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Doucet3
04-09-2011, 06:04 PM
Did anyone else see the program on GolTV, TFC: a New Beginning ?, it was pretty good actually gave me a little bit more hope for this season and for the future.

Ossington Mental Youth
04-09-2011, 06:06 PM
yep, bit fluffy at moments (which other people are sure to go into detail about) but overall decent.

icecoldbeer
04-09-2011, 06:09 PM
Seems like they really edited out DeRo...also it froze in a few spots, or is that just my Cogeco digital cable?

Doucet3
04-09-2011, 06:13 PM
most likley cogeco, my brother works for them and even i get the same problem lol, but yea it seems like they cut dero out and focused more of the footage on Santos and Frei

Ossington Mental Youth
04-09-2011, 06:55 PM
when they did show dero they really emphasized how unhappy he is (not surprised)

Red Rat
04-09-2011, 07:07 PM
TFC "A New Beginning"

Again and again, round and round we go
where we are heading, nobody knows!

Ball of confusion, that is what the team is today, hey hey

Pachuco
04-09-2011, 07:37 PM
My first thought was, a new beginning after 5 years? yikes. Somebody must've fucked up large to start all over in your 5th season.

Sweeper
04-10-2011, 08:16 PM
Propaganda film.....no just kidding. I liked the soundtrack.

Esquire
04-10-2011, 08:43 PM
Here's a link (http://torontofc.neulion.com/tfc/console.jsp?catid=2&id=2960)to the video on the TFC site. I'm just taking a look at it now.

Red Rat
04-10-2011, 08:46 PM
this video is a
"yes we Fucked up, yes we know it" but we will fuck up again.
sugar coated screwed...

hmmmm

mclaren
04-10-2011, 10:02 PM
A new 5 year plan! Awesome! Sunshine and Lollipops for everyone!

ilikemusic
04-11-2011, 02:39 AM
I love how they talk about a 'new' beginning as if there was ever really a first beginning. :lol:

Mikey
04-11-2011, 06:40 AM
Toronto Groundhogs FC
A new start...every season

ensco
04-11-2011, 06:50 AM
Surprised they didn't call it "we may not be good, but we're slow"

Cashcleaner
04-11-2011, 06:52 AM
Not a bad video. Actually, in terms of audios and visuals it was quite enjoyable, but let's be clear here, this is all about damage control. Make no mistake, it actually was very interesting and I like most of what I saw, but as a supporter first and a viewer second, I totally understood the intent.

mastermixer
04-11-2011, 08:21 AM
Really well done. But definitely sugar coated.

Roogsy
04-11-2011, 08:25 AM
I am at a point now where I am no longer happy waiting for something good to finally happen. I am done waiting. There comes a point in any relationship where you have given as much as you can and now you expect something in return. I now expect this team to start making an effort with me and all the fans and trying to honestly win me over. Fluff like this does not do it. Lower concession prices. Freeze ST prices for the next 3 years. Bring in an exciting name as a DP. Something. If they're whole argument on why we should continue to be patient is "we have it right this time" I am going to say "no thanks, I am not trusting you anymore".

mastermixer
04-11-2011, 08:42 AM
I am at a point now where I am no longer happy waiting for something good to finally happen. I am done waiting. There comes a point in any relationship where you have given as much as you can and now you expect something in return. I now expect this team to start making an effort with me and all the fans and trying to honestly win me over. Fluff like this does not do it. Lower concession prices. Freeze ST prices for the next 3 years. Bring in an exciting name as a DP. Something. If they're whole argument on why we should continue to be patient is "we have it right this time" I am going to say "no thanks, I am not trusting you anymore".

I agree with you. The only successful thing around this team has been the one thing they don't have control over which is the support. Everything else has fallen apart year after year. I actualy cringed when I heard Paul Bierne say they now have a "20 year plan" on that video.
Can you imagine if big corporations like Sony or Microsoft said you know what, our 5 year plan didnt work, we now have a 20 year plan. Buy our shit.

menefreghista
04-11-2011, 08:47 AM
I actualy cringed when I heard Paul Bierne say they now have a "20 year plan" on that video.


If the attendance trend continues Paul Beirne might have to plan to fill out an EI report.

