Montero is Seattle's next DP

[Nuvinho]

http://worldsoccerreader.com/2010/11/seattle-sounders-to-announce-fredy-montero-as-next-designated-player/

World Soccer Reader has learned that the Seattle Sounders will likely be announcing a new Designated player contract with Colombian striker Fredy Montero during a scheduled press conference Wednesday at 12PM PST.
WSR learned about the clubs interest in securing the young striker long-term in July when we reported the Alvaro Fernandez transfer (http://worldsoccerreader.com/2010/07/update-alvaro-fernandez-to-join-seattle-sounders/). The 23-year-old striker recently secured his green card and is reportedly being tracked by several European clubs.
Montero joined Seattle on loan in January 2009 from Deportivo Cali and has gone on to score 22 league goals for the Sounders.

[Roogsy]

But wait, the DP rule wasn't designed for players already in MLS!

Couldn't be that contracts are given based on performance could it? That's crazy talk.

[reggie]

dont worry roogsy.. the haters and whiners will be on soon,

[Yeoman]

yeah but did he bitch in public about it?

[ArmenJBX]

Montero played well and Seattle, a much more soccer savvy organization, has rewarded his efforts.

Our jackasses did not. It's simply football love vs football money.
De Rosario making more money means MLSE pays more.
De Rosario leaving means MLSE pays less.
De Rosario is, unfortunately, replaceable. What MLSE doesn't realize is that replacing him means a more expensive, European DP.

[rocker]

Montero hired a airplane company to fly a big cheque across the sky above Qwest Field. ;) ;)

I'd probably give Montero DP money. He's the future @ 23. Better player than De Ro. De Ro is near the end. De Ro is also not being tracked by Europe, and also doesn't have any sell-on value.

Good business for Seattle, really.

[Roogsy]

yeah but did he bitch in public about it?

Who cares?

[Yeoman]

well apparently you did with throwing that stuff out there
or is that baiting?

[Roogsy]

well apparently you did with throwing that stuff out there
or is that baiting?


Do I care about DeRo's bitching? Nope. And for all you know, Montero did bitch about his salary, hence getting the DP. But because he did it in public, he deserves the slot but not somebody who scores 17 goals. Great logic. :thumbsup:

[reggie]

yeah but did he bitch in public about it?
yr right dero is such a bitch..the whole cheque signing thing is so old,get over it,the guy does more charity work then anybody else on the team,he works is ass off,give him a fucking break,

[Roogsy]

^ None of that matters Reggie. It's all about whether you can be a pussy and let a team boss you around. Not whether you score a bucket of goals and do positive work in the community.

[Brooker]

the difference is Montero is young and a hot commodity.

[rocker]

not whether you score a bucket of goals and do positive work in the community.

goals by one guy and positive work in the community..

that'll get TFC into the MLS Cup final!

[Roogsy]

goals by one guy and positive work in the community..

that'll get TFC into the MLS Cup final!


Replace "TFC" with "Seattle" and isn't it the same thing? There are things that matter and things that don't. All you guys are STILL making such a big issue about some dumb gesture (which he already APOLOGIZED for) and minimizing goals and yet isn't the goals itself that the team counts on for success? Methinks it's you guys that are concentrating on things that don't matter.

Obviously Seattle feels the same. Remember, they just gave the DP slot to a guy who was accused of raping a girl last year.

[FluSH]

Obviously Seattle feels the same. Remember, they just gave the DP slot to a guy who was accused of raping a girl last year.

comeon... the key word is accused

Nevertheless, character and personality goes a long way... Mike Tyson went to Jail for rape... and he still had 1/2 the world cheering for him when he returned... ain't that some shit.

[reggie]

goals by one guy and positive work in the community..

that'll get TFC into the MLS Cup final!

no it wont...but it won 2 canadian champ did it not,

[Roogsy]

comeon... the key word is accused

Nevertheless, character and personality goes a long way... Mike Tyson went to Jail for rape... and he still had 1/2 the world cheering for him when he returned... ain't that some shit.

Exactly.

We have athletes that rape, athletes that get caught with drugs, athletes that beat their women...but they get forgiven. Shit, look at Vick. The man is tearing it up in Philly and the Philly fans couldn't care less that he murdered animals. And Big Ben's off-season shenanigans have almost been completely forgotten.

But our leading goal scorer by a country mile can't get support from the hometown simply because he's upset that promises weren't kept to him and he made it known publicly. Shame on him. What a sin! Many people here want him run out of town for what I can only describe as emotionally irrational reasons because they certainly aren't logical reasons.

Montero dragged that accusation with him all season long and the charges were dropped due to insufficient evidence. He was never completely vindicated (as is often the problem with sexual accusations). He has 4 caps with the national team despite being 23. It's not like he's an international superstar. And yet gets the DP slot. Why? Because the team deemed him worthy. Now if you tell me that Montero is more valuable to Seattle than DeRo is to Toronto, then there is not much else I can say.

