The Little Red Book

[cherono]

Well, the wrapping's red...

Anyway, I just recieved a small, notebook sized book from TFC outlining the philosophy of the club going forward. Very graphic-heavy, but outlining Style of Play, Culture, Player Development and Results. It's pretty neat; any one else get it?

[London]

did you ask for this?

was it random??

[cherono]

Totally random. Though when I did the latest SSH survey, I indicated that I was basically 50/50 on re-newing.

[SuperTCP]

Does it include any coupons? (i.e. 50% off SS 2012, or free beer?)

[Cashcleaner]

So this just turned up in the mail for you? I wonder if every SSH is going to get one. Sounds interesting.

[cherono]

Arrived out of the blue. There's very little new info or real substance to it - in fact there are 30 or so pages of blank paper so that it doubles up as a notebook. It's quite well put together though. Nice gesture.

[West220Side]

Arrived out of the blue. There's very little new info or real substance to it - in fact there are 30 or so pages of blank paper so that it doubles up as a notebook. It's quite well put together though. Nice gesture.

Pictures would be nice..

[ElvistheEvilScotsman]

Totally random. Though when I did the latest SSH survey, I indicated that I was basically 50/50 on re-newing.

So did the Little Red book make any impact on your decision?

This smells like the FO might realize they have a problem going into renewal season.

[Yohan]

lol. did MLSE take a page out of Mao and the Liberals playbook?

[james]

i got the red book to. Dont know if it had anything to do with the fact i use to have 4 season tickets but went down to 2 this year. That or everyones getting one just some soonner then others.

[flatpicker]

Well, I guess whoever lives at my old address will be getting mine.

Time to update my account manager.

[ElvistheEvilScotsman]

Well, I guess whoever lives at my old address will be getting mine.

Time to update my account manager.

Ha! Maybe the little red book will be convincing enough to get the new occupant to purchase season tickets next year.

[stoked]

I got one aswell. The cover and binding look quite nice but I don't see the point of it really as it just reiterates what thy have already said throughout the year. What's with the blank pages?

[nxtmike]

sounds interesting. pics anyone??

[ensco]

I haven't seen it yet, but they'll likely have made a mistake, if they sent it to me.

I never like being treated like someone who can be manipulated, over a looming multi-thousand dollar decision, with trinkets.

[MG42]

just got one in the mail, meh

[Roogsy]

I haven't seen it yet, but they'll likely have made a mistake, if they sent it to me.

I never like being treated like someone who can be manipulated, over a looming multi-thousand dollar decision, with trinkets.

Unfortunately you are in the minority.

This sounds like a new initiative from the new "recovery team" they have put in place to try to win back fans and goodwill (read: ticketbase).

I always said it was easier to keep fans than to try to win them back.

[Pookie]

You know it isn't easy being MLSE.

They get criticized for not listening and not taking an active role in marketing. Then when they do invest a little in the team and reach out with customer surveys, personal calls from Reps, PB and Tom Anselmi they get criticized for that too.

Of course they want to sell tickets. It's a business.

Of course they are worried about renewals. They want to sell tickets. It's a business.

[Oldtimer]

I always said it was easier to keep fans than to try to win them back.

You're right, and that's a basic law of customer service. You have to work 10 times as much to gain/regain a customer as you do to keep one.

The other law is that for every dissatisfied customer that you are aware of, there are 6 others you don't know about.

[Roogsy]

You're right, and that's a basic law of customer service. You have to work 10 times as much to gain/regain a customer as you do to keep one.

The other law is that for every dissatisfied customer that you are aware of, there are 6 others you don't know about.


Except what that last law doesn't quantify is how difficult it is to win new clients as well, not just dissatisfied ones. If they're not already TFC fans, there is a reason for it.

[Canary10]

Does anyone know what ticket pricing is going to be next year? In another thread someone said they're dropping prices slightly. I haven't heard that to be true officially though.

[ensco]

You know it isn't easy being MLSE.

They get criticized for not listening and not taking an active role in marketing. Then when they do invest a little in the team and reach out with customer surveys, personal calls from Reps, PB and Tom Anselmi they get criticized for that too.

Of course they want to sell tickets. It's a business.

Of course they are worried about renewals. They want to sell tickets. It's a business.

That's not what I'm criticizing them for. I'm all for honest-to-goodness marketing and sincere customer service/interaction.

But I find certain things (like maybe this book, caveat I haven't seen it) are more cynical/manipulative, frankly the town halls and the empty statements there such as "we'll be ready for opening day, guaranteed" are Exhibit A.

It's bigger than MLSE, it's about the modern world, it's sadly common in corporate and political life, and I react negatively to it wherever it's done.

[Roogsy]

That's not what I'm criticizing them for. I'm all for honest-to-goodness marketing and sincere customer service/interaction.