ManUtd4ever
04-11-2011, 08:53 AM
I am at a point now where I am no longer happy waiting for something good to finally happen. I am done waiting. There comes a point in any relationship where you have given as much as you can and now you expect something in return. I now expect this team to start making an effort with me and all the fans and trying to honestly win me over. Fluff like this does not do it. Lower concession prices. Freeze ST prices for the next 3 years. Bring in an exciting name as a DP. Something. If they're whole argument on why we should continue to be patient is "we have it right this time" I am going to say "no thanks, I am not trusting you anymore".

I agree with you regarding ticket prices, concessions, a DP signing (preferably an attacking mid), etc. I wouldn't hold my breath regarding the cost of a beer at BMO Field, but there is a chance that MLSE will hold the line on ticket prices beyond next season (based on current sales), and history suggests that a 2nd DP is definitely not out of the question.

For the time being I am most concerned with the product on the pitch. The team has undergone a drastic roster overhaul over the last several weeks. Other than the positions at AM and RB, this is probably the most balanced roster that a TFC management regime has ever assembled. All we can reasonably expect at this point in time is for the club to demonstrate tangible improvement every week. After the debacle against Vancouver, I can honestly say that the club has been more cohesive and looked more effective with every passing match.

In the relatively brief history of this franchise, it already feels like we've endured an inordinate amount of controversy and negativity. While there is still a long road ahead to respectability, I believe there is finally legitimate cause for optimism.

jabbronies
04-11-2011, 08:56 AM
I like the video. Gave me goosebumps and got me excited for the next game.

The players love playing at BMO - they love the atmosphere we created.

Roogsy
04-11-2011, 10:20 AM
I agree with you regarding ticket prices, concessions, DP signing (preferably an attacking mid), etc. I wouldn't hold my breath regarding the cost of a beer at BMO Field, but the there is a chance that MLSE will hold the line on ticket prices beyond next season (based on current sales), and history suggests that a 2nd DP is definitely not out of the question.

For the time being I am most concerned with the product on the pitch. The team has undergone a drastic roster overhaul over the last several weeks. Other than the positions at AM and RB, this is probably the most balanced roster that a TFC management regime has ever assembled. All we can reasonably expect at this point in time is for the club to demonstrate tangible improvement every week. After the debacle against Vancouver, I can honestly say that the club has been more cohesive and looked more effective with every passing match.

In the relatively brief history of this franchise, it already feels like we've endured an inordinate amount of controversy and negativity. While there is still a long road ahead to respectability, I believe there is finally legitimate cause for optimism.

That's the thinking each time this team says "this time we've got it right". No thank you. My enthusiasm will be reserved for when there is tangible proof that we do have it right. They no longer deserve the benefit of the doubt.

Ossington Mental Youth
04-11-2011, 10:48 AM
and im not trying to instigate anything Roogsy, but im really curious as to why follow the team? why read/watch/talk about them until MLSE has sold them on? If theres nothing worth being positive about why bother with the team at all, arent you putting yourself in a position of being unhappy when you could easily be happier?

ilikemusic
04-11-2011, 11:00 AM
and im not trying to instigate anything Roogsy, but im really curious as to why follow the team? why read/watch/talk about them until MLSE has sold them on? If theres nothing worth being positive about why bother with the team at all, arent you putting yourself in a position of being unhappy when you could easily be happier?

Why do Leafs fans complain about the team all the time, yet still go to the games, and watch on TV?

I still follow TFC, even though I have nothing good to say about the team, because I love football, and I am from Toronto.

FreekAce
04-11-2011, 11:10 AM
and im not trying to instigate anything Roogsy, but im really curious as to why follow the team? why read/watch/talk about them until MLSE has sold them on? If theres nothing worth being positive about why bother with the team at all, arent you putting yourself in a position of being unhappy when you could easily be happier?

funny i was thinking the exact same thing when reading that.
if a hobby causes so much frustration and gives you (from my impression) no satisfaction, why bother? i'd have already moved on to something else.

ExiledRed
04-11-2011, 11:29 AM
funny i was thinking the exact same thing when reading that.
if a hobby causes so much frustration and gives you (from my impression) no satisfaction, why bother? i'd have already moved on to something else.

You might as well ask me why I havent left my wife.

At least in that situation I could possibly find love again, and I wouldnt have to leave the province to do it.

With TFC, once you're out, you're out.

