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View Full Version : De Ro was he our best player ever?



trane
04-20-2011, 04:29 PM
I would think that like him or not, it shuold be almost universaly accepted that De Ro was all in all the best player, in terms of what he did with us and skill, that we have had.


Mind you I am very partial to Dichio, and I think JDG is our best player but has admitedly not deliverd fully YET.

But there has been so much negativity about De Ro, that sometime wonder if people lose sight of the fact of how much he contributed to the team. He was not without faults mind you. But overall he delivered the offense he was brought in to deliver.

kaos197O
04-20-2011, 04:34 PM
I would think that like him or not, it shuold be almost universaly accepted that De Ro was all in all the best player, in terms of what he did with us and skill, that we have had.


Mind you I am very partial to Dichio, and I think JDG is our best player but has not admitedly not deliverd fully YET.

But there has been so much negativity about De Ro, that sometime wonder if people lose sight of the fact of how much he contributed to the team. He was not without faults mind you. But overall he delivered the offense he was brought in to deliver.
Absolutely. Best player in TFC history both on and off the pitch!

v00d00daddy
04-20-2011, 04:53 PM
Short answer:

Yup. Talent wise for sure.

fiji_blue
04-20-2011, 04:54 PM
AGREE

Absolutely. Best player in TFC history both on and off the pitch!

razor787
04-20-2011, 04:56 PM
Jesus, the guy is gone and we are still making topics about him. How about we talk about OUR players, and not those of the past?

Roogsy
04-20-2011, 04:57 PM
And yet you posted. :lol:

razor787
04-20-2011, 04:58 PM
And yet you posted. :lol:

oh the irony haha

werewolf
04-20-2011, 04:59 PM
DeRo had lots of talent, and lots of heart. Something that can't be said about the players we currently have.

Red CB Toronto
04-20-2011, 05:01 PM
DeRo was the best player the Reds have had so far, no question about it. Really looking forward to what may be his return to BMO Field when Canada take on Ecuador on June 1.

Whoop
04-20-2011, 05:01 PM
Nah... Andy Welsh.

:leaving:

Nodoubtguy
04-20-2011, 05:11 PM
Nah... Andy Welsh.

:leaving:

what?? Lombardo!!!

but seriously....I think DeRo was the best ever player to wear a TFC jersey by far. JDG has it in him to be amazing, but as has been said.....he has not shown it yet.

Oldtimer
04-20-2011, 05:14 PM
Best individual player. If soccer was an individual sport, he'd be tops.

TFCRegina
04-20-2011, 05:28 PM
He was the worst trade we ever made, and the best player ever to wear the TFC jersey.

But I think my feelings are very well known on this topic.

Pachuco
04-20-2011, 05:41 PM
By far. It's not even close.

Roogsy
04-20-2011, 05:45 PM
Where's the poll? :lol:

I don't think I need to answer this question. It's pretty obvious. This was the straw that broke the camel's back for me with this team and a big part of why I am so pissed off at them. They ruined what should have been a glorious return home for one of Canada's best players ever and one of MLS's most decorated players. A player that should have been brought in as a final piece of a team ready to take the next step to success and instead he found himself in the middle of a clusterfuck of an organization. I almost wish he hadn't come at all.

Cashcleaner
04-20-2011, 05:47 PM
DeRo was the best player to don a TFC jersey in it's short history. His record more than speaks for itself. A friend of mine mentioned that over the time he was here, DeRo either scored or assisted just under half the goals we earned in league play.

I can think of three people just off the top of my head who agree with Roogsy and have severely scaled-back their support of the team. Not because they had put DeRo on some sort of pedestal, but because trading him to New York basically proved (in their minds) that this club has absolutely no idea how to build a winning team and will allow petty contract squabbles to trump the overall quality of the roster.

Bars92
04-20-2011, 05:48 PM
Ronnie O'Brien was simply the best.

Waggy
04-20-2011, 05:51 PM
Clearly the best. Though the more interesting question is who is 2nd.

But the worst trade we've ever made? I have a feeling the package we got for Dero may wind up being looked at as the best trade we've ever made. The worst by FAR is Cronin. That might have been the single worst trade I've ever seen a team make in any sport, ever. Outside of the whole "Brad Boyes, Alan Mcauley and 2 picks for Owen Nolan" disaster anyways.

Suds
04-20-2011, 06:00 PM
Yes, to date no other player has played better for TFC than DeRo.

THA BUTCHA
04-20-2011, 06:15 PM
They should take Brennan down and put Dero on the wall of honor instead.

Nuvinho
04-20-2011, 06:49 PM
Adam Braz

LittleOzzy
04-20-2011, 07:08 PM
The wall of honor is pointless knowing De Ro won't make it. Teams like the Raptors have been around for years without retiring a number or honoring a player, why TFC thought they should do it in the first five years is beyond me.

rocker
04-20-2011, 07:12 PM
Clearly the best player.
But as Jason Kreis says "the team is the star."
So the fact that he was the best player we ever had means essentially nothing.

