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TFC USA
08-24-2010, 08:57 PM
We were incredibly bad today but we weren't diving pricks like Arabe Unido. Then again diving usually isn't rewarded by a competent ref.

Go fuck yourself, referee. I'm sick and tired of CONCACAF bullshit.

As far as the team I hope Preki learned his lesson. The "B-team" you have is fucking shit and you should never play them in league competition again.

werewolf
08-24-2010, 08:58 PM
that match went about exactly as I expected.

brad
08-24-2010, 08:58 PM
CONCACAF at it's finest.

werewolf
08-24-2010, 08:59 PM
Moving forward, puts more pressure on us to win both games against Salt Lake.

TFC USA
08-24-2010, 08:59 PM
Our depth is an indictment on Mo.

I hope he gets the sack even if we make the playoffs.

shwade
08-24-2010, 09:00 PM
Will Preki have to answer for his bullshit decisions though since no one's down there covering the game?

TFC USA
08-24-2010, 09:00 PM
Moving forward, puts more pressure on us to win both games against Salt Lake.

Right now we're in a position where we might have to win every home game and win at least one road game to make the playoffs. DCU is winnable and everything else we should just forfeit.

razor787
08-24-2010, 09:00 PM
Is there any possible way to file a protest against that match? Absolute discrace. The ref was definately biased. And how the fuck did we only get 3 mins of stoppage? I had a feeling it was going to be that little, since the ref was such a fuck-up, but honestly, everything about that match was a discrace.

kaos197O
08-24-2010, 09:00 PM
Let's not forget the disaster that has been PREKI over the last few games.

Regardless of the bullshit refereeing, Preki's moves gave us no shot in Hell of winning this match!

TFC Cityboy
08-24-2010, 09:01 PM
fwiw this was my Facebook update around 8pm tonight

"prediction for TFC in Panama tonight: dirty cynical playacting home team aided by incompetant central american ref. Will be delighted and shocked if we get a result"

I must be a bloody octopus

ArmenJBX
08-24-2010, 09:01 PM
Fuck Arabe Unido, fuck their diving, crying, cheating players, and most importantly fuck that referee.

We should stop focusing on these games. I actually agree with Preki right now, play the B-Team and bow out with a bit of dignity. If winning the group means diving, whining, and playacting, and relying on a biased ref who probably gets paid by the card, then I don't even want to win this goddamn trophy. Let's focus on the league, where we can play against teams who actually have an ounce of integrity. I know MLS isn't the best league in the world, but it's certainly better then what those corrupt pieces of shit have. Let's focus on playoffs and competing for the MLS Cup AT HOME.

tl,dr: Fuck the corrupt CCL. Focus on MLS.

Oh, and as for Preki, yeah, you did your thing. I don't care. Mista was necessary today and you put on Joseph Nane...AGAIN. I hate the fact that you continue to play him. A true boss realized the team comes first, and just because someone doesn't like you doesn't mean the team has to suffer for it. We are paying fans, who demand to see top flight football. This is the second DP you seem to dislike. If you're not going to use them, stop paying for them. We needed a striker and you gave us Fuad Ibrahim. What are you thinking??????

Vince Whirlwind
08-24-2010, 09:02 PM
Preki shows his colours completely.

His personal stuff comes before his job.

Have lost respect.

pawlukj
08-24-2010, 09:02 PM
Concacaf is a joke, and it might be the downfall to this years team all the extra games needing to be played,

id much rather focus on making the playoffs than competing in this third world league

Blizzard
08-24-2010, 09:03 PM
Will Preki have to answer for his bullshit decisions though since no one's down there covering the game?

It was live on TV. If he doesn't have to answer for it tonight, he'll have to answer for it when he gets back home.

kaos197O
08-24-2010, 09:03 PM
Is there any possible way to file a protest against that match? Absolute discrace. The ref was definately biased. And how the fuck did we only get 3 mins of stoppage? I had a feeling it was going to be that little, since the ref was such a fuck-up, but honestly, everything about that match was a discrace.
The first half should have been 6.....I timed stoppages. They gave 2. Second half was the same! Arabe Unido should be banned from playing....if you that's what you can calling it. This is obviously geared to promoting football in countries that are less fortunate. Disgraceful!

redcard
08-24-2010, 09:03 PM
how does Garber expect MLS teams to take this competition seriously with shit like this?

AL-MO
08-24-2010, 09:03 PM
Is there any possible way to file a protest against that match? Absolute discrace. The ref was definately biased. And how the fuck did we only get 3 mins of stoppage? I had a feeling it was going to be that little, since the ref was such a fuck-up, but honestly, everything about that match was a discrace.

I wouldn't waste any time with that.

ag futbol
08-24-2010, 09:03 PM
We played like trash.

But that's not nearly as frustrating as watching the douche squad from panama roll around on the ground for 90 minutes.

CONCACAF is a fucking joke. Brings back memories of Paul Stalteri's penalty from the last gold cup and about 100 other cheating occurrences from past qualifications past.

tfcleeds
08-24-2010, 09:03 PM
Agreed...field Academy kids in the remaining CCL matches. This competition doesn't deserve TFC's attention.

koryo
08-24-2010, 09:04 PM
Didn't watch the match, but it sounds as though it was a combination of starting a less-than-starting-XI side and getting absolutely f*cking jobbed. Baldomero Toledo would have been welcome as ref tonight (unless he was the ref). Is that about right?

RPB_RED_NATION_RPB
08-24-2010, 09:04 PM
how does Garber expect MLS teams to take this competition seriously with shit like this?

ref this ..ref that...this game was lost because of PREKI!!!

J_Tibu
08-24-2010, 09:05 PM
It saddens me say that ref is from my home country.....lol

tfcleeds
08-24-2010, 09:06 PM
ref this ..ref that...this game was lost because of PREKI!!!

This match was a perfect storm: headscratching lineup selection by Preki, poor play on the field, and absolutely incompetent refereeing.

colman1860
08-24-2010, 09:06 PM
Go on, make yourselves feel better pissing on the referee. Red card for LaBrocca was 100% deserved, as was the second yellow against Ibrahim. The referee did not give a penalty against Kocic in the first half where any biased referee would have (not saying he should have, just supports my claim that the referee was in no way biased against us). We were simply fucking terrible (and a lot of that blame has to be placed on team selection)

Baggio2TFC
08-24-2010, 09:06 PM
I will have to agree with someone in the other thread....Win the Canadian Championship, then send out the academy and either lose 10-0 or break some f**king bones!!!

Vince Whirlwind
08-24-2010, 09:06 PM
You can blame the ref all you want...he was an utter disgrace...but the team from top to bottom played like shite and we deserved to lose regardless.

That line-up was about as stupid as putting on Joseph Nane when we were down a goal.

At least Ibbe won't be playing next game is about the only good I take from it.

kaos197O
08-24-2010, 09:07 PM
We should stop focusing on these games. I actually agree with Preki right now, play the B-Team and bow out with a bit of dignity.

Sorry but I call bullshit on that comment! You cannot give up without a fight. Why even bother to play so hard at Home only to throw in the towel. No free ride from me. The problems need to be fixed fast. It's crazy that we were playing fairly well and overnight it seems things have turned into a circus!

RPB_RED_NATION_RPB
08-24-2010, 09:07 PM
This match was a perfect storm: headscratching lineup selection by Preki, poor play on the field, and absolutely incompetent refereeing.

Bingo!

jimiv
08-24-2010, 09:07 PM
CONCACAF at it's finest.

You would think MLSE could come up with a few more $$$ then Arabe Unido could to pay off CONCACAF and their refs.

Blizzard
08-24-2010, 09:08 PM
Our depth is an indictment on Mo.

I hope he gets the sack even if we make the playoffs.

Our depth isn't really that different from any other team in the league. When two of your three starting strikers are injured and the third is sat down because Preki is annoyed at him, you can't blame it on depth, not in MLS.

There's no way you can hang this loss on Mo. Preki wouldn't play Mista, Preki didn't dress Adrian Cann, Preki subs in a defense oriented Nane instead of actually trying to pull a goal back by putting in the uninjured Mista.

Preki chose a sub-standard starting 11 in part because he wanted to show who's in charge.

Well thanks Preki, ya we know you're in charge and we also know that you threw away this match!

Greg
08-24-2010, 09:08 PM
I am incredibly angry right now. I don't understand how these refs can be allowed to work these games.

HOWEVER, the way to counteract all the crying and all the calls against us is to put DeRo, Mista, Frei out there and score some freaking goals. These panamanians suck! What we needed to do was put our A team and score 2-3 goals. I think we could've done it.

That way the ref would have a hard time influencing the game as much as he did here (ie. every call went against us)

I'd like Preki to explain why we let these 3 points get away by starting Kocic and Harden and Ibrahim. Or he should come out and say that we are not interested in CONCACAF.

ag futbol
08-24-2010, 09:08 PM
I will have to agree with someone in the other thread....Win the Canadian Championship, then send out the academy and either lose 10-0 or break some f**king bones!!!
Fuck what happened to the Martin Saric of earlier this season.

He might have only lasted five minutes on the pitch, but if he got a good shot or two in why not? Hell we're going to be sent off and disadvantaged for nothing, I want my pound of flesh.

gtaguy
08-24-2010, 09:09 PM
Our depth is an indictment on Mo.

I hope he gets the sack even if we make the playoffs.

Amen to that

ArmenJBX
08-24-2010, 09:10 PM
The Good
-The TV Broadcast featured replay editing from the 80s, not the 70s.
-Kocic was fairly competent. I guess...

The Bad
-The Referee decides to strut his shit.
-Playacting, diving, crying, and completely degrading football.
-Losing to a piece of shit team like Arabe Unido.

The Ugly
-You guessed it: Fuad Ibrahim and OBW.
-Preki being a pissy little bitch and not playing Mista.
-Corrupt, useless central american bullshit.

Other Thoughts:
Please, let's focus on the league. The MLS Cup is in Toronto. We're not going to win this tournament anyways, so let's not even waste our time and players. Use the academy from now on. Let's make playoffs this year, and focus on other shit later. Playoffs first Preki. We don't give a shit about the CCL, especially if it takes the loss of honour and integrity to compete in. Fuck the CCL.

TFC Cityboy
08-24-2010, 09:10 PM
Didn't watch the match, but it sounds as though it was a combination of starting a less-than-starting-XI side and getting absolutely f*cking jobbed. Baldomero Toledo would have been welcome as ref tonight (unless he was the ref). Is that about right?
the cnut tonight made Toledo look like Pierluigi Collina.

Super
08-24-2010, 09:10 PM
Didn't watch the match, but it sounds as though it was a combination of starting a less-than-starting-XI side and getting absolutely f*cking jobbed. Baldomero Toledo would have been welcome as ref tonight (unless he was the ref). Is that about right?

