TFC vs Dallas post-match rant

[Oldtimer]

discuss

[TFCRegina]

Strangely, I'll be the voice of reason.

Give them 5 games together. They actually looked better than the shitty team that took the field for the first 1/2 + a bit of this season. Maybe with a couple games we'll see a little bit more chemistry.

Defense still needs improving. But that's not a revelation to anyone.

At least we didn't get bossed 6-2 or whatever at home.

[ArmenJBX]

Pathetic

[ag futbol]

Good: Frings, Johnson

Bad: Earth to Winter, that's not how you coach!

[Beach_Red]

Strangely, I'll be the voice of reason.

Give them 5 games together. They actually looked better than the shitty team that took the field for the first 1/2 + a bit of this season. Maybe with a couple games we'll see a little bit more chemistry.

Defense still needs improving. But that's not a revelation to anyone.

At least we didn't get bossed 6-2 or whatever at home.

You're right. There was more potential tonight than we've seen in a long time.

[Soccerpro]

You're not going to consistently win with Ty Harden and Danliegh Borman playing. Your just not. End of discussion. Any other improvements are pointless.

[[NBF]]

I was the first one to name the post game thread, the post game rant woooohooo, my idea will live forever!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!1

[ArmenJBX]

My avatar curse better fucking work soon, if he plays one more game I'll become an Impact fan, much less painful.

Well...actually nevermind. Fuck Montreal.

[Blixa]

We lost by the smallest of margins. That is an improvement in my opinion.

[mclaren]

;1344757']I was the first one to name the post game thread, the post game rant woooohooo, my idea will live forever!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!1

But what if we win...oh wait.

[TFC07]

lack of match fitness, chemistry and some of older TFC players playing is the reason why we lost tonight.

[sashavukelich]

Next week we'll be significantly stroker with Ecks back, and Dunfield fit. That means Youra at right back, and Ecks at left back.

I can't believe Maicon Santos missed that wide open header.

[Limani_Ole]

no organization at all.. everyone trying to do their own thing..

too many chiefs not enough ....

[Pookie]

Kind of hard to fault Harden when you get outshot something like 14-3 in the first 60 mins.

But whatever floats your boat.

[Davenport]

You're not going to consistently win with Ty Harden and Danliegh Borman playing. Your just not. End of discussion. Any other improvements are pointless.
or Soolsma, or Yourass, or Sturgis.....
Rating of the new players:
Frings 8
Koev 5
Johnson 7
Viator 3
Iro 4

[adam1001]

Second half was a little bit better than the first, despite the goal. Frings is looking like a solid signing. Koev is horribly out of shape, but i'll give him some time. Defense is pathetic as always. Honestly, a single pylon would be more effective than those 4 clowns.

[PopePouri]

Loving Frings. The quality is just miles ahead of anything we've seen.

[mclaren]

This is like watching Sunderland under Mick McCarthy. Sheer constant pain/boredom.

[ginkster88]

Meanwhile in Seattle...

http://extremegoal.yolasite.com/

Not looking out of place just yet vs. Man. Utd.

[Pookie]

What's with the Soolsma hate? Couple of fairly good crosses into the box as a result of winning 1 v 1 space.

[[NBF]]

I think its possible we become a more attacking team if we get DeGuzman and Frings in the same lineup.

4-2-3-1:
-----------------------Frei------------------
Eckersley----Williams--------Iro---Yourassowsky
-----------DeGuzman--------Frings-----------
---------------------Johnson-----------------
Martina--------------------------------Santos
---------------------Koevermans-------------

[Empirical]

I told y'all!

Kouv looked out of form and that blonde bottom with the Mohawk was looking up to the task. If only I could find a bookie who let me bet after watching the warmup. I'm not complaining I won $280 betting on Dallas. A total of $2,600 betting against TFC on this season. I like to regulate my mood, so I'm never too happy or sad. But I ALWAYS want TFC to win!!

[Roogsy]

Pretty much what I expected, I said this team would need 2-3 games to find their way and losing to a top club in MLS shouldn't surprise us. These guys are after all MLS Cup finalists. I thought there was some good points to take. The DPs did show flashes of their superior quality. I thought Soolsma did well coming on as a sub.

But the D. Oh dear lord that D. And the space again in the middle of the pitch could fit several small houses.

Overall, better. But better from shit is something along the lines of average, and considering the payroll of this roster, average is not good enough. Let's hope that with time, it goes well above average.

[Pookie]

What's the story on JDG? True injury...?

[Stryker]

Kind of hard to fault Harden when you get outshot something like 14-3 in the first 60 mins.

And most of those shots were a result of Harden being way out of position. And as absolutely horrible as he was... Borman somehow managed to be that much worse. The only way those two are going to be of any use to TFC fans is if they're used as pothole filler on the 401.

[Pookie]

And most of those shots were a result of Harden being way out of position. And as absolutely horrible as he was... Borman somehow managed to be that much worse. The only way those two are going to be of any use to TFC fans is if they're used as pothole filler on the 401.

If they are shooting, the ball is in their attacking 1/3 which means we aren't controlling possession in our attacking 1/3.

Anyways, if you have Eckersley, Williams and Cann at your disposal, I'm not sure we see Harden taking regular minutes.

I agree, Borman had a tough game tonight. At times, he can be an asset in supporting the attack moving forward. Not tonight though.

[ArmenJBX]

Quick question.
Why the hell is Yourassowsky, a leftback, being played out of position, allowing dusters like Borman to take the spot?

More importantly, what happened to Demitrius Omphroy? Is he not a fullback who can be used? I'd rather see Omphroy than Borman to be completely honest.

[Shakes McQueen]

I saw some promise. We knew going into this game that it was going to be a few weeks before the new guys gelled with the existing team, but with that said, there were good things.

Frings was fantastic, for his first game as a Red. His set pieces were generally great, and every touch he had was sublime.

Koov showed some cleverness, but was a bit rough, as well as clearly not match fit.

Viator and Iro were all over the place, quality-wise. Considering Viator just signed today, and was playing out of position, I'm willing to give him a bit of time.

