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kodiakTFC
08-19-2010, 02:36 PM
http://www.mlsplayers.org/files/august_12_2010_salary_information__by_club.pdf

Team Name Position 2010 Base Salary 2010 Guaranteed Salary

TFC Attakora-Gyan Nana D $ 4 0,000.00 $ 40,000.00
TFC Barrett Chad F $ 2 05,000.00 $ 212,500.00
TFC Cann Adrian D $ 5 6,592.00 $ 65,342.00
TFC Conway Jon GK $ 6 0,000.00 $ 69,833.33
TFC de Guzman Julian M $ 1 ,670,796.00 $ 1,717,546.00
TFC DeRosario Dwayne M $ 3 75,000.00 $ 443,750.00
TFC Frei Stefan GK $ 8 0,000.00 $ 135,000.00
TFC Gala Gabe D-M $ 4 0,000.00 $ 40,000.00
TFC Garcia Nick D $ 1 90,000.00 $ 198,750.00
TFC Gargan Daniel M $ 4 0,000.00 $ 40,000.00
TFC Gomez Emmanuel D $ 4 0,000.00 $ 45,600.00
TFC Harden Ty D $ 4 0,000.00 $ 40,000.00
TFC Herold Zachary D $ 6 0,000.00 $ 109,166.67
TFC Hscanovics Raivis D $ 1 14,000.00 $ 120,250.00
TFC Ibrahim Fuad F $ 1 00,000.00 $ 133,000.00
TFC Joseph Nane M $ 4 0,000.00 $ 40,000.00
TFC Kocic Milos GK $ 4 0,000.00 $ 40,000.00
TFC LaBrocca Nick M $ 7 7,000.00 $ 79,500.00
TFC Martinez Miguel "Mista" F $ 9 68,736.00 $ 987,337.50
TFC Peterson Jacob F $ 1 25,000.00 $ 143,000.00
TFC Santos Maicon F $ 9 3,000.00 $ 93,000.00
TFC Sanyang Amadou D $ 4 0,000.00 $ 46,555.55
TFC Saric Martin M $ 9 0,000.00 $ 90,000.00
TFC Usanov Maxim D $ 9 6,000.00 $ 102,250.00
TFC White O'Brian F $ 1 05,000.00 $ 182,000.00

ArmenJBX
08-19-2010, 02:38 PM
TFC Herold Zachary D $ 6 0,000.00 $ 109,166.67

Whaaaaaat? He isn't even playing for us! How is he making 100k+? Scratch that, how is he making ANYTHING?

kodiakTFC
08-19-2010, 02:40 PM
TFC Herold Zachary D $ 6 0,000.00 $ 109,166.67

Whaaaaaat? He isn't even playing for us! How is he making 100k+? Scratch that, how is he making ANYTHING?

Generation Adidas.

Heart of Stone
08-19-2010, 02:49 PM
I'm embarrassed that Attakora only makes $40 000 ... that's appalling for a guy who does so much week-in and week-out for us...

At $40 000/year with the expense of living in Toronto you're counting every dime...

kodiakTFC
08-19-2010, 02:51 PM
I'm embarrassed that Attakora only makes $40 000 ... that's appalling for a guy who does so much week-in and week-out for us...

At $40 000/year with the expense of living in Toronto you're counting every dime...

He probably still lives at home considering he's from here. But yeah, I agree, this kid deserves a massive pay raise. Gargan too!

Nodoubtguy
08-19-2010, 02:54 PM
Cann + Nana = less then Ibby???

Heart of Stone
08-19-2010, 02:55 PM
Cann + Nana = less then Ibby???

This needs to change pronto or both will look elsewhere to ply their craft... Cann - Vancouver, Attakora - Europe...

TFCtoMUFC
08-19-2010, 02:59 PM
Harden makes the same as Attakora LOL
Hscanovics makes more than Nana and Cann combined LOL

TFCDP
08-19-2010, 03:11 PM
Some of these numbers are just mind boggling... How pissed would you be if you were Attakora or gargan... U play that many minutes for the club and guys who don't even play are getting almost three times what you are... A hard pill to swallow for some of these guys.

woolly
08-19-2010, 03:15 PM
Gotta switch the salaries for Hscanovics and Nana... Nana's gotta stay!

And Garcia's salary still makes me wince, even though I know part of it is being payed by SJ.

KdotOdot
08-19-2010, 03:19 PM
Jacob Peterson makes how much?? The fuck is wrong with this world!