I appreciate that you grew up watching an underachieving team and think its normal to expect humiliation every week, and this is part of your 'hobby'. You've said so yourself, however Im not of the opinion that this makes you more seasoned, intelligent or devout as a fan. I also dont think its an appropriate mindest for Toronto FC or any other MLS team.

I worry that when you support a team like that too much, you start to get offended when people talk about expectations and winning. In the small team's world, winning everything is something that is so out of reach, even trying to reach it is going to unbalance everything and lead to a fall.

We're not a small team in this league, and shouldn't act like one.

Ossington Mental Youth
04-11-2011, 11:41 AM
That being said is it fair to give a man 2 months for a huge turn around and then lose all faith when it doent occur?
at what point is there reason for positivity?

I guess im forever an optimist even when theres no reason for it (Mos gone! We have an FO that seemingly looks like they know what their doing!), doesnt mean you ignore the lows, but it also doesnt mean you ignore the highs (or mids in this case)

FreekAce
04-11-2011, 12:05 PM
You might as well ask me why I havent left my wife.

At least in that situation I could possibly find love again, and I wouldnt have to leave the province to do it.

With TFC, once you're out, you're out.

I appreciate that you grew up watching an underachieving team and think its normal to expect humiliation every week, and this is part of your 'hobby'. You've said so yourself, however Im not of the opinion that this makes you more seasoned, intelligent or devout as a fan. I also dont think its an appropriate mindest for Toronto FC or any other MLS team.

I worry that when you support a team like that too much, you start to get offended when people talk about expectations and winning. In the small team's world, winning everything is something that is so out of reach, even trying to reach it is going to unbalance everything and lead to a fall.

We're not a small team in this league, and shouldn't act like one.

lets be clear, i dont expect "humiliation" every week (which if its a refference to TFC so far, a statement way blown out of proportion), i do expect that results will be based on the realistic current situation of the squad. and as i've stated before, i love winning just as the next dude, we all want that for our team. its just not the number one criteria for me to have fun supporting.

oh and that underachieving team that gets humiliated every week i support back home managed to get a 4-0 away victory with one of the youngest squads fielded in over a 100 years. those same fans also pack a 70.000 seat ground for every game despite being in a relegation spot before the winterstop. thats supporting a team, and guaranteed that those victories mean a hell of fuckin lot more then the ones from those teams that win every week because they toss money they dont really have around like water, and play for plastic fans that dont bother showing up first sign of trouble. i sure as shit know what club i'd have TFC be anyday.

Roogsy
04-11-2011, 12:07 PM
and im not trying to instigate anything Roogsy, but im really curious as to why follow the team? why read/watch/talk about them until MLSE has sold them on? If theres nothing worth being positive about why bother with the team at all, arent you putting yourself in a position of being unhappy when you could easily be happier?

Like mentioned by ilikemusic...what's the point of following any team? Teams will frustrate us. The key point here is how we respond. I am not willing to give TFC a "blank cheque" any longer. That is the difference. Before, I'd give them the benefit of the doubt, I'd buy merchandise willy nilly, I'd support every move they make, I'd promote the team personally to all friends and family. Now I am in "wait and see" mode where if they do well, I will be happy, if they don't, I will continue to pull my financial support more and more.

This team only understands dollars and cents. If blind support didn't get us to where we want to be, then other pressure must be applied.

As for happiness...only when I stopped allowing myself to be TFC's bitch did I realize how much stress I stopped feeling.

Ossington Mental Youth
04-11-2011, 12:13 PM
Gotcha, now i understand, didnt know about the money bit, good idea.
Just never gathered you got any satisfaction from the team in any manner, thanks for the input

ManUtd4ever
04-11-2011, 12:13 PM
You might as well ask me why I havent left my wife.

At least in that situation I could possibly find love again, and I wouldnt have to leave the province to do it.


Classic! :rofl:

For your sake, I hope she doesn't read the boards!

ManUtd4ever
04-11-2011, 12:20 PM
That's the thinking each time this team says "this time we've got it right". No thank you. My enthusiasm will be reserved for when there is tangible proof that we do have it right. They no longer deserve the benefit of the doubt.

Fair enough, I just notice a distinctly different approach to the manner in which our current management team is building the squad this time around, as if there is actually some long term vision and thought process in place regarding the player personnel moves. The philosophy of Winter and Mariner is a refreshing change, it's long overdue, and it's the main reason for my optimism.

