Avila for Santos?

[Nuvinho]

TXFutgol (http://twitter.com/TXFutgol)

Breaking: Eric Avila to Toronto FC for Maicon Santos #fcdallas (http://twitter.com/search?q=%23fcdallas) #mls (http://twitter.com/search?q=%23mls) #tcf (http://twitter.com/search?q=%23tcf)10 minutes ago (http://twitter.com/TXFutgol/status/98472194149072896)via Twitter for iPhone (http://twitter.com/#!/download/iphone)Retweeted by 3rdDegreeNet (http://twitter.com/3rdDegreeNet)

[Whoop]

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Eric_Avila

[Nuvinho]

GA player

Avila decided to forgo his senior season as professional clubs started to show interest. Avila decided to sign a Generation Adidas (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Generation_Adidas) contract and he was subsequently drafted in the 2nd Round (19th Overall) by FC Dallas (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/FC_Dallas) in the 2008 MLS SuperDraft (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2008_MLS_SuperDraft#Round_2).

[Detroit_TFC]

His stats don't really say "attacking mid" to me.

[pekduck]

if true, not bad to free up international spot to get a US domestic MF for depth

[denime]

Nice, another young player and GA.

is this the AM there was some talk last week?

[pekduck]

His stats don't really say "attacking mid" to me.

in depth game log shown that most of his 'games' are 1 min - 15 min subs to kill time or causing havoc

[Whoop]

If this is true, Avila would be player #36 and TFC will have tied New York's record for most players used in a season.

[Nuvinho]

I remember they said that he was supposed to fill in for David Ferriera when he got hurt.

Things good for TFC in this deal:
1.GA player
2.Young
3.Domestic (US) - we gain an international spot

[pekduck]

i think Santos fits FC Dallas's style better as the 4-4-2 striker

[Jeff s]

oh cool, we're back to 2 strikers and a hell of a lot of mids. THis is exactly what we need.

[rocker]

hmm... career backup so far (9 starts in 63 games). I can't say I really remember much about him.

[MartinUtd]

So this means Johnson is now our #2 striker if anything goes wrong with Danny?

[Ossington Mental Youth]

oh cool, we're back to 2 strikers and a hell of a lot of mids. THis is exactly what we need.

we got alot more than only 2 strikers, they just happen to be able to play elsewhere on the field quite well.

-Koevermans
-Johnson
-Merasovic

are all strikers first and fore most

[pekduck]

So this means Johnson is now our #2 striker if anything goes wrong with Danny?

It appears that way to me. Plata/Soolsma/Martina/Merosvic are the wingers.

Dunfield/JDG/Frings/Sturgis/Stinson/Gold/Avila are mids, a little crowded

may be Sturgis or Gold are on the outs?

[jloome]

I may be recalling this incorrectly but I believe Avila can play fullback as well.

[mdc 77]

Seems like he wasn't at FC Dallas' training today...
http://espn.go.com/blog/dallas/soccer/post/_/id/12971/eric-avila-out

[ManUtd4ever]

Well, this must be the alleged deal that Dan Dunleavy tweeted on Sunday.

I like Santos. I hope Avila is worth it.

[Ossington Mental Youth]

So this means Johnson is now our #2 striker if anything goes wrong with Danny?

id say so

also frees up another 100k and an international spot on the roster

[Azerban]

TFC I hope you enjoy Avila giving up on plays, never hoofing down balls and pouting constantly.


cool, exciting

[Pinkie]

noooooooooooooooooo

[Detroit_TFC]

If this is true, Avila would be player #36 and TFC will have tied New York's record for most players used in a season.

The league office must be so sick and tired of getting paperwork from TFC by now. Bet they have August 14 circled on their calendars.

[Ossington Mental Youth]

Well, this must be the alleged deal that Dan Dunleavy tweeted on Sunday.

I like Santos. I hope Avila is worth it.

def gotta put faith in mariner for this one

[Whoop]

FWIW, Kurt Larson from the Sun likes the deal. I tend to trust him as he seems to have some decent knowledge of the landscape when it comes to Americans, seeing as he is one.

Says he's more dynamic than Santos and fits TFC's system better than Santos.

Even though Santos had 6 goals, he always seemed out of sorts.

We'll have to wait and see.

[rocker]

def gotta put faith in mariner for this one

you BLIND FAITHER!!! ;)

[pekduck]

FWIW, Kurt Larson from the Sun likes the deal.

Says he's more dynamic than Santos and fits TFC's system better than Santos.

Even though Santos had 6 goals, he always seemed out of sorts.

We'll have to wait and see.

i think this trade will be a win-win for both players and teams. FC Dallas gets starting FC in Santos in its 4-4-2. We free up Intl spot, depth in versatile and young MF, and more than likely more playing time for both Avila and Santos

[Ageroo]

Seems like he wasn't at FC Dallas' training today...
http://espn.go.com/blog/dallas/soccer/post/_/id/12971/eric-avila-out

He definitely knows something is up......according to his twitter.

http://twitter.com/#!/EricAvila12

Seems like he was held up in el salvador......possibly for a short trip to Nicaragua.....:)

[Whoop]

From what I'm quickly reading/glancing at, it sounds like he'll probably fit into that AM role but can play the wing as well.

[ag futbol]

id say so

also frees up another 100k and an international spot on the roster
We'll have to check and see if there is any sign of him graduating from the GA program before we confirm the cap hit.

I'd like to see us upgrade our wing positions. Outside of Plata, not enough speed and overall quality.

[rocker]

FWIW, Kurt Larson from the Sun likes the deal. I tend to trust him as he seems to have some decent knowledge of the landscape when it comes to Americans, seeing as he is one.

Says he's more dynamic than Santos and fits TFC's system better than Santos.

Even though Santos had 6 goals, he always seemed out of sorts.

We'll have to wait and see.

I'm torn on Santos. He has some really good traits (hard shot, can do some good interplay with teammates, has actually scored goals) but on the other hand, he only fits one spot (up front striker), seems lazy at times, occasionally makes dumb decisions (see the KC game for two examples).

[arsenal]

We'll have to check and see if there is any sign of him graduating from the GA program before we confirm the cap hit.

I'd like to see us upgrade our wing positions. Outside of Plata, not enough speed and overall quality.

