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View Full Version : Post Game: TFC v. Craplumbus v. the Ref



TFCRegina
04-23-2011, 05:12 PM
Discuss.

MG42
04-23-2011, 05:13 PM
6 points out of 15 at BMO

QSIM
04-23-2011, 05:14 PM
Well... Aaron Winter will definitely be using one word quite a bit in his post game to describe what happened... any guesses?

- Pity.

Brooker
04-23-2011, 05:14 PM
Well... Aaron Winter will definitely be using one word quite a bit in his post game to describe what happened... any guesses?

- Pity.

MASSIVE?

TFCRegina
04-23-2011, 05:15 PM
Well... Aaron Winter will definitely be using one word quite a bit in his post game to describe what happened... any guesses?

- Pity.

We know he isn't surprised any more.

ricciboy
04-23-2011, 05:15 PM
bull shit call by the ref

QSIM
04-23-2011, 05:16 PM
6 points out of 15 at BMO

Still on 1 win after an "easy" opening schedule, with plenty of games at hope. Let's hope were still improving.

Soccerpro
04-23-2011, 05:17 PM
Blaming the ref for the Tchani sending off is like complaining when you get a parking ticket when you've parked in the same no parking zone everyday but have never gotten a ticket there before. You breached the rules of the game and you allowed the referee to make the decision to send you off. Is it a consistent decision? No. Did anyone force Tony Tchani to go jump in the stands? No

James17930
04-23-2011, 05:20 PM
Blaming the ref for the Tchani sending off is like complaining when you get a parking ticket when you've parked in the same no parking zone everyday but have never gotten a ticket there before. You breached the rules of the game and you allowed the referee to make the decision to send you off. Is it a consistent decision? No. Did anyone else but Tony Tchani force him to go jump in the stands? No

AND WHEN EVERY SINGLE OTHER CAR AROUND YOU DOESN'T GET A TICKET?

C'mon man, seriously -- how often do you ever see that called?

Dkolish3
04-23-2011, 05:20 PM
Tchani should not have leaped in to the crowd knowing that he already had a yellow, and knowing how inconsistent MLS referees are. All things considered being down ten men at half-time and still getting a point is good, however 3 points from 4 home matches is unacceptable. Negative things: Maicon looked ineffective, Gargan should have been burned if the Crew had wide players, we gave up the goal, Tchani despite scoring the goal had trouble passing along with most of his teammates. Positive things: DeGuzman looked excellent, Eckerseley looked serviceable, and Cann looks recovered, and Gordan looks like a target forward.

Stryker
04-23-2011, 05:21 PM
After 20 mins I dare say Eckersly is the the best right back we've ever had. The Ecks-JDG-Martina trio could be deadly bringing the ball up the right side.
Dicoy Williams was impressive.
Plata has more heart than the entire starting eleven in past seasons.
Bormans crosses were piss poor. Hopefully thats atypical for him.
JDG as always ruined flashes of awesomeness with another off balance pass to the opposition.
Alan Gordan... I love this guy. Very hard worker.
Martina was the Martina we fell in love with the first two games. Anyone who compares him to Ricketts is retarded.

James17930
04-23-2011, 05:23 PM
After 20 mins I dare say Eckersly is the the best right back we've ever had. The Ecks-JDG-Martina trio could be deadly bringing the ball up the right side.
Dicoy Williams was impressive.
Plata has more heart than the entire starting eleven in past seasons.
Bormans crosses were piss poor. Hopefully thats atypical for him.
JDG as always ruined flashes of awesomeness with another off balance pass to the opposition.
Alan Gordan... I love this guy. Very hard worker.
Martina was the Martina we fell in love with the first two games. Anyone who compares him to Ricketts is retarded.

That's pretty amazing you can say that given that he wasn't even playing at RB :rolleyes:

Stryker
04-23-2011, 05:24 PM
That's pretty amazing you can say that given that he wasn't even playing at RB :rolleyes:
Yeah thanks tips. Where did he win most of the balls and whats his natural position again?
Away with you.

Soccerpro
04-23-2011, 05:25 PM
Aaron Winter - Thank you for saying Tchani was stupid to jump into the crowd on a yellow!

twistedchinaman
04-23-2011, 05:25 PM
Give some more time to Eckersley and put Gargan on the bench for a bit...I think the boy needs some time here.

Williams was a good, Plata if he keeps it up will be spectacular.

Otherwise...refs, :facepalm:

Soccerpro
04-23-2011, 05:28 PM
Williams was solid
Eckersley was solid
JDG was the best we've seen him this year, very steady.
Plata was a spark plug

Please don't put Harden and Gargan back in.

Anyone else think Borman is a disaster waiting to happen?

twistedchinaman
04-23-2011, 05:31 PM
^ You could say the same for Peterson.

LesH
04-23-2011, 05:32 PM
6 points out of 15 at BMO

Looking just at the points made, this is a horrible performance (5 games at home = 1 win, 1 loss, 3 draws), but I saw some glimpses in these games which gives me some hope even for this season...

phonzo
04-23-2011, 05:34 PM
Gargan isn't a starter. Last year fine we had no options but now......

Davenport
04-23-2011, 05:35 PM
Eckersley proved in just a few minutes he's a footballer.
Gargan has proved in 2 years he isn't.

That was the most INEPT performance I've ever seen from a referee.
Both coaches must be pissed off.
He was shite for both teams !!

twistedchinaman
04-23-2011, 05:40 PM
That was the most INEPT performance I've ever seen from a referee.
Both coaches must be pissed off.
He was shite for both teams !!

Didn't Wileman say at the top of the broadcast that it was only the twit's THIRD MLS game?

:facepalm:

This guy was worse than "Handball" Toledo...and that's saying a lot. Give the whistle to Petrescu or Chennard next match...never to that guy again!

canadian_bhoy
04-23-2011, 05:41 PM
Ecks was great.
Plata is fast as fuck.
JDG was great again (but seems to foul a lot)
Frei was Frei. Solid and left out to dry.
Martina has been kinda disappointing the last couple games.
Gargan. Release the gargan. no...seriously, release him, he's not good.

Roogsy
04-23-2011, 05:44 PM
It's too bad. I think TFC played well enough to take 3 points today. That card, whether you felt it was deserved or not, was the difference in the game.

boban
04-23-2011, 05:44 PM
Ecks was great.
Plata is fast as fuck.
JDG was great again (but seems to foul a lot)
Frei was Frei. Solid and left out to dry.
Martina has been kinda disappointing the last couple games.
Gargan. Release the gargan. no...seriously, release him, he's not good.
Every time he lets in a goal he's left out to dry.
Never his fault or that he could of done better no.
Give me a break, he dove with reflexes slower than molasses on that goal.

QSIM
04-23-2011, 05:47 PM
Tchani should not have leaped in to the crowd knowing that he already had a yellow, and knowing how inconsistent MLS referees are. All things considered being down ten men at half-time and still getting a point is good, however 3 points from 4 home matches is unacceptable. Negative things: Maicon looked ineffective, Gargan should have been burned if the Crew had wide players, we gave up the goal, Tchani despite scoring the goal had trouble passing along with most of his teammates. Positive things: DeGuzman looked excellent, Eckerseley looked serviceable, and Cann looks recovered, and Gordan looks like a target forward.

This would never be an issue with consistent officiating.

ag futbol
04-23-2011, 05:49 PM
Totally random thoughts:

- Tchani - JDG combo in the middle is a good one. Its too bad the drop off is huge if one of those guys go down.
- I think Gargan has been going to the Jimmy B school of defending opposing wingers. Guy stands 6 feet away from the attacker, and he doesn't effectively defend the space behind him or against potential crosses into the box. They might as well have a scarecrow playing RB.
- We really lack a danger man up front. Martina is rapidly becoming found out by opposing teams who realize they can simply bring the second man and he'll hold on to the ball too long trying to do everything himself. He's still a starter, but won't be carrying the load anytime soon.
- Peterson free kicks = terrible
- TFC much more composed and better at keeping their shape than in every previous season. Credit to Winter on the tactics for making the most out of some terrible decisions by the ref.

phonzo
04-23-2011, 05:50 PM
Very true roogsy. I would be fine with the. Ard if it applied to others which it hasnt

rocker
04-23-2011, 05:51 PM
C'mon man, seriously -- how often do you ever see that called?

I've seen it called twice before this season -- Terry Dunfield in the first Vancouver game, and Hassli in another game. Both got yellows. So it's the third time this season I've seen it called. All three players jumped into the crowd.

Players cannot leave the field of play. When I saw Tchani running over, I thought "OHHHH NOOOOOOO!!!! DON'T LEAVE THE PLAYING FIELD!!!!"

Tchani was as dumb as Hassli was.

I can't fault the ref really.

Brooker
04-23-2011, 05:52 PM
I've seen it called twice before this season -- Terry Dunfield in the first Vancouver game, and Hassli in another game. Both got yellows. So it's the third time this season I've seen it called.

Players cannot leave the field of play. When I saw Tchani running over, I thought "OHHHH NOOOOOOO!!!! DON'T LEAVE THE PLAYING FIELD!!!!"

Tchani was as dumb as Hassli was.

Hassli got a yellow for taking off his jersey.... as far as the commentators were saying.

In the 4 and a bit years at BMO, how many of our players have run into the crowd (a shitload) and how many have been carded? (zero before today.)

discretion for fucks sake, referee!

boban
04-23-2011, 05:52 PM
I've seen it called twice before this season -- Terry Dunfield in the first Vancouver game, and Hassli in another game. Both got yellows. So it's the third time this season I've seen it called.

Players cannot leave the field of play. When I saw Tchani running over, I thought "OHHHH NOOOOOOO!!!! DON'T LEAVE THE PLAYING FIELD!!!!"