Spot on!

razor787
08-24-2010, 09:11 PM
Go on, make yourselves feel better pissing on the referee. Red card for LaBrocca was 100% deserved, as was the second yellow against Ibrahim. The referee did not give a penalty against Kocic in the first half where any biased referee would have (not saying he should have, just supports my claim that the referee was in no way biased against us). We were simply fucking terrible (and a lot of that blame has to be placed on team selection)


Card against labrocca was a 50/50 challenge, where LaBrocca got the ball first. That was not deserved as a card.

Ibrahim didnt even deserve a yellow. And the fact that he was given a yellow, and then a red 10 seconds later, when DeGuzman was protesting, boggles my mind.

The PK, I agree, was a pk. BUT I was shocked to see the Arabe player not protesting. THAT would be why the ref didnt give the PK.

If the ref thinks its a pk, but the player acts as if he fairly lost the challenge, then it wont be called. If he thinks its a pk, and gets the dispute, then it will be called.

ArmenJBX
08-24-2010, 09:12 PM
Sorry but I call bullshit on that comment! You cannot give up without a fight. Why even bother to play so hard at Home only to throw in the towel. No free ride from me. The problems need to be fixed fast. It's crazy that we were playing fairly well and overnight it seems things have turned into a circus!

I agree that his player choice was strange, but I see his logic. Why waste your time when you know you're going to get the famous CONCACAF shaft, and play all your starters. Fuck that shit.

However, Preki should have made the proper adjustments, like bringing Mista in. Other then that, if we just bowed out of this tournament and focused on the MLS, we'd be a lot more successful then failing at both at the rate we're going now.

Vince Whirlwind
08-24-2010, 09:16 PM
This whole idea of throwing the CCL is for losers.[/B]

I want TFC to want to win it all. That's all that matters.

Start a decent 11 down there and things might have been different. Preki is an arrogant fool that cost us a chance at this game as far as I'm concerned.

Heart of Stone
08-24-2010, 09:19 PM
Arabe Unido's antics were worse against Salt Lake last week...

kaos197O
08-24-2010, 09:20 PM
This whole idea of throwing the CCL is for losers.[/b]

I want TFC to want to win it all. That's all that matters.

Start a decent 11 down there and things might have been different. Preki is an arrogant fool that cost us a chance at this game as far as I'm concerned.
100% agree!

If we don't want to win it all then fuck playing all those matches leading up to it. Bow out in the Nutrilite Canadian Championships then. Don't waste the supporter's money on games only to check out at the later stages of the tourney!

Preki screwed the pooch on this one and has a huge fucking hole to climb out of now!

WE CAN WIN IT ALL!

TFC Bhoy
08-24-2010, 09:21 PM
Card against labrocca was a 50/50 challenge, where LaBrocca got the ball first. That was not deserved as a card.

Ibrahim didnt even deserve a yellow. And the fact that he was given a yellow, and then a red 10 seconds later, when DeGuzman was protesting, boggles my mind.

The PK, I agree, was a pk. BUT I was shocked to see the Arabe player not protesting. THAT would be why the ref didnt give the PK.

If the ref thinks its a pk, but the player acts as if he fairly lost the challenge, then it wont be called. If he thinks its a pk, and gets the dispute, then it will be called.Couldn't agree more, I was so confused! Ibrahim gets the yellow, then while JDG was talking to the ref somehow ibrahim gets a red?? It doesn't make any sense unless he swore at him or something. But it didn't even look like the ref was looking at Ibrahim, at first i thought JDG was actually getting the red.

TFC USA
08-24-2010, 09:23 PM
Time in and time out the summer is when we collapse.

That can't be coaching and players have come and gone so perhaps it's just Mo has built a team not equipped for greatness.

Greg
08-24-2010, 09:24 PM
Couldn't agree more, I was so confused! Ibrahim gets the yellow, then while JDG was talking to the ref somehow ibrahim gets a red?? It doesn't make any sense unless he swore at him or something. But it didn't even look like the ref was looking at Ibrahim, at first i thought JDG was actually getting the red.

And wouldn't he need to show a second yellow followed by a red if in fact he wanted to send off Ibrahim for arguing?

TFC Cityboy
08-24-2010, 09:26 PM
Time in and time out the summer is when we collapse.

That can't be coaching and players have come and gone so perhaps it's just Mo has built a team not equipped for greatness.

July onwards every bloody year. I'm at the point that I almost want us to nosedive so the shitshow in the FO gets turfed.

ArmenJBX
08-24-2010, 09:27 PM
It doesn't make sense. Let's be REALISTIC. We are not going to win the CONCACAF Champions League. It's not happening. No way. It's the equivalent of USA Winning the WC2010. They have a couple good performances, beat a couple big teams, but they're not going to win it. However, USA can win the Gold Cup. Same with TFC. TFC isn't going to win the CCL, but it CAN win the MLS Cup. If we continue to lose players due to CCL games, fatigue and mental tiredness coupled with demoralizing defeats will destroy both the CCL campaign as well as the playoff push.

It is for this reason that I stand behind the fact that we should aim for playoffs and nothing else. We are not Chelsea or Barca, we're not winning everything this year. What we can do is keep our goals realistic and attainable and work towards those, rather then living in dreamland and ruining what could have been.

ag futbol
08-24-2010, 09:30 PM
Time in and time out the summer is when we collapse.

That can't be coaching and players have come and gone so perhaps it's just Mo has built a team not equipped for greatness.
It's not terribly surprising.

We just have to be better at retaining the ball. Chasing the game in the heat is a losing strategy.

TFC Bhoy
08-24-2010, 09:35 PM
And wouldn't he need to show a second yellow followed by a red if in fact he wanted to send off Ibrahim for arguing?
exactly, another reason why i thought it was JDG getting a straight red at first, i was really confused

Vince Whirlwind
08-24-2010, 09:35 PM
It doesn't make sense. Let's be REALISTIC. We are not going to win the CONCACAF Champions League. It's not happening. No way. It's the equivalent of USA Winning the WC2010. They have a couple good performances, beat a couple big teams, but they're not going to win it. However, USA can win the Gold Cup. Same with TFC. TFC isn't going to win the CCL, but it CAN win the MLS Cup. If we continue to lose players due to CCL games, fatigue and mental tiredness coupled with demoralizing defeats will destroy both the CCL campaign as well as the playoff push.

It is for this reason that I stand behind the fact that we should aim for playoffs and nothing else. We are not Chelsea or Barca, we're not winning everything this year. What we can do is keep our goals realistic and attainable and work towards those, rather then living in dreamland and ruining what could have been.

100% Disagree.

Think there's less number of quality teams in the CCL to beat vs. the MLS cup. Montreal came very close last year and they had to play their USL league games just as we have to play our MLS season.

Nevermind the effect of creating a non-winning atmosphere in the room.

Reminds me of the mediocrity the Leafs have that "getting into the playoffs" is accomplishment enough. That hasn't worked out too well...

ofer
08-24-2010, 09:35 PM
I can`t believe some of the guys here blame the ref. or the diving, god , did u saw the game TFC was a joke, we can blame Preki or Mo, but the players on the field they are to blame, they should have play better then those collective of players from Panama that wouln`t make third team. Attacora last couple of games played very bad including red card and big reason for the own goal last Saturday, the other four defenders included the keeper are very rusty but even though they had to play better in order to show that they deserve first team and then we have Ibraim, honestly I thought this guy is a star but Preki gave him many chances and the guy refuse to take it last but not list is mr. White chance after chance and still can`t deliver. Last is MLSE they show us over and over it`s not about winning it`s about the money they can take home

ag futbol
08-24-2010, 09:37 PM
It doesn't make sense. Let's be REALISTIC. We are not going to win the CONCACAF Champions League. It's not happening. No way. It's the equivalent of USA Winning the WC2010. They have a couple good performances, beat a couple big teams, but they're not going to win it. However, USA can win the Gold Cup. Same with TFC. TFC isn't going to win the CCL, but it CAN win the MLS Cup. If we continue to lose players due to CCL games, fatigue and mental tiredness coupled with demoralizing defeats will destroy both the CCL campaign as well as the playoff push.

Oh it's possible. Montreal and PR both came pretty close.

But it's a hallow victory.

This contest is setup like a joke, the teams with the most talent take it like a joke, I could care less about any moral victory of taking this thing seriously when none else gives a rats ass and concashaft can't even be bothered to run it properly.

ArmenJBX
08-24-2010, 09:37 PM
Just be honest:

Would you rather fail at winning the CCL and qualifying for playoffs, or would you rather make playoffs and bow out of the CCL by playing the academy.

jazzy
08-24-2010, 09:38 PM
This whole idea of throwing the CCL is for losers.[/b]

I want TFC to want to win it all. That's all that matters.

Start a decent 11 down there and things might have been different. Preki is an arrogant fool that cost us a chance at this game as far as I'm concerned.

you do play to win......I'm dismayed at times why this team consistantly doesn't play it's best players....we are supposed to pay top dollar aren't we?...I'd rather go out fighting..with dignity..........watching this game gives those anti football pions fuel .......and I have no answer
Has anyone considered that the players too are pissed at Preki with his choice af starters!!!...and may have given up .....

Darlofletch
08-24-2010, 09:38 PM
wow, so many irritating things here, the super bouncy plastic pitch, annoying floppy players and an astoundingly ridiculous reffing performance. also luke and jason were clearly just commentating from a studio watching a tv which is very bush league.

however despite all the disadvantages we faced, that was still a very winnable game, they are nothing special and we could have easily got three points here if Preki had tried. We're not likely to get points in mexico or salt lake, yet we're now very unlikely to qualify without getting points there, this was the game where we should have been going for it.

What does Preki do? ibbe? white? gala? all at the same time? with de ro and mista on the bench? are you fucking kidding me? Then after bringing on De Ro, who does more in 5 minutes than the entire team did in the fist half, even down to 10 men, we could have gone for it and got something out of the game, they really were there for the taking.

what does Preki do? brings on joseph? and Gargan? are you fucking kidding me?

complain all we want about the ref but we got what we deserved from this game, I am very disillusioned and bitter about this. I've been very pro preki all season, but now? I find myself channeling my inner John Oliver

Go fuck yourself Preki.

Vince Whirlwind
08-24-2010, 09:41 PM
Just be honest:

Would you rather fail at winning the CCL and qualifying for playoffs, or would you rather make playoffs and bow out of the CCL by playing the academy.


If they do their best (coach and players) to win in both, I'd be happy with any result that transpires.

Play with dignity and give 100% at all times. That's all I ask of them as a supporter.

It's the BS of putting out that disgraceful line-up, poor play and Preki's obvious hissy-fit not playing Mista that leaves a bad taste in my mouth.

Chevy
08-24-2010, 09:42 PM
This match was a perfect storm: headscratching lineup selection by Preki, poor play on the field, and absolutely incompetent refereeing.