But I find certain things (like maybe this book, caveat I haven't seen it) are more cynical/manipulative, frankly the town halls and the empty statements there such as "we'll be ready for opening day, guaranteed" are Exhibit A.

It's bigger than MLSE, it's about the modern world, it's sadly common in corporate and political life, and I react negatively to it wherever it's done.


Here, here...

[MG42]

That's not what I'm criticizing them for. I'm all for honest-to-goodness marketing and sincere customer service/interaction.

But I find certain things (like maybe this book, caveat I haven't seen it) are more cynical/manipulative, frankly the town halls and the empty statements there such as "we'll be ready for opening day, guaranteed" are Exhibit A.

It's bigger than MLSE, it's about the modern world, it's sadly common in corporate and political life, and I react negatively to it wherever it's done.

Basically this note book thing is selling hope. It has 4 sections - style of play, culture, player development, results. It would not be worth the time to describe it in detail because it is all stuff we have heard already ie we are going to play attractive attacking football, "all for one" means this or that, random quotes from Winter and the coaching staff, pimping the voyageurs cup.

I will leave you with these fine quotes

"At Toronto FC, how we play will define us. It's our identity. We will play entertaining football, and we will play to win."

"Leadership begins in the front office. Toronto FC's leadership team brings experience, expertise and a desire to compete fiercely with a will to win."

[Pookie]

That's not what I'm criticizing them for. I'm all for honest-to-goodness marketing and sincere customer service/interaction.

But I find certain things (like maybe this book, caveat I haven't seen it) are more cynical/manipulative, frankly the town halls and the empty statements there such as "we'll be ready for opening day, guaranteed" are Exhibit A.

It's bigger than MLSE, it's about the modern world, it's sadly common in corporate and political life, and I react negatively to it wherever it's done.

My shelves are full of Michael Moore books too. I've seen way too many "create high paying jobs" tag lines over my lifetime to get excited by election claims and we could spend all day discussing the lip service paid to corporate "responsibility."

That said, with regards to the book, the book itself is nothing special. At the same time, promoting TFC isn't something that they have done actively. The games are now buried on GolTV, in Standard Definition no less, without much hype for matches. These guys didn't even spend to promote the MLS Cup, the marquee match in the league.

What I take as a positive is that the investment in the book signifies a willingness to actually spend money to promote the team... and yes, ultimately sell tickets. However, spending money to promote the team should contribute to more exposure, more and improved coverage and ultimately the long term health of the team. Which is a good thing.

[Technorgasm]

Well, the wrapping's red...

Anyway, I just recieved a small, notebook sized book from TFC outlining the philosophy of the club going forward. Very graphic-heavy, but outlining Style of Play, Culture, Player Development and Results. It's pretty neat; any one else get it?

just got mine delivered to the office. nice surprise.

YES - I will be renewing in November as always. .
in fact, I hope some stupid part-time supporters give up their seats near me so I can buy another season ticket.

THINK of all the kids and members of the community that will benefit from the TFC faciklity at downsview. . . . No company sets out to operate without profit. fucking deal with it.

Never Give up. Love my TFC.

[MG42]

^ I get wanting to promote the team, but what I want to read (and never will lol) is a letter with something along the lines of - we were caught off guard by the tremendous fan reaction to Toronto FC in 2007. We took advantage of the situation we found ourselves in. We now realize that by some of our actions, we have alienated the very people that made Toronto FC such a great success, and for that we apologize.

[P-NUTZ]

ya i got one - small political gesture, but with some heart.
i trashed them in the SSH survey and demanded something - discounts, rewards programs, kits etc to make me feel better while the team struggles.
and i got a dam notebook.

they should have taken out the blank pages at the back and put in something more worthwhile as a closer. idiots - actually CHEAP idiots.

[Toronto Gunner]

I'm happy with the book. It's quite inspiring, gives hope for the future and shows that they're trying to give back to the fans. I'm not a critic of MLSE, I have a hard time understanding criticisms of the organization as I can't really see how I would have run it differently. I agree with many of the decisions that they've made, I've always have amazing customer service, and I think they go above and beyond to promote the team locally and to give value to season seat holders.

Thanks TFC!


David.

[Kyle_121]

http://www.odsusjedamali.com/media/this-thread-completely-useless-WITHOUT-IMAGES.jpg

[flambe]

I haven't got this book yet.

Anyone in the Mt. Pleasant/Eglinton area got one?

[Nomad]

Geez...i still never even got a link to the damn survey!

[Suds]

ya i got one - small political gesture, but with some heart.
i trashed them in the SSH survey and demanded something - discounts, rewards programs, kits etc to make me feel better while the team struggles.
and i got a dam notebook.

they should have taken out the blank pages at the back and put in something more worthwhile as a closer. idiots - actually CHEAP idiots.