According to the Laws of the Game you can't leave the field without permission of the ref. This was clearly the case.

No fault to the ref at all. Players need to read the fucking rules of the sport they play.
Hassli got called for taking off his shirt. yes he had another Whitecaps jersey underneath, but he took it off nonetheless.

QSIM
04-23-2011, 05:55 PM
Well... Aaron Winter will definitely be using one word quite a bit in his post game to describe what happened... any guesses?

- Pity.

Post game reaction from Winter: "Ah it's pity.."

brad
04-23-2011, 06:00 PM
Tchani was dumb to so what he did and you can't argue about the sending off

What you can argue about is the lack of consistency in the refs- as Becks did. Pretty sure Montero went and hugged a bunch if supporters after his goal last night and didn't get a card. Gordon did it after his first game.

Gazza_55
04-23-2011, 06:04 PM
Totally random thoughts:

- Tchani - JDG combo in the middle is a good one. Its too bad the drop off is huge if one of those guys go down.
- I think Gargan has been going to the Jimmy B school of defending opposing wingers. Guy stands 6 feet away from the attacker, and he doesn't effectively defend the space behind him or against potential crosses into the box. They might as well have a scarecrow playing RB.

- TFC much more composed and better at keeping their shape than in every previous season. Credit to Winter on the tactics for making the most out of some terrible decisions by the ref.

So Tchani will play vs Edmonton but probably is suspended for Seattle. Who plays with JDG against the Sounders?

And to your last point. Totally agree - we look much better than in previous years.

rocktml
04-23-2011, 06:12 PM
The refs in this league want to make me puke.

QSIM
04-23-2011, 06:13 PM
So Tchani will play vs Edmonton but probably is suspended for Seattle. Who plays with JDG against the Sounders?

And to your last point. Totally agree - we look much better than in previous years.

Maybe Peterson or Yourass.... we really have no other options

swan
04-23-2011, 06:18 PM
lot of negativity i thought the boys played good we were giving it to them even after the red..

RPB73
04-23-2011, 06:19 PM
Personally I am very pleased with today's performance . JDG is starting to show what type of player he is, Tchani is strong in his midfield role what can I say about Gordon just tremendous . The only thing I would like to see is Eckersley for Gargan and Yourassowski for Borman . With Stevanovic back and Martina back to where he was at the start of the season . One last point we need more from Santos .

ryan
04-23-2011, 06:23 PM
JDG was great today. Gordon was pretty serviceable in his return, very obvious we are worse without him.

Plata needs to be used more, his speed with the ball is very useful.

Cannot believe Tchani was carded, I can recall Gordon doing it in the south stands...where was the card then?

I don't fucking care what the rules are, you either call things one way or you don't. That is bullshit that they are pick and choosing times to do it. This call had WAY TOO MUCH bearing on the outcome of the match, fucking stupid.

deltox
04-23-2011, 06:23 PM
So this ref carded a player as per the rule book. I don't think u can be mad at this ref for that call

ryan
04-23-2011, 06:26 PM
So this ref carded a player as per the rule book. I don't think u can be mad at this ref for that call

You can be mad because it's not a consistent call.

Either it is or it isn't.

http://beta.images.theglobeandmail.com/archive/01261/Gordonew03_1261128gm-t.jpg

MG42
04-23-2011, 06:28 PM
right now we are on track to get 20 points from 17 home games.

And players going into the crowd is awesome IMO. Anyone remember that video of Cunningham climbing like spiderman to get into the crowd after he scored with RSL?

Soccerpro
04-23-2011, 06:28 PM
You can be mad because it's not a consistent call.

Either it is or it isn't.

http://beta.images.theglobeandmail.com/archive/01261/Gordonew03_1261128gm-t.jpg

It wasn't this ref's fault that other refs don't follow the rule

boozilla
04-23-2011, 06:29 PM
So this ref carded a player as per the rule book. I don't think u can be mad at this ref for that call

Fair enough. It just made for a lame 2nd half.
TFC played great a man down and The KKKrew were held useless.

deltox
04-23-2011, 06:29 PM
It is a yellow card offense. I'm not saying that refs are good. But that right there is a yellow.

Couchy81
04-23-2011, 06:29 PM
So this ref carded a player as per the rule book. I don't think u can be mad at this ref for that call

As someone posted in the game thread, the fifa rule on leaving the field of play to celebrate is that it is not illegal in and of itself. Can get booked for taking too long to get back onto the pitch. The ref in this game said it was "unsportsmanlike", so I guess he just makes up his own rules.

deltox
04-23-2011, 06:31 PM
Entering or exiing the field without permission is the rule. I'm on my iPhone so can someone else copy the 7 yellow card offences here from FIFA?

Dreadlocks
04-23-2011, 06:31 PM
JDG was the difference today. If there is no red card, he opens up Columbus at will....Like he did on that pass to Tchani.

QSIM
04-23-2011, 06:35 PM
Bottom line - the ref shouldnt determine the outcome in any game. Today he did.

ryan
04-23-2011, 06:36 PM
It wasn't this ref's fault that other refs don't follow the rule

So then sort your shit out refs, it's not right that it's this way.

It's further irritating when you see situations like Winter's locker room media ban being shunned because "in North America, Media owns you", but regular player/crowd interaction like crowd jumping is not acceptable despite being normal in North American sport.

Silly.

mclaren
04-23-2011, 06:37 PM
Anyone got a link for the Vancouver game?

Couchy81
04-23-2011, 06:38 PM
Here is the rule in it's entirety:

"
While it is permissible for a player to demonstrate his joy when a goal has been
scored, the celebration must not be excessive.
Reasonable celebrations are allowed, but the practice of choreographed
celebrations is not to be encouraged when it results in excessive time-wasting
and referees are instructed to intervene in such cases.
A player must be cautioned if:
• in the opinion of the referee, he makes gestures which are provocative,
derisory or infl ammatory
• he climbs on to a perimeter fence to celebrate a goal being scored
• he removes his shirt or covers his head with his shirt
• he covers his head or face with a mask or other similar item
Leaving the fi eld of play to celebrate a goal is not a cautionable offence in itself
but it is essential that players return to the fi eld of play as soon as possible.
Referees are expected to act in a preventative manner and to exercise common
sense in dealing with the celebration of a goal"

http://www.fifa.com/mm/document/worldfootball/clubfootball/01/37/04/28/law12.pdf


Now the only thing I saw Tchani climb was the stupid ad board, which is why I think the ref enforced the yellow. Total judgement call, and making that call on a player who already has a yellow and will be ejected is a bad call.

ManUtd4ever
04-23-2011, 06:40 PM
Overall, the team played with heart today and were robbed of a chance to earn the victory by yet another brutal MLS official. Kudos to JDG, Tchani, Williams, Eckersley, Gordon, and Plata in particular.

Other than the red card and the plague of flies at the stadium today, I had a good time.

CretanBull
04-23-2011, 06:43 PM
Two games in a row a visiting player has scored a goal on us an taunted the crowd. The league has to put an end to that because the people around me in 105 - who were the furthest thing from hardcore supporters - were looking for things to throw when Renteria ran over to the side line to taunt the crowd.

ensco
04-23-2011, 06:43 PM
^Tchani was only in there for a few seconds. Reading that rule, I say that ref blew it. TFC need to petition the league to get Tchani back for the Seattle game.

Jeff s
04-23-2011, 06:49 PM
charlie davies went up to the fans last week and "shhhh" us. That should've been a yellow, did he get it? No. The refs these days pick and choose which calls to make, its annoying.

69Chevy396
04-23-2011, 06:51 PM
On a few occasions, after being badly beaten, Gargan came back and made a decent defensive tackle to prevent a goal. But he was responsible for at least four give aways, two inside the box. He is the worst player I think I have every watched, he loses his mark all the time, the less than average Columbus strikers were cake walking through him all game, he makes stupid passes and just looks like a fucking idiot on the ball. As long as he starts Winter is either an idiot himself, or is receiving orders from Satan, there is no reason for Gargan to start ever again, but here he was again, today. Shit.

tfcleeds
04-23-2011, 06:54 PM
I'm sure there may be a separate thread on this, but for about 10 mins. in the 2nd half, my attention was diverted from what was happening on the pitch to what was happening in 112/113. What was going on? Security was being heavy-handed, and a few people got tossed?

69Chevy396
04-23-2011, 06:56 PM
Two games in a row a visiting player has scored a goal on us an taunted the crowd. The league has to put an end to that because the people around me in 105 - who were the furthest thing from hardcore supporters - were looking for things to throw when Renteria ran over to the side line to taunt the crowd.
Our friends in 127 were serenading the Columbus subs for 20 minutes or so, and the Columbus players where having a lot of fun with that, one pretended to be a conductor. A little player/fan interaction is not a problem, adds to the atmosphere, and should be allowed. Mocking the fans is a soccer players prerogative, they do it all the time, at every level, at in every league, get used to it.

werewolf
04-23-2011, 07:07 PM
Two games in a row a visiting player has scored a goal on us an taunted the crowd. The league has to put an end to that because the people around me in 105 - who were the furthest thing from hardcore supporters - were looking for things to throw when Renteria ran over to the side line to taunt the crowd.

Write a letter to the league. I did after the disgrace of last week, and a few people copied and sent it in as well.