Mikey
08-19-2010, 03:22 PM
The whole wage structure in MLS is a complete joke. The cap is all about making sure the owners risk as little as possible, and traps the MLS as a farm league for second and third tier leagues overseas looking for upcoming players, and as a retirement league for hasbeens being payed outside the cap.

rocker
08-19-2010, 03:24 PM
Don't feel bad for Nana. I remember reading that some insiders said TFC has offered Nana much better $$$ but he's refused to see out the completion of his MLS contract.

Stuart Holden was making that same amount for years and every time the salaries were released, people couldn't believe it and felt sorry for him. But he was constantly refusing Houston's contract offers because he wanted to get out of his deal and go to Europe on his terms. Now he's in the EPL.

ArmenJBX
08-19-2010, 03:25 PM
Cap order should be

De Guzman
Mista
De Rosario
Chad Barrett
Maicon Santos
Nana Attakora
Stefan Frei
Adrian Cann
Nick LaBrocca
Dan Gargan
-----------

Everyone else should be 60K and below IMO.

rocker
08-19-2010, 03:26 PM
The whole wage structure in MLS is a complete joke. The cap is all about making sure the owners risk as little as possible, and traps the MLS as a farm league for second and third tier leagues overseas looking for upcoming players, and as a retirement league for hasbeens being payed outside the cap.

And it protects the league from turning into the NASL. The cap is useful.

If the cap didn't exist, we'd either be overpaying Americans due to domestic quotas, or without such domestic rules, we'd no longer develop any domestics cuz we could just buy Europeans.

woolly
08-19-2010, 03:34 PM
Cap order should be

De Guzman
Mista
De Rosario
Chad Barrett
Maicon Santos
Nana Attakora
Stefan Frei
Adrian Cann
Nick LaBrocca
Dan Gargan
-----------

Everyone else should be 60K and below IMO.

I agree except Frei should be making as much as Santos/ Barrett in the vain hope we can keep him a few years longer.

And I think that we could keep Nana for a few years before he decides to go to Europe; he's still pretty young. At least I hope: He and Cann should be solid for the CMNT for a few years.

DichioTFC
08-19-2010, 03:41 PM
Nana will be getting $75K next time around and, if his form holds, $110K.

I wouldn't worry about Nana too much.

ecospice
08-19-2010, 03:57 PM
How much does Preki make???

prizby
08-19-2010, 05:26 PM
3 mil on the NYRB sal cap

Stryker
08-19-2010, 05:31 PM
OBW and Peterson gots to go.

* ethier trade OBW now for something or let him go in the expansion draft.

ag futbol
08-19-2010, 05:42 PM
He probably still lives at home considering he's from here. But yeah, I agree, this kid deserves a massive pay raise. Gargan too!
He'll be getting his pay raise, here or elsewhere. TFC has been trying to extend him for a while but he's holding out.



Nana will be getting $75K next time around and, if his form holds, $110K.

I wouldn't worry about Nana too much.
Dunno where you're getting those numbers from but a defender with his skill set is worth much more than that.

Heart of Stone
08-19-2010, 05:43 PM
The thing that would piss me off if I'm Cann but even more so, Attakora, is not having any sort of a nest egg if heaven forbid a career-ending/altering injury occurs while only earning 40k-60k/year... it seems that what makes pro athlete's inflated salaries somewhat more palatable is the idea that their careers are a lot shorter(8-12 years) than the average person's...

Torontotonto
08-19-2010, 06:20 PM
Can't believe that they are paying Gargan, Cann, Attakora 40K ???
Doesn't make any sense to me.

troy1982
08-19-2010, 06:22 PM
The thing that would piss me off if I'm Cann but even more so, Attakora, is not having any sort of a nest egg if heaven forbid a career-ending/altering injury occurs while only earning 40k-60k/year... it seems that what makes pro athlete's inflated salaries somewhat more palatable is the idea that their careers are a lot shorter(8-12 years) than the average person's...

You make it sound like professional athletes are unable to work after their careers in sports.

Why don't you feel sorry for factory workers making $10/hr who aren't playing a sport they love for 2-4 hrs a week with no benefits or fame.

Blizzard
08-19-2010, 06:54 PM
The thing that would piss me off if I'm Cann but even more so, Attakora, is not having any sort of a nest egg if heaven forbid a career-ending/altering injury occurs while only earning 40k-60k/year... it seems that what makes pro athlete's inflated salaries somewhat more palatable is the idea that their careers are a lot shorter(8-12 years) than the average person's...

There are insurance policies for players. There would be something for him.

And I agree with Troy's comment. The working life will continue after his playing career is over.

Heart of Stone
08-19-2010, 07:09 PM
Why don't you feel sorry for factory workers making $10/hr who aren't playing a sport they love for 2-4 hrs a week with no benefits or fame.