Doucet3
04-20-2011, 07:17 PM
hahaah this thread has turned into a shit show, but my answer is skill wise yea even though he did it mostly alone lol, and off the pitch he was pretty good to good with the media n what not, which he could have retired with us but oh well when greed comes in people will push there own moms down for a quick buck i guess lol

torontocelt
04-20-2011, 07:21 PM
By far the best, DeGuzman getting DP money really bugs me when he is not in the same class as DeRo was in a TFC shirt.

Brooker
04-20-2011, 07:24 PM
Adam Braz

With honorable mention going to Joey Melo, Marco Reda & Rick Titus.

Couchy81
04-20-2011, 07:32 PM
The wall of honor is pointless knowing De Ro won't make it. Teams like the Raptors have been around for years without retiring a number or honoring a player, why TFC thought they should do it in the first five years is beyond me.

The wall of honor definitely wasn't well thought out. We honour Dichio every game in song, he doesn't need to be up there, and Brennan? Comon.

Back on topic, Dero is by far the best player TFC has had in it's short history.

Gazza
04-20-2011, 07:33 PM
Clearly the best player.
But as Jason Kreis says "the team is the star."
So the fact that he was the best player we ever had means essentially nothing.

Essentially it means he's the best player we've ever had. Which is the thread topic question.

Belfast_Boy
04-20-2011, 07:40 PM
yes and it'll be a long time before anyone can fill those shoes.

JDG is good at his job (and that's what TFC is to him) but he'll never be a DeRo!

denime
04-20-2011, 08:21 PM
Best individual player. If soccer was an individual sport, he'd be tops.

This

rocker
04-20-2011, 08:33 PM
Essentially it means he's the best player we've ever had. Which is the thread topic question.

Which is exactly what I said.

Dreadlocks
04-20-2011, 08:53 PM
The best ever for TFC hands down and one of the all-time greatest the MLS has ever seen.

TFCwestcan
04-20-2011, 11:08 PM
Jesus, the guy is gone and we are still making topics about him. How about we talk about OUR players, and not those of the past?

Ditto!

Roogsy
04-21-2011, 12:14 AM
Ditto!


Nobody is stopping you from starting up a thread about any player.

Roogsy
04-21-2011, 12:15 AM
This

Yeah too bad he's never won anything to prove that he is a team player huh? :lol:

GBV
04-21-2011, 12:15 AM
No question.

ExiledRed
04-21-2011, 12:47 AM
Statistically he was our best player.

Where Im from, good players that fuck off to rival teams for more money dont get too much respect.

Can someone instead tell me why Labrocca got the shit booed out of him a couple of weeks ago? that guy wasnt brilliant but he was a positive player and never put a foot wrong with the fans or his media appearances.

DeRo should expect a fair amount of it, but Labrocca?

Toronto Gunner
04-21-2011, 06:54 AM
DeRo was hands down our best player.

Menelaos
04-21-2011, 07:08 AM
Mista anyone?

Clearly DeRo has been the best.
Anyone here stating should be put down for sheer stupidity.

Brooker
04-21-2011, 07:14 AM
He's gone and he's part of the shit. Or are we cheering for the redbulls now?

Menelaos
04-21-2011, 07:21 AM
He's gone and he's part of the shit. Or are we cheering for the redbulls now?

This is fucked! lol!

Wait so recognizing a player as having been the best to wear our kit is wrong because that player no longer plays here? Here I thought that when chosing a "best ever" one tends to look back at everyone who has at one point played for your team.

I am however curious to know how you made the leap from "I think DeRo was the best FC player" to "I now cheer for the Red Bulls".

Fascinating how there are some get turned on so much when they trash DeRo, that they can't have a positive thread go without voicing their over-stated opinion against the man.

He is, to this date, the best single player that has played for Toronto. That is certainly a fact. A fact that may change in time when/if a better player comes along. Until then, gone or not, like him or not, he is our best player ever.

That is what this thread was about right? Or does the above state I am a Red Bulls fan now?

Jamaicanadian
04-21-2011, 07:25 AM
The best ever for TFC hands down and one of the all-time greatest the MLS has ever seen.

I'm wid the dread on this one...trust me!

menefreghista
04-21-2011, 07:38 AM
Statistically he was our best player.

Where Im from, good players that fuck off to rival teams for more money dont get too much respect.

Can someone instead tell me why Labrocca got the shit booed out of him a couple of weeks ago? that guy wasnt brilliant but he was a positive player and never put a foot wrong with the fans or his media appearances.

DeRo should expect a fair amount of it, but Labrocca?

Supposedly Labrocca wanted out.

/just saying....

Wull
04-21-2011, 07:43 AM
Can someone instead tell me why Labrocca got the shit booed out of him a couple of weeks ago? that guy wasnt brilliant but he was a positive player and never put a foot wrong with the fans or his media appearances.

DeRo should expect a fair amount of it, but Labrocca?

this bugged the shit out of me too. Always showed up, always put in a shift, always one of the first to acknowledge us win or lose and he got shit on for being traded. One of the few times I've actually been disgusted with our behaviour.


And yes, DeRo was our best player by a country mile

drexel10
04-21-2011, 08:08 AM
In my eyes Amado has been the best player to put on a TFC shirt. DeRo had a little more production for us, but Amado has been the best we have had.