Whoop
04-11-2011, 12:21 PM
lets be clear, i dont expect "humiliation" every week (which if its a refference to TFC so far, a statement way blown out of proportion), i do expect that results will be based on the realistic current situation of the squad. and as i've stated before, i love winning just as the next dude, we all want that for our team. its just not the number one criteria for me to have fun supporting.

oh and that underachieving team that gets humiliated every week i support back home managed to get a 4-0 away victory with one of the youngest squads fielded in over a 100 years. those same fans also pack a 70.000 seat ground for every game despite being in a relegation spot before the winterstop. thats supporting a team, and guaranteed that those victories mean a hell of fuckin lot more then the ones from those teams that win every week because they toss money they dont really have around like water, and play for plastic fans that dont bother showing up first sign of trouble. i sure as shit know what club i'd have TFC be anyday.

Hopefully you guys do us a favour in 2 weeks. LOL

In response to Roogsy, why are you giving your team a blank cheque? Or being their bitch?

Everyone is getting clouded by the rhetoric coming out of the suits in the FO. I see a lot more positive signs on the pitch than I did in week 1 and anticipate there being more improvement. People act like this is some sort of expansion team. I don't see this team having a record goal scoring drought. From a personal standpoint, I don't anticipate feeling lower than I did after Montreal won the Voyageurs Cup in Toronto or when TFC lost 5-0 to NYRB with a playoff spot in sight.

Does this mean I'm going to start wearing TFC gear from head to toe? Does this is mean I'm going to jump when the FO says jump? Does this mean I'm going to bow down to the coach when he walks by me? Never have, never will.

I understand demanding expectations but ultimately you support the players on the field, not the FO. If some rich oil baron bought the team would you support the team even more?

If you so strongly about the team sell your tickets. Don't renew.

Oldtimer
04-11-2011, 12:23 PM
I liked the show, a bit "fluffy" though as has been noted.

Whoop
04-11-2011, 12:24 PM
Fair enough, I just notice a distinctly different approach to the manner in which our current management team is building the squad this time around, as if there is actually some long term vision and thought process in place regarding the player personnel moves. The philosophy of Winter and Mariner is a refreshing change, it's long overdue, and it's the main reason for my optimism.

I have to agree from a team building standpoint this is the most optimistic I've been in a while about the team. I'm beginning to think TFC will exceed my expectations this season.

But I must be falling for the FO's pablum.

Roogsy
04-11-2011, 12:31 PM
In response to Roogsy, why are you giving your team a blank cheque? Or being their bitch?


Both have to do with personal decisions I have made. In previous years, I purchased everything "new" that came out and accepted all new decisions as "postive" and the "right" direction. I have gone from someone who gave them every chance to someone who is now completely skeptical. The video is a nice piece of propaganda but it's not something I am buying into. Especially considering some of the worrisome attitudes found in the video that point to simply not understanding what they did wrong.

If this really is a "new beginning" then they have to start by acting like they have to win me over as a new fan in year 1. If not, then this "new beginning" is nothing but a delay tactic and so I delay my acceptance of what they have done.

As for giving up tickets...that argument has been done to death and is as illogical as it was when people first started using it.

Whoop
04-11-2011, 12:36 PM
Both have to do with personal decisions I have made. In previous years, I purchased everything "new" that came out and accepted all new decisions as "postive" and the "right" direction. I have gone from someone who gave them every chance to someone who is now completely skeptical. The video is a nice piece of propaganda but it's not something I am buying into. Especially considering some of the worrisome attitudes found in the video that point to simply not understanding what they did wrong.

If this really is a "new beginning" then they have to start by acting like they have to win me over as a new fan in year 1. If not, then this "new beginning" is nothing but a delay tactic and so I delay my acceptance of what they have done.

As for giving up tickets...that argument has been done to death and is as illogical as it was when people first started using it.

Fair enough.

I understand the ticket thing too. My point with the ticket thing is that if you're that unhappy (not saying you per se) why purchase something that makes you unhappy?

Sometimes I find people hold onto the tickets (again not you per se) because they don't want to miss out on the "party" when the team ends up doing well or winning a championship.

ensco
04-11-2011, 12:36 PM
There's one thing we can all agree on:

It's cheaper to make a video, than to sign a quality defender.

