CONCACAF Champions League/MLS Playoffs...

[ManUtd4ever]

Several supporters have commented on the significance of TFC competing in the CCL compared to MLS playoffs and I think this is an intriguing dilemna that Preki now faces with an unprecedented congested schedule on the horizon.

Ideally, we all hope for success in both league play and the CCL tournament. However, it is highly unlikely to achieve results in both areas given the demanding schedule and lack of depth on most MLS rosters, including TFC. Preki simply cannot dress our best starting 11 every match from this point forward.

Therefore, in your opinion, should Preki put more emphasis on the CCL group stage or should making the MLS playoffs remain his top priority?

As I've stated previously, I believe our top priority should be success in the CONCACAF Champion's League, despite the fact that the MLS Cup is in Toronto this year...

[J .]

I want to win the MLS Cup, but I think winning Champions League would be a bigger feat. It would be an amazing day if we could beat Cruz Azul in Mexico.

[Ageroo]

In my opinion CL....raising the international status of the club will in future put us on the radar for more high profile acquisitions...but only my opinion....and the fact that there is more prestige winning the CL than the MLS Cup...but again my opinion.

[H Bomb]

MLS is bush league. Champions league has a huge upside and the chance to become regionally recognized. But Preki will focus on MLS and we'll probably end up doing badly in both

[reggie]

In my opinion CL....raising the international status of the club will in future put us on the radar for more high profile acquisitions...but only my opinion....and the fact that there is more prestige winning the CL than the MLS Cup...but again my opinion.

yes...i totally agree with you on that,now if we could only get a gm with some international connections that would also help.

[mastermixer]

This year... I would love to win the MLS cup obviously because its at BMO.

If you ask me this any other year its CL no doubt.

[Ageroo]

We aren't going to get all the high profile players from the States.....that is a simple fact. Winning the MLS Cup just raises our status in the states.....and it really does not translate into us getting any top-notch Americans....however....moving along the CL route.....more internationakl audience...more players taking notice of our club....that translates to something in my opinion.

[DangerRed]

The CCL is much more important. However, there are three key reasons why Preki will focus on the MLS and at least hitting the playoffs:

1. The final is being played in Toronto - having a nice run into the playoffs will make us less of a laughing stock when we're not in the final. And if we do make it all the way, the bonanza is huge as the game is on our turf. We could actually win the cup.

2. Mo's gone if we don't hit the playoffs, and Mo signs Preki's cheque - Mo may have been down in Honduras for the match yesterday, but don't get it twisted: he wants those playoffs more than anything.

3. The casuals don't give a shit - yes, it's a tired argument, but it's true. Look at the attendance at the home CCL games so far. See the empty seats? That's what sets the agenda. CCL games get played Tuesday nights while MLS gets the weekends. What's more, there are tons more people at MLS games. MLSE would trade in our three-game CCL group stage run for three extra playoff matches in a heartbeat.

That's why you'd expect Preki to tap the Academy (aside from the obvious depth concerns we have) when Cruz Azul comes to BMO to steamroll right over us.

[clc12]

This year... I would love to win the MLS cup obviously because its at BMO.

If you ask me this any other year its CL no doubt.

i totally agree with you. being in the mls cup this year would be awesome.

[mastermixer]

The CCL is much more important. However, there are three key reasons why Preki will focus on the MLS and at least hitting the playoffs:

1. The final is being played in Toronto - having a nice run into the playoffs will make us less of a laughing stock when we're not in the final. And if we do make it all the way, the bonanza is huge as the game is on our turf. We could actually win the cup.

2. Mo's gone if we don't hit the playoffs, and Mo signs Preki's cheque - Mo may have been down in Honduras for the match yesterday, but don't get it twisted: he wants those playoffs more than anything.

3. The casuals don't give a shit - yes, it's a tired argument, but it's true. Look at the attendance at the home CCL games so far. See the empty seats? That's what sets the agenda. CCL games get played Tuesday nights while MLS gets the weekends. What's more, there are tons more people at MLS games. MLSE would trade in our three-game CCL group stage run for three extra playoff matches in a heartbeat.

That's why you'd expect Preki to tap the Academy (aside from the obvious depth concerns we have) when Cruz Azul comes to BMO to steamroll right over us.

