Redcoat]

There's more than one person here that are planning to abstain from using this opportunity to be heard.

As far as I see it that says they think more good could come from voicing their concerns here on the internet.

If you don't have faith in the people giving you the opportunity to tell them so- tell them. Otherwise you're complaints are all but impotent whinging.

I will be severely disappointed to see these meetings half full if there continues to be an onslaught of MLSE complaints afterwards from people who can't be bothered.

[denime]

There will be a supporters town hall, just awaiting confirmation.

Thanks for info,looking forward to this one.

[TFC_Junky]

While I know people around here aren't exactly keen on the FO, I think it's important to show up and be heard at these events. At a minimum, it shows the FO that we care what happens with this team and that we have opinions on how to improve things. Whether they listen is obviously another matter but at least you get to voice an opinion.

[London]

There's more than one person here that are planning to abstain from using this opportunity to be heard.

As far as I see it that says they think more good could come from voicing their concerns here on the internet.

If you don't have faith in the people giving you the opportunity to tell them so- tell them. Otherwise you're complaints are all but impotent whinging.

I will be severely disappointed to see these meetings half full if there continues to be an onslaught of MLSE complaints afterwards from people who can't be bothered.

thats not it for me at all,

factor in that i will have to spend $40 on gas, $4 on parking and 4 hours on the road all lead me to not want to drive there on a weeknight to have smoke blown up my ass and some wings!!

not worth it:flare:

[Juanito]

^^

The wings are pretty good though. ;)

If you can make it, great. But I definitely see your point. I will try and be there though.

[Juanito]

I don't know if you lads listen to THE FAN. Anselmi is on the short-list to be the new president of MLSE. I think he has blown enough smoke up people's ass and kissed the right arses to do it. I have a feeling this is why he isn't there .... he's moving on and COULDN'T CARE LESS about us "soccer folk".

[Wull]

Anselmi will be there, Paul confirmed to me yesterday that they will both be there. Count me in for the RPB one

[eustacchio]

I'll definitely go to the RPB/Supporter's one again.

[Ben - D.O.W.]

I'm kind of disappointed there's only the two dates for this - I'll be out of the country for both of them. Spreading them out a bit might have been a little less practical for them but it might have made it easier for some people to make it.

[eustacchio]

^ What are the dates (I have season's, but they're not in my name so I don't always know about this stuff).

[Ben - D.O.W.]

So far:

Wednesday, September 28th
6:00 - 7:00 p.m.
7:30 - 8:30 p.m.
Thursday, September 29th
6:00 - 7:00 p.m.

Plus when ever the RPB one is.

[Derko]

Did anyone else get an invite to the town halls next week? I got it about 40 minutes ago, and am signed up for the 7:30 Wednesday group.

Me too, I will be there at 7:30 on Wednesday as well.

[WestStandGeoff]

So far:

Wednesday, September 28th
6:00 - 7:00 p.m.
7:30 - 8:30 p.m.
Thursday, September 29th
6:00 - 7:00 p.m.

Plus when ever the RPB one is.

If I had to guess, it looks like there's a 7:30-8:30 time slot on Thursday for the supporters meeting.

[Ben - D.O.W.]

Yeah I'd assume so. I forget - was last years RPB/Usector/NEE all in one meeting or did everyone get their own?

[Suds]

Yeah I'd assume so. I forget - was last years RPB/Usector/NEE all in one meeting or did everyone get their own?

Each group had their own session.

[MartinUtd]

So I noticed Paul Bernie is the one that sent the email yet he's conspicuously absent the management team. Tbh I have no qualms with Winter, Mariner or De Klerk; they've been doing a great job. The reasons I'm unlikely to renew are squarely on the actions and inactions of the FO. That's Bernie and his puppeteer.

This town hall is an even bigger waste of time than the last one.

[__wowza]

:rolleyes: i dont have to stand there with my hand up for an hour again this year do i?

[Fort York Redcoat]

:rolleyes: i dont have to stand there with my hand up for an hour again this year do i?

No I spoke to them yesterday. Just come see me first so I can give you your nametag. They know to call on "Wowzilla" first and formost.:D

But srsly, that won't happen again. You were wayyyyy too patient, mate. Mega-polite.

[TorCanSoc]

The question is... what was proposed last town hall, and what was acted on? And do we see the results.

Talking high ups, about culture, and direction, and new coaches, are all good... those must be made and talked about.

What about specifics that are 100% in the control of the FO. Forcing ticket packs bugs the hell out of me. These are business decisions, I get that. But its also forcing me not to buy tix (I'm talking CCL stuff, of course).

...anyway, that's my beef.

[Fort York Redcoat]

There's more than one person here that are planning to abstain from using this opportunity to be heard.

As far as I see it that says they think more good could come from voicing their concerns here on the internet.

If you don't have faith in the people giving you the opportunity to tell them so- tell them. Otherwise you're complaints are all but impotent whinging.

I will be severely disappointed to see these meetings half full if there continues to be an onslaught of MLSE complaints afterwards from people who can't be bothered.


thats not it for me at all,

factor in that i will have to spend $40 on gas, $4 on parking and 4 hours on the road all lead me to not want to drive there on a weeknight to have smoke blown up my ass and some wings!!

not worth it:flare:

No excuse! Get here early and pick up Regina up on your way! :rolleyes::D

Of course there are exceptions but most should get there if they think they need explanations and tell the FO what they think.

[Joe Kool]

I was thinking about going but if they are not going to be talking business stuff which is what everyone gets pissed about including me then it may not be worth my while. I don't have to listen to them talk for 30 min on the coaches vision and passion and how much they value the 12th man crap. I got the little red book that told me that. I would prefer to wait for the supporter town hall which I am sure will get down to that stuff more.

[MisterMacphisto]

It seems pointless. (Sorry for lengthy rant)

FO could have things spelled out for them in black and white, with neon billboards, written in the sky, tatooed on their arms... It's just that many think they will ever get it. Don't think they will ever understand supporters culture and never truly support us and our efforts, just the occasional platitude thrown our way.

They are more than happy to market the atmosphere any chance they can, while squeezing every last penny they can out of season ticket prices. They continually attempt to appease people with hokey marketing gimmicks like ridiculous glossy brochures and pointless town-halls and with half-hearted efforts like "Freezing prices" that are already the highest in the league and shouldn't have been raised that high in the first place.

It isn't rocket science or some big mystery.

Supporters are (were) the club's biggest advocates. Go out of your way to treat your biggest advocates with some genuine respect and appreciation.

If I was running the show:
- North and South stand supporters sections would be general admission with very affordable seasons tickets.
- Whatever supporters needed, would be done. Proper lockable storage, areas or apparatuses to display TIFO's, advertising banners moved if needed, access to grounds, friendly helpful security, platforms for capo's in north stands, closeby warehouse space for TIFO creation, ANYTHING.
- I'd show genuine appreciation for supporters, by doing random things like throwing in a free CCL game, offer to cover expenses for 5 buses to an away game, offer a free game if we had a completely shit game where we lost 6-2 etc..
- I would offer random giveaways like signed kits for supporters groups that they could use as raffle to raise funds for TIFO's.
- I would let the team know that after games, as a TFC player it is mandatory, no matter win or lose, to go right up to supporters sections and show appreciation. Not half way, but right up to supporters sections.
- I would constantly ask supporters groups if there was anything I could do to help.
- As director, I wouldn't tweet condescending tweets towards supporters or constantly make jokes regarding things related to TFC, like the whole club was some half-hearted, casual and amusing personal past-time of mine. The club, the players, the supporters, the media, everyone top to bottom would know this was a genuine burning passion of mine to succeed. Everyone employed by the club would have to have the same passion. (Don't confuse passion with not having fun! The two are not mutually exclusive)
- I would create a real away supporters section. Having visiting supporters show up raises the temperature of the place and raises home supporters game, creates more excitement and increases ticket sales, media interest etc..
- I would pay for this by cutting out stupid glossy brochures, repetitive surveys and town halls, fake social media people and all the frivolous stuff and with extra ticket revenue and TV deals and make plans to grow the stadium because...

The place would be filled to the rafters every single game and there would be such a huge, enormous buzz about the club in the city and throughout North America. Every supporter would be the clubs best advocate and would be singing the praises of the club to friends in person, online, it would be the the talk of the media and other groups would be talking about the club (Like people are sick of hearing about Portland) That would be happening instead of most people badmouthing what a royal screwup MLSE has been so far to the point that they are loathed.

If I was really a partner to supporters groups and was constantly scratching their back and showing genuine love and asked them to scratch back a little, supporters would return the favour with jersey and merchandise sales, concession sales (That would be reasonably priced) etc.. MLS would benefit with increased road trip attendance too. Their advocacy would be worth 100x more than any stupid printed up glossy marketing item. In year 1, I actively contacted some advertisers and thanked them for their support of TFC and that I would endorse their products for their support! I even bought a fucking KIA and let them know. (I know, not very ultra, but I wanted TFC to succeed!)

From our short history, we get the impression that MLSE sees supporters as a nuisance that occasionally needs to be addressed and appeased. They openly have said they don't know the difference between a supporter and other fans. They don't realize that most of us actually want to be on the same page as them. We'd rather be friendly with them. We'd love for the club to be hugely financially successful and making money hand over fist. We want to be partners in the clubs success, but this has been mostly a one way marriage the past 5 years and a lot of supporters are asking for a divorce. We're not going to get stuck in a long-term, over-priced abusive relationship like leafs fans.

It is absolutely mind-boggling how they managed to take such an enormous opportunity that buzz around the team that fell in their lap in year one to the point where things are now.

So we now have town-appease-the-fans-hall 2.0 and they are throwing out Aron, Bob and Paul M.... IMO and many others, they don't really need to be out there. There was quite a few platitudes thrown out about things last year that were "going to be looked at" that resulted in nothing, and I unfortunately expect a lot more of the same. A lot of content about our 4 point-plan. (Great, implement it)

I think at this point, MLSE probably knows the kinds of things their customers really want, they just don't want to do it or don't have the desire to. Or maybe any decision gets stuck in stuffy, suited up board-rooms and dies by committee. If by now they don't recognize the value of supporters beyond ticket sales (With only about 5k at start of last nights game with majority being supporters), they probably never will.

I'm sure some casual new soccer fans who use this board as just a TFC discussion board, some "The sky is always bright and sunny with rainbows" type people and a few paid MLSE social media contributors will disagree, but I know this is what the majority of supporters who devout a huge chunk of the time and life to this thing will agree with. (Not every point on what I'd do, but overall sentiment)

As far a performance on pitch and our teams success, we're making good modest improvements and there is reason for some cautious optimism that we are slowly moving in right direction, but I'm not planning parade routes for us winning a supporters shield or championship just yet. The club's fabric still seems to lack some passion to want to be the best team in the league, not just having modest goals of "trying to hopefully, maybe make the playoffs." I like the new academy facility we are building, but I somewhat think the motivation is creating more Maurice Edu's to sell for $5 Mil, more than it truly is to make TFC the best team in MLS.

[__wowza]

No I spoke to them yesterday. Just come see me first so I can give you your nametag. They know to call on "Wowzilla" first and formost.:D

But srsly, that won't happen again. You were wayyyyy too patient, mate. Mega-polite.

it's how i was raised man, when i get outtve line i feel the ghost hand of my yiayia smacking me upside the head.

i havent gotten the email about the townhall yet, ive shipped off two emails to the one that sent the info to me last year but ive yet to hear back. does the nametag comment mean someones already stuck my name in or should i pop another email off and just tell them im coming whether they like it or not?

they fed us last year, and my art-student blood won't allow me to miss out on free pizza and beer tickets.

[king dave]

What if they had a town hall and absolutely no supporter from any group showed up?
How would MLSE interpret that?
I think I know how.
KD.

[CretanBull]

It seems pointless. (Sorry for lengthy rant)

FO could have things spelled out for them in black and white, with neon billboards, written in the sky, tatooed on their arms... It's just that many think they will ever get it. Don't think they will ever understand supporters culture and never truly support us and our efforts, just the occasional platitude thrown our way.

They are more than happy to market the atmosphere any chance they can, while squeezing every last penny they can out of season ticket prices. They continually attempt to appease people with hokey marketing gimmicks like ridiculous glossy brochures and pointless town-halls and with half-hearted efforts like "Freezing prices" that are already the highest in the league and shouldn't have been raised that high in the first place.

It isn't rocket science or some big mystery.

Supporters are (were) the club's biggest advocates. Go out of your way to treat your biggest advocates with some genuine respect and appreciation.

If I was running the show:
- North and South stand supporters sections would be general admission with very affordable seasons tickets.
- Whatever supporters needed, would be done. Proper lockable storage, areas or apparatuses to display TIFO's, advertising banners moved if needed, access to grounds, friendly helpful security, platforms for capo's in north stands, closeby warehouse space for TIFO creation, ANYTHING.
- I'd show genuine appreciation for supporters, by doing random things like throwing in a free CCL game, offer to cover expenses for 5 buses to an away game, offer a free game if we had a completely shit game where we lost 6-2 etc..
- I would offer random giveaways like signed kits for supporters groups that they could use as raffle to raise funds for TIFO's.
- I would let the team know that after games, as a TFC player it is mandatory, no matter win or lose, to go right up to supporters sections and show appreciation. Not half way, but right up to supporters sections.
- I would constantly ask supporters groups if there was anything I could do to help.
- As director, I wouldn't tweet condescending tweets towards supporters or constantly make jokes regarding things related to TFC, like the whole club was some half-hearted, casual and amusing personal past-time of mine. The club, the players, the supporters, the media, everyone top to bottom would know this was a genuine burning passion of mine to succeed. Everyone employed by the club would have to have the same passion. (Don't confuse passion with not having fun! The two are not mutually exclusive)
- I would create a real away supporters section. Having visiting supporters show up raises the temperature of the place and raises home supporters game, creates more excitement and increases ticket sales, media interest etc..
- I would pay for this by cutting out stupid glossy brochures, repetitive surveys and town halls, fake social media people and all the frivolous stuff and with extra ticket revenue and TV deals and make plans to grow the stadium because...

The place would be filled to the rafters every single game and there would be such a huge, enormous buzz about the club in the city and throughout North America. Every supporter would be the clubs best advocate and would be singing the praises of the club to friends in person, online, it would be the the talk of the media and other groups would be talking about the club (Like people are sick of hearing about Portland) That would be happening instead of most people badmouthing what a royal screwup MLSE has been so far to the point that they are loathed.

If I was really a partner to supporters groups and was constantly scratching their back and showing genuine love and asked them to scratch back a little, supporters would return the favour with jersey and merchandise sales, concession sales (That would be reasonably priced) etc.. MLS would benefit with increased road trip attendance too. Their advocacy would be worth 100x more than any stupid printed up glossy marketing item. In year 1, I actively contacted some advertisers and thanked them for their support of TFC and that I would endorse their products for their support! I even bought a fucking KIA and let them know. (I know, not very ultra, but I wanted TFC to succeed!)

From our short history, we get the impression that MLSE sees supporters as a nuisance that occasionally needs to be addressed and appeased. They openly have said they don't know the difference between a supporter and other fans. They don't realize that most of us actually want to be on the same page as them. We'd rather be friendly with them. We'd love for the club to be hugely financially successful and making money hand over fist. We want to be partners in the clubs success, but this has been mostly a one way marriage the past 5 years and a lot of supporters are asking for a divorce. We're not going to get stuck in a long-term, over-priced abusive relationship like leafs fans.

It is absolutely mind-boggling how they managed to take such an enormous opportunity that buzz around the team that fell in their lap in year one to the point where things are now.

So we now have town-appease-the-fans-hall 2.0 and they are throwing out Aron, Bob and Paul M.... IMO and many others, they don't really need to be out there. There was quite a few platitudes thrown out about things last year that were "going to be looked at" that resulted in nothing, and I unfortunately expect a lot more of the same. A lot of content about our 4 point-plan. (Great, implement it)

I think at this point, MLSE probably knows the kinds of things their customers really want, they just don't want to do it or don't have the desire to. Or maybe any decision gets stuck in stuffy, suited up board-rooms and dies by committee. If by now they don't recognize the value of supporters beyond ticket sales (With only about 5k at start of last nights game with majority being supporters), they probably never will.