[reggie]

forget about this dero thing for a min,im fucking worried that this is club is going to go status quo with this front office and coaching...

[Darlofletch]

so we're turning this into another de ro thread? full of condescension to anyone that dares have a different opinion? good work roogsy.

[Roogsy]

forget about this dero thing for a min,im fucking worried that this is club is going to go status quo with this front office and coaching...


Seattle has been aggressive from the very start. This Montero signing (which I agree with by the way) is evidence of that.

Vancouver has been showing the same type of aggressiveness.

San Jose rectified things after a slow start.

TFC is increasingly proving to be a success in the stands but a complete and utter failure on the pitch/team management.

[ochos]

^^ gonna have to agree with almost everything the man said today.

- MLSE are idiots and we should be heaping pressure on them right now
- Despite anything Dero did wrong, it seems he was one of the only things right with this organization the past 2 years
- Dero deserved DP status and it's completely understandable why he's upset. I fully agree that the cheque signing move was wrong, but in the long term I'm much more upset with the ownership/management than I am with Dero

[TFC/Everton]

Freddy is 23 and if he wasn't made a DP he would go to Europe. Dero is an aging MLS all-star with no options to go overseas.

[Juanito]

Well, the precedence has been set.

If MLSE values De Rosario, they will make him our DP, if they think they can do better, they will let him ride out his contract.

I'm not sure what they will do. I guess it depends on how MLSE feels they owe the general TFC supporter.

TFC/Everton is right .... DeRo's age works against him.

[DangerRed]

Yeah, we should totally sign DeRo to a DP deal, because, you know, a guy about to crest the hill who trialed at Forest and didn't get a deal is worth exactly as much as a 23 with a very bright future and at least 10 more MLS years in him. /sarcasm

Good work in the community and clutch performances are good, but football is still a business. GBS at Columbus understood that, JPA at NYRB understands it, but for some reason, this guy and his cheerleaders do not.

Yes, DeRo is younger and still scores goals.

The risk manager in the room should understand that everyone in the FO is looking for the crest of DeRo's hill on the horizon and that the rate at which that asset will start to depreciate will accelerate markedly. I know you kiss the ground he walks on, but you still do not sign a guy like DeRo to a new DP deal.

[Brooker]

Yeah, we should totally sign DeRo to a DP deal, because, you know, a guy about to crest the hill who trialed at Forest and didn't get a deal is worth exactly as much as a 23 with a very bright future and at least 10 more MLS years in him. /sarcasm

Good work in the community and clutch performances are good, but football is still a business. GBS at Columbus understood that, JPA at NYRB understands it, but for some reason, this guy and his cheerleaders do not.

Yes, DeRo is younger and still scores goals.

The risk manager in the room should understand that everyone in the FO is looking for the crest of DeRo's hill on the horizon and that the rate at which that asset will start to depreciate will accelerate markedly. I know you kiss the ground he walks on, but you still do not sign a guy like DeRo to a new DP deal.

http://i33.tinypic.com/2dwglci.jpg

[Roogsy]

The risk manager in the room should understand that everyone in the FO is looking for the crest of DeRo's hill on the horizon and that the rate at which that asset will start to depreciate will accelerate markedly. I know you kiss the ground he walks on, but you still do not sign a guy like DeRo to a new DP deal.

The risk manager understands that nobody in any room knows where that crest is and to try to project it is as useless as people timing the markets. Therefore, all anyone can do is an educated guess about value and impact. What kind of impact can he have and what value does it represent? Montero has both, hence the obviously easy decision to give him the DP slot. The harder analysis is DeRo. Will he have impact and does it provide value? These are the only issues. People's unnatural preoccupation with his age is a red herring much like it is with Montero. It's not about age, it's about impact. We have plenty of young guys on our team and we don't try to hang on to them because of a possible upside that has not developed yet. The only upside is that which has already been proven, which Montero has done (and DeRo as well, there is no denying that). Otherwise, the average DP age in this league wouldn't be over 30. Montero is the exception to the rule. Funny enough, when TFC decided to overlook this standard and signed JDG, we all now agree that it was a mistake.

So I disagree with you. You DO sign a guy like IF you determine that the qualifying conditions have been met. It has nothing to do with whether I "kiss the ground" he walks on which by the way is a strawman argument.

As for JPA and GBS, they are actually proof that DeRo should be given a DP slot rather than an argument against it. Both Columbus and NY gave these guys DP slots and contracts during a period where they had impact despite their age. And they produced and had success. Once they did not produce, their contracts were not renewed. (So easy...it's not like these players are being signed for life even if people are acting like it.) So is your case that DeRo is no longer producing? Based on what?