Don't hold your breath on this one... if we win a couple of CL games and don't make the playoffs we will get a big song and dance from MLSE and MoJo about the tough schedule and the success in getting to the CL group stage. Just a hunch.

[Oldtimer]

For Mo and Preki to keep their jobs, TFC has to:

(1) defend the Voyageurs Cup (accomplished)

(2) get into the group stages of the CCL (accomplished)

(3) make the playoffs (not yet done)


There is little chance TFC will win the CCL, and there is no benefit (apart from pride) to Mo or Preki if TFC goes further, so the obvious emphasis will be on the MLS playoffs. Anything else is bonus. That is regardless of what the hardcore fan thinks.

[bgnewf]

I don't like that there is no option in the poll to choose both.

TFC has made it to the Champions League group stages for the first time. In my eyes whatever we achieve in that tournament from here on in is gravy on the fries.

Oldtimer is right on the money. MLSE wants all three of the Voyageurs Cup, the CCL group stages and the MLS playoffs. To me, and to the MLSe brain trust i think they both hold equal significance.

[Roogsy]

I need to see real progress on the league front. To me, the Champions League is great and I want to do well, but the league is more important. It's higher profile (not like in Europe where the CL has a higher profile) and is a better reflection of whether the team has progressed or not.

[denime]

CL is extra $$$ for MLSE,all that $$$ stays in house.
MLSE doesn't have to split profit with MLS like US clubs,so for MLSE going deep into CL is probably more important than MLS playoffs.

[tfc2007]

Agreed 100% with bgnewf and Oldtimer.

The goal going into the season (in my opinion) was make playoffs and make it to the CCL Group stage.

Realistically I think we have a better shot of going further in the MLS playoffs than the CCL, and for that reason I still say making the playoffs should be a top priority.

That said, if TFC clearly starts falling out of a play off picture, than play the Academy A team for all leauge games, and save the true starting 11 for the CCL games. As of right now though we are in a solid picture to make the playoffs, especially if the win lastnight ignites the boys to get on a streak.

[Carefree]

Good arguments supporting both sides of this debate. For me, all I know is that I "feel" it a whole lot more when we do well in the CCL. When we win a league game it puts a smile on my face. When we win in the champions league (or the games leading up to it) I'm ecstatic.

[ManUtd4ever]

I don't like that there is no option in the poll to choose both.

TFC has made it to the Champions League group stages for the first time. In my eyes whatever we achieve in that tournament from here on in is gravy on the fries.

Oldtimer is right on the money. MLSE wants all three of the Voyageurs Cup, the CCL group stages and the MLS playoffs. To me, and to the MLSe brain trust i think they both hold equal significance.

The reason I didn't list both options is because it is simply unrealistic to expect our best starting lineup to be deployed for all of our remaining matches. Therefore, the emphasis will inevitably have to be slightly more focused on the CCL or MLS playoffs throughout the duration of the schedule. Regardless of the fact that MLSE and the supporters want TFC to be successful in both areas, Preki still has to somehow manage the roster effectively based on the level of competition and relative importance of each match...

[Detroit_TFC]

Well, with the Cup match being in TO this year, I would hope we at least make a push for being one of the teams playing - that would be badass to be in the final at home.

[ochos]

I don't like that there is no option in the poll to choose both.

TFC has made it to the Champions League group stages for the first time. In my eyes whatever we achieve in that tournament from here on in is gravy on the fries.

Oldtimer is right on the money. MLSE wants all three of the Voyageurs Cup, the CCL group stages and the MLS playoffs. To me, and to the MLSe brain trust i think they both hold equal significance.

Agreed with both of you - which is why I say go for the MLS Cup. It's in Toronto FFS! I think winning the domestic league comes before winning a continental cup trophy...

We actually have a shot at winning the MLS Cup too...

[Blowing Bubbles]

I think Mo has already "won" his ability to sell MLSE on the bottom line.

Securing 3 CCL gates is massive.

Think about it. The MLS playoffs are as follows:
Quarters: 2 legged tie
Semi's: 1 game @ team that is higher seed
Final: neutral site

Basically our realistic maxing out in the playoffs is 1 more home gate. Yes that gate is bigger than a CCL gate, but it's not an order of magnitude bigger.