I'm sure some casual new soccer fans who use this board as just a TFC discussion board, some "The sky is always bright and sunny with rainbows" type people and a few paid MLSE social media contributors will disagree, but I know this is what the majority of supporters who devout a huge chunk of the time and life to this thing will agree with. (Not every point on what I'd do, but overall sentiment)

As far a performance on pitch and our teams success, we're making good modest improvements and there is reason for some cautious optimism that we are slowly moving in right direction, but I'm not planning parade routes for us winning a supporters shield or championship just yet. The club's fabric still seems to lack some passion to want to be the best team in the league, not just having modest goals of "trying to hopefully, maybe make the playoffs." I like the new academy facility we are building, but I somewhat think the motivation is creating more Maurice Edu's to sell for $5 Mil, more than it truly is to make TFC the best team in MLS.

How can we get you hired? :thumbsup:

[spark]

As far a performance on pitch and our teams success, we're making good modest improvements and there is reason for some cautious optimism that we are slowly moving in right direction, but I'm not planning parade routes for us winning a supporters shield or championship just yet. The club's fabric still seems to lack some passion to want to be the best team in the league, not just having modest goals of "trying to hopefully, maybe make the playoffs." I like the new academy facility we are building, but I somewhat think the motivation is creating more Maurice Edu's to sell for $5 Mil, more than it truly is to make TFC the best team in MLS.

Has anyone ever heard the club set a goal higher than making the playoffs? Even if it was BS I'd be happier if they set it out in stone the goal is MLS Cup ever year.

[james]

I'd love to go and rant about how supporters need the freedom of their own designated section in order to return to our past atmosphere. God knows they won't listen.


what i think they need is selling South End stands as General admisson rather then being assigned to one seat. This way first ones in stadium get to stand where they please, lets friends be with friends, and lets supporter groups organize where they want with flags, banners, tifos, drums, it could realy help inprove the atmosphere across the south end rather then just in 112 or 113 every game. Portland do it in 1 section, and i believe Montreal Impact are doing it next season as well!

[james]

It seems pointless. (Sorry for lengthy rant)

FO could have things spelled out for them in black and white, with neon billboards, written in the sky, tatooed on their arms... It's just that many think they will ever get it. Don't think they will ever understand supporters culture and never truly support us and our efforts, just the occasional platitude thrown our way.

They are more than happy to market the atmosphere any chance they can, while squeezing every last penny they can out of season ticket prices. They continually attempt to appease people with hokey marketing gimmicks like ridiculous glossy brochures and pointless town-halls and with half-hearted efforts like "Freezing prices" that are already the highest in the league and shouldn't have been raised that high in the first place.

It isn't rocket science or some big mystery.

Supporters are (were) the club's biggest advocates. Go out of your way to treat your biggest advocates with some genuine respect and appreciation.

If I was running the show:
- North and South stand supporters sections would be general admission with very affordable seasons tickets.
- Whatever supporters needed, would be done. Proper lockable storage, areas or apparatuses to display TIFO's, advertising banners moved if needed, access to grounds, friendly helpful security, platforms for capo's in north stands, closeby warehouse space for TIFO creation, ANYTHING.
- I'd show genuine appreciation for supporters, by doing random things like throwing in a free CCL game, offer to cover expenses for 5 buses to an away game, offer a free game if we had a completely shit game where we lost 6-2 etc..
- I would offer random giveaways like signed kits for supporters groups that they could use as raffle to raise funds for TIFO's.
- I would let the team know that after games, as a TFC player it is mandatory, no matter win or lose, to go right up to supporters sections and show appreciation. Not half way, but right up to supporters sections.
- I would constantly ask supporters groups if there was anything I could do to help.
- As director, I wouldn't tweet condescending tweets towards supporters or constantly make jokes regarding things related to TFC, like the whole club was some half-hearted, casual and amusing personal past-time of mine. The club, the players, the supporters, the media, everyone top to bottom would know this was a genuine burning passion of mine to succeed. Everyone employed by the club would have to have the same passion. (Don't confuse passion with not having fun! The two are not mutually exclusive)
- I would create a real away supporters section. Having visiting supporters show up raises the temperature of the place and raises home supporters game, creates more excitement and increases ticket sales, media interest etc..
- I would pay for this by cutting out stupid glossy brochures, repetitive surveys and town halls, fake social media people and all the frivolous stuff and with extra ticket revenue and TV deals and make plans to grow the stadium because...

The place would be filled to the rafters every single game and there would be such a huge, enormous buzz about the club in the city and throughout North America. Every supporter would be the clubs best advocate and would be singing the praises of the club to friends in person, online, it would be the the talk of the media and other groups would be talking about the club (Like people are sick of hearing about Portland) That would be happening instead of most people badmouthing what a royal screwup MLSE has been so far to the point that they are loathed.

If I was really a partner to supporters groups and was constantly scratching their back and showing genuine love and asked them to scratch back a little, supporters would return the favour with jersey and merchandise sales, concession sales (That would be reasonably priced) etc.. MLS would benefit with increased road trip attendance too. Their advocacy would be worth 100x more than any stupid printed up glossy marketing item. In year 1, I actively contacted some advertisers and thanked them for their support of TFC and that I would endorse their products for their support! I even bought a fucking KIA and let them know. (I know, not very ultra, but I wanted TFC to succeed!)

From our short history, we get the impression that MLSE sees supporters as a nuisance that occasionally needs to be addressed and appeased. They openly have said they don't know the difference between a supporter and other fans. They don't realize that most of us actually want to be on the same page as them. We'd rather be friendly with them. We'd love for the club to be hugely financially successful and making money hand over fist. We want to be partners in the clubs success, but this has been mostly a one way marriage the past 5 years and a lot of supporters are asking for a divorce. We're not going to get stuck in a long-term, over-priced abusive relationship like leafs fans.

It is absolutely mind-boggling how they managed to take such an enormous opportunity that buzz around the team that fell in their lap in year one to the point where things are now.

So we now have town-appease-the-fans-hall 2.0 and they are throwing out Aron, Bob and Paul M.... IMO and many others, they don't really need to be out there. There was quite a few platitudes thrown out about things last year that were "going to be looked at" that resulted in nothing, and I unfortunately expect a lot more of the same. A lot of content about our 4 point-plan. (Great, implement it)

I think at this point, MLSE probably knows the kinds of things their customers really want, they just don't want to do it or don't have the desire to. Or maybe any decision gets stuck in stuffy, suited up board-rooms and dies by committee. If by now they don't recognize the value of supporters beyond ticket sales (With only about 5k at start of last nights game with majority being supporters), they probably never will.

I'm sure some casual new soccer fans who use this board as just a TFC discussion board, some "The sky is always bright and sunny with rainbows" type people and a few paid MLSE social media contributors will disagree, but I know this is what the majority of supporters who devout a huge chunk of the time and life to this thing will agree with. (Not every point on what I'd do, but overall sentiment)

As far a performance on pitch and our teams success, we're making good modest improvements and there is reason for some cautious optimism that we are slowly moving in right direction, but I'm not planning parade routes for us winning a supporters shield or championship just yet. The club's fabric still seems to lack some passion to want to be the best team in the league, not just having modest goals of "trying to hopefully, maybe make the playoffs." I like the new academy facility we are building, but I somewhat think the motivation is creating more Maurice Edu's to sell for $5 Mil, more than it truly is to make TFC the best team in MLS.

i mostly feel the same way.

As for away fans alot of teams wouldnt have any travelling fans to Toronto (San Jose, Dallas, far distances exc.) but maybe for when they play certain teams such as Columbus, DC, chicago, NY who might actually bring supporters...maybe what they do is dont let any season tickets be sold in this section, and dont even sell any of those seats to the public utill 3 weeks before the game. If say away fans like DC dont use up all 500 tickets then left overs can be sold to the general public. if this catches on maybe let more away fans come in the future, but current 100 tickets for away fans is shit ( chicago wanted to bring 500 few years back but Toronto didnt release enough seats for them).

Supporter tickets wouldnt beable to change a whole lot, tickets at $14-$20 a game is reasonable. However its more the east, west stand that should hugely decrease prices. Many seats are being sold in those stands for $55 and up its rediculous. Also champion League games/nurtilite games, no tickets in the stadium should be over $30-$40. Should maybe do something like West Ham have done for Carling Cup matches. !8 pounds for the entire stadium.

[TFC Cityboy]

It seems pointless. (Sorry for lengthy rant)

FO could have things spelled out for them in black and white, with neon billboards, written in the sky, tatooed on their arms... It's just that many think they will ever get it. Don't think they will ever understand supporters culture and never truly support us and our efforts, just the occasional platitude thrown our way.

They are more than happy to market the atmosphere any chance they can, while squeezing every last penny they can out of season ticket prices. They continually attempt to appease people with hokey marketing gimmicks like ridiculous glossy brochures and pointless town-halls and with half-hearted efforts like "Freezing prices" that are already the highest in the league and shouldn't have been raised that high in the first place.

It isn't rocket science or some big mystery.

Supporters are (were) the club's biggest advocates. Go out of your way to treat your biggest advocates with some genuine respect and appreciation.

If I was running the show:
- North and South stand supporters sections would be general admission with very affordable seasons tickets.
- Whatever supporters needed, would be done. Proper lockable storage, areas or apparatuses to display TIFO's, advertising banners moved if needed, access to grounds, friendly helpful security, platforms for capo's in north stands, closeby warehouse space for TIFO creation, ANYTHING.
- I'd show genuine appreciation for supporters, by doing random things like throwing in a free CCL game, offer to cover expenses for 5 buses to an away game, offer a free game if we had a completely shit game where we lost 6-2 etc..
- I would offer random giveaways like signed kits for supporters groups that they could use as raffle to raise funds for TIFO's.
- I would let the team know that after games, as a TFC player it is mandatory, no matter win or lose, to go right up to supporters sections and show appreciation. Not half way, but right up to supporters sections.
- I would constantly ask supporters groups if there was anything I could do to help.
- As director, I wouldn't tweet condescending tweets towards supporters or constantly make jokes regarding things related to TFC, like the whole club was some half-hearted, casual and amusing personal past-time of mine. The club, the players, the supporters, the media, everyone top to bottom would know this was a genuine burning passion of mine to succeed. Everyone employed by the club would have to have the same passion. (Don't confuse passion with not having fun! The two are not mutually exclusive)
- I would create a real away supporters section. Having visiting supporters show up raises the temperature of the place and raises home supporters game, creates more excitement and increases ticket sales, media interest etc..
- I would pay for this by cutting out stupid glossy brochures, repetitive surveys and town halls, fake social media people and all the frivolous stuff and with extra ticket revenue and TV deals and make plans to grow the stadium because...

The place would be filled to the rafters every single game and there would be such a huge, enormous buzz about the club in the city and throughout North America. Every supporter would be the clubs best advocate and would be singing the praises of the club to friends in person, online, it would be the the talk of the media and other groups would be talking about the club (Like people are sick of hearing about Portland) That would be happening instead of most people badmouthing what a royal screwup MLSE has been so far to the point that they are loathed.

If I was really a partner to supporters groups and was constantly scratching their back and showing genuine love and asked them to scratch back a little, supporters would return the favour with jersey and merchandise sales, concession sales (That would be reasonably priced) etc.. MLS would benefit with increased road trip attendance too. Their advocacy would be worth 100x more than any stupid printed up glossy marketing item. In year 1, I actively contacted some advertisers and thanked them for their support of TFC and that I would endorse their products for their support! I even bought a fucking KIA and let them know. (I know, not very ultra, but I wanted TFC to succeed!)

From our short history, we get the impression that MLSE sees supporters as a nuisance that occasionally needs to be addressed and appeased. They openly have said they don't know the difference between a supporter and other fans. They don't realize that most of us actually want to be on the same page as them. We'd rather be friendly with them. We'd love for the club to be hugely financially successful and making money hand over fist. We want to be partners in the clubs success, but this has been mostly a one way marriage the past 5 years and a lot of supporters are asking for a divorce. We're not going to get stuck in a long-term, over-priced abusive relationship like leafs fans.

It is absolutely mind-boggling how they managed to take such an enormous opportunity that buzz around the team that fell in their lap in year one to the point where things are now.

So we now have town-appease-the-fans-hall 2.0 and they are throwing out Aron, Bob and Paul M.... IMO and many others, they don't really need to be out there. There was quite a few platitudes thrown out about things last year that were "going to be looked at" that resulted in nothing, and I unfortunately expect a lot more of the same. A lot of content about our 4 point-plan. (Great, implement it)

I think at this point, MLSE probably knows the kinds of things their customers really want, they just don't want to do it or don't have the desire to. Or maybe any decision gets stuck in stuffy, suited up board-rooms and dies by committee. If by now they don't recognize the value of supporters beyond ticket sales (With only about 5k at start of last nights game with majority being supporters), they probably never will.

I'm sure some casual new soccer fans who use this board as just a TFC discussion board, some "The sky is always bright and sunny with rainbows" type people and a few paid MLSE social media contributors will disagree, but I know this is what the majority of supporters who devout a huge chunk of the time and life to this thing will agree with. (Not every point on what I'd do, but overall sentiment)

As far a performance on pitch and our teams success, we're making good modest improvements and there is reason for some cautious optimism that we are slowly moving in right direction, but I'm not planning parade routes for us winning a supporters shield or championship just yet. The club's fabric still seems to lack some passion to want to be the best team in the league, not just having modest goals of "trying to hopefully, maybe make the playoffs." I like the new academy facility we are building, but I somewhat think the motivation is creating more Maurice Edu's to sell for $5 Mil, more than it truly is to make TFC the best team in MLS.

Likely the best post I've ever read on here.
Very eloquent and you capture the feelings of many, I think.

TFC is hiring a Marketing Director and you have absolutely NO CHANCE of landing the gig with that approach!

[J .]

I get trolled, hated on, banned for my opinion, but this team has seen far more negatives results and outings than positive since day one until today. From the moment MoJo was fired up until now has been poorly managed by the FO. This is an organization run from the top down and I fail to see how town halls address or rectify serious problems.

We deserved much more than going from horrible to acceptable sometimes.

Winter was put in a bad position and we sacrificed another season, to arguably be the or one of the worst teams in the league? A GD of -20? Results have improved lately, but lets be honest, the season has long been over. Our blip of positive forms doesn't mask the fact this team has been on many days, plain horrible.

Another Town Hall wont address that.

[ensco]

^The Little Red Book, the Town Halls...it's hard work just deflecting all this "attention" around renewal time.

I just think teams thrive on the confusion about the difference between "being a supporter no matter what" and "getting ripped off".

I believe this board has sometimes, unwittingly, been a part of that, but that's for another day.

[mclaren]

Excellent post MisterMacphisto - you nailed it.

[Pookie]

[B]Supporters are (were) the club's biggest advocates.

- I'd show genuine appreciation for supporters, by doing random things like throwing in a free CCL game,

...Every supporter would be the clubs best advocate and would be singing the praises of the club to friends in person, online, it would be the the talk of the media and other groups would be talking about the club

If I was really a partner to supporters groups and was constantly scratching their back and showing genuine love and asked them to scratch back a little, supporters would return the favour with jersey and merchandise sales, concession sales (That would be reasonably priced) etc..

... MLS would benefit with increased road trip attendance too. .

I pulled out these points to play a little Devil's Advocate with you.

1. Why should "Supporters" get a free CCL ticket and not regular STHs? Or half season ticket holders that aren't affiliated with a group?

2. Best advocates? Have you read these forums this year?

3. Supporters already buy merchandise as do the "regular TFC fans" who buy more merchandise per capita than Leaf fans.

4. Road trip attendance is a moot issue until a few knuckleheads get it through their heads that flares and other incidents do more harm than good. The cost for extra security and liability concerns probably outweighs the revenue share on the ticket purchase.

[james]

I pulled out these points to play a little Devil's Advocate with you.

1. Why should "Supporters" get a free CCL ticket and not regular STHs? Or half season ticket holders that aren't affiliated with a group?

2. Best advocates? Have you read these forums this year?

3. Supporters already buy merchandise as do the "regular TFC fans" who buy more merchandise per capita than Leaf fans.

4. Road trip attendance is a moot issue until a few knuckleheads get it through their heads that flares and other incidents do more harm than good. The cost for extra security and liability concerns probably outweighs the revenue share on the ticket purchase.

supporters shouldnt get extra stuff that other season ticket holders dont get. But ALL SEASON TICKET HOLDERS getting a free game, or major doscounted games ( Champions League, Nutrilite, friendly games exc.) woulndt be a bad idea to make season ticket holders feel appreciated now and then.