Yourass, Sturgis, Borman and Harden were all total garbage.

Hopefully with JDG and Ecks back in the lineup, we look a bit more coherent going forward next time up.

- Scott

[adam1001]

And most of those shots were a result of Harden being way out of position. And as absolutely horrible as he was... Borman somehow managed to be that much worse. The only way those two are going to be of any use to TFC fans is if they're used as pothole filler on the 401.
Exactly. How many times was the defense completely out of position, leaving 2 or 3 dallas players wide open in front of goal?

[Shakes McQueen]

Pretty much what I expected, I said this team would need 2-3 games to find their way and losing to a top club in MLS shouldn't surprise us. These guys are after all MLS Cup finalists. I thought there was some good points to take. The DPs did show flashes of their superior quality. I thought Soolsma did well coming on as a sub.

But the D. Oh dear lord that D. And the space again in the middle of the pitch could fit several small houses.

Overall, better. But better from shit is something along the lines of average, and considering the payroll of this roster, average is not good enough. Let's hope that with time, it goes well above average.

No idea why Winter chose to play Viator out of position and start Harden, instead of putting Gargan in.

But yeah - I agree.

- Scott

[TOBOR !]

My avatar curse better fucking work soon, if he plays one more game I'll become an Impact fan, much less painful.

Well...actually nevermind. Fuck Montreal.

thanks man. you made me smile.

[Heathen]

There`ve been too many games this season that people have been willing to write off but if there ever was one to sacrifice it`s this one. 5 debutants it wasn`t worth investing too much hope. What I will say is that Frings looks a class above anything we've had at TFC.

[sully]

You're not going to consistently win with Ty Harden and Danliegh Borman playing. Your just not. End of discussion. Any other improvements are pointless.

Yes absolutely ^^^

[TOBOR !]

go Venezuela!

[Oldtimer]

Meanwhile in Seattle...

http://extremegoal.yolasite.com/

Not looking out of place just yet vs. Man. Utd.

Man Utd. is barely trying. YAWN

[bigtfcfan]

Iro and Harden = Fail
Frings = highest quality player we have ever had
Yourass = needs to play at LB instead of Borman
Ecks = very missed today

[Serb_Star]

Preki>Winter, at least he knew ho to keep the team organized.

Frings had some great moments.

[TFC07]

Next week we'll be significantly stroker with Ecks back, and Dunfield fit. That means Youra at right back, and Ecks at left back.

I can't believe Maicon Santos missed that wide open header.

I think you mean this Saturday. :o

TFC vs Sporting KC.

[adam1001]

Preki>Winter, at least he knew ho to keep the team organized.

Frings had some great moments.
Cummins>Preki

[ManUtd4ever]

Pretty much what I expected, I said this team would need 2-3 games to find their way and losing to a top club in MLS shouldn't surprise us. These guys are after all MLS Cup finalists. I thought there was some good points to take. The DPs did show flashes of their superior quality. I thought Soolsma did well coming on as a sub.

But the D. Oh dear lord that D. And the space again in the middle of the pitch could fit several small houses.

Overall, better. But better from shit is something along the lines of average, and considering the payroll of this roster, average is not good enough. Let's hope that with time, it goes well above average.


I saw some promise. We knew going into this game that it was going to be a few weeks before the new guys gelled with the existing team, but with that said, there were good things.

Frings was fantastic, for his first game as a Red. His set pieces were generally great, and every touch he had was sublime.

Koov showed some cleverness, but was a bit rough, as well as clearly not match fit.

Viator and Iro were all over the place, quality-wise. Considering Viator just signed today, and was playing out of position, I'm willing to give him a bit of time.

Yourass, Sturgis, Borman and Harden were all total garbage.

Hopefully with JDG and Ecks back in the lineup, we look a bit more coherent going forward next time up.

- Scott

Agreed. I was hoping for a positive result, but Dallas definitely played like MLS Cup finalists tonight.

As for the new acquisitions, Frings played as advertised, Koevermans should be a force once he is match fit, Johnson was creative on the attack, and Iro and Viator were fairly solid defensively, although Viator seems more suited to play in the central defence.

It was a disappointing result tonight, but the additions of Eckersley, JDG, and Dunfield should make a noticeable difference next match.

[TFC USA]

Ty. Fucking. Harden.

[TOBOR !]

go Venezuela!

0 - 0 after 90.

[Stryker]

The reason I hate Harden so much isn't even because he sucks so badly. Its the way he lazily jogs back to or across the box when he could easily challange for the ball if he just busted his ass once in a while.

[PopePouri]

It's always nice to know Vancouver is there to make us feel better.

[gomesv]

Pretty much what I expected, I said this team would need 2-3 games to find their way and losing to a top club in MLS shouldn't surprise us. These guys are after all MLS Cup finalists. I thought there was some good points to take. The DPs did show flashes of their superior quality. I thought Soolsma did well coming on as a sub.

But the D. Oh dear lord that D. And the space again in the middle of the pitch could fit several small houses.

Overall, better. But better from shit is something along the lines of average, and considering the payroll of this roster, average is not good enough. Let's hope that with time, it goes well above average.

"the DPS', dont know about that.....Frings no doubt showed some quality and heart.... Danny..... first game and all but I didn't notice him at all

[TFC USA]

It's obvious we aren't making the playoffs, and if you think otherwise you are damn near demented.

So as much as it pisses me off that in year 5 we're looking for improvement, we have no choice but to look for improvement.

[adam1001]

It's obvious we aren't making the playoffs, and if you think otherwise you are damn near demented.

So as much as it pisses me off that in year 5 we're looking for improvement, we have no choice but to look for improvement.

Agreed. I think we have all has pretty much accepted that were not going to make it yet again.

[TFC USA]

Holy shit Shite Bulls are 4-0 down to Colorado.

[TOBOR !]

0 - 0 after 90.

Paraguay down to 10 men in 104th mimute. just FYI. Still 0-0.

[ArmenJBX]

Dale Venezuelaaaaaaaaa :D

[Roogsy]

"the DPS', dont know about that.....Frings no doubt showed some quality and heart.... Danny..... first game and all but I didn't notice him at all


That's why I said flashes. By the end of the game, both DPs were fairly neutralized.