Plus there is that carrot of playing in Skydome if we get out of the group stage in CCL.

The expected value in terms of monetary reward is much higher in the CCL.

From a personal standpoint I'd prefer chasing CCL success. I'd like to see us copy Seattle and start getting early to mid 20 somethings from Central and South America as our "star" players since we're not going to be able to attract the same players that LA & NY will.

[Blowing Bubbles]

For Mo and Preki to keep their jobs, TFC has to:

(1) defend the Voyageurs Cup (accomplished)

(2) get into the group stages of the CCL (accomplished)

(3) make the playoffs (not yet done)


There is little chance TFC will win the CCL, and there is no benefit (apart from pride) to Mo or Preki if TFC goes further, so the obvious emphasis will be on the MLS playoffs. Anything else is bonus. That is regardless of what the hardcore fan thinks.

There is no benefit to playing in front of 50,000 ppl potentially at Skydome in the quarters? Seriously?

You do realize we realistically can only get 1 home playoff game in the MLS playoffs?

[Broadview]

I need to see real progress on the league front. To me, the Champions League is great and I want to do well, but the league is more important. It's higher profile (not like in Europe where the CL has a higher profile) and is a better reflection of whether the team has progressed or not.

I agree with what Roogsy wrote here.

I just might have to start reading his posts again...

[P-NUTZ]

interesting discussion. There is something giddy and exciting about the international club fixtures - and having that "foreign club invade our turf". so the CCl is more significant to me.

That said, i think my choice is also influenced by how frustrated i am with regular season ties and losses to teams we could or should beat. So right now the league/playoff picture for me is a big pain in the ass!

[zeelaw]

Let's start with the MLS, move on up from there. Step at a time.

[lips]

The MLS cup final at BMO, if we were to make it there would be EPIC

Going far in the CCL is what I'd like to see.

[Wagner]

For Mo and Preki to keep their jobs, TFC has to:

(1) defend the Voyageurs Cup (accomplished)

(2) get into the group stages of the CCL (accomplished)

(3) make the playoffs (not yet done)


There is little chance TFC will win the CCL, and there is no benefit (apart from pride) to Mo or Preki if TFC goes further, so the obvious emphasis will be on the MLS playoffs. Anything else is bonus. That is regardless of what the hardcore fan thinks.

Damn your sobering and logical thinking.

[ForestGlade]

There is no benefit to playing in front of 50,000 ppl potentially at Skydome in the quarters? Seriously?

You do realize we realistically can only get 1 home playoff game in the MLS playoffs?

I wouldn't be so sure that a quarter-final match would be contested at SkyDome. Toronto isn't Montreal when it comes to winters, and with the new grass put in, I could see them keeping it at BMO. 20,000 at the stadium you lease is cheaper than a questionable attendance figure in the height of Leafs season for whatever SkyDome charges

[jazzy]

For Mo and Preki to keep their jobs, TFC has to:

(1) defend the Voyageurs Cup (accomplished)

(2) get into the group stages of the CCL (accomplished)

(3) make the playoffs (not yet done)


There is little chance TFC will win the CCL, and there is no benefit (apart from pride) to Mo or Preki if TFC goes further, so the obvious emphasis will be on the MLS playoffs. Anything else is bonus. That is regardless of what the hardcore fan thinks.

Hence ...^this is why I believe Preki started Henry and Nane last night.....He's still not ready to go all out for CL.....Still I'm not sure we could win both anyway with our too small roster, as per MLS rules....god help us with any injuries.....the scheduling is tough

[Blizzard]

Hence ...^this is why I believe Preki started Henry and Nane last night.....He's still not ready to go all out for CL.....Still I'm not sure we could win both anyway with our too small roster, as per MLS rules....god help us with any injuries.....the scheduling is tough

Nana played well in the first leg or at least the second half of the first leg. He earned his start.

Preki has to juggle. I'll defend him on his logic. He can't go all out for the CCL without sacrificing MLS play-offs.

[bee dubya]

I would rather see TFC do well in the CCL but I think doing well in the MLS playoffs is more important to the club. Like a number of others have pointed out, I believe that a lot of people still don't get what the CCL is all about. TFC having a good run in the CCL could help educate them but for most folks, pre-season, season and post-season is what they understand.

