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View Full Version : Fortgate - NE Revolution Supporters vs FO



Ben - D.O.W.
06-21-2011, 07:44 AM
Hey everyone - I figured I'd post this here as some might find it interesting as we deal with our own struggles with FO and security (who are also Team Ops if I'm not mistaken - same as New England). This is from a buddy who's a member of one of the Rev supporters groups, who has always come up for Toronto/New England every year and we always go down to visit for the reverse fixture. I'm not going to say its "good" that we're not the only one dealing with crap, but it's interesting to see the parallels. Also I hear 'YSA' (or 'YSD') pretty much every week at BMO and have yet to see any repercussions.

http://www.thedrugisfootball.com/2011/06/fortgate.html

phonzo
06-21-2011, 07:55 AM
The problem is someone at NE front office has started to cave to the league...the league in short hates swearing. They tried explaining it to us at last years supporters summit and hoping to push people away from it....fuck garber.

Ben - D.O.W.
06-21-2011, 08:00 AM
I'm just glad I've never heard any curse words coming out of 110-113. How would those poor goalies / corner kick takers handle it after all?

Unfortunately I can't help thinking if they start succesfully cracking down at some stadiums it won't be long before we have the league breathing down our necks at BMO.

jabbronies
06-21-2011, 08:09 AM
Not sure if this is the Front office hiding behind TeamOps or if TeamOps is just trowing it's weight around. Sounds like the first one.

The league can be pretty fucking sneaky about things like this. It's Corporate America/Big Brother at it's best. If they can't do things out in the open, they try and do it another way while letting someone else take the fall.

Anyways I'm ranting here. I think this SG needs to make a stand. grow some balls and start making moves to protect what they have - not bend over and do what the FO tells them to do. They've already shown weakness by saying they will stop the swearing by years end.

Suds
06-21-2011, 08:21 AM
The problem is someone at NE front office has started to cave to the league...the league in short hates swearing. They tried explaining it to us at last years supporters summit and hoping to push people away from it....fuck garber.

From Websters
Definition of FUCK

intransitive verb
1
usually obscene : copulate (http://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/copulate)

2
usually vulgar : mess (http://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/mess) 3 —used with with

transitive verb
1
usually obscene : to engage in coitus with —sometimes used interjectionally with an object (as a personal or reflexive pronoun) to express anger, contempt, or disgust

2
usually vulgar : to deal with unfairly or harshly : cheat (http://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/cheat), screw (http://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/screw)


Definition of FUCK OFF

intransitive verb
usually vulgar : scram (http://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/scram) —usually used as a command





If it's in Websters then trying to censor it is stupid! Kids hear way worse every day outside the stadium.


We've made a point of not swearing where I sit because there are families around. As for the supporters sections, the league is just stupid to try and come down on this. Fix the crap refereeing first!

maninb
06-21-2011, 08:23 AM
Complete nonsense....I've NEVER heard of a supporters group being BANNED because of profanity...except for racist chants....Imagine if they tried this nonsense in Europe or South America???? Unfortunately I just think it's a matter of time before they come after our SGs for the same reason...

brad
06-21-2011, 08:25 AM
http://www.thedrugisfootball.com/2011/06/fortgate.html?m=1

For those wanting a detailed account. Came through my twitter feed, no idea how accurate it is. Says people where also getting arrested.

eustacchio
06-21-2011, 08:31 AM
From Websters
Definition of FUCK

intransitive verb
1
usually obscene : copulate (http://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/copulate)

2
usually vulgar : mess (http://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/mess) 3 —used with with

transitive verb
1
usually obscene : to engage in coitus with —sometimes used interjectionally with an object (as a personal or reflexive pronoun) to express anger, contempt, or disgust

2
usually vulgar : to deal with unfairly or harshly : cheat (http://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/cheat), screw (http://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/screw)


Definition of FUCK OFF

intransitive verb
usually vulgar : scram (http://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/scram) —usually used as a command





If it's in Websters then trying to censor it is stupid! Kids hear way worse every day outside the stadium.


We've made a point of not swearing where I sit because there are families around. As for the supporters sections, the league is just stupid to try and come down on this. Fix the crap refereeing first!

Webster's is the Toronto Sun of dictionaries. It also includes bootylicious, crunk and d'oh as words.