Merchandise is way over priced i must say. Not sure if thats MLSE or what who make prices but $115 fpr TFC jerseys is bit crazy. Makes me think twice about buying anything. If prices were even say $70 i might consider buying some and they might actually sell twice as much stuff.

Road trips dont come in huge travelling numbers in MLS yet. But imagine 2,000 TFC fans going to Montreal?? or 2,000 Portland fans going to Seattle...that sure would create one hell of an atmosphere that might make fans wanting to come that much more to games home or away!

[v00d00daddy]

It seems pointless. (Sorry for lengthy rant)

FO could have things spelled out for them in black and white, with neon billboards, written in the sky, tatooed on their arms... It's just that many think they will ever get it. Don't think they will ever understand supporters culture and never truly support us and our efforts, just the occasional platitude thrown our way.

They are more than happy to market the atmosphere any chance they can, while squeezing every last penny they can out of season ticket prices. They continually attempt to appease people with hokey marketing gimmicks like ridiculous glossy brochures and pointless town-halls and with half-hearted efforts like "Freezing prices" that are already the highest in the league and shouldn't have been raised that high in the first place.

It isn't rocket science or some big mystery.

Supporters are (were) the club's biggest advocates. Go out of your way to treat your biggest advocates with some genuine respect and appreciation.

If I was running the show:
- North and South stand supporters sections would be general admission with very affordable seasons tickets.
- Whatever supporters needed, would be done. Proper lockable storage, areas or apparatuses to display TIFO's, advertising banners moved if needed, access to grounds, friendly helpful security, platforms for capo's in north stands, closeby warehouse space for TIFO creation, ANYTHING.
- I'd show genuine appreciation for supporters, by doing random things like throwing in a free CCL game, offer to cover expenses for 5 buses to an away game, offer a free game if we had a completely shit game where we lost 6-2 etc..
- I would offer random giveaways like signed kits for supporters groups that they could use as raffle to raise funds for TIFO's.
- I would let the team know that after games, as a TFC player it is mandatory, no matter win or lose, to go right up to supporters sections and show appreciation. Not half way, but right up to supporters sections.
- I would constantly ask supporters groups if there was anything I could do to help.
- As director, I wouldn't tweet condescending tweets towards supporters or constantly make jokes regarding things related to TFC, like the whole club was some half-hearted, casual and amusing personal past-time of mine. The club, the players, the supporters, the media, everyone top to bottom would know this was a genuine burning passion of mine to succeed. Everyone employed by the club would have to have the same passion. (Don't confuse passion with not having fun! The two are not mutually exclusive)
- I would create a real away supporters section. Having visiting supporters show up raises the temperature of the place and raises home supporters game, creates more excitement and increases ticket sales, media interest etc..
- I would pay for this by cutting out stupid glossy brochures, repetitive surveys and town halls, fake social media people and all the frivolous stuff and with extra ticket revenue and TV deals and make plans to grow the stadium because...

The place would be filled to the rafters every single game and there would be such a huge, enormous buzz about the club in the city and throughout North America. Every supporter would be the clubs best advocate and would be singing the praises of the club to friends in person, online, it would be the the talk of the media and other groups would be talking about the club (Like people are sick of hearing about Portland) That would be happening instead of most people badmouthing what a royal screwup MLSE has been so far to the point that they are loathed.

If I was really a partner to supporters groups and was constantly scratching their back and showing genuine love and asked them to scratch back a little, supporters would return the favour with jersey and merchandise sales, concession sales (That would be reasonably priced) etc.. MLS would benefit with increased road trip attendance too. Their advocacy would be worth 100x more than any stupid printed up glossy marketing item. In year 1, I actively contacted some advertisers and thanked them for their support of TFC and that I would endorse their products for their support! I even bought a fucking KIA and let them know. (I know, not very ultra, but I wanted TFC to succeed!)

From our short history, we get the impression that MLSE sees supporters as a nuisance that occasionally needs to be addressed and appeased. They openly have said they don't know the difference between a supporter and other fans. They don't realize that most of us actually want to be on the same page as them. We'd rather be friendly with them. We'd love for the club to be hugely financially successful and making money hand over fist. We want to be partners in the clubs success, but this has been mostly a one way marriage the past 5 years and a lot of supporters are asking for a divorce. We're not going to get stuck in a long-term, over-priced abusive relationship like leafs fans.

It is absolutely mind-boggling how they managed to take such an enormous opportunity that buzz around the team that fell in their lap in year one to the point where things are now.

So we now have town-appease-the-fans-hall 2.0 and they are throwing out Aron, Bob and Paul M.... IMO and many others, they don't really need to be out there. There was quite a few platitudes thrown out about things last year that were "going to be looked at" that resulted in nothing, and I unfortunately expect a lot more of the same. A lot of content about our 4 point-plan. (Great, implement it)

I think at this point, MLSE probably knows the kinds of things their customers really want, they just don't want to do it or don't have the desire to. Or maybe any decision gets stuck in stuffy, suited up board-rooms and dies by committee. If by now they don't recognize the value of supporters beyond ticket sales (With only about 5k at start of last nights game with majority being supporters), they probably never will.

I'm sure some casual new soccer fans who use this board as just a TFC discussion board, some "The sky is always bright and sunny with rainbows" type people and a few paid MLSE social media contributors will disagree, but I know this is what the majority of supporters who devout a huge chunk of the time and life to this thing will agree with. (Not every point on what I'd do, but overall sentiment)

As far a performance on pitch and our teams success, we're making good modest improvements and there is reason for some cautious optimism that we are slowly moving in right direction, but I'm not planning parade routes for us winning a supporters shield or championship just yet. The club's fabric still seems to lack some passion to want to be the best team in the league, not just having modest goals of "trying to hopefully, maybe make the playoffs." I like the new academy facility we are building, but I somewhat think the motivation is creating more Maurice Edu's to sell for $5 Mil, more than it truly is to make TFC the best team in MLS.

I get the overall sentiment (treat the supporters group better) and I agree with it. That being said there are so many issues with some of these things.

Bolded

-I'm in the south end and am a SSH since day one. I'm not a part of a supporters group. How do you propose taking my seat away (that I basically earned for having the foresight and interest before this team even had a name) to give it to a supporters group.

-Again...because I don't belong to a supporters group I don't deserve to be rewarded with freebies and reimbursement for terrible performances?

-legislating the team into paying hommage to the supporters section? this is a joke right?

-so stuff like town halls and brochures stating the teams goals are frivolous so you can pay to make an away support section....and then you complain that you're not heard?

I'm sorry but this kind of stuff screams of an inflated idea of self importance.

The supporters groups are awesome....they're a huge part of the game day experience.

That being said....You sound like you want the club to cater to a small group (in relative terms) to alleviate some sense of huge disrespect towards them.

I'm sorry but first and foremost is the product on the field.

After that the club has to figure out a way to accomodate ALL the SSH. At the end of the day...if they did all of the things you suggested they could conceivably end up with an empty stadium and 2000 very satisfied supporter group members.

Honest to god..the absolute last thing on my wishlist for this club is the super duper treatment of the members of the supporters clubs. And I'd wager that I'm not alone amongst the 12-13 (or 15...whatever it is) thousand SSH holders.

Give us a good product on the field. All the rest will take care of itself.

[Nestease]

what i think they need is selling South End stands as General admisson rather then being assigned to one seat.

Someone asked this exact question during the last years town hall meeting. The answer given by Paul Beirne was it's impossible due to safety reasons.

[MisterMacphisto]

I get the overall sentiment (treat the supporters group better) and I agree with it. That being said there are so many issues with some of these things.

Bolded

-I'm in the south end and am a SSH since day one. I'm not a part of a supporters group. How do you propose taking my seat away (that I basically earned for having the foresight and interest before this team even had a name) to give it to a supporters group.

-Again...because I don't belong to a supporters group I don't deserve to be rewarded with freebies and reimbursement for terrible performances?

-legislating the team into paying hommage to the supporters section? this is a joke right?

-so stuff like town halls and brochures stating the teams goals are frivolous so you can pay to make an away support section....and then you complain that you're not heard?

I'm sorry but this kind of stuff screams of an inflated idea of self importance.

The supporters groups are awesome....they're a huge part of the game day experience.

That being said....You sound like you want the club to cater to a small group (in relative terms) to alleviate some sense of huge disrespect towards them.

I'm sorry but first and foremost is the product on the field.

After that the club has to figure out a way to accomodate ALL the SSH. At the end of the day...if they did all of the things you suggested they could conceivably end up with an empty stadium and 2000 very satisfied supporter group members.

Honest to god..the absolute last thing on my wishlist for this club is the super duper treatment of the members of the supporters clubs. And I'd wager that I'm not alone amongst the 12-13 (or 15...whatever it is) thousand SSH holders.

Give us a good product on the field. All the rest will take care of itself.

The goal is being the best club in MLS. If anyone wants to support and be a part of that, go in a supporters section. Don't want to support, get out of the supporters section. I just want Toronto to have the best support in MLS, the best team in MLS, the best Club in MLS from top to bottom.

This isn't anything new, it works really well in Portland, Seattle to name a few MLS clubs. Their attendance is pretty good if you haven't noticed and they seem to be having fun. If just having a good "product" on the field was all that was needed, Columbus should be full to the rafters the past few seasons. I'm sorry dude, but it's going to be a loooooooooong time until a team in MLS can sellout simply on the class of talent on the pitch.

It's not a joke that players should show appreciation to fans. Many clubs and organizations tell their players to show respect to their fans. Portlands players are mandated to go along with their supporters traditions. UFC mandates their fighters to show fans mad respect and to connect with their fans whenever possible. What's a joke, is that some players and athletes have to be told in the first place.

Complaining about not being heard.... I'm not complaining about not being heard and this isn't about fucking self-importance. This talk of this thing being simply a "Product" and relegating supporters as just a part of the "game day experience" is the mentality of the FO, it's the path we've been on, and it's the one that leads to an empty stadium with only a hand full of supporters left.

The path that clubs like Seattle and Portland are taking, without the hokey marketing and focus on filling the stadium with soccer moms is the one that's filling stadiums and generating huge excitement and filling seats, getting more advertisers and TV deals. Players like playing for those types of clubs and environments too, they say so repeatedly. The video they show potential players has lots of highlights with supporters on it. When MLSE advertises and other companies advertise, they usually aren't showing pictures and video of people sitting in the middle of the stadium seats.

z9AKIblQKN4

I don't want my ego stroked by MLSE, I want to be a part of something huge and exciting. Showing appreciating to your most vocal advocates is the best way to get there. If you want to look at it in terms of pure product level, it's just good business.

I want fans outside of supporters sections to have an amazing day too and their issues addressed. I want them to enjoy good food and all those issues that aren't important to me. I want a winning team. I want the director of the club to drive a nice car and have a nice office. I want the bathrooms nice a tidy, I want the ball boys to have clean shirts, I want the grounds crew to have the best fertilizer...

Anyways... I won't completely right off the town-hall and that there isn't hope.

[torontocelt]

Please can anyone confirm if they have received an approval to their request to attend, not including those going to the supporters town halls?

[mastermixer]

I haven't. Booked for the Wed 7:30 slot. Hoping I don't get bumped, it's the only time I can go.

[Greg]

Just received a confirmation email for Wed.

[Red CB Toronto]

I just received my confirmation for Wednesday night, I guess I double clicked or something as i received two, one for each of the sessions that evening.

[Canary10]

I received one for the Thursday session.

[WestStandGeoff]

I received my confirmation a couple hours ago for the 7:30 Wednesday session.

[Mark in Ottawa]

I was gonna ask if there was a way for "fans from away" to submit questions/concerns like I always do to the supporters forum at the MLS Cup?

But it doesn't really matter if MisterMacphisto is gonna be there.
I think he summed up a lot of my concernsvery succinctly.
Thanks for that.

[123 elite]

It seems pointless. (Sorry for lengthy rant)



It isn't rocket science or some big mystery.

Supporters are (were) the club's biggest advocates. Go out of your way to treat your biggest advocates with some genuine respect and appreciation.

If I was running the show:
- North and South stand supporters sections would be general admission with very affordable seasons tickets.
- Whatever supporters needed, would be done. Proper lockable storage, areas or apparatuses to display TIFO's, advertising banners moved if needed, access to grounds, friendly helpful security, platforms for capo's in north stands, closeby warehouse space for TIFO creation, ANYTHING.
- I'd show genuine appreciation for supporters, by doing random things like throwing in a free CCL game, offer to cover expenses for 5 buses to an away game, offer a free game if we had a completely shit game where we lost 6-2 etc..
- I would offer random giveaways like signed kits for supporters groups that they could use as raffle to raise funds for TIFO's.
- I would let the team know that after games, as a TFC player it is mandatory, no matter win or lose, to go right up to supporters sections and show appreciation. Not half way, but right up to supporters sections.
- I would constantly ask supporters groups if there was anything I could do to help.
- As director, I wouldn't tweet condescending tweets towards supporters or constantly make jokes regarding things related to TFC, like the whole club was some half-hearted, casual and amusing personal past-time of mine. The club, the players, the supporters, the media, everyone top to bottom would know this was a genuine burning passion of mine to succeed. Everyone employed by the club would have to have the same passion. (Don't confuse passion with not having fun! The two are not mutually exclusive)
- I would create a real away supporters section. Having visiting supporters show up raises the temperature of the place and raises home supporters game, creates more excitement and increases ticket sales, media interest etc..
- I would pay for this by cutting out stupid glossy brochures, repetitive surveys and town halls, fake social media people and all the frivolous stuff and with extra ticket revenue and TV deals and make plans to grow the stadium because...

The place would be filled to the rafters every single game and there would be such a huge, enormous buzz about the club in the city and throughout North America. Every supporter would be the clubs best advocate and would be singing the praises of the club to friends in person, online, it would be the the talk of the media and other groups would be talking about the club (Like people are sick of hearing about Portland) That would be happening instead of most people badmouthing what a royal screwup MLSE has been so far to the point that they are loathed.

.

When i read this all i read is me me me me me. Free stuff, special treatment for ME. I am the most important person here. ME ME ME etc etc. Would you apply the same criteria to say BMO for the money they have put into the club? The south stand already has very affordable ticket prices. A season ticket works out at not much more than $20 a ticket. How cheap should it be ? What would make you happy ? $10 ? $5 ? And is it up to the red seats to make up the difference ? Because why .... they can afford it? They are all soccer moms? Free tickets, free kits, storage facilities? What else ? Carry you shoulder high to the pub after the game? Making players come and applaud you and only you after the game? Can i have them come over on mass and applaud me? What about the guys in section 220? After they are done with you do they all get in the elevator and go up there and buy them $13 beers? If you have a shitty day at work how would you feel if you had to go and applaud your boss and kiss his feet thanking him for the job you have.

There are what 15-16 thousand season ticket holders out there and only a small percentage are in a supporters club. I know you dont speak for everyone but as a non supporters club 5 year long fan reading this kind of self serving crap makes me want to just give it up. You clearly see yourself and the group you belong to as being more important than everyone else. How does that create an 'enormous buzz'. Isn't one of the problems at some f those clubs in Argentina that they have gone too far down that road to the point that its not a club anymore but a toy for gangster 'supporters groups'

There are plenty of problems at this club but its bad enough being at the mercy of a faceless organisation like MLSE who are experts at inventing new ways to take your money without adding a group to it that demand everything for virtually free.

[English Rachel]

I will be there tomorrow at 6

[Wull]

While I'm not looking for anything from the team etc. what I would point out is that this team gets advertised and promoted on the supporters section. They don't use the players (that much, may change with Frings and Koevs), they don't use the league, they don't use results, they don't use the people in the red seats, they use the south end, the NEE and 110-111. They don't owe us anything except for a fair shake and most people think they're making it a lot harder than it needs to be

[J .]

It would be great if they came out and offered the SGS the north end stand as a general admission seating. Not popular to all, but from what Ive heard from the FO they will not consider doing it out of safety concerns which I find to be a little silly and so far presented without evidence.

That said, as previously mentioned by me, I dont feel this has much of an effect. They failed in their promises last season (a GD of -20 doesnt not denote attacking football) so I expect little to come of this.

[Pookie]

^ puzzling comment regarding the north stand. Why exactly would this be great?

[Brooker]

That said, as previously mentioned by me, I dont feel this has much of an effect. They failed in their promises last season (a GD of -20 doesnt not denote attacking football) so I expect little to come of this.