Very true, but the first two contributed to the loss much more than the third.

kaos197O
08-24-2010, 09:43 PM
Just be honest:

Would you rather fail at winning the CCL and qualifying for playoffs, or would you rather make playoffs and bow out of the CCL by playing the academy.
If only it was that simple! There's no guarantee that we would make eithe and that's why we don't bow out until we are out of the running.

Quitting is BULLSHIT!

TFC USA
08-24-2010, 09:44 PM
wow, so many irritating things here, the super bouncy plastic pitch, annoying floppy players and an astoundingly ridiculous reffing performance. also luke and jason were clearly just commentating from a studio watching a tv which is very bush league.

How is it bush league? I'd be shocked if that stadium had room for more than one commentary team.

Greg
08-24-2010, 09:45 PM
wow, so many irritating things here, the super bouncy plastic pitch, annoying floppy players and an astoundingly ridiculous reffing performance. also luke and jason were clearly just commentating from a studio watching a tv which is very bush league.

however despite all the disadvantages we faced, that was still a very winnable game, they are nothing special and we could have easily got three points here if Preki had tried. We're not likely to get points in mexico or salt lake, yet we're now very unlikely to qualify without getting points there, this was the game where we should have been going for it.

What does Preki do? obie? ibbe? white? gala? all at the same time? with de ro and mista on the bench? are you fucking kidding me? Then after bringing on De Ro, who does more in 5 minutes than the entire team did in the fist half, even down to 10 men, we could have gone for it and got something out of the game, they really were there for the taking.

what does Preki do? brings on joseph? and Gargan? are you fucking kidding me?

complain all we want about the ref but we got what we deserved from this game, I am very disillusioned and bitter about this. I've been very pro preki all season, but now? I find myself channeling my inner John Oliver

Go fuck yourself Preki.

That is the biggest thing. We could've had more chances in the second half. He should've brought Mista on. DeRo managed to change the game as soon as he came in. We just needed to press.

I can see Gargan being useful even if only for his long throw-ins but Nane made no sense to bring in even as we were starting to control the ball just a little.

reggie
08-24-2010, 09:45 PM
how can they try to sell tickets for the next 2 ccl games after a display like that..
MO MUST GO AND BRING THAT PRICKI WITH YOU..

Oldtimer
08-24-2010, 09:46 PM
Let's face it, this result was a deliberate choice by Preki, and represents a "roll of the dice."

Preki knows that 9 points can likely get us through, so he's counting on the home games and throwing the away games.

That's how he deals with fixture congestion, so that we can still make the MLS playoffs.

The risk is that sometimes you need 10 points to advance, so he is "rolling the dice."

TFC USA
08-24-2010, 09:46 PM
No matter how bullshit CONCACAF is it would be a disgrace playing academy kids in any CL unless you're way ahead in the standings.

SilverSamurai
08-24-2010, 09:48 PM
Oh it's possible. Montreal and PR both came pretty close.

But it's a hallow victory.

This contest is setup like a joke, the teams with the most talent take it like a joke, I could care less about any moral victory of taking this thing seriously when none else gives a rats ass and concashaft can't even be bothered to run it properly.
But it's our region. We're stuck with it, unless the CSA can somehow convince FIFA that we should move to UEFA or the Asian federation.

Why is CONCACAF less important than CONEMBOL, UEFA or Oceania?
Money? History (have to start somewhere), stadiums?
The current tourney just started, it'll pick up...

Just be honest:

Would you rather fail at winning the CCL and qualifying for playoffs, or would you rather make playoffs and bow out of the CCL by playing the academy.
Fail at CCL. Players learn and play against different opposition.
How often have people said that the atmosphere of BMO is threatening and that other teams crack under the pressure?
How does a player learn and get used to playing in hostile environments? Playing in them! Success in the CCL will translate to league play and national team play.

Heart of Stone
08-24-2010, 09:52 PM
Tonight's goal by Arabe Unido was weak... any discussion as to why Attakora was standing behind the goal line?

scut farkus
08-24-2010, 09:52 PM
Dero seems pretty pissed: http://twitter.com/dwaynederosario/status/22053509094
"Sorry to the viewers that watched that game. Embarrassing..."

Vince Whirlwind
08-24-2010, 09:52 PM
Let's face it, this result was a deliberate choice by Preki, and represents a "roll of the dice."

Preki knows that 9 points can likely get us through, so he's counting on the home games and throwing the away games.

That's how he deals with fixture congestion, so that we can still make the MLS playoffs.

The risk is that sometimes you need 10 points to advance, so he is "rolling the dice."

There's far less chance of us making the playoffs/winning anything in MLS than CCL if you look at the standings/opposition.

I can never understand why coaches don't START their better players and try and go for the first goal (which usually, more times than not, results in a positive result) instead of hoping your shlubs can pot a lucky one and pray they can hold on. If you get the lead, THEN take off your starters for rest and put guys like Nane and Gala on.

Makes so much more sense.

reggie
08-24-2010, 09:53 PM
this was the most winable game they had on the road,,,they had to play there best players and put the points in the bank... f u pricki...

Oldtimer
08-24-2010, 09:55 PM
If it was up to me, I would have gone all out to win this game, and played the scrubs against Cruz Azul (no MLS team has ever won in Mexico).

Greg
08-24-2010, 09:55 PM
Tonight's goal by Arabe Unido was weak... any discussion as to why Attakora was standing behind the goal line?

pretty sure it was gala who tried to clear it. attakora was jumping in front of it trying to block it if i remember correctly.

Blizzard
08-24-2010, 09:56 PM
I can`t believe some of the guys here blame the ref. or the diving, god , did u saw the game TFC was a joke, we can blame Preki or Mo, but the players on the field they are to blame, they should have play better then those collective of players from Panama that wouln`t make third team. Attacora last couple of games played very bad including red card and big reason for the own goal last Saturday, the other four defenders included the keeper are very rusty but even though they had to play better in order to show that they deserve first team and then we have Ibraim, honestly I thought this guy is a star but Preki gave him many chances and the guy refuse to take it last but not list is mr. White chance after chance and still can`t deliver. Last is MLSE they show us over and over it`s not about winning it`s about the money they can take home

Preki chose the starting 11 sitting a number of better players such as DeRo, Mista and Cann (who he didn't even dress)!

Blame the players if you want too but they did their best. Preki as their coach should know what their capabilities are and I believe he does. Preki tried to squeak by with a sub-standard line-up. Preki chose those guys to start.

This was Preki's doing.

Greg
08-24-2010, 09:56 PM
If it was up to me, I would have gone all out to win this game, and played the scrubs against Cruz Azul (no MLS team has ever won in Mexico).

Exactly. Get the points you know you can get with a proper squad and let the kids experience playing in a crazy game in mexico since you are not going to get those 3 points anyway.

Blizzard
08-24-2010, 09:57 PM
this was the most winable game they had on the road,,,they had to play there best players and put the points in the bank... f u pricki...

Absolutely. Three points here are insurance and assuming a home win against RSL is a very dangerous strategy.

backbeat
08-24-2010, 09:57 PM
as far as i'm concerned this is ALL Preki - period - full stop

sure the refereeing sucked, big time - no doubt - but Preki is so full of himself it hurts

he put a less than 'B' squad on the pitch for a game where we realistically could have got 3 points and entrenched ourselves at the top of the table - instead he pissed the game away - a game where we would have put a lot of pressure on the other teams and improved our chances of coming in the top 2 immensely

0 for 9 points in the last 3 games - THANK YOU PRICK-I!!!

Heart of Stone
08-24-2010, 10:00 PM
assuming a home win against RSL is a very dangerous strategy.

The upcoming three game series with Salt Lake, 2 at home and 1 away, 2 CL and 1 MLS, will truly show the world where we stand as a team...

ag futbol
08-24-2010, 10:02 PM
Why is CONCACAF less important than CONEMBOL, UEFA or Oceania?
Money? History (have to start somewhere), stadiums?
The current tourney just started, it'll pick up...

Because none of the important teams within our hemisphere take it seriously and the entire setup is fraught with problems. This is not UEFA or CONEMBOL, we are not testing ourselves against the "best of the best" within our region because they can't even be bothered to show up.

When Mexico (and to a certain extent MLS teams) start trotting out the A-roster every game, when we can count on at least having an official who is only somewhat horrible for an average game, when you don't have to travel practically 24 hours straight to a Tuesday fixture after playing a Sunday league match, that's when this thing deserves our time.

reggie
08-24-2010, 10:04 PM
what do you guys expect...they are a below 500 team going nowhere,they better win saturday or they can start to kiss the playoffs goodbye...
i wonder if mista is on a plane to spain tonight..lol

MO MUST GO AND BRING PRICKI WITH YOU.

reggie
08-24-2010, 10:10 PM
When i saw this line up tonight i turned off the tv...fuck i cant believe they didnt go for the 3 pts,,,why even bother flying dero and mista,keep them home rested for saturday game...what a bunch of fuckers,thank god i didnt watch that shit.

TFC Cityboy
08-24-2010, 10:14 PM
When i saw this line up tonight i turned off the tv...fuck i cant believe they didnt go for the 3 pts,,,why even bother flying dero and mista,keep them home rested for saturday game...what a bunch of fuckers,thank god i didnt watch that shit.
good choice...I do sometimes wonder why I watch this shower of shite on the road. It only makes me angry. It's been a train wreck since the 1st 4 away games in 07.

scooterTFC
08-24-2010, 10:16 PM
You pretty much had to know we were going to see the diving, acting, off the ball elbows and other antics from this opponent. And the refereeing was about same level that Canada has had to deal with in WCQ in Central America in the past. This is just how the game is played in that part of the world… its not going to change because this is the only way these little countries and clubs can compete with the bigger countries and clubs in the wealthier countries north of them. Does anyone remember that mess of a game Panama played vs. Mexico in the last Gold Cup? I don’t believe the ref fixed the match, he just got worked over by home sides tactics. Barely any CONCACAF ref’s can handle games played between Canada/US and any of the small Central American countries - the clash of styles just produces games that are impossible to ref. That’s a FIFA problem the Laws of the Game are incomplete and have not been uniformly applied across the region and around the world for far too long.


Having said all that, Preki’s line-up decisions were really puzzling. Didn’t he learn his lesson in that game against RSL earlier this year? Play the attacking starters in the first half and bring the defensive subs on for the 2nd half, if your key guys can‘t play 90. I actually expected to see him rest more guys from the starting backline then he did. I also thought it would have been a good game to move JDG to a more advanced top of the diamond central midfield role like he has played for Canada vs. central american teams.

backbeat
08-24-2010, 10:19 PM
i usually give the benefit of the doubt but i am sooo pissed with the team selection tonight - this was a winnable match and as far as i'm concerned it meant less to Preki than Toronto and to me that's a HUGE problem...

phonzo
08-24-2010, 10:21 PM
Let's face it, this result was a deliberate choice by Preki, and represents a "roll of the dice."