Danny K however had that one moment where I jumped out of my seat. That blister of a shot from 20 yards out was something else.

[Roogsy]

Holy shit Shite Bulls are 4-0 down to Colorado.

Exactly what I meant when I said that NY was having defensive problems.

[gomesv]

That's why I said flashes. By the end of the game, both DPs were fairly neutralized.

Danny K however had that one moment where I jumped out of my seat. That blister of a shot from 20 yards out was something else.

fair enough.....I know its early on but I think we will enjoy having frings.... and regret losing Gordon just my opinion......

[T.O TILL I DIE]

Remove Borman From Toronto Fc Please.

[TOBOR !]

interesting that the referee's gear manufactured by a company called PENALTY.

[jloome]

I saw great promise tonight undone by the fact that we have a patchwork first team.

Frings was exceptional, easily the best midfield performance in terms of completeness I've seen from this team since Amado's better days.

Koevermans was OK. He looked unfit and the service was just awful. If Borman could hit the broadside of a barn door with a cross we might've had a goal. He's truly a terrible back. Should never start. Speed player for later in the game to menace from midfield? Sure. But his soccer brain is shit and he should never start.

Sturgis was defensively invisible. Yourrasowsky had the opposite problem, trying to do too much; Viator was OK, couple of coverage fuckups and his crossing wasn't so hot. Iro looked leadfooted for this system but also nervous. Certainly looked more solid that Harden. I just can't understand how two grown men with their pedigree can't see how truly dreadful his positioning and foot speed are.

Defense was generally shit. Iro spent most of the game trying to bark at the other guys to keep shape. I thought he was going to have apoplexy.

Still, stick a fit Koevermans up top, get JDG or Dunfield behind him in the hole, and retool the backline with, perhaps,Eckersely remaining as Iro's central partner (he just reads the game really well, and two central defenders who maintain proper positioning will solve a lot of our problems) and it has prospects.

It wasn't embarassing tonight, more frustrating.

[KRO]

Iro and Harden = Fail
Frings = highest quality player we have ever had
Yourass = needs to play at LB instead of Borman
Ecks = very missed today

Yourass = needs to play for some other team!

[v00d00daddy]

I agree with most of whats been said so far although I didn't think harden was as bad as he usually is.

The most irritating TFC player tonight, for me, was plata. Lost the ball on the same 1 v 1 attempt over and over and over.

[Serb_Star]

Penalties! come on Venezuela!

[ag futbol]

Yeah I agree , he over did it challenging the defenders tonight.

It's one thing if you're running at Jonathan Leathers, another if you are taking on a decent back and coming out on the wrong end all the time.

[dupont]

Well.. at least I saw some quality plays today. We still suck but I could kind of see us not sucking in a few months. That is something I guess.

[TOBOR !]

Full time 0-0. Par v Ven going to penalties.

[Jenkins12]

Yourassowsky is complete shite...Get Omphrey at LB because Borman and Yourassowsky are complete trash

[TFC USA]

I'm sick of Borman.

The DeRo trade nets us a promising player we trade away for a central defender and Borman, who is fecking shit right now.

This sucks short term and long term.

[TOBOR !]

1-1 after 1

[SoccMan]

You know what's sad is that a team like Dallas who are lucky to get more than 8,000 per game is able to put a good team out on the pitch, but TFC with very good crowds can't seem to put any type of winning seasons together. TFC had over 21,000 tonight for a midweek game, if this game had been in Dallas there would have been no more than 3,000 people in the stands , however, Dallas has a winning team on the pitch but nobody in Dallas cares, here in Toronto where people do care about their MLS team the team can't get it together, it just makes no sense.

[TOBOR !]

now 3-2 for P'guay after 3

[TOBOR !]

if Paraguay score here they win... and they do. Poor Venezuela.

[ArmenJBX]

FUUUUCK :(

My family is devastated :(
As a Venezuelan, I am so proud of this years side, making it to the semi-finals.

Dale Venezuela! Let's get to the world cup!

[Jenkins12]

Seattle 0-6 UNITED

Atleast were not wasting our time with shite friendlies getting demolished

[jloome]

Heh, Jacob Peterson just set up Wondolowski for the go ahead vs. vancouver.

[Blowing Bubbles]

how about that Brek Shea kid ........

having a 21 year old like him would make me more excited than almost any DP signing (within reason).

[cherono]

That was a very nice goal...

[ag futbol]

2-2 now .. Hassli with a second goal

[mclaren]

Seattle 0-6 UNITED

Atleast were not wasting our time with shite friendlies getting demolished

Make it 7

[swan]

before i throw yourass under the bus i would like to see the guy get some games in his position at LB... how many games has he played at LB, 2..

i just wish winter would start him there instead of borman..

[ensco]

Finalists for the pint. Going to sleep on it before declaring a winner:

ag futbol
FCD has two pretty good defenders back there. I’d say we can expect an industrial but unspectacular performance from Koevermans for his first game out. I think they said he was further away from full fitness than Frings so maybe a 65th minute sub will be seen as well. Frings will win the ball a lot but will probably have some issues linking up going forward with new teammates.


TFCtoMUFC
Both play the full 90 because we need a win and the pressure from the FO to spark more interest in the team. Koevermans will be frustrated at the lack of good service he receives from Soolsma on the wing, but will be pleased with Plata. He'll get a good chance to score, and it will result in a good save. Other than that he will be relatively quiet but show that he will be a force in MLS. Frings will breakup some plays, have a few beautiful touches, but will look a bit lost at the lack of skill on both teams and at that he hasn't quite exactly got the MLS style down just yet. I think he'll take a set piece or two and have the best two efforts off a set piece this year (maybe aside from Sturgis off the crossbar).


kodiakTFC
Frings will move the ball well but won't be noticed much. Koevermans will come on strong early but miss a bunch of chances. We lose 2-1 on a Plata goal early in the second half. Dallas score the first two.