Just because you're -20 doesn't mean you don't attack. Hell, sometimes teams have such a dreadful goal differential because they attack too much and get torn to shreds on the counter a la Blackpool who were -23.

[Section 110]

They don't need to give out free stuff, etc, to supporters because supporters aren't going anywhere; their loyalty is the one thing that the FO can count on. They will humour the supporter groups at Town Halls, etc, and provide what they can for the minimal amount of cost/effort. They're reasonably assured to get supporters' season ticket renewals which, I might add, tend to be for the cheapest seats in the stadium making the supporters less important from a ticket-sale point of view than someone who buys season seats in the dark greys, etc.

[Suds]

They don't need to give out free stuff, etc, to supporters because supporters aren't going anywhere; their loyalty is the one thing that the FO can count on. They will humour the supporter groups at Town Halls, etc, and provide what they can for the minimal amount of cost/effort. They're reasonably assured to get supporters' season ticket renewals which, I might add, tend to be for the cheapest seats in the stadium making the supporters less important from a ticket-sale point of view than someone who buys season seats in the dark greys, etc.

yeah, because we all sit the cheap seats

Care to trade invoices on our renewals? I'll gladly take on your dark grey if you pay mine.

[james]

Someone asked this exact question during the last years town hall meeting. The answer given by Paul Beirne was it's impossible due to safety reasons.

but from what ive seen on portland and Montreal Impact website they have sections sold as general admission, why is it possible for them to do it but not at BMO field? did the Toronto FC front office actually look into it?? is it to unsafe?? or did they just asume its unsafe? just dont want to lose control of where people are?? are they just lazy and cant be bothered to change it? id really like to know. If Montreal could do it in a similar like stadium or if they can do it down the street at Ampathetre i would like to know why it cant be done at BMO.

[__wowza]

so wait, when're they? i cant access my email from work.

[jabbronies]

I'll be there tonight.

[DichioTFC]

If someone is going, can they please bring up MLS scheduling? Its not a stretch to say more traveling support = louder, better home atmosphere (get a chance to know the chants, each other, etc.)

We will not buy into the league if our away games restrict us from watching away games in person.

[jazzy]

but from what ive seen on portland and Montreal Impact website they have sections sold as general admission, why is it possible for them to do it but not at BMO field? did the Toronto FC front office actually look into it?? is it to unsafe?? or did they just asume its unsafe? just dont want to lose control of where people are?? are they just lazy and cant be bothered to change it? id really like to know. If Montreal could do it in a similar like stadium or if they can do it down the street at Ampathetre i would like to know why it cant be done at BMO.

So what do u say to sth's that are holding seats in the area in question?.....get out, change seats?....it's too late, you can only do it at the beginning....I love our feeling of entilment, though.

[J .]

^ puzzling comment regarding the north stand. Why exactly would this be great?

I think it is the best location for the SGs to get together in one location.


Just because you're -20 doesn't mean you don't attack. Hell, sometimes teams have such a dreadful goal differential because they attack too much and get torn to shreds on the counter a la Blackpool who were -23.

Indeed, and look at what happened to Blackpool. They couldnt score enough goals and were not suited to playing that style successfully. Therefore, that style of play was unsuccessful and in my opinion a failure. Good coaches take average and make it a winner. This season has been a failure.

Will season 6 be different? Let us all hope that their Winter gamble will pay off and enjoy a winning side.

[Canary10]

If anyone's going tonight give us an update! I'm very curious to hear what's being talked about.

[TFC1154ever]

If anyone's going tonight give us an update! I'm very curious to hear what's being talked about.

+1 please do

[Pookie]

I think it is the best location for the SGs to get together in one location.



what would make it different though? 112 and 113 are pretty easy for folks to "get together"... if NEE moves over, there you go.

Massive price drop would be required to move to the North and that isn't going to happen. So, unless folks are willing to triple their expenses to "get together in one (different) location", I'm not at all certain what benefit there would be.

[Yohan]

what would make it different though? 112 and 113 are pretty easy for folks to "get together"... if NEE moves over, there you go.

Massive price drop would be required to move to the North and that isn't going to happen. So, unless folks are willing to triple their expenses to "get together in one (different) location", I'm not at all certain what benefit there would be.
not enough spots in 112 and 113 for all the SGs. not to mention no room for growth

[J .]

not enough spots in 112 and 113 for all the SGs. not to mention no room for growth


Agreed

I also, this would get a chance for a just supporters section and I think it would get better sound. The south end has lots of people who really arent interested. They could keep the South side for people into the supporters but not really participate. I think there could be a more participatory culture developed with organization in one area.

Security wise I think it would solve a lot of grief between people. Fans and those more interested in just watching and not contributing would have their defined areas as supporters would migrate to one area.

Plus the view is pretty awesome from there ;)

[Phil]

not enough spots in 112 and 113 for all the SGs. not to mention no room for growth

Even with the price drop tickets will cost more per game.

Growth like that does have a cost, I just don't know how attractive supporters groups are considering the image that some want to push on others.

[Alonso]

what would make it different though? 112 and 113 are pretty easy for folks to "get together"... if NEE moves over, there you go.

Massive price drop would be required to move to the North and that isn't going to happen. So, unless folks are willing to triple their expenses to "get together in one (different) location", I'm not at all certain what benefit there would be.

A massive price drop has been given in those seats. The price is a little over 1.5 times the price of yellows at the moment. Not totally unreasonable if the offer of a supporter group only section with control was tabled.

Would you pay 1.5 times more to have what Seattle or Portland have? Plus room to grow?

[Alonso]

Even with the price drop tickets will cost more per game.

Growth like that does have a cost, I just don't know how attractive supporters groups are considering the image that some want to push on others.

I'm not very clear on what you are trying to say here.

[Phil]

I'm not very clear on what you are trying to say here.

There just seems to be a lot of negativity surrounding supporters groups and I think it has a toll. Just my point of view, but it seems easier to attract growth when things are more positive.

[__wowza]

any news on whats being said at the town hall?
i know last year we had a bit of a live blog, but i could be mistaken.

looking forward to a write up/the blogs section being updated en masse. itll give me something to read and pontificate at work tomorrow.

[Phil]

any news on whats being said at the town hall?
i know last year we had a bit of a live blog, but i could be mistaken.

looking forward to a write up/the blogs section being updated en masse. itll give me something to read and pontificate at work tomorrow.

Its more of an interactive session with club management vs. a meeting with front office. Hence there being no updates about burning issues, it will be big picture stuff about on field product.

I am curious to hear though.

[Alonso]

There just seems to be a lot of negativity surrounding supporters groups and I think it has a toll. Just my point of view, but it seems easier to attract growth when things are more positive.

Oh I see. I'm glad I didn't respond with what I thought you were trying to say.:D

That would have been egg on my face.

[__wowza]

There just seems to be a lot of negativity surrounding supporters groups and I think it has a toll. Just my point of view, but it seems easier to attract growth when things are more positive.

i think a supporters group pseudo merger could work. you keep everyone in the same section but run separately, sorta like a mafia 5 families deal. i could just be talking out of my ass, but the nordecke seemed to pan out.

whadaya mean by a lot of negativity? within the groups or with others towards us?

[Alonso]

i think a supporters group pseudo merger could work. you keep everyone in the same section but run separately, sorta like a mafia 5 families deal. i could just be talking out of my ass, but the nordecke seemed to pan out.

whadaya mean by a lot of negativity? within the groups or with others towards us?

This is part of what I was reading into his post. I think he means others outside the group have a negative perception of "Supporters Groups" in general.

[Phil]

This is part of what I was reading into his post. I think he means others outside the group have a negative perception of "Supporters Groups" in general.

Bingo, and people and online comments sometimes get misread, misunderstood.

[Alonso]

Even with the price drop tickets will cost more per game.

Growth like that does have a cost, I just don't know how attractive supporters groups are considering the image that some want to push on others.

Yeah but it would be nice if that when this happens we have seats to offer these new members in our section. Like in the North End for instance :scarf::flare::scarf:

[__wowza]

Bingo, and people and online comments sometimes get misread, misunderstood.

mhmm, s'why i asked for clarification. weird perception, are there any specific issues they have with TFC fans? i havent heard of anything major.


Its more of an interactive session with club management vs. a meeting with front office. Hence there being no updates about burning issues, it will be big picture stuff about on field product.

I am curious to hear though.

yeah, i was at the one last year. i couldve sworn there was someone posting from their phone. last year there were enough burning issues for the supporters to dig at, but you still had people throw specific issues in. i know the payment package being unflexable was one of them.

[torontocelt]

mhmm, s'why i asked for clarification. weird perception, are there any specific issues they have with TFC fans? i havent heard of anything major.



yeah, i was at the one last year. i couldve sworn there was someone posting from their phone. last year there were enough burning issues for the supporters to dig at, but you still had people throw specific issues in. i know the payment package being unflexable was one of them.

Is there a separate thread in the members section perhaps ? i am pretty sure last year there was and it was kept separate to help facilitate the move of more STH who were not in supporters sections to get into the south stand.

[king dave]

I just bought an 8 gb mp3 player and have absolutely no know idea how to use it.
Maybe I should have a town hall?
KD.

[Alonso]

I just bought an 8 gb mp3 player and have absolutely no know idea how to use it.
Maybe I should have a town hall?
KD.

...LOL

[__wowza]

I just bought an 8 gb mp3 player and have absolutely no know idea how to use it.
Maybe I should have a town hall?
KD.

we can all sit around and complain about the price you paid for it.

[king dave]

Maybe I should hire one of you tech-douchebags to teach me how to get it up and running?
KD.

[Alonso]

I just bought an 8 gb mp3 player and have absolutely no know idea how to use it.
Maybe I should have a town hall?
KD.

So do you no know how much you paid for it?

[MisterMacphisto]

When i read this all i read is me me me me me. Free stuff, special treatment for ME. I am the most important person here. ME ME ME etc etc. Would you apply the same criteria to say BMO for the money they have put into the club? The south stand already has very affordable ticket prices. A season ticket works out at not much more than $20 a ticket. How cheap should it be ? What would make you happy ? $10 ? $5 ? And is it up to the red seats to make up the difference ? Because why .... they can afford it? They are all soccer moms? Free tickets, free kits, storage facilities? What else ? Carry you shoulder high to the pub after the game? Making players come and applaud you and only you after the game? Can i have them come over on mass and applaud me? What about the guys in section 220? After they are done with you do they all get in the elevator and go up there and buy them $13 beers? If you have a shitty day at work how would you feel if you had to go and applaud your boss and kiss his feet thanking him for the job you have.

There are what 15-16 thousand season ticket holders out there and only a small percentage are in a supporters club. I know you dont speak for everyone but as a non supporters club 5 year long fan reading this kind of self serving crap makes me want to just give it up. You clearly see yourself and the group you belong to as being more important than everyone else. How does that create an 'enormous buzz'. Isn't one of the problems at some f those clubs in Argentina that they have gone too far down that road to the point that its not a club anymore but a toy for gangster 'supporters groups'

There are plenty of problems at this club but its bad enough being at the mercy of a faceless organisation like MLSE who are experts at inventing new ways to take your money without adding a group to it that demand everything for virtually free.

I wasn't talking about me me me me, I was talking about what I would do for supporters if I was running the club for supporters. I also explained that all aspects of all STH's were important to me, as well as the people who work at BMO and even the people on top. I was just mostly talking about supporters because this is a supporters board.

For myself personally, all I would really like is a general admission supporter's section. I'd like to bunch up with other like minded supporters who's main goal is the best support, like there is at academy games an on the road. I'd like a positive environment where that mentality grows until it is the best support in MLS.

I mention things I would do for supporters if I was running, because from a support aspect, those things would help grow the movement to support. It's things that are done or similarly done in Portland and Seattle. (I know people are sick of hearing about them, I understand, I hate mentioning them, but it's relevant) I mention them because I think it would be simply be good business for FO, as it would generate excitement and buzz for the club on so many levels.

The alternative is apathy. All you have to do is look at ACTUAL attendance the last few months and apathy in so many other areas. Attendance is going to be even more rocky next season.

Anyways, your comment about showing that kind of appreciation for supporters will lead to gangster supporters groups like Argentina is beyond ridiculous and says a lot about your point of view.

[Pookie]

Yeah but it would be nice if that when this happens we have seats to offer these new members in our section. Like in the North End for instance :scarf::flare::scarf:

As a testament to our leadership, they were able to secure some tickets in 112 this year. Then came flares and smoke bombs and the net result is that I don't think you are going to see SG controlled sections in the near future.

As for "room to grow", there is plenty of room all across the South End. The concept of a unified North End sounds wonderful, until you realize that the entire South End is there in front of us yet there does not seem to be a plan, or a will amongst the groups to bring it together.

I don't see how moving changes anything if you bring the same baggage with you. It's just a more expensive house with a crappy view of the video score board.

[Globetrotter]

I was at the 6pm showing. It was decent. There were discussions about the team, the game, the style. One bonehead had a 7 minute speech that was fairly painful to listen to, and fully typed out on a couple of pages. He was trying to slam MLSE for not giving respect and free or discounted tickets. A lot of what he was saying had merit, unfortunately however it was pretty amateur in style. When that happens, the message often loses its bite. It was a full out attack, using terms like "you've never done this", "I've never seen that"; he positioned himself to be picked off. Some decent points overshadowed by, perhaps, lack of experience, or some unbiased proof reading.

Fortunately the response given was brief, and we could move on to topics that weren't at the heart of last years debates.

There were big applauds when someone suggested we needed a team full of guys like Eckersley. Though nobody on staff disagreed, De Clerk added that though the fans see him as a great showman and devoted player, he sees Eckersley differently from a technical side and it's important to find the balance between attractive soccer and sound soccer.

There were points about poor schedules. TFC are locked into X amount of games decided by the networks. They play 34 games in 34 weeks, minus 4 fifa weekends, plus all other added tournaments... so night games will happen, so will mid week games. They also discussed trying to combine road trips league wide so that games (for example) against Van-Por-Sea could be played Sat-Wed-Sat to minimize travel costs, fatigue throughout the year etc.

All in all, there was a lot of positivity. Concerns were brought up and discussed. There was just that one 7 minute blip that just didn't fit in tonight.

[Alonso]

As a testament to our leadership, they were able to secure some tickets in 112 this year. Then came flares and smoke bombs and the net result is that I don't think you are going to see SG controlled sections in the near future.

As for "room to grow", there is plenty of room all across the South End. The concept of a unified North End sounds wonderful, until you realize that the entire South End is there in front of us yet there does not seem to be a plan, or a will amongst the groups to bring it together.

I don't see how moving changes anything if you bring the same baggage with you.

These seats in the South End are all spoken for. 80% of the North End is not spoken for yet (But soon, this will no longer be true). A MAJORITY of RPB think this is a good idea.

There is NO ROOM in the south end. Not even ONE seat. As you have pointed out, the leadership have worked very hard to secure the group SOME seats in 112, like 20 or so. THERE ARE HUNDREDS AND HUNDREDS OF SEATS ALL TOGETHER IN THE NORTH END. ACTUALLY OVER A THOUSAND I WOULD GUESS.

Please answer my original question to you. Would you be willing to pay 1.5 times your current yellow ticket price to have what Portland and Seattle have?


Also, no one is certain if the flares and smoke bombs were RPB or not. Weren't they were in the North End? I was getting an appendectomy that game and couldn't make it. But regardless a few fans doing whatever cannot be held against this group period.

[king dave]

None of my bizz but, how were the town hall wings tonight?
KD.

[king dave]

^^Yeah!
What the soup guy said?
KD.

[Suds]

None of my bizz but, how were the town hall wings tonight?
KD.

heard the wings were great .. and they had Tetley's too

http://www.carlsberggroup.com/brands/PublishingImages/Bottles/UK/tetles_smoothflow_can.png

[Globetrotter]

Wings, veggies, doritos + salsa, drinks (beer, water, soft drinks).

[MisterMacphisto]

Would you be willing to pay 1.5 times your current yellow ticket price to have what Portland and Seattle have?

I don't know why FO wouldn't be willing to drop the tickets a little in the north stands to have what Portland and Seattle have.

[DOMIN8R]

The wings were good and they hand out 2 drink tickets. The only part your would care about, Kraft Dinner, are the 2 drink tickets.

[king dave]

heard the wings were great .. and they had Tetley's too

http://www.carlsberggroup.com/brands/PublishingImages/Bottles/UK/tetles_smoothflow_can.png
Well that is something+.
But you are NOW a whore you fuckl.
KD.