Ultimately the point is do you want DeRo on the team. If no, then the answer is simple. If yes, then the answer is just as simple. Regardless of what position of the fence you are on, this really isn't a difficult issue even if people make it out to be. And paint me as irrational or as an ass-kisser all you want, there is one irrefutable fact that undoes that strawman argument...nobody on TFC can even come close to touching his goal-count. And here I thought we were discussing positive impact on a team. Is there a greater measure?

[Shakes McQueen]

Yeah, we should totally sign DeRo to a DP deal, because, you know, a guy about to crest the hill who trialed at Forest and didn't get a deal is worth exactly as much as a 23 with a very bright future and at least 10 more MLS years in him. /sarcasm

Good work in the community and clutch performances are good, but football is still a business. GBS at Columbus understood that, JPA at NYRB understands it, but for some reason, this guy and his cheerleaders do not.

Yes, DeRo is younger and still scores goals.

The risk manager in the room should understand that everyone in the FO is looking for the crest of DeRo's hill on the horizon and that the rate at which that asset will start to depreciate will accelerate markedly. I know you kiss the ground he walks on, but you still do not sign a guy like DeRo to a new DP deal.

Wonderfully put.

- Scott

[DangerRed]

It's not about age, it's about impact. We have plenty of young guys on our team and we don't try to hang on to them because of a possible upside that has not developed yet. The only upside is that which has already been proven, which Montero has done. Otherwise, the average DP age in this league wouldn't be over 30. Montero is the exception to the rule. Funny enough, when TFC decided to overlook this standard and signed JDG, we all now agree that it was a mistake.

So I disagree with you. You DO sign a guy like IF you determine that the qualifying conditions have been met. It has nothing to do with whether I "kiss the ground" he walks on which by the way is a strawman argument.

No one was making a strawman argument. I was just stating that your adulation of this player is acknowledged and might colour your decisions and opinion a little. However, I digress.

If you mean to sit there with a straight face and tell me that age and impact aren't related, then we have nothing to talk about. Age destroys players, and it can happen year-to-year. In fact, that is exactly how it happens, with the offseason a common point at which fitness walks out and never comes back the same.

It has happened countless times, but you insist (without stating it outright, which is a cheap trick of discourse - you use terms like "qualifying conditions" that need to be met) that it won't happen to DeRo. You said earlier that he hasn't been injury prone, which is true (except for recurring hamstring issues at the start of 2009 and the injury to his ACL earlier in his career).

If you said three years ago even, "sign him to a DP for God's sake," I would jump right on. But we live in reality, unfortunately. Your logic isn't convincing me and I sincerely hope it doesn't convince MLSE either.

[Roogsy]

Wonderfully put.

- Scott

Tell me Scott, how old was GBS and JPA respectively during the DP contracts?

[tfc2007]

Montero hired a airplane company to fly a big cheque across the sky above Qwest Field. ;) ;)

I'd probably give Montero DP money. He's the future @ 23. Better player than De Ro. De Ro is near the end. De Ro is also not being tracked by Europe, and also doesn't have any sell-on value.

Good business for Seattle, really.

100% nailed itttt.

[Roogsy]

No one was making a strawman argument. I was just stating that your adulation of this player is acknowledged and might colour your decisions and opinion a little. However, I digress.

If you mean to sit there with a straight face and tell me that age and impact aren't related, then we have nothing to talk about. Age destroys players, and it can happen year-to-year. In fact, that is exactly how it happens, with the offseason a common point at which fitness walks out and never comes back the same.

It has happened countless times, but you insist (without stating it outright, which is a cheap trick of discourse - you use terms like "qualifying conditions" that need to be met) that it won't happen to DeRo. You said earlier that he hasn't been injury prone, which is true (except for recurring hamstring issues at the start of 2009 and the injury to his ACL earlier in his career).

If you said three years ago even, "sign him to a DP for God's sake," I would jump right on. But we live in reality, unfortunately. Your logic isn't convincing me and I sincerely hope it doesn't convince MLSE either.

That's an unfair tactic DR. I am not saying age will not catch up to DeRo, but will YOU admit that age catches up to each of us at different points of our age? What evidence has there been that DeRo has begun a significant downslide of his career? Does the 17 goals not indicate that it's not the case....YET. Do players like GBS who are pushing 40 not indicate that while you make it a consideration, as long as the skill and physique cooperate, a player in the later portions of their career still have significant impact?

And hell...we're talking about a guy who has not even hit 33 yet! He's not Beckham who is turning 36 this year. Beckham's naysayers were saying the same thing and he proved them wrong. GBS came here and made kids 12 years his junior look silly. Marquez will be 32 at the start of the season. Are any of these guys making less than DP salaries?

You'd think you guys would have been making more noise about Mista and his million-dollar contract when age had obviously done HIM in instead of getting worked up about a guy who DID produce and is younger and yet made half as much. Where is the logic here?