Preki knows that 9 points can likely get us through, so he's counting on the home games and throwing the away games.

That's how he deals with fixture congestion, so that we can still make the MLS playoffs.

The risk is that sometimes you need 10 points to advance, so he is "rolling the dice."

well said.

In the end we can blame shitty reffing (and boy was it shit) but our lineup wasn't going to be the most productive had the fixture been fair.

SilverSamurai
08-24-2010, 10:22 PM
Because none of the important teams within our hemisphere take it seriously and the entire setup is fraught with problems. This is not UEFA or CONEMBOL, we are not testing ourselves against the "best of the best" within our region because they can't even be bothered to show up.

When Mexico (and to a certain extent MLS teams) start trotting out the A-roster every game, when we can count on at least having an official who is only somewhat horrible for an average game, when you don't have to travel practically 24 hours straight to a Tuesday fixture after playing a Sunday league match, that's when this thing deserves our time.
I highly doubt the big UEFA clubs always bring out their A teams when they play the smaller teams from San Marino, Austria, Belgium or even Wales. (I don't watch the Euro teams so I'm just pulling random names out)
So how is it any different?
After Mexico the quality drops BIG time in the region, especially on the club level.

You pretty much had to know we were going to see the diving, acting, off the ball elbows and other antics from this opponent. And the refereeing was about same level that Canada has had to deal with in WCQ in Central America in the past. This is just how the game is played in that part of the world… its not going to change because this is the only way these little countries and clubs can compete with the bigger countries and clubs in the wealthier countries north of them. Does anyone remember that mess of a game Panama played vs. Mexico in the last Gold Cup? I don’t believe the ref fixed the match, he just got worked over by home sides tactics. Barely any CONCACAF ref’s can handle games played between Canada/US and any of the small Central American countries - the clash of styles just produces games that are impossible to ref. That’s a FIFA problem the Laws of the Game are incomplete and have not been uniformly applied across the region and around the world for far too long.


Having said all that, Preki’s line-up decisions were really puzzling. Didn’t he learn his lesson in that game against RSL earlier this year? Play the attacking starters in the first half and bring the defensive subs on for the 2nd half, if your key guys can‘t play 90. I actually expected to see him rest more guys from the starting backline then he did. I also thought it would have been a good game to move JDG to a more advanced top of the diamond central midfield role like he has played for Canada vs. central american teams.
+1.
Very confusing...

Heart of Stone
08-24-2010, 10:24 PM
Barely any CONCACAF ref’s can handle games played between Canada/US and any of the small Central American countries - the clash of styles just produces games that are impossible to ref. That’s a FIFA problem the Laws of the Game are incomplete and have not been uniformly applied across the region and around the world for far too long.

Paul Ward(Canadian) had a lot of difficulty with the RSL - Arabe Unido game...

TFC USA
08-24-2010, 10:29 PM
I highly doubt the big UEFA clubs always bring out their A teams when they play the smaller teams from San Marino, Austria, Belgium or even Wales. (I don't watch the Euro teams so I'm just pulling random names out)
So how is it any different?

It's very different when Chelsea or Arsenal or Inter Milan play their B teams. Why? Because they're the best teams in Europe.

Toronto FC is the best team in Canada but that's like being the sexiest woman at fat camp. TFC is a below-average MLS team with an awful road record so this B team is bullshit.

boozilla
08-24-2010, 10:30 PM
Shit game, Preki, OBW etc.
I'm getting really frustrated with JDG.
I used to like his little heads-up 360's after he collects the ball. But he's just been giving it away right after. It's not even that no-one is open, he just can't put two moves together.

Torontotonto
08-24-2010, 10:31 PM
ref this ..ref that...this game was lost because of PREKI!!!

+1 RPBREDNATION

Poor officiating for a FIFA sactioned match.

My Preki rating dropped tonight.

Why not start your best 11 in a Concacaf road game when away goals count +2 and hope you are up at half or later....then rest our best for RSL Saturday ?

Reminds me of the RSL away game (2-1) in May 1st when DeRo & DeGuz started on the bench.

Blizzard
08-24-2010, 10:35 PM
Paul Ward(Canadian) had a lot of difficulty with the RSL - Arabe Unido game...

He did but he called a great game. He gave full value to the stoppage time (eight minutes at the end of the second half), he saw the dives and he refereed an honourable game (and I'm referring to his game, not the game which was a bloody disgrace).

Azerban
08-24-2010, 10:40 PM
preki fucked up, clear and simple

fuck, we can never make things easy, can we

Torontotonto
08-24-2010, 10:46 PM
He did but he called a great game. He gave full value to the stoppage time (eight minutes at the end of the second half), he saw the dives and he refereed an honourable gme.

You gotta be kidding. :facepalm:

TheKing7
08-24-2010, 11:00 PM
I can't wait until an Arabe player flops at BMO, someones going apeshit.

Torontotonto
08-24-2010, 11:05 PM
I can't wait until an Arabe player flops at BMO, someones going apeshit.

I WILL BE
Dig a hole, bury him.

Blizzard
08-24-2010, 11:10 PM
You gotta be kidding. :facepalm:

Not at all. The ref did pretty well. He handed out a raft of yellows and two reds to the Arabe Unido side and it was totally deserved. He added on a ton of stoppage time not letting the Panamanian side get away with much in the way of time wasting. Ya he gave one yellow to the wrong guy allowing the fellow who should have gotten the yellow to finish the match. That wasn't good.

It wasn't an easy game for him but to my eye, his decisions were pretty much right on including the Penalty that allowed RSL to score the winning goal in the 93rd minute.

It was nice to see a referee add sufficient stoppage time for a change. Eight minutes! How often are you going to see that happen. Not often enough I'd say.

I can see how an Arabe Unido would not like the officiating but most neutrals would look at that match and the farcical way AU tried to manipulate the match and the referee and I think they'd believe the referee did all he could.

What more do you expect him to do? Sure some diving got through (it happens in every game) but I think he had a decent handle on what crap that team was trying to get away with and for the most part, he didn't let them get away with it.

Shakes McQueen
08-24-2010, 11:10 PM
Let's face it, this result was a deliberate choice by Preki, and represents a "roll of the dice."

Preki knows that 9 points can likely get us through, so he's counting on the home games and throwing the away games.

That's how he deals with fixture congestion, so that we can still make the MLS playoffs.

The risk is that sometimes you need 10 points to advance, so he is "rolling the dice."

Sounds about right.

My prediction: People who think Preki is terrible will explain why he's an idiot for fielding a bunch of sieves in a winnable road match. People who like Preki will explain why he's smart for resting key players during a CCL group-stage road fixture, because we have a congested schedule.

Both sides will curse and swear for a day or two on these boards, then slowly calm will return... just in time for the next game. And then we can do it all over again!

Can we at least all agree that Preki probably isn't pants-on-head retarded, and hence probably had a long-game strategy in mind when he decided to bring on defensive players in the second half (whether you agree with it or not)? I can't believe some people have already boldly declared that Preki threw this game because of "personal issues" with Mista. Fuck me.

- Scott

Huyton
08-24-2010, 11:13 PM
Perhaps Preki expected (at least) a couple of players to be red carded, and would rather have had the lesser lights unavailable for the home games.

If he'd started a very strong team, there's a possibility that:
1) Arabe would have kicked the living daylights out of them, and then he's got a worse injury problem.
2) Arabe dive all over the place and with the Central American refs, our best players are red carded.

Or both!

Which is exactly what happened. So, we still have our strongest team available for the home games.

There should have been enough talent on the field to handle the Panamanians. Keep it tight, and sneak a goal. It might have worked, too, if Gala was actually on the line rather than inside the net (surprised he didn't get a yellow card for leaving the field of play without permission).

So, if Central American refs always massively help the home team, then maybe that's just what we need when they come to BMO.

Super
08-24-2010, 11:53 PM
I'm less mad now that I've had a little time to put the game behind me. To be honest, this was a terrible game - and Preki and the team should be less than happy with the performance. This is all true. However, all is not lost, and if we can beat Arabe and Salt Lake at home, and maybe pick up a point in Salt Lake or Mexico City, then we should be good to go for at least a second place. Won't be easy, but then playing the MLS + CCL is not easy for any club. Sure, if we could spend tons of cash and add 10 players to the squad, yeah, then it'd be easier, but that's not reality. It is what it is, folks.

Also, let's not forget: there is more money and prestige in the MLS play-offs than the CCL. So what is Preki to do? Exhaust our very best players in the CCL - and then risk a loss on Saturday? It's a tough position to be in for him. Also, I don't think a coach or manager has EVER been fired because of a poor CCL performance. Not making the play-offs? Different story. Mo, and maybe Preki too, would get fired. These are facts! I wish the CCL was a bigger priority for every team in Concacaf, but it's just not - look at the attendance at most CCL games, it's faaar less than regular league games.

We'll consider this a wake up call, and then move on. Saturday is a terribly important game, and we (players as well as supporters) need to shake this game off of us asap. Just my 2 cents.

__wowza
08-24-2010, 11:54 PM
best first touch of the night:
gargan to chest. no yellow.

/thread.

reggie
08-24-2010, 11:55 PM
preki gambled and he lost,which we have been doing alot lately.
no excuse to lose to that team lastnight,

Stryker
08-25-2010, 12:11 AM
Sure I'll catch flack for this but here goes.
I saw no hustle, no fire, no passion and a general lack of concern from De Guzman tonight and I think to have him wear the captains band is a huge dis-service to the honor of this club.
You don't pin medals on mercenaries.

PS Preki's a fuckin idiot throwing away the only away game we had a good shot at winning.

Shakes McQueen
08-25-2010, 01:11 AM
Sure I'll catch flack for this but here goes.
I saw no hustle, no fire, no passion and a general lack of concern from De Guzman tonight and I think to have him wear the captains band is a huge dis-service to the honor of this club.
You don't pin medals on mercenaries.

PS Preki's a fuckin idiot throwing away the only away game we had a good shot at winning.

We don't even have a SHOT of winning in Salt Lake?

- Scott

Derko
08-25-2010, 05:01 AM
Preki shows his colours completely.

His personal stuff comes before his job.

Have lost respect.

The disgraceful officiating aside, Preki lost the match for us again, because of his arrogance, I thought he would bring some stability to TFC, which like all of our previous seasons, start of well but don't improve throughout the season, which in my opinion is a reflection on the coach's philosophy.
I am totally dissapointed in Preki's decisions last night, it was a very winnable match, even with the biased referee. Arabe-Unido are not that good, we lost to a very poor team.

Shame on Preki.