I hear ya. But I'd rather they take the time to put something with substance together for the upcoming year than pump out some lame discount for the last few games to quiet the noise.

I think the book is just part of there ongoing marketing. Nothing special. It's just ongoing communication with the fan base.

I think we need to remember many of these things are not geared towards us; the smaller percentage of fans who live and breath TFC. We've heard everything in the book. This kind of stuff is targeted at the average fan.

[mclaren]

You know it isn't easy being MLSE.

I think you're giving them too much credit. It was easy for MLSE to increase season ticket prices year-on-year, it was easy for MLSE to disrespect fans when Real Madrid rolled into town, it was easy to MLSE to charge the prices they do at the stadium.

You're right that some people will give MLSE no credit for anything, but you're wrong that they haven't laid their bed and are now laying in it.

I gave up my season tickets after 4 years. Not because of the crappy football but because I felt disrespected as a fan. Tom Jefferson was right when he said "In matters of style swim with the current. In matters of principle, stand like a rock". This is the principle, and we should all stand strong until there are price decreases.

[ensco]

^Well put.

It's the cheesy sloganeering that I especially can't stand. After all this.

Spare me.

[WestStandGeoff]

So does anyone know what the blank pages are for? Autograph book? Do I bring it to the match and keep notes about how close they're keeping to their vision? Agree with whoever said they could have put something a lot more useful than blanks...



EDIT - I do appreciate what the club is doing here. While the book isn't going to sway my renewal decisions, I like what they put together, and it was a plesant surprise to find it in the mailbox last night... just don't understand the blank pages (well almost blank, except for the 3 or 4 that have a one-line quote). Appologies if I came across as bitchy.

[JonO]

I think the book is just part of there ongoing marketing. Nothing special. It's just ongoing communication with the fan base.
I agree with Suds on this one. Really - I think some are making a mountain over a mole hill. I am right on the border with my decision to renew. This gesture does not address my main concern (which is $$) but I do like it...

[TOBOR !]

http://www.odsusjedamali.com/media/this-thread-completely-useless-WITHOUT-IMAGES.jpg

this made me laugh.

[bones]

http://www.odsusjedamali.com/media/this-thread-completely-useless-WITHOUT-IMAGES.jpg

Uploading Video to YouTube....need faster upload...guh!

[james]

ya thanks for the book, but something better would of been lower ticket prices next year across the stadium exspecially in Nutrilite Cup/Champions League games in the higher end tickets, they are rediculous prices. Add in other things like stop chassing fans away with not letting flags in the stadium within half of an hour of kickoff? WTF was the reasonning behind that???

[bones]

jmAcHhz9QLg

[Roogsy]

ya thanks for the book, but something better would of been lower ticket prices next year across the stadium exspecially in Nutrilite Cup/Champions League games in the higher end tickets, they are rediculous prices. Add in other things like stop chassing fans away with not letting flags in the stadium within half of an hour of the stadium? WTF was the reasonning behind that???

I fear we have lost sight of what is important. And this post here illustrates my frustration not just with the team, but with fellow supporters. We credit the team for this effort (and I have nothing against the book itself) but it is relatively insignificant and yet we let them off on issues that truly matter such as supporting those that generate the game-day experience that this team has so heavily-relied upon while it shits on the field. I wouldn't care less if they sent out 100 marketing packages like this so long as they stop hassling the very supporters that have kept the TFC experience alive until now. How about the money they save on this marketing effort they use to reduce ticket prices as a show of goodwill towards all fans? Doubtful. And yet that would show real initiative and a meaningful gesture as opposed to sending us stuff that will wind up in landfills in the not too distant future.

This team is full of meaningless marketing gestures.

[West220Side]

jmAcHhz9QLg

are you a professional hand model good sir? LOL.

[Ossington Mental Youth]

hope i get one for collecting sake

[mclaren]

May I suggest this book could have been more appropriate: http://www.amazon.com/Not-My-Life-Dont-Preventing/dp/0915202778/ref=sr_1_2?ie=UTF8&qid=1315949456&sr=8-2

[Brooker]

I think you're giving them too much credit. It was easy for MLSE to increase season ticket prices year-on-year, it was easy for MLSE to disrespect fans when Real Madrid rolled into town, it was easy to MLSE to charge the prices they do at the stadium.

What was the "Loyalty Discount" again? 5%? 10%? LOL.

[ElvistheEvilScotsman]

hope i get one for collecting sake

You can have mine if the wife hasn't already thrown it out. I don't need tfc related bathroom reading material.

I find this thing offensive as they're using it as a smoke screen to cover up the real issues between the fans and the front office just in time for renewals.

If they want to show a real gesture refund everyone who didn't go postal on their rep their Dallas ccl tickets.

[james]

ya not giving refund an option for the Dallas game is discusting!