[prizby]

thing i like about Montero.

23 years old
Still a lot of upside
CAN BE SOLD FOR MILLIONS SHOULD THE RIGHT OFFER BE RECIEVED

DP in the MLS terms is also about protecting your assets, giving them an opportunity to be compensated for what they could get in other leagues

[ginkster88]

Great move by Seattle. In DeRo news... guy makes another losing season all about him in front of the club's longsuffering fans. I hope he's wearing blue next year.

[DangerRed]

You'd think you guys would have been making more noise about Mista and his million-dollar contract when age had obviously done HIM in instead of getting worked up about a guy who DID produce and is younger and yet made half as much. Where is the logic here?

Age is the great equalizer, no matter when it affects a player. You mentioned Rafa and Beckham. Do you honestly think DeRo is in the same league? I mean, listen, we wear the same colours on Saturdays, but can you seriously tell me that DeRo and those players are of the same calibre? What about Thierry Henry?

DeRo has played in a league in which he can score consistently. He beats its defenders routinely, has excellent positional awareness most of the time and still pretty good pace. But he's not David Beckham -- decades of training and conditioning by some of the best fitness coaches in the world.

But you bring up Mista, and that's actually an excellent example of what I'm talking about. I made a ton of stink about Mista's age, fitness, attitude and playing ability (or what's left of it). He was old, unfit and not playing close to where he used to be.

All I'm saying is you can wake up a season from now and the only difference between Mista and DeRo might be the name on their shirt.

[Roogsy]

All I'm saying is you can wake up a season from now and the only difference between Mista and DeRo might be the name on their shirt.

Or we can wake up a season with DeRo playing in blue and we're bottom of the table again and DeRo has scored a dozen goals again and is heading towards division championships. Any speculation is useless unless you have historical data backing you up. If we saw a decline in DeRo this year you'd have a better case to say that next year he won't produce much. But since he in fact had a career this year, what physiological evidence do you have that his decline will begin next year?

[DangerRed]

Or we can wake up a season with DeRo playing in blue and we're bottom of the table again and DeRo has scored a dozen goals again and is heading towards division championships. Any speculation is useless unless you have historical data backing you up. If we saw a decline in DeRo this year you'd have a better case to say that next year he won't produce much. But since he in fact had a career this year, what physiological evidence do you have that his decline will begin next year?

Whoa, hang on.

you first accuse me of a strawman argument, and then bust out a pretty spectacular fallacy that renders anything I say meaningless because I can't foretell the future. You, sir, are a card. And here you had me thinking we were having an intelligent discussion. I don't think arguing with you will amount to much more than typing text on my laptop if you pull nonsense like that. Poor form, Roogsy.

Good night.

[Smokecell]

no it wont...but it won 2 canadian champ did it not,

not a great point to argue...Seattle won the US Cup those same 2 years - a far harder tournament to win and have made the playoffs the past 2 years. If anything that argues against DeRo....

Montero is very worthy of the slot if it keeps him in the league. MLS should've added a 4th "homegrown" DP slot to keep players from going to europe...or at least made the 3rd slot free if it's a Montero "homegrown" type DP signing as oppose to having to purchase it.


p.s by homegrown I mean guys that are signed internally from within the organization - not the textbook meaning for homegrown

[habstfc]

Montero is a pretty good player, but to assume he would go on and conquer vastly superior leagues is laughable. I think he himself realizes this, that is why he's signing on to stay here, otherwise he would go on to play in these leagues.

As for Dero his career speaks for itself. He deserves DP money, no question. What is it with toronto sports fans who continually shit on the player's who actually do things, whether it be on the ice, the field, the court or the pitch? Thank god this is the only toronto sports team I'm a fan of.

[Shakes McQueen]

not a great point to argue...Seattle won the US Cup those same 2 years - a far harder tournament to win and have made the playoffs the past 2 years. If anything that argues against DeRo....

Montero is very worthy of the slot if it keeps him in the league. MLS should've added a 4th "homegrown" DP slot to keep players from going to europe...or at least made the 3rd slot free if it's a Montero "homegrown" type DP signing as oppose to having to purchase it.


p.s by homegrown I mean guys that are signed internally from within the organization - not the textbook meaning for homegrown

I'd love to see a change in the rules that allows teams to spend whatever it takes to secure their own talent, for a flat cap hit (lower than the DP flat-rate).

- Scott

[prizby]

i'd give dero money if we can sell him for millions 2 or 3 years from now...end of story

THAT is why Montero got DP money!

[Roogsy]

Whoa, hang on.

you first accuse me of a strawman argument, and then bust out a pretty spectacular fallacy that renders anything I say meaningless because I can't foretell the future. You, sir, are a card. And here you had me thinking we were having an intelligent discussion. I don't think arguing with you will amount to much more than typing text on my laptop if you pull nonsense like that. Poor form, Roogsy.