TFC Cityboy
06-21-2011, 08:43 AM
well, if MLSE and MLS want to strike the killer blow to matchday enjoyment at BMO Field, this could be it.
What a joke. I feel for our friends at the Revs- great fans and they deserve to be treated much better than this.

ginkster88
06-21-2011, 08:43 AM
http://www.thedrugisfootball.com/2011/06/fortgate.html?m=1

For those wanting a detailed account. Came through my twitter feed, no idea how accurate it is. Says people where also getting arrested.

That's the same link as the OP...

Alixir
06-21-2011, 08:52 AM
personally I have always thought the YSA chant is silly, but thats just my opinion. Aside from that, I feel bad for the Revs SG. This is just another reason this league is M-I-C-K-E-Y M-O-U-S-E. Stay stong Rev supporters.
They should stand outside the teams head office and chant "You suck assholes!"

Suds
06-21-2011, 08:54 AM
Webster's is the Toronto Sun of dictionaries. It also includes bootylicious, crunk and d'oh as words.

I know ... it's great, eh? :D

Wull
06-21-2011, 08:57 AM
well, if MLSE and MLS want to strike the killer blow to matchday enjoyment at BMO Field, this could be it.
What a joke. I feel for our friends at the Revs- great fans and they deserve to be treated much better than this.

Wonder how many charges we'd have had on Saturday?!

Roogsy
06-21-2011, 09:10 AM
I honestly believe supporters across the league need to stand up to their individual teams and their owners. The league can't ignore THOUSANDS of ticketholders, let alone their most visible ticketholders and most loyal fans, telling them to back off once and for all.

Without a united front, each individual supporters group in each city will be left to fight it's own team and security personnel on their own. It's a battle of attrition that is not the most efficient way of dealing with this issue.

If ever there was a point where the United Supporters of the league needed to get their shit together and get some action done, this is it. This is a direct attack on the very fans that pay money and come to games. I have seen swearing and vulgar language at every single sporting event I have ever been to and never once an arrest. Vancouver goes up in flames and they have had barely more arrests so far than the number of fans arrested at this Revs game. This is a ridiculous state of affairs.

Swearing...geez. Dear lord this league has it's head up it's ass.

kodiakTFC
06-21-2011, 09:17 AM
No matter how bad things get with TFC I just have to remind myself how much worse NER have it. No stadium, no atmosphere, no coverage, no hope and terrible team. I feel badly for the supporters, I really do, especially considering they are sitting on an untapped goldmine in Boston (proper).

Beach_Red
06-21-2011, 09:18 AM
I honestly believe supporters across the league need to stand up to their individual teams and their owners. The league can't ignore THOUSANDS of ticketholders, let alone their most visible ticketholders and most loyal fans, telling them to back off once and for all.

Without a united front, each individual supporters group in each city will be left to fight it's own team and security personnel on their own. It's a battle of attrition that is not the most efficient way of dealing with this issue.

If ever there was a point where the United Supporters of the league needed to get their shit together and get some action done, this is it. This is a direct attack on the very fans that pay money and come to games. I have seen swearing and vulgar language at every single sporting event I have ever been to and never once an arrest. Vancouver goes up in flames and they have had barely more arrests so far than the number of fans arrested at this Revs game. This is a ridiculous state of affairs.

Swearing...geez. Dear lord this league has it's head up it's ass.


I wonder if anyone swears at Patriots games? Would this be different if they had a stadium in Boston?

From the article this really sums it up:


This team is at a crossroads, will you go for the 18-35 demographic that has driven the passion of the teams who are now in "MLS 2.0" and even stepping into "MLS 3.0" or will you continue on with the youth soccer crowd and continue to be left in the dust. The ball is on the penalty spot put it in the back of the net or botch it Revs, it's up to you how you carry forward from here.

ryan
06-21-2011, 09:25 AM
A chant/song should be created. Something quick and easy, loaded with fuck's and basically saying "we can say what we want"

Then all SG's league wide should sing it during a week's play.


Let the league know who pays their fuckin bills.

TFC Cityboy
06-21-2011, 09:29 AM
Wonder how many charges we'd have had on Saturday?!

I don't think I ever invent a song that doesn't use the F bomb as the adjective.
I'd like to see the security guards cart Sean (10) off for yelling "The referee's a wanker"- that's be interesting eh.