Nobody should have to work for $10/hour ... everyone, especially factory workers, should play a sport they love...

KezmanCCCC
08-19-2010, 11:25 PM
all i can say is MO IS RETARTED... the club needs to sort out these salaries and really look and realize who our most valued players are... and compensate them accordingly... otherwise once these players start clueing in we might face losing some of our best and most beloved players....

jloome
08-19-2010, 11:33 PM
all i can say is MO IS RETARTED... the club needs to sort out these salaries and really look and realize who our most valued players are... and compensate them accordingly... otherwise once these players start clueing in we might face losing some of our best and most beloved players....

There's a certain irony in misspelling 'retarded', but the point is valid. OB White is not returning on $182,000 of guaranteed payout.

Toronto Ruffrider
08-20-2010, 12:05 AM
There's a certain irony in misspelling 'retarded', but the point is valid. OB White is not returning on $182,000 of guaranteed payout.

I would certainly hope not. Maicon is making barely half of that, and he's a way better player than White. So many salaries on our roster are inverted from what would be expected based on merit.

RPB_RED_NATION_RPB
08-20-2010, 01:52 AM
Attakora is getting raped..not only is this guy an everyday player.....he is our top defender in my book!!!

Gala makes as much as this guy......and he rides pine all season!!! what a joke!

How much does nana got remaining on his contract?

He's due for a hefty raise.....thats if we even get to see him do another term!!!

Thats the problem with this league...no f'in cash to keep these young prospects!!!

2.8m caps!!....JOKE!

torontocelt
08-20-2010, 06:11 AM
Unbelievably too much, this is insane:

Ibby (WTF?), White (WTF?), Garcia, Zachary, Peterson

Too much compared to others:

Raivis, Usanov

Not enough by a long shot:

Attakora, Gargan, Cann, Santos, La Brocca

Living in near poverty, buy them a drink not the other way round:

Harden, Gabe, Nane, Gomez etc

I really cannot believe the Ibby one, is he also GA?

White also is taking the piss, he should not be anywhere near a salary like that with the lack of talent he has, he must feel like he is the Houdini of football the way he has pulled the wool over everyone's eyes.

Wull
08-20-2010, 07:03 AM
this is just like being at the office, the useless and the lazy get paid better than the people keeping the ship steady!! DeRo, Nana and Frei should be at the top based on performance. The likes of Cann and Gargan getting paid more for the sheer effort and effectiveness and some of them should be embarrassed at the money they make compared to how they perform when judged against their teammates (no names, I'm not getting into this again)

ua-kozak_TFC
08-20-2010, 07:41 AM
no body mentions de guzman salary... I know this is no surprise and we known how much he is getting for a long time but... it still discusts me.

If you look at it closely deguz gets more money than Dero, Frei, Cann, Gargan, Barett, Attakora, Peterson, labroca, Maicon and sanyang put together AND you'd still save half a mill. The worst part is that the only player i think degus he might outpeform is sanyang. I know that he is canadian and all... but i think there are cunucks out there who will get you more bang for your buck... or even non canadians within the league...
Throw a half a mill on sharlie joseph and or beckerman and they would be better than deguz by miles...

ps: Other overpayed players are... Garcia and Obw.

Stouffville_RPB
08-20-2010, 07:54 AM
TFC have got alot out of players on or around the league minimum salary. For all the schtik we give Mo for the failed big signings there are some good players on very little.

Think that White, Peterson, Garcia are the most overpaid based on what they provide on pitch. If Ibby is no longer a Generation Adidas player that is a bad deal for TFC.

Maicon and Cann seem like good signings for the price. If Mista plays every game like the first half of the Cruz Azul game he is definately worth close to 1m.

razor787
08-20-2010, 07:54 AM
no body mentions de guzman salary... I know this is no surprise and we known how much he is getting for a long time but... it still discusts me.

If you look at it closely deguz gets more money than Dero, Frei, Cann, Gargan, Barett, Attakora, Peterson, labroca, Maicon and sanyang put together AND you'd still save half a mill. The worst part is that the only player i think degus he might outpeform is sanyang. I know that he is canadian and all... but i think there are cunucks out there who will get you more bang for your buck... or even non canadians within the league...
Throw a half a mill on sharlie joseph and or beckerman and they would be better than deguz by miles...

ps: Other overpayed players are... Garcia and Obw.

Not your money, why do you care?


One thing I do find kinda funny though. Garcia is making close to 200k, with 100 of that being paid by San Jose.