Yohan
08-25-2010, 05:23 AM
speaking of bad reffing, looks like Columbus got the shaft as well

http://www.goal.com/en-us/news/594/concacaf-champions-league/2010/08/25/2086558/concacaf-champions-league-santos-1-0-columbus-late-goal

The match was fairly even at the start but in the 21st minute Columbus appeared to have taken the lead. Emilio Renteria crossed the ball in from the right flank and Andy Iro headed a ball into the back of the net.


However, controversy ensued. Santos' sideline protested because Renteria was wearing a jersey with no number on it. Minutes earlier, Renteria took an elbow to the face and drew blood, forcing him to come back onto the field with a bandage and a new shirt. The shirt, though, had no number and thus he should not have been allowed back into the game.
a bit of fault on Columbus's part too, but would be nice to have a ref who knew the rules...

colman1860
08-25-2010, 05:52 AM
Weird situation in the Columbus game for sure...FIFA laws don't mandate a number. Whether the competition rules (CONCACAF) do is the real question...

Fort York Redcoat
08-25-2010, 06:54 AM
Go on, make yourselves feel better pissing on the referee. Red card for LaBrocca was 100% deserved, as was the second yellow against Ibrahim. The referee did not give a penalty against Kocic in the first half where any biased referee would have (not saying he should have, just supports my claim that the referee was in no way biased against us). We were simply fucking terrible (and a lot of that blame has to be placed on team selection)

The referee does more than hand out cards. An 18 to 9 foul count may look suspicious to some. Especially the 11-1 while we were full strength. Your claim needs more support.

I'd like to propose the genius of Preki playing bench players not in some mad Rafa rotation scenario but that he expected red card casualties in such a crooked game.:D

And regardless how crappy that squad played did anyone feel they were dominated by this terrible floppy team?

ganzo_thebest
08-25-2010, 07:25 AM
Go on, make yourselves feel better pissing on the referee. Red card for LaBrocca was 100% deserved, as was the second yellow against Ibrahim. The referee did not give a penalty against Kocic in the first half where any biased referee would have (not saying he should have, just supports my claim that the referee was in no way biased against us). We were simply fucking terrible (and a lot of that blame has to be placed on team selection)

you can't really say that....there were numerous phantom calls that the players didn't even get touched and it was a foul and there were many fouls on us he didn't think twice about....ref was horrible and our squad needed Mista...I hope Preki can get his shit together cause other wise we are going to be out of every competition

Derko
08-25-2010, 07:31 AM
Now that I am not as pissed as before, come on you reds, lets play with some passion on Saturday.

Detroit_TFC
08-25-2010, 07:33 AM
I'm still pissed off about this, I think we got the business last night. I don't see any reason to send a first team squad to Mexico City.

Oldtimer
08-25-2010, 07:35 AM
Perhaps Preki expected (at least) a couple of players to be red carded, and would rather have had the lesser lights unavailable for the home games.

If he'd started a very strong team, there's a possibility that:
1) Arabe would have kicked the living daylights out of them, and then he's got a worse injury problem.
2) Arabe dive all over the place and with the Central American refs, our best players are red carded.

Or both!

Which is exactly what happened. So, we still have our strongest team available for the home games.

There should have been enough talent on the field to handle the Panamanians. Keep it tight, and sneak a goal. It might have worked, too, if Gala was actually on the line rather than inside the net (surprised he didn't get a yellow card for leaving the field of play without permission).

So, if Central American refs always massively help the home team, then maybe that's just what we need when they come to BMO.

I think that was exactly Preki's idea. Play the "C" squad against a depleted Arabe Unido, hope to get a draw.

Preki only needs to win the 3 home games and get 1 draw to guarantee TFC in, if Cruz Azul, as widely expected, gets 6 points against the other 2 clubs. Even without a draw, TFC will be in unless RSL gets 6 points against Arabe Unido (in which case it gets more interesting).

Doing things this way gives TFC a chance to progress in the CCL, while maintaining a fresh squad for MLS action (and try to get in the playoffs).

Oldtimer
08-25-2010, 07:36 AM
I'm still pissed off about this, I think we got the business last night. I don't see any reason to send a first team squad to Mexico City.

Preki will send in the scrubs, for sure. No MLS squad has ever won in Mexico.

KRO
08-25-2010, 07:53 AM
5 Things To Take From This Game
1. Preki's priority is the MLS playoffs. Having wasted 2 hours of my life watching that fiasco last night I tend to agree with him.
2. Arabs United are probably the worst team we have ever played.
3. We are so bad away from BMO we can't even beat the worst team we have ever played!
4. Ibby and Gala are not even good enough to be depth players.
5. MLS refs are not as bad as we think they are.

ManUtd4ever
08-25-2010, 07:54 AM
I don't necessarily agree with Preki's starting lineup last night but he obviously felt that our reserves were capable of earning a result against Arabe Unido while resting key players for an important league match on Saturday with a playoff spot in the balance. Based on what I saw last night Arabe Unido was ripe for the picking, even against TFC's makeshift lineup. Unfortunately, the players did not perform well and were dealt two absolutely ridiculous red cards in the process. Nonetheless, TFC actually played a decent stretch in the 2nd half with DeRo on the pitch after Labrocca was sent off as they tried to get back in the game. What I can't comprehend is why Preki brought on TWO defensive subs in Gargan and Joseph with Mista on the bench and the club down a goal. Why did Mista bother flying with the club to Panama if he was never going to be utilized? Mista definitely could have made a difference in the last 30 minutes of the match. Despite blatantly bias officiating, last night was a huge opportunity wasted as a result of questionable personnel decisions by Preki...

ManUtd4ever
08-25-2010, 07:58 AM
5 Things To Take From This Game
1. Preki's priority is the MLS playoffs. Having wasted 2 hours of my life watching that fiasco last night I tend to agree with him.
2. Arabs United are probably the worst team we have ever played.
3. We are so bad away from BMO we can't even beat the worst team we have ever played!
4. Ibby and Gala are not even good enough to be depth players.
5. MLS refs are not as bad as we think they are.

LOL, agreed on all points!

Oldtimer
08-25-2010, 08:16 AM
5. MLS refs are not as bad as we think they are.

ALL CONCACAF refereeing is bad. It's just that US and Canada refs are the best of a sorry lot (plus there are a couple of good refs, such as Paul Ward of Canada).

__wowza
08-25-2010, 08:47 AM
what we're all forgetting is that we've dropped the easiest three points we possibly could've picked up on the road in this tournament. we could've taken an immense amount of pressure off of ourselves, but in typical MLSE fashion, we've shot ourselves in the foot.

blame the refs/mo/preki/players..
we shit the bed, it doesn't matter.

for everyone whose saying "start the B team! screw the champions league!" i'd like to go over the previous threads to see how many of us thought the champions league was more important than the playoffs because of the international prestige. we didn't beat cruz azul only to lose to these fucks, yet thats what happened. i was half expecting us to be the tottenham of the MLS; lose the league, win the odd cup. if we can't even do that, however, then we have a HUGE problem on our hands.

Fort York Redcoat
08-25-2010, 08:54 AM
what we're all forgetting is that we've dropped the easiest three points we possibly could've picked up on the road in this tournament. we could've taken an immense amount of pressure off of ourselves, but in typical MLSE fashion, we've shot ourselves in the foot.

blame the refs/mo/preki/players..
we shit the bed, it doesn't matter.

for everyone whose saying "start the B team! screw the champions league!" i'd like to go over the previous threads to see how many of us thought the champions league was more important than the playoffs because of the international prestige. we didn't beat cruz azul only to lose to these fucks, yet thats what happened. i was half expecting us to be the tottenham of the MLS; lose the league, win the odd cup. if we can't even do that, however, then we have a HUGE problem on our hands.

I really don't think it's the same people who prioritized the CCL before that are saying screw it now. And why bring up MLSE AGAIN. They didn't shell out the $$$ for the ref?

dupont
08-25-2010, 09:02 AM
I know TFC probably didn't play well but all I could think of for the entire match was how much I hated all the diving and crying and poor reffing.
If that game last night was how all soccer was played, I would simply stop watching the sport forever.

__wowza
08-25-2010, 09:30 AM
I really don't think it's the same people who prioritized the CCL before that are saying screw it now. And why bring up MLSE AGAIN. They didn't shell out the $$$ for the ref?

MLSE: nothing ever comes easy.
the best chances the leafs/raps ever had in the playoffs were when we just barely made it.

reggie
08-25-2010, 09:43 AM
im totally MISTAfied why pricki didnt play him last night...
thank god i didnt watch that shite last night..
how do MLSE have the balls to charge full price for the next 2 ccl games after giving away 3 pts last night...jus mail in the points to cruz and salt lake..

MO MUST GO AND BRING PRICKI WITH HIM..

Detroit_TFC
08-25-2010, 10:15 AM
If Mista was in, he probably would have been red carded and/or injured. Seriously. Even though Preki probably kept him out as a stupid ass punishment, it was a good thing in hind sight.

Phil
08-25-2010, 10:19 AM
im totally MISTAfied why pricki didnt play him last night...


I think because by the time it made sense to bring in Mista we were already down a man and Mista doesnt do defense too well.

ilikemusic
08-25-2010, 10:23 AM
Preki started a less than ideal team, but he has done that in the past, with positive results. This loss isnt on Preki, its not on the squad, it isnt even on Arabe Unido.

It is all on the ref; and I have no reservations about saying that. It wasnt diving by Arabe (though that contributed to the discrepency in free kicks), it was incompetence (or flat out dishonesty) on the part of this ref.

Labrocca's red card was bullshit. Ibrahim's was even more so.

Fuck this stupid tournament. I say we should play for wins at home, and play for blood on the road. There is no sense in wasting energy fighting an uphill battle against not just the opposition, but the officials as well.

Fuck! With this kind of bullshit its no wonder nothing CONCACAF does ever catches on. When people talk about North Americans ignoring football, I dont think they truly understand the abysmal level of quality and professionalism of this confederation.

Phil
08-25-2010, 10:23 AM
If anyone hasn't checked out TFC TV do so. The post game with Dero pretty much says it all. Frustration with the ref, with the opponent and admits that the team needs more heart, more bite and more fight.

Dave67
08-25-2010, 10:32 AM
Wow MLSE wants $47 for my 110 ticket. Oct 19 @ 8:00 pm. To watch that diving, complaining, horrific & disgusting team as an opponent.

You might want to re price this one MLSE.

Phil
08-25-2010, 10:34 AM
Wow MLSE wants $47 for my 110 ticket. Oct 19 @ 8:00 pm. To watch that diving, complaining, horrific & disgusting team as an opponent.

You might want to re price this one MLSE.

I agree but think about those friendlies too. Double the price and still get the C squad.

Ben - D.O.W.
08-25-2010, 10:38 AM
To those who think Mista should have started - he's older, knows a thing or two about being injured and in my opinion is important to our offence going forward. Is that the kind of guy you want starting in last nights game? I'd put money on him getting hacked down in no time if he started last night. Of course I also still don't buy this Mista vs. Preki thing but maybe that's just me.