__wowza
04-21-2011, 08:32 AM
I HEARD WE WERE TALKING ABOUT BEST EVER TFC PLAYER SO IM JUST GOING TO LEAVE THIS HERE..

http://storage.canoe.ca/v1/dynamic_resize/sws_path/suns-prod-images/1302508179162_ORIGINAL.jpg?size=650x

trane
04-21-2011, 09:10 AM
Statistically he was our best player.

Where Im from, good players that fuck off to rival teams for more money dont get too much respect.

Can someone instead tell me why Labrocca got the shit booed out of him a couple of weeks ago? that guy wasnt brilliant but he was a positive player and never put a foot wrong with the fans or his media appearances.

DeRo should expect a fair amount of it, but Labrocca?


I was going to ask, this, how do people think De Ro should be received by us when he comes back with the Red Bulls?

Roogsy
04-21-2011, 09:15 AM
I HEARD WE WERE TALKING ABOUT BEST EVER TFC PLAYER SO IM JUST GOING TO LEAVE THIS HERE..

http://storage.canoe.ca/v1/dynamic_resize/sws_path/suns-prod-images/1302508179162_ORIGINAL.jpg?size=650x


:lol:

Thanks for the morning laugh.

Can you believe the kid was pulling down 6 figures???

trane
04-21-2011, 09:18 AM
He's gone and he's part of the shit. Or are we cheering for the redbulls now?

What???? I was not even particullalry upset when he was traded, as I realized that this is a year of change and growth, and sometimes big changes have to be made.

So now that he is gone, we are to pretend that he was a shit player for us????

trane
04-21-2011, 09:25 AM
:lol:

Thanks for the morning laugh.

Can you believe the kid was pulling down 6 figures???

To be honest the moment I saw this kid, I thought he would never make it as a striker. For one, he was so skinny, that a good CB could just knock him of the ball with a shoulder. Pace is good, but it is not enough in this game.

Gazza
04-21-2011, 09:29 AM
Best individual player. If soccer was an individual sport, he'd be tops.

His me first attitude ruined any chance of San Jose and Houston winning anything...oh wait...

ManUtd4ever
04-21-2011, 09:36 AM
DeRo was the best game breaker in TFC history. Guevara was probably the most skilled player in TFC history, although his effort on the pitch wasn't as consistent as DeRo.

Roogsy
04-21-2011, 09:46 AM
DeRo was the best game breaker in TFC history. Guevara was probably the most skilled player in TFC history, although his effort on the pitch wasn't as consistent as DeRo.


Interestingly enough, if we're going with the most "skilled" player, we'd have to include Mista in there! :lol:

Gazza
04-21-2011, 09:56 AM
Poor Mista. Off topic, both Mista and JDG had to leave La Liga and come to Toronto in order to be discredited as footballers.

I always knew La Liga was overrated. MLS standards can humble just about any player. Not De Ro, of course.

Shep
04-21-2011, 10:01 AM
Clearly the best. Though the more interesting question is who is 2nd. ..

Frei

sully
04-21-2011, 10:07 AM
Being able to work as a team player is a key consideration to answer the question so, was he our best player - no. Overall, I think Dichio was.

SteeltownBhoy
04-21-2011, 10:08 AM
This thread reminds me on someone dating the hot chick in High School then loosing her to the star quarterback. It was never meant to be, take her picture out of your wallet...move on!!!!

Wull
04-21-2011, 10:12 AM
I was going to ask, this, how do people think De Ro should be received by us when he comes back with the Red Bulls?

Based on Labrocca he should be booed off the park. Based on Robbo he should get a standing ovation. I can't figure us out half the time!! I'll leave it to the moment to decide personally how to react because I can't discredit his contributions but I can't abide the shitstorms he was involved in either

jabbronies
04-21-2011, 10:14 AM
Best Ever player? yup. Cant argue against it.

Dichio was "Best Leader".

Cunningham was "Best person to shit on"

Frei is "Best Goalie"

Mista is "Best way to waste DP money"

I think the only one that is in question is the "Best person to forget was on our team". too many to choose.

Gazza
04-21-2011, 10:19 AM
:lol:

Thanks for the morning laugh.

Can you believe the kid was pulling down 6 figures???

He was pulling down 6 figures?? I sure hope he was helping Attakora and Gargan pay their rent at least. Or at least getting them drunk every saturday night.

What a waste of money.

RedsYNWA
04-21-2011, 10:21 AM
AMADO GUEVARA was an overall better player in the MLS and for his nation, Dero was a tad better for TFC

Yohan
04-21-2011, 10:24 AM
He was pulling down 6 figures?? I sure hope he was helping Attakora and Gargan pay their rent at least. Or at least getting them drunk every saturday night.

What a waste of money.
He forgot to mention that Ibby was a GA player

AmherstNY_TFC
04-21-2011, 10:34 AM
Given that the team has been a losing team so far, isn't this like giving an award to the skinniest kid at fat camp?

David_Oliveira
04-21-2011, 10:37 AM
Two Words.. ANDY WELSH!!

P-NUTZ
04-21-2011, 10:46 AM
Dero is the best to date - but considering the massive retarded mess this franchise has been in its short 5 years, such recognition means very little to me now and I would sooner put dero on my very long tfc "forget list".
:drinking:

AL-MO
04-21-2011, 12:26 PM
Simply answer, YES.