Graduated GA last season ... salaries are comparable so no money saved unless part of the deal

http://www.mlssoccer.com/news/article/generation-adidas-players-graduate-seasons-end

[Whoop]

The one thing I'm gathering from Winter - and it's more of an Ajax trait - is that he's trying to find players who can fill more than one role on the pitch, with the exception of the keeper and the target man.

[Ossington Mental Youth]

i like santos but realize it was time for him to go, bit of a waste of talent and money with him only ever playing back up here

[pekduck]

The one thing I'm gathering from Winter - and it's more of an Ajax trait - is that he's trying to find players who can fill more than one role on the pitch, with the exception of the keeper and the target man.

yep, noticed that too, almost all of them are dual position capable to maximize the value and options

[mdc 77]

Santos is talented and lazy...too bad because he should have been better but just didn't seem to care to be. Oh well. No big loss, another young player with potential, i'll take it.

[rocker]

I'm still pissed off at him for the KC game... when he was in midfield, he turns back towards the KC goal, tries to take on everybody despite passing options, gets stripped, KC goes back on the counter and scores. Then the play where he's "guarding" the post on the corner kick, sees the ball all the way, it comes right to him, he's got a goal line and a side line for clearing out, and it bounces off him straight to Kamara for a goal. I was yelling "WAKE UP!!!!! WAKE UP!!!!!"

But then he'd do things like score that beauty on Vancouver in game 1... or when he took that hard shot in the rain that went through Conway's legs. Sometimes he seemed smart, sometimes he seemed dopey, unaware.

[117]

Avila dressed vs. Alianza but did not play. That means he's Cup-tied for the rest of the tourney, and not eligible for us, yes?

Santos did not dress, and will probably see action against us in the group stage, if both TFC and FCDallas qualify.

[mdc 77]

On a sidenote the world football adventure for Santos continues. He has played in Brazil, North Africa, Israel, Toronto, L.A. and now Texas

[Ossington Mental Youth]

Avila dressed vs. Alianza but did not play. That means he's Cup-tied for the rest of the tourney, and not eligible for us, yes?

Santos did not dress, and will probably see action against us in the group stage, if both TFC and FCDallas qualify.

think it might reset if we qualify

[PopePouri]

cool, exciting

No player is without his faults. We can something similar like:

Dallas I hope one day you'll enjoy Santos' ability to sit on the bench or being injured and one day if he does play, he'll probably be invisible for most of the game.

[Couchy81]

No player is without his faults. We can something similar like:

Dallas I hope one day you'll enjoy Santos' ability to sit on the bench or being injured one day and if he does play, he'll probably be invisible for most of the game.

It's true, even though he has an amazing shot and scored some screamers for us, his lack of vision with passing and ability to melt into the shadows of the play ultimately led to him not starting for a number of games. I still think he is a super-sub though.

[Serb_Star]

I liked Santos, it wasn't his fault that the coach played him out of position.

[prizby]

If this is true, Avila would be player #36 and TFC will have tied New York's record for most players used in a season.


and griffit will be player #37


NEW RECORD!

[mdc 77]

I liked Santos, it wasn't his fault that the coach played him out of position.

Oh thats what caused him being lazy.

[prizby]

I liked Santos, it wasn't his fault that the coach played him out of position.

you mean to say its not his fault that he doesn't fit into the system and is extremely lazy

[BFin]

On a sidenote the world football adventure for Santos continues. He has played in Brazil, North Africa, Israel, Toronto, L.A. and now Texas

LOL

I don't think you need to separate out LA and Texas, or Toronto (from Canada) if you are lumping Brazil into one category.

[dantdot]

First play that comes to mind when I think of Santos. That made a lot worst miss of year compilations.

VTEorzMDWKI&

To be fair, he did have some crackers.

[Ultra & Proud]

TFC I hope you enjoy Avila giving up on plays, never hoofing down balls and pouting constantly.

Hey Dallas, hope you like the same because that's what you just got. The only difference is that the one you got is injured often and won't back track to defend after he tries to take on 3 opposing players and gets stripped.

[Ossington Mental Youth]

I liked Santos, it wasn't his fault that the coach played him out of position.

he was good in his position BUT also disposable

[mastermixer]

First play that comes to mind when I think of Santos. That made a lot worst miss of year compilations.

VTEorzMDWKI&

To be fair, he did have some crackers.

Wow... Stevanovic on TFC seems like years ago.

[mdc 77]

LOL

I don't think you need to separate out LA and Texas, or Toronto (from Canada) if you are lumping Brazil into one category.

True. Although I don't think he ever really played in Brazil, not many matches at least. Actually for someone whos 27 he sure has been on a lot of clubs but not played much. Tells ya something about the man eh?

For the sake of accuracy;

Santos has now played in Rio and Belem in Brazil. Sousse, Tunisia and Benghazi, Libya in North Africa. Couple of small towns in Israel. L.A., Toronto and now Dallas.

[ag futbol]

Oh thats what caused him being lazy.
Being a striker isn't about work rate, it's about being effective. He is effective as a striker but doesn't have the characteristics needed to play mid.

Winter wants versatility so this makes him surplus.

[Canary10]

He's not really effective as a striker either, and has a bad work rate.

[117]

and griffit will be player #37


NEW RECORD!


And Dasan Robinson #38?

[kodiakTFC]

Its official, both teams have announced it on twitter. I'm okay with it.

[mowe]

http://www.mlssoccer.com/news/article/2011/08/02/fc-dallas-trade-avila-toronto-fc-acquire-santos

We also gave up one international spot for the rest of the year.

[mdc 77]

Being a striker isn't about work rate, it's about being effective. He is effective as a striker but doesn't have the characteristics needed to play mid.

Winter wants versatility so this makes him surplus.

Maybe if you have world class talent it isn't about work rate, Santos is nowhere near that class.

[ag futbol]

He's not really effective as a striker either, and has a bad work rate.

Maybe if you have world class talent it isn't about work rate, Santos is nowhere near that class.
Yeah .. going to have to disagree with these. He's paid a low level MLS salary and produces a decent number of goals, I think that's acceptable.

Looking for work rate from your striker is barking up the wrong tree.