[Alonso]

I don't know why FO wouldn't be willing to drop the tickets a little in the north stands to have what Portland and Seattle have.

They've dropped it by more then 30% for next year. If we made a proposal that they would like maybe they would drop it more. As of now they are only 1.5 times more then the cheapest seats in the house.

[Suds]

Well that is something+.
But you are NOW a whore you fuckl.
KD.

not yet ... I go tomorrow :)

[king dave]

The wings were good and they hand out 2 drink tickets. The only part your would care about, Kraft Dinner, are the 2 drink tickets.
Very wellnascarcuyguy done Harold.
KD.

[Alonso]

Well that is something+.
But you are NOW a whore you fuckl.
KD.

Jesus KD. LOL... again.




















This time I have Guinness up my nose.

[king dave]

not yet ... I go tomorrow :)
You have a someting to offer son.
KD.

[Kyle_121]

i think a supporters group pseudo merger could work. you keep everyone in the same section but run separately, sorta like a mafia 5 families deal. i could just be talking out of my ass, but the nordecke seemed to pan out.


Things are already a giant mess with 2 major SGs in 112 and 113. I once wandered over for a game and it was brutal. There was almost no coordination or cooperation with regards to getting a large group of people that spanned multiple sections to all do the same chant.

If there was a single person leading the chants or multiple people that were truly coordinated, then it might work, but adding in additional groups like the NEE guys or whatever will just add more noise and no clarity.

[king dave]

I really miss the days.
KD.

[denime]

These seats in the South End are all spoken for. 80% of the North End is not spoken for yet (But soon, this will no longer be true). A MAJORITY of RPB think this is a good idea.

There is NO ROOM in the south end. Not even ONE seat. As you have pointed out, the leadership have worked very hard to secure the group SOME seats in 112, like 20 or so. THERE ARE HUNDREDS AND HUNDREDS OF SEATS ALL TOGETHER IN THE NORTH END. ACTUALLY OVER A THOUSAND I WOULD GUESS.

Please answer my original question to you. Would you be willing to pay 1.5 times your current yellow ticket price to have what Portland and Seattle have?


Also, no one is certain if the flares and smoke bombs were RPB or not. Weren't they were in the North End? I was getting an appendectomy that game and couldn't make it. But regardless a few fans doing whatever cannot be held against this group period.

For a move like this I wouldn't call 54% a Majority,it just shows that half of the members would stay where they are,and in that case we are better off in South.

[Alonso]

Things are already a giant mess with 2 major SGs in 112 and 113. I once wandered over for a game and it was brutal. There was almost no coordination or cooperation with regards to getting a large group of people that spanned multiple sections to all do the same chant.

If there was a single person leading the chants or multiple people that were truly coordinated, then it might work, but adding in additional groups like the NEE guys or whatever will just add more noise and no clarity.

Yeah man, there really has to be more inroads laid between the groups. It's pathetic and short sighted when we are chanting against/out of unison, of each other.

Yesterday was great. The whole Southend was chanting in tune and cooperating and sounding great. This is what can be game in and game out if we (like minded singing TFC supporters) all united in one area.

[Phil]

For a move like this I wouldn't call 54% a Majority,it just shows that half of the members would stay where they are,and in that case we are better off in South.

Think about the absent vote too. Just saying.

[Pookie]

These seats in the South End are all spoken for. 80% of the North End is not spoken for yet (But soon, this will no longer be true). A MAJORITY of RPB think this is a good idea)

Please answer my original question to you. Would you be willing to pay 1.5 times your current yellow ticket price to have what Portland and Seattle have?


Also, no one is certain if the flares and smoke bombs were RPB or not. Weren't they were in the North End? I was getting an appendectomy that game and couldn't make it. But regardless a few fans doing whatever cannot be held against this group period.

Re: majority
I'd have to go back to that thread and to be fair you'd need true costs on it before it goes from a simple poll to an actual motion. I don't recall an overwhelming vote either way.

Re: would I pay
I'm not the one to ask as I already have a pair of dark greys to go along with 111 tickets. I am very skeptical that a larg percentage want to pay 1.5 times or triple as currently priced

Re: smokes and flares
Smokes were lit in 112 flares in 127. Flares also lit on RPB road trip. Flies in the face of the notion that a supporter controlled section can police itself. Whether RPBs lit the flare on the road trip or the smoke bomb, the fact is that it wasnt controlled or self policed.


I would absolutely love what Portland has. I would just be spending more time and energy on engaging the south end through membership recruitment and more strategic use of drums and capos to name just a few.

[Alonso]

For a move like this I wouldn't call 54% a Majority,it just shows that half of the members would stay where they are,and in that case we are better off in South.

Depends, if their was a clear and relevant offer on the table. 54% are for the conjectured idea. But how many would agree if the terms were solid and defined?

I would say upwards of 65%. Many are hesitant to say yes for various reasons which would go away if there was actually an offer with clear consequences. A vote for change is always heavily in favour of "No" until all the cards are on the table.

[king dave]

Now I support smoke, flares, banners and flags.
Because I blelieve that that is the way supporters should be allowed to express the feelings they suppress all week to support any given team.
KD.

[Phil]

The absent vote is a moot point. It works both ways.

I don't see it that way when its in the 75% range.

[Yohan]

I would absolutely love what Portland has. I would just be spending more time and energy on engaging the south end through membership recruitment and more strategic use of drums and capos to name just a few.
I'd love to hear your ideas because the support has been regressing last two years, and the supporters section does not seem to be getting better

[Ultra & Proud]

I would absolutely love what Portland has. I would just be spending more time and energy on engaging the south end through membership recruitment and more strategic use of drums and capos to name just a few.

This right here is bang on and what SHOULD be looked at. So many people down there have no clue about the SGs and don't know anyone and won't just wander into a SG pub or tailgate to get acquainted. It's not an easy thing to walk into 5 years in. These groups come off as very cliquey and that is a put off. Active & friendly recruitment from all SG groups would be great.

[Alonso]

Re: majority
I'd have to go back to that thread and to be fair you'd need true costs on it before it goes from a simple poll to an actual motion. I don't recall an overwhelming vote either way.

Re: would I pay
I'm not the one to ask as I already have a pair of dark greys to go along with 111 tickets. I am very skeptical that a larg percentage want to pay 1.5 times or triple as currently priced

Re: smokes and flares
Smokes were lit in 112 flares in 127. Flares also lit on RPB road trip. Flies in the face of the notion that a supporter controlled section can police itself. Whether RPBs lit the flare on the road trip or the smoke bomb, the fact is that it wasnt controlled or self policed.


I would absolutely love what Portland has. I would just be spending more time and energy on engaging the south end through membership recruitment and more strategic use of drums and capos to name just a few.


A large percentage, actually the majority I would venture to guess, of RPB's would be paying less for their seats if we moved to the North End. The fact that we don't have these stats is not good. As a group, we should know who our constituents are.

To the second bolded point, It wasn't controlled or self policed because we were never given control or the option to self police. But if we were... well we don't know yet do we?

[Alonso]

I don't see it that way when its in the 75% range.

All things being equal, and since none of us can know any different, those 75% would have voted exactly as the rest of us who did vote.

It's clear logic, Occam's Razor, if you will.

[king dave]

I don't see it that way when its in the 75% range.
Phil?
You are a great supporter and a leader, in the true sense, of any group.
Gary too.
Me?
Not a hit over here I think:D
But just a bit more transparency/accountability woulk go a long way after the prev. $$$ fuck up.
KD.

[phonzo]

A large percentage, actually the majority I would venture to guess, of RPB's would be paying less for their seats if we moved to the North End. The fact that we don't have these stats is not good. As a group, we should know who our constituents are.

To the second bolded point, It wasn't controlled or self policed because we were never given control or the option to self police. But if we were... well we don't know yet do we?

Considering after the poll majority was against the move your majority assumption is incorrect. Not caring means indifference thus considered a no vote. Just like at work

[phonzo]

Phil?
You are a great supporter and a leader, in the true sense, of any group.
Gary too.
Me?
Not a hit over here I think:D
But just a bit more transparency/accountability woulk go a long way after the prev. $$$ fuck up.
KD.

Hey stud

[king dave]

Check this!
Move to members please?
KD.

[king dave]

Hey stud
I luv you!
KD.

[phonzo]

Check this!
Move to members please?
KD.

Nah there is a members discussion that has been open for a while. No need for two threads :)

[Phil]

lets keep the laundry in its place. :D KD brings a good point.

[Alonso]

Maybe a forced vote should be in order.

Time is of the essence, and we only have a few months to even give this a shot at all. If it appears, as it does with your own vote call Rooney, that there is a majority interest in moving to the north end with all other willing singing supporters; then lets have a forced vote by all members to finally put this one to bed.

Everyone has to vote or their membership is revoked/suspended, something.

The question should be simple and clear.

[king dave]

I have a request fo the Moe song from some Voyegeurs supporters Feg you fuck?
KD.

[jazzy]

it was casual and basically very nonconfronting.....great wings and veggies....enjoyed the cider,....it started off with someone saying ticket prices were too cheap,..yup?...even Anselmi laughed and said most of us would disagree. Mostly fan based questions and finally at the end we got into scheduling,..(front loaded)..At least we got Deklerk and Winter's perspective on everything. Anselmi mentioned stadium expansion basically on the backburner but did allow that they didn't rule out two roofs. Lots of emphasis on academy. When friendlies were brought up Winters mentioned he was asked to play Juventus but declined, (correctly) that his schedule was way too tight for a basically non-important game. Great emphasis on their disappointment of our MLS ref's and felt that the Canadian teams were all to often put at a disadvantage as per the American teams.? It basically ended with someone voicing their approval that DeRO was sent packing...I finally woke up and needed a cider after that. But had a nice chat with Winter after and I like the man, get him talking football and he is very eloquent. He has complete faith in our youngsters and feels they, correctly are our future. I mentioned how much I loved Morgans rise and he concurred mentioning with great pride the Canadian coach is longing for a LB and
guess who is getting the call!!...Go Ashton! PS thought this thread was about town hall's......my mistake,...seems...it's the north-end move thread.......))

[Alonso]

Considering after the poll majority was against the move your majority assumption is incorrect. Not caring means indifference thus considered a no vote. Just like at work

54%, or the majority, WERE for the move.

As to indifference, it works both ways. Maybe many thought, whats the point, a move will never happen. Right?

[Yohan]

Hey stud
i think phonzo has man love with every guy in RPB. slut :hump:

[123 elite]

I wasn't talking about me me me me, I was talking about what I would do for supporters if I was running the club for supporters. I also explained that all aspects of all STH's were important to me, as well as the people who work at BMO and even the people on top. I was just mostly talking about supporters because this is a supporters board.

For myself personally, all I would really like is a general admission supporter's section. I'd like to bunch up with other like minded supporters who's main goal is the best support, like there is at academy games an on the road. I'd like a positive environment where that mentality grows until it is the best support in MLS.

I mention things I would do for supporters if I was running, because from a support aspect, those things would help grow the movement to support. It's things that are done or similarly done in Portland and Seattle. (I know people are sick of hearing about them, I understand, I hate mentioning them, but it's relevant) I mention them because I think it would be simply be good business for FO, as it would generate excitement and buzz for the club on so many levels.

The alternative is apathy. All you have to do is look at ACTUAL attendance the last few months and apathy in so many other areas. Attendance is going to be even more rocky next season.

Anyways, your comment about showing that kind of appreciation for supporters will lead to gangster supporters groups like Argentina is beyond ridiculous and says a lot about your point of view.

What you said was....

If I was running the show:
- North and South stand supporters sections would be general admission with very affordable seasons tickets.

$360 or $395 (Yellow or lights) is already a very affordable price.


- Whatever supporters needed, would be done. Proper lockable storage, areas or apparatuses to display TIFO's, advertising banners moved if needed, access to grounds, friendly helpful security, platforms for capo's in north stands, closeby warehouse space for TIFO creation, ANYTHING.

So what then 15000 lockers? I'm a supporter as are many around me not in the south end. Do we get lockers? What does MLSE say to the advertisers putting th emoney into the club ? Sorry.... need that space for banners? What kind of business plan is that ?

- I'd show genuine appreciation for supporters, by doing random things like throwing in a free CCL game,
OK thats potentially 15000 free tickets now.

offer to cover expenses for 5 buses to an away game,

Only 5? How many does a bus hold 60 ? So 300 places. Pecking order based on what ?

offer a free game if we had a completely shit game where we lost 6-2 etc.. See previous free game arguement

So they sell 12000 tickets for a CCL gmae and they are rubbish. What do they do then ? Give out 12000 free tickets? To who? If liverpool suck in the Europa league do they give out 45000 free tickets for the next game ? Or do they only give them to the Kop? How does that work?


- I would offer random giveaways like signed kits for supporters groups that they could use as raffle to raise funds for TIFO's.

Why ? Can i have a random free kit? I could use it to raise money too.



- I would let the team know that after games, as a TFC player it is mandatory, no matter win or lose, to go right up to supporters sections and show appreciation. Not half way, but right up to supporters sections.

Are you serious ? Again it appears that supporters are all in the south stand.


- I would constantly ask supporters groups if there was anything I could do to help.

Why ? To help what ? Paint a banner?

- As director, I wouldn't tweet condescending tweets towards supporters or constantly make jokes regarding things related to TFC, like the whole club was some half-hearted, casual and amusing personal past-time of mine. The club, the players, the supporters, the media, everyone top to bottom would know this was a genuine burning passion of mine to succeed. Everyone employed by the club would have to have the same passion. (Don't confuse passion with not having fun! The two are not mutually exclusive)
- I would create a real away supporters section. Having visiting supporters show up raises the temperature of the place and raises home supporters game, creates more excitement and increases ticket sales, media interest etc..


In 5 years the biggest away support i have ever seen is columbus a few years ago. At BMO its about 30-50 tops. Potential with Montreal but considering its an 8-10 hr drive to Columbus, Boston, Chicago, NY or Philly it doesn't really suggest a great business move to promote an away section. So how about keeping it real.


- I would pay for this by cutting out stupid glossy brochures, repetitive surveys and town halls, fake social media people and all the frivolous stuff and with extra ticket revenue and TV deals and make plans to grow the stadium because...


No issue here.


Like i said in my earlier post i feel your ideas are based on the notion that that corner of the south end is the most important thing in this club. It's not. We are all supporters. Nothing grates me more than being told i am less of a fan because i dont stand in that section and there are thousands like me that follow everything in this club that dont. You are not special. You dont deserve any different treatment from the rest of us that pay up every year. If you start to divide the supporters into loyalty based groups of your own invention then what actually happens in your own section ? The longest serving are the most important ? Are they first place on those 5 buses. Its a bullshit arguement and an idea that i have never heard anywhere in all the years i have watched football. And like i said in Argentina once a small group gets to decide how the show is run then slippery slope my friend. If it was such a ridiclous statement the situation in Argentina wouldn't exist. It does.

I want things to improve here but to divide up supporters into 'i'm a better supporter than you' groups is not the way to go. I love the action of the south end. It brings a lot of atmosphere to the games but when i am in the stadium watching the the team almost everyone around me is too. And other than the odd 10 sec mild amusement reaction to the south end jumping up and down.... no-one really cares that much. We just want a winning team.

[king dave]

lets keep the laundry in its place. :D KD brings a good point.
Thanks Phil.
Give Diane a kiss for me.
KD.

[Phil]

Thanks Phil.
Give Diane a kiss for me.
KD.

Will do. Give Kitty one for me.

[phonzo]

Maybe a forced vote should be in order.

Time is of the essence, and we only have a few months to even give this a shot at all. If it appears, as it does with your own vote call Rooney, that there is a majority interest in moving to the north end with all other willing singing supporters; then lets have a forced vote by all members to finally put this one to bed.

Everyone has to vote or their membership is revoked/suspended, something.

The question should be simple and clear.

No, things unfortunately are never this cut and dry. Let's take a look at just a few negatives to north that have been brought up and just some other points:

1) Limited room for growth - in the end there is a finite amount if seats while I love the idea of 1000 united supporters the fact this becomes the max for something we all believe in growing...doesn't work
2) banner space - we would need to fight a long upward battle for this. Most of the north is advertising space. Commence rants about commercialization of the game now.