Good night.

Not at all, simply following your own line of reasoning. You keep pointing to some concern about DeRo's decline in form this upcoming year because of his age alone and all I am asking for is your basis (beyond his age) for making such an assertion that the decline wil begin THIS year? Because if you have no evidence of any decline, then what's the worry based on, the number on his birth certificate alone? Seems to be minimal evidence considering what he was doing just a few weeks ago. And if there is nothing pointing to a decline over the next year or two, why would we worry now as opposed to 2 or 3 years from now when his contract is not an issue for us any longer? You admit you cannot foretell the future and yet you want people to trust your belief that DeRo is on the decline when the evidence to this point has not shown anything to indicate that? If you're not predicting the future, then on what basis are you claiming that DeRo's decline will happen this year?

I wasn't the one that was making his forward performance an issue. I have consistently taken the position that it is his historical performance and most importantly his recent performance THIS year that merits a look at his contract situation. That is what Seattle did with Montero. I am quite sure they are not making him a DP in the hopes that he stays with the team 10 years from now. This is solely a move to keep him on over the next couple of years while they make a run for the playoffs again and hopefully the finals. That is what most contracts are about. As would be DeRo's. If you consider that a dubious position to take, I'd be more than happy to hear how so.

[Roogsy]

i'd give dero money if we can sell him for millions 2 or 3 years from now...end of story

THAT is why Montero got DP money!

So you're saying that's the only reason why teams sign DPs?

[prizby]

So you're saying that's the only reason why teams sign DPs?

no i said that's why Montero gets DP money and DeRo isn't

[Roogsy]

I don't think whether or not DeRo does or does not ever get DP status has ever had anything to do with whether he can be sold for a profit. That's never been the issue. Most teams in MLS that use the DP slot have never had this in mind and to be honest, I don't believe that is why Seattle signed Montero to the DP slot either athough I am sure for them it would be a nice after-effect, I doubt that is what they are counting on.

[Smokecell]

I wasn't the one that was making his forward performance an issue. I have consistently taken the position that it is his historical performance and most importantly his recent performance THIS year that merits a look at his contract situation. That is what Seattle did with Montero. I am quite sure they are not making him a DP in the hopes that he stays with the team 10 years from now. This is solely a move to keep him on over the next couple of years while they make a run for the playoffs again and hopefully the finals. That is what most contracts are about. As would be DeRo's. If you consider that a dubious position to take, I'd be more than happy to hear how so.

You're missing the major point in this all....the Montero signing is not only a good soccer signing but a good business signing. he can only appreciate in value from here. Say in 3 years he goes to europe - Seattle makes out with $$$$$. At 31 dero's value is at it's peak and can only go down from here, TFC only stands to lose being locked into a DP contract with Dero when they have him contractually obligated for at least this next year to play at his normal salary.

[prizby]

I don't think whether or not DeRo does or does not ever get DP status has ever had anything to do with whether he can be sold for a profit. That's never been the issue. Most teams in MLS that use the DP slot have never had this in mind and to be honest, I don't believe that is why Seattle signed Montero to the DP slot either athough I am sure for them it would be a nice after-effect, I doubt that is what they are counting on.

Montero got it for a few reasons

1. He is YOUNG
2. He still has plenty of UPSIDE
3. He can be sold on for MILLIONS
4. He puts the ball into the back of the NET

i see DeRo fitting 1 out of 4 of these qualities

Most teams in the MLS use it to bring in marketable players or other player from other leagues that look to IMPROVE their team.

[Roogsy]

Or in the case of LA, to retain a current player.

In other words, the DP rule is flexible (as it should be) to be used by the respective teams as they see fit in order to benefit their club. There is no defined "way" of using the DP rule and therefore why Montero was given DP status will be different from whoever the next DP will be and the DP after that.

[Smokecell]

Or in the case of LA, to retain a current player.

In other words, the DP rule is flexible (as it should be) to be used by the respective teams as they see fit in order to benefit their club. There is no defined "way" of using the DP rule and therefore why Montero was given DP status will be different from whoever the next DP will be and the DP after that.

LA never used a DP slot on Landycakes....the MLS just stopped grandfathering his salary and circumventing the DP rules and decided on LA's behalf he was a DP once they moved to the 3DP system

[Roogsy]

It can be argued that the 3DP rule was put in place for LA for exactly this reason, because LA was facing down the barrell of a very difficult situation had they not been handed exceptions and new rules on a silver platter by the league.

The point is there are no rules. Most DPs in this league are not given that designation in the hopes of making money off of them down the road. Most of them are signed for impact on their respective teams. Montero's youth gives him the added benefit of hopefully having both impact as well as intrinsic value, but it's not a guarantee and I would have to think it's his impact that earned him the DP slot, not his eventual value down the road.