VoxPopuliCosmicum
06-21-2011, 09:35 AM
If ever there was an issue that could bridge the differences that arise among supporters, this has to be it.

Roogsy and I will stand shoulder-to-shoulder against the Morality Brigade!

Ben - D.O.W.
06-21-2011, 09:36 AM
Wonder how many charges we'd have had on Saturday?!

Or at the Canada / USA game in Detroit.

The wheels on the bus go round and round,
round and round,
round and round,

The wheels on the bus go round and round,
and Landon you're a cunt.

craigtfc
06-21-2011, 10:21 AM
Another article on this:

http://wvhooligan.com/2011/06/21/11271/trouble-brewing-between-revs-fo-and-their-supporters-group/

Wull
06-21-2011, 10:58 AM
I don't think I ever invent a song that doesn't use the F bomb as the adjective.
I'd like to see the security guards cart Sean (10) off for yelling "The referee's a wanker"- that's be interesting eh.

I think my conversation with Grant would have produced enough citations to destroy a rain-forest!

Hasn't he gotten you in enough trouble at BMO?!

Darlofletch
06-21-2011, 11:10 AM
A chant/song should be created. Something quick and easy, loaded with fuck's and basically saying "we can say what we want"

Then all SG's league wide should sing it during a week's play.


Let the league know who pays their fuckin bills.

rage against the machine, killing in the name of (look it up, I'm quite drunk and lazy right now)

1st game, Start it innocuously but threateningly

and now you do what they tell you.
der-der der!
and now you do what they tell you.
der-der der....repeat as necessary and then just leave it at that.

there's still problems, the next game, you move on to the

fuck you, I won't do what you tell me.. part of the song.

or, the tim howard song, adapted for whoever

chim chimenee,
chim chimenee
chim, chim, cheroo
we are (red patch boys/u-sector/nee/nordecke/ecs/etc etc) and we say fuck you!

Pookie
06-21-2011, 11:21 AM
I'm not even sure that the YSA ban is related to the "kids" in the stadium.

Watching an American MLS game on TV, often the only audible chant is the YSA on goalkicks. I'd wager this league stance has more to do with not offending advertisers than it does those in attendance.

Whoop
06-21-2011, 11:29 AM
I honestly believe supporters across the league need to stand up to their individual teams and their owners. The league can't ignore THOUSANDS of ticketholders, let alone their most visible ticketholders and most loyal fans, telling them to back off once and for all.

Without a united front, each individual supporters group in each city will be left to fight it's own team and security personnel on their own. It's a battle of attrition that is not the most efficient way of dealing with this issue.

If ever there was a point where the United Supporters of the league needed to get their shit together and get some action done, this is it. This is a direct attack on the very fans that pay money and come to games. I have seen swearing and vulgar language at every single sporting event I have ever been to and never once an arrest. Vancouver goes up in flames and they have had barely more arrests so far than the number of fans arrested at this Revs game. This is a ridiculous state of affairs.

Swearing...geez. Dear lord this league has it's head up it's ass.

This.

+1

prizby
06-21-2011, 11:43 AM
I'm not even sure that the YSA ban is related to the "kids" in the stadium.

Watching an American MLS game on TV, often the only audible chant is the YSA on goalkicks. I'd wager this league stance has more to do with not offending advertisers than it does those in attendance.

i think this is exactly what Garber said when he didn't want the "swearing"

if your one random guy yelling F U at the ref, well that won't be heard on tv, but a continual chorus, not only does that potentially affect advertising, but it also might have issues with broadcast corporations and the ppl that police them and stuff (don't think espn wants any of that on live tv etc...)

Gobi
06-21-2011, 12:06 PM
Article (http://www.thedrugisfootball.com/2011/06/fortgate.html#comment-form)
There should be an expectation that if you go to a sporting event, especially where there is alcohol served that there will be foul language, it is a part of every sport in every pro league all around the world, to think that you can avoid because it's a soccer game is ludicrous.
Even without the 'alcohol served' bit, this is an important point.

Any situation where anyone is passionate about anything, passionate language will be used. DUH.