Roogsy
04-21-2011, 12:33 PM
He forgot to mention that Ibby was a GA player


I didn't forget at all. I wasn't making a comment on his cap hit, only on the kind of income he was making as a kid with underwhelming prospects as a footballer.

Roogsy
04-21-2011, 12:35 PM
This thread reminds me on someone dating the hot chick in High School then loosing her to the star quarterback. It was never meant to be, take her picture out of your wallet...move on!!!!


:lol:

Great metaphor.

Of course, some guys will claim that they dumped her because they never wanted her in the first place. Suuuuuuure...

Roogsy
04-21-2011, 12:36 PM
Being able to work as a team player is a key consideration to answer the question so, was he our best player - no. Overall, I think Dichio was.


Interesting way to look at it. Of course, what exactly was it that made Dichio a better team player? What statistic reflects this fact?

Yohan
04-21-2011, 01:07 PM
I didn't forget at all. I wasn't making a comment on his cap hit, only on the kind of income he was making as a kid with underwhelming prospects as a footballer.
he was signed as GA at age 16 because he was considered one of the top US prospects at the time

Roogsy
04-21-2011, 01:08 PM
he was signed as GA at age 16 because he was considered one of the top US prospects at the time


I know...still incredible he was making over 100Gs...and some of our more useful players weren't making half of that.

Nicholas982
04-21-2011, 01:23 PM
A whoooooole lot of people in this thread trying out for the role of Captain Obvious. :D


He's the best player we've had, so far. Hopefully this summer the transfer window will yield our new best player yet, and bump Darren DeRossius (?) to second place.

trane
04-21-2011, 01:41 PM
^ That was the point, I think it should be obvious, and yet there is so much on conraversy.

I am not a De Ro fan as such, I am a TFC and CNMT supporter, and I appreciate what he has done for both. But as much as I prefer other players over him, on a personal style preference, I find it strange that people are so reluctant to aknowledge his cotntribution. I do not give a shit what he does with the Red Bull, but do hope he contributes the CNMT, and I think that alot of the critizism of him as a team player is more then valid. However, his overall ability and contribution seems obvious to me... and yet

Nicholas982
04-21-2011, 01:47 PM
^ That was the point, I think it should be obvious, and yet there is so much on conraversy.

I am not a De Ro fan as such, I am a TFC and CNMT supporter, and I appreciate what he has done for both. But as much as I prefer other players over him, on a personal style preference, I find it strange that people are so reluctant to aknowledge his cotntribution. I do not give a shit what he does with the Red Bull, but do hope he contributes the CNMT, and I think that alot of the critizism of him as a team player is more then valid. However, his overall ability and contribution seems obvious to me... and yet


That's because he handled himself like such a classless moron when it came to his contract situation. It says a lot that the only player we've ever had that can actually score, had built up so much enmity between himself and the club's supporters. He practically ran himself out of town, FFS.

Hopefully we can have enough success this season so that we can bury this tiresome topic once and for all. :scarf:

P-NUTZ
04-21-2011, 01:52 PM
Simply answer, YES.



no..

69Chevy396
04-21-2011, 03:48 PM
Poor Mista. Off topic, both Mista and JDG had to leave La Liga and come to Toronto in order to be discredited as footballers.

I always knew La Liga was overrated. MLS standards can humble just about any player. Not De Ro, of course.

La Liga is the best league in the world. DeRo wouldn't land a job there as a grounds keeper..

ExiledRed
04-21-2011, 04:13 PM
Better question, how soon can we expect a player to better DeRo's record?

Or to stop beating around the bush....

When can we expect a replacement of DeRo's calibre, and this time is it possible to find someone with a desire to help build this club's reputation and win shit?

We need a DeRo, with the attitude of Dichio, or alternatively, someone like RSL's Morales who likes the challenge of being the underdog and fighting to the top, and is willing to put his personal ego aside to help achieve that.

I just dont think attitude and ego are ever factored into our signings, and its hurting us. Reading about RSL just now made it clear that for the best team in the MLS, ego and attitude are the first things they look at, when signing players.

no1redsfan
04-21-2011, 04:19 PM
This is absurb.

Now the club will have to spend all it's time and energy to come up with the next DeRo. Why couldn't we just keep the one we had and make him
happy? I will tell you why. It's all about ego and upper management trying
to pad their own ego and show everyone that it's all about them and that the players are just a interchangeable commodity.

People have got to realize that the DeRo situation was just the tip of the
iceberg. There was Carver, Robinson, Cann and the list could go on and on. While other teams are focused on their next opponent, the only battle
that's apparent in this organization is the one between players and management.

I regret ever spending one red cent on this sorry excuse for a franchise,
and laugh myself silly at all the supporters who are spending their hard earned dollars just to stroke the egos of the upper management.

You can play musical chairs with coaches and players all you want but
nothing will ever change with this team until there's an attitude adjustment with the brass or their out and out removal. You can see just how much players care about this team by the way they come out for every game. That's the biggest hint. No get-up-and-go. Complete apathy.

IMO, supporter = idiot, and the sooner they realize this, the better.