[Jenkins12]

before i throw yourass under the bus i would like to see the guy get some games in his position at LB... how many games has he played at LB, 2..

i just wish winter would start him there instead of borman..

It's not asif it could get worse for us, but Yourass is compelte garbage..I understand he's out of position but he cant get the basics right FFS.

4-3-3 is getting on my nerves..we should just go back to good ol' fashion 4-4-2 or even 4-5-1

[ensco]

Not sure Koevermans should have played 90 minutes, he was limping noticeably.

For all of Frings obvious quality, he was really slow out there, that is not what I wanted to take away from his first game in TFC red.

Johnson was invisible (except when he humorously spent 10 minutes as a DM after Santos came on, but before Zavarise came on). Does anyone have a theory on why Maicon Santos would sit in favour of Ryan Johnson? Maybe there's an injury issue.

Best heckle heard all night (when Shea went down early): "Get up, Flock of Seagulls!"

[Jenkins12]

Not sure Koevermans should have played 90 minutes, he was limping noticeably.

For all of Frings obvious quality, he was really slow out there, that is not what I wanted to take away from his first game in TFC red.

Johnson was invisible (except when he humorously spent 10 minutes as a DM after Santos came on, but before Zavarise came on). Does anyone have a theory on why Maicon Santos would sit in favour of Ryan Johnson? Maybe there's an injury issue.

I didn't think Johnson played that bad actually..didn't get great service and he's not going to be able to play his best when he has Borman playing behind him. I remember being happy about his performance but can't remember why now..cant of been that impressive!

[Whoop]

I didn't notice Frings being slow today. He did hustle, though he didn't look good on the Brek Shea goal.

But to me what I got out of tonight is Frings is far above any class of player that's played at TFC. Just hope he doesn't become demoralized playing with TFC.

Koevermans looked slow. Hasn't played a lot this season.

[Whoop]

And if it wasn't obvious with the loss tonight you can kiss the playoffs goodbye.

Try to focus solely on the CCL.

[backbeat]

all-in-all one of the more entertaining matches at BMO BUT we really need help on defence and mid - which should come (hopefully) by the next game as well as gel time....

--------------------------Frei-----------------------
Viator----------Eks---------------Iro-------Yourassowsky
-------------------------Frings-----------------------
-----------------JDG-----------Dunfield-------------
Plata/Griffit-----------------------------------Johnson
----------------------Koevermans-------------------

[ExiledRed]

Santos proved once again he has the desire to score whatever the run of play even when he doesnt find the net, he's a cracking player to have on the squad and he upstaged a spirited and fun to watch Koevermans, once he took the pitch.

Frings showed his brilliance there but made a couple of forgiveable errors that someone of his calibre usually shouldnt. Shame about that last free kick.

Koevermans has drive and desire and I like him already. Great fun to watch and that scorcher! fuckin' Hartman man What a goal that would have been.

Plata's disallowed goal was irritating, considering his excess of offsides, he's weak on the ball but he played his heart out and looked good out there.

Harden's too poor for this team. waive him or something.

Iro gave me a chuckle. I can imagine:
canadian Ref: "calm down, calm down, eh"
Iro : "Oh great another fuckin comedian! fuck off!"

(if you dont get that dont ask)

[hodgkiss]

what has to go:
sloppy passing, everyone for themselves, small passes forward from frei to defenders (pressure is way to much) fewer long balls, constant giveaways and not being first on the ball.

what has to come back:
posession style game (doesn't exist anymore), control the ball, short passes through the midfield, overlap on the wings more often and positional play.

what needs improvement:
wanting the ball, marking players, reading the play defensively (seeing things before they become an issue), creating more through balls to the centre forward, better crosses from the wings and set piece training and opportunities.

[Dub Narcotic]

You know what's sad is that a team like Dallas who are lucky to get more than 8,000 per game is able to put a good team out on the pitch, but TFC with very good crowds can't seem to put any type of winning seasons together. TFC had over 21,000 tonight for a midweek game, if this game had been in Dallas there would have been no more than 3,000 people in the stands , however, Dallas has a winning team on the pitch but nobody in Dallas cares, here in Toronto where people do care about their MLS team the team can't get it together, it just makes no sense.

Yeah, I wish FC Dallas could get their off-field situation straight, because they are one of my favourite on-field teams in MLS. Lots of good players, they move the ball well and they've done a great job scouting in South America and building their academy. I think there's talk of a downtown stadium so hopefully they get sorted out in a few years. Dallas is a natural soccer hotbed with the climate and Latino influence, and MLS needs that huge media market to generate interest and income for the league.

[ExiledRed]

what has to go:
sloppy passing, everyone for themselves, small passes forward from frei to defenders (pressure is way to much)

Absolutely agree with this, when you have crap players in defence who arent going to be hanging around long, why the fuck are we 'building from the back' when its going to fail to pass the halfway line 40% of the time?

[123 elite]

As expected. A bunch of guys not knowing what anyone else was doing. Not rocket science really. Show me a club where 5 new players in one night works. Show me.

[ExiledRed]

However I'm not at all pissed at this defeat, Im glad it wasnt the CL game.

I really think we played a much stronger game than usual, we typically wilted in the heat with new and apparently tired players. I think next wednesday will give us more clues as to how good we can be.

[rocker]

there are still some major holes on this team in a few positions (CB, LB), but I generally think the squad is better than before the trades. Borman was awful, and so was Harden. Beyond them I didn't think anyone was absolutely pathetic (I mean, in the end they lost just 1-0, so it wasn't like everyone sucked). I see positives. Viator was OK, I guess.. not impressive but better than Gargan.

It's just too bad we had to play Dallas in the first game back from the break. They are obviously a very good team, a team that took Hyndman a few years to build (they didn't make the playoffs right away). Brek Shea was excellent, I hate to admit.

[TFCRegina]

there are still some major holes on this team in a few positions (CB, LB), but I generally think the squad is better than before the trades. Borman was awful, and so was Harden. Beyond them I didn't think anyone was absolutely pathetic (I mean, in the end they lost just 1-0, so it wasn't like everyone sucked). I see positives. Viator was OK, I guess.. not impressive but better than Gargan.