[prizby]

Or in the case of LA, to retain a current player to keep him from leaving the league!

In other words, the DP rule is flexible (as it should be) to be used by the respective teams as they see fit in order to benefit their club. There is no defined "way" of using the DP rule and therefore why Montero was given DP status will be different from whoever the next DP will be and the DP after that.

fixed

[Whoop]

Legitimate question, after DeRo honours this existing question, how many years would you sign DeRo to a contract?

He's at a stage where your best bet is to give one year contracts but will he complain about his salary half way through the year before signing another one?

Whether Mo screwed him or not, money was issue in Houston before and there was no Mo to blame.

This is a smart signing by Seattle.

[Smokecell]

It can be argued that the 3DP rule was put in place for New York for exactly this reason, because New York was facing down the barrell of a very difficult situation had they not been handed exceptions and new rules on a silver platter by the league.

The point is there are no rules. Most DPs in this league are not given that designation in the hopes of making money off of them down the road. Most of them are signed for impact on their respective teams. Montero's youth gives him the added benefit of hopefully having both impact as well as intrinsic value, but it's not a guarantee and I would have to think it's his impact that earned him the DP slot, not his eventual value down the road.

Also fixed...

[Roogsy]

Legitimate question, after DeRo honours this existing question, how many years would you sign DeRo to a contract?

He's at a stage where your best bet is to give one year contracts but will he complain about his salary half way through the year before signing another one?

Whether Mo screwed him or not, money was issue in Houston before and there was no Mo to blame.

This is a smart signing by Seattle.

I don't think anyone sees this as bad move by Seattle. Funny how they have had a DP in each year of their initial existance huh? I will never forgive TFC for their (sorry but there is no better word for it) stupidity. There is no good reason why TFC could not have made efforts to bring in stars or impact players from the very start. The more we move past the Mojo era, the more and more his incompetence is evident. By the time the first 10 year anniversary rolls around, hopefully we will have forgotten these dark years.

As for DeRo, honestly, I would sign him to a 2 year, 750k contract. I would drop JDG after his contract expires at the end of this year (I believe, I am not sure) and I would go after a bonafide superstar up top, a Raul-type player who is money in front of the net. I'd spend most of our current allocation and cap space on solid winger midfielders and I'd shore up our D with 1 or 2 more solid defenders. Whatever is left under the cap I would use on the bench.

[prizby]

i have a solution...let roogsy compensate DeRo what he feels he is worth and then let TFC sign 3 DP's

no more issues

[reggie]

im so fucked up reading all this...i think i need a holiday..i need some 420 action.can we please get a away game vs joe public

[Roogsy]

im so fucked up reading all this...i think i need a holiday..i need some 420 action.can we please get a away game vs joe public

I am not kidding, the solution to the TFC nightmare? Gamewatching FC Barcelona. Join us next time! :D

[reggie]

i may take u up on that,,,where do u guys watch? joes?

[Roogsy]

We watched the last game at the Twisted Kilt but we have often watched it at Joes as well. Good times.

That's it for my plug.

[BS1327]

This will only benefit the league and Seattle in the end.
With Seattle offering Montero a DP contract, they can sell him to a European team next winter transfer for more money, seeing as Montero is in demand and the teams will pry him away with more money than Seattle is paying him.. Great business deal for Seattle!

[phonzo]

lol...love the dero spill over.

[Brooker]

Or we can wake up a season with DeRo playing in blue and we're bottom of the table again and DeRo has scored a dozen goals again and is heading towards division championships. Any speculation is useless unless you have historical data backing you up. If we saw a decline in DeRo this year you'd have a better case to say that next year he won't produce much. But since he in fact had a career this year, what physiological evidence do you have that his decline will begin next year?

Where was DeRo from June until October? Not scoring goals, that's for sure.

[Nuvinho]

Saborio becomes RSL's DP

http://www.sltrib.com/sltrib/home/50784824-76/saborio-designated-player-rsl.html.csp