Just as an aside, I thought yesterday's match was one of the more enjoyable TFC matches I've watched in terms of the overall quality of play on display.

[RedsYNWA]

"I thought yesterday's match was one of the more enjoyable TFC matches I've watched in terms of the overall quality of play on display."

QFFT.. it matters if it was do or die match .. I remember jumping on the chair when Canada was called offside in the Gold cup this was my second biggest emotion..montreal was up there as well this is what makes the Sport #1

[ManUtd4ever]

I would rather see TFC do well in the CCL but I think doing well in the MLS playoffs is more important to the club. Like a number of others have pointed out, I believe that a lot of people still don't get what the CCL is all about. TFC having a good run in the CCL could help educate them but for most folks, pre-season, season and post-season is what they understand.

Just as an aside, I thought yesterday's match was one of the more enjoyable TFC matches I've watched in terms of the overall quality of play on display.

I would have to agree with your comments. It's interesting to note that based on the results of the poll thus far, the overwhelming majority of hardcore TFC supporters hold the CCL in high regard despite the fact that the tournament is in it's infancy stages. As for the casual fans, I think you're right in that league results are the only barometer of success they are familiar with...

[FluSH]

I want to win the MLS Cup, but I think winning Champions League would be a bigger feat. It would be an amazing day if we could beat Cruz Azul in Mexico.

I would bust a nut... It would be like dying and having hot sex in heaven... If we beat Cruz Azul in Mexico!!! What that would mean to this club!!!! Monumental!!!!

[FluSH]

...and for the record it's the CCL for me...

MLS PLayoffs? we will get our chance some day if not this year... playing the finals at home would be awesome, but if we ever made the finals guess what... anywhere in North America would be home turf for us... without question.

To me CCL is about the Big Dawgs... getting your name on the map and earning your respect... and If you are going to prove your worth and earn your respect... you are going to pick the meanest motherfucker there is and kick his ass... That's what Cruz Azul is right now... The biggest most decorated team in this shit... and we're going to stand up against this team with nothing to lose and show them who's the Boss... That to me is bigger than meeting RSL at the playoffs...

[rocker]

I'm torn on this.... I see the importance of the CCL. But MLS Cup is in Toronto this fall, so making the playoffs and potentially getting to the final at home would be massive.

[FluSH]

I'm torn on this.... I see the importance of the CCL. But MLS Cup is in Toronto this fall, so making the playoffs and potentially getting to the final at home would be massive.

I would much rather play in Columbus for the finals and take over that city once again while whooping their ass... but that's just me lol

[twistedchinaman]

I want to win the MLS Cup, but I think winning Champions League would be a bigger feat. It would be an amazing day if we could beat Cruz Azul in Mexico.

And besides, with Champions League we can potentially be on the world's biggest stage with the world's biggest teams garnering their attentions -- hey, if a team like TP Mazembe from DR Congo can make it, why not us?

Onwards, to the world! MLS Cup is nice, and would make a great piece...but the Champions League trophy...even better. :)

[twistedchinaman]

I would bust a nut... It would be like dying and having hot sex in heaven... If we beat Cruz Azul in Mexico!!! What that would mean to this club!!!! Monumental!!!!

And to beat a Mexican team, home OR away (Superliga does NOT count). What MLS team can legitimately say that they have done it?

[twistedchinaman]

^ And for the record:

1997 CC Qualifying: LA 3-2 Santos Laguna
1998 CC Qualifying: Colorado 1-0 Leon (Went on to lose 2nd leg)
1998 CC SF: DC 2-0 Leon
1998 CC Final: DC 1-0 Toluca
2002 CC QF: SJ 1-0 Pachuca (Lost 1st leg 3-0)
2002 CC QF: KC 2-0 Santos Laguna (Lost 1st leg 2-1)
2003 CC QF: Columbus 2-0 Morelia (Lost 1st leg 6-0)
2007 CC SF: Houston 2-0 Pachuca (Lost 2nd leg 5-2)
2008 CC SF: DC 2-1 Pachuca (Lost 1st leg 2-0)

Over 13 years of Champions' Cup and Champions League; MLS has NINE victories over Mexican teams, and so far none in Mexico. Sad record, ne?