TFC Bhoy
04-23-2011, 07:08 PM
Just for those saying that everywhere else in the world its ok to jump into the stands I can say that I know in Scotland its not. Not that the SPL is best league in the world by any sense of the means, but i have seen this type of yellow card issued time and time again.
In fact when Tchani jumped into the crowd I said to my friend, "of fuck thats another yellow" I saw it coming. Stupid rule, sure, VERY incosistant in its calling, sure, but was worthy by my view

bigtfcfan
04-23-2011, 07:10 PM
wow gargan is terrible

2mil4dero+santo
04-23-2011, 07:13 PM
to be fair to the ref, we will never know if they've been given a directive from the board to clamp down on this kind of thing. Don't get me wrong, I don't understand why its a yellow, but directives are given to referees and if they don't adhere to them they will get in shit. You never know if the ref that didn't give Gordon a yellow got shit on for that or disciplined.
The issue I have is that there should be communication to the players and coaches if this is something the league wants to clamp down on.
It doesn't make sense to me, his shirt stayed on and santos was there too but didn't get a yellow?! very confusing decision to say the least.
One thing you have to give credit to santos, he tried his best to convince the ref to give him the yellow instead of Tchani.

prizby
04-23-2011, 07:25 PM
"My first one, it wasn't actually me. I didn't push [the Columbus player]. I didn't want to snitch on my teammate but it was my teammate who pushed the guy," Tchani explained.

Interesting...

A player must be cautioned if:
• in the opinion of the referee, he makes gestures which are provocative,
derisory or inflammatory
• he climbs on to a perimeter fence to celebrate a goal being scored
• he removes his shirt or covers his head with his shirt
• he covers his head or face with a mask or other similar item

dumb rule

TFCtoMUFC
04-23-2011, 07:28 PM
The first yellow on Tchani I didn't understand, he went in, kinda yelled a bit, then got out. I think it was Maicon who shoved the guy. The second yellow looked really bad after Renteria ran off the turf and made gestures towards our supporters. It's fine if you book our guy for it, as long as you book the other guy as well.

TFC USA
04-23-2011, 07:29 PM
Convinced we're never beating Columbus. Ever.

If God were real we'd at least have that to celebrate in an increasingly painful season that already feels "last-place" like.

Ron Manager
04-23-2011, 07:39 PM
JDG is starting to show his class, what a ball over the top to Tchani.

Flint
04-23-2011, 08:06 PM
The buildup to Tchanis goal was great to watch.
Plata impressed me a lot with his speed and control with the ball.
Wasnt impressed with Yourassowskys first touch.
We played well enough for 3 points IMO obviously the red card was the turning point in the game.

Whoop
04-23-2011, 08:10 PM
That buildup on Tchani's goal was one of the nicest I've seen from TFC at BMO ever.

Whoop
04-23-2011, 08:14 PM
Maybe Ives is onto something.



SoccerByIves (http://twitter.com/#%21/SoccerByIves) Ives Galarcep



What an awful red card in the New England-Sporting KC match. This stuff is getting ridiculous. Red card bonuses for refs? Sheesh

Lennon
04-23-2011, 08:16 PM
The buildup to Tchanis goal was great to watch.
Plata impressed me a lot with his speed and control with the ball.
Wasnt impressed with Yourassowskys first touch.
We played well enough for 3 points IMO obviously the red card was the turning point in the game.

+1 :(
We should have created a chance or two from his runs at defenders around the box but got nothing out of them because of his poor touches ... he also seems to suffer a bit from Stevanovic-syndrome ..
(having said that I'd still start him over Borman)

Kinda funny that up to this year we didn't have a single player that would take defenders on ... and now we have three that do it waaay too often

Whoop
04-23-2011, 08:18 PM
I agree with last point Lennon.

rocker
04-23-2011, 08:26 PM
He is the worst player I think I have every watched, .

Did you ever watch Marco Reda? haha.

CretanBull
04-23-2011, 08:28 PM
Our friends in 127 were serenading the Columbus subs for 20 minutes or so, and the Columbus players where having a lot of fun with that, one pretended to be a conductor. A little player/fan interaction is not a problem, adds to the atmosphere, and should be allowed. Mocking the fans is a soccer players prerogative, they do it all the time, at every level, at in every league, get used to it.

If he did that at Elland Rd. he wouldn't make it out of Leeds alive.

DangerRed
04-23-2011, 08:28 PM
A predictable red for Tchani. I knew he was going to get it as soon as he hopped the boards -- and he should have. The Columbus keeper pointed to the middle circle to show the ref his team was ready to restart when Tchani was still behind the boards. The Laws are clear. That was cardable.

HAVING SAID THAT, this was way more positive than I thought it would be. Eckersley is a great addition and Plata could've potted one if not for a bad final touch.

Entertaining draw that feels like a loss.

In other news, we're still 7 points out of 7 games, about to hit the road, and fall way lower. Not being negative here, just pointing out reality.

werewolf
04-23-2011, 08:30 PM
If he did that at Elland Rd. he wouldn't make it out of Leeds alive.

Should have been that way last week...

azorean10
04-23-2011, 08:41 PM
more of plata . PLEASE !

Detroit_TFC
04-23-2011, 08:59 PM
Good: Overall not a bad game. We didn't get killed when down a man. Eckersley a big addition.

Bad: Damn few home games the rest of the season and not much to show for our efforts. Chances of making playoffs = nearing zero. Other than that one save, Gargan was terrible. Time for the bench or maybe someplace that that isn't Toronto. Disappointing performance from Dicoy Williams, who I was eager to start a game to see what he could do.

As for Tchani's card, what other refs fail to do in terms of player celebrations or enforcement of rules is not a grounds for the ref not to follow the clearly stated laws of the game. Complain about refs who don't do it, not ones who do. Yes it sucks but let's not be homers on this one.

mightydrm
04-23-2011, 09:07 PM
This was far and away the best the Reds have played all season. Restored my hope in the club for this year. Julian is showing his class, and others are making good contributions: Gordon, Plata, Williams, Yourassowsky. Also, while it is true Gargan made some really bad screw ups, this is a team that needs his toughness and enthusiasm. The good start wasn't an accident, and I worry if they start without him in the line up. Lots of progress, so while the points level is worrying, there are good signs. Although wouldn't DeRo have looked good out there today?

flamehawk
04-23-2011, 09:10 PM
So Tchani will play vs Edmonton but probably is suspended for Seattle. Who plays with JDG against the Sounders?

And to your last point. Totally agree - we look much better than in previous years.



Suspensions don't apply across different competitions?

jazzy
04-23-2011, 09:11 PM
Blaming the ref for the Tchani sending off is like complaining when you get a parking ticket when you've parked in the same no parking zone everyday but have never gotten a ticket there before. You avies breached the rules of the game and you allowed the referee to make the decision to send you off. Is it a consistent decision? No. Did anyone force Tony Tchani to go jump in the stands? No

AND Davies last week running into the supporters section, after scoring,.. intimidating the fans, is also a yellow,.....seriously Tchani's first was a haphazard call, randomly selected by the ref after a Columbus roughousing,.. so it being his second,.it should be a stern warning ONLY, if you are a quality ref,...this isn't the fooking world cup,....this is a young league trying to attract new fans, and enthusiasm should be what?,....highly frowned upon.......go have a bath

brad
04-23-2011, 09:24 PM
Apparantly a Revs player just scored and tossed his shirt into the crowd - no card. This league is a joke. Either you call excessive celebrations across the league or you don't.

TFCRegina
04-23-2011, 09:28 PM
Suspensions don't apply across different competitions?

Nope.

jazzy
04-23-2011, 09:31 PM
Here is the rule in it's entirety:

"
While it is permissible for a player to demonstrate his joy when a goal has been
scored, the celebration must not be excessive.
Reasonable celebrations are allowed, but the practice of choreographed
celebrations is not to be encouraged when it results in excessive time-wasting
and referees are instructed to intervene in such cases.
A player must be cautioned if:
• in the opinion of the referee, he makes gestures which are provocative,
derisory or infl ammatory
• he climbs on to a perimeter fence to celebrate a goal being scored
• he removes his shirt or covers his head with his shirt
• he covers his head or face with a mask or other similar item
Leaving the fi eld of play to celebrate a goal is not a cautionable offence in itself
but it is essential that players return to the fi eld of play as soon as possible.
Referees are expected to act in a preventative manner and to exercise common
sense in dealing with the celebration of a goal"

http://www.fifa.com/mm/document/worldfootball/clubfootball/01/37/04/28/law12.pdf


Now the only thing I saw Tchani climb was the stupid ad board, which is why I think the ref enforced the yellow. Total judgement call, and making that call on a player who already has a yellow and will be ejected is a bad call.

thank you......very informative,...and as I said before Davies = yellow card

jazzy
04-23-2011, 09:38 PM
Two games in a row a visiting player has scored a goal on us an taunted the crowd. The league has to put an end to that because the people around me in 105 - who were the furthest thing from hardcore supporters - were looking for things to throw when Renteria ran over to the side line to taunt the crowd.

Davies, Renteria,...= no card,.....Tchani = yellow/red , I pay to see a game and get shafted........

werewolf
04-23-2011, 09:41 PM
The ref seemed ok aside from the questionable dead-ball issues. It definitely changed the game, but considering what we have witnessed in previous weeks (and years), his officiating of the match play itself was alright.

Huyton
04-23-2011, 09:41 PM
Agreed, Jazzy...I don't think you effectively send someone off for celebrating their first ever goal for TFC, and only the second in their career.

The Ref should have had a quiet word with him, told him to be more sensible next time, and he'd be watching him closely for the rest of the game.

Blowing Bubbles
04-23-2011, 09:44 PM
If he did that at Elland Rd. he wouldn't make it out of Leeds alive.

gmafb. they would literally kill him???. Ooh yes big bad England. Lampard told the West Ham fans to stick it today after scoring a goal, somehow I think he managed to make it home in one piece.

Lets not pretend we're hard here.

Blowing Bubbles
04-23-2011, 09:46 PM
Apparantly a Revs player just scored and tossed his shirt into the crowd - no card. This league is a joke. Either you call excessive celebrations across the league or you don't.