Even with SJ paying half his salery, he seems over paid :D

Oldtimer
08-20-2010, 07:55 AM
... but i think there are cunucks out there who will get you more bang for your buck... or even non canadians within the league...
Throw a half a mill on sharlie joseph and or beckerman and they would be better than deguz by miles...



You're assuming that we could get these players.
Remember, you'd have to trade to their clubs to get them. Who would you offer them?

De Guzman seems terribly under-rated by many. They are looking for a goal-scorer, which he isn't. He is a major reason why our defense is looking so good this year.

BTW, one man's "underpaid player" is another man's "great cap management" by MoJo.

You also have to look within the league context. Look at this article:


Only Los Angeles, Real Salt Lake, Columbus and FC Dallas are scoring considerably more than one goal per game, so it’s been slim pickings for many of the men up front in 2010.

http://www.socceramerica.com/article/39348/sa-rankings-slim-pickings-for-many-forwards.html

We're not alone.

razor787
08-20-2010, 08:04 AM
^agreed

They signed the contracts, and were fine with that pay, so people shouldnt be bitching to give them more, when they were fine with it. Especially in a capped league.

I also agree that DeGuzman is underrated. Many have said we have the best defence in the league this year, and DeGuzman is a vital piece to that, and also helps a bunch, holding up the ball, to get our forewards into position.

Everyone says they dont expect him to score, but they expect him to get a couple, which is ridiculous. Who cares who puts the ball in the net. Julain is a DCM, not a winger or striker. Look at his goal record for his other clubs, and you will see he has never been a goal scorer. Its not what he is paid to do.

ua-kozak_TFC
08-20-2010, 08:19 AM
Not your money, why do you care?


One thing I do find kinda funny though. Garcia is making close to 200k, with 100 of that being paid by San Jose.

Even with SJ paying half his salery, he seems over paid :D

Because it is MY CLUB!!!

That's why you should care too.

Wull
08-20-2010, 08:21 AM
why does everyone seem to think we're looking for goals out of de Guzman if we think he's not been a good signing? Believe me, I'm perfectly aware of what a holding midfielder is supposed to do and I don't see him being worth all the extra we're paying him over what Robbo was doing before him. Robbo won player of the year twice so I think TFC fans are generally aware of what the position entails.

In a lot of eyes, he simply hasn't been overly effective in that position and thus not worth the exorbitant salary he commands. His reading of the game is good but he loses out on a lot of tackles, gets knocked on his arse a lot and makes a lot of "bad" passes that give the opposition possession back. you can bicker all you like about what he attempts to do but if his passes are going to good space but not our players consistently he simply has to make the adjustments necessary so we retain possession

ensco
08-20-2010, 08:36 AM
How can we really evaluate these contracts without understanding when they expire?

Nana's situation is worrying. If he's potentially available on a free transfer as a 23 or 24 year old, my respect for him just got that much higher.

He could make millions if by then he's ready for Europe. Worst case, he could benefit from the limited form of free agency that was created in the new labor contract. Think Vancouver or Montreal wouldn't enjoy taking the best young Canadians off us?

bgnewf
08-20-2010, 08:41 AM
How can we really evaluate these contracts without understanding when they expire?

Nana's situation is worrying. If he's potentially available on a free transfer as a 23 or 24 year old, my respect for him just got that much higher.

He could make millions if by then he's ready for Europe. Worst case, he could benefit from the limited form of free agency that was created in the new labor contract. Think Vancouver or Montreal wouldn't enjoy taking the best young Canadians off us?

I have it on good authority that Nana has turned down on at least two occasions a contract extension with TFC that would have seen him get a substantial raise.

maninb
08-20-2010, 08:42 AM
Fuad, White, Garcia, & Herold....all that money WASTED!!! Makes me sick.....

razor787
08-20-2010, 08:45 AM
Because it is MY CLUB!!!

That's why you should care too.

Yes, but the majority of the money he is being paid, doesnt count against the cap. The only money you should care about, is the 375k or whatever it is, that goes towards the cap. Anything above that doesnt matter at all.

And, something i just realized. When a US team joins the league, and they get a few players to choose the players teams leave on the doorstep, a couple of those need to be domestic players.

Will that be the same case for Van and MTL?

If so, we will need to sign some crap academy players, to keep our canucks safe. We cant afford to lose any of them.

Stouffville_RPB
08-20-2010, 08:58 AM
Fuad, White, Garcia, & Herold....all that money WASTED!!! Makes me sick.....

Ibby and Herold signed with Generation Adidas and I believe GA contracts are a minimum of $100,000. So it isn't TFC offering them the contract and their salary's don't count towards the cap.