[eustacchio]

ya i got one - small political gesture, but with some heart.
i trashed them in the SSH survey and demanded something - discounts, rewards programs, kits etc to make me feel better while the team struggles.
and i got a dam notebook.

they should have taken out the blank pages at the back and put in something more worthwhile as a closer. idiots - actually CHEAP idiots.

You can't always take out the blank pages. Each sheet of paper is technically four pages once it's folded and bound. There are usually sixteen sheets in signature (group of pages). If you have ten pages of printed material you're going to end up with six blank pages.

[bones]

are you a professional hand model good sir? LOL.

I used to watch Vanna White verrrry carefully.

I swear I was looking at her hands ;)

[Parkdale]

does this mean tim90 finally got his mediaguide???

[sulfur]

If anyone has a spare that they want to get rid of, I'd be willing to take it off of your hands :)

[menefreghista]

What was the "Loyalty Discount" again? 5%? 10%? LOL.

$15...

[TOBOR !]

That was only half a book.

[Phil]

If anyone has a spare that they want to get rid of, I'd be willing to take it off of your hands :)

ditto....

[Auzzy]

I got The Book.

Now I would have understood it better if all the blank pages immediately followed the "Results" chapter heading.... :D

[Phil]

All jokes aside, I thought it was pretty well done and a quick communication of where they want to go with this.

Will it sway someone who has given up on the team? Probably not. But it is nice to have communication on that level with the club.

[Waggy]

You remember in the last election, before he quit, the most common criticism of Ignatieff was that he was an intellectual in an ivory tower who couldn't speak to or relate to common people? A lot of that comes down to basic public speaking stuff, he didn't know how to not speak like a professor speaking to students who just don't QUITE get what he's saying (which makes sense cause he is a prof). To me thats MLSE's problem as well. They don't know how to interact with fans without it feeling forced and patronizing, even if that's totally not the reason or intent. Everything feels like it's either a 'standardized test' type of generic questionair/email, or some "Hello (insert name here), we are thankful you have purchased season tickets to (insert sports franchise here). We have heard you (insert emotion) the direction of the team. To help in your decision to renew tickets for (insert year here), we have decided to explain better to you what we are trying to do" sort of creepy and or patronizing call or email, or in this case book. Communication can be simple, or can be complicated. They make it very complicated. Either way, the team seems to be rounding into better form, and really that's all that matters. Give the club credit for trying, but good lord do they still have a long way to go to get communications between fans and the club on track. First thing they have to do is stop thinking of fan as a euphemism for customer, I'm not holding my breath on that one.

[ensco]

Just got it. There's not a single hackneyed sports cliche that they didn't throw this in thing.

So the air war has begun. Ground war coming soon.

I suspect there's going to be a very high pressure approach used this year. We know they love the "free game" thing (which lowers prices without changing the baseline for the following year) so something along the lines of "SSH get a couple of free games next year off if you renew within 7 days" would not surprise me. I think they'll lose quite a few people if it isn't a meaningful number of games being "given away". Assuming that's what they do, I need to see at least 5 games free, ie a 25-30% reduction in prices, or else I'm cutting back for sure.

Also I cannot see how they don't tie prices in 2013 to making the playoffs in 2012 (ie guaranteed no price increase without playoffs). It's a meaningless freebie to give, in light of the overall situation. The variable they'll be playing with is how many games they give away, not pricing.

Based on the timing of this mailing, it wouldn't surprise me if the renewal campaign launches tomorrow, if TFC have a good game tonight. They could be out of CCL by the time the natural SSH renewal period occurs (mid October to November).

[Suds]

^^
Don't they start to ramp up the renewal communication towards the end of September every year?

I do not see how that would be surprising to anyone.

[dow117]

Nobody is more cynical than me when it comes to corporations and their pathological persuit of profit but I am trying to see the genuineness of this gesture. I think that I need to take things at face value initially and look for the positive that the club is trying to do the right thing. Though like most corps, faced with maximizing profit or doing the right thing ... the former will always be the choice. But , in this case , I really believe that they mean it and it is appreciated. Will it affect my renewal decision ???? ... No !. I will renew coz I love the game and its the best in town...

[TO DEVILS]

I fear we have lost sight of what is important. And this post here illustrates my frustration not just with the team, but with fellow supporters. We credit the team for this effort (and I have nothing against the book itself) but it is relatively insignificant and yet we let them off on issues that truly matter such as supporting those that generate the game-day experience that this team has so heavily-relied upon while it shits on the field. I wouldn't care less if they sent out 100 marketing packages like this so long as they stop hassling the very supporters that have kept the TFC experience alive until now. How about the money they save on this marketing effort they use to reduce ticket prices as a show of goodwill towards all fans? Doubtful. And yet that would show real initiative and a meaningful gesture as opposed to sending us stuff that will wind up in landfills in the not too distant future.