It's just too bad we had to play Dallas in the first game back from the break. They are obviously a very good team, a team that took Hyndman a few years to build (they didn't make the playoffs right away). Brek Shea was excellent, I hate to admit.

I'd definitely agree the trades have made a huge difference. Still gaping holes at the two positions you mentioned, specifically with two players.

Here's a hint: Iro wasn't one of them.

[TFCREDNWHITE]

Viator, borman, iro....suck

[brad]

Still say it will be 5 - 10 games before we can really see what this teams like. Some players need match fitness and everyone needs to get used to their new team mates.

[Alixir]

well I guess its a good thing I didn't break my plans with my wife to watch the game like I wanted to...I didn't miss much.

[Empirical]

You know what's sad is that a team like Dallas who are lucky to get more than 8,000 per game is able to put a good team out on the pitch, but TFC with very good crowds can't seem to put any type of winning seasons together. TFC had over 21,000 tonight for a midweek game, if this game had been in Dallas there would have been no more than 3,000 people in the stands , however, Dallas has a winning team on the pitch but nobody in Dallas cares, here in Toronto where people do care about their MLS team the team can't get it together, it just makes no sense.

1) Welcome to pro sports!

2) Especially: Welcome to MLSE owned sports teams.

IN FACT there is causation for a relationship between fan support (attendance) and losing: MLSE knows they could put a bunch of gorillas in leaf jerseys and put them on the ice and STILL sell out every game, make tonnes of ad revenue off viewers etc...

Same here, the team hasnt scored this month, but still we go in droves, buy 21,000 tickets, not to mention food, bevvies and paraphanalia. Don't get me wrong, if the product is better they will make more money, more people buy jerseys etc... But in terms of the marginal cost, it is sometimes advantageous to not spend on improving the team. (if there will be strong financial fan support anyway)

Dallas on the other hand, will collapse if they dont win, you said they are luckly to have 3,000 fans, imagine what they would look like if they were as poor as us this season? they might not be able to survive.

So in a twisted way, you supporting TFC, puts the club in a position where winning games is not quite a desperate priority. (I see this more with the Leafs, because we have seen TFC spend shitloads on players)

[MarkoftheDrink]

That or they want to keep the shortsighted fans/media happy and try to win/make the playoffs ASAP and in doing so fail to ever properly build a TEAM.

I honestly don't understand the obsession some seem to have with the playoffs. Who cares if we make the playoffs if we scrape in and get bounced the first round? The playoffs are meaningless if we don't have a proper team.

Making the playoffs two years ago when we missed out by a point after we were blown out by NYRB could have set this team back another 5 years from where it is now and Mo might still have a job here. :fear:

As far as tonight goes, good effort from the boys. Dallas has quite an athletic team and they play well as a unit. Considering our influx of new blood and some fitness issue we have, I think with a little luck we could have easily had a point and maybe more. Torsten is a class above and the other players seem like improvements over what we had. Can't wait to see everyone else and Ekersley in the lineup.

[torontocelt]

Frings played well, Koovermans had no service and agree he did not seem 100% fit however it was crazy warm out there. Johnson had some nice touches and looks like he could do well. The rest, hmm not impressed as of yet. To get the best from Kooverman we need players who can cross, Valitor and Borman cannot cross. I would stop short of saying we played well, our defense was ripped apart time and time again, Dallas made it look very easy. I really do think we need to ship JDG out asap and try and get in a DP CB who can begin to Marshall the absolute shit show that is our defense. We are crying out for someone to take control back there and help us keep shape. It is either that or Winter has to make the team play more defensively ie no right back and left backs pushing too far forward. We did miss Ecks but the problem is way worse than what he can fix as we have seen so far. The defense is a combination of players who are not good enough and tactics which are leaving them hung out to dry.

Apologies for spelling of some players names.

[Oldtimer]

The good:

Frings is a very good player. Although it will be a few games until he gets match-fit, he is a tremendous pick-up for the club, everything that you want from a DP. He makes the team look better. I can't imagine what he is thinking after playing in this poor league with this even crappier squad.

The mediocre:

Tactics: For all that we've said about Winter being rigid, he recognized both the heat and the lack of fitness of the players, and had them play route 1 football (this was a deliberate strategy, as they started that way, it wasn't just panic, and they were consistent). However, if he was willing to play a different strategy, he should have changed formations, as well. A 4-4-2 would have done much better in neutralizing Dallas' midfield.

Frei: We're so used to Frei being outstanding, this game he looked a little weak, at times.

Koev: obviously not match fit, at all. His screamer shot on net, though, showed what he is capable of. When fit he could be a game-changer, or not. We'll have to see.

Team effort: Unlike the previous 2 outings, the team didn't give up but pushed until the end. I put that up to Frings and to a lesser extent, Iro.

The bad:

Welcome to pre-season #2. The players don't know each other and it shows. Quite a few were out of shape. It will take several games to meld this group, and by then the playoff deficit will be more than 5 points.

The defense. Disorganized, often caught out of position, they looked horrible. Harden particularly looked terrible, makes one wonder why Gargan wasn't played (I'm sure that Winter can see what we see). I like Harden's character, but he currently doesn't have what it takes to play in MLS. Maybe he is a 'work in progress," or maybe he should go back to whatever he studied in college and call it a day.

The midfield (apart from Frings). Lacking creativity, and just basic skill. Too bad Tchani had to be traded in order to bolster our defence. Hopefully JDG can get back soon, because even at his most mediocre, he is far better than what we saw out there last night.

Hopefully we are like RSL just after their rebuild. It took them half a season to get their chemistry going. However, it may not work, or may take longer.

Definitely the defense will have to be rebuilt over the off-season. JDG will probably go in the January transfer window, and the cap space can be used in back. We also won't be continuing to cover the salaries of ex-TFC players, so that will also bring some cap relief.

[kodiakTFC]

Johnson and Frings had good games. In fact, Frings looked just dominate in the midfield and man wouldn't it have been special if we scored on that rocket of a freekick in the second minute. Iro was pretty bad but I know he's good so i'll give it time.