Ossington Mental Youth
04-11-2011, 12:40 PM
maybe?
I mean its all under the same cap, its not like MLSE gets to keep that money as income if they dont spend it, also dont think youd find any coaches willing to work for a company like that (sauve Nicol)

Pookie
04-11-2011, 12:40 PM
.

This team only understands dollars and cents. If blind support didn't get us to where we want to be, then other pressure must be applied.


I think you have great sentiment but are a little misguided in your argument.

Folks seem to say that MLSE doesn't care about winning. They only care about money.

If we all agree that they care about money, then we all agree that MLSE gets dollars and cents.

Which means that somebody, somewhere in that organization knows how to work a calculator and has figured out that if you book additional home dates (ie. through playoffs) you make more dollars and cents.

There was an excellent historical look at the culture of the Leafs that attempted to explain why they put up losing seasons.

The theory goes is that the reason MLSE puts up losers is that they default to the quick fix. They are very reactionary. They have a short term window on coaches, managers and deals that came to their President and VPs were looked at for immediate impact.

It isn't that they don't care about the playoffs, it's about that they care so much about the playoffs THIS year, that they were willing to give up draft picks for aging veterans at the trade deadline. Or accept a Manager's recommendation to have a new coach every year because the "next one" will get them in.

The good news is that they have appeared to abandon this vision with the changes in reporting structure for the Leafs and Raptors (ie. no Peddie, no Anselmi... Burke/Colangelo go straight to the Board). I can only hope TFC adopts a similar structure moving forward.

Roogsy
04-11-2011, 12:41 PM
Fair enough.

I understand the ticket thing too. My point with the ticket thing is that if you're that unhappy (not saying you per se) why purchase something that makes you unhappy?

Sometimes I find people hold onto the tickets (again not you per se) because they don't want to miss out on the "party" when the team ends up doing well or winning a championship.


I don't know about others but I made a concerted effort to get these tickets. I bought on day 1. I bought before these tickets were even in demand. Before Beckham signed. Before people saw what the gameday experience was like. I was there on day 1 when they released the first replica jersey. I was there when they signed Jimmy. I won't completely give up on the hope that I had before the first game ever...but they've done a completely thorough job killing my enthusaism. A video won't bring it back.

It's like a spouse that has been cheated on. Maybe they take the cheating spouse back but it doesn't mean they trust them fully. Now the cheater has to prove he's changed. That is where I am. Prove to me you are a new organization and I will make my way back. Keep making the same type of dumb mistakes and all you are doing is proving that you are still the same poorly run organization with a new face.

FreekAce
04-11-2011, 12:44 PM
Fair enough.

I understand the ticket thing too. My point with the ticket thing is that if you're that unhappy (not saying you per se) why purchase something that makes you unhappy?

Sometimes I find people hold onto the tickets (again not you per se) because they don't want to miss out on the "party" when the team ends up doing well or winning a championship.

ugh, gloryhunters (also not aimed at anyone in particular). :frown2:

Whoop
04-11-2011, 12:46 PM
It's a video piece.

Like canadian_bhoy had said I wish MLS could do something like NFL films. I think things like that help. Maybe not so much in Toronto, but league wide.

The deadline window closes on the 15th. I think they'll bring someone else before then.

FreekAce
04-11-2011, 12:54 PM
It's like a spouse that has been cheated on. Maybe they take the cheating spouse back but it doesn't mean they trust them fully. Now the cheater has to prove he's changed. That is where I am. Prove to me you are a new organization and I will make my way back. Keep making the same type of dumb mistakes and all you are doing is proving that you are still the same poorly run organization with a new face.

haha, i like this comparison, and fair enough ;)
but you also have to give the club the chance to prove you are wrong or right, and shooting down everything they do in an attempt to become better does not only seem pointless, but it really stinks up the atmosphere for everybody else :D

ManUtd4ever
04-11-2011, 01:13 PM
Roogs, it depends on who you view as the cheating spouse, LOL. If we're looking at ticket prices and concessions, MLSE is the culprit. If we're evaluating the on field product, then MoJo was the culprit, and he's gone. It's unfair to hold a grudge against management (not ownership) for the mistakes of the past.

Roogsy
04-11-2011, 01:23 PM
Roogs, it depends on who you view as the cheating spouse, LOL. If we're looking at ticket prices and concessions, MLSE is the culprit. If we're evaluating the on field product, then MoJo was the culprit, and he's gone. It's unfair to hold a grudge against management (not ownership) for the mistakes of the past.