NE -- Rajko Lekic (caution; Shirt Removal) 84

Mark TFC
04-23-2011, 09:55 PM
There's no doubt we looked better this game than the last. Our team is progressing every game and for the first time this season we didn't suffer due to a poor start. The red card was an unnecessary decision made by the ref. I think we deserved the 3 today, but a draw is better than none at all.

werewolf
04-23-2011, 09:59 PM
What does "gmafb" mean?

CretanBull
04-23-2011, 10:00 PM
gmafb. they would literally kill him???. Ooh yes big bad England. Lampard told the West Ham fans to stick it today after scoring a goal, somehow I think he managed to make it home in one piece.

Lets not pretend we're hard here.

Yes, literally kill him - that's what I meant :rolleyes:

Are you really comparing a guy playing at home telling the visiting fans to stick it from somewhere on the pitch to a guy playing on the road running over to the home supporters section to give them an obnoxious "shhhhhhhhhhh!" ? You know perfectly well that if Lampard ran over to the West Ham supporter's end at Upton Park and pulled that "shhhhhhhh!" stunt it would lead to trouble.

Who's pretending to be hard?

torontocelt
04-23-2011, 10:03 PM
I thought Gordon was tremendous today, I was sad to see him taken off at half time. I am guessing it was a tactical move as he didn't appear injured and I guess that Winter was looking for more speed in that area of the pitch as he was a man down. I for one would not have taken Gordon off as he was holding the ball up really well, if he was taken off purely for tactics then I think Winter made a bad move.

Tchani has got no one to blame but himself, I dont blame the referee at all for his call as it was the right one. Tchani really fecked up and let the team down today, in my view he was one of the major reasons we did not get the three points today.

Gargan was utter garbage, he was regularly fecking up and looked scared of putting himself about. He needs to be dropped asap. Peterson was appalling on almost all set pieces, please god someone let Winter know this, surely we must have someone else better than him at set pieces?

I was impressed with Eckersley, he did put himself about and looked to be giving it his all. He looks like a good capture but it is hard to judge a player on one half of football.

Plata looks like a real live wire, I reckon he would be good coming on as a sub in the 70th minute to run at players. He has pace to burn and opposition players would struggle with him when they are tired.

DeGuzman was good, he was doing what we know he can do, he still has it all to prove though.

TFC were a little unlucky today although they are at fault for causing their own bad luck. The boys worked hard and the game was entertaining. Columbus were not impressive apart from their goal.

7 points from 7 games or 7 points from 21 is very poor especially when you have had 5 home games. I fear for this team once we go on the road, this is going to be a very long season.

swan
04-23-2011, 10:10 PM
I thought Gordon was tremendous today, I was sad to see him taken off at half time. I am guessing it was a tactical move as he didn't appear injured and I guess that Winter was looking for more speed in that area of the pitch as he was a man down. I for one would not have taken Gordon off as he was holding the ball up really well, if he was taken off purely for tactics then I think Winter made a bad move.

Tchani has got no one to blame but himself, I dont blame the referee at all for his call as it was the right one. Tchani really fecked up and let the team down today, in my view he was one of the major reasons we did not get the three points today.

Gargan was utter garbage, he was regularly fecking up and looked scared of putting himself about. He needs to be dropped asap. Peterson was appalling on almost all set pieces, please god someone let Winter know this, surely we must have someone else better than him at set pieces?

I was impressed with Eckersley, he did put himself about and looked to be giving it his all. He looks like a good capture but it is hard to judge a player on one half of football.

Plata looks like a real live wire, I reckon he would be good coming on as a sub in the 70th minute to run at players. He has pace to burn and opposition players would struggle with him when they are tired.

DeGuzman was good, he was doing what we know he can do, he still has it all to prove though.

TFC were a little unlucky today although they are at fault for causing their own bad luck. The boys worked hard and the game was entertaining. Columbus were not impressive apart from their goal.

7 points from 7 games or 7 points from 21 is very poor especially when you have had 5 home games. I fear for this team once we go on the road, this is going to be a very long season.

he took gordon off to be safe with his injury since being that lone striker a man down would have been risky with all the running.. don't wanna rehurt him..


i thought Gargan didn't play as bad as everyone is making out to be..

ensco
04-23-2011, 10:13 PM
What does "gmafb" mean?

give me an effing break

boban
04-23-2011, 10:23 PM
give me an effing break
Why?
Seriously, what does it mean?!












:p

AmherstNY_TFC
04-23-2011, 10:31 PM
We all agree that the standard of officiating in MLS is pretty poor. This referee was another example. The players were allowed to kick lumps out of each other, and then, all of a sudden, the yellows start flying. It was a cheap, "letter of the law" interpretation of the rule. But, Tchani needs to control himself. He's on a yellow, the rule is in the books, and he broke it. We can complain about the fact that it isn't called, and that players can wind up opposing fans, but when Tchani jumped into the stands, he ran the risk of a yellow card, given the way officials are. Since this is a young team, we have to expect these kinds of things to happen.

All-in-all, I was pleased with the way they played. The attacking system is rounding out nicely. They put a lot of great touches together in the first half. They did try to go forward and score in the second half. Last year, Preki would have left 10 men behind the ball and settled for the 1-1 draw. Gordon holds up the ball well-much better than Maicon. It looks like we're figuring out who the best 11 are, and they are starting to gel. There are going to be many more bumps in the road between now and October, but I am willing to wait and see how much more the progress up to the All-Star break.

Despite the sandflies, it was a glorious day to be at the park-for once.

ensco
04-23-2011, 10:35 PM
:p
:D

rofl

Bars92
04-23-2011, 11:04 PM
kept our shape tonight, I'll take 1-1 or 1-0 all season, just as long as we don't lose 3-0 and lokk like bloody eejits at the the back.

Cashcleaner
04-23-2011, 11:14 PM
There are plenty of reasons to complain about the officiating in general today, but nobody should fault the ref for giving the red to Tchani. It was a stupid, stupid move on his part. He already had a card against him - and that's the whole point of issuing cautions - you're supposed to act, well.... cautiously afterwards.

Also, +14(?) on Eckersley. The guy definitely looked like a real threat out there in one way or another.

*sigh* I think we could have finally got three points from the Crew today. It's a shame we didn't.

ricciboy
04-24-2011, 12:02 AM
This would never be an issue with consistent officiating.

the league needs to address what celebrations are aloud and not aloud. A good example is Charlie Davies, he is getting away with taunting after scoring goals, long celebrations. I cant believe I'm saying this Beckham was right about the refs

iansmcl
04-24-2011, 12:07 AM
Anyone else get frisked on the way into this game? I was chosen as the lucky one in five, according to the security guard in the way in... didn't see it happen to anyone else though... no biggie.

scut farkus
04-24-2011, 12:31 AM
i thought Gargan didn't play as bad as everyone is making out to be..

Agreed.

Blizzard
04-24-2011, 01:15 AM
Apparantly a Revs player just scored and tossed his shirt into the crowd - no card. This league is a joke. Either you call excessive celebrations across the league or you don't.

He got a yellow card for that.

http://www.mlssoccer.com/matchcenter-recap/second-half-rally-drives-revs-3-2-win-over-sporting

James17930
04-24-2011, 01:27 AM
Here is the rule in it's entirety:

"
While it is permissible for a player to demonstrate his joy when a goal has been
scored, the celebration must not be excessive.
Reasonable celebrations are allowed, but the practice of choreographed
celebrations is not to be encouraged when it results in excessive time-wasting
and referees are instructed to intervene in such cases.
A player must be cautioned if:
• in the opinion of the referee, he makes gestures which are provocative,
derisory or infl ammatory
• he climbs on to a perimeter fence to celebrate a goal being scored
• he removes his shirt or covers his head with his shirt
• he covers his head or face with a mask or other similar item
Leaving the fi eld of play to celebrate a goal is not a cautionable offence in itself
but it is essential that players return to the fi eld of play as soon as possible.
Referees are expected to act in a preventative manner and to exercise common
sense in dealing with the celebration of a goal"

http://www.fifa.com/mm/document/worldfootball/clubfootball/01/37/04/28/law12.pdf


Now the only thing I saw Tchani climb was the stupid ad board, which is why I think the ref enforced the yellow. Total judgement call, and making that call on a player who already has a yellow and will be ejected is a bad call.

Well there you go. It's NOT an offence unless he's out there for a long time. Tchani took 10 secs at most.

werewolf
04-24-2011, 01:28 AM
^ I bet he took less time then the coordinated dancing from last week.

Can't expect anything else from MLS though.

Yohan
04-24-2011, 03:08 AM
Considering man down, I thought TFC played better. Lots of positives, especially how wing play is developing. We really need an AM to have the ability to push the ball up the middle.

Yourassowsky having to play as striker is just awkward. Stop with Santos as AM experiment.

Columbus played pretty defensively, even with a man up so I'd take today's result with a grain of salt.

dow117
04-24-2011, 07:36 AM
Two games in a row a visiting player has scored a goal on us an taunted the crowd. The league has to put an end to that because the people around me in 105 - who were the furthest thing from hardcore supporters - were looking for things to throw when Renteria ran over to the side line to taunt the crowd.

Could not agree more... charlie Davis in front of the supporters last week was a disgrace and should have been carded for incitement. The same with the KKcrew. But no, lets card a celebration and take the joy out of the game !!

Pookie
04-24-2011, 07:45 AM
I stopped reading the Gargan hate after last game's post game thread in which Gargan was blamed for the first 2 goals and wasn't even on the pitch. But I digress.

I'm not sure how anyone can see yesterday's game as anything but a net positive.

The much maligned defense played strong in the first half and weathered 50 minutes with a man down to concede just 1 goal. Cann, Williams, Gargan and Borman deserve a solid round of applause.

JDG was strong through the middle and put an excellent ball through to Tchani. Tchani, excellent placed shot. Our other new acquisitions in Eckersley and Plata also provided some solid minutes.