If they (Garber, the FOs, et al) believe they can fill stadia with only Soccer Moms and Ned Flanders types, they've really got their heads up their asses.
The league will die.

ginkster88
06-21-2011, 12:07 PM
i think this is exactly what Garber said when he didn't want the "swearing"

if your one random guy yelling F U at the ref, well that won't be heard on tv, but a continual chorus, not only does that potentially affect advertising, but it also might have issues with broadcast corporations and the ppl that police them and stuff (don't think espn wants any of that on live tv etc...)

The way SGs are specifically targeted by mics to manufacture crowd noise for TV means that swearing by individuals can actually be heard clearly.

Pookie
06-21-2011, 12:12 PM
^ 100% agree (with you agreeing with me ;) )

I don't think we have to worry at TFC. If the Americans hear "Douche-bag" they think it is something french.

Which makes you wonder in the day and age of fake audio tracks such as the Masters' Golf Tournament broadcasts requiring a set number of piped in "bird chirps" over set time frame, why they simply cannot turn down the in-stadium audio and replace it with a simple crowd noise loop?

I guess selectively arresting your season ticket holders is an easier solution. Broadcasts look so much better when they are in front of an empty, swear-free mind you but empty stadium.

Pookie
06-21-2011, 12:22 PM
Article (http://www.thedrugisfootball.com/2011/06/fortgate.html#comment-form)

Even with out the 'alcohol served' bit, this is an important point.

Any situation where anyone is passionate about anything, passionate language will be used. DUH.

The swearing thing isn't any easy argument. You can't shelter your kids if you choose to take them. My son knows the words to TFC chants but we don't use them around the house and definitely not infront of grandma or with his teachers or coaches. Time and place.

At the same time, if folks are in a family section then a little courtesy goes a long way.

In the end though, I don't think this has to do with swearing in a general sense. I think it has more to do with an organized chant that is clearly audible on network TV which is likely why they targeted that one (and the SG) specifically.

Beach_Red
06-21-2011, 01:17 PM
The swearing thing isn't any easy argument. You can't shelter your kids if you choose to take them. My son knows the words to TFC chants but we don't use them around the house and definitely not infront of grandma or with his teachers or coaches. Time and place.

At the same time, if folks are in a family section then a little courtesy goes a long way.

In the end though, I don't think this has to do with swearing in a general sense. I think it has more to do with an organized chant that is clearly audible on network TV which is likely why they targeted that one (and the SG) specifically.


But you're right, if they want to keep the chants off the TV broadcast it's easy to do. So it may have more to do with the "organized" part of the chants they don't like. Customers are great, organized customers are tougher to deal with.

Yeoman
06-21-2011, 07:13 PM
http://www.facebook.com/home.php#!/pages/Support-The-Fort/137842492960306
i did not see this there, but join and show your support

Nomad
06-21-2011, 09:26 PM
During the Supporters Summit this issue was raised and heatedly debated (mostly by Toronto SGs in attendance). MLS Executive Nelson Rodriguez was the one who brought it up and really pushed for swearing to be prohibited in the stands and more specifically this chant (YSA) but swearing in general. There was even an SG from San Jose in attendance who has tried to go so far as to get another SG from their club disbanded for using profane language. The debate at the time ended in somewhat of a stalemate but was followed by the infamous "carrots and sticks" approach favoured by said Executive. My guess is that this policy is quietly being tested for effectiveness. The league is in the process of writing guidelines for standard MLS security policies (in as much as they can). While these guidelines are not yet mandatory i guess some clubs have started to implement them.

Phil
06-21-2011, 09:41 PM
Another account that I found on Usector and direct link to the embeded ones:

http://www.thebentmusket.com/2011/6/20/2234298/fracas-in-the-fort-revolution-supporters-banned-and-arrested-for

There is video of a supporter being arrested for swearing on there, while the cops swear at him.

That summed it up for me.

TFCRegina
06-21-2011, 09:42 PM
I put forth a motion that from here on the suffix -gate will be removed from the English language.

All in favour, say Aye.

Auzzy
06-21-2011, 11:14 PM
^ Sounds like Censorgate to me. :D

Oldtimer
06-22-2011, 07:51 AM
Another account that I found on Usector and direct link to the embeded ones:

http://www.thebentmusket.com/2011/6/20/2234298/fracas-in-the-fort-revolution-supporters-banned-and-arrested-for

There is video of a supporter being arrested for swearing on there, while the cops swear at him.

That summed it up for me.