TFC is an organization as a whole. MoJo was arguably the single biggest problem within that organization but he wasn't the only problem. The ticket price hike had nothing to do wtih MoJo. Sticking a propaganda video in between our march was not a MoJo decision. Just because Mo is gone does not mean all of a a sudden the organization has been redeemed of all their faults.

The cheating spouse is TFC as a whole and as a whole they have to make amends. That means being more considerate of fans in all areas. Pricing, value, effort and on field product.

ManUtd4ever
04-11-2011, 01:35 PM
TFC is an organization as a whole. MoJo was arguably the single biggest problem within that organization but he wasn't the only problem. The ticket price hike had nothing to do wtih MoJo. Sticking a propaganda video in between our march was not a MoJo decision. Just because Mo is gone does not mean all of a a sudden the organization has been redeemed of all their faults.

The cheating spouse is TFC as a whole and as a whole they have to make amends. That means being more considerate of fans in all areas. Pricing, value, effort and on field product.

We'll have to agree to disagree. I'm still bitter with MLSE for the ticket price increases (regardless of the on field product) and effectively changing the atmosphere in the stadium by virtue of the thousands of empty seats at BMO Field.

On the other hand, I'm very content with the manner in which Winter and Mariner have conducted themselves in terms of dealing with adversity and constructing the team.

Ownership is directly responsible for the issues off the field and management is accountable for the product on the pitch.

Jeffro
04-11-2011, 01:50 PM
Sure we've been shit for 4 years, but I don't see the point in focusing on past failures and over looking positive steps. I just don't see how right now is the time to take a stand against past problems. Did we find a miracle cure? No. Have I tempered my expectations a bit? Yes. That doesn't mean I will support the team any differently than I ever have. There are teams over seas who haven't won a title in 50 years. Our 4 years of suffering pales in comparison.

I demand to see improvement, desire to win, and positive direction, and I think since the end of last season we've seen most of that. Sure I wish we hired the right coach three years ago and had a contending team right now, but we didn't. That's in the past and the team has shown that it doesn't want to repeat those same mistakes again. Winter may be the coach to lead us to glory, he may fail miserably. That's sports. Always a gamble, there are no sure things.

Oldtimer
04-11-2011, 01:52 PM
TFC is an organization as a whole. MoJo was arguably the single biggest problem within that organization but he wasn't the only problem. The ticket price hike had nothing to do wtih MoJo. Sticking a propaganda video in between our march was not a MoJo decision. Just because Mo is gone does not mean all of a a sudden the organization has been redeemed of all their faults.

The cheating spouse is TFC as a whole and as a whole they have to make amends. That means being more considerate of fans in all areas. Pricing, value, effort and on field product.

dishonesty, moral corruption, incompetence = MoJo
ripping off fans by hiking tickets = Paul B.
Propaganda video producer = someone appointed by MoJo
Overall mess = Tom Anselmi

ExiledRed
04-11-2011, 01:54 PM
lets be clear, i dont expect "humiliation" every week (which if its a refference to TFC so far, a statement way blown out of proportion), i do expect that results will be based on the realistic current situation of the squad. and as i've stated before, i love winning just as the next dude, we all want that for our team. its just not the number one criteria for me to have fun supporting.

Humiliation is coming into an american league as the only canadian team and absolutely stinking. Did nobody find that embarassing?

The current situation of the squad is manageable and alterable. If for any reason the squad isnt good enough to get a result, there should be a drive to improve that, and unlike with your team back home, its not impossible to spend as much as the league leaders.


oh and that underachieving team that gets humiliated every week i support back home managed to get a 4-0 away victory with one of the youngest squads fielded in over a 100 years. those same fans also pack a 70.000 seat ground for every game despite being in a relegation spot before the winterstop. thats supporting a team, and guaranteed that those victories mean a hell of fuckin lot more then the ones from those teams that win every week because they toss money they dont really have around like water, and play for plastic fans that dont bother showing up first sign of trouble. i sure as shit know what club i'd have TFC be anyday.

And I wasn't dissing your team or its support. I was paraphrasing you and maybe some other posters who often point to how they're 'real team' doesnt do very well, but their supporters remain upbeat as some kind of parallel to this team in MLS.


Im just pointing out that in the situation of teams that cant compete at the top, it would be ludicrous to demand a league title when the expense associated with achieving one is outside the scope of the club finances.