[__wowza]

pros: frees up an international spot and roster space.
cons: i liked santos, and im not too sure about our backup striker role.

i rate this trade:


http://i.imm.io/7OT9.pnghttp://i.imm.io/7OT9.pnghttp://i.imm.io/7OT9.pnghttp://i.imm.io/7OTe.pnghttp://i.imm.io/7OTe.png

THREE HARDEN O-FACES OUTT'VE FIVE.

[BFin]

True. Although I don't think he ever really played in Brazil, not many matches at least. Actually for someone whos 27 he sure has been on a lot of clubs but not played much. Tells ya something about the man eh?

Big time.

No disagreement from me.

Maicon's bullet of a shot was often outweighed by his unwillingness to look for teammates, his inability to look off defenders, and his lack of defensive effort.

[Whoop]

http://www.mlssoccer.com/news/article/2011/08/02/fc-dallas-trade-avila-toronto-fc-acquire-santos

We also gave up one international spot for the rest of the year.


pros: frees up an international spot and roster space.
cons: i liked santos, and im not too sure about our backup striker role.

i rate this trade:


http://i.imm.io/7OT9.pnghttp://i.imm.io/7OT9.pnghttp://i.imm.io/7OT9.pnghttp://i.imm.io/7OTe.pnghttp://i.imm.io/7OTe.png

THREE HARDEN O-FACES OUTT'VE FIVE.

Nope.

TFC gives up an international spot in the deal.

[Auzzy]

^ But only for 1/2 a season.

[pekduck]

ah.. so our International Spot went to Dallas with Santos for this season. well, can't have everything i guess

[__wowza]

^ But only for 1/2 a season.

a golden martin saric head on top of the original rating!
cause this is starting to sound like a steal.

http://i.imm.io/7OUi.png

[mdc 77]

Maicon's bullet of a shot was often outweighed by his unwillingness to look for teammates, his inability to look off defenders, and his lack of defensive effort.

This right here is what I meant about his lacking work rate. "Work rate" or being lazy doesn't just mean running fast, it's making plays and showing a desire to do so. Santos rarely did that.

[Ossington Mental Youth]

decent enough trade, looking forward to seeing what he can offer in midfield, curious to see if he can play tonight/for the rest of the CCL

[FootieChick]

It's official. I fucking HATE WINTER!

He keeps trading off our valuable players that DO SOMETHING... first Attakora, now Santos!?! What's next, FUCKIN PLATA OR MARTINA?

Instead of creating a 'functional system' for the players we HAVE that are MORE THAN ABLE TO PERFORM. He creates some God awful system that DOES NOT WORK in the fucking MLS! We are NOT IN EUROPE! This is a NORTH AMERICAN team and we have different talent and a different game. It's a hard game. Not pretty passes and a smooth plays. It's rough and ridged with passes you have to run for and people you need to run over. You need size and power - which both Santos and Attakora acquired.

More dissapointment FFS... what else is new?!?

[pekduck]

It's official. I fucking HATE WINTER!

He keeps trading off our valuable players that DO SOMETHING... first Attakora, now Santos!?! What's next, FUCKIN PLATA OR MARTINA?

Instead of creating a 'functional system' for the players we HAVE that are MORE THAN ABLE TO PERFORM. He creates some God awful system that DOES NOT WORK in the fucking MLS! We are NOT IN EUROPE! This is a NORTH AMERICAN team and we have different talent and a different game. It's a hard game. Not pretty passes and a smooth plays. It's rough and ridged with passes you have to run for and people you need to run over. You need size and power - which both Santos and Attakora acquired.

More dissapointment FFS... what else is new?!?

easy there Steph :)

in other news, official release on MLS

http://www.mlssoccer.com/news/article/2011/08/02/fc-dallas-trade-avila-toronto-fc-acquire-santos

[Ossington Mental Youth]

where would you play him?
Would you sit Koevermans to play him?

Sorry, does not compute.

Shit we even have Johnson to play for Koevermans (should godforbid anything happen to him), ever Johnson has a better record than Santos.

Santos was decent and did well here but its not a huge loss by anymeans especially as we have enough decent cover. Dude wasnt going to get playing time, was taking up an international slot and costing 145k or something. Im sure he'd rather move and play then rot on the bench.

[dantdot]

Plata now has the most goals for TFC. That really tells the story.

[Pachuco]

It's official. I fucking HATE WINTER!

He keeps trading off our valuable players that DO SOMETHING... first Attakora, now Santos!?! What's next, FUCKIN PLATA OR MARTINA?

Instead of creating a 'functional system' for the players we HAVE that are MORE THAN ABLE TO PERFORM. He creates some God awful system that DOES NOT WORK in the fucking MLS! We are NOT IN EUROPE! This is a NORTH AMERICAN team and we have different talent and a different game. It's a hard game. Not pretty passes and a smooth plays. It's rough and ridged with passes you have to run for and people you need to run over. You need size and power - which both Santos and Attakora acquired.

More dissapointment FFS... what else is new?!?

I don't agree with the sentiment that you can't play a possession style (which is what I think you are complaining about) in the MLS. The best teams in this league pass the ball incredibly well. Just look at RSL and Dallas for example. They have flare to them, they move the ball around quite nicely, they are far from a team I would describe as size and power.

Anyway, as for Santos being traded, as much as I liked him, Winter obviously had no place for him at striker since we have a DP there and he was just brutal playing AM. So if Avila can pick up the pieces here then great.

[Ossington Mental Youth]

I don't agree with the sentiment that you can't play a possession style (which is what I think you are complaining about) in the MLS. The best teams in this league pass the ball incredibly well. Just look at RSL and Dallas for example. They have flare to them, they move the ball around quite nicely, they are far from a team I would describe as size and power.

Anyway, as for Santos being traded, as much as I liked him, Winter obviously had no place for him at striker since we have a DP there and he was just brutal playing AM. So if Avila can pick up the pieces here then great.


agreed on all fronts

[ManUtd4ever]

ah.. so our International Spot went to Dallas with Santos for this season. well, can't have everything i guess

I think Dallas needed our international slot in order to consumate the deal.

In essence, we gave up our backup CF for their backup AM. I hope this will be a case of the deal working out well for both clubs, based on the circumstances. Santos was not going to see any meaningful playing time at CF behind Koevermans, and he just wasn't effective in the midfield.

[Ultra & Proud]

He keeps trading off our valuable players that DO SOMETHING... first Attakora, now Santos!?!