Additionally a personal view. There is a strong belief that a single section will resolve what SGs believe is driving membership numbers down. Unfortunately I can't see this as being true. Pookie nailed a few points earlier in this thread but I'd like to add an additional thought. Look at the issues getting just the south end at times to coordinate. Do you think any of those issues would magically disappear in the north end? Nope

[phonzo]

54%, or the majority, WERE for the move.

As to indifference, it works both ways. Maybe many thought, whats the point, a move will never happen. Right?

Not true. Indifference is a sign of complacency and acceptance thus accepting status quo. Nor was that poll which is still open anywhere close to the majority of our members.

[phonzo]

i think phonzo has man love with every guy in RPB. slut :hump:

I save myself for you ;)

[Yohan]

I save myself for you ;)
ohhhhhhh... *hump*

[phonzo]

However as per KDs wisdom if there is more discussion needed on the groups view please take it to the appropriate members thread.

[king dave]

Will do. Give Kitty one for me.
:D:D:D:D:D
KD.

[king dave]

I love fucking you doucebags!
except fo GeorgeB
KD.

[Rocket Robin]

Details of the Toronto FC Town Hall Meeting of Wednesday September 28th, 2011 at 6:00pm.
The meeting was held at the Rogers Club at BMO Field.


By Rocket Robin (who writes updates on the CSL games on one of the other threads but I'm also a season ticket holder. I didn't get the e-mail but thank the staff for getting me a place).


The meeting started at 6:12pm. There were six chairs at the front occupied by:
Paul Mariner—director of player development (TA)
Earl Cochrane—director of team operations (EC)
Bob de Klerk—assistant head coach (BdK)
Aron Winter—head coach (AW)
Tom Anselmi—MLSE executive VP & COO (TA)
Paul Beirne—senior director business operations (PB)

Paul Beirne introduced who was up at front.


TA starts with a statement. It's a good opportunity to meet people. A dialogue on a different level than
last year. There's been two halves to the season. He's confident we're heading in the right direction.


AW welcomes everyone. The fans are the twelfth man on the team. He likes being here to build to where we want to be. The book we sent to the fans outline our pillars. We have two definitions of winning—short term and long term. Long term is the investment in youth development. He doesn't want to make long statements which are outlined in the book...This is your evening! One other thing,
this is a great company to work for. We have a commitment to succeed.


Questions (from different people Fan 1 to 14):
Fan 1. Why did Danny Koevermans only play one half last night?
AW Danny was tired so he was subbed off but he's OK.


Fan 2. What have you noticed is the biggest difference between MLS and Europe?
AW We have to work with a salary cap. The distance between cities. The short period between games.
There are a lot of rules but Paul Mariner knows them.


Fan 3. I hate Saturday night games because I have young children.
AW likes to play in the afternoon.
TA They've been pushed into them for the television deal they have with TSN. There may be a way to split the afternoon and night games in their ticket packages.
PB There are 34 games in 34 weeks plus four NCC games BUT they will have to take four weekends off for FIFA dates. All midweek games are at night.


Fan 4. Makes some good comments about the Academy players but how will they train 'overcoached' 13 year olds?
BdK Some of the Academy players may make the first team. Three former Academy players looked good last night. Ashton Morgan, Matt Stinson, Doneil Henry. Ashton Morgan has just been named as a Canadian international.
I ask: Can Academy players brought up 'flip' back down to the Academy?
BdK It depends on the contract.
BdK There is enough talent in the area to have young 13 year olds to form a team.


Fan 5. Reads from a prepared speech—He says it's MLSE that's his source of frustration. He's not blaming the players and staff. He gave the Dwayne de Rosario example. He feels he's been disrespected for five seasons. He says MLSE overpriced the Concacaf tickets so many seats were unfilled. (whereas Seattle only charged $15 for seats). He's heard five seasons of “We're do better”. MLSE has crushed my spirits. The only gesture they've made is frozen next year's prices. I'm out of blood! MLSE has mismanaged the team through six coaches in five seasons. The image that you give is “we've screwed up”. We have the highest prices in the league. Please give us some respect!
(huge round of applause).
AW TFC and MLSE are one. We're making a new start. We've got to believe. Sometimes it's MLS (meaning Major League Soccer) that makes the decision (as a reference to De Rosario). I've only been here nine months. He can't promise we'll be satisfied.


Fan 6 first compliments Academy. He's become disillusioned. He can't GIVE his tickets away!
Asks TA: Besides having a good team, how will we bring the 'buzz' back?
TA He knows we're frustrated in Year 4 but now the team has made changes that he believes in.


Fan 7 The 4-3-3 model. Who do we have to bring in to make it work? What is the long term plan to pull it off?
BdK It must be created. Plata and Avila are creative and attacking. Youth 8-19 are needed to build this program. They need good coaches. Now our roster needs 'left footed defenders' yet only Andy Iro is that now—we need two or three more. We need a '4' and '5' Ashtone Morgan is one but he can't play 40 or 50 games in a season. Only Plata can play in position '11'. We have a decent midfield.


Fan 8 No night games in April please! TFC should play more of a balanced schedule in that they'd always played three games more than most other teams from early on. There's bad press in this city. There's no player profiles. We need three Eckersley's who play their heart out. (Applause)


Fan 9 The Adrian Cann and Dicoy Williams injuries?
AW We're bringing them back for preseason. They should be ready. We will try to keep the 'on-loan'
Eckersley and Plata.


Fan 10 Please try to schedule away games together so fans can travel. Vancouver-Seattle-Portland.
PB agrees. It makes financial sense, there's less travel, it's easier on the players.
AW reading his notes—We travel 150,000kms. We've been 50 times in an airplane this season. There's 56 games in 9 months. We've been away 172 days. Because of recovery days there's only been 63 days we could train. It hurts a rebuilding team.


Fan 11 Requests that coaches not be so nice. Get thrown out of games when the referee calls go wrong.
AW The refs decisions have cost us points. He's found out it's not good to complain. We need refs from Europe to train North American ones.
BdK didn't know the refs were so poor! He tries to speak in Dutch but it seems the refs understand. Aron tells him to sit down during games.


Fan 12 There's been scheduling problems, fan fanatics are disappearing. We want to win or at least be entertained! It seems there are two extremes on the team. We often recognize the ex TFC players!
(directed back at the comments about bad press by Fan 8) Why are we inconsistant? We're either good or flat.
AW We don't have a big roster. He could see a huge difference playing Chivas USA after playing Tauro FC. We were flat as the players were tired. We need two players for every position.
BdK Entertain us? We've got Plata, Eckersley, Avila but different players entertain for different types of fans. We want our own 21 year old locals rather than getting some 32 year old from another league.


Fan 13 comes to see the 'quality', not just to grind out a win.
BdK says we need a balance (like his answer to the previous fan).


Fan 14 Plata's health?
AW He's fit and may be on the bench for the Red Bulls game but after that will play the last three games.


The meeting had to break up as there was another session starting at 7:30pm (those fans were kept in the downstairs lobby).


I had got my answer (from TFCA director Stuart Neely) before the town hall was called to order about the TFC Academy playing it's last CSL games—four still to play with the season ending and supposed to start playoffs in two weeks. They will get their games in even if the playoffs are pushed back.
Also no word on if they're be any Academy player grads this year but will wait until training camp in the spring.


I still wanted to clear some other questions up. About next season's tickets I was directed downstairs to talk to two officials who were doubling up checking attendance for the next session.
My question about the Convenience Pack (17 reg season games plus 2 NCC games plus everything else that TFC plays) vs Standard Season Package (17 reg season games plus 2 NCC games).
If you buy only the Standard package will I still have the option of buying your OWN seat when they make Concacaf tickets available rather than being thrown to the back row? Answer: Yes!
If you buy the Convenience pack will I have the option of opting out if you don't want to go like if a Manchester United exhibition game comes with $400 minimum price? Answer: Yes!


Now back upstairs to ask Paul Beirne:
Next Reserves game is scheduled the morning of the TFC main game! Answer: subject to change.
More answers: The TFC Reserves and the TFC Academy will play at the new Downsview facility.
I asked: could they play indoors if something like the April storm blew over Downview April 17th and cancelled the DC United game after the players had arrived. It was eventually played months later.
Answer: Maybe they will play indoors but may be a restriction on number of fans that can be squeezed under the bubble.
I asked: TFC Academy games earlier this year used to be updated on the TFC website but that stopped. Why?
Answer: We used to have Luke Wileman do it but the new guy doesn't have the time in their understaffed office.


Rocket Robin
robing@eol.ca (robing@eol.ca)

[king dave]

Goodnight!
Love, peace and all the love kids.
EXCEPFOREALMO.
KD.

[RedRum]

I'd love to hear your ideas because the support has been regressing last two years, and the supporters section does not seem to be getting better

Unbelievably, this is what is lost on people. So lets all just continue with the status quo and watch it die. Damn it's gonna feel great next year when Montreal puts our support to shame.

[RedRum]

I'm a supporter as are many around me not in the south end.



Only 5? How many does a bus hold 60 ? So 300 places. Pecking order based on what ?


Pecking order based on supporting... you know stuff like chanting for 90, traveling to away games regularly, painting banners etc. You are a supporter, so you no doubt do all of those things. No worries 123, your spot on bus is already reserved.

[DichioTFC]

i dont think the issue is south end v. north end, the issue is better organization. 110, 111, 112, 113, 127 are well organized. we need coordination with the established sections and engage the neighbouring sections (110 with 109, 113 with 114, 127 with 126).

or, if some RPBs want to move to the north end, do it. get a few people together, sit close to each other, and get organized. it only takes 10 people to make a tourist section chanting (on a good day).

IMO, this is what we should focus on. not moving RPB as a whole, but seeing how we can expand our reach across the various sections. the quicker we can engage others, the faster our group will grow, the better things will be overall.

[Kyle_121]

i dont think the issue is south end v. north end, the issue is better organization. 110, 111, 112, 113, 127 are well organized. we need coordination with the established sections and engage the neighbouring sections (110 with 109, 113 with 114, 127 with 126).

or, if some RPBs want to move to the north end, do it. get a few people together, sit close to each other, and get organized. it only takes 10 people to make a tourist section chanting (on a good day).

IMO, this is what we should focus on. not moving RPB as a whole, but seeing how we can expand our reach across the various sections. the quicker we can engage others, the faster our group will grow, the better things will be overall.

I think this is a bad idea. Sure, it might only take 10 people to get a tourist section chanting, but those chants wont be anything other than TFC clap-clap-clap.

Numbers are at an all time low. The groups need to unite and make this work. Getting the entire south end going for 90 minutes would be magical. Getting huge displays done for the big games requires many hands.

I know if I was offered a chance to move into the south stands, I'd be there in a heartbeat.

[RedRum]

1) Limited room for growth - in the end there is a finite amount if seats while I love the idea of 1000 united supporters the fact this becomes the max for something we all believe in growing...doesn't work



There is what... 1700-1800 seats in the north stand total? With what? 1500 not occupied at the moment by SSH? You could take all of RPB, usector, NEE, and the unaffiliated that would be interested in committed vocal support and that would give you maybe 800 tops? So there would still be room to almost double the number. Personally I couldn't care less about growth if we could get 800 chanting. It would sound incredible. You are worried about growth when support is dwindling and dying before our eyes? C'mon dude, don't make me start with the polish jokes :D

Look at Section 8 in Chicago. They are not a supporters group - they are an umbrella organization that mesh the multiple supporters groups in the stand. Worked out pretty well for them, no? Look at Columbus. Their support was shit until all the groups were forced to move together. Considering their attendance, they quite did well for themselves.







2) banner space - we would need to fight a long upward battle for this. Most of the north is advertising space.



GA seating puts us behind the net for maximum effect on the game (not tucked into a corner because the FO likes how it looks on TV) and put the banners vertically in the first 2 or 3 rows - worst case - not that I think the advertising boards couldn't just be removed at minimal cost to the almighty corporation. Problem solved. I don't buy PB's line about GA seating being impossible because of safety. Frankly it's hogwash. Jays games in the grandstand at the Ex as a kid? GA, no problems. Go to a concert lately? GA is common. Our best support is at away games. Away games: GA.



Look at the issues getting just the south end at times to coordinate. Do you think any of those issues would magically disappear in the north end? Nope

Yes. One capo with equal representation from the 3 SG's (every 30 minutes or game by game rotation), one powerful megaphone or better yet a mic and speakers. Problem solved.

Any other concerns you need addressed, just let me know :)

[DichioTFC]

I think this is a bad idea. Sure, it might only take 10 people to get a tourist section chanting, but those chants wont be anything other than TFC clap-clap-clap.

Numbers are at an all time low. The groups need to unite and make this work. Getting the entire south end going for 90 minutes would be magical. Getting huge displays done for the big games requires many hands.

I know if I was offered a chance to move into the south stands, I'd be there in a heartbeat.

basic chants > no chanting.

its simply not possible logistically to consolidate all supporters in the south end if they're currently located in other sections. I really don't see how having members of SGs sit close to one another in their own sections is a bad idea.

regardless, this isn't about huge displays, its about how to get more chanting. the blind faith that some people have in a 'magical' south end where everyone chants is nonsense. it wont happen, at least not on its own and definitely not overnight. From scalpers to the unmotivated, there are a number of reasons why uniting the south end wont happen. Not without a bit of organization in each section - including the other parts of the south end. And don't get anyone here started about uniting the groups.

like i wrote before; organize better, coordinate and engage, expand our reach. RPBs will end up in non-supporter sections anyways, why not try to make something happen there?

[denime]

Please stay on topic,thanks!
:topic:

[Glenchen29]

Bob and Aron would have stayed all night and talked football, really informative and passionate guys.

#1, GET BEER SERVICE BACK TO THE SUPPORTERS SECTION

Tom and Paul said they were not aware we haven't had it since the All Star game so lets see?

[Fort York Redcoat]

Anselmi mentioned stadium expansion basically on the backburner but did allow that they didn't rule out two roofs. Lots of emphasis on academy. When friendlies were brought up Winters mentioned he was asked to play Juventus but declined, (correctly) that his schedule was way too tight for a basically non-important game.

Yes. Yes. Yes.

Forget expansion till we have 5 sellout years in a row.
A roof would be nice for the fairweather (literally speaking) fans but it's addition would only be aesthetic to me.

The Academy is the future and should get more attention.

FUCK mid season friendlies. I don't care who it is.

This post made the town hall worth it for me.

[DavydMT]

Yeah man, there really has to be more inroads laid between the groups. It's pathetic and short sighted when we are chanting against/out of unison, of each other.

Yesterday was great. The whole Southend was chanting in tune and cooperating and sounding great. This is what can be game in and game out if we (like minded singing TFC supporters) all united in one area.


UNITE OR BECOME IRRELEVANT! :scarf:

[boban]

They've dropped it by more then 30% for next year. If we made a proposal that they would like maybe they would drop it more. As of now they are only 1.5 times more then the cheapest seats in the house.
Still waaay tooo much money.

[Canary10]

Thanks for that sysnopsis Rocket Robin.

[prizby]

Rocket Robin - your summary was fantastic

3 questions I would like addressed.


1. Will TFC press the league to open in Montreal (on a weekend) for 2012?
2. Will Winter rest his starters on October 15 so they are FRESH for the must win champions league game?
3. As the academy is being built, expanded and more players are being added at a younger age, what is being done about coaching development? Is there a plan in place to develop coaches within Canada so they are able to teach the 4-3-3 system that will be played with the TFC first team and will there be a short-term fix (as there are clearly not enough qualified coaches within Canada that can teach the 4-3-3) and Winter plans to bring more coaches over from the Netherlands?

ok a 4th
4. Maybe they can explain how they have improved the scouting within South America...you see teams within the MLS get some real fine players (Montero/Rosales with the Sounders)

[Canary10]

Ha, best question I've heard:

"3. As the academy is being built, expanded and more players are being added at a younger age, what is being done about coaching development? Is there a plan in place to develop coaches within Canada so they are able to teach the 4-3-3 system that will be played with the TFC first team and will there be a short-term fix (as there are clearly not enough qualified coaches within Canada that can teach the 4-3-3) and Winter plans to bring more coaches over from the Netherlands?"

I'm going tonight and will ask this if it doesn't come up.

[Whoop]

My only two concerns are:
1) Montreal matches have to be on a weekend, preferably Saturday evening. Both home and away matches.
2) Keep the night matches in the summer weekends but afternoon games in early spring and possibly late, late fall.