That isnt the case here, and im not being told that my support is 'gloryhunting' or somehow 'superficial' because Im expecting that the money and intelligence that is available, is duly allocated to making this team succesful.

If your team was bought out by a thrillionaire, and due to clever marketing and a fluke qualification nto the CL, became the richest club in your league. Would your expectations change?

Roogsy
04-11-2011, 02:19 PM
We'll have to agree to disagree. I'm still bitter with MLSE for the ticket price increases (regardless of the on field product) and effectively changing the atmosphere in the stadium by virtue of the thousands of empty seats at BMO Field.

On the other hand, I'm very content with the manner in which Winter and Mariner have conducted themselves in terms of dealing with adversity and constructing the team.

Ownership is directly responsible for the issues off the field and management is accountable for the product on the pitch.

That's fine. This is my personal opinion anyways. I simply do not accept the idea of separating the team in two parts.

Ossington Mental Youth
04-11-2011, 02:23 PM
If your team was bought out by a thrillionaire, and due to clever marketing and a fluke qualification nto the CL, became the richest club in your league. Would your expectations change?

prob similar to now as there'd still be a cap :D

Section 117
04-11-2011, 02:26 PM
Roogsy or maybe you are just bitter that TFC got rid of Dero...

I kid I kid.

bones
04-11-2011, 02:30 PM
I think everyone if missing the key problem with this product. Too much Lee Godfrey, not enough Andi Petrillo. :)

Bones...

Roogsy
04-11-2011, 03:05 PM
Roogsy or maybe you are just bitter that TFC got rid of Dero...

I kid I kid.

I was here before DeRo, I will be here long after DeRo is a memory. I was killing myself in the stands long before anyone ever whispered DeRo. And long before people starting jumping on the party bandwagon.

Phil
04-11-2011, 03:09 PM
I thought the show was alright. To be honest, they surprised me with their blunt assesment of the team up until this point.

I was also shocked, but in a good way, to see them deal with the Dero situation head on.

FreekAce
04-11-2011, 04:31 PM
because Im expecting that the money and intelligence that is available, is duly allocated to making this team succesful.


i fully agree with you, the squandering of funds on bad decisions and purchases like we have seen should not be repeated. with new management so far it looks like in that department they've smartened up as well.

as for us stinking up the league as the first canadian team, one of us had to be the first and since were tied to the same restrictions as the yanks are, expectations could only be the same. tome no different to me then other teams joining for the first time. i understand the national pride aspect of wanting to do well, but national pride unfortunately doesnt help us win games. think we supporters have proven that and then some ;)

i misunderstood the bit on my shitty team back in holland (and for the record, i consider TFC to be MY club, i live here, support here,been with the Reds since the get-go, this is where im most emotionally invested) you make a good point in regards to the financial equality in this league and are right that it makes for a more even playing field in terms of strength and competitiveness. we just had the luck of some dumb shit's screwing the financial pooch!

Davenport
04-11-2011, 04:55 PM
I think everyone if missing the key problem with this product. Too much Lee Godfrey, not enough Andi Petrillo. :)

Bones...

Lee Godfrey......Give me a break.
WTF does he know about soccer ?

TFCRegina
04-11-2011, 08:46 PM
This thing is posted on the TFC website now. 8 parts.

manic.street.preacher
04-11-2011, 08:59 PM
I thought the show was alright. To be honest, they surprised me with their blunt assesment of the team up until this point.

I was also shocked, but in a good way, to see them deal with the Dero situation head on.
^this. for as much of a fluff, feel-good piece as it is, there were a couple moments of blunt honesty in it when i thought 'whoa, didn't expect to hear that' ... doesn't erase all the bs and sideways talk of the past of course ... it's also nice to see the better attitudes we've seen in the piece reflected on the pitch ... and cos it is just a feel-good piece, it achieves it's goal (with me at least, cos i haven't felt this optimistic about the team since maybe year 1)

TFCRegina
04-11-2011, 09:10 PM
^this. for as much of a fluff, feel-good piece as it is, there were a couple moments of blunt honesty in it when i thought 'whoa, didn't expect to hear that' ... doesn't erase all the bs and sideways talk of the past of course ... it's also nice to see the better attitudes we've seen in the piece reflected on the pitch ... and cos it is just a feel-good piece, it achieves it's goal (with me at least, cos i haven't felt this optimistic about the team since maybe year 1)

Feel good as it is, I find it interesting and compelling to watch.