__wowza
08-25-2010, 10:40 AM
how IN THE FUCK do people have de guz listed as MoM on the TFC website?

Dave67
08-25-2010, 10:41 AM
Imagine this very possible set up. TFC needs to win Oct 18 at home to advance. Attending the game means watching that pile of shit as an opponent and in all likelyhood having a heart attack or stroke in the stands at the bullshit that will go on.

Do you stay home or go? I don't know if I can stomach another 90 minutes of watching that Arabe Unido crap.

__wowza
08-25-2010, 10:44 AM
how is CONCACAF with fines? because if any one of them said something like this in the MLS im sure they'd be handed something.

http://www.torontofc.ca/sites/default/files/imagecache/extratime_intheirwords/Preki051510.JPG


"It's really hard to describe what's been going on today here. I would even have to say that it's an embarrassing thing for the competition to have this kind of refereeing for this kind of game. I'm speechless ... (we) really weren't given a chance to play. The referee found a way to kill this game." - Preki on the several foul calls and stoppages that disturbed any chance for Toronto to find a footing.



http://www.torontofc.ca/sites/default/files/imagecache/extratime_intheirwords/DeRosario032109.jpg


"It's tough because as a team you come into this game (after) long hours of traveling, hectic season and you have to put up with this kind of officiating. It's embarrassing really, CONCACAF should be ashamed of themselves. I know as players we are not supposed to talk about it but there's only so much you can take." - Dwayne De Rosario assesses referee Mejia's performance.



http://www.torontofc.ca/sites/default/files/imagecache/extratime_intheirwords/LaBrocca3.jpg


"Obviously you want to get something out of the game but there are a lot of things out of our control. I think the game was a bit of a joke, probably the biggest joke I've ever been a part of." - Nick LaBrocca didn't hold back any feelings on what transpired in Panama.

Carts
08-25-2010, 10:46 AM
how IN THE FUCK do people have de guz listed as MoM on the TFC website?

Because no matter what JDG does, there will be people who think he is great, and people who think he is shit...

Nobody seems to look at him with unbias eyes...

Seriously, JDG could score 2 own goals, and give away another for a 3rd, and people would say "...did you seem him control the game, he's class..."

AND... He could play a great match, have 99% possession rating, 99% passing rating, and even chip in a goal or two as a defensive mid, and some people would say "...he's shit, did you see that pass to nowhere in the 2nd half..."

For some reason, its all or nothing from most fans about JDG - and one of the most frustrating things I read after every game...

Carts...

ilikemusic
08-25-2010, 10:53 AM
how is CONCACAF with fines? because if any one of them said something like this in the MLS im sure they'd be handed something.

http://www.torontofc.ca/sites/default/files/imagecache/extratime_intheirwords/Preki051510.JPG


"It's really hard to describe what's been going on today here. I would even have to say that it's an embarrassing thing for the competition to have this kind of refereeing for this kind of game. I'm speechless ... (we) really weren't given a chance to play. The referee found a way to kill this game." - Preki on the several foul calls and stoppages that disturbed any chance for Toronto to find a footing.



http://www.torontofc.ca/sites/default/files/imagecache/extratime_intheirwords/DeRosario032109.jpg


"It's tough because as a team you come into this game (after) long hours of traveling, hectic season and you have to put up with this kind of officiating. It's embarrassing really, CONCACAF should be ashamed of themselves. I know as players we are not supposed to talk about it but there's only so much you can take." - Dwayne De Rosario assesses referee Mejia's performance.



http://www.torontofc.ca/sites/default/files/imagecache/extratime_intheirwords/LaBrocca3.jpg


"Obviously you want to get something out of the game but there are a lot of things out of our control. I think the game was a bit of a joke, probably the biggest joke I've ever been a part of." - Nick LaBrocca didn't hold back any feelings on what transpired in Panama.


:hump:

Love it!

That game was an absolute farce. If CONCACAF even thinks of fining these guys for their comments MLSE should just laugh in their face.

As I said before, I dont blame Preki or any players for that game. It was a farce orchestrated by the referee who was either completely incompetent, or unabashedly biased.

woolly
08-25-2010, 10:59 AM
This is what I took away from that 90 minutes of my life that I will never get back:

Dwayne DeRosario >>> Julian Deguzman
Gabe Gala >>> Faud Ibraham
Pile of Dog Crap >>> Marlon Mejia

Rudi
08-25-2010, 11:00 AM
I don't normally pimp my own blog on here, but I figured some of you might appreciate this one. It's my post-match thank you notes.

"Hello. Thank You." (http://bit.ly/djEDch)

scooterTFC
08-25-2010, 11:01 AM
I think those that are placing the blame singularly on the officiating are a bit narrow minded. Like I said earlier in this thread, the clash of styles just produces games that are impossible to ref. This would have been a challenging game for anyone to officiate. We all focus on the diving, acting from Panama. However we also need to remember that Canadian/American/MLS style of play is far more physical than how the game is generally played in Latin America. They have far less tolerance for physical contact in defensive challenges. They think our style of play is brutish and un-skillful. The growing disparity in the how the game is played and officiated within our confederation is a problem that can only be corrected by FIFA. They need to tighten up the rules to remove the regional ‘flavours’ that influence how the game is played and officiated. The written ‘Laws of the Game’ are uniform and universal however the style of play and application of the rules is dramatically different around the world. This game is prime example of that.[/font]

ACSertL
08-25-2010, 11:02 AM
Didn't watch the match but saw the highlights and the only thing I am going to comment on based on the highlights is LaBrocca's red card. It looked deserved; it was dangerous play regardless if it was a so called 50/50 ball. The replays I have seen did show contact with the goalkeeper's head, and despite the theatrics (if you want to see how a goalkeeper should react after getting kicked in the face, look up Thierry Henry and Hans-Jorg Butt on Youtube) that is dangerous play.

The rest of the game I cannot speak to.

scooterTFC
08-25-2010, 11:07 AM
This game reminded me of the Mexico vs Panama Gold cup match from 2009 - http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6LuzdjDmvX4&feature=related

You might remember the mexican coach got red carded. After going down a goal the Panamanian players made an absolute mess of the game trying to draw mexico into takeing more cards. I guess this is just how they play.

Technorgasm
08-25-2010, 11:10 AM
I must have been watching a different match.
the ref was TOTALLY pro-TFC.
kick aftger kcik, after kick. . . . he even called back a CLEAR goal to give us antoehr chance.
then awareded a nothing-kick and as the commentator said "TFC awarded yet again. . . and they can not even get it into the box"

it was a piss poor showing
we had every help from the ref
yes
it WAS that bad.

the REd was silly but. . . . could have gone either way.

Players need to front the blame here.
We need to front the blame her.
open up and take it up the arse. . . . well deserved loss.

dont agree?

eat it.

__wowza
08-25-2010, 11:16 AM
I don't normally pimp my own blog on here, but I figured some of you might appreciate this one. It's my post-match thank you notes.

"Hello. Thank You." (http://bit.ly/djEDch)


LOLOLOLOLOL. big up the senator kelly reference!

Carts
08-25-2010, 11:19 AM
The sad thing is, in my opinion, I don't think he was pro either side...

I just think that's the level of officiating down there...

They see the dives game in and game out - they see the fake acting game in and game out, and don't know whats fake and what's not...

When doing these CCL games, they see a slide tackle, see a guy in agony on the pitch, and go for the card...

They see the same thing with "gasp!" the keeper, and they pull out the red...

It sucks, it really sucks - but that's what CCL is... sadly...

Carts...

Phil
08-25-2010, 11:25 AM
^^^ agreed. I dont think he was out for us, I think inept is the word for him and to Arabe Unido credit they knew how to play to it.

Oldtimer
08-25-2010, 11:31 AM
I must have been watching a different match.
the ref was TOTALLY pro-TFC.

dont agree?

eat it.

I think you're a minority opinion here.

Oldtimer
08-25-2010, 11:33 AM
I don't normally pimp my own blog on here, but I figured some of you might appreciate this one. It's my post-match thank you notes.

"Hello. Thank You." (http://bit.ly/djEDch)

Good blog. Everyone should read it. My favourite quote:


Hello Marlon Mejia. Thank you for refereeing this match. Your calm, even-handed demeanour was a credit to your profession, and bucked the trend of your CONCACAF brethren. In no way were you going to fall into the age-old stereotype of corrupt officials from Central America with complete and contemptible bias against the team trying to play honourable football. Your two red cards against TFC players made sure of it. Those Toronto bastards were asking for it all night, what with their audacious attempts to take the ball away from Arabe Unido players and stop them from attacking. Where do those gringos get off?

GlenM
08-25-2010, 11:43 AM
My thoughts in Zen: (because I want to scream and run wild)

A) No experience in CL, no discipline, no heart, can't get results on the road.

B) Coach/Players made bad decisions, played crap, shite all around, ref was unreal - like approx. 20 fouls to there 5 fouls, 2 Red cards, looked like a kindergarden outside pitch only approx. 400 fans.

No excuse, you play and win as a team.

We can sit here again, whine, scream, throw up (believe me - I almost did last night even without drinking), do protest, wear whatever no going to change.

Bottom line, reminder this...

Dennis Green ring a bell...

Were who we thought were...

Decent, made progress in 4 yrs, inconsistent, can't get results on the road.

I'm not buying injuries, blah blah blah.

You play you best lineup no matter what and take your chances.

I understand and realize resting guys...

wtf was Mista doing there? getting some frequent flyers points?

This team better wake up now...brutal schedule.

Rant over...

Let's get pumped and bring it for Real Salt Lake on Sat.

This will be a measuring stick for sure, hopefully not up our butts.

One game at a time.

GlenM

Ossington Mental Youth
08-25-2010, 11:51 AM
I didnt think Harden was that bad out there in fact i hoped he was going to be playing CB.
Little miffed at why we played Kocic over Conway, suspect it was to cement who will be number two.
As for the rest we played like shit and Mista should have come on the second half. We didnt deserve the calls we got but we certainly did not out play our opponent.

TFC USA
08-25-2010, 11:57 AM
The problem I have with these arguments saying Preki put in a shit squad on purpose because it was a road game is that this was the worst team in the group and apparently we can be beaten at home after all.

You just can't take these risks. It's stupid.

TFC_Central
08-25-2010, 11:59 AM
not only the diving, the play acting, the cards. Also the foul count. Go back and watch the highlights again. The last fast break in extra time the forward for Aribe unido body checks hscanovic to open the play for his winger. Not even a peep. This looks more along the lines of match fixing then incompetence. As for the people wanting to give up their ticket, id be glad to take it and give those diving cunts, & their little man of a keeper a fair share of what i think of them. In spanish, of course.

wzhxvy
08-25-2010, 12:06 PM
I think Preki is on a path that is leading to no where. If he didnt want Mista to play down there, then why the freak did he ask him to make the trip ? But to put him as a sub and not bring him in...something stinks again with this club and their management.