[prizby]

Ha, best question I've heard:

"3. As the academy is being built, expanded and more players are being added at a younger age, what is being done about coaching development? Is there a plan in place to develop coaches within Canada so they are able to teach the 4-3-3 system that will be played with the TFC first team and will there be a short-term fix (as there are clearly not enough qualified coaches within Canada that can teach the 4-3-3) and Winter plans to bring more coaches over from the Netherlands?"

I'm going tonight and will ask this if it doesn't come up.

haha don't steal it :p

be asked at the 7:30 tonight :)

[Globetrotter]

1. Will TFC press the league to open in Montreal (on a weekend) for 2012?
2. Will Winter rest his starters on October 15 so they are FRESH for the must win champions league game?
3. As the academy is being built, expanded and more players are being added at a younger age, what is being done about coaching development? Is there a plan in place to develop coaches within Canada so they are able to teach the 4-3-3 system that will be played with the TFC first team and will there be a short-term fix (as there are clearly not enough qualified coaches within Canada that can teach the 4-3-3) and Winter plans to bring more coaches over from the Netherlands?

ok a 4th
4. Maybe they can explain how they have improved the scouting within South America...you see teams within the MLS get some real fine players (Montero/Rosales with the Sounders)

1- wasn't discussed (making key games on weekends for road travel was discussed)

2- likely not. Winter has always said he'll field the best team he can.

3- it's been known for a long time that they are being taught that style of the game. Not just 4-3-3, but it's variations and derivatives as well.

4- plata. they love plata and will point to that example.

[Canary10]

haha don't steal it :p

be asked at the 7:30 tonight :)

It's yours. Make sure you post the answer here though. :)

[prizby]

3- it's been known for a long time that they are being taught that style of the game. Not just 4-3-3, but it's variations and derivatives as well.

4- plata. they love plata and will point to that example.

Plata was MLS signed and not scouted by MLSE...they only introduced South American scouts this summer

3-whats a long time? 9 months? who is training the coaches? 4-3-3 is not an easy thing to teach, who is being taught this? still never answered the question

[Mark in Ottawa]

It's not an easy thing to walk into 5 years in. These groups come off as very cliquey and that is a put off. Active & friendly recruitment from all SG groups would be great.
This is what we tried to achieve at the tail gates in the first few years.
We waived people over, offered them a chance to eat a bit on the cheap if they wanted and a chance to talk footy and supporters groups.

We invited them to drop in here on line and size up the RPB's as well as get involved with banner making etc... if they so wished.

Some joined and some did not but there you have it.

[Mark in Ottawa]

Hey Rocket Robin!! Thanks for the write up, greatly appreciated.

[jazzy]

Rocket Robin - your summary was fantastic

3 questions I would like addressed.


1. Will TFC press the league to open in Montreal (on a weekend) for 2012?
2. Will Winter rest his starters on October 15 so they are FRESH for the must win champions league game?
3. As the academy is being built, expanded and more players are being added at a younger age, what is being done about coaching development? Is there a plan in place to develop coaches within Canada so they are able to teach the 4-3-3 system that will be played with the TFC first team and will there be a short-term fix (as there are clearly not enough qualified coaches within Canada that can teach the 4-3-3) and Winter plans to bring more coaches over from the Netherlands?

ok a 4th
4. Maybe they can explain how they have improved the scouting within South America...you see teams within the MLS get some real fine players (Montero/Rosales with the Sounders)

on question #3, in last nights 2nd meeting, Deklerk and Mariner did emphasis, not on the backgrounds of the coaches so much, but did infer that the Academy would have the 'best' calibre coach's......Very important to the Academy.

on question #2 the champions league game was not as important last night, as it is now but, I know we're in good hands with Winters...Next year he also wants to find ways to alleviate the huge amts of travel, emphasis easier transitions, btwn games with less wear and tear on the players considering the small MLS roster.

They emphasized their NCAA scouts last night and Paul's major network of coach contacts but shit, never occurred to bring up South America...good points

[prizby]

It's yours. Make sure you post the answer here though. :)

basically got what i wanted to know...they aren't bringing anyone else over from Europe (was bit disappointed cuz i really thought they could add a bunch of people to supplement what we got, but heck maybe frings and DK will become coaches in a few years)

on the positive side, seems like they are committed to trying to get canadian coaches to learn the system and be able to teach it...hard to do cuz these coaches would have to be committed and open to learning new ways; i agree...BdK answered the question

[jazzy]

My only two concerns are:
1) Montreal matches have to be on a weekend, preferably Saturday evening. Both home and away matches.
2) Keep the night matches in the summer weekends but afternoon games in early spring and possibly late, late fall.

Aron prefers afternoon matches....so if there was any choice that would be the decision.

[AL-MO]

Pecking order based on supporting... you know stuff like chanting for 90, traveling to away games regularly, painting banners etc. You are a supporter, so you no doubt do all of those things. No worries 123, your spot on bus is already reserved.

Yep, by the sounds of it he would be right at the top of said pecking order.

[bgnewf]

Putting a link to my write up from the Town Hall in the blog section if anyone is interested.

[prizby]

Aron prefers afternoon matches....so if there was any choice that would be the decision.

Talked to Aron last night and slipped in how I love night games and his face had a huge surprised look to him, to which I asked him, during day games or during night games, when is the atmosphere best? and he said the night games. Then I explained, look if its the beginning of the year or end of the year when temperatures are cooler, then yes, day games are preferred, but in the middle of the summer, to have day games is unreasonable especially if its mid 30's; i lose my voice at halftime and he thought about it for a second and said yeah, i do too

i think he might have actually agreed to night games in the summer idea

[Oldtimer]

Rocket Robin - your summary was fantastic

3 questions I would like addressed.


1. Will TFC press the league to open in Montreal (on a weekend) for 2012?
2. Will Winter rest his starters on October 15 so they are FRESH for the must win champions league game?


bgnewf answered both of these in his blog on the Town Hall (see the blogs thread http://www.redpatchboys.ca/forums/showthread.php?p=1385899 (http://www.redpatchboys.ca/forums/showthread.php?t=29582&page=3))

[Globetrotter]

3-whats a long time? 9 months? who is training the coaches? 4-3-3 is not an easy thing to teach, who is being taught this? still never answered the question

Never answered the question because the question was not asked at the town hall!!??!?! You want very specific answers to YOUR questions, go ask them yourself to the right people, and not just throw them out there on the internet. We've tried to decipher an answer from what we who attended heard. Think about who you're asking these questions to. :rolleyes:

[Greatest Ripoff]

Did they mention anything about getting Goltv in HD or if most of the fixtures for next season would continue to be on Goltv?

[Globetrotter]

Did they mention anything about getting Goltv in HD or if most of the fixtures for next season would continue to be on Goltv?

In private yes, but it wasn't a question that was asked.

Basically, they absolutely are trying to give gol tv to as many people as possible (similar to leafs and raptors tv). They know it's important to get it out there. I won't say more, but I would suggest that people stop slamming them about this issue. There's a lot of complications, but it's definitely being worked on.

[Whoop]

They emphasized their NCAA scouts last night and Paul's major network of coach contacts but shit, never occurred to bring up South America...good points

I asked the long winded scouting question last night. LOL

Paul answered the question, and I spoke with him briefly afterward. Toronto FC has increased their presence in South America, or at least trying to. The other thing is TFC has increased their scouting presence in Ontario now with the addition of the Academy. As Paul mentioned, they have 6 guys working in Ontario looking for players.

The bottom line is that it seems with the team has increased the number of people in their network - people in their employed, paid by the team, not necessarily someone such as an agent looking to place people on the team - in order to find talent. That's all I really wanted to know.

The other thing I got out of it, as someone mentioned previously, is that at least there is a clear organizational structure. Now if it means results we'll see. For me, I found it strange that it seems like de Klerk is more of the coach than Winter but that happens in most sports so really I'm not that surprised as usually most assistants are the "teachers" and head coach just manages.

And I think Winter is willing to take responsibility for the failures this season, he basically said that this season has gone worse than he expected. But they're sticking to their plan.

The other guy who impressed me last night was Earl Cochrane. Last year, I didn't find him impressive at all, but last night he acquitted himself well. My opinion of him definitely changed.

Overall, I wasn't blown away by them, nor fawning over them, but I feel about 25% better for next year.

[Canary10]

Funny moment for me was Winter said playing the other MLS teams they'll look at player and say "he's good, he'd be a good fit on our team." Then seomeone inevitably tells them that player used to play for TFC (Cronin was one I think he mentioned). Then he just shakes his head.

[Wull]

I thought they all came across pretty well last night, even Tom seemed to be interested, passionate and somewhat knowledgeable on what he addressed. I cringed when the guy two seats from me asked the Iro question though

[Canary10]

I thought they all came across pretty well last night, even Tom seemed to be interested, passionate and somewhat knowledgeable on what he addressed. I cringed when the guy two seats from me asked the Iro question though

Heard about that. What did they ask and what was the answer?

[brad]

Winter said Andy isn't doing badly - and good for him on saying that. Regardless of how he is playing te last thing I would want to hear is Winter throwing a player under the bus to appease a bunch of supporters.

That said De Klerk did mention something in passing about Iro and harden not being able to cope 1v1 at the back - but that was in reference to Pumas.

[brad]

One thing of the many things I took out of last night - anyone that thinks that our management don't know the game technically or how to make subs really should take any opportunity to listen to De Klerk talk about such things.

He talked in very detailed terms about why they went into a shell against Pumas - what they were trying to accomplish, how it didn't work, the effect if fatigue and lack of roster depth on substitutions.

[Canary10]

I asked about what the plan was for filling gaps next year (decided not to mention any specifically, only that they've been talked about a lot). They seems pretty set on Avila, JDG and Frings in the midfield and reasonably happy up front. The alluded to the central defence but didn't really say specifically. I think the priority for them is to have 20 players who can play on any given night without losing much from the starting 11. They also said they are scouting everywhere in the world.

[TFCREDNWHITE]

One thing of the many things I took out of last night - anyone that thinks that our management don't know the game technically or how to make subs really should take any opportunity to listen to De Klerk talk about such things.

He talked in very detailed terms about why they went into a shell against Pumas - what they were trying to accomplish, how it didn't work, the effect if fatigue and lack of roster depth on substitutions.

I'd like to hear more in De Klerks detailed terms....can you tell us more. I wasn't able to be there.....

[Auzzy]

One thing of the many things I took out of last night - anyone that thinks that our management don't know the game technically or how to make subs really should take any opportunity to listen to De Klerk talk about such things.

He talked in very detailed terms about why they went into a shell against Pumas - what they were trying to accomplish, how it didn't work, the effect if fatigue and lack of roster depth on substitutions.

I was at the 6pm session on Thursday, maybe I'll have a chance to say something about it later.

However, speaking of subs & fatigue, did anyone in the later session ask directly, why Koevermans (& others) were all sent to California to play Chivas, so that many of them were fatigued 3 days later vs Pumas? Especially Koef, where they have admitted he had to go off at the half due to fatigue in the Pumas game? (I used up my question on something else.)

[Wull]

Heard about that. What did they ask and what was the answer?

"I would like to know who is responsible for bringing Andy Iro here?"

Aron: "I am" he then leapt to the defence of the player (quite rightly regardless of which player and how good or bad they've been) saying we win and lose as a team

[Whoop]

Heard about that. What did they ask and what was the answer?

He asked who was responsible for bringing Andy Iro in.

Winter said he was responsible for bringing Iro to the team.

And he went to defend him, in that, while yes he hasn't played well, or to expectations, in the end, when the team loses it's not on the shoulders of one guy.

One of the main goals for next season appears to be improving the overall quality and depth of the team, ideally have two players for every position on the team.

[Whoop]

Winter said Andy isn't doing badly - and good for him on saying that. Regardless of how he is playing te last thing I would want to hear is Winter throwing a player under the bus to appease a bunch of supporters.

That said De Klerk did mention something in passing about Iro and harden not being able to cope 1v1 at the back - but that was in reference to Pumas.

Agreed. Yesterday wasn't the forum to throw players under the bus so to speak.

[Whoop]

I was at the 6pm session on Thursday, maybe I'll have a chance to say something about it later.

However, speaking of subs & fatigue, did anyone in the later session ask directly, why Koevermans (& others) were all sent to California to play Chivas, so that many of them were fatigued 3 days later vs Pumas? Especially Koef, where they have admitted he had to go off at the half due to fatigue in the Pumas game? (I used up my question on something else.)

That was addressed last night in a roundabout way as someone did ask about roster management and why Koevermans played pretty much the whole match. While no one directly asked that, the impression I got was that the coaching staff want to put a solid 11 for every game but yes, they know the importance of the Dallas match and are cognizant of the implication of said game.

[Globetrotter]

They seems pretty set on Avila, JDG and Frings in the midfield and reasonably happy up front. The alluded to the central defence but didn't really say specifically.

They are absolutely set on Avila, and perhaps rightly so. They think very highly of the kid.

Maybe it wasn't brought up on Thursday, Wednesday they stressed a left footed central defender.




However, speaking of subs & fatigue, did anyone in the later session ask directly, why Koevermans (& others) were all sent to California to play Chivas, so that many of them were fatigued 3 days later vs Pumas?

I've already answered this earlier in the thread, and Winter has said repeatedly "he will always dress the best possible lineup". If you have a game on Saturday, he's not thinking of Tuesday, no matter how important. Like it or not, that's his style, he's said it 100 times.

[brad]

I'd like to hear more in De Klerks detailed terms....can you tell us more. I wasn't able to be there.....

He spent 5 or 10 minutes on in it (if you have ever heard him talk he covers more in 5 minutes than most people would in 20 :-))

I'm short on time - but very basically - Koevs was tired and couldn't perform at the level needed so he has to come off. There is no depth in teh squad and we didn't have a sub to do the same job up front. Without that - they new there would be more pressure at the back and they knew that if they left Harden and Iro 1 v 1 against Pumas we would lose.

Said they would have stayed more attacking if we had te right players in te bench.

Basically - they wouldnt have gone into a defensive shell by choice - but try needed to change and they were caught between a rock and a head place.

[mastermixer]

In private yes, but it wasn't a question that was asked.

Basically, they absolutely are trying to give gol tv to as many people as possible (similar to leafs and raptors tv). They know it's important to get it out there. I won't say more, but I would suggest that people stop slamming them about this issue. There's a lot of complications, but it's definitely being worked on.

In the wednesday session, Anselmi mentioned that they offered rogers the HD channel for free and they declined. They were also asked about getting games on The Score and Anselmi said they never made an offer, and Sportsnet was very difficult to deal with as well. I'm guessing Rogers are a bunch of hard-asses to deal with or something. Anselemi was also dissapointed with the production value of the concacaf games and said that the regular season games have some of the best production value in the leauge and if it was up to him he would want to take over those games too. Someone also blurted out the fact that GolTV is owned by MLSE and Anselmi just aggreed and moved on.

[Auzzy]

1- wasn't discussed (making key games on weekends for road travel was discussed)

2- likely not. Winter has always said he'll field the best team he can.

3- it's been known for a long time that they are being taught that style of the game. Not just 4-3-3, but it's variations and derivatives as well.

4- plata. they love plata and will point to that example.





<snip>

I've already answered this earlier in the thread, and Winter has said repeatedly "he will always dress the best possible lineup". If you have a game on Saturday, he's not thinking of Tuesday, no matter how important. Like it or not, that's his style, he's said it 100 times.

Yes, I read that above, but was that directly asked & answered in the Wednesday session you attended; or are you basing that on media interviews etc? I know he has said that before, but I haven't heard it being questioned further. It would have been interesting to prod him a bit more on this -- i.e., yes, you like to field the strongest team & win every game. But if you manage your roster & field your strongest (& fittest) team in the game that matters the most, then you will improve the chance to play & win more games (by getting to the next round)....

Anyway, just asking about the other sessions -- I placed a contentious question about something else & didn't want to raise more of a stink.

[Globetrotter]

^I spoke with Aron only briefly and didn't ask him that. Would be nice, as you say, to pick his brain.

It wasn't asked out loud in the session, just when I was speaking to some of the others one on one. They were saying what we have heard from them in interviews, and what the press might have released.

[Suds]

"I would like to know who is responsible for bringing Andy Iro here?"

Aron: "I am" he then leapt to the defence of the player (quite rightly regardless of which player and how good or bad they've been) saying we win and lose as a team

I was impressed when Aron jumped in to answer that and say it was him. That shows he's strong enough to take the heat and be there to defend his players. That's how a coach earns the respect of the locker room. He was not about to allow anyone to throw Iro under the bus. Good on Aron!