A large portion of Garcia's contract is being paid by San Jose (much like TFC with Robbo).

So really it's just White. At the time they signed him though he was 1 year removed from being the most dangerous striker in the NCAA and overall best player in college. He just hasn't lived up to expectations.

Yohan
08-20-2010, 09:03 AM
I really cannot believe the Ibby one, is he also GA?

White also is taking the piss, he should not be anywhere near a salary like that with the lack of talent he has, he must feel like he is the Houdini of football the way he has pulled the wool over everyone's eyes.
He signed a GA contract at age 16. Was considered one of top prospects in MLS 3 years ago. And he's only 18. Still got a lot of room to improve.

Why do people expect GAs to make immediate contributions? Yes, some GAs are NCAA players at 22, 23 yrs of age and they should be near finished products ready to step into MLS.

Guys like Ibby, Luis Gil (who is suppose to be the next hot thing but just got loaned to an USL club), other teeners are for the future...

Oldtimer
08-20-2010, 09:03 AM
why does everyone seem to think we're looking for goals out of de Guzman if we think he's not been a good signing? Believe me, I'm perfectly aware of what a holding midfielder is supposed to do and I don't see him being worth all the extra we're paying him over what Robbo was doing before him. Robbo won player of the year twice so I think TFC fans are generally aware of what the position entails.

I

Lots of people said Robbo was "overpaid" and couldn't believe we were "wasting cap space" on a DM. If he had been a DP, I could only imagine the flack he would have received. So, no, I disagree that TFC fans know the usefulness of that position.

Wull
08-20-2010, 09:11 AM
Lots of people said Robbo was "overpaid" and couldn't believe we were "wasting cap space" on a DM. If he had been a DP, I could only imagine the flack he would have received. So, no, I disagree that TFC fans know the usefulness of that position.


Then we'll agree to disagree on that. No harm, no foul (unless it's the ref from Tuesday!!)

Oldtimer
08-20-2010, 09:28 AM
Then we'll agree to disagree on that. No harm, no foul (unless it's the ref from Tuesday!!)

ha-ha!

Pachuco
08-20-2010, 10:30 AM
Yes, but the majority of the money he is being paid, doesnt count against the cap. The only money you should care about, is the 375k or whatever it is, that goes towards the cap. Anything above that doesnt matter at all.

And, something i just realized. When a US team joins the league, and they get a few players to choose the players teams leave on the doorstep, a couple of those need to be domestic players.

Will that be the same case for Van and MTL?

If so, we will need to sign some crap academy players, to keep our canucks safe. We cant afford to lose any of them.

This argument gets so tiresome. It matters, it matters alot. If you don't care that's fine, I do and so do others. If you don't think Deguzman's salary impacts MLSE and their decision to sign other DPs and their decision to raise ticket prices then fine, but I do and so reading this argument everyday is getting boring.

Pachuco
08-20-2010, 10:32 AM
Lots of people said Robbo was "overpaid" and couldn't believe we were "wasting cap space" on a DM. If he had been a DP, I could only imagine the flack he would have received. So, no, I disagree that TFC fans know the usefulness of that position.

You are generalizing based on what a few fans said. It's obvious considering he won back to back MVPs CHOSEN by the fans that TFC fans in in general know the value of the position. Your just choosing to point out the random people on an internet board that thought he was overpaid.

Pachuco
08-20-2010, 10:35 AM
He signed a GA contract at age 16. Was considered one of top prospects in MLS 3 years ago. And he's only 18. Still got a lot of room to improve.

Why do people expect GAs to make immediate contributions? Yes, some GAs are NCAA players at 22, 23 yrs of age and they should be near finished products ready to step into MLS.

Guys like Ibby, Luis Gil (who is suppose to be the next hot thing but just got loaned to an USL club), other teeners are for the future...

Seriously, if we weren't offering money to these prospects then what do you think would happen? We'd have a bunch of people bitching about how we lose young talent to Europe. There is only one way we can keep them here and that is by offering them a substantial amount of money (in MLS terms).

Wull
08-20-2010, 10:45 AM
Seriously, if we weren't offering money to these prospects then what do you think would happen? We'd have a bunch of people bitching about how we lose young talent to Europe. There is only one way we can keep them here and that is by offering them a substantial amount of money (in MLS terms).