The cops were swearing?

http://4.bp.blogspot.com/_5Z_ofOD26N4/TMb0PFzX7FI/AAAAAAAAAGs/8ljv32DTQUk/s1600/think+of+the+children.jpeg

Frankly, I'm sure my son hears worse stuff in High School than he does from the organized chants at a football match.

Wull
06-22-2011, 08:44 AM
They're asking that for the next few games, instead of the YSA chant at goal kicks, we change it to support the fort. Wonder which one would piss off mls more?!

Fort York Redcoat
06-22-2011, 08:50 AM
^"They" the NE support?

and YSA is everyone else's of douchebag? Is that right?

Wull
06-22-2011, 08:55 AM
^"They" the NE support?

and YSA is everyone else's of douchebag? Is that right?

They as in the support the fort and yes, the YSA is whenever a goal kick is taken by the other keeper, but we tend to cue the vuvuzelas and douchebag chants

Fort York Redcoat
06-22-2011, 09:06 AM
^Got it.

Lent my support. Will help any way I can.

and....Vuvuzela? at BMO? If true please taunt them.

Wull
06-22-2011, 09:15 AM
^Got it.

Lent my support. Will help any way I can.

and....Vuvuzela? at BMO? If true please taunt them.

there's no actual vuvuzelas, we just make the noise to try and put off the keeper. All of this is dependent on us getting far enough up field for people to actually shoot of course ........

koryo
06-23-2011, 07:19 AM
A chant/song should be created. Something quick and easy, loaded with fuck's and basically saying "we can say what we want"

Then all SG's league wide should sing it during a week's play.


Let the league know who pays their fuckin bills.

OyxNgnQ9m30

Yeoman
06-27-2011, 08:06 PM
harass the facebook page and convince them to mail out 'support the fort' t-shirt to up here in TO

nfitz
06-27-2011, 09:21 PM
And I ask again. How on earth is "You suck assholes" considered profane?

werewolf
06-27-2011, 09:28 PM
http://www.redpatchboys.ca/forums/showthread.php?t=24827

"Step on their throats" gets you kicked out of Bmo Field, if you cross-paths with the right people on the right powertrip.

Mexinese
06-27-2011, 09:33 PM
Why dont we do the same? I really dont see why not. In fact, I think it would look pretty cool seeing that whole south end as well as NEE emptied out for one game. What would be cooler is we all attend for OH-Canada and right after that.........leave the match...Thats gota knock some sense into the FO....? Anyone agree??!

Mikey
06-28-2011, 07:24 AM
Whole south end? First five rows of 112 and the first two rows of 113 more like. When Nee left last season everyone just moved down the front of 127 into their empty seats about 30 seconds after they were gone.

I predict any seats walked out on in the south end would fill in again in seconds.....

EDIT* plus, add in sods law, with TFC scoring twice in three minutes immediately after people left.

Wull
06-28-2011, 09:07 AM
Why dont we do the same? I really dont see why not. In fact, I think it would look pretty cool seeing that whole south end as well as NEE emptied out for one game. What would be cooler is we all attend for OH-Canada and right after that.........leave the match...Thats gota knock some sense into the FO....? Anyone agree??!


Why exactly are we walking out?

Azerban
06-28-2011, 09:33 AM
OyxNgnQ9m30

hey cool its me after yet another loss

Petor
07-18-2011, 07:14 AM
Yesterday was Black Sunday in New England.
The all wore black and walked out in the 16th minute...

http://www.flickr.com/photos/zhosef/5949390220/in/set-72157627096069365

Huyton
07-18-2011, 07:52 AM
Anyway we can put up a big banner to "Support The Fort" to show solidarity?

TOBOR !
07-18-2011, 08:36 AM
Here's a suggestion - just change everything to 'Garber'.

When an opposing GK takes a kick, shout "You Suck Garber !", and (to the tune of 'Oh, My darling Clementine') "You're a Garber, You're a Garber, You're a Garber, Referee...".

It works on so many levels.

ryan
07-18-2011, 08:56 AM
Here's a suggestion - just change everything to 'Garber'.

When an opposing GK takes a kick, shout "You Suck Garber !", and (to the tune of 'Oh, My darling Clementine') "You're a Garber, You're a Garber, You're a Garber, Referee...".

It works on so many levels.

I see what you're trying to do, but I think Garber would prefer that so ultimately he'd "win" if we did that.