Stryker
08-25-2010, 12:11 PM
Think this about sums it up...

http://suckiest.ytmnd.com/

Kaz
08-25-2010, 12:19 PM
That game was Preki at his finest. Preki is a points player not a every game matters Coach. So in his mind because of the issue with the train wreck at BMO this past Saturday, He needs to rest his best players for the game this week in MLS. And because we won the first game at Home in the CL last tuesday this game didn't matter as much. Add to his my way or highway style and lack of killer instinct, you have this game. It is pure classic Preki a great example as to why Chivas never made it into the group stage, and never made it far in the play-offs and why Preki was canned. Everything about his record says he isn't the Coach for TFC, but he and Mo are Friends... and MO is an idiot.

pawlukj
08-25-2010, 12:43 PM
lets not totally give up on preki yet, he has made a good impact on the club this year, i mean we were within arms reach from 2nd in the east, we have qualified this far for the CL , and were still not out of it ,

this has to be the turning point in the season, its either we move forward or we crash and burn right now, salt lake on saturday will be a good hint of where were heading towrds the end of the season

Heart of Stone
08-25-2010, 02:00 PM
At the end of the NYRB last Saturday DeRo admitted to being "fatigued" ... Preki did well to not play him in the first half last night... unfortunately he had to bring DeRo in for the second half...

Waggy
08-25-2010, 03:25 PM
I dunno how many of you got the opportunity to 'enjoy' the 'match' between Santos and Colombus after the TFC game, but I was so angry I was even looking for the Crew of all people to get revenge on behalf of our hemisphere. It was almost as large an abomination to fair play and the game of soccer as ours was. I was super excited about this tournament leading up to it, but after yesterday I think I'm done with it. Why worry or care about a tournament where the winners are pre-arranged? It's just aggravation. Yes TFC didn't play perfectly, yes Preki had some... questionable decisions (I don't mind Mista not playing on turf against a dirty team, but then why pull him at the half against the Shite Bulls?). But at no point yesterday did I feel that TFC had a legitimate chance to gain a point against that team of floppers with the assistance of all 4 refs. I actually thought TFC looked GREAT in the 2nd half, even with 10 men.

1 lingering question: what the fuck was with that random drop ball that ate up a minute of stoppage time in the 2nd half? And why did the ref take 50+ seconds setting that up, only to end the game at 3:14 or whatever it was? And don't even get me started on either red card. If I'm TFC from now on I go for the Canadian title as hard as possible, then send the academy to get experience in the CCL. That farce of a tourny doesn't deserve our support, our crowds, our money or our time.

Gwando
08-25-2010, 08:55 PM
To ALL TFC fans and anyone who is against match-fixing and that debauchle of a game last night..... CALL CONCACAF and make your voices heard. I just called and they are flooded with complaints. You all should call too! Phone number is : 1 (212) 308-0044

Pachuco
08-25-2010, 09:32 PM
I agree with the the few people that didn't think the ref was that bad. He really wasn't. Yes he called alot of fouls on TFC, but he was freeking consistent with them and we did nothing to adjust. We were always the agressors in that game, he didn't miss any fouls the other way (okay maybe the Hscanovic one where he got checked) but really, it's bedcause they weren't fouling us.

He's simply a ref that called a tight game and we did absolutely nothing about it except continue to foul them.

Don't get me wrong, they are little crying bitches who embelish everything but if it's not a surprise to the fans it shouldn't have been a surprise to the players.

As for the Ibbey red card. Stop listening to Jason Devos please, he's an absolute biased moron who has no place in play by play. As JDG goes to talk to the referee, Ibbey punches the air while looking directly at the ref (in a menacing way). All this happens on camera for everyone to see while Devos asks why Ibbey got the red. They replayed it three times, it was right in front of his eyes, and those of you that missed it it's probably because you were listening to him as opposed to actually watching the screen.

Pachuco
08-25-2010, 09:33 PM
To ALL TFC fans and anyone who is against match-fixing and that debauchle of a game last night..... CALL CONCACAF and make your voices heard. I just called and they are flooded with complaints. You all should call too! Phone number is : 1 (212) 308-0044

Do you have Preki's number instead? Pretty sure that's the person that needs to be questioned about match fixing.

Blizzard
08-25-2010, 10:41 PM
To ALL TFC fans and anyone who is against match-fixing and that debauchle of a game last night..... CALL CONCACAF and make your voices heard. I just called and they are flooded with complaints. You all should call too! Phone number is : 1 (212) 308-0044

No offence Gwando but in my mind I can hear Jack Warner laughing his head off. They really don't give a damn what we think.

Canada has been the victims of CONCACAF's incompetent officials time and time again and that just isn't going to change. They don't care what we think.

Whether you or I or anyone else think it's match fixing or just straight out crappy officiating (which is my view), CONCACAF doesn't care.

Phil
08-25-2010, 10:55 PM
Paulberirne tweeted this:

Had a convo with a CONCACAF official today. No love on last nights game but they told me our supporters are killing them! :))

KezmanCCCC
08-26-2010, 01:21 AM
Columbus' first goal last night vs santos was called back after the columbus player that provided the cross that created the goal was wearing a jersey with no shirt number... and the reason he had no shirt number was because a few minutes earlier he was fouled and was bleeding on his jersey and had to change it... what a reason to call back a goal... CONCACAF needs to looking into these matches after they are played and hand out suspensions/bans for poor officials...

Hooligan69
08-26-2010, 04:57 AM
The game and result were total rubbish. Absolute disgrace yet not the least bit surprising.

denime
08-26-2010, 05:38 AM
To ALL TFC fans and anyone who is against match-fixing and that debauchle of a game last night..... CALL CONCACAF and make your voices heard. I just called and they are flooded with complaints. You all should call too! Phone number is : 1 (212) 308-0044


Paulberirne tweeted this:

Had a convo with a CONCACAF official today. No love on last nights game but they told me our supporters are killing them! :))


Just to make sure everybody can see this again :D


CONCACAF Phone number is : 1 (212) 308-0044

Fort York Redcoat
08-26-2010, 06:34 AM
No offence Gwando but in my mind I can hear Jack Warner laughing his head off. They really don't give a damn what we think.

Canada has been the victims of CONCACAF's incompetent officials time and time again and that just isn't going to change. They don't care what we think.

Whether you or I or anyone else think it's match fixing or just straight out crappy officiating (which is my view), CONCACAF doesn't care.

I'm not going to dissuade Gwando or anyone who wants to make more of a ripple in the waters than bitching on our own interwebs.

And as for CONCACAF not caring? People said that about the CSA. I think we have their attention now.

It stinks right now. It doesn't always have to. Thanks Gwando.

bgnewf
08-26-2010, 08:42 AM
CONCACAF 1 - TFC 0. Arabe Unido Post Game V Blog

My video thoughts on the loss away to Arabe Unido including what it means for TFC, for the Champions League tournament as a whole and why Preki in my eyes missed a chance to snatch a victory on the road.

http://viewfromthesouthstands.com/2010/08/concacaf-1-tfc-0-arabe-unido-post-game-v-blog/

Waggy
08-26-2010, 12:59 PM
Preki has really been taking it on the chin for his starting lineup, I think the criticism is overdone.

To my count, he started 7 of 10 outfield players that he started against Cruz Azul (Attakora, Hscanovics, Usanov, LaBrocca, Saric, DeGuzman, White). The Cruz Azul game was generally considered to be TFC's best game in club history.

Considering the packed schedule, can you really blame Preki for trying to manage his lineup here. I'm sure he views MLS games as the top priority. Is he wrong to do that considering what we've seen in CCL? Joke refereeing, crowds in the hundreds. Is it really more important than MLS?

If you look at the outfield changes, it is Harden for Cann. I don't find this extremely controversial. Cann has been a complete workhorse, played almost every game. Surely he deserved a rest some time. Then it's Gala for Dero. Clearly Preki decided that he didn't want to use Dero for the full 90, so he chose to play him in the second half when the game is on the line. Considering the game on Saturday against RSL again I find this reasonable.

So the whole controversy really just comes down to one player Mista, an important player but just one. Could Preki have been saving Mista for RSL, it's possible. I personally think he's in Preki's doghouse for lack of effort against NYRB. Either way he had a reason.

I don't think it's illogical for Preki to think he had a very good chance of winning against a lesser opponent, fielding a team largely the same as the one he fielded against Cruz Azul, while holding back his star player for the second half. Aside from Mista he just dealt the cards at his disposal. He didn't start the Academy here, although based on quality of play it ended up looking that way.

I dunno who the hell you think you are coming around here with your 'logic' and 'rational thought'. Playing every game with the top squad worked for me in Fifa 11 god damn it! Rest is for the weak!

Also has anyone noticed most of the really anti-Preki people are also the hardcore anti-Mo people? As an anti-Mo guy, this baffles me. If TFCs problems are all Prekis fault, then Mo is doing a good enough job assembling pieces for him and he is misusing them. If it's all Mo's fault then Preki is doing the best he can with a limited roster that's poorly put together. It can be both of their faults, but then you can't lay absolute blame with either of them. Let alone both of them. The best you can say is that a poorly put together roster is being slightly misused. In which case- do you REALLY break out the torches and pitchforks for Preki, who in his first year who has already led TFC to our greatest success of yet, and alienated 2 players who we can say are either bat fits or bad signings to begin with? (albeit that modicum of success says very little). Or do we go after the man with the 5 year plan

woolly
08-26-2010, 01:28 PM
Considering the packed schedule, can you really blame Preki for trying to manage his lineup here. I'm sure he views MLS games as the top priority. Is he wrong to do that considering what we've seen in CCL? Joke refereeing, crowds in the hundreds. Is it really more important than MLS?

Whether the CCL or MLS is more important is irrelevent for this particular game. Considering playing at altitude in Mexico or Utah, this was the most winnable of the road games, so logic dictates that it was important to try and get the whole 3 points while we could. Although you could argue that we are on the cusp of the MLS playoffs and every point is more important than the opening of the CCL, every point is important at this juncture.


If you look at the outfield changes, it is Harden for Cann. I don't find this extremely controversial. Cann has been a complete workhorse, played almost every game. Surely he deserved a rest some time. Then it's Gala for Dero. Clearly Preki decided that he didn't want to use Dero for the full 90, so he chose to play him in the second half when the game is on the line. Considering the game on Saturday against RSL again I find this reasonable.