I don't see why the league counts them against the cap, especially if they're going to be with the youth team or loaned out. Any youth product or draft pick under 21 should be given a pass for salary to encourage the club to develop them and have them around the squad

ArmenJBX
08-20-2010, 10:49 AM
I think that every player has the ability to go up to Mo and ask for a raise. What they are making now wasn't forced on them, they agreed to it. That being said, certain players got much better deals then others. Right now, it is up to Nana and Cann to go to Mo and demand better pay. Mo isn't going to give it to them on a silver platter if the players are just accepting what they're making, they need to go get it.

reggie
08-20-2010, 10:52 AM
i wonder if some of the lower paid players get any perks??rent,car,

Pachuco
08-20-2010, 10:53 AM
I don't see why the league counts them against the cap, especially if they're going to be with the youth team or loaned out. Any youth product or draft pick under 21 should be given a pass for salary to encourage the club to develop them and have them around the squad

But that's how it works as far as I know. Generation Adidas players don't count towards the cap. or am I wrong?

Pachuco
08-20-2010, 10:53 AM
i wonder if some of the lower paid players get any perks??rent,car,

Supposively you can't do this, having said that, who knows what happens behind closed doors.

ArmenJBX
08-20-2010, 10:57 AM
I think the one player on this list who probably deserves the money if he had his chance is Raivis Hscanovics. He was a beast down that left flank last game, and set up that Mista goal perfectly. The wingback play against Cruz Azul was Barcelona-esque.

Hopefully he gets his shot and we have a strong LB.

DangerRed
08-20-2010, 10:59 AM
If Nana's turned down contract extensions that would have given him big raises, he obviously has something in his back pocket.

I'd imagine if Cann keeps showing like he has been, he soon will be in the same position.

And there's already rumours of Frei leaving.

Frei aside, we're going to lose two guys who are rock solid at the back and that will only free up about $100,000 in cap space.

Anyone else see a looming problem?

menefreghista
08-20-2010, 11:03 AM
I think the one player on this list who probably deserves the money if he had his chance is Raivis Hscanovics. He was a beast down that left flank last game, and set up that Mista goal perfectly. The wingback play against Cruz Azul was Barcelona-esque.

Hopefully he gets his shot and we have a strong LB.

LOL. This is the same player that lost his starting spot to Nick Garcia of all players.

Oldtimer
08-20-2010, 11:48 AM
You are generalizing based on what a few fans said. It's obvious considering he won back to back MVPs CHOSEN by the fans that TFC fans in in general know the value of the position. Your just choosing to point out the random people on an internet board that thought he was overpaid.

It's the same "random" people who think De Guzman's overpaid.

Oldtimer
08-20-2010, 11:50 AM
This argument gets so tiresome. It matters, it matters alot. If you don't care that's fine, I do and so do others. If you don't think Deguzman's salary impacts MLSE and their decision to sign other DPs and their decision to raise ticket prices then fine, but I do and so reading this argument everyday is getting boring.

You say it matters, but you have no basis for saying that. Is it possible that you find the argument "tiresome' because the few people (less than 10 per my count) who are complaining have no basis for that complaint? The only thing that matters is the cap hit, because it's the cap hit that prevents us from signing other players.

Less than 10 people complaining out of over 2,000 active posters on this board. It's insignificant.

As far as ticket prices, they will be set based on supply and demand, and the team's record will affect that. What MLSE are paying one player doesn't factor in.

menefreghista
08-20-2010, 11:55 AM
As far as ticket prices, they will be set based on supply and demand, and the team's record will affect that. What MLSE are paying one player doesn't factor in.

This is a true statement that a lot of people don't realize.

Pachuco
08-20-2010, 12:33 PM
You say it matters, but you have no basis for saying that. Is it possible that you find the argument "tiresome' because the few people (less than 10 per my count) who are complaining have no basis for that complaint? The only thing that matters is the cap hit, because it's the cap hit that prevents us from signing other players.

Less than 10 people complaining out of over 2,000 active posters on this board. It's insignificant.

As far as ticket prices, they will be set based on supply and demand, and the team's record will affect that. What MLSE are paying one player doesn't factor in.

Ummm..no. The only thing that matters isn't the cap hit. It's the cap hit, the roster spot, the DP spot allocated to the player, the fact that every DP probably becomes a tougher sell to MLSE. The fact that having a significantly overpaid player on a team can cause locker room problems.

Regardless, that's not my point. It matters to me, and therefore I'm tired of hearing this argument. It matters to me whether Mo is significantly overpaying a player who in my opinion doesn't produce. I'm a paying customer, and it matters to me when a player is getting payed a shit load of money and taking a vacation while doing it. It's my personal opinion, it's my personal choice to make it matter to me.

It gets tiresome because you'd like me to change my opinion and not care, but I won't. So why do I keep on being questioned as to why it matters?