Whoop
04-21-2011, 04:21 PM
Better question, how soon can we expect a player to better DeRo's record?

Or to stop beating around the bush....

When can we expect a replacement of DeRo's calibre, and this time is it possible to find someone with a desire to help build this club's reputation and win shit?

We need a DeRo, with the attitude of Dichio, or alternatively, someone like RSL's Morales who likes the challenge of being the underdog and fighting to the top, and is willing to put his personal ego aside to help achieve that.

I just dont think attitude and ego are ever factored into our signings, and its hurting us. Reading about RSL just now made it clear that for the best team in the MLS, ego and attitude are the first things they look at, when signing players.

A lot of people call it character.

That requires a lot of work in order to determine one's character. Background checks, talking to teammates, former teammates, coaches, trainers, etc.

Though I've always been a proponent of you can tell a player's character by the way he plays on the pitch/field/ice, at least a big part of a player's character. That's what David Checketts saw in Jason Kreis.

But you do that necessary homework you will find if a player has warts or not. If he does have warts, why? What was the situation? Is he a bad apple? Or is he perceived to be a bad apple?

It takes more than just looking at film or taking the advice of some bird dog in Timbuktu.

RedsYNWA
04-21-2011, 04:43 PM
This is absurb.

Now the club will have to spend all it's time and energy to come up with the next DeRo. Why couldn't we just keep the one we had and make him
happy? I will tell you why. It's all about ego and upper management trying
to pad their own ego and show everyone that it's all about them and that the players are just a interchangeable commodity.

People have got to realize that the DeRo situation was just the tip of the
iceberg. There was Carver, Robinson, Cann and the list could go on and on. While other teams are focused on their next opponent, the only battle
that's apparent in this organization is the one between players and management.

I regret ever spending one red cent on this sorry excuse for a franchise,
and laugh myself silly at all the supporters who are spending their hard earned dollars just to stroke the egos of the upper management.

You can play musical chairs with coaches and players all you want but
nothing will ever change with this team until there's an attitude adjustment with the brass or their out and out removal. You can see just how much players care about this team by the way they come out for every game. That's the biggest hint. No get-up-and-go. Complete apathy.

IMO, supporter = idiot, and the sooner they realize this, the better.

I guess you are not a #1 reds fan are you :p

AL-MO
04-21-2011, 05:10 PM
no..

So who was then?

BakaGaijin
04-21-2011, 05:15 PM
There are three people ahead of Dero on this list that would qualify.........

1Jaime Moreno (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jaime_Moreno)133
2Jeff Cunningham (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jeff_Cunningham)132
3Ante Razov (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ante_Razov)114
4Jason Kreis (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jason_Kreis)108
5Landon Donovan (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Landon_Donovan)103
6Taylor Twellman (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Taylor_Twellman)101
7Edson Buddle (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Edson_Buddle)90
8Roy Lassiter (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Roy_Lassiter)88
9Carlos Ruiz (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Carlos_Ruiz_(Guatemalan_footballer))84
10Raúl Díaz Arce (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ra%C3%BAl_D%C3%ADaz_Arce)82

I am just saying.............Lol.

ha ha ha.

Gazza
04-21-2011, 05:17 PM
Interesting way to look at it. Of course, what exactly was it that made Dichio a better team player? What statistic reflects this fact?

Exactly. And what was it about De Ro (on the field) that made him not a team player? His assists? His 3 championships? Playoff MVP trophies?

Gazza
04-21-2011, 05:21 PM
That's because he handled himself like such a classless moron when it came to his contract situation. It says a lot that the only player we've ever had that can actually score, had built up so much enmity between himself and the club's supporters. He practically ran himself out of town, FFS.

Hopefully we can have enough success this season so that we can bury this tiresome topic once and for all. :scarf:

I'm sure that most of the club's supporters can differentiate between the problems he had with the FO and his desire to win here for the team and the supporters.

Some are still bitter and can't seem to separate the two.

Shakes McQueen
04-21-2011, 06:18 PM
I suppose it depends on your definition of "best". In terms of performance while specifically with our team, there's no doubt that DeRo was our best offensive player.

We also, in terms of pure fact, went furthest as a team while he was wearing the captain's armband - we made it to the CCL, won the NCC, and even beat Cruz Azul. What amount of that you attribute to DeRo's talent, or his leadership, versus other factors, is up to the individual.

"Best" means different things to different people. Guevara probably had more pure skill. JDG has a much higher pedigree. Dichio stirred more emotion from the fans.

- Scott

Damien
04-21-2011, 06:42 PM
Guevara > DeRo

Blazer
04-21-2011, 06:47 PM
I would think that like him or not, it shuold be almost universaly accepted that De Ro was all in all the best player, in terms of what he did with us and skill, that we have had.


Mind you I am very partial to Dichio, and I think JDG is our best player but has admitedly not deliverd fully YET.

But there has been so much negativity about De Ro, that sometime wonder if people lose sight of the fact of how much he contributed to the team. He was not without faults mind you. But overall he delivered the offense he was brought in to deliver.

If he is our best player “ever”, it isn’t saying much.