After weeks of complex international negotiations, Real Salt Lake has signed forward Alvaro Saborio to a long-term contract that will make him the first “designated player” in the professional soccer team’s history.
A team spokesman confirmed Wednesday that Major League Soccer has approved the deal, which includes the next two years guaranteed and each of the subsequent two years at the team’s option. If he plays out the life of the contract, Saborio will remain in an RSL uniform through the 2014 season.
Financial terms were not immediately disclosed.
But Saborio certainly will become the highest-paid player in team history, knowing that league rules allow teams to pay designated players as much as they want, with only the first $335,000 counting against its salary budget. Teams can reduce the amount applied to its salary budget using allocation money.
Saborio will become one of 12 designated players in MLS.
He joins an impressive list of others that includes Landon Donovan and David Beckham of the Los Angeles Galaxy, Thierry Henry and Rafa Marquez of the New York Red Bulls and Nery Castillo of the Chicago Fire. Already this offseason, Omar Bravo joined Sporting Kansas City as its first designated player, while the Seattle Sounders are expected to make Fredy Montero their third designated player on Wednesday.
A native of Costa Rica who played in the 2006 World Cup, the 28-year-old Saborio led RSL with 18 goals in all competitions in his first season with the team, on loan from FC Sion in Switzerland. His loan deal expired Wednesday, though, and the team had been at work on a new contract since its season ended unexpectedly in the first round of the playoffs.
General manager Garth Lagerwey had to negotiate not just with Saborio and his agent, but also FC Sion and Deportivo Saprissa of Costa Rica, which owned a portion of Saborio’s contract. Saborio had played for Saprissa from 2001-2006, before moving to FC Sion.
Signing Saborio had been RSL’s top offseason priority, since it knew it was losing forward Robbie Findley and would need a strong attacking presence when it plays in the quarterfinals of the CONCACAF Champions League in February.
Next up for Lagerwey will be trying to work out a new contract for young striker Paulo Junior, who joined RSL during the season on loan from minor-league Miami FC

[boban]

But wait, the DP rule wasn't designed for players already in MLS!

Couldn't be that contracts are given based on performance could it? That's crazy talk.
Well if you read the whole post, and if the article is to be believed, Montero is being courted by European clubs. haven't heard anything like that about DeRo.

[DichioTFC]

Where was DeRo from June until October? Not scoring goals, that's for sure.

Well, except for the seven goals he scored August 21, September 18, September 25, October 2 and October 23....

Still, DeRo isn't Montero. DeRo should not be compared to Montero. DeRo should not be getting Montero money.

[Section 117]

But wait, the DP rule wasn't designed for players already in MLS!

Couldn't be that contracts are given based on performance could it? That's crazy talk.


Both Montero and Saborio from RSL were loaned to their respected MLS squads they were not under contract with the MLS... Roogsy there is a big difference between these two and Dero.

At the end of the day if MLS gives Dero DP money the only good thing is we cap relief as he makes over 400K which IMO is pretty good for this league.I would give him a max 2 year extension at DP money so when he is 33 or 34 we can relevaluate the situation. I would then EXPECT a home town discount if he decides to continue playing.

But when Dero starts his decline and is no longer producing 15 goals and we are paying him DP money I can't wait for everyones reactions on this board and Roogsy defedning him..... :D

[Jeffro]

How many fucking DeRo threads do we need? I hope they trade him so we can stop tallking about this. See how divisive it is with the fans? I wonder how divisive it is in the dressing room as well.

[Whoop]

^^
LOL

Touche.

[C.Ronaldo]

dero can make more money marketing himself in Toronto than anywhere else in the MLS.

I hope he considers that.

I personally say pay the man

[MartinUtd]

Jesus reading these first few comments gave me a headache.

True or false: DeRo got a new contract for more guaranteed money when he joined TFC?

It's not our fault he's a bad negotiator.
End of discussion.

[Juanito]

How many fucking DeRo threads do we need? I hope they trade him so we can stop tallking about this. See how divisive it is with the fans? I wonder how divisive it is in the dressing room as well.


Interesting you brought this up. How does MLSE view him? If they view him as an integral part of the BUSINESS PLAN (marketing, on-pitch product, goodwill), then I think they would probably resign him this offseason as a DP for two or three years based on his performances. I think it's important to note that he has been our only consistent goal-scorer.

If MLSE does not think this way, they may just trade him at his request.

Personally, I think they will bite. In general, the fans love him, they want to do something nice and have a nice PR campaign around re-signing him. Considering all the bad press they have, DeRo is a relatively cheap bargain all things considered.

The big IF is whether the new GM thinks he's a cunt or not.

[Chevy]

You're missing the major point in this all....the Montero signing is not only a good soccer signing but a good business signing. he can only appreciate in value from here. Say in 3 years he goes to europe - Seattle makes out with $$$$$. At 31 dero's value is at it's peak and can only go down from here, TFC only stands to lose being locked into a DP contract with Dero when they have him contractually obligated for at least this next year to play at his normal salary.

True.

Regardless of what Seattle is paying Montero, there is a good chance that they can recoup that investment with a future transfer - in essence getting his playing services for nothing (or at a huge discount).

Forgetting for one minute the fact that shelling out $1M+ for DeRo is flat out ridiculous, he's also an asset that has a ROI of zero.

[Yohan]

Montero is a pretty good player, but to assume he would go on and conquer vastly superior leagues is laughable. I think he himself realizes this, that is why he's signing on to stay here, otherwise he would go on to play in these leagues.

you sure about this? you never know until you go to europe and see.

see clint dempsey and IMO montero is more better than when dempsey left MLS for europe

[Yohan]

Jesus reading these first few comments gave me a headache.