Well Santos hasn't contributed much in a while other than a few decent strikes and a whole lotta misses. Passing, defending, getting into good positions, and not giving up on balls when he tried to dribble past 3 defenders on our side of the field were not part of his resume so they hardly went missing.

And Attakora is being run out of town by the Quakes supporters and they are using his acquisition as the ammo to get the FO to shitcan Yallop.

[FootieChick]

No one has to agree with me... I know it and I see it. I've done enough research and watched enough footie in my lifetime to know when something DOES NOT WORK. Santos didn't have a position! How do you play when you're running wild on a field with no position!?!?!

No I will not take it easy or calm down... this team is not what it should be. It's a bunch of people put together to play a game... not a team. More rebuilding... get rid of the players that don't do fuck all like JDG. He is still stickin' his thumb up his ass on that one.

[117]

Plata now has the most goals for TFC. That really tells the story.

And Martina and Koevs tied for second with 2 each. That's active career scoring for TFC in all comps.

[Couchy81]

And Attakora is being run out of town by the Quakes supporters and they are using his acquisition as the ammo to get the FO to shitcan Yallop.

Attakora messed up on both goals leading to Dero's brace the past game that led to Dero being named player of the week.

[Ossington Mental Youth]

No one has to agree with me... I know it and I see it. I've done enough research and watched enough footie in my lifetime to know when something DOES NOT WORK. Santos didn't have a position! How do you play when you're running wild on a field with no position!?!?!

No I will not take it easy or calm down... this team is not what it should be. It's a bunch of people put together to play a game... not a team. More rebuilding... get rid of the players that don't do fuck all like JDG. He is still stickin' his thumb up his ass on that one.

nothing we can do with JDG while his contract is still good.
Good luck with your mission (pretty sure a few of us here have watched a bit of football as well)

[Ultra & Proud]

With Santos having 6 goals and an extra half seasons worth of matches under his belt already, I say Koervermans has as many as him by season's end albeit with about half as many matches played.

[rocker]

Attakora messed up on both goals leading to Dero's brace the past game that led to Dero being named player of the week.

he also looked weak in his first game, the RSL game. He got turned by one guy and easily beaten by another. He has looked very rusty and probably needs more time (like Iro) to get back into form.

[Ultra & Proud]

he also looked weak in his first game, the RSL game. He got turned by one guy and easily beaten by another. He has looked very rusty and probably needs more time (like Iro) to get back into form.

If he (and Yallop) last. Things are not too good down there these days. If Yallop is sacked then Attakora won't be safe.

[BFin]

No one has to agree with me... I know it and I see it. I've done enough research and watched enough footie in my lifetime to know when something DOES NOT WORK. Santos didn't have a position! How do you play when you're running wild on a field with no position!?!?!

No I will not take it easy or calm down... this team is not what it should be. It's a bunch of people put together to play a game... not a team. More rebuilding... get rid of the players that don't do fuck all like JDG. He is still stickin' his thumb up his ass on that one.

You just said Santos didn't have a position, and everyone else has said he couldn't play AM. If you agree with everyone why do you think it is such a bad trade when the team has a better strikes and is in need of a competent AM that can play the system?

JDG's contractual status has long been discussed on this forum.

Most teams are a collection of players. Not sure I get that point.

Are you sure you researched this?

[Ossington Mental Youth]

If he (and Yallop) last. Things are not too good down there these days. If Yallop is sacked then Attakora won't be safe.

yeah Attakoras done at the end of the season too (as far as his contract with MLS is concerned), that wont help

[icecoldbeer]

consequences will never be the same

[69Chevy396]

I cannot believe Dallas made this trade.This may be the trade of the year for this club, if Avila performs the way he has shown in the past (wasn't he one of the stand outs for Dallas during their playoff run?), and build his career in Toronto for a while, he, and not koevermans and Frings, will be the mainstay of this team for a few years. At his age and with his talent, he is clearly a player that the team needs to build around, and am hoping he is able to demonstrate that this was a steal of a deal for Toronto.

[nascarguy]

he is on our roster and I hope he will be good for us.

[ag futbol]

I don't have a problem with giving up Santos, but he was a decent asset so I hope Avila can deliver something in return.

Steven Sandor is saying Atlas is interested in him so his TFC stay may not be that long.

[Ossington Mental Youth]

yeah think he was supposed to go on loan there but it fell through, anyone know when his contracts up?

[Ultra & Proud]

It's official. I fucking HATE WINTER!

He keeps trading off our valuable players that DO SOMETHING... first Attakora, now Santos!?! What's next, FUCKIN PLATA OR MARTINA?

Instead of creating a 'functional system' for the players we HAVE that are MORE THAN ABLE TO PERFORM. He creates some God awful system that DOES NOT WORK in the fucking MLS! We are NOT IN EUROPE! This is a NORTH AMERICAN team and we have different talent and a different game. It's a hard game. Not pretty passes and a smooth plays. It's rough and ridged with passes you have to run for and people you need to run over. You need size and power - which both Santos and Attakora acquired.

More dissapointment FFS... what else is new?!?

Or we could have kept all the same losers from last year and the ones from the first half of this season, had Preki getting us to play tough MLS ready Preki-ball, and had an awesome 'team' that couldn't (and didn't) win shit because 90% of those players were hacks. And if you want to see players running around with no system or position, take a boo at the mess we had last year.

[DangerRed]

The price is great, the depth he adds is welcome and the potential inherent in this kid if we work at developing him will also make itself apparent soon. The possibilities alone make the trade off of losing a lazy, selfish forward more than worth it.

[ManUtd4ever]

I don't have a problem with giving up Santos, but he was a decent asset so I hope Avila can deliver something in return.

Steven Sandor is saying Atlas is interested in him so his TFC stay may not be that long.

I read that Atlas was interested in acquiring him on loan from Dallas recently. Ultimately, it will be TFC's decision, but I envision him playing in Toronto.

[Detroit_TFC]

Through all of this it's very clear to me we'd be in the deep weeds if it wasn't for Paul Mariner. That is not a slam against Aron Winter. The dude just has a body of knowledge about the players in the league.

[TFC Cityboy]

looks like a decent trade, but FFS, we need to get that gaping black hole in central defence sorted as pri 1 , Iro and Harden are donkeys

[ryan]

Well I always said Santos was on his way out, just had hoped it would be for a central defender. Oh well.