Winter, in what hasn't really been noticed, started the game with 2 forwards. Showing adaptability when criticized for not doing so and led to a first half 1-0 lead.

Yes, there were some errors. Yes, this is our 3rd red card in 7 games. But all in all, it was a very solid step forward on many levels.

Mikey
04-24-2011, 07:48 AM
PLATA!

is a fucking giant compared to some of the lame asses we have starting instead of him.

UNLEASH THE ROADRUNNER!!!!

torontocelt
04-24-2011, 07:56 AM
I was sitting in the third row of the north stand yesterday as I moved due to the flies and I seen how inept Gargan was yesterday. He had many individual errors (second half right in front of me) and he was quite lucky he was not punished for them on more than one occasion. I'm not hating on Gargan but he looked out his depth yesterday and I was hoping for the good of the team that he would be taken off.

NewcastleFan
04-24-2011, 08:36 AM
Anybody else see a bunch of fans in the south end get kicked out at around the 70th minute?

Rocco
04-24-2011, 08:37 AM
Every time he lets in a goal he's left out to dry.
Never his fault or that he could of done better no.
Give me a break, he dove with reflexes slower than molasses on that goal.

I think it's a bit harsh to blame Frei on the goal. He was square to the ball as he should be, on the goal line near the post, given the position of the ball. A bounce off the pitch off a header is very hard to predict which way and its going. Not too many keepers can stop that one.

Kaz
04-24-2011, 08:43 AM
Tchani took less time then the Columbus player took taunting TFC fans, which under the rules is also a bookable offence.

The Ref choose to change the course of the game rather then using basic judgement. If you don't give a red card for a late high challenge, then you don't give a player a second yellow for that. It's not even consistency between refs its consistency by the ref situation to situation, Tchani had no reason to think he was going to get crap for that with the way the officiating was being handled.

And that had the biggest effect, but nearly every card was stupid. And the non calls, and the calls that hinder game flow that went against advantage were just insane.

Calling for a restart for a foul that didn't prevent TFC from moving, and still had advantage was stupid. I thought Winter's head was going to exploded.

boban
04-24-2011, 08:54 AM
I think it's a bit harsh to blame Frei on the goal. He was square to the ball as he should be, on the goal line near the post, given the position of the ball. A bounce off the pitch off a header is very hard to predict which way and its going. Not too many keepers can stop that one.
I didn't say I blamed him. Just nothing really to praise about.
He could have done better on the goal. But that doesn't mean it still would not have gone in.

TFCREDNWHITE
04-24-2011, 09:01 AM
I think if JDG was not playing in this game, the result would have been a loss.

Rocco
04-24-2011, 09:05 AM
refereeing has always been the problem since the inception of the league, way before TFC was even conceived. It's an MLS issue that by now everyone is well aware of. To bitch about how shitty the refereeing has become is like sticking your nose in a pile of shit and expect it not to stink. Fact of the matter is shit will always stink. You wanna stop it from stinking, clean it up. I personally think the coaches and GMs as a whole need to address the league and point out the fundamental issues with referring, mostly being inconsistent and controversial calls that change the outcome of games. I understand in the heat of things, it is very difficult for a referee to make the correct call and not to take away from any of them, it's not an easy job.

I strongly believe through better training and experience, the refereeing can improve. OR shell out the extra cash, grab reputable international referees that can work with and coach the current referees that we have around the league. If this issue is not addressed, I feel that the outcome of the league's success is in jeopardy. We don't need one more reason to be at a disadvantage compared to the other well established leagues around the world. We need every reason to grow.

2mil4dero+santo
04-24-2011, 09:20 AM
refereeing has always been the problem since the inception of the league, way before TFC was even conceived. It's an MLS issue that by now everyone is well aware of. To bitch about how shitty the refereeing has become is like sticking your nose in a pile of shit and expect it not to stink. Fact of the matter is shit will always stink. You wanna stop it from stinking, clean it up. I personally think the coaches and GMs as a whole need to address the league and point out the fundamental issues with referring, mostly being inconsistent and controversial calls that change the outcome of games. I understand in the heat of things, it is very difficult for a referee to make the correct call and not to take away from any of them, it's not an easy job.

I strongly believe through better training and experience, the refereeing can improve. OR shell out the extra cash, grab reputable international referees that can work with and coach the current referees that we have around the league. If this issue is not addressed, I feel that the outcome of the league's success is in jeopardy. We don't need one more reason to be at a disadvantage compared to the other well established leagues around the world. We need every reason to grow.

I hate to play devil's advocate here, but mls has been trying very hard to improve the officiating. Making consistent calls is easier said than done and as for controversial calls, I don't see what it matters if its controversial or not, as long as its the right call.

Unlike most of you, I've been following MLS since the 90's and there's been a huge improvement in officiating.

You've got to remember, in Europe, referees begin their careers from age 11 or 12. They are trained by the best from that age full time with the one focus of becoming a professional referee. They don't just ref in the summer for a couple bucks when they're not playing.

The training is getting better and better and you'll see better officials coming up through the ranks. Already you can see big improvements with referees like Jair Marrufo and Prus and Hernandez.

The main problem is Canada doesn't have any refs yet that are on the same level as these guys. Thats why you can see the difference when we get Canadian refs. I don't see the situation in Canada improving anytime soon unfortunately.

Also, as some people have pointed out, it's frustrating that there seems to be a lack of communication about directives, ie the coaches and players don't seem to be properly informed about new directives and initiatives.

One last point, and I've always been alone on this, but please fifa, two refs!

just my 2 cents...

Rocco
04-24-2011, 09:45 AM
I agree, refereeing is improving but not fast enough to save the league. I'm not too familiar with the process of choosing officials but can't you fly officials to games?
I mean if the problem is the talent pool is lacking, why can't you bring outside talent? It can't be that hard to find good referees out there that are willing to work in North America.

I personally have no knowledge in the subject matter. This is simply from observation. Having said that, I can see the issues but don't see them improve as fast as I like. I know the solution is never as simple as it seems. What can be done and who needs to do it? Sad truth is it all comes down to the politics of the game.

Cristiano14
04-24-2011, 09:53 AM
What was going on with the cops and people getting kicked out of the south end towards the end of the match?

pekduck
04-24-2011, 10:04 AM
I agree, refereeing is improving but not fast enough to save the league. I'm not too familiar with the process of choosing officials but can't you fly officials to games?
I mean if the problem is the talent pool is lacking, why can't you bring outside talent? It can't be that hard to find good referees out there that are willing to work in North America.

I personally have no knowledge in the subject matter. This is simply from observation. Having said that, I can see the issues but don't see them improve as fast as I like. I know the solution is never as simple as it seems. What can be done and who needs to do it? Sad truth is it all comes down to the politics of the game.

they get paid around 200-500 for ref a game, who outside of N.A. would come to earn that kind of wage?

also refs are assigned by USSF and CSA

they want to minimize travel cost as well

at last, there are like 3 full time ref including toledo everyone else is just part timers

Ryan1984
04-24-2011, 10:08 AM
http://www.ussoccer.com/Referees/Laws-of-the-Game.aspx

On Page #27

Cautionable Offenses
A player is cautioned and shown the yellow card if he commits any of the following seven offenses:
• unsporting behavior
• dissent by word or action
• persistent infringement of the Laws of the Game
• delaying the restart of play
• failure to respect the required distance when play is restarted with a corner kick, free kick or throw-in
• entering or re-entering the field of play without the referee’s permission
• deliberately leaving the field of play without the referee’s permission

Whoop
04-24-2011, 10:09 AM
Fans of every sport complain about referees. It's a fact of life. LOL

I just want more consistency.

I could live with Tchani getting a yellow if Renteria or Davies had received yellows as well. Or even Gordon.

I mean that's what Tchani's excuse was - poor as it may be - but Davies didn't get a yellow, why should he?

deltox
04-24-2011, 10:19 AM
http://www.ussoccer.com/Referees/Laws-of-the-Game.aspx

On Page #27

Cautionable Offenses
A player is cautioned and shown the yellow card if he commits any of the following seven offenses:
• unsporting behavior
• dissent by word or action
• persistent infringement of the Laws of the Game
• delaying the restart of play
• failure to respect the required distance when play is restarted with a corner kick, free kick or throw-in
• entering or re-entering the field of play without the referee’s permission
• deliberately leaving the field of play without the referee’s permission

these are FIFA laws of the game. what was posted before are the interpretation of the laws.

either way, its done now.

maninb
04-24-2011, 10:28 AM
I saw progress today....baby steps to be sure..but we now have some QUALITY and DEPTH...let's give Winter & staff some time....nobody in their right mind expected TFC to make the playoffs anyway...perhaps Mariner can add something in by June....As long as we're playing some entertaining football and not getting blow out...

Detroit_TFC
04-24-2011, 10:44 AM
Bad reffing is everywhere, like looking for water in the ocean. Think MLS is bad, check out NCAA. Oy vey.

In any case, after seeing the "quality" of Central American refs in our CCL games, I'm left without much hope. MLS is never going to bring in refs outside of CONCACAF, I'm not even sure that is allowed.

rocker
04-24-2011, 10:44 AM
anyways, players are free to jump into the crowd or go beyond the lines or delay the game once per game (as long as the player doesn't already have a yellow).

As Winter said in the postgame chat, Tchani's dumb play was to do when already on yellow. Hassli was just as dumb in Vancouver.

ExiledRed
04-24-2011, 10:47 AM
MLS has to realise that the diminishing interest from Toronto fans isnt just the responsibility of MLSE.

The on field product, isnt just our team, its the MLS too. We're paying to watch TFC play MLS games, and if MLS is a crap product then TFC cant be anything but.