[Fort York Redcoat]

MLS is bush league. Champions league has a huge upside and the chance to become regionally recognized.

Champions league is the future of the game here.

Playoffs are the past.

I don't think it likely that if Preki rested everyone in the CL for playoffs that we would go to being a team that gets to MLS final. Just yesterday we were talking IF we're making the playoffs. Now it's should we?

[Yohan]

i don't get it. only quality and more famous opposition comes from Mexico and that's about it. it's not like TFC is playing European or SA teams. so i don't see the glamour of CCL

[Oblio2]

MLS first for me.....

[Cashcleaner]

Winning CONCACAF Champions League is the better choice of the two for the simple reason that we'll be likely facing much greater opposition in that tourney than in the MLS playoffs.

Don't get me wrong, advancing far in either scenarios would be great for the club, and I wouldn't get all bent outta shape if we lost the next round for CONCACAF but made it into the league playoffs. It's just that as myself and others have mentioned, winning the MLS Cup doesn't really do much for us. I mean, you get a trophy and have bragging rights for the next season, but there's nothing else after that. With Champions League, you not only face-off against some of the best clubs in your confederacy, but you have a shot to advance even further and make it to the Club World Cup.

There have been great points made for both sides of the arguments, but I'm firmly in the camp of the CCL taking higher priority.

[gtaguy]

i don't get it. only quality and more famous opposition comes from Mexico and that's about it. it's not like TFC is playing European or SA teams. so i don't see the glamour of CCL


But the Mexicans at the moment have the best league in N.A, C.A and the Carribean so beating them gives your club notoriety.
If you ask me TFC can win alot more supporters and fans by beating the bigger clubs on our continent which directly translate in an increase in tv viewership numbers, more people wanting to go to the stadium more casual fan recognition. we just might get snob eurosnob recognition to boot aswell.

NOT TO MENTION THE 1 MILLION DOLLAR GRAND PRIZE IS NOT TOO SHABBY ASWELL.

[Oldtimer]

Personally, I am torn between the two, given that the final is in Toronto.

However, I am pretty sure that the effort from the club will be on the league from here on in.

[Cashcleaner]

Personally, I am torn between the two, given that the final is in Toronto.

However, I am pretty sure that the effort from the club will be on the league from here on in.

That is a bit of a wrench thrown into the argument for CCL priority, I'll gladly admit. I can't think of anyone who wouldn't jump at the chance to see Toronto play for the Cup on home soil.

[Hitcho]

I voted play-offs. You have to learn to walk before you can run. I take Shankly's view on this: the league is your bread and butter, and only when you're consistently doing well there should you start to try and conquer continental competition.

Not to say I don't want us in the CCL, but at this stage in TFC history, if I had to choose then I would rather see us win the MLS Cup than win the CCL. Once we've got a few MLS Cups under our belt and are perennial play off contenders, then it will become more important to nail a couple of CCL trophies as well.

Just my 2c...

[Fort York Redcoat]

^Well I guess I could look forward to the Vcup in your scenario, Hitch, but that's about it.

I'd love to be the team they change rules for because we consistently win the Supporter's Shield then play the Accies in the playoffs. I'd love it if they ignored MLS cup and went to play the likes of Barca in Abu dhabi.

[Yohan]

But the Mexicans at the moment have the best league in N.A, C.A and the Carribean so beating them gives your club notoriety.
If you ask me TFC can win alot more supporters and fans by beating the bigger clubs on our continent which directly translate in an increase in tv viewership numbers, more people wanting to go to the stadium more casual fan recognition. we just might get snob eurosnob recognition to boot aswell.

NOT TO MENTION THE 1 MILLION DOLLAR GRAND PRIZE IS NOT TOO SHABBY ASWELL.
so by your logic, SuperLiga is more important than MLS Cup? you get to play Mexican teams in that as well

I mean, we can't even beat Columbus

[ManUtd4ever]

http://tsn.ca/soccer/story/?id=329477

I posted this link because the number of comments posted is far greater than usual for a TFC related article on TSN's website. Perhaps even casual fans seem to take more notice regarding success in the Champions League...