This team is full of meaningless marketing gestures.

Against modern meaningless marketing gestures

[Whoop]

How do you combat indifference?

It's not through a little red book.

[TO DEVILS]

How do you combat indifference?

It's not through a little red book.

I would have rather gotten this book...

http://www.zitantique.com/images/DCP_1047.JPG

[ensco]

^My favourite line from that is "Truth flows from the barrel of a gun!"

I don't think this book per se matters, other than as a window into the soul of the machine.

It's just the SSH warm up, but they've spent real money on it, sent it by mail instead of email, and sent it earlier (the SSH warmup email came in early October in 2010, and late October in 2009).

[TO DEVILS]

On a serious note i think the boat has sailed when it comes to apathy in the TFC fan base. Could it return to port, sure it could, but it would take 1 of two things, a complete overhaul in the FO structure and people, or a complete come clean from those same people and admitting their short comings in the past years and reformulate a new plan for the future.

A plan that has short term initiatives that are palpable and not Town Hall of empty promises.

I am almost sure that neither will happen. The first would be the smart move and it to be honest should have happened when Mo was fired.

But the fact that the FO is still to this day friends with Mo and regard him in high esteem while stomping anybody else who under him and brought by him, failed, shows a complete lack of understanding for this sport and the unique business model that it takes to have it succeed.

This team (FO team) has failed us, so the smart move would be to bring a new team who can blame the past team, and build towards the future while earning a free pass from the fans in the process....expecting me to believe someone who has clearly lied to me for the last 5 years is not reasonable.

[TO DEVILS]

^My favourite line from that is "Truth flows from the barrel of a gun!"

I don't think this book per se matters, other than as a window into the soul of the machine.

It's just the SSH warm up, but they've spent real money on it, sent it by mail instead of email, and sent it earlier (the SSH warmup email came in early October in 2010, and late October in 2009).

Plus the ones getting the book, already know the vision and philosophy....to me it just comes across as petty. Not to be confused with pity, which is what this management has been over the years.

[Hitcho]

I want to renew my season tickets but only one thing will have any impact on whether I do or not:

PRICE

I am sick to death of massive annual price increases. And whichever way they sell it with including this and that, what I want, for once, is the smallest number possible when it comes time to pay the renewal fees.

I think they said there will be a price freeze next year, and there was a debate about what that would mean given that this season included the All Star game cost - are they freezing total number you have to pay, price per game, total price for league and CCC games package?

Frankly I think they should go the extra mile and for renewing season ticket holders give a price freeze on the per match cost of league games and chuck in free CCC games to boot.

Time to give something back after all the years of taking.

[bones]

Plus the ones getting the book, already know the vision and philosophy....to me it just comes across as petty. Not to be confused with pity, which is what this management has been over the years.

I can see your point but I think it's important to look at who this book is for. Is it for the supporters, the group that makes the most noise at games but contributes the least to overall income? I think the answer is no. I think it's for the average to occasional fans that pay probably 50-60% of the total income generated. Re-assuring them that we have a long term plan, that we are committed to trying to put the best team together always going forward seems to be the focus here with this book.

I'm wondering if this is a "damage control" device. There are many that look at the failure this team has had in the past and think that the ownership is to blame and the owners don't care if they win as long as the seats are full. While the choices in those individuals that were directly responsible for the makeup (and re-makeup, and re-makeup....) of this team keep showing they have failed, the owners gave them full license to make those choices. (given enough rope). Every year when they bring in a new person to run/choose team/manage we get told that we will be better and make the playoffs yadda yadda. The average and occasional fan has heard all this and here's the damage control part. This time they want to show that they've got new people at the top that are going to be here a long time. They want to show they've invested a very large amount of ownership $ on development. etc.

From my perspective this book is an attempt at trying to show that this years changes at the top is different than all the other years changes. They don't have a list of 16k waiting for seasons this year ;) They depleted that last year.

[bones]

I want to renew my season tickets but only one thing will have any impact on whether I do or not:

PRICE

I am sick to death of massive annual price increases. And whichever way they sell it with including this and that, what I want, for once, is the smallest number possible when it comes time to pay the renewal fees.

I think they said there will be a price freeze next year, and there was a debate about what that would mean given that this season included the All Star game cost - are they freezing total number you have to pay, price per game, total price for league and CCC games package?

Frankly I think they should go the extra mile and for renewing season ticket holders give a price freeze on the per match cost of league games and chuck in free CCC games to boot.

Time to give something back after all the years of taking.

I know this is a very, VERY long shot but IF we can and actually do make the playoffs and the price does not go up will you renew?

[ensco]

I'll always be a fan, with or without the slogans. No matter how bad the team gets.

They should decide what they want to charge, I'll decide if I'll renew.