Whether it was the right call or not. We suffer from a huge imbalance of calls against, and there are many non calls that should have been made, that are gamechanging. Our players are afforded little protection to the point that it almost seems like the other teams have a license to foul our players. Good home goals get disallowed and I cant ever think of a time that we got given a goal which shouldnt have counted. We get penalties against for farting in the box, but their players could chop our players head off with a machete and the ref would wave it on.

How many times during our set pieces does the whistle blow the moment the ball gets kicked, and look.....free kick against....someone moved their pinkie.

The fans needed that goal yesterday, and the ejection turned a great game into another frustrating grind that's going to turn off more casual fans, yet again.

When it looks like the league itself is customised to hinder our success through poor reffing, bad scheduling, forced trading and nerfing etc... well we may as well watch the wrestling. If hoping for TFC success is futile because they dont want our success and maybe believe that it would be detrimental to the US support, Im not interested in this product in the slightest.

prizby
04-24-2011, 10:51 AM
i fail to see how Tchani gets a yellow for leaving the field...i believe 6 or 7 TFC players left with him...either they all get a yellow or none of them do

2mil4dero+santo
04-24-2011, 10:54 AM
I agree, refereeing is improving but not fast enough to save the league. I'm not too familiar with the process of choosing officials but can't you fly officials to games?
I mean if the problem is the talent pool is lacking, why can't you bring outside talent? It can't be that hard to find good referees out there that are willing to work in North America.

I personally have no knowledge in the subject matter. This is simply from observation. Having said that, I can see the issues but don't see them improve as fast as I like. I know the solution is never as simple as it seems. What can be done and who needs to do it? Sad truth is it all comes down to the politics of the game.

Top referees in Europe have spent their entire lives getting where they are. They would not leave Europe even if FIFA would change the rules to allow it. Also, I'm not sure if Germany still have full-time referees, but everywhere that I know of, the referees also have day jobs they would have to leave if they wanted to come over here. Bottom line is it would never happen.

Also, it's good to develop referees here. As much as people complain, the officiating in MLS is better than most leagues around the world. I would go so far as to say its the best officiated league outside of the top European leagues.

There are some excellent American officials and there will be more to come. The same unfortunately can't be said of our country.

I think the next step is to develop a culture ie what is called and what isn't on a consistent basis and if the board decides to focus on something one year they need to communicate that to the teams.

Beach_Red
04-24-2011, 10:56 AM
MLS has to realise that the diminishing interest from Toronto fans isnt just the responsibility of MLSE.

The on field product, isnt just our team, its the MLS too. We're paying to watch TFC play MLS games, and if MLS is a crap product then TFC cant be anything but.

Whether it was the right call or not. We suffer from a huge imbalance of calls against, and there are many non calls that should have been made, that are gamechanging. Our players are afforded little protection to the point that it almost seems like the other teams have a license to foul our players. Good home goals get disallowed and I cant ever think of a time that we got given a goal which shouldnt have counted. We get penalties against for farting in the box, but their players could chop our players head off with a machete and the ref would wave it on.

How many times during our set pieces does the whistle blow the moment the ball gets kicked, and look.....free kick against....someone moved their pinkie.

The fans needed that goal yesterday, and the ejection turned a great game into another frustrating grind that's going to turn off more casual fans, yet again.

When it looks like the league itself is customised to hinder our success through poor reffing, bad scheduling, forced trading and nerfing etc... well we may as well watch the wrestling. If hoping for TFC success is futile because they dont want our success and maybe believe that it would be detrimental to the US support, Im not interested in this product in the slightest.

Yes, but it isn't up to MLS to notice, it's up to MLSE to force the issue. Probably other owners do and that's why TFC is usually on the wrong end of these things.

Has MLSE gotten as much out of MLS as other owners have?

2mil4dero+santo
04-24-2011, 10:59 AM
MLS has to realise that the diminishing interest from Toronto fans isnt just the responsibility of MLSE.

The on field product, isnt just our team, its the MLS too. We're paying to watch TFC play MLS games, and if MLS is a crap product then TFC cant be anything but.

Whether it was the right call or not. We suffer from a huge imbalance of calls against, and there are many non calls that should have been made, that are gamechanging. Our players are afforded little protection to the point that it almost seems like the other teams have a license to foul our players. Good home goals get disallowed and I cant ever think of a time that we got given a goal which shouldnt have counted. We get penalties against for farting in the box, but their players could chop our players head off with a machete and the ref would wave it on.

How many times during our set pieces does the whistle blow the moment the ball gets kicked, and look.....free kick against....someone moved their pinkie.

The fans needed that goal yesterday, and the ejection turned a great game into another frustrating grind that's going to turn off more casual fans, yet again.

When it looks like the league itself is customised to hinder our success through poor reffing, bad scheduling, forced trading and nerfing etc... well we may as well watch the wrestling. If hoping for TFC success is futile because they dont want our success and maybe believe that it would be detrimental to the US support, Im not interested in this product in the slightest.

With all due respect, most of our officiating problems this year have been from Canadian refs. I'm not sure if the MLS can change that. I don't know exactly how it works but it seems like we can't get the good mls officials to ref at BMO for some reason. I'm not sure if MLS has control over the bmo assignments.

I would say its more a problem with the CSA than MLS. Someone correct me if I'm wrong.

2mil4dero+santo
04-24-2011, 11:19 AM
i fail to see how Tchani gets a yellow for leaving the field...i believe 6 or 7 TFC players left with him...either they all get a yellow or none of them do

I would love to have this call explained for that reason. The cautionable offense of leaving the field of play is usually reserved for instances like a substitution that the ref didn't authorize or if a player attempts to circumvent a rule or law by leaving the field of play.
Whats puzzling in this case is that other players left the field and were in the same location as Tchani. His shirt didn't come over his head and he didn't delay the game, so it must be for leaving the field. However, like you said other players left the field (players who weren't on a yellow).

Nothing about this call makes sense to me, and I'm usually the only one sticking up for the refs on this board.

TFCREDNWHITE
04-24-2011, 11:28 AM
Toledo has screwed us so many times!

Davenport
04-24-2011, 11:29 AM
I would love to have this call explained for that reason. The cautionable offense of leaving the field of play is usually reserved for instances like a substitution that the ref didn't authorize or if a player attempts to circumvent a rule or law by leaving the field of play.
Whats puzzling in this case is that other players left the field and were in the same location as Tchani. His shirt didn't come over his head and he didn't delay the game, so it must be for leaving the field. However, like you said other players left the field (players who weren't on a yellow).

Nothing about this call makes sense to me, and I'm usually the only one sticking up for the refs on this board.

You can't leave the field of play and get involved with the fans. You can leave the field and celebrate on the side lines, but as soon as a player goes up to the fans and starts hugging it's a yellow. All players around the world know it's a no-no.
It was a stupid thing to do and the fact he already had a yellow was just brainless.
Even Winter said so.

Alixir
04-24-2011, 11:32 AM
the way they pump this game up as a "rivalry"...I can't see how Tchani gets a yellow for his celebration. Its a rivalry...unless the ref says so. Rogers complains once that he was fouled when he kicked the ball out for a goal kick and the ref turns into his best friend calling fouls on TFC everytime a breeze knocks the wanker to the deck.
The ref pretty much dictated how this "rivalry" was played out.

2mil4dero+santo
04-24-2011, 11:43 AM
You can't leave the field of play and get involved with the fans. You can leave the field and celebrate on the side lines, but as soon as a player goes up to the fans and starts hugging it's a yellow. All players around the world know it's a no-no.
It was a stupid thing to do and the fact he already had a yellow was just brainless.
Even Winter said so.

I agree it was bad judgement on Tchani's part, when he's already on a yellow. Your point about players knowing its a no-no is what I have issue with. In some leagues its a no-no, it some leagues it isn't. Just like in South america you go in challenge with studs up - automatic yellow, even if there's no contact. Not the case in most western european leagues.
We've seen many instances this season of players leaving the field to celebrate that didn't get cautioned. Gordon hugged the fans, didn't get a yellow, that DC player that tried to open the car door etc etc..
I just think there should be a clear line communicated to the teams about what is acceptable and not acceptable. It's a grey area that needs to be cleared up. The shirts is black and white - if it comes over the head - yellow card. But celebrating goals by running to your supporters is not clear to anyone.

Alixir
04-24-2011, 11:51 AM
I just think there should be a clear line communicated to the teams about what is acceptable and not acceptable. It's a grey area that needs to be cleared up. The shirts is black and white - if it comes over the head - yellow card. But celebrating goals by running to your supporters is not clear to anyone.
exactly...take Jeff Cunningham for example...his trademark goal celebration used to be to run and jump into the supporters. How many cards did he ever recieve for that...not many, if any at all. Gordon jumps into the supporters...no card. Tchani jumps in and gets a card. Either the refs call it everytime or don't call it at all. A player jumps into the supporters section and its unsportsmanlike, but that Davis wanker taunts the home supporters and its not unsportsmanlike? Soon players won't be able to kiss their badge as its "unsportsmanlike"

Davenport
04-24-2011, 12:02 PM
I agree it was bad judgement on Tchani's part, when he's already on a yellow. Your point about players knowing its a no-no is what I have issue with. In some leagues its a no-no, it some leagues it isn't. Just like in South america you go in challenge with studs up - automatic yellow, even if there's no contact. Not the case in most western european leagues.
We've seen many instances this season of players leaving the field to celebrate that didn't get cautioned. Gordon hugged the fans, didn't get a yellow, that DC player that tried to open the car door etc etc..
I just think there should be a clear line communicated to the teams about what is acceptable and not acceptable. It's a grey area that needs to be cleared up. The shirts is black and white - if it comes over the head - yellow card. But celebrating goals by running to your supporters is not clear to anyone.