How about Dallas though? They were incredible all around last night. I keep hearing people on this forum complain about the quality in this league but what I saw tonight was a really talented Dallas team.

What was up with the pitch last night? Everyone was slipping constantly, Johnson fouled a breakaway up and Iro lost the ball as the last defender; both slips and both occured on seperate sides of the field.

[Pookie]

^ too much water IMO. There are times when the ball has a rooster tail on it.

Pretty reasonable comments for the most part. I wonder, if Santos could head a ball into the net from 4 feet, what the tone would be in this post game thread?

[canadian_bhoy]

5 new players against the best team in the league. Not bad I would say.

Frings is class. Kovermans will be great too. He was good last night but needed a bit better service.

Was nice to see the excitement back at BMO last night. Haven't seen or heard it for a long time. 112 started out great - but I guess people assumed we'd win 5-0 or something, so when that didn't happen people started turning sour.

Surprised to hear people criticise Plata for running at defenders too much. That's what he does, that's his job. Plata runs at defenders, Kovermans is the target man. Seems like a good match to me.

Looking forward to watching this team play from here on in.

Jacko the Capo dancing and slapping his ass at the chick in 111 was potentially the highlight of the night.

[Detroit_TFC]

^ too much water IMO. There are times when the ball has a rooster tail on it.

Pretty reasonable comments for the most part. I wonder, if Santos could head a ball into the net from 4 feet, what the tone would be in this post game thread?

I'm finding it even more difficult to understand what to do with Santos. He can be dangerous but seems like the type of player whose morale can't withstand being on the bench. But, when he starts he's a dud.

[maninb]

You're not going to consistently win with Ty Harden and Danliegh Borman playing. Your just not. End of discussion. Any other improvements are pointless.

My thoughts exactly....good God were they TERRIBLE...and wasn't Sturgis supposed to be playing right-mid? Viator had 2-3 guys on him ALL NIGHT...Christ that was painful to watch...but what else is new....and could someone please explain to Yourassowsky that you're supposed to dribble with the ball at your feet, not kick it 3 yards in front of you and chase it...he was directly responsible for the goal and you could see Winter was absolutely furious with him for giving up the ball every time he touched it...

[Auzzy]

The good:

Frings is a very good player. Although it will be a few games until he gets match-fit, he is a tremendous pick-up for the club, everything that you want from a DP. He makes the team look better. I can't imagine what he is thinking after playing in this poor league with this even crappier squad.



I'm sure Frings wasn't too disappointed in the way Dallas played most of the time -- and that will help him realize what is possible in this league.

Man, Dallas can pass the ball around well, and play themselves out of some pretty tight situations. Not perfect of course, they have the same salary cap, but pretty damn good.

[Roca]

Does anyone know what happened at the top of 110 last night? There were security and paramedics; it looked as though someone may have passed out or something.

[felipe]

I like yourass - but agree about Borman and Harden, not a big fan of either.

I like Iro's energy; Frings did ok - but I wasn't blown away, you could see the quality, and I'm surer he'll play better next time; it just reminded me of how everyone used to cry about Robbo giving the ball away - Frings must have given it away ten times with errant passes...

Koverman did nothing - obviously out of shape.

Soolsma was impressive to me

did not understand the subs at all - it seemed like Plata was our most dangerous player and off he went, same with yourass - he was finding some space and off he went -

[maninb]

^ Yourass got pulled cause he was at fault on the goal and gave the ball away every time he touched it...You could see Winter and DeKlerk screaming at him, and they gave him an earful when he got to the sidelines..

[reggie]

i agree with you on youras,he was brutal,the goal was totally his fault.
shea is the best player ive seen in the mls this year by far.
saying that they gave him way too much space,i dont think he will be in this league much longer.

[dupont]

You know... thinking back to the game, we had a lot of great scoring chances. That game could have went differently if their keeper didn't make those stops (I realize they had lots of chances that Frei stopped too). It wasn't as bad as it first seemed.
I'm optimistic.

[Auzzy]

I like yourass - but agree about Borman and Harden, not a big fan of either.

I like Iro's energy; Frings did ok - but I wasn't blown away, you could see the quality, and I'm surer he'll play better next time; it just reminded me of how everyone used to cry about Robbo giving the ball away - Frings must have given it away ten times with errant passes...

Koverman did nothing - obviously out of shape.

Soolsma was impressive to me

did not understand the subs at all - it seemed like Plata was our most dangerous player and off he went, same with yourass - he was finding some space and off he went -

Plata was running like crazy on a very hot night. They have difficult games coming up, twice a week for the next stretch. We don't want to kill the kid. Perhaps they told him, go all-out from the beginning, we'll sub you when needed. Just guessing, perhaps they also weren't happy with Plata giving the ball away a few times when he had a better opportunity to pass. Plus, they had made two other offensive-minded subs before that (Santos and Soolsma in), so it's not like they were throwing in the towel.

Frings was off on a few passes, usually chipped efforts that were partly necessary because other Toronto players weren't more open. However, he also successfully completed 49 passes in the game (from the TFC report), a high for the team: especially in his first game, you would expect some to be off. That got better in the course of the game IMO.

Agreed on the big defensive problems. However, Break Shea's goal was at least as much a midfield as a defensive problem. Yourassowsky turned over the ball, Frings went down too quickly in his challenge on Shea IMO, and Sturgis jogged along next to Shea before the shot.

[ryan]

I want to rant about the crowd tonight, I just was so utterly annoyed by the people there. It was like 95% of them had never been to a football match before.

Last couple matches I had sold my top of 111 seats and moved down to 112, finally went back to 111 tonight only to find the place full of seated tourists and odd stares as I tried to make some noise. Nobody was willing to make a sound up there and people we're being fussy about seating...ugh it was irritating.

Add to the fact that BMO was as quiet as I've seen 20,000 people before and I have to say the atmosphere was pretty god damn boring last night. No offence to anyone who was doing their thing tho.



As for on the field, I thought we looked OK as a whole with all things considered. Teammates who don't know each other playing against a strong side and we kept with them for the most part. Had we drawn it wouldn't have been undeserved.