[pekduck]

Is that how they are translated into English? The Chinese version meant something else but still distantly related.


^My favourite line from that is "Truth flows from the barrel of a gun!"

I don't think this book per se matters, other than as a window into the soul of the machine.

It's just the SSH warm up, but they've spent real money on it, sent it by mail instead of email, and sent it earlier (the SSH warmup email came in early October in 2010, and late October in 2009).

[TO DEVILS]

I can see your point but I think it's important to look at who this book is for. Is it for the supporters, the group that makes the most noise at games but contributes the least to overall income? I think the answer is no. I think it's for the average to occasional fans that pay probably 50-60% of the total income generated. Re-assuring them that we have a long term plan, that we are committed to trying to put the best team together always going forward seems to be the focus here with this book.

I'm wondering if this is a "damage control" device. There are many that look at the failure this team has had in the past and think that the ownership is to blame and the owners don't care if they win as long as the seats are full. While the choices in those individuals that were directly responsible for the makeup (and re-makeup, and re-makeup....) of this team keep showing they have failed, the owners gave them full license to make those choices. (given enough rope). Every year when they bring in a new person to run/choose team/manage we get told that we will be better and make the playoffs yadda yadda. The average and occasional fan has heard all this and here's the damage control part. This time they want to show that they've got new people at the top that are going to be here a long time. They want to show they've invested a very large amount of ownership $ on development. etc.

From my perspective this book is an attempt at trying to show that this years changes at the top is different than all the other years changes. They don't have a list of 16k waiting for seasons this year ;) They depleted that last year.

If the book is as you say for the casual fans, i am afraid they have lost the plot then.

This book will have zero impact on what someone in 225 will do at renewals.

SSH other than the ones in supporter sections, care about 2 things: Wins & price of product.
This book will be tossed in the garbage just as fast as junk mail with flyers from longos.

[Oldtimer]

I want to renew my season tickets but only one thing will have any impact on whether I do or not:

PRICE

I am sick to death of massive annual price increases. And whichever way they sell it with including this and that, what I want, for once, is the smallest number possible when it comes time to pay the renewal fees.


I need a decrease. With tickets out there in various deals at 30% off, why would I be so stupid as to renew my seasons?

[CSO_BBTB]

^My favourite line from that is "Truth flows from the barrel of a gun!"

You should try mentioning that quotation to somebody who grew up in China. You tend to get looked at like you have gone completely insane, then it finally dawns on them what you are referring to and you get told that what he really said was "power from gun" with an accompanying "what have you been smoking" sort of expression.

[ensco]

I need a decrease. With tickets out there in various deals at 30% off, why would I be so stupid as to renew my seasons?

It's worse than that. Most of the seats are not in the south end. Since most everyone here is more familiar with the south end, I thought I'd point out that in the better seats, market per seat is the same $20 that you get for the south end, but the SSH price is $65-70.
http://www.ebay.com/itm/190574208489?ssPageName=STRK:MESOX:IT&_trksid=p3984.m1562.l2649#ht_500wt_1116

They can send out all the surveys and brochures they want, but this is the problem, and it's the only problem.

[ensco]

You should try mentioning that quotation to somebody who grew up in China. You tend to get looked at like you have gone completely insane, then it finally dawns on them what you are referring to and you get told that what he really said was "power from gun" with an accompanying "what have you been smoking" sort of expression.

I stand corrected.

My favorite Mao story is how he swim the Yangtze in 1996, at age 73, in a time that would have made him an Olympic champion.

http://www.discoveryangtze.com/Yangtzediscovery/old_man_river.htm

[Nuvinho]

I just got the email to fill out the survey today, so they will probably be sending me a book shortly, because I said I 50/50 on renewing them for next year.

[leafsman]

i hope they do something about the pricing as that will determine if i renew. It's my first time as SSH and i do like my seats but not at the price im paying. The face value of my tickets are 51 in the north end which is too much for that crappy product. The view is better than the south but not worth double the price.

[bdiddy]

I received the book too as well yesterday,

[bdiddy]

Although I never filled out the Survey they are talking about.

[Pookie]

It's worse than that. Most of the seats are not in the south end. Since most everyone here is more familiar with the south end, I thought I'd point out that in the better seats, market per seat is the same $20 that you get for the south end, but the SSH price is $65-70.
http://www.ebay.com/itm/190574208489?ssPageName=STRK:MESOX:IT&_trksid=p3984.m1562.l2649#ht_500wt_1116

They can send out all the surveys and brochures they want, but this is the problem, and it's the only problem.

Agreed. I've always theorized that there are 2 markets for TFC tickets.

Season Ticket Market and Secondary Per Game Market

The Season Ticket buyer is essentially looking for value. They will attend all (or most) games and want to save some money by buying in bulk. They also want the assurance of access. This is your loyal group that win or lose will generally stick with the team.