In all the games I've seen whenever a player gets involved with fans it's a yellow. Delay of game, unsporting, whatever you want to call it.
e.g. You're 1 up and they equalise in injury time and their players want to go and hug their fans. Fukc that, you want to get the game started right away and so does the ref.
That's the prime example but it applies anytime a goal is scored.
In this case Tchani had just got booked. You don't give the ref (especially this one who was a disgrace) any possible reason to think about giving you a yellow. A very poor decision by the young Cameroonian.
Your comment on the shirt thing is right...Cohen just got one at Bolton and even though it was very sad, the ref made the right decision.

Parkdale
04-24-2011, 12:07 PM
The on field product, isnt just our team, its the MLS too. We're paying to watch TFC play MLS games, and if MLS is a crap product then TFC cant be anything but.


I've seen some very decent MLS games. The problem is that TFC is rarely in them! We've always been sub-par, even based on the standard of the MLS being a mediocre league.

Sure the overall standard of MLS play is much lower than many other leagues, but when TFC can't even seem to play at the standard of the league.... we'll the blame should rest on the shoulder of our club.

IF we were doing well in this league, even by a simple measurable result like making the playoffs, then we would be in a better position to talk about the overall quality of the league.

If the world of Football is like hamburgers, then the MLS is a crappy fast food chain, but TFC isn't even their best burger. We're on the kids menu at whitecastle.

ExiledRed
04-24-2011, 12:17 PM
IF we were doing well in this league, even by a simple measurable result like making the playoffs, then we would be in a better position to talk about the overall quality of the league.


This is part of my point. Referees have cost us more points in the last few seasons than any patch of missed sitters.

If its true that half of the missed sitters in season 2 and 3 would have taken us to the playoffs, it must also be true that the fair goals disallowed, unfair ejections, non calls, non penalties, unfair penalties, imbalance of cards and calls against etc..... have equally contributed to preventing that playoff run that you're referring too.

Parkdale
04-24-2011, 12:28 PM
This is part of my point. Referees have cost us more points in the last few seasons than any patch of missed sitters.

If its true that half of the missed sitters in season 2 and 3 would have taken us to the playoffs, it must also be true that the fair goals disallowed, unfair ejections, non calls, non penalties, unfair penalties, imbalance of cards and calls against etc..... have equally contributed to preventing that playoff run that you're referring too.


yes, but doesn't the shitty officiating effect all teams equally? We only make note of the bad calls against us, but in truth, there are bad calls that help us as well.

If our team has to play without cleats, then it's unfair, but if every team in the league has to play barefoot (and on gravel) then it's shitty - BUT equally so.

I just don't believe that the shit officials are more shit for us than for everyone else. Sure there are some people like Toledo who seem to hate us, but there are probably comparable relationships for every team out there.



so let's say that the refs are equally shit across the board - we are still playing sub par compared to the rest of the teams who deal with the same shit.

Nerepis
04-24-2011, 12:41 PM
In all the games I've seen whenever a player gets involved with fans it's a yellow. Delay of game, unsporting, whatever you want to call it.
e.g. You're 1 up and they equalise in injury time and their players want to go and hug their fans. Fukc that, you want to get the game started right away and so does the ref.
That's the prime example but it applies anytime a goal is scored.
In this case Tchani had just got booked. You don't give the ref (especially this one who was a disgrace) any possible reason to think about giving you a yellow. A very poor decision by the young Cameroonian.
Your comment on the shirt thing is right...Cohen just got one at Bolton and even though it was very sad, the ref made the right decision.

Not trolling just an aside, I watched that game online with a German feed and didn't get the back story. Was the picture on his T-shirt a dead friend or something?

Detroit_TFC
04-24-2011, 12:47 PM
^ His father, who died in a motorcycle accident earlier in the season.

Kooper
04-24-2011, 12:52 PM
Whether it was the right call or not. We suffer from a huge imbalance of calls against, and there are many non calls that should have been made, that are gamechanging. Our players are afforded little protection to the point that it almost seems like the other teams have a license to foul our players. Good home goals get disallowed and I cant ever think of a time that we got given a goal which shouldnt have counted. We get penalties against for farting in the box, but their players could chop our players head off with a machete and the ref would wave it on.

No we don't suffer from more bad calls, the league has bad refs and they affect all teams more or less equally. Read the other supporters groups boards, they are all whining about the same things. We just remember every bad call against us and forget the bad calls in our favour.

ensco
04-24-2011, 12:53 PM
I hope the ref imbalance is just one of those things, but I have to say, it does not seem like we get points because of the refs nearly as often as we give them up.

I think the question of MLS interest in the success or failure of TFC is worthy of its own thread. My own guess is that MLS were hugely committed to helping us early on, but have given up.

Early examples:

(i) look at the roster Mo got in our expansion draft, we got far more in there than subsequent expansion teams did in their expansion drafts
(ii)we have had real attempts by the league to fix problems related to the limited number of decent Canadians available

But I believe the MLS league office have become just as disenchanted with MLSE as the rest of us have, and have moved on - there's only so many hours in the day.

Nerepis
04-24-2011, 12:54 PM
^ His father, who died in a motorcycle accident earlier in the season.

Thanks, I thought it was something like that. It was a touching moment.

I cried too, but I'm a Gunner fan and it was for different reasons.

LesH
04-24-2011, 01:00 PM
they get paid around 200-500 for ref a game, who outside of N.A. would come to earn that kind of wage?

also refs are assigned by USSF and CSA

they want to minimize travel cost as well

at last, there are like 3 full time ref including toledo everyone else is just part timers


Holy cow, are you sure about this????
I know and I consider that MLS is still a Mickey Mouse league, but the officials are not professionals? I had no idea about this.. :facepalm:

Beach_Red
04-24-2011, 01:05 PM
I hope the ref imbalance is just one of those things, but I have to say, it does not seem like we get points because of the refs nearly as often as we give them up.

I think the question of MLS interest in the success or failure of TFC is worthy of its own thread. My own guess is that MLS were hugely committed to helping us early on, but have given up.

Early examples:

(i) look at the roster Mo got in our expansion draft, we got far more in there than subsequent expansion teams did in their expansion drafts
(ii)we have had real attempts by the league to fix problems related to the limited number of decent Canadians available

But I believe the MLS league office have become just as disenchanted with MLSE as the rest of us have, and have moved on - there's only so many hours in the day.

Yeah, I agree, there could be a thread in this.

Did MLSE do enough in the first three seasons to justify a comittment by MLS? Especially when other teams came along that seemed a lot more committed.

2mil4dero+santo
04-24-2011, 01:22 PM
Holy cow, are you sure about this????
I know and I consider that MLS is still a Mickey Mouse league, but the officials are not professionals? I had no idea about this.. :facepalm:

They are professional... but not full time. I don't think (someone correct me if I'm wrong) there are any leagues now that employ full time officials. They tried in Germany, but I beleive it didn't work.

There is good reasons for this and I won't bore you with the details you can research it, but basically employing officials full time actually decreased their performance because of incentives.

CretanBull
04-24-2011, 01:30 PM
Holy cow, are you sure about this????


Yes, only 3 full time professional refs on the MLS payroll for the entire league - and one of them is the useless twat Baldomero Toledo. The rest are part-timers. The 3 pros that they do have were only hired last season (or two seasons ago?) before that they were all part-timers.

rocker
04-24-2011, 01:31 PM
employing officials full time actually decreased their performance because of incentives.

how was performance judged?

bore me with the details. I find it interesting.

Oldtimer
04-24-2011, 01:32 PM
It's true, at least of last year, that only 3 officials are full-time.

It's a poor reflection on MLS that of the 3 full-time officials, one of them is Toledo.

habstfc
04-24-2011, 01:46 PM
Most people think a referee's job is to enforce every rule in the rulebook and that's simply not the case, it's more about game management. With the exception of baseball every sport allows it's referee's and umpires to interpret the rules as they see fit in the context of the game at any given moment. That's why you don't see a holding call in football or a penalty in hockey every play, even though according to the rules one could be given out. In the context of the game yesterday the referee should have let it slide and warned him that it was a bookable offense. I think part of the problem is that referee's come to bmo and say to themselves that they won't be intimidated by the crowd and that's when they make shitty calls.

If there is a sport that needs 2 ref's it's soccer.

2mil4dero+santo
04-24-2011, 01:58 PM
how was performance judged?

bore me with the details. I find it interesting.

You'll have to forgive me. I used to be heavily involved and knowledgable, but I've spent the last few years on my masters (engineering) plus three kids, I've fallen behind on whats going on in the soccer world.

I remember when they did it in germany and the consensus after a few years was it didn't work. However, your right it looks lke now fifa is going back to full-time officials and mls in fact has three full time referees (not sure about assistants).

Some of the arguments against were that match fixing was more prominent with full time officials. In that they are already on the pay-roll, they don't have to worry about not getting assignments due to poor performance.

For instance... if you are full time making $50,000 a year and some guy calls from Hong Kong offering $10,000 to make sure the result goes a certain way, what are you gonna do? You call a dubious penalty, you don't get picked for the final for that $6000 extra. You're still ahead. However, if you're a part time you do the same thing, your season is over in terms of asignments and its not worth it. Although this has been debated back and forth.

Secondly, it deters officials who have high paying jobs. If ur a doctor or engineer making 200K a year and the league will only use full time referees, are you gonna quit your high paying job to referee?

Like I said, it looks like they're going back to full time officials now, but I have to ask you guys, do you think Vaughan and Toledo are the best referees in the league? because they're full time. This proves my point...

2mil4dero+santo
04-24-2011, 02:01 PM
Most people think a referee's job is to enforce every rule in the rulebook and that's simply not the case, it's more about game management. With the exception of baseball every sport allows it's referee's and umpires to interpret the rules as they see fit in the context of the game at any given moment. That's why you don't see a holding call in football or a penalty in hockey every play, even though according to the rules one could be given out. In the context of the game yesterday the referee should have let it slide and warned him that it was a bookable offense. I think part of the problem is that referee's come to bmo and say to themselves that they won't be intimidated by the crowd and that's when they make shitty calls.