Lets just play the 3-1-3-3 for the rest of the season. :scarf:

[Ossington Mental Youth]

Through all of this it's very clear to me we'd be in the deep weeds if it wasn't for Paul Mariner. That is not a slam against Aron Winter. The dude just has a body of knowledge about the players in the league.

Fucking eh.
Dude is definitely an integral part of this FO/Team, hope they are paying him ridiculous amounts to keep him happy

[rocker]

Through all of this it's very clear to me we'd be in the deep weeds if it wasn't for Paul Mariner. That is not a slam against Aron Winter. The dude just has a body of knowledge about the players in the league.

that's a good point... in all the talk elsewhere of the inexperience of Winter, people forget Paul Mariner knows this league like the back of his hand, both as a coach and as a scout. That's probably why he was paired with the inexperienced coach.

[Ossington Mental Youth]

Give it some time to acclimitize and the CBs will be better, not best, but better.
Also dont play Harden.

[ryan]

I read that Atlas was interested in acquiring him on loan from Dallas recently. Ultimately, it will be TFC's decision, but I envision him playing in Toronto.

From the article..


Avila nearly joined Atlas of the Mexican Primera División last month before a last-minute paperwork snafu scuttled the loan deal.

[Detroit_TFC]

Though some might say we ARE in the deep weeds right now, but could be in the ditch upside down otherwise.

[ManUtd4ever]

Through all of this it's very clear to me we'd be in the deep weeds if it wasn't for Paul Mariner. That is not a slam against Aron Winter. The dude just has a body of knowledge about the players in the league.

Yup. Winter's acquisitions are Koevermans, Martina, Soolsma, and Bouchiba. Frings can be attributed to Klinsmann. Everyone else is clearly Paul Mariner's handywork.

[Ossington Mental Youth]

that's a good point... in all the talk elsewhere of the inexperience of Winter, people forget Paul Mariner knows this league like the back of his hand, both as a coach and as a scout. That's probably why he was paired with the inexperienced coach.

exactly. Best of both worlds.
I truly believe any trades involving MLS players since Mariners signing has been all Mariner under the guidance of Winter (ie Winter says i need a striker, Mariner finds him a striker in the mold he wants)

[hodgkiss]

i liked that fact that santos scored goals. however, his first touch on the ball was terrible. if avilla can run with the ball through the midfield well without getting picked off and can deliver a good through ball (something we have been missing) then this deal is golden.

[denime]

No one has to agree with me... I know it and I see it. I've done enough research and watched enough footie in my lifetime to know when something DOES NOT WORK. Santos didn't have a position! How do you play when you're running wild on a field with no position!?!?!

No I will not take it easy or calm down... this team is not what it should be. It's a bunch of people put together to play a game... not a team. More rebuilding... get rid of the players that don't do fuck all like JDG. He is still stickin' his thumb up his ass on that one.

That you watched this game so long and you understand what it takes to win in MLS,I can believe that, but you lost me at Santos running wild,seriously Santos running?

Since Winter start cleaning house from deadwood leftovers by previous coach,this team is actually starting to play a soccer,instead of kicking and chasing the ball down the field.

This was definitely good move same as sending Nana to SJ,who very soon will be shipped out from there too.

[Roogsy]

I cannot believe Dallas made this trade.This may be the trade of the year for this club, if Avila performs the way he has shown in the past (wasn't he one of the stand outs for Dallas during their playoff run?), and build his career in Toronto for a while, he, and not koevermans and Frings, will be the mainstay of this team for a few years. At his age and with his talent, he is clearly a player that the team needs to build around, and am hoping he is able to demonstrate that this was a steal of a deal for Toronto.


You might be thinking of someone else. There are lots of Latinos on Dallas so it's tough to figure out who, but Avila was not central in any way to Dallas's run last year.

[Ossington Mental Youth]

he did score the goal against RSL in teh playoffs that brought them to the finals if im not mistaken

[nickio]

We can now play a natural point up

------------ Frei-----------------
Eckersley--Iro--Robertson--Morgan
------Frings----Dunfield--------
-----------Avila----------------
-Plata---------------Johnson---
---------Koevermans------------

and natural point down

------------ Frei-----------------
Eckersley--Iro--Robertson--Morgan
--------------JDG-----------------
--------Frings----Dunfield--------
--Plata-----------------Johnson--
----------Koevermans------------

and the infamous switch, to really screw up and get into those 4-4-2 holes:

------------ Frei-----------------
Eckersley--Iro--Robertson--Morgan
-------------------JDG-----------
--------Frings-------------------
--Plata-----------------Johnson--
--------------Morasevich---------
-------Koevermans---------------

[__wowza]

We can now play a natural point up and natural point down

good point, i didnt notice that.

this may be far reaching, but it could signal a fire under JDGs ass to get out. notice how i said "get out" and not "step up". that man is incapable of such a thing.

[dantdot]

A little higher on this trade after reading some comments from Dallas fans. Described as a decent creative mid that's quick and can also play wide but lacked consistency. We shall see...

[BeerBaron95]

It's official. I fucking HATE WINTER!

He keeps trading off our valuable players that DO SOMETHING... first Attakora, now Santos!?! What's next, FUCKIN PLATA OR MARTINA?

Instead of creating a 'functional system' for the players we HAVE that are MORE THAN ABLE TO PERFORM. He creates some God awful system that DOES NOT WORK in the fucking MLS! We are NOT IN EUROPE! This is a NORTH AMERICAN team and we have different talent and a different game. It's a hard game. Not pretty passes and a smooth plays. It's rough and ridged with passes you have to run for and people you need to run over. You need size and power - which both Santos and Attakora acquired.

More dissapointment FFS... what else is new?!?


Seriously, deal with it.

Often injured, lazy on some plays and bad decisions on others.

Yeah, he scored some sweet goals for the club but it was time to move on from a player that was gonna become a bench backup fixture

Stop letting your 'friendships' with traded players cloud your judgement.. hell, maybe they should be blaming you.. seems all those players you shoot the shit with on bbm or whatever get shipped out!! ;)

Come to think of it......Can u do us a favor and please add JDG?? Cause he needs to go ASAP! :drinking:

Thanks in advance Steph :D

[menefreghista]

looks like a decent trade, but FFS, we need to get that gaping black hole in central defence sorted as pri 1 , Iro and Harden are donkeys

I've mentioned this in another thread, but I think with the additions of Viator, Iro and Robinson recently they are probably done dealing with the CB position.