The Secondary Per Game buyer is looking to attend specific games. They aren't as price conscious, willing to pay more to go to big games (ie vs Vancouver or Montreal) or for specific players (like seeing Henry or Beckham.) This group is more concerned about wins, losses, or "atmosphere". It's a night out (or a few nights out) and they'd like to get something exciting from that.

The trouble right now lies in the fact that both markets are connected.

The Secondary Per Game buyer isn't snapping up seats because of performance and lack of exposure. They have heard the team is crappy but haven't been watching because they don't have GolTV (in Standard Definition). Most are casually following the team at best.

Unfortunately, this drives the value for the Season Ticker Buyer down. Remember, they want to see all games and at a discount. Anyone with a calculator will see that you could get to all games, for prices less than season seats. So, why renew?

If they focus on the secondary market by marketing the team, and drive demand up on a per game basis, suddenly my season tickets have value once again. Which is where I think the Red Book signifies a direction change for the FO. They have to market the team now.

Ideally, that means TFC games in HD. More media coverage, more hype, and maybe we can even sell our tickets at cost once again in the near future. Which is why I see the investment in marketing as a positive for Season Ticket Holders.

[ensco]

I personally would not renew a more expensive seat on the thesis that the FO can/will influence secondary market pricing through marketing. To each his own.

[LCB]

I need a decrease. With tickets out there in various deals at 30% off, why would I be so stupid as to renew my seasons?

Seeing everyone talk about price, and a reduction, made me wonder if I'm the only one who saw an invoice on their account for next year's tickets, as I did yesterday. So I logged back in just now and the invoice is gone, possibly a bug?

I do recall though that it was $722 for my two tickets in 112. Did anyone else see this? Or am I misreading and it's a non-issue?

Edit: that's a drop from I think, $800 last year.

[Suds]

Seeing everyone talk about price, and a reduction, made me wonder if I'm the only one who saw an invoice on their account for next year's tickets, as I did yesterday. So I logged back in just now and the invoice is gone, possibly a bug?

I do recall though that it was $722 for my two tickets in 112. Did anyone else see this? Or am I misreading and it's a non-issue?

Edit: that's a drop from I think, $800 last year.


Last year Tickbastard screwed up and posted ticket package prices early and eventually pulled them. This started the early rage among SSH's once they realized the increases they were facing.

I have no idea if this is the same in your case, but it would not surprise me based on past experience.

[bones]

Seeing everyone talk about price, and a reduction, made me wonder if I'm the only one who saw an invoice on their account for next year's tickets, as I did yesterday. So I logged back in just now and the invoice is gone, possibly a bug?

I do recall though that it was $722 for my two tickets in 112. Did anyone else see this? Or am I misreading and it's a non-issue?

Edit: that's a drop from I think, $800 last year.

Did you get pinged with the MLS Cup or did you wait to renew at a "reduced" cost?

[DichioTFC]

This should encourage me to check my mailbox, which I haven't checked in a few weeks now.

... It should, but didn't.

[LCB]

Did you get pinged with the MLS Cup or did you wait to renew at a "reduced" cost?

Last year? I had the MLS cup included. I don't remember the details, and now I'm kicking myself that I didn't look into the invoice more before it disappeared (i.e. which games were included, etc).

I'm almost positive it was $722 though. Anyway, I guess we'll see.

[bones]

Last year? I had the MLS cup included. I don't remember the details, and now I'm kicking myself that I didn't look into the invoice more before it disappeared (i.e. which games were included, etc).

I'm almost positive it was $722 though. Anyway, I guess we'll see.

So last year you would have paid more because of the cup tickets and this would look like a reduction without it.

hmmm, interested to see now. I thought we were under a price freeze for next year. I'm not anticipating a reduction with the increase in overhead maxing out 3 DP's.

[LCB]

So last year you would have paid more because of the cup tickets and this would look like a reduction without it.

hmmm, interested to see now. I thought we were under a price freeze for next year. I'm not anticipating a reduction with the increase in overhead maxing out 3 DP's.

Ahhh, I see, I see what you're saying. I guess about $40/cup ticket is probably about right, too. It makes sense.

[Pookie]

Don't forget though that with Montreal in the league there will be an extra home date.

[menefreghista]

Last year? I had the MLS cup included. I don't remember the details, and now I'm kicking myself that I didn't look into the invoice more before it disappeared (i.e. which games were included, etc).

I'm almost positive it was $722 though. Anyway, I guess we'll see.

Hmm. That's an interesting number.

Last year south end tickets ended up being $376 (with the MLS Cup ticket). At the number you saw whey would be $361 (or possibly $355 + the account fee) for next year.

I don't consider that much of a discount. Although its the higher priced tickets that will require much deeper discounting.