----

I mentioned this in another thread. The takeaway for me last night was the level of professionalism in the management team now. Everyone knows their role and what's expected of them.

[Carts]

I was impressed when Aron jumped in to answer that and say it was him. That shows he's strong enough to take the heat and be there to defend his players. That's how a coach earns the respect of the locker room. He was not about to allow anyone to throw Iro under the bus. Good on Aron!

----

I mentioned this in another thread. The takeaway for me last night was the level of professionalism in the management team now. Everyone knows their role and what's expected of them.

I need to echo Suds post above...

Winter defending the player and taking responsibility for the selection shows class, loyalty, and respect...

I also liked Bob getting a little defensive about playing defensive. He was honest in his assessment with about our roster strength against Pumas and rhymed off exactly why the lads played the system/style they did. He didn't hide anything...

Not only the professionalism, I liked the fact that they took that 'professional guard' down after and just shot the shit with, or when Bob joked about kickin' the shit outta the Dallas mascott, or Winter's joke about "HOW GREAT CONCACAF REFS ARE!" lol...

[Whoop]

Yes, I read that above, but was that directly asked & answered in the Wednesday session you attended; or are you basing that on media interviews etc? I know he has said that before, but I haven't heard it being questioned further. It would have been interesting to prod him a bit more on this -- i.e., yes, you like to field the strongest team & win every game. But if you manage your roster & field your strongest (& fittest) team in the game that matters the most, then you will improve the chance to play & win more games (by getting to the next round)....

Anyway, just asking about the other sessions -- I placed a contentious question about something else & didn't want to raise more of a stink.

It was touched on last night in the question and answer period as Bobby from U-Sector asked that question.

And the impression was that Winter will always try to field the best team possible - one game at a time, never look past the next match - but I think the staff got the impression from the supporters of how important the match versus Dallas is given the way the season has gone.

[Wull]

Winter's joke about "HOW GREAT CONCACAF REFS ARE!" lol...

I'm taking credit for that one!!

[TFCREDNWHITE]

He spent 5 or 10 minutes on in it (if you have ever heard him talk he covers more in 5 minutes than most people would in 20 :-))

I'm short on time - but very basically - Koevs was tired and couldn't perform at the level needed so he has to come off. There is no depth in teh squad and we didn't have a sub to do the same job up front. Without that - they new there would be more pressure at the back and they knew that if they left Harden and Iro 1 v 1 against Pumas we would lose.

Said they would have stayed more attacking if we had te right players in te bench.

Basically - they wouldnt have gone into a defensive shell by choice - but try needed to change and they were caught between a rock and a head place.

Awesome thanks!

[Canary10]

My overall reaction is that the team is in good hands with them.

Couple of other things I got from the Thurs. 6:00 session. Winter said he believes in giving everyone a chance to perform. So his plan coming in was to bring the style he wanted to play, and give the team he inherited a chance to play it. Once people either showed they couldn't or wouldn't, he went about moving them, as they weren't going to be the right fit. I'm not surprised so many people who have been traded bad mouthed TFC after because they really didn't fit the plan anyway.

I also got the impression that TFC was a serious mess when they came, more than we know. That might just be an impression, but his comments around the quality of the players that were moved suggested to me that they had a lot of cleaning up to do. Also, although I think they really support JDG, I think they think his contract is ridiculous and never would have signed him for double what Frings and Koevermans make together.

[cmonyoureds]

Funny moment for me was Winter said playing the other MLS teams they'll look at player and say "he's good, he'd be a good fit on our team." Then seomeone inevitably tells them that player used to play for TFC (Cronin was one I think he mentioned). Then he just shakes his head.

I can't even imagine anything that sums up the previous 5 years more accurately than this.

In fact this post should be mandatory reading material for every executive over at MLSE.:picard:

[Auzzy]

My overall reaction is that the team is in good hands with them.

Couple of other things I got from the Thurs. 6:00 session. Winter said he believes in giving everyone a chance to perform. So his plan coming in was to bring the style he wanted to play, and give the team he inherited a chance to play it. Once people either showed they couldn't or wouldn't, he went about moving them, as they weren't going to be the right fit. I'm not surprised so many people who have been traded bad mouthed TFC after because they really didn't fit the plan anyway.

I also got the impression that TFC was a serious mess when they came, more than we know. That might just be an impression, but his comments around the quality of the players that were moved suggested to me that they had a lot of cleaning up to do. Also, although I think they really support JDG, I think they think his contract is ridiculous and never would have signed him for double what Frings and Koevermans make together.

Exact quote from De Klerk in reference to the contract: "Julian has a very good agent" and the whole room laughed. But they went on to say, JDG is performing very well now, and fitting into a system that works for him & the rest. (Didn't touch on his previous injury issues, although that would have been obvious in this context.)

[prizby]

Never answered the question because the question was not asked at the town hall!!??!?! You want very specific answers to YOUR questions, go ask them yourself to the right people, and not just throw them out there on the internet. We've tried to decipher an answer from what we who attended heard. Think about who you're asking these questions to. :rolleyes:

i did ask the coach question at the townhall

[Canary10]

Exact quote from De Klerk in reference to the contract: "Julian has a very good agent" and the whole room laughed. But they went on to say, JDG is performing very well now, and fitting into a system that works for him & the rest. (Didn't touch on his previous injury issues, although that would have been obvious in this context.)

Yup, that's the exact quote.

Again, they seem to think very highly of him a player. But I don't think they would have signed him to that contract.

[jazzy]

Talked to Aron last night and slipped in how I love night games and his face had a huge surprised look to him, to which I asked him, during day games or during night games, when is the atmosphere best? and he said the night games. Then I explained, look if its the beginning of the year or end of the year when temperatures are cooler, then yes, day games are preferred, but in the middle of the summer, to have day games is unreasonable especially if its mid 30's; i lose my voice at halftime and he thought about it for a second and said yeah, i do too

i think he might have actually agreed to night games in the summer idea

True enough, find night games in colder weather, sort of unneccesary

[Whoop]

LOL... that's why I stated, afternoon games in March/April and late September/October, night games in the summer.

Midweek games over course have to be played during the night unless it's a holiday.

[mastermixer]

They should also put a game on Canada day between either Montreal or Vancouver to magnify the rivalry a little bit and make it a yearly tradition.

[jazzy]

Did they mention anything about getting Goltv in HD or if most of the fixtures for next season would continue to be on Goltv?

Anselmi says everything already is in HD, blame Rogers, as even though mlse offered all the games for free to rogers they wouldn't carry it. No one wants the games apparently??

[__wowza]

They should also put a game on Canada day between either Montreal or Vancouver to magnify the rivalry a little bit and make it a yearly tradition.

i'm still waiting on the "TFC v l'impact" derby name thread.
may i suggest: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Battle_of_the_Plains_of_Abraham

[mastermixer]

i'm still waiting on the "TFC v l'impact" derby name thread.
may i suggest: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Battle_of_the_Plains_of_Abraham

Epic!

[mightydrm]

I can't even imagine anything that sums up the previous 5 years more accurately than this.

In fact this post should be mandatory reading material for every executive over at MLSE.:picard:

Very honest comment by Winter, particularly about Sam Cronin. Why they let him go under Preki baffled me.

PS original quote by canary 10 was about them seeing players on other teams and saying "he'd be a perfect fit for us" then discovering he was x-TFC ie Cronin.

[sulfur]

Very honest comment by Winter, particularly about Sam Cronin. Why they let him go under Preki baffled me.
Sadly, Preki never liked Cronin. Same as Guevara.

[TFC Cityboy]

Exact quote from De Klerk in reference to the contract: "Julian has a very good agent" and the whole room laughed. But they went on to say, JDG is performing very well now, and fitting into a system that works for him & the rest. (Didn't touch on his previous injury issues, although that would have been obvious in this context.)


I really like BDK from what I've seen- seems honest and a great sense of humour.

[PopePouri]

I was impressed when Aron jumped in to answer that and say it was him. That shows he's strong enough to take the heat and be there to defend his players. That's how a coach earns the respect of the locker room. He was not about to allow anyone to throw Iro under the bus. Good on Aron!

----

I mentioned this in another thread. The takeaway for me last night was the level of professionalism in the management team now. Everyone knows their role and what's expected of them.

Exactly. Compare that with Soehn and Vancouver...
http://www.theprovince.com/sports/Whitecaps+coach+tears+into+Demerit+Rochat+poor+def ence/5478931/story.html?utm_source=dlvr.it&utm_medium=twitter

[brad]

One other thing I got from chatting with Winter directly last night.

Before he came he watched some of our games and though he knew the level of players here. When he showed up - he was surprised as how bad technically some if the players were. He said he was generally suprised that he had professionals that couldn't pass te ball over 15 yards - and that was something you learn when you are a kid.

[Macksam]

Exactly. Compare that with Soehn and Vancouver...
http://www.theprovince.com/sports/Whitecaps+coach+tears+into+Demerit+Rochat+poor+def ence/5478931/story.html?utm_source=dlvr.it&utm_medium=twitter
A good reason he is gone next season I imagine. Everything this guy has done is bad, especially his mishandling of Russel Tiebert.

[boban]

In the wednesday session, Anselmi mentioned that they offered rogers the HD channel for free and they declined. They were also asked about getting games on The Score and Anselmi said they never made an offer, and Sportsnet was very difficult to deal with as well. I'm guessing Rogers are a bunch of hard-asses to deal with or something. Anselemi was also dissapointed with the production value of the concacaf games and said that the regular season games have some of the best production value in the leauge and if it was up to him he would want to take over those games too. Someone also blurted out the fact that GolTV is owned by MLSE and Anselmi just aggreed and moved on.
What did he say about CBC's offer and dealings?
So are we to assume to be prepared for the same if not more TFC games on GolTV.

[mastermixer]

What did he say about CBC's offer and dealings?
So are we to assume to be prepared for the same if not more TFC games on GolTV.

Well I think the fact that most games moved to 7:30 on Saturday nights didnt accommodate CBC very well for obvious reasons.

[ensco]

^I think this is backwards. I think when TFC/MLS went with TSN, one of the consequences was they had to move a bunch of games to a TFC-friendly schedule (ie 7.30pm, to provide prime time programming for TSN2 mostly).

My belief is they got this wrong because this isn't La Liga, they don't have the SSH base that can withstand all those spring/fall night games (or having TV dictate start times in general)

[pdogg]

I preferred the CBC feed personally, mostly because I don't have cable tv. I picked up all the CBC games in HD through my antenna. It didn't matter what cable/satellite/antenna package you got, you could still get the CBC games.

Now I'm "forced" to watch streams online - although the MLS MatchDay deal this year looked pretty good and I wish I'd jumped onto it.

[Pookie]

Bit of a chicken and egg really, there are two sides to this.

Start times dictated by TV can be inconvenient for the paying customers. The more inconvenient it is, the less willing they are to go. In the ratings game though, I'd wager that TV will always win out over start times.

If you don't expose your "brand" to a large audience, you risk experiencing the CFL "Blackout" phenomenon of years gone by in that if you don't have exposure, eventually you get forgotten.


This is the risk of keeping games on GolTV. Not many have it and the SD quality is very poor in relation to other games. Seems silly that in my local market I can watch Vancouver in HD while having to watch the hometown Reds in SD.

With the Rogers situation, perhaps trying to kill the channel in favour of driving content to Setanta (which Rogers' now owns 100% of), I don't see it being resolved any time soon. As of Monday, Setanta Canada was rebranded as Sportsnet World.

MLSE might have to make a decision to abandon GolTV as a carrier of MLS games and adopt a CCL, and "Extra Coverage" (ie. pre and post game), Game in an Hour, type focus.

[Ossington Mental Youth]

I preferred the CBC feed personally, mostly because I don't have cable tv. I picked up all the CBC games in HD through my antenna. It didn't matter what cable/satellite/antenna package you got, you could still get the CBC games.

Now I'm "forced" to watch streams online - although the MLS MatchDay deal this year looked pretty good and I wish I'd jumped onto it.

unfortunately you wouldnt be able to watch the games on that either as the games can be watched locally, drives me nuts

[pdogg]

That's ridiculous - I just read the blackout rules:

The following MLS matches will be blacked out in Canada on MatchDay Live and MatchDay Live Mobile (the “Canadian Match Broadcasts”):
- All MLS games featuring at least one (1) Canadian-based Club.

- All MLS games featuring two U.S.-based Clubs which is broadcast on live national television in Canada (e.g., TSN & GolTV Canada).

Canadian Match Broadcasts are available for viewing forty-eight (48) hours after the end of the original live broadcast.

So they not only blackout the TFC games, but I wouldn't be able to watch the Caps or Impact. So ridiculous...

[Ossington Mental Youth]

yep pretty frustrating.
dont understand why they do it.
id gladly purchase the package in a heart beat, too many games dont have streams or have terrible ones

[rocker]

I never had a problem with the streams on it. If it's jumpy or whatever, it's probably your internet connection. I have the fastest you can get on Rogers. Matchday Live has three different streaming levels too, which you can select depending upon your internet speed.

The games that are missing are usually games that are currently being shown on TV in your area (even if you don't have the channel). So I know when the Vancouver game is blocked, I probably have it on my Rogers digital (Sportsnet1). Or it's on GolTV. Naturally, these channels wouldn't want you choosing the internet over their own channel on TV -- what they should offer is an option on their websites for those of you without the cable channel... so you have to view the commercials and they get their advertising eyeballs.

[Auzzy]

That's ridiculous - I just read the blackout rules:

The following MLS matches will be blacked out in Canada on MatchDay Live and MatchDay Live Mobile (the “Canadian Match Broadcasts”):
- All MLS games featuring at least one (1) Canadian-based Club.

- All MLS games featuring two U.S.-based Clubs which is broadcast on live national television in Canada (e.g., TSN & GolTV Canada).

Canadian Match Broadcasts are available for viewing forty-eight (48) hours after the end of the original live broadcast.

So they not only blackout the TFC games, but I wouldn't be able to watch the Caps or Impact. So ridiculous...

Those rules are incomplete. All of the games shown on GolTV were not blocked this season; they were all available on MLS MatchDay Live within Canada. I watched all the away games that way, at least the ones that were on Gol. (I had a harder time getting the TSN games, because I don't have cable.) That's probably a (minor) advantage of GolTV being owned by MLSE -- they can make a special arrangements with MLS MatchDay Live.

[Auzzy]

What's shown at http://www.mlssoccer.com/blackout is strange anyway.

I remember earlier this season, there was a special note there, that games on GolTV would not be blocked in Canada. Maybe we should just keep quiet about this... ;)

[Ossington Mental Youth]

I never had a problem with the streams on it. If it's jumpy or whatever, it's probably your internet connection. I have the fastest you can get on Rogers. Matchday Live has three different streaming levels too, which you can select depending upon your internet speed.

The games that are missing are usually games that are currently being shown on TV in your area (even if you don't have the channel). So I know when the Vancouver game is blocked, I probably have it on my Rogers digital (Sportsnet1). Or it's on GolTV. Naturally, these channels wouldn't want you choosing the internet over their own channel on TV -- what they should offer is an option on their websites for those of you without the cable channel... so you have to view the commercials and they get their advertising eyeballs.

meant streams not on MLS Matchday live.
also i understand they want us to buy cable and the channels but youd think theyd want to spread brand awareness at least through the actual Leagues website...

[Auzzy]

Here's my own quote I found from near the beginning of the season:


The "MLS MatchDay Live" blackout regulations for 2011 expressly say that TFC games shown on GOL TV will not be blocked:

http://www.mlssoccer.com/blackout

I'm counting on that, because that's why I bought the service & that's how I'm planning to watch tonight... otherwise I'll go mental.

I know that at that time (April 9th), the MLS MatchDay Live blackout rules specifically said, that TFC games on GolTV would not be blocked in Canada. (I think there was a special note about that at the bottom.) They must have changed the rules on that web page after April 9th (although the web page incorrectly states, "Updated: March 9, 2011).

Anyway, in reality, I watched almost all the GolTV TFC away games on MLS MatchDay Live here in Toronto, so those were never blocked for me. Were they blocked for anyone else?

They better not block them next season...

[Ossington Mental Youth]

crazy, did not know this. only got rid of cable in sept, im guessing they didnt show the away games on tsn tho??