It doesn't make a different to you, it makes a difference to me, simple :)

Pachuco
08-20-2010, 12:36 PM
It's the same "random" people who think De Guzman's overpaid.

How do you come up with a statement like that? I never in my life said Robbo was overpaid and I think he was key in his time here. Also don't think we should have let him go.

On the other hand, you know what I think of JDG.

So where is this proof that it's the same random people?

Regardless, once again, the majority of people voted Robbo as the MVP for 2 years straight. That means the majority of people undersatnd the value of the position. Making your statement "TFC Fans don't understand the value of the position" innacurate. Even if a few people on the boards don't get it, they don't represent the entire TFC fan population.

torontocelt
08-20-2010, 12:39 PM
He signed a GA contract at age 16. Was considered one of top prospects in MLS 3 years ago. And he's only 18. Still got a lot of room to improve.

Why do people expect GAs to make immediate contributions? Yes, some GAs are NCAA players at 22, 23 yrs of age and they should be near finished products ready to step into MLS.

Guys like Ibby, Luis Gil (who is suppose to be the next hot thing but just got loaned to an USL club), other teeners are for the future...

If GA are picking up Ibby's wages then great. In short I think GA are crazy giving him that amount of money but that is up to them and I do understand that age counts against him and he could progress a lot in the next few years. I just think GA should offer these kids a whole lot less at that age, unless a kid looks like the next Pele I would not be offering them wages like that.

Oldtimer
08-20-2010, 01:02 PM
How do you come up with a statement like that? I never in my life said Robbo was overpaid and I think he was key in his time here. Also don't think we should have let him go.

On the other hand, you know what I think of JDG.

So where is this proof that it's the same random people?

Regardless, once again, the majority of people voted Robbo as the MVP for 2 years straight. That means the majority of people undersatnd the value of the position. Making your statement "TFC Fans don't understand the value of the position" innacurate. Even if a few people on the boards don't get it, they don't represent the entire TFC fan population.


It was not a majority of people who voted Robbo as MVP. It was a tiny minority that voted in an online poll.

BTW, I wasn't referring to you specifically as the "same random people." It's just that you can't dismiss other people on a message board as "random people" when you're just one individual yourself. You're entitled to your opinion, and I'm entitled to mine, but calling the arguments of people like me "boring" and calling them "random" just because they disagree with you is disrespectful.

You can give your reasons, and I'll give mine. In the end we can agree to disagree. Almost every player on our squad, including DeRo have had their haters on this board. You hate De Guzman, that's fine. But don't disrespect the people who disagree with you.

Yohan
08-20-2010, 01:03 PM
If GA are picking up Ibby's wages then great. In short I think GA are crazy giving him that amount of money but that is up to them and I do understand that age counts against him and he could progress a lot in the next few years. I just think GA should offer these kids a whole lot less at that age, unless a kid looks like the next Pele I would not be offering them wages like that.
aren't people ranting against the salary cap because it prevents clubs from offering players competitive wage against european clubs?

a lot of European scouts are paying attention to North America for talents now.

Pachuco
08-20-2010, 01:41 PM
It was not a majority of people who voted Robbo as MVP. It was a tiny minority that voted in an online poll.

BTW, I wasn't referring to you specifically as the "same random people." It's just that you can't dismiss other people on a message board as "random people" when you're just one individual yourself. You're entitled to your opinion, and I'm entitled to mine, but calling the arguments of people like me "boring" and calling them "random" just because they disagree with you is disrespectful.

You can give your reasons, and I'll give mine. In the end we can agree to disagree. Almost every player on our squad, including DeRo have had their haters on this board. You hate De Guzman, that's fine. But don't disrespect the people who disagree with you.

I don't know where your confusion started, but I'm not sure where you see me calling your arguments random.

As for calling them tiresome. Yes, because anytime anyone posts something about a DP being overpaid your argument comes out that they shouldn't care because we don't pay the bills. But people like me do care, so therefore the argument gets tiresome to address every time. In this specific case it's you trying to change the feelings of others, I'm not telling you to change your opinion, just saying, stop asking me or others not to care about overpaid DPs when they do.

jloome
08-20-2010, 01:47 PM
I don't know where your confusion started, but I'm not sure where you see me calling your arguments random.

As for calling them tiresome. Yes, because anytime anyone posts something about a DP being overpaid your argument comes out that they shouldn't care because we don't pay the bills. But people like me do care, so therefore the argument gets tiresome to address every time. In this specific case it's you trying to change the feelings of others, I'm not telling you to change your opinion, just saying, stop asking me or others not to care about overpaid DPs when they do.