[Fort York Redcoat]

so by your logic, SuperLiga is more important than MLS Cup? you get to play Mexican teams in that as well

I mean, we can't even beat Columbus

Illogical. Superliga is a farcical invitational that has no right to exist. :mad:

As to the comparison of quality of competition between Mexico and here it's a moot point. For an attraction a team only has to PLAY a better team for attention not BEAT them.

[Azerban]

Who cares - to be in the Champion League don't you have to be a champion in your league like in Europe and remind me what did the Toronto FC win last year. Go International Milan

[Hitcho]

^Well I guess I could look forward to the Vcup in your scenario, Hitch, but that's about it.

I'd love to be the team they change rules for because we consistently win the Supporter's Shield then play the Accies in the playoffs. I'd love it if they ignored MLS cup and went to play the likes of Barca in Abu dhabi.

Hah, I'm not saying duck out of the CCL, we should definitely be aiming to make the group stages every year, but if we could ONLY win one of the MLS Cup or CCL, then right now I'd take the MLS Cup.

Anyway, we'll win nothing until Mo has gone and we get a decent GM in place that builds a squad capable of challenging for top honours. :(

[Wull]

League should always trump cup competitions but, sadly, our league ends in a cup competition :picard:

[Oldtimer]

League should always trump cup competitions but, sadly, our league ends in a cup competition :picard:

Until 2003, Brazil's Serie A ended in a cup competition with 8 clubs making the playoffs.

Uruguay has a playoff between the top team from each half season.

Just saying...

[Fort York Redcoat]

Who cares - to be in the Champion League don't you have to be a champion in your league like in Europe and remind me what did the Toronto FC win last year. Go International Milan

They've let in 2nd, 3rd place teams in Europe for some years now, silly. Maybe not in Germany but definitely the top 3 have more than one spot in the European Champions League.

Toronto won the Vcup because we're not allowed to play in the US's reindeer games.

And I believe it's Internationale.:D

[Hitcho]

They've let in 2nd, 3rd place teams in Europe for some years now, silly. Maybe not in Germany but definitely the top 3 have more than one spot in the European Champions League.

Toronto won the Vcup because we're not allowed to play in the US's reindeer games.

And I believe it's Internationale.:D

England and Spain get 4 slots each. Italy get at least 3. (well, if you count qualifying spots as well as direct entrants). Although from this season on the top 3 in the EPL get straight into the group stages and the 4th placed team has to do an extra round of qualifying I think (unless an English team wins the CL and comes 4th again I suppose).

European Cup had more value when only the league champion of each nation got in, but these days there are so many good teams that would be denied entry as a result (Barca or Madrid in Spain, a whole bunch in the EPL, Juve, Inter or Milan in Italy, etc) that UEFA and the TV companies cannot stand the thught of all those dollars washing away. Plus I guess it makes more sense to take all of the very best teams from around Europe and put them into one competition, rather than just taking two or three really good ones and bunch of crap like the league winners in Estonia.

[Fort York Redcoat]

Until 2003, Brazil's Serie A ended in a cup competition with 8 clubs making the playoffs.

Uruguay has a playoff between the top teams from each half season.

Just saying...

Say whatcha like. Playoffs don't reflect the quality of the league play. Playoffs reflect strength of a league. Their are boatloads of leagues South of us that have used Playoffs but it's almost always due to money issues.

Most popular team in the league about to get relegated? More playoffs and relegation is aggregate over 3 yrs as of now! The history of the game South of our league has been full of greatness but also inconsistent stability.

[Darlofletch]

Toronto could win the supporters shield and the mls cup, but unless we win the voyageurs cup we don't get to play in the ccl.

I think the league should probably be a priority, but damn-it, cup competitions are just more exciting.

[Azerban]

They've let in 2nd, 3rd place teams in Europe for some years now, silly. Maybe not in Germany but definitely the top 3 have more than one spot in the European Champions League.

Toronto won the Vcup because we're not allowed to play in the US's reindeer games.

And I believe it's Internationale.:D

lol

can't believe i'd ever get confused for an especially dumb italian

straight up copy-paste off the comments section of that tsn article

[Oldtimer]

Say whatcha like. Playoffs don't reflect the quality of the league play. Playoffs reflect strength of a league. Their are boatloads of leagues South of us that have used Playoffs but it's almost always due to money issues.