Instead, lets turn all words into swear words. So instead of "You Suck Asshole", lets go with "Shit fuck Asshole!" and sound like we all have tourettes.

sashavukelich
07-18-2011, 09:23 AM
I actually find the bad language incredibly unclever on our behalf, and i would prefer it not to be there. The best chants are more tongue-in-cheek that 'your an asshole', which if i may say so, does nothing to ingratiate us with the ref.

So, if it was a vote, i'd say let's turn our brain-volume to 11 and sing hilarious songs.

TOBOR !
07-18-2011, 09:27 AM
I see what you're trying to do, but I think Garber would prefer that so ultimately he'd "win" if we did that.


Instead, lets turn all words into swear words. So instead of "You Suck Asshole", lets go with "Shit fuck Asshole!" and sound like we all have tourettes.

I'm not sure that it would be a win for him. On the one hand we're using his name as a synonym for 'Asshole', while at the same time, the message is 'you suck, Garber'. It slices and dices.

Sure, we aren't using the actual term, but I think it's a good end-run. No-one's going to get arrested for saying 'Garber', and it may draw more attention to the matter - especially if a league's worth of fans joins in.

in fact, I'm going to start using it at work now... 'Hey, Garber'... 'Nice one, Garber'... (geez, what a Garber).

Keystone FC
07-19-2011, 04:02 AM
I actually find the bad language incredibly unclever on our behalf, and i would prefer it not to be there. The best chants are more tongue-in-cheek that 'your an asshole', which if i may say so, does nothing to ingratiate us with the ref.

So, if it was a vote, i'd say let's turn our brain-volume to 11 and sing hilarious songs.
Well, we could always say...You inhale with great force anal pour.:cool:

Huyton
07-19-2011, 05:15 AM
So "Fellatio, Rectum" would be OK?

Sounds like something from Harry Potter.

koryo
07-19-2011, 07:07 AM
I actually find the bad language incredibly unclever on our behalf, and i would prefer it not to be there. The best chants are more tongue-in-cheek that 'your an asshole', which if i may say so, does nothing to ingratiate us with the ref.

So, if it was a vote, i'd say let's turn our brain-volume to 11 and sing hilarious songs.

Some of its gratuitous, I'll grant you, but some of it is heat of the moment stuff. A player cheats, or a ref (weekly) blows an obvious call, I swear a bucket full. Why? I'm fucking angry that's why. And I don't care how many kids are around me, whether any of them are mine, or how many muppet jobsworths get offended. When I was a boy, I heard and saw much worse than swearing. And what did my dad do? He told me that whatever was said in the football ground stayed in the football ground. If I repeat it outside, especially in front of my mother, I'd get it (which in those days meant a proper kicking).

End of the day, this move by FOs and the league is an attempt at social control, spear-headed by people who are thick enough think that child-proofing the world is a good idea.

What I can't stand about situations like this is, ultimately, it will be a small and vocal group of prudish bastards, with the emotional development of toddlers I might add, who aren't able to provide any context for their kids simply because the world is still black and white to them. Naturally, they want to ruin it for the rest of us.

Here's the solve:
1. world-proof your child instead of child-proofing the world
2. if you can't manage that, go back to fucking church

Oblio2
07-19-2011, 07:13 AM
Some of its gratuitous, I'll grant you, but some of it is heat of the moment stuff. A player cheats, or a ref (weekly) blows an obvious call, I swear a bucket full. Why? I'm fucking angry that's why. And I don't care how many kids are around me, whether any of them are mine, or how many muppet jobsworths get offended. When I was a boy, I heard and saw much worse than swearing. And what did my dad do? He told me that whatever was said in the football ground stayed in the football ground. If I repeat it outside, especially in front of my mother, I'd get it (which in those days meant a proper kicking).

End of the day, this move by FOs and the league is an attempt at social control, spear-headed by people who are thick enough think that child-proofing the world is a good idea.

What I can't about situations like this is, ultimately, it will be a small and vocal group of prudish bastards, with the emotional development of toddlers I might add, who aren't able to provide any context for their kids simply because the world is still black and white to them. Naturally, they want to ruin it for the rest of us.