I agree with you on this manic.

In Part 3 so far on the website and still haven't decided to shut it off, and i've been quite pissed with this club this year, in case people haven't noticed.

Whoop
04-11-2011, 09:16 PM
I just think some people are pissed because there's too much Paul and Cesar in it.

But I like the look of it and the way it was shot.

It's like canadian_bhoy said, stuff like NHL 24/7 or something like ESPN 30 in 30 is always good. It will be cool if they could continue to do something for the rest of the season.

TFCRegina
04-11-2011, 09:22 PM
I just think some people are pissed because there's too much Paul and Cesar in it.

But I like the look of it and the way it was shot.

It's like canadian_bhoy said, stuff like NHL 24/7 or something like ESPN 30 in 30 is always good. It will be cool if they could continue to do something for the rest of the season.

Definitely. It'd be very interesting to follow that...as long as people were brutally honest in their assessment of the club.

Whoop
04-11-2011, 09:24 PM
^^
Agreed.

Sweeper
04-11-2011, 09:56 PM
I only watched half of the video, nothing new, got bored. Was the girl giving interviews on media day in any of the segments?

DichioTFC
04-12-2011, 03:41 AM
Just finished watching it. Sure its a promo piece, but I loved it. Got the warm and fuzzies just watching it. Its themes echoed what I've been saying since pre-season (being optimistic and hopeful about the playoffs). The past couple games are reason enough to believe the hype.

KingBee
04-12-2011, 06:02 AM
As many have already said, the piece was a bit fluffy at times. While I did appreciate the flashes of honesty, the cynic in me felt like I was watching a sales video. The moments when I was actually interested were quickly washed away just by the look and feel of the interview segments with management. Honestly, if the team wasn't catastrophically mismanaged for the last 5 years does this special even get made? It was pure pandering imo to roll out somethin' wih that type of look and feel.

Hitcho
04-12-2011, 06:20 AM
I agree with Roogsy's first point - give the fans something tangible BEFORE we start winning.

Can you imagine what MSLE is going to do to us if Winter does turn this team into consistent challengers? We'll get raped. Part of me would rather we just kept losing because at least that way I can just about afford to keep my season tickets each year...

EDIT - ok, that was a bit negative for a "new beginning" thread, so yeah, hopefully the team really does start come together this year and going forward with a long term plan for sustanied success. But I do worry what MLSE will do to try and exploit that if so, especially since they've "lost" money recently on their business plan which they will likely want to recoup.

boban
04-12-2011, 06:26 AM
But I do worry what MLSE will do to try and exploit that if so, especially since they've "lost" money recently on their business plan which they will likely want to recoup.
They lost compared to seasons past, but they are still making money.
Remember they make money on 13 - 14,000 people showing up. And thats at 2007 prices, let alone the increases they put since then. Add to that the shirt sponsor and stadium naming rights, and this adventure is still making them hand over fist money. But I could just see it now also. Once we start winning we will get massive price increases.

ManUtd4ever
04-12-2011, 07:51 AM
They lost compared to seasons past, but they are still making money.
Remember they make money on 13 - 14,000 people showing up. And thats at 2007 prices, let alone the increases they put since then. Add to that the shirt sponsor and stadium naming rights, and this adventure is still making them hand over fist money. But I could just see it now also. Once we start winning we will get massive price increases.

Well, let's hope not. If current attendance is any indication, MLSE should take notice of the fact that putting a winning club on the field will not necessarily sell out the stadium. The product on the pitch has been abysmal for the most part, but I think most supporters can agree the unjustified ticket price increases are the primary reason for the dwindling attendance figures.

MLSE has been using the atmosphere at BMO field to promote the club since day one. The supporter groups have already put the front office on notice regarding excessive ticket prices, and they are well aware that further increases might lead some supporter groups to turn their back on the club, which would ultimately ruin the game day experience for most fans at the stadium, and the optics on television would deteriorate as well.

So the question is, what would be a more lucrative and beneficial long term marketing strategy for MLSE in terms of promoting TFC, 14,000-15,000 fans paying exorbitant prices in a stadium with no atmosphere, or 21,000 fans paying reasonable prices in an electric atmosphere?