As for this trade, as much as I like Santos and his goal poaching ability he had become surplus. At least with this trade TFC is taking a chance on a young player with upside.

One thing I've noticed is that in the last couple of weeks TFC has added a lot of players that I would call MLS level 'projects'. This might end up working well for the team if these additions can reach their potential.

[BeerBaron95]

Give Iro some time... Harden is a lost cause.

[BFin]

I wonder if the trading of Santos will be her last straw...

Time for a Canadian.

:)

[Yohan]

A little higher on this trade after reading some comments from Dallas fans. Described as a decent creative mid that's quick and can also play wide but lacked consistency. We shall see...
some guys also think a locker room cancer and who seemed to have switched off after his loan to Atlas fell through...

[ManUtd4ever]

The results of all the recent transactions for all the clubs involved will invariably depend not only talent, but each individual's ability to integrate into their new surroundings. I wouldn't worry too much about comments regarding a player's character. Perhaps Avila was upset over his lack of playing time. There have been many instances around the league wherein talented players flourished in a new environment simply because of a change of scenery.

[redcard]

It's official. I fucking HATE WINTER!

He keeps trading off our valuable players that DO SOMETHING... first Attakora, now Santos!?! What's next, FUCKIN PLATA OR MARTINA?

Instead of creating a 'functional system' for the players we HAVE that are MORE THAN ABLE TO PERFORM. He creates some God awful system that DOES NOT WORK in the fucking MLS! We are NOT IN EUROPE! This is a NORTH AMERICAN team and we have different talent and a different game. It's a hard game. Not pretty passes and a smooth plays. It's rough and ridged with passes you have to run for and people you need to run over. You need size and power - which both Santos and Attakora acquired.

More dissapointment FFS... what else is new?!?

yeah I hate Winter too, that bastard is trying to make TFC a much better team by trading away all that deadwood!! Freakin Ass...who does he think he is!!! LOL!!!

[69Chevy396]

Sadly, these moves good that they appear to be, comes too late to rescue this miserable mls season. Even if the club wins most of their remaining games they would likely fail to make the playoffs.

[jazzy]

Sadly, these moves good that they appear to be, comes too late to rescue this miserable mls season. Even if the club wins most of their remaining games they would likely fail to make the playoffs.

ya absolutely, but it's getting fun, (albeit slowly), again ....and I think there's a certain amount of pride kicking in on the field......

[mmmikey]

Sadly, these moves good that they appear to be, comes too late to rescue this miserable mls season. Even if the club wins most of their remaining games they would likely fail to make the playoffs.

who cares.

this season has been over for weeks, the quicker everyone comes to grips with that the quicker you can see the upside.

this squad is finally looking like a team, and beginning to resemble the type of squad who CAN play the system Winter has put in place. work isn't over, but this project is making some serious strides.

[sashavukelich]

who cares.

this season has been over for weeks, the quicker everyone comes to grips with that the quicker you can see the upside.

this squad is finally looking like a team, and beginning to resemble the type of squad who CAN play the system Winter has put in place. work isn't over, but this project is making some serious strides.

Mikey, you nailed it man.

Spot on. Anyone who watched the San jose Highlights vs DC United so reiterates that we've made grade trades.

Nana FELL DOWN after playing DeRO onside...i was never on the Nana bandwagon, i mean i wish him no harm, but he's not a winner.

Loving the trades, Mariner/Winter trade duo are a flippin brain trust.

[ryan]

Mikey, you nailed it man.

Spot on. Anyone who watched the San jose Highlights vs DC United so reiterates that we've made grade trades.

Nana FELL DOWN after playing DeRO onside...i was never on the Nana bandwagon, i mean i wish him no harm, but he's not a winner.

Loving the trades, Mariner/Winter trade duo are a flippin brain trust.

The SJ/DC game in six had at LEAST 5 Nana errors, seriously.

Peterson made a nice cross to Gordon who got an ok attempt on net, they may actually fit in with that club, who knows, who cares.

[ag futbol]

The SJ/DC game in six had at LEAST 5 Nana errors, seriously.
So if we rewind that and compare it to our Harden / Iro shit-show in the back. push?

Or is it possible both Iro and Nana are making more mistakes than they normally would after long periods of time on the bench.

[mdc 77]

he did score the goal against RSL in teh playoffs that brought them to the finals if im not mistaken

Yes he did.

[69Chevy396]

who cares.

this season has been over for weeks, the quicker everyone comes to grips with that the quicker you can see the upside.

this squad is finally looking like a team, and beginning to resemble the type of squad who CAN play the system Winter has put in place. work isn't over, but this project is making some serious strides.
Yea, I can see this, too bad my season ticket prices stay the same despite the on field product. No discount or scratch and save days in this business.

[ryan]

So if we rewind that and compare it to our Harden / Iro shit-show in the back. push?

Or is it possible both Iro and Nana are making more mistakes than they normally would after long periods of time on the bench.

You'd have to have a spectacularly bad match to have that many errors captured in a game recap.

Harden's not a starter and has no trade worth, so comparing Attakora to him says little.

I'd like to think that they both are simply rusty, time will tell and I don't think enough has been given just yet.

At the end of the day though, the trade with San Jose is looking like absolute trade rape with every match Johnson plays.

[MarkoftheDrink]

0xKfzXyWy3k&sns

As nice as some of Santos' goals were I don't think he would pass the Avi Test either.

[MarkoftheDrink]

I think this kid could be a huge steal.

[rocker]

Yea, I can see this, too bad my season ticket prices stay the same despite the on field product.

If you still have season tickets after what has happened in 2007, 2008, 2009 and 2010, you shouldn't be complaining about the on field product. You knew what you were getting into when you bought for 2011.

[Ossington Mental Youth]

Pretty much. Also the end product (as of recent) is looking significantly better than it has in the past and i bet it only gets better.

[Pookie]

Yea, I can see this, too bad my season ticket prices stay the same despite the on field product. No discount or scratch and save days in this business.

If that materialized, you want prices to go up when the team starts to do well?