Here's the solve:
1. world-proof your child instead of child-proofing the world
2. if you can't manage that, go back to fucking church

AMEN

sulfur
07-19-2011, 08:45 AM
When I was a boy, I heard and saw much worse than swearing. And what did my dad do? He told me that whatever was said in the football ground stayed in the football ground. If I repeat it outside, especially in front of my mother, I'd get it (which in those days meant a proper kicking).
That's my attitude too. Teaching RPBKatie early with "stadium voice" and "other voice". Fortunately for her (and unfortunately for me), her mother is even more of a loudmouth than I am, so that threat about repeating it in front of her mother just won't fly too well. :)

Pookie
07-19-2011, 09:31 AM
All fine and dandy to talk to your kids about swearing (as I do with mine as well). Until someone talks to MLS advertisers about swearing, the issue isn't going away.

Again, if folks think that they are concerned about little ears within the stadium:

- why set aside group tickets (usually youth soccer teams) in section 104 under visitors support?
- why put a family section (227) above the NEE?
- why accept ads that display "Sex Crazed Maniac" throughout the game?

This has everything to do with TV and nothing to do with kids in seats.

TFC Cityboy
07-19-2011, 09:38 AM
Some of its gratuitous, I'll grant you, but some of it is heat of the moment stuff. A player cheats, or a ref (weekly) blows an obvious call, I swear a bucket full. Why? I'm fucking angry that's why. And I don't care how many kids are around me, whether any of them are mine, or how many muppet jobsworths get offended. When I was a boy, I heard and saw much worse than swearing. And what did my dad do? He told me that whatever was said in the football ground stayed in the football ground. If I repeat it outside, especially in front of my mother, I'd get it (which in those days meant a proper kicking).

End of the day, this move by FOs and the league is an attempt at social control, spear-headed by people who are thick enough think that child-proofing the world is a good idea.

What I can't stand about situations like this is, ultimately, it will be a small and vocal group of prudish bastards, with the emotional development of toddlers I might add, who aren't able to provide any context for their kids simply because the world is still black and white to them. Naturally, they want to ruin it for the rest of us.

Here's the solve:
1. world-proof your child instead of child-proofing the world
2. if you can't manage that, go back to fucking church

spot on, mate...and you KNOW that matches what I let my lads get away with at BMO Field. Time, place and context is key.

Gazza
07-19-2011, 09:44 AM
A chant/song should be created. Something quick and easy, loaded with fuck's and basically saying "we can say what we want"

Then all SG's league wide should sing it during a week's play.


Let the league know who pays their fuckin bills.

Didn't South Park have a creative swearing song?

Menelaos
07-19-2011, 09:50 AM
Some of its gratuitous, I'll grant you, but some of it is heat of the moment stuff. A player cheats, or a ref (weekly) blows an obvious call, I swear a bucket full. Why? I'm fucking angry that's why. And I don't care how many kids are around me, whether any of them are mine, or how many muppet jobsworths get offended. When I was a boy, I heard and saw much worse than swearing. And what did my dad do? He told me that whatever was said in the football ground stayed in the football ground. If I repeat it outside, especially in front of my mother, I'd get it (which in those days meant a proper kicking).

End of the day, this move by FOs and the league is an attempt at social control, spear-headed by people who are thick enough think that child-proofing the world is a good idea.

What I can't stand about situations like this is, ultimately, it will be a small and vocal group of prudish bastards, with the emotional development of toddlers I might add, who aren't able to provide any context for their kids simply because the world is still black and white to them. Naturally, they want to ruin it for the rest of us.

Here's the solve:
1. world-proof your child instead of child-proofing the world
2. if you can't manage that, go back to fucking church


Great post, right up to where you seem to mock the church.
Shame really.

Joe Kool
07-19-2011, 10:39 AM
Great post, right up to where you seem to mock the church.
Shame really.

Yeah I thought there were some good points in the post blended with some real ignorance.

My wife and I are dealing with this right now. I started to bring my kids to most games this year and I sit at the top of the supporter section. We have noticed, particularly from one individual, that the swearing is getting worse in my section as the season is going on. I was always hoping that it would go over their heads but I also had the conversation with them that they will hear it but don't repeat it. My 7 year old just told us this past weekend, in a fit of rage, that he "fucking hates" something. We now have to decide whether we bring the kids anymore because I don't expect that the crowd will really change much nor do I really feel that they should. It comes with the territory. They are not exposed to swearing at home but I do believe they hear it at school and other places as well. It is life. The only problem with bringing them to the TFC games is that they are 100% guaranteed to hear it so I have to make that call. Will see how it goes.