Koevermans wasn't fit but a few times he showed off some decent ball control and I look forward to seeing him going forward.

Plata gave the ball away alot tonight, many runs he'd try and beat the defender and lose. He has to slow it down if he's constantly losing on challenges and look to play the ball to someone else.

Johnson played a decent game, worked the wing very well at times with Borman, just a shame that Borman lacks any ability to do something dangerous with the ball.

Soolsma came in and showed off his very consistent ability to lay them into the box. A shame he's so bloody slow. I'm not sure he's better off starting vs fresh defenders or coming in late, but I hope he continues to get regular minutes with the way he plays the ball into the area.

Yourass and Sturgis were rightfully subbed, I didn't see anything from them at all in the middle and they were just poor. Looking forward to seeing Dunfield, JDG and possibly Griffit? in that role.

Frings was exactly what I expected. A class above our team and worked relentlessly to get things going. This one game alone says he was the right signing for our club. His spot kick ability is obviously got some rust on it for now.

At the back, Borman was his standard garbage self blowing markings and being useless on the attack. I liked what I saw from Viator at RB. For a guy that's probably the newest of all the new I thought he did well on some plays and was a step above what we normally get from Gargan/Borman.

Harden was Harden in the middle, I can't recall anything to crap on him about but I'm sure there's something. Iro was up and down, he made some nice plays at times but then got caught badly at others. Probably a matter of time for him to get his playing legs under him and getting comfy with Frei and the other defenders. He looks like a giant compared to some guys out there and will definitely be useful on the attack late in games.

[swan]

I'm finding it even more difficult to understand what to do with Santos. He can be dangerous but seems like the type of player whose morale can't withstand being on the bench. But, when he starts he's a dud.


i say a 4-4-2 him and danny on the front line..

[ElvistheEvilScotsman]

Here's hoping we break our typical behaviour of bringing in a striker provide zero service and then say the guy is shit at the end of the season.

What I really loved seeing was Frings tackling. Obviously minus the big miss at half before the Shea goal. But where the fuck were the defenders?

[__wowza]

"I talked to the team right away from the beginning, that's what I'm here for. We have a young team and I want to show them leadership, and that's what I (possess). I want to give them some confidence and motivation because we're kind of on a losing streak right now."- Frings
FROM HERE ON OUT, THIS IS HOW WE WILL DESCRIBE OUR PERFORMANCE (GERMAN ACCENT AND ALL).

[kodiakTFC]

I want to rant about the crowd tonight, I just was so utterly annoyed by the people there. It was like 95% of them had never been to a football match before.

Last couple matches I had sold my top of 111 seats and moved down to 112, finally went back to 111 tonight only to find the place full of seated tourists and odd stares as I tried to make some noise. Nobody was willing to make a sound up there and people we're being fussy about seating...ugh it was irritating.

Add to the fact that BMO was as quiet as I've seen 20,000 people before and I have to say the atmosphere was pretty god damn boring last night. No offence to anyone who was doing their thing tho.


Last night was the first time I stood at the top of 111 in weeks and it was just a reminder of how bad it has gotten. I really hope some seats open up so I can move the hell out of there next season. Standing for a match is great but whats the point if your not making any noise? Your just a prawn with better knees.

[jloome]

I like yourass - but agree about Borman and Harden, not a big fan of either.

I like Iro's energy; Frings did ok - but I wasn't blown away, you could see the quality, and I'm surer he'll play better next time; it just reminded me of how everyone used to cry about Robbo giving the ball away - Frings must have given it away ten times with errant passes...

Koverman did nothing - obviously out of shape.

Soolsma was impressive to me

did not understand the subs at all - it seemed like Plata was our most dangerous player and off he went, same with yourass - he was finding some space and off he went -

I counted, and unless I missed eight, Frings had two bad passes in the entire match, and one instance where he was late to a ball.

[rocker]

two simple passes in the second half by Frings were badly received by TFC players and went out for Dallas throws. So I wouldn't fault Frings on those two. I think Borman was one of the receivers and he needed to be more aware.

[ensco]

ag futbol
FCD has two pretty good defenders back there. I’d say we can expect an industrial but unspectacular performance from Koevermans for his first game out. I think they said he was further away from full fitness than Frings so maybe a 65th minute sub will be seen as well. Frings will win the ball a lot but will probably have some issues linking up going forward with new teammates.

I declare ag futbol the winner of the pint: ag futbol, PM me to collect.

[Pookie]

With the next game scheduled for Saturday, this match fitness issue will continue for the next while.

[__wowza]

http://i.imm.io/7mpb.jpeg


^ not directed to anyone specific. im strangely seeing a lot of positivity after a loss, im thankful for many of the realists on here. i'm seeing what ive wanted to see, progress. if you want to debate that progress, ask yourself what the margin would've been like if we kept the squad we had 2 weeks ago on the pitch for this game (sans ecks).

[Oldtimer]

There were a lot of German articles on Frings' MLS debut.

This is one of the better ones:

In German: http://newsticker.sueddeutsche.de/list/id/1182820

In Google English: http://translate.google.ca/translate?hl=en&sl=de&tl=en&u=http%3A%2F%2Fnewsticker.sueddeutsche.de%2Flist%2 Fid%2F1182820


21 087 fans were expected, pleased come into the stadium, "BMO Field" to marvel at the first use of Frings. And the German debutant disappointed they did not. Already in the second minute he forced goalkeeper Kevin Hartman Dallas with a 20-yard free-kick into a fine save. Frings It is primarily intended to strengthen the defensive midfield and disrupt the enemy with his famous duel hardness in the game design. No wonder the media in the run had pointed out that the 34-year-old has a total of 92 yellow cards, the third highest number of warnings from the Bundesliga history.
In the coming days, the German one more task - that of the psychologist.Toronto has lost four of the last five games.
Frings knows "that the guys do not have much confidence."
"psychologist" :lol: so true.

[Ossington Mental Youth]

Unserer Frings
Couldnt be happier that hes here

[TFC USA]

Watched the goal again:

Yourassowsky gives it away, Iro is jogging backwards towards his net, Sturgis fucks up, Shea does awesome stuff.