[__wowza]

If that materialized, you want prices to go up when the team starts to do well?

ppoks, ive heard you make this argument a lot on the forums, and i wholeheartedly agree. however, the more i look at it, the more i think that MLSE will start to raise prices when we're winning anyways. why not get the cheapest prices we can out of watching a team rebuild?

[69Chevy396]

If that materialized, you want prices to go up when the team starts to do well?
Shit. This did not occur to me. I suppose that means ACC season ticket holders will be taking out mortgages and selling their children by the time the leafs start winning.

[69Chevy396]

If you still have season tickets after what has happened in 2007, 2008, 2009 and 2010, you shouldn't be complaining about the on field product. You knew what you were getting into when you bought for 2011. That reasoning is like having sex with your future mother in law to find out what your wife will be like in 20 years.

[Detroit_TFC]

That reasoning is like having sex with your future mother in law to find out what your wife will be like in 20 years.

An educated consumer is our best customer. :D:hump:

[Ossington Mental Youth]

That reasoning is like having sex with your future mother in law to find out what your wife will be like in 20 years.

god that sounds so hot

[Wull]

That reasoning is like having sex with your future mother in law to find out what your wife will be like in 20 years.


With the girl I'm seeing, I'd be kinda up for that just now :D

[Red Skies At Night]

That reasoning is like having sex with your future mother in law to find out what your wife will be like in 20 years.

You say that like it's a bad thing... don't discount the importance of research.

[__wowza]

i Dont Know What This Thread Is About Anymore.

[Ossington Mental Youth]

sex with Maicon Santos' mother in law

[ManUtd4ever]

:lol:

[ensco]

If you still have season tickets after what has happened in 2007, 2008, 2009 and 2010, you shouldn't be complaining about the on field product. You knew what you were getting into when you bought for 2011.

That is not true. It's pretty easy to feel hosed. It's been maybe the most massive turnover of players in sports history, a perpetual training camp. Prices of course remained the highest in the league.

There are two outfield players left from the season end 2010 roster (4 if you count Cann and Lindsay, but you get the picture).

How you feel about that is up to you. I think they're going to pay for it.

[ArmenJBX]

The difference is, however, that the turnover rate for the next season looks like it's going to remain relatively low.

Winter is building HIS team, and I doubt they'd make the same mistake as years prior and blow it up if it doesn't work immediately.

[ManUtd4ever]

That is not true. It's pretty easy to feel hosed. It's been maybe the most massive turnover of players in sports history, a perpetual training camp. Prices of course remained the highest in the league.

There are two outfield players left from the season end 2010 roster (4 if you count Cann and Lindsay, but you get the picture).

How you feel about that is up to you. I think they're going to pay for it.

Agreed on all accounts. I have no doubt that renewals will stagnate next season, but that will benefit all of us in the long run.

[menefreghista]

The difference is, however, that the turnover rate for the next season looks like it's going to remain relatively low.

Winter is building HIS team, and I doubt they'd make the same mistake as years prior and blow it up if it doesn't work immediately.

I think the turnover will continue. Lots of the guys Winter/Mariner brought in during the first transfer window will probably also be moved out (Martina, Yourass, etc.) This team still isn't good enough to compete in MLS. Don't let matches against Portland and Real Esteli fool you.

And it wouldn't surprise me if there is an entirely new CB pairing.

It also wouldn't surprise me if at the end of the day we have nothing to show for the De Rosario trade.

[rocker]

That is not true. It's pretty easy to feel hosed. It's been maybe the most massive turnover of players in sports history, a perpetual training camp. Prices of course remained the highest in the league.

There are two outfield players left from the season end 2010 roster (4 if you count Cann and Lindsay, but you get the picture).

How you feel about that is up to you. I think they're going to pay for it.

I just find it amusing that people renew over and over and then complain when the team sucks. I have heard this *every year* since the end of the 2008 season.

I say to them "Buyer Beware." This team hasn't had much success. Buying season seats and then complaining about performance is like buying a used car you know has had major running problems in the past and then complaining when it breaks down.

Personally, I knew it was going to be a rebuilding year when Preki and Mo were fired. I still renewed my season seats. I'm not now going to complain that I'm getting ripped off because the team is performing poorly in rebuilding mode and demand a refund. I took my chances, knowing how shitty this team has been over the years and all the turmoil that's gone on. I was fully aware.

[ManUtd4ever]

I think the turnover will continue. Lots of the guys Winter/Mariner brought in during the first transfer window will probably also be moved out (Martina, Yourass, etc.) This team still isn't good enough to compete in MLS. Don't let matches against Portland and Real Esteli fool you.

And it wouldn't surprise me if there is an entirely new CB pairing.


I think the bulk of the current roster will remain intact going into next season though, especially our key players in the starting lineup.

[Ossington Mental Youth]

id be amazed if we rid of Johnson, who we got for the DeRo trade and thats just one piece of it

[Ossington Mental Youth]

I think the bulk of the current roster will remain intact going into next season though, especially our key players in the starting lineup.

agreed, i dont think our team will differ much next year from what we have right now, except they will play better together

[menefreghista]

id be amazed if we rid of Johnson, who we got for the DeRo trade and thats just one piece of it

No. We got Johnson in the Attakora + Peterson + Gordon trade.

Right now we essentially have Borman, Iro, Griffit and a draft pick to show for De Rosario.

[denime]

I just find it amusing that people renew over and over and then complain when the team sucks. I have heard this *every year* since the end of the 2008 season.

I say to them "Buyer Beware." This team hasn't had much success. Buying season seats and then complaining about performance is like buying a used car you know has had major running problems in the past and then complaining when it breaks down.

Personally, I knew it was going to be a rebuilding year when Preki and Mo were fired. I still renewed my season seats. I'm not now going to complain that I'm getting ripped off because the team is performing poorly in rebuilding mode and demand a refund. I took my chances, knowing how shitty this team has been over the years and all the turmoil that's gone on. I was fully aware.

+1,
this post sums it really nice

[menefreghista]

I think the bulk of the current roster will remain intact going into next season though, especially our key players in the starting lineup.

There is a core of 5-6 players who might be good enough to form a good MLS team. But there are a number of positions we need to improve on. Plus a number of the recent additions are projects. They won't all pan out.