You're making as much of an effort to convert him as he you, Pachuco. He said it was tiresome. He didn't say it had to be tiresome to you. People don't normally have to qualify everything they say with "but hey, that's just me permanently."

He thinks it's tiresome. You think it's not. The two of you disagreeing doesnt' make it any attempt on his part to invalidate your feelings.

Pachuco
08-20-2010, 02:00 PM
You're making as much of an effort to convert him as he you, Pachuco. He said it was tiresome. He didn't say it had to be tiresome to you. People don't normally have to qualify everything they say with "but hey, that's just me permanently."

He thinks it's tiresome. You think it's not. The two of you disagreeing doesnt' make it any attempt on his part to invalidate your feelings.

Huh? I said it was tiresome and he didn't like it not the other way around. Anyways, this is retarted, lots of misunderstandings going on here so let's just forget about it.

Oldtimer
08-20-2010, 02:12 PM
Sounds good.

Wull
08-20-2010, 02:13 PM
Huh? I said it was tiresome and he didn't like it not the other way around. Anyways, this is retarted, lots of misunderstandings going on here so let's just forget about it.

the whole jdg debate is tiresome. It's why I specifically avoided mentioning him in my post because it always denigrates into accusations of people not knowing the position, people giving him a break because he's Canadian arguments that never go anywhere and never get to the crux of the matter that either side is trying to get across

Pachuco
08-20-2010, 02:25 PM
the whole jdg debate is tiresome. It's why I specifically avoided mentioning him in my post because it always denigrates into accusations of people not knowing the position, people giving him a break because he's Canadian arguments that never go anywhere and never get to the crux of the matter that either side is trying to get across

Yes I agree. I personally pledge to stop talking about JDG. Unless I'm just directly commenting on his play in a post game thread or something.

v00d00daddy
08-20-2010, 03:32 PM
I get all of this angry, negative talk when we're shit. It makes total sense. But I don't get these conversations when we actually have something to be happy about/look forward to.

We've just come off the biggest win in this teams short history and our team has not lost in front of us at BMO in forever.

I'm finally on the way to being (somewhat) happy.

Not gonna bitch now about salaries.

As for the JDG/Robbo overpaid/value of the position/2 time team MVP conversation....all I can say is it's laughable...in all respects.

Laughable that those two guys are even mentioned in the same sentence.
Laughable that those two guys have cost the same amount of money (in terms of cap hit)
Laughable that Robbo was named MVP twice and some people here bitch about JDG.

I'm gonna keep laughing all the way to BMO tomorrow in anticipation of seeing TFC spank NYRB and more specifically....watching Cann totally neutralize Henry...which I see happening.

Can't wait.

Yohan
08-20-2010, 10:42 PM
interesting article on New England and how they managed their salary cap...

http://www.goal.com/en-us/news/1110/major-league-soccer/2010/08/19/2078739/new-england-revolution-comment-how-mls-crushes-dynasties

sidney
08-20-2010, 10:48 PM
Nana making chump-f-ing-change? Mojo (although I've generally approved of him for many years now), again seems to have no-f-ing-common sense or common decency!

SirBobSaget
08-20-2010, 11:10 PM
Nana making chump-f-ing-change? Mojo (although I've generally approved of him for many years now), again seems to have no-f-ing-common sense or common decency!

Its pretty obvious what the situation is here. Attakora signed a small contract while he was young and unproven. Then this year he turns out to be a very good DC, so TFC tries to sign him to an extension, but he refuses because he intends to play out his contract and walk over to Europe as a Free Transfer and collect huge $$$$. He's extra attractive with no Transfer Fee attached and will collect a premium salaray because the signing club doesnt have to fork out to release him from a contract.

Why would he sign to TFC for 4 years at 200k per when he can go to League One and make double that? And if he proves himself further, will make 7 figures in Prem.

Hes not settling for 40k right now because he has a low opinion of his abilities.

sidney
08-21-2010, 07:48 AM
Its pretty obvious what the situation is here. Attakora signed a small contract while he was young and unproven. Then this year he turns out to be a very good DC, so TFC tries to sign him to an extension, but he refuses because he intends to play out his contract and walk over to Europe as a Free Transfer and collect huge $$$$. He's extra attractive with no Transfer Fee attached and will collect a premium salaray because the signing club doesnt have to fork out to release him from a contract.

Why would he sign to TFC for 4 years at 200k per when he can go to League One and make double that? And if he proves himself further, will make 7 figures in Prem.

Hes not settling for 40k right now because he has a low opinion of his abilities.

hope you're right...at least for Nana's sake

Blizzard
08-21-2010, 08:39 AM
hope you're right...at least for Nana's sake

He's right.