Most popular team in the league about to get relegated? More playoffs and relegation is aggregate over 3 yrs as of now! The history of the game South of our league has been full of greatness but also inconsistent stability.

I agree that the focus should be on the league winner... so I consider the Supporters' Shield winner the true winner of MLS.

I was responding to a post that suggested that MLS is the only league with playoffs... I'm simply pointing out that is not the case. I'm not defending the playoff format of MLS or of South America.

[Pachuco]

I'm gonna go with MLS playoffs in this one.

I think there is still a huge potential to grow the interest in TFC 10 fold in the GTA. If we win the Champions League, most people in Toronto will say "what's that?". If we win the MLS Cup, most people in Toronto would say "Well we finally have a winning team in Toronto". Sorry but the reality is most people who are going to watch TFC on TV are gonna be way more impressed and are going to associate way more with TFC going far into the playoffs then the Champions League. So at the end of the day, TV ratings is more important to me then the little international recognition we'll get in a tournament that most teams who compete in it could care less about.

[Fort York Redcoat]

^Yeah OT I know many make the assumption that we're the only crazy ones using playoffs but I wanted to point out why a league with history and quality would ever use the system that is considered sub standard in Europe.

I've seen too many use the excuse "Well they're doing it and they play better than us."

We use Playoffs in NA out of a sense of "tradition" that doesn't reflect well enough on this sport. The fact the Playoff system makes more money doesn't help eradicating it.

[CanadianSwede]

I think its just great to play against teams from countries where football is the life and passion of the nation. At this point in time, the MLS needs to take this competition seriously because its the only way to prove that the league and the teams in the league are the most competitive in the region. As it stands I would argue that the Mexican Primera is still ahead by some distance of the MLS but thats gradually changing.

Put simply, saying you're the best in the region has way more appeal than best in MLS.

[Oldtimer]

The fact the Playoff system makes more money doesn't help eradicating it.

You write the truth!

Add to it the fact that in the US, "Joe Sixpack" checks out once summer ends unless there are playoffs to hold his interest, and you have a perfect $$$ reason why the purist's dream of a single table deciding everything won't be coming soon, unfortunately.

However, MLS is not unique in sacrificing what's ideal for the sport in order to bring in the cash.

[GlenM]

You play to win the game, plain and simple - make playoffs, get home field, progress thru Champions League.

It's not a trade off.

Good teams don't forecast and aren't concerned with that, they play and win, bottom line.

GlenM

[denime]

Who cares - to be in the Champion League don't you have to be a champion in your league like in Europe and remind me what did the Toronto FC win last year. Go International Milan

Since mid 90' you don't have to be Domestic Champion to play in UEFA CL.

GO TORONTO FC !

[SilverSamurai]

CCL. Hands down.
MLS Cup is nice, but really, it's local in a sense.
CCL is international. Where the big boys play.

And to those that say the Mexican league is a joke, they are 1 of the richest, if not the richest outside of Europe.

I wonder how different the responses would be if the MLS Cup was not in Toronto...

[Azerban]

Since mid 90' you don't have to be Domestic Champion to play in UEFA CL.

GO TORONTO FC !

really

[Wull]

I agree that the focus should be on the league winner... so I consider the Supporters' Shield winner the true winner of MLS.

I was responding to a post that suggested that MLS is the only league with playoffs... I'm simply pointing out that is not the case. I'm not defending the playoff format of MLS or of South America.

I don't recall using only in that context

[pdogg]

CCL. Hands down.
MLS Cup is nice, but really, it's local in a sense.
CCL is international. Where the big boys play.

And to those that say the Mexican league is a joke, they are 1 of the richest, if not the richest outside of Europe.

I wonder how different the responses would be if the MLS Cup was not in Toronto...

As well, I think the responses would be different if we were in a more secure spot int he standings as well. For the LA Galaxy/RSL teams, they are well on their way to a playoff berth and the added revenue. We're only debating which to focus on because going full tilt in both league games and CCL group matches could jeopardize results in one, if not both.