[DichioTFC]

I'd prefer getting a defender for Santos, but at this point, I'll take this plus the always mysterious allocation money

[ManUtd4ever]

I just find it amusing that people renew over and over and then complain when the team sucks. I have heard this *every year* since the end of the 2008 season.

I say to them "Buyer Beware." This team hasn't had much success. Buying season seats and then complaining about performance is like buying a used car you know has had major running problems in the past and then complaining when it breaks down.

Personally, I knew it was going to be a rebuilding year when Preki and Mo were fired. I still renewed my season seats. I'm not now going to complain that I'm getting ripped off because the team is performing poorly in rebuilding mode and demand a refund. I took my chances, knowing how shitty this team has been over the years and all the turmoil that's gone on. I was fully aware.

Sure, STH's that renewed had to be aware that the team was going to struggle, but I don't think anyone could have possibly expected 3 wins thus far. If I buy a used car, I expect it to require additional maintenance and occasional repairs, but I don't expect it to break down regularly.

I do believe that there is finally just cause for optimism looking ahead to next year, but it is certainly understandable if casual fans, that comprise the majority of STH's and are far less knowledgeable about the club than the frequent posters on this forum feel ripped off, and decide not to renew next season as a result.

[ensco]

I just find it amusing that people renew over and over and then complain when the team sucks. I have heard this *every year* since the end of the 2008 season.

I say to them "Buyer Beware." This team hasn't had much success. Buying season seats and then complaining about performance is like buying a used car you know has had major running problems in the past and then complaining when it breaks down.

Personally, I knew it was going to be a rebuilding year when Preki and Mo were fired. I still renewed my season seats. I'm not now going to complain that I'm getting ripped off because the team is performing poorly in rebuilding mode and demand a refund. I took my chances, knowing how shitty this team has been over the years and all the turmoil that's gone on. I was fully aware.

This reads like a press release from MLSE.

Whatever floats your boat.

[Ossington Mental Youth]

No. We got Johnson in the Attakora + Peterson + Gordon trade.

Right now we essentially have Borman, Iro, Griffit and a draft pick to show for De Rosario.

my bad, for wahtever reason remembered getting Gordon from NY which is way off.

Regardless, I still wont be upset.
DeRo either way was going to leave. Lets not make this another DeRo thread.

[menefreghista]

This reads like a press release from MLSE.

Whatever floats your boat.

The funny thing is that even TFC FO essentially promised us things would be better.

They stood in front of us at the townhalls and promised the team would be ready for the start of the season and that this would be the best management team in MLS. Yet it wasn't ready and the jury is still out. But now some fans are totally happy to write off the first 2/3rds of the season.

I don't think even they thought we would have 3 wins in 24 games.

[ManUtd4ever]

There is a core of 5-6 players who might be good enough to form a good MLS team. But there are a number of positions we need to improve on. Plus a number of the recent additions are projects. They won't all pan out.

It depends on the contract status of Ecks and Plata and the injury status of Cann and Williams. If they all remain with the club next season (and I hope they do), I think we could have a core of as many as 8-9 starters returning.

[69Chevy396]

The funny thing is that even TFC FO essentially promised us things would be better.

They stood in front of us at the townhalls and promised the team would be ready for the start of the season and that this would be the best management team in MLS. Yet it wasn't ready and the jury is still out. But now some fans are totally happy to write off the first 2/3rds of the season.

I don't think even they thought we would have 3 wins in 24 games.
Given mlse's legacy of earning bundles of money while building horrible pro teams, winning 3 games was probably right on target for these dummies. Winter seems genuinely perturbed about the lack of success, but his bosses could care less; "winning is a bad thing" is the appropriate motto.

[Yohan]

Let's put this thread back on track...

Some thoughts from Dallas BS poster on Avila


His biggest assets are his creativity and knack for scoring clutch goals. Not fast, but shifty enough to beat players and create room for a pass/shot. A good mix of power and accuracy on his shots. His biggest knocks are strength (easily muscled off the ball) and his consistency - the latter may be cured through more consistent PT.

Avila was perfectly suited to the Vinny "The Microwave" role off the bench for our team - that is, a team with a coach that emphasizes high pressure and two-way play out of pretty much everyone except his #10. Unfortunately for Avila, we already have a pretty damn good #10 (MVP actually) so he either came on late when we needed offense or played as an occasional wide MF.

He never really played enough consistent defense to be in any other role than a supersub on offense for FCD. I think he could be very effective in the #10 role with the right defensive partnerships (and no Ferreira ahead of him). Frings may be a good match in this regard. Don't think I am speaking out of turn to say he is a fan favorite and will be missed. I, for one, wish him the best of luck as he brought a level of excitement every time he came on the field.

is this guy the AM we're looking for?

[ManUtd4ever]

More thoughts on Avila from a FC Dallas supporter...



I am a huge Avila fan, but the sad truth is that he isn't a good fit in the FCD system, mainly because we have a very crowded roster at midfield, and as fans know, Eric is a one-way player....he goes forward, he takes the space, and has really good skill on the ball. He can also thread a fine pass to a striker making a run. However, he gets out of position on the defensive side and he can lose possession in transition, which is why he comes off the bench for us instead of getting the sheer quantity of minutes that he truly deserves to be getting on another team.

I was hoping that the Atlas deal would go through because the style of play in Mexico would be great for him, but this is also a good outcome for Avila. Aron Winter wants to create a one-touch passing team at TFC--a situation that should afford Avi a chance to wear the #10, to create, and to score goals with that golden right foot of his.

[ag futbol]

is this guy the AM we're looking for?
I think he's the "substitute" AM we are looking for.

Unfortunately, long-term I think he finds himself in the same situation he did in Dallas.

[brad]

I'm not so sure he'll be a sub (at least not now). Sounds like the kind of guy that can bring something no one else currently can. I could him being given a shot as our AM.

[69Chevy396]

Avila is precisely the type of player we need more of. He should start every game. Move jdg back to defender or bench him.

[Ossington Mental Youth]

blech, defender?
No thanks, bench him or play him at regular position.
Im sure itll alternate between JDG and Dunfield

[69Chevy396]

blech, defender?
No thanks, bench him or play him at regular position.
Im sure itll alternate between JDG and Dunfield
You mean the world class ex la liga superstar would have trouble playing a new position in mls? Yea, he would.