If there is a sport that needs 2 ref's it's soccer.

absolutely.... btw anyone know what happened to the goal-line officials. Also the spray that was used at the beginning of the mls season? They both seemed like good ideas to me...

habstfc
04-24-2011, 02:03 PM
absolutely.... btw anyone know what happened to the goal-line officials. Also the spray that was used at the beginning of the mls season? They both seemed like good ideas to me...

I don't know about the goal line officials but the spray was used yesterday.

Alixir
04-24-2011, 02:03 PM
I think part of the problem is that referee's come to bmo and say to themselves that they won't be intimidated by the crowd and that's when they make shitty calls.

If there is a sport that needs 2 ref's it's soccer. My opinion about yesterdays ref was that since he is Canadian and it was his first MLS game that he did not want to come off looking biased so he called everything against TFC he could...and he did.

cmonyoureds
04-24-2011, 02:04 PM
Anybody else see a bunch of fans in the south end get kicked out at around the 70th minute?

interesting, anybody else see it?

2mil4dero+santo
04-24-2011, 02:20 PM
This is part of my point. Referees have cost us more points in the last few seasons than any patch of missed sitters.

If its true that half of the missed sitters in season 2 and 3 would have taken us to the playoffs, it must also be true that the fair goals disallowed, unfair ejections, non calls, non penalties, unfair penalties, imbalance of cards and calls against etc..... have equally contributed to preventing that playoff run that you're referring too.

if u think its just tfc... go here and watch the RSL winning goal in 93rd minute that shouldn't have been allowed. happens to every team, every league...

http://www.ussoccer.com/News/Referee-Programs/2011/04/Referee-Week-in-Review-Week-5.aspx

I think we should be more concerned about our team than the officials...

Alixir
04-24-2011, 02:25 PM
if u think its just tfc... go here and watch the RSL winning goal in 93rd minute that shouldn't have been allowed. happens to every team, every league...

http://www.ussoccer.com/News/Referee-Programs/2011/04/Referee-Week-in-Review-Week-5.aspx

I think we should be more concerned about our team than the officials...I don't know...although we have had a pretty lousy team since our birth...the MLS officials are the ones that make me bitch and swear the most. This league is almost unwatchable at times.

Yohan
04-24-2011, 02:26 PM
Liked the mix of possession based attacks, as well as mixing it up with long balls to stretch opposition defence. Esp with Gordon available to fight for the long balls.

Yohan
04-24-2011, 02:33 PM
Alan Gordon is getting to be pretty important to attack, just as much as Dichio was. Like that one touch pass off of JDG long ball to set Martina on a breakaway on 25min. I love a good target man striker

2mil4dero+santo
04-24-2011, 02:35 PM
Alan Gordon is getting to be pretty important to attack, just as much as Dichio was. Like that one touch pass off of JDG long ball to set Martina on a breakaway on 25min. I love a good target man striker

speaking of Alan Gordon, he should have been sent off against portland according to Michael Kennedy. Gotta say I agree with him. Just goes to show we remember the calls against us, but not the ones in our favour!

http://www.ussoccer.com/News/Referee-Programs/2011/04/2011-Referee-Week-in-Review-Week-2.aspx

Whoop
04-24-2011, 03:49 PM
NFL officials are also part timers.

When you're mainly a weekend league, most of your officials will be part-timers.

2mil4dero+santo
04-24-2011, 03:57 PM
NFL officials are also part timers.

When you're mainly a weekend league, most of your officials will be part-timers.

Thats interesting, I didn't know that. I guess that puts the "bush league" argument to rest.
Sorry to post another link, but for anyone whos interested, theres another clip from US soccer where Michael Kennedy explains a little bit about excessive celebrations.

http://www.ussoccer.com/News/Referee-Programs/2011/04/2011-Referee-Week-in-Review-Week-4.aspx

babone
04-24-2011, 04:04 PM
Could the league recind the second yellow?

Whoop
04-24-2011, 04:06 PM
I thought most football referees around the world were part-timers which is one of the reasons why they were always susceptible to bribery.

Like I said, when you're mainly working weekends, you're a part-timer. I figure once you get to be on UEFA's/FIFA's list where you work international or cup matches then you move from part-time to full-time.

Beach_Red
04-24-2011, 04:06 PM
NFL officials are also part timers.

When you're mainly a weekend league, most of your officials will be part-timers.

Yeah, but there's fifteen or twenty of them on the field at a time ;).

Whoop
04-24-2011, 04:10 PM
I'm not a big fan of adding more officials onto the field.

Though I would argue they should have some form of goal line technology though.

Roca
04-24-2011, 04:10 PM
Beside's Tchani's red, there was what looked to everyone in 110 like a stone-cold penalty we should have had in the first half (mind you, it was at the other end of the field). There were also a couple of tackles in the Columbus box in the second half that looked dodgy to say the least. I'd say it was absolutely the worst-refereed game I've seen at BMO Field, except that so many others have been so bad that it's hard to make the call.

bgnewf
04-24-2011, 09:11 PM
TFC v Columbus Video Blog

http://viewfromthesouthstands.com/2011/04/tfc-v-columbus-video-blog/

I take a look back at the TFC v Crew match in my post game video blog. COmments always welcome & appreciated.

spot-on
04-24-2011, 09:25 PM
http://farm6.static.flickr.com/5067/5651918330_1cd619bd6a_b.jpg

Auzzy
04-24-2011, 11:43 PM
In terms of officiating, consistency & all the rest: take a look at the replay of Tchani's first yellow card. There were about 4 Columbus subs outside of their technical area, on the field, and more or less involved with the altercation. Isn't that a red-card offence?

Fort York Redcoat
04-25-2011, 08:03 AM
Officiating was terrible for both teams but more chances building up were spoiled for us then for Columbus. We're lucky they couldn't execute better shots on goal or that would've been a much longer day for us.

Tchani sure made his first goal for us memorable. It's unfortunate since he may have been a difference in the end result if he had stayed on the pitch.

donnie_rpu
04-25-2011, 09:55 AM
I thought the call was garbage.
However, we aren't privy to the ref's instructions to the teams.
Its very possible that the ref told the teams before the game that he didn't want to see excessive celebrations.

All-in-all though, there were baffling calls both ways.

2mil4dero+santo
04-25-2011, 10:00 AM
In terms of officiating, consistency & all the rest: take a look at the replay of Tchani's first yellow card. There were about 4 Columbus subs outside of their technical area, on the field, and more or less involved with the altercation. Isn't that a red-card offence?

no, its not.

grizzle
04-25-2011, 10:29 AM
interesting, anybody else see it?

For a bit near the end it seemed like security was pulling out people one after another. I think one guy got tossed for throwing a beer, but a girl and another guy went but I don't really know what they did. Also there was a fight in 108-109 area and that guy got tossed.

ExiledRed
04-25-2011, 10:42 AM
if u think its just tfc... go here and watch the RSL winning goal in 93rd minute that shouldn't have been allowed. happens to every team, every league...

http://www.ussoccer.com/News/Referee-Programs/2011/04/Referee-Week-in-Review-Week-5.aspx

I think we should be more concerned about our team than the officials...

Im not going to do the research, but it has been done in past seasons, and invariably there is a huge imbalance of calls against us, to the calls for us. I seem to remember that the stats had us with the most calls against and fewest calls for, in the league. Maybe somebody can either confirm or refute this, like I said, I cant be bothered to do the research here, and I'm already sneaking time out of work to write this.

trane
04-25-2011, 10:48 AM
It's too bad. I think TFC played well enough to take 3 points today. That card, whether you felt it was deserved or not, was the difference in the game.


Agreed. I have to say in light of the fact that they let that DC fuck taunt are fans the week before, that they ended up kicking out our player due to celebrating with our fans, in our stadium, makes me like this leage and their refs just that much more. I think that is the game. Sure there are other issues, but we lost becuase we were down a man. Had they done something more the week before I would have not been so bitter, but this is ridicolous.

trane
04-25-2011, 10:50 AM
I am realy, realy bitter at MLS refs they are sub par and obiously biased.

2mil4dero+santo
04-25-2011, 11:19 AM
Im not going to do the research, but it has been done in past seasons, and invariably there is a huge imbalance of calls against us, to the calls for us. I seem to remember that the stats had us with the most calls against and fewest calls for, in the league. Maybe somebody can either confirm or refute this, like I said, I cant be bothered to do the research here, and I'm already sneaking time out of work to write this.

I'm not gonna disagree with you about some refs in this league not being exactly the greatest. But as far as the calls against us, one way to correct that is to hold onto the ball and not give it away so much. And to have defenders who are quicker and better on the ball. When you're constantly chasing the game, chasing the ball, you commit more fouls.

With the tactics and the the players we've employed over the last few seasons, even if we had premiership refs I think we would still have had a huge number of fouls against.

werewolf
04-25-2011, 12:48 PM
Why does TFC game in 6 mins spend 30 seconds on Tchani and his celebration and fails to show the bruhaha that led to his first yellow? I understand one was the red card, but its obivous why he was sent off (rightly or wrongly), but they don't show the first incident at all, just a few seconds of a bad camera angle.

2mil4dero+santo
04-26-2011, 10:18 AM
Why does TFC game in 6 mins spend 30 seconds on Tchani and his celebration and fails to show the bruhaha that led to his first yellow? I understand one was the red card, but its obivous why he was sent off (rightly or wrongly), but they don't show the first incident at all, just a few seconds of a bad camera angle.

Why? Because your making 2 assumptions:

1) They actually know the game well enough to understand important points in the game

2) They actually give a shit

I hope this helps.