*IF* we need to choose between the two, I think we need to look at the realistic chances of us succeeding in either of them. What are the chances we can make the playoffs? What are the chances of getting out of the group stage?

[GhostKiller]

I'm gonna go with MLS playoffs in this one.

I think there is still a huge potential to grow the interest in TFC 10 fold in the GTA. If we win the Champions League, most people in Toronto will say "what's that?". If we win the MLS Cup, most people in Toronto would say "Well we finally have a winning team in Toronto". Sorry but the reality is most people who are going to watch TFC on TV are gonna be way more impressed and are going to associate way more with TFC going far into the playoffs then the Champions League. So at the end of the day, TV ratings is more important to me then the little international recognition we'll get in a tournament that most teams who compete in it could care less about.

This is the way I feel as well. There is still lots of work to grow TFC in south west ont. If we grabbed a playoff spot, or better yet hosted and participated in the finals, that would grow the TFC brand big time domestically. Fact is everyone in Toronto knows about TFC, but for the majority thats about it. More stability here, then focus on the rest of the world.

[dupont]

I'm really into the Champions League games. I think it's because we get to play such an interesting variety of opponents and not just the same teams we always see.
I would be more interested to see a deep champions league run than playoffs.
However if we are talking specifically about this season then I would love to see TFC in the MLS cup to play at home.

[LesH]

*IF* we need to choose between the two, I think we need to look at the realistic chances of us succeeding in either of them. What are the chances we can make the playoffs? What are the chances of getting out of the group stage?


If the Champs League is taken seriously, I would say we have a major chance finishing the group in the 2nd place after Cruz Azul. And that's quarterfinals!

On the other hand, right now maybe we have 50% chance to make the playoffs. But even if we are making it, then we have very slim chances to get past the first elimination stage.

[TFCRegina]

If the Champs League is taken seriously, I would say we have a major chance finishing the group in the 2nd place after Cruz Azul. And that's quarterfinals!

On the other hand, right now maybe we have 50% chance to make the playoffs. But even if we are making it, then we have very slim chances to get past the first elimination stage.

Yep, and the club gets more home dates if they make the Champions League Quarterfinal. Ideally, they should be able to qualify for both, but they're going to need to take advantage of the new roster rules so they have some more depth. Sign those two academy players.

[denime]

In today's news(Friday),a day before game vs Chivas there was not even one article about it,however there are 3-4 articles regarding upcoming Cruz Azul game.

I think that shows importance going deep into CCL than MLS Cup.

[Fort York Redcoat]

I'm gonna go with MLS playoffs in this one.

I think there is still a huge potential to grow the interest in TFC 10 fold in the GTA. If we win the Champions League, most people in Toronto will say "what's that?". If we win the MLS Cup, most people in Toronto would say "Well we finally have a winning team in Toronto". Sorry but the reality is most people who are going to watch TFC on TV are gonna be way more impressed and are going to associate way more with TFC going far into the playoffs then the Champions League. So at the end of the day, TV ratings is more important to me then the little international recognition we'll get in a tournament that most teams who compete in it could care less about.

You've got a valid point there Pachuca. People will go with what they know (playoffs mean they're good, right?) rather than wasting time on new format regardless if it's better or more exciting.

My point is that I don't waste time on playoffs since that's what the casual is looking for anyway. That and it's the clubs job to market the hell out of playoffs. With CCL people need a little extra education on it's importance.

[ForestGlade]

My biggest problem with the CCL is how it stretches into two different seasons for TFC because MLS is a summer league, so if TFC makes the finals they'd be playing in late April. Guess who always wins the attention of the Canadian media in late April

[FluSH]

In today's news(Friday),a day before game vs Chivas there was not even one article about it,however there are 3-4 articles regarding upcoming Cruz Azul game.

I think that shows importance going deep into CCL than MLS Cup.


This poll alone is one of the most lopsided I've seen... not the most lopsided but up there...

THIS GAME IS like the Telus HIPPO... BIG

http://www.dennissylvesterhurd.com/blog/122805.jpg

[Hitcho]

I'm gonna go with MLS playoffs in this one.

I think there is still a huge potential to grow the interest in TFC 10 fold in the GTA. If we win the Champions League, most people in Toronto will say "what