JDG isn’t our best player currently nor would I say he has been for any more than a game or two consecutively in the past. To me, he’s either done or he’s just not getting the MLS game. Whichever it is, he’s ineffective and detrimental at this point.

Frei is currently our best player - head and shoulders above all others.

Nicholas982
04-21-2011, 07:30 PM
I'm sure that most of the club's supporters can differentiate between the problems he had with the FO and his desire to win here for the team and the supporters.

Some are still bitter and can't seem to separate the two.

Well, sure. He stayed classy to the end when it came to his interactions with the SG's and the fanbase as a whole. To me, it seemed as if he was angrier at the FO than the management, seeing as how a change in management failed to change anything. Of course, money would have solved everything, but.......

Ah well. We're all beating a dead horse. Let's talk about how we have one win in six games instead. :facepalm:

TFC USA
04-21-2011, 07:37 PM
Yes.

It's not his fault the team is/was shit.

torontocelt
04-21-2011, 07:56 PM
Yes.

It's not his fault the team is/was shit.

Pretty much bang on the mark. Imagine how your heart would drop when you learned you were being partnered with OBW and you would have Ibby 'supplying' you from the wing, that is enough to make a grown man cry.

brad
04-21-2011, 08:37 PM
Interestingly enough, if we're going with the most "skilled" player, we'd have to include Mista in there! :lol:

And Robert.

Roogsy
04-21-2011, 10:22 PM
Exactly. And what was it about De Ro (on the field) that made him not a team player? His assists? His 3 championships? Playoff MVP trophies?


4 championships.

As well as having top assists in the league in one of his most successful year.

TFCRegina
04-21-2011, 10:25 PM
4 championships.

As well as having top assists in the league in one of his most successful year.

And being the guy who got TFC a grass pitch. :flare:

Roogsy
04-21-2011, 10:31 PM
In NY right now, he is making an impact. While not on the scoresheet yet, he is drawing defenders away and opening space for Henry, Rodgers, Agudelo and Lindpere. He seems perfectly fine playing the role asked of him in NY. He was perfectly fine playing the role asked of him in San Jose and Houston and people really believe that he wasn't willing to play a role here? His only ever point was that if he was going to be the top scoring player on the team, don't make him the 3rd top paid player. If you had brought in a Henry or a Beckham, I don't think he would have realistically argued that he should be paid more, completely contrary to what people claim. This argument that he is not a team player is so full of shit you can smell it from the south end of BMO right to the GO station.

DeRo has been and continues to be a player that can contribute to a winning team. The only reason Toronto could not win with him was because Toronto couldn't build a team if they had been given a roadmap, a book for "Dummies" and Arsene Wenger's brain. People who blame Toronto's ineptitude on DeRo do so because it fits their dislike of the man too easily not because the evidence shows anything of the sort.

Whoop
04-21-2011, 10:31 PM
TFC was working on getting a grass pitch even before DeRo was coming to TFC.

Bars92
04-21-2011, 10:35 PM
The sale of Edu got the grass pitch.

Shakes McQueen
04-21-2011, 10:42 PM
And being the guy who got TFC a grass pitch. :flare:

DeRo was a vocal critic of the plastic pitch, which I assume helped, but TFC had announced they were working on that long before he arrived.

Most people attribute it directly to the sale of Maurice Edu, but to my knowledge that has never been confirmed.

- Scott

Shakes McQueen
04-21-2011, 11:19 PM
Roogsy, I can't figure out if I admire your continuing tenacity and vigour throughout the DeRo debate, or if it frightens me, haha.

- Scott

Roogsy
04-21-2011, 11:25 PM
LOL!

I've tried to stay out of the DeRo threads and for the most part I have. But this one seemed less likely to head into the pits of argumentation. Besides...after watching the last two NYRB games, you'd have to be intentionally blind not to see that many of the things that people accused him of are just plain not true. Laying off balls for others. Creating space and letting others take shots. You know...attacking midfielder type stuff that apparently he was too selfish to do here :rolleyes: , he's doing it there and it's paying off almost immediately for NY. So why exactly could we not have been recipients of those benefits? For supporters to continue to lay the lion's share of blame on DeRo is just plain ignorant in my mind. They bought into the misinformation from the FO, they bought into some deluded version of what "class" players do and what "leaders" do and allowed this team to let a unique player get away. A player not easily replaced as we are so easily finding out for ourselves. A player that would have stayed for the right contract that was never offered to him, regardless of what the MLSE sycophants would tell you.

It will be a long time before I forgive this organization for ruining what could have been a fairy tale sports story for all Toronto sports fans, young and old. Soccer-lover or not.

Yes I am still mad and this season-ticket holder will be keeping the fire to the feet of this organization (even if others are buying into the koolaid) until they start producing something else on the pitch other than the god-awful mess I keep seeing. Take my favourite player away, you'd better start giving something else that I will enjoy.

Shakes McQueen
04-21-2011, 11:40 PM
Always a good long rant laying just under the surface with you, buddy. :D

I stopped a while ago. It actually turns my brain to Jell-O when I read arguing about DeRo, at this point. And some of the arguments are, frankly, just getting way out to lunch.

- Scott

Roogsy
04-21-2011, 11:46 PM
I suffer from IBS of the mouth... :lol:

Chevy
04-22-2011, 06:27 AM
LOL!