You miss the point here. There was no issue with Harden for Cann; Of the offensive players started we replaced two of our best attackers and most highly paid players with two depth players (Gala for DeRo and Ibby for Mista). As a result, there was no offence at all (except possibly to the fans). This was obvious to anyone watching the game for longer than 10 minutes. Preki subbed Gala off when he was obviously struggling with the heat, but replaced White with Peterson, leaving Ibby to be totally outclassed up front. Find me anyone that thinks that substitution makes sense except as spite.

Pachuco
08-26-2010, 02:20 PM
Preki has really been taking it on the chin for his starting lineup, I think the criticism is overdone.

To my count, he started 7 of 10 outfield players that he started against Cruz Azul (Attakora, Hscanovics, Usanov, LaBrocca, Saric, DeGuzman, White). The Cruz Azul game was generally considered to be TFC's best game in club history.

Considering the packed schedule, can you really blame Preki for trying to manage his lineup here. I'm sure he views MLS games as the top priority. Is he wrong to do that considering what we've seen in CCL? Joke refereeing, crowds in the hundreds. Is it really more important than MLS?

If you look at the outfield changes, it is Harden for Cann. I don't find this extremely controversial. Cann has been a complete workhorse, played almost every game. Surely he deserved a rest some time. Then it's Gala for Dero. Clearly Preki decided that he didn't want to use Dero for the full 90, so he chose to play him in the second half when the game is on the line. Considering the game on Saturday against RSL again I find this reasonable.

So the whole controversy really just comes down to one player Mista, an important player but just one. Could Preki have been saving Mista for RSL, it's possible. I personally think he's in Preki's doghouse for lack of effort against NYRB. Either way he had a reason.

I don't think it's illogical for Preki to think he had a very good chance of winning against a lesser opponent, fielding a team largely the same as the one he fielded against Cruz Azul, while holding back his star player for the second half. Aside from Mista he just dealt the cards at his disposal. He didn't start the Academy here, although based on quality of play it ended up looking that way.

That statement right there is at the center of the problem. If Preki seriously thought he had a very good chance of beating a central american team away from home with that lineup he's absolutely smoking shit. Regardless, it didn't work out, so it doesn't matter what his mentality was. The decision was obviously the wrong one.

Blizzard
08-26-2010, 03:34 PM
Columbus' first goal last night vs santos was called back after the columbus player that provided the cross that created the goal was wearing a jersey with no shirt number... and the reason he had no shirt number was because a few minutes earlier he was fouled and was bleeding on his jersey and had to change it... what a reason to call back a goal... CONCACAF needs to looking into these matches after they are played and hand out suspensions/bans for poor officials...

Having watched the replay, the play was offside. They made the right call but just by fluke.

The fact that a player was cut open and forced off the field for treatment with no punishment to the elbow wielding culprit is inexcusable.

Waggy
08-26-2010, 03:38 PM
Having watched the replay, the play was offside. They made the right call but just by fluke.

The fact that a player was cut open and forced off the field for treatment with no punishment to the elbow wielding culprit is inexcusable.

I saw that in the replay too, however in game you can see no offside was called. The linesmans flag was down, and no Santos player started pointing at the linesmen, nor did anyone make a motion to try and take a free kick at the spot of the offside. Additionally, if the goal had been called back for offside then why give the yellow card, since the 4th official waved the player on and he didn't impact anything? Also in the refs match report apparently it stated that the goal was disallowed for the jersey infraction. The fact that it was offsides just means not only did the 4th official and the lead one screw up, but so did the linesman.


Edit- Also fwiw Colombus filed an official protest with Concacaaf according to their BS forum.

Phil
08-26-2010, 03:40 PM
Having watched the replay, the play was offside. They made the right call but just by fluke.

The fact that a player was cut open and forced off the field for treatment with no punishment to the elbow wielding culprit is inexcusable.

It was offside. The call they made was the right one regardeless of whatever they said it was not a goal.

However, I have to ask, was it not a goal for legit reasons, or was it called back because the other side complained and the ref gave in.

To me, its worse if the ref appears to not hold his decision and I think that is where the Columbus guys get most of their frustration.

Blizzard
08-26-2010, 04:41 PM
It was offside. The call they made was the right one regardeless of whatever they said it was not a goal.

However, I have to ask, was it not a goal for legit reasons, or was it called back because the other side complained and the ref gave in.

To me, its worse if the ref appears to not hold his decision and I think that is where the Columbus guys get most of their frustration.

It's a good question. I'd like to know if the assistant actually blew the call and missed the offside. I'm presuming he did or the referee and fourth official could have saved themselves a lot of trouble by just saying "it was offside".

Yes, that is the bigger question. Did the ref wave the player on and if so, is the blame totally on the fourth official for allowing an improperly equipped player on to the field?

The fact that the fourth is Mexican only adds to the suspicion.

It's unfortunate that CONCACAF went with local fourth officials to save money (I believe I read that somewhere anyway). What happens if the man in the middle is injured and can't continue? Obviously the fourth is then moved into an onfield position (lines or centre) again opening up the possibility of bias infecting the match.

jimiv
08-26-2010, 05:01 PM
Just to make sure everybody can see this again :D


CONCACAF Phone number is : 1 (212) 308-0044


or you could email the whole executive commitee all at once...

salsan@itelgua.com; arielab@sinfo.net; captainburrell@hotmail.com; gcanedow@msn.com; afredo_hawit@yahoo.com; LAustinBRB@aol.com; chuck.blazer@concacaf.org; jack.warner@concacaf.org

Waggy
08-26-2010, 05:09 PM
It's a good question. I'd like to know if the assistant actually blew the call and missed the offside. I'm presuming he did or the referee and fourth official could have saved themselves a lot of trouble by just saying "it was offside".

Yes, that is the bigger question. Did the ref wave the player on and if so, is the blame totally on the fourth official for allowing an improperly equipped player on to the field?

The fact that the fourth is Mexican only adds to the suspicion.

It's unfortunate that CONCACAF went with local fourth officials to save money (I believe I read that somewhere anyway). What happens if the man in the middle is injured and can't continue? Obviously the fourth is then moved into an onfield position (lines or centre) again opening up the possibility of bias infecting the match.

What happened was the goal was scored (the linesmans flag was down). Colombus celebrated, Santos dejectedly walked back to their side. They were about to kick off when the 4th official called the lead official over. The Santos manager had been complaining. The 3 huddled for a moment or 2, then the goal was waved off and the Crew player was shown a card. Whether or not the play was offside and the goal shouldn't have counted is immaterial, it wasn't the call.

Pachuco
08-26-2010, 06:04 PM
Panama isn't exactly a giant on the world soccer stage. Why wouldn't he think he could beat them?

There weren't 10,000 fans throwing bags of piss and batteries at TFC, there were 200 people taking a siesta and filing their nails. It wasn't exactly intimidating. Arabe was also missing players through suspension, they weren't playing their full squad either.

How does your argument help Preki? even if I believe you that Preki thought we could beat them with that lineup. It's simple enough, we didn't. Therefore his decision was the wrong one. Therefore, how can Preki not take some of the blame for losing that game?

Roogsy
08-26-2010, 06:44 PM
How does your argument help Preki? even if I believe you that Preki thought we could beat them with that lineup. It's simple enough, we didn't. Therefore his decision was the wrong one. Therefore, how can Preki not take some of the blame for losing that game?


The way I look at it is:

If Preki gets credit when the team wins, why doesn't Preki take the blame when the team loses or drops points?

ensco
08-26-2010, 07:16 PM
Preki gave us the biggest win in team history, followed by two of the worst losses in team history. Plus a public spat with star player. All in 7 days!

The guy is a stress-production machine. TFC should have included zoloft with the season ticket package.

ensco
08-26-2010, 07:42 PM
Corleone doesn't get heart attacks, he gives them.

Blizzard
08-26-2010, 09:43 PM
The really maddening thing is that aside from the odd sideline outburst, he is only person connected to the whole enterprise (including supporters) who doesn't seem stressed. Mo looks like his head is going to explode.

Preki just sits there like his look-alike Michael Corleone whispering orders into the ears of his capos.

Your kidding aren't you? He's been going at fouth officials constantly this year. If you haven't seen it, well I guess you have just missed it but there are times when Preki reminds me of JC.

Pachuco
08-27-2010, 12:11 AM
You'll notice I did say "aside from the odd sideline outburst", so yes I've seen them. No way is he as bad as Carver, though. Carver was way more wound up. With Preki it's strategic, he blows steam then calmly returns to the bench. I don't think he's stressed at all. In interviews he's generally calm and cool. Carver would stew for days about things.

I agree with you here. I don't mind Preki's approach at all. He let's the official have it from time to time but that's it. I actually like the way he mans the sidelines. Gets up when he needs, talks to players when he needs to but he definately doesn't seem to over do it.

As for Preki though, I agree with Ensco. And it's not just about the last three games. Under Preki we have seen the absolute best and the absolute worst footie I have ever seen at BMO in the 3+ years this team has been together.

Shakes McQueen
08-27-2010, 12:41 AM
Under Preki we have seen the absolute best and the absolute worst footie I have ever seen at BMO in the 3+ years this team has been together.

I charge most of this to Mo Johnston. Even under Cummins, we saw what was ostensibly the "best and worst" this team had to offer to that point in our existence - remember the win against Chivas early in the season when they were the toast of the league? Or the "Mirace in Montreal"? Or for a low spot - the embarrassment by New York in the last game of the season has to be near the top, even still.

The one constant among all of our coaches has been Mo Johnston as the man behind the curtain, signing sieves and underwhelming Euro dropouts. He has had the odd stroke of competence, like Adrian Cann, but everything else has been a hodgepodge of inconsistent mediocrity. Even his DP signing has been woefully underwhelming (relative to his salary and DP status), and while I supported signing JDG, I'm not the one getting paid big money to make the right decisions.

At some point we have to stop the coaching carousel, and look elsewhere for the catalyst of this team's problems - and when you do, you quickly realize that there has only been one constant (that can be changed - MLSE aren't going to fire themselves as owners), and that constant is Mo Johnston.

I'm just so exhausted of the mediocrity. I almost think it'd be unfair to judge Preki at all, without giving him a season working under the wing of a competent GM. Coaching for a Mo Johnston-built team seems to be like boxing with one arm behind your back - you're at an immediate disadvantage. Mo can't even get the simple administrative stuff right, like trading and releasing veteran players with dignity (see: Robinson, Carl or Dichio, Danny).

- Scott

BS1327
08-27-2010, 01:10 AM
Edit- Also fwiw Colombus filed an official protest with Concacaaf according to their BS forum.

I was wondering why TFC isn't filing a protest against the red cards...

Gwando
08-27-2010, 10:31 PM
Sent one to all of them...thanks Jimiv

Super
08-27-2010, 10:52 PM
I was wondering why TFC isn't filing a protest against the red cards...

Maybe they already did, but they're keeping it away from the media and supporters. Not sure if that's the case, but I sure as hell hope that they did.