Auzzy
07-19-2011, 10:44 AM
All fine and dandy to talk to your kids about swearing (as I do with mine as well). Until someone talks to MLS advertisers about swearing, the issue isn't going away.

Again, if folks think that they are concerned about little ears within the stadium:

- why set aside group tickets (usually youth soccer teams) in section 104 under visitors support?
- why put a family section (227) above the NEE?
- why accept ads that display "Sex Crazed Maniac" throughout the game?

This has everything to do with TV and nothing to do with kids in seats.

As mentioned on the Support the Fort Facebook page, there are easy ways to control how loudly & how clearly the fan noise gets through on a broadcast. Especially if it's something totally predictable, like the YSA chant on an opposing-team goal kick. (Which I think is pretty stupid, as do most of the NE supporters -- as often, it's the awful way the issue was dealt with more than anything else.) Why not turn off or slightly distort the mikes from the supporter's sections at those moments? (Of course, when you see how poor the camera work & production are for many MLS games -- maybe it is too much to expect.)

Instead, the supporters sections are often miked heavily, shown in broadcasts & team advertisements, etc to hype up the "atmosphere" but then some people want to guys to act like choir boys.

I'm sure advertisers & broadcasters are concerned about language etc., but I'm sure there have also been in-stadium complaints from folks with sticks up their butts which have led to the hassles.

^ As to the previous post, I do agree that there can be some very obnoxious folks at games, and often swearing is only part of the problem.

Pookie
07-19-2011, 10:56 AM
I'm sure advertisers & broadcasters are concerned about language etc., but I'm sure there have also been in-stadium complaints from folks with sticks up their butts which have led to the hassles.


You are making the assumption that the league and FO act on the complaints of the average fan.

League wide, there is a drive to market to corporations. Field side tables, various "clubs" and other incentives to the higher priced market. Think of our own BMO. Who do you think is going to get attention at BMO? A guy in the Club Section, Field Side Tables or Corporate boxes next to 127? Or the parent in row 24 of 227?

Many folks are incorrectly (IMO) labeling this as a family/soccer mom targeting issue. A soccer mom complains and the league jumps into action.

Not so, this is about language impacting the number of TV advertisers and higher end ticket buyer who is using the confines of a soccer stadium as a "business deduction."

Not focusing on the real problem means wasted efforts.

Auzzy
07-19-2011, 11:13 AM
^ It could be that the corporate seats are the ones with sticks up their butts, rather than "soccer moms" -- or at least are the ones the league and FOs listen to -- I don't know. I do think the NE supporters have some info about where the complaints came from, but I don't have time to look that up right now. My main point was, there are ways to control how clearly bad language makes it through on broadcasts, which is what the broadcasters & advertisers are worried about. If the teams aren't doing whats possible, they're stupid -- which is probably true.

However, I'm sure that the "team ops" and cheap/overblown security pricks in some of the stadiums are strongly complaint-driven, regardless of where those complaints come from.

In any case, I think it's very unclear how much of this hassle is coming from what source and for what purpose. Many people have their pre-set (conspiracy) theories.

Detroit_TFC
07-19-2011, 01:02 PM
Didn't something like this happen in Colorado at the Dick? Supporters and FO went at it for a while over language but then worked out somewhat of an accomodation by moving the supporters over to the unused stage on a new terraced section, away from tender ears. FFS Gillette Stadium is half empty, put the Fort on the tarped end or where ever. Why is this shit so hard for people to figure out. In any case, I'm 100% behind the Revs supporters taking action on how this has been handled by their FO.

TorCanSoc
07-19-2011, 05:06 PM
<old prude>I used to bring my daughter to the games, now she's 7. I hate the swearing in chants. I'll bring her back when she's older.</old prude>

Swearing is everywhere. No fault of TFC SGs of course, but my wife caught my 7 year old daughter, and her 8 year old cousin asking what "fucking" means. Anyone want to help me out on that one? :)

Personally, I find more creativity without the swearing. Like a comedian, who constantly uses a well timed f-bomb. Sure its funny, but not very imaginative.

Phk it. Its an argument no one can win.