True or false: DeRo got a new contract for more guaranteed money when he joined TFC?

It's not our fault he's a bad negotiator.
End of discussion.
it's really his fault that he didn't ask for DP when he signed for TFC eh? then again, he already got a massive raise (from 150k per year) to max non DP money

[Chevy]

^^ I think he was making 300K+ when playing for Houston.

And yes, it's his and his agent's fault for not getting all the supposed promises in writing.

[Azerban]

^^ I think he was making 300K+ when playing for Houston.



yeah, they doubled his salary the year before he came, and he got another raise coming here

2007 he was making 150k though

[Brooker]

Well, except for the seven goals he scored August 21, September 18, September 25, October 2 and October 23....

Still, DeRo isn't Montero. DeRo should not be compared to Montero. DeRo should not be getting Montero money.

But I never said he didn't score in October. My bad for missing the other ones but still, 4 goals from June to the end of September is very underwhelming for a DP. That's only a goal a month in the most important part of our season.

[J .]

Montero showed up for Seattle when it counted. DeRo disappeared for two months this season, disappeared in NY last and did nothing for the CMNT during qualification except complain.

No DP for MeRo.

[ag futbol]

Edit: I'm going to re-write this

What are these arguments talking about exactly? Dero scored 5 more goals (in two less games) and played on a terrible team.

As for the "Dero disappeared for month X". Please provide some solid evidence. The numbers don't indicate it, his goals are not chunked in one portion of the season any more than of the other top scorers. Not to mention we didn't even sign this guy as a goal scorer in the first place. He just picked up the slack from an absolutely atrocious striker force.

Where was Dero is the wrong question to ask. Where was the rest of this team, where was the production from the flanks? It didn't exist. It took Lindsay all of three or four games to practically equal the output of guys who had played an entire year. Disgraceful.

[habstfc]

Just a question how many goals has montero scored the last 2 years and how many has dero scored last 2 years, too lazy to check myself, league only goals I'm talking about.

[Azerban]

Just a question how many goals has montero scored the last 2 years and how many has dero scored last 2 years, too lazy to check myself, league only goals I'm talking about.

22 in 56 for montero, 26 in 55 for dero

18 assists versus 9

[ochos]

People on here are pitiful. Give the man a 1yr $500000 contract, a DP status and let's move on. Sometimes I really can't believe I'm supporting the same team as some of you - having to argue against giving a player more money who deserves it, based on apples to oranges comparisons of a 23 year old....

[DichioTFC]

But I never said he didn't score in October. My bad for missing the other ones but still, 4 goals from June to the end of September is very underwhelming for a DP. That's only a goal a month in the most important part of our season.

I know, i was just raggin on ya ;)

Your point is valid, he did disappear down the stretch. I don't equate that to a lack of effort, but to his age and his knees / legs gradually starting to fade.

[Brooker]

I know, i was just raggin on ya ;)

Your point is valid, he did disappear down the stretch. I don't equate that to a lack of effort, but to his age and his knees / legs gradually starting to fade.

Lol...Hell I don't really care DP or not anymore... but 1 goal in MLS between May 29th and September 11th is shocking considering how strong he started and finished the season.

[DichioTFC]

^ Exactly. The law of averages dictates that we're going to see less production from him in future years. We should let him ride out his current contract (which is pretty good value) and see if he wants to re-sign as a supersub in a couple years.

[Chevy]

People on here are pitiful. Give the man a 1yr $500000 contract, a DP status and let's move on. Sometimes I really can't believe I'm supporting the same team as some of you - having to argue against giving a player more money who deserves it, based on apples to oranges comparisons of a 23 year old....

I would agree with you in a heartbeat, but $500k won't make DeRo happy. He's looking for $1M plus, which I find ridiculous.

[jloome]

22 in 56 for montero, 26 in 55 for dero

18 assists versus 9

Someone remind me again why DeRo is a midfielder?

[MartinUtd]

Someone remind me again why DeRo is a midfielder?


Yeah no kidding. I'd be happy with Maicon, Barrett and DeRo up top and perhaps a Giovanni-type to link in between.

For the record I'm not against giving DeRo DP status, I just think he should honour his word. If he doesn't like it then too bad.

[Wull]

Can we leave canada out of this? I don't care who does what for them when it comes to matters that only affect TFC

[ag futbol]

Someone remind me again why DeRo is a midfielder?
Because it hurts his brain when you call him a striker (nobody's perfect). Anyway, from what i've seen I'd much rather have him play in the forward role.

Needless to say, I'm neutral as to what we do with him but i want fair value if a trade goes down. Considering were giving up one of the best players in the league, fair value is pretty high.

[rocker]

De Ro just doesn't function as a midfielder.
He doesn't pass to his teammates much, he runs into cul-de-sacs, etc.
He's best on the receiving end of passes or simply taking the scoring chances himself.