I've tried to stay out of the DeRo threads and for the most part I have. But this one seemed less likely to head into the pits of argumentation. Besides...

Is there an emoticon for "The mother of all WTF's?" :jaw:

v00d00daddy
04-22-2011, 08:00 AM
LOL!

I've tried to stay out of the DeRo threads and for the most part I have. But this one seemed less likely to head into the pits of argumentation. Besides...after watching the last two NYRB games, you'd have to be intentionally blind not to see that many of the things that people accused him of are just plain not true. Laying off balls for others. Creating space and letting others take shots. You know...attacking midfielder type stuff that apparently he was too selfish to do here :rolleyes: , he's doing it there and it's paying off almost immediately for NY. So why exactly could we not have been recipients of those benefits? For supporters to continue to lay the lion's share of blame on DeRo is just plain ignorant in my mind. They bought into the misinformation from the FO, they bought into some deluded version of what "class" players do and what "leaders" do and allowed this team to let a unique player get away. A player not easily replaced as we are so easily finding out for ourselves. A player that would have stayed for the right contract that was never offered to him, regardless of what the MLSE sycophants would tell you.

It will be a long time before I forgive this organization for ruining what could have been a fairy tale sports story for all Toronto sports fans, young and old. Soccer-lover or not.

Yes I am still mad and this season-ticket holder will be keeping the fire to the feet of this organization (even if others are buying into the koolaid) until they start producing something else on the pitch other than the god-awful mess I keep seeing. Take my favourite player away, you'd better start giving something else that I will enjoy.

I'm not going to argue with you about the merits of DeRo. It's been done enough and I think it's safe to say we disagree.

What I take issue with is this fucking ridiculous "Kool Aid" shit.

It's Kool Aid drinking NOW?

Now that we've gone out and got a GM with a good rep in this league?
Now that we've gone out and got a coach from a world class developmental system like Ajax?
Now that we have a coach that has come out and explicitly laid out the vision and plan for all of us to hear?

Give me a fucking break.

I don't subscribe to the "drinking the Kool Aid" shit because we all have different opinions on what progress looks like and we all have a different vision of what we want this team to look like.

But if I did subscribe to the "drinking the Kool Aid" theory I would say this:

All the people that were supporting this team through thick and thin during the first couple of years when we had Mo, Carver and Cummins as coaches.....YOU were part of the problem.

YOU ignored the blatantantly obvious fact that our tactics were prehistoric. You were content with every player on our team kicking the ball away like it was a grenade. YOU were the ones elevating shitty players to cult status. YOU were the ones who set the expectations bar so low.

I'm sorry to say this...but if we had real expectations out of the gate we might not be in this mess right now. If management had known from day one that we were not interested in seeing shitty players play this game like a bunch of 14 year olds from 1985 we might have started the progress ball rolling.

Instead....YOU drank the Kool Aid from day one and elevated Dichio and Brennan and Robbo to cult status.

YOU were the ones who believed that, because we were an expansion team, we HAD to be dreadful for a long time. Now we see that it's just not true.

NOW we're saying that people supporting the latest incarnation of this team are "drinking the Kool Aid"?

Fine...then I'm a Kool Aid drinker. But please don't think I'm the first one.

There have been "Kool Aid" drinkers amongst the supporters of this team since Day 1.

And Roogsy..this is not a shot at you. It's a shot at all the people who just now got upset with this team. All the people who had no problem supporting garbage for 4 years.

Whatever..I'm rambling on and on and in all honesty...I don't care all that much.

I'm happy with the direction of this team for the first time...ever.

And that's merely because, for the first time ever, they have direction.

Seems like a weird time to get all pissy about the results.

A little late folks. We had plenty of time to get pissy under the previous regime and it never happened. (when it comes to product on the pitch)

See you on Saturday. :)

I apologize for not keeping this on topic so....

for the record..I'm still happy that DeRo is gone. :)

Wull
04-22-2011, 09:50 AM
^^ Well said and that's from someone else who's apparently drinking the kool aid now

torontocelt
04-22-2011, 12:23 PM
Seems like a weird time to get all pissy about the results.

A little late folks. We had plenty of time to get pissy under the previous regime and it never happened. (when it comes to product on the pitch)


As usual some good points and I am glad you are happy with the current regime even though I am far from convinced. What I would argue with though is that you claim people never complained about results before under the previous regime. I dont understand why you would say that, people were complaining like crazy about Preki and Mo etc for a long time and this also included complaining about the poor team and the poor results. To say people never complained is just not accurate.

v00d00daddy
04-22-2011, 03:24 PM
As usual some good points and I am glad you are happy with the current regime even though I am far from convinced. What I would argue with though is that you claim people never complained about results before under the previous regime. I dont understand why you would say that, people were complaining like crazy about Preki and Mo etc for a long time and this also included complaining about the poor team and the poor results. To say people never complained is just not accurate.


You're right. To suggest that nobody every complained is an exaggeration but, if you were vocal about displeasure with the team in seasons 1-4, you were you were generally shit on.

In season 1 I was saying that we need a coach who is going to implement a style based on possession and team play and that the team we had, and the coaches we had, were complete garbage. Turns out, that's exactly what they were.