Edit:

Just doing some math, and $361 works out perfectly for 19 games at $19 each. That would essentially be a price freeze from last year. Maybe their plan is to make the NCC tickets 'free'.

[Wombat]

I received my package in this morning's post - "this looks interesting" I thought, as I opened the TFC envelope, hope it's something useful like a car sticker, tee shirt or beer / food coupon for the final home game, etc

No - as I looked through the glossy booklet, which was very professional & expensive to print, I got quite angry...

all fluff & rah-rah about "next year we'll be a TEAM, here's our philosophy, we value the fans, you're our 12th man....blah, blah, blah

Actions speak louder than words... this booklet was like giving beads & trinkets to the Indians as they ripped off their gold!

Another waste of club funds and an insult to our intelligence.

Message to TFC front office - forget the glossy mags - give us a winnning team & cheaper beer :flare:

[AL-MO]

Got mine in the mail today. I completed the first survey but didn't bother with the last one.

I'll have a read when I get a chance.

[brad]

I want to renew my season tickets but only one thing will have any impact on whether I do or not:

PRICE

I am sick to death of massive annual price increases. And whichever way they sell it with including this and that, what I want, for once, is the smallest number possible when it comes time to pay the renewal fees.

I think they said there will be a price freeze next year, and there was a debate about what that would mean given that this season included the All Star game cost - are they freezing total number you have to pay, price per game, total price for league and CCC games package?

Frankly I think they should go the extra mile and for renewing season ticket holders give a price freeze on the per match cost of league games and chuck in free CCC games to boot.

Time to give something back after all the years of taking.

They should drop the prices - flat out. Prices are set by supply and demand. The prices where inflated when the supply was low and the demand was high.

The demand is now low and the supply is high, and prices should be adjusted to reflect that.

I don't expect that to happen though.

[brad]

If the book is as you say for the casual fans, i am afraid they have lost the plot then.

This book will have zero impact on what someone in 225 will do at renewals.

SSH other than the ones in supporter sections, care about 2 things: Wins & price of product.
This book will be tossed in the garbage just as fast as junk mail with flyers from longos.

I would add a third, they want to be entertained with attacking football. I don't think the masses would appreciate a winning team playing Preki-ball

[brad]

Agreed. I've always theorized that there are 2 markets for TFC tickets.

Season Ticket Market and Secondary Per Game Market

The Season Ticket buyer is essentially looking for value. They will attend all (or most) games and want to save some money by buying in bulk. They also want the assurance of access. This is your loyal group that win or lose will generally stick with the team.

The Secondary Per Game buyer is looking to attend specific games. They aren't as price conscious, willing to pay more to go to big games (ie vs Vancouver or Montreal) or for specific players (like seeing Henry or Beckham.) This group is more concerned about wins, losses, or "atmosphere". It's a night out (or a few nights out) and they'd like to get something exciting from that.

The trouble right now lies in the fact that both markets are connected.

The Secondary Per Game buyer isn't snapping up seats because of performance and lack of exposure. They have heard the team is crappy but haven't been watching because they don't have GolTV (in Standard Definition). Most are casually following the team at best.

Unfortunately, this drives the value for the Season Ticker Buyer down. Remember, they want to see all games and at a discount. Anyone with a calculator will see that you could get to all games, for prices less than season seats. So, why renew?

If they focus on the secondary market by marketing the team, and drive demand up on a per game basis, suddenly my season tickets have value once again. Which is where I think the Red Book signifies a direction change for the FO. They have to market the team now.

Ideally, that means TFC games in HD. More media coverage, more hype, and maybe we can even sell our tickets at cost once again in the near future. Which is why I see the investment in marketing as a positive for Season Ticket Holders.

There is another reason to be a season ticket holder - attachment to the people in your vicinity. I have become good friends with people that I sit with and watching the matches with them is a big part of my game day experience. Give up my seasons and I lose that.

[Klinsmann]

Got mine in the mail today. I completed the first survey but didn't bother with the last one.

I'll have a read when I get a chance.

WTF! I still haven't received mine yet! If it doesn't come tomorrow I'm not renewing............

[CoachGT]

The little red book is a pretty good keepsake. I've had a few players sign mine, and most hadn't seen it before and were genuinely interested and thought it a nice touch.

The back "blank" pages are ideal for players to sign, and this will be a very nice thing to keep. I have a few of these SSH items from the Blue Jays in the 80s and while they may seem cheesy at the time, they are very good little keepsakes.

Who knows, they might be worth something some day!

[London]

so was there ever an explination on the blank pages??

it was half the book and looks like it was strategically done when you see some pages have quotes

[Mark in Ottawa]

Never got the "Red Book" and don't expect I ever will given I am a "partial pack" ticket holder.

I have never got anything from the club except a rise in blood pressure every time I think about the "ransom pack" that I was stupid enough to have purchased in the past.