TFC in a nutshell.

[ag futbol]

ag futbol
FCD has two pretty good defenders back there. I’d say we can expect an industrial but unspectacular performance from Koevermans for his first game out. I think they said he was further away from full fitness than Frings so maybe a 65th minute sub will be seen as well. Frings will win the ball a lot but will probably have some issues linking up going forward with new teammates.

I declare ag futbol the winner of the pint: ag futbol, PM me to collect.
lol, nice!

Unfortunately, I'm out of Toronto until January 2012 it looks like. I'll donate my pint to the second place finisher.

[19Barrett19]

TFC lost to FC Dallas 1-0 this is the second best team in the league at the moment. If you look at the standings they are just behind LA to tops in the league and FC Dallas is my pick to MLS cup Champs.

Next game TFC win a shocker on the road and it gets better from then on ...

You heard it here first.

[trane]

I thought the new guys all looked good, particullarly Frings. Harden is becoming my new Barrett, a duded that tries hard, but just does not have him, he makes so many poor decisions, and is so poor positionaly that it is painfull. Not that he is too blame for this game, but generally looking at him play is frustrating. A CM/ACM is needed. OR

We can play like;

-------------------CF-----------------
----WF--------------------------WF-
--------LDM-----Frings-----RDM--
LB------------CB-------CB---------RB

Fringgs as the deep playmaking CDM. Let him realy run the team he seems much more able to do so then JDG.

[maninb]

^ Sorry mate but with that formation, Koevermans will NEVER see the ball...you need an attacking midfielders...all's that formation encourages is punt and chase...not Winters style...

[Auzzy]

Just wanted to mention that referee Hilario Grajeda was pretty hilariously bad... The ARs about the same.

[Auzzy]

There were a lot of German articles on Frings' MLS debut.

This is one of the better ones:

In German: http://newsticker.sueddeutsche.de/list/id/1182820



I'm really glad I could read the German version.

So after reading all of Frings' comments to the German paper, who shall we believe? Frings, or Gordon chatting with someone at the airport? Probably neither, as one is a current player, and one is a former player...

[trane]

^ Sorry mate but with that formation, Koevermans will NEVER see the ball...you need an attacking midfielders...all's that formation encourages is punt and chase...not Winters style...

No, Frings does not stay put at the back, he starts at the back and moves up distributing to the wings or forward to the CF, same role as Pirlo plays, registra deep lying playmaker. With what we have got there is no one better at distributing.

[AmherstNY_TFC]

What we all saw was the difference between a well-organized team, and one loaded with new players. Dallas were difficult to break down at the back, and were able spring guys on the attack. They showed why they were unbeaten in 20 matches last year. TFC were starting players they had acquired in the last 2-3 days.

I am glad that Frings has some gas in the tank. I was worried that he was coming here to hammer a check and enjoy some warm weather. Nothing got by him in the middle, and his passing was a huge improvement over Tchani. Also, it seems he has been brought in to help the North American players understand what it takes on and off the pitch to be a professional player. I suspect he will have the captain's armband in 2012.

To me, the difference between winning and losing comes down to Brek Shea. His goal was a moment of brilliance. I thought he owned Viator all match. Dallas had a guy who was a difference maker, and he showed it. Toronto, as of yet, does not.

I am glad that Winter and Mariner are trying to improve the squad, and not write off the year. Their actions speak volumes about trying to overcome a culture of complacency and failure.

[bgnewf]

Home Opener Redux

http://viewfromthesouthstands.com/2011/07/home-opener-redux/

Some brief video observations on the game last night that saw five of the seven recent arrivals for Toronto FC featuring in a loss to high flying FC Dallas.

In this edition I question the expectations of TFC fans, I heap praise upon Torsten Frings who became a leader for TFC the second he walked on the pitch, I take a brief look at the other newcomers and I throw some criticism at the club for blowing the pricing for the upcoming CONCACAF Champions League game and I state my belief that next Wednesday will be the smallest crowd for a competitive game in TFC/BMO Field history.

[MarkoftheDrink]

I think the first play that told me Frings was something we have never had here was the long ball he played cross field to Johnson about 15 minutes in I think. The Dallas RB stepped up and picked it out but it if Johnson had stepped across and chested it down it would have been a big problem for Dallas. I can't recall anyone coming close to making that pass on this team. If he can do that on a consistent basis that will give the team so much more space to work.

Koef looks like he could be quite dangerous, even unfit and with little service he had a few chances.

I thought Iro and Viator played well considering Iro's played 4 times this year and Viator signed the day of. Does anyone know off hand the longest a back four have been together on this team? I'm guessing like 4 games.

[sidvan]

Guess I was the only one surprised that Borman came out for the second half. He just didn't have it last night. Too many lost 1v1 battles and uncontested turnovers.

[mclaren]

Boys and girls...it's time for us to stop complaining about the refs. Yes, they're awful but I do believe the decisions even themselves out over a season.

[Roogsy]

Boys and girls...it's time for us to stop complaining about the refs. Yes, they're awful but I do believe the decisions even themselves out over a season.

There are girls in here???

Allow myself to introduce.........myself...

http://www.examiner.com/images/blog/EXID15166/images/austin-powers-3.jpg

[TFCRegina]

Boys and girls...it's time for us to stop complaining about the refs. Yes, they're awful but I do believe the decisions even themselves out over a season.

I don't agree that they even themselves out over a season.

I actually think the calls go to the better team more often than not, each match.

TFC has rarely been the better team this season.

[tfcocd]

Watched the goal again:

Yourassowsky gives it away, Iro is jogging backwards towards his net, Sturgis fucks up, Shea does awesome stuff.


TFC in a nutshell.

I just watched the goal again and that was a world class strike. The offside goal by Plata had a great build up and TFC had some chances after Shea's moment of brilliance. But seeing the shots 14-3 at the 60 minute mark I did wonder if TFC was lucky? In the end Dallas was wasteful and Frei only had to make a handful of stops. He did make a big play on Shea point blank but I guess Iro was the real hero on that play when he cleared it off the line.