It took 4 seasons to come to what some of us have been saying since day one and now that it's here there are people already ready to write the team off.

That's what I find frustrating.

When I was saying that change was needed and that the product was unacceptable I was told that I wasn't a true supporter.

Now, when there is actually light at the end of the tunnel (imo) it's time to panic and shit on the team after a few games of a completely different team philosophically.

It's kinda scary.

Roogsy
04-22-2011, 07:53 PM
I think you are falling into the common error on this board that when someone disagrees with you all of a sudden you make it sound like everyone was disagreeing with you.

The truth of the matter is that the voices got progressively louder with each year culminating with last year. If you were saying these things in year 1, that's a notch in your belt, but to say that the voices of discontent started this year is patently incorrect.

Funny enough, the position you claim you had back in year 1 is the position I am in now and yet you disagree with my stand? I simply don't have the confidence you do in the current direction, much like you did not have confidence in the direction back in year 1. Should you not have voiced your opinion back then?

2mil4dero+santo
04-22-2011, 08:11 PM
You're right. To suggest that nobody every complained is an exaggeration but, if you were vocal about displeasure with the team in seasons 1-4, you were you were generally shit on.

In season 1 I was saying that we need a coach who is going to implement a style based on possession and team play and that the team we had, and the coaches we had, were complete garbage. Turns out, that's exactly what they were.

It took 4 seasons to come to what some of us have been saying since day one and now that it's here there are people already ready to write the team off.

That's what I find frustrating.

When I was saying that change was needed and that the product was unacceptable I was told that I wasn't a true supporter.

Now, when there is actually light at the end of the tunnel (imo) it's time to panic and shit on the team after a few games of a completely different team philosophically.

It's kinda scary.

Buddy if its any consolation, everyone get shit on here. I got kicked out years ago for my views on MO, when it wasn't cool to harp on douchebags like him and brennan.
Although I see some things I like about where we're heading now, I still get shit on if I question something winter or the team did. you just gotta have thick skin and forget about it.
hope this helps...

Shakes McQueen
04-22-2011, 08:31 PM
Buddy if its any consolation, everyone get shit on here. I got kicked out years ago for my views on MO, when it wasn't cool to harp on douchebags like him and brennan.
Although I see some things I like about where we're heading now, I still get shit on if I question something winter or the team did. you just gotta have thick skin and forget about it.
hope this helps...

Without any knowledge of what you're talking about, I can state pretty definitively that you weren't kicked out for criticizing Mo Johnston.

Just judging from your language above, I'd guess it probably had more to do with how you articulated your opinions.

- Scott

v00d00daddy
04-22-2011, 09:43 PM
I think you are falling into the common error on this board that when someone disagrees with you all of a sudden you make it sound like everyone was disagreeing with you.

The truth of the matter is that the voices got progressively louder with each year culminating with last year. If you were saying these things in year 1, that's a notch in your belt, but to say that the voices of discontent started this year is patently incorrect.

Funny enough, the position you claim you had back in year 1 is the position I am in now and yet you disagree with my stand? I simply don't have the confidence you do in the current direction, much like you did not have confidence in the direction back in year 1. Should you not have voiced your opinion back then?

Well...I did voice my opinion back then and got shit on pretty universally.

Here's a thread I started way back when:

http://www.redpatchboys.ca/forums/showthread.php?t=4817

And I can't even remember stuff from the old board.

And then there was this beaut where every voice of complaint or dissention was forced into one mega thread because the "real suppoters" were tired of reading complaints in every thread.

http://www.redpatchboys.ca/forums/showthread.php?t=4899

Oh how the times have changed.

Whatever..all that matters is that I think we're on the right track.

I'm happy and looking forward to seeing progress that I truly believe is coming.

I may be wrong...but I hope not. :scarf:

Brooker
04-23-2011, 03:28 AM
Wait so recognizing a player as having been the best to wear our kit is wrong because that player no longer plays here? Here I thought that when chosing a "best ever" one tends to look back at everyone who has at one point played for your team.

I am however curious to know how you made the leap from "I think DeRo was the best FC player" to "I now cheer for the Red Bulls".

Fascinating how there are some get turned on so much when they trash DeRo, that they can't have a positive thread go without voicing their over-stated opinion against the man.

He is, to this date, the best single player that has played for Toronto. That is certainly a fact. A fact that may change in time when/if a better player comes along. Until then, gone or not, like him or not, he is our best player ever.

That is what this thread was about right? Or does the above state I am a Red Bulls fan now?

It was sarcasm.

2mil4dero+santo
04-23-2011, 08:39 AM
Without any knowledge of what you're talking about, I can state pretty definitively that you weren't kicked out for criticizing Mo Johnston.

Just judging from your language above, I'd guess it probably had more to do with how you articulated your opinions.

- Scott

thank you for educating me with your fine english skills. i bow down to ur superior intellect.

Fort York Redcoat
04-23-2011, 10:00 AM
Guys. Let's chill. It's gameday.

Gazza
04-23-2011, 10:04 AM
4 championships.

As well as having top assists in the league in one of his most successful year.

See, he's so great that i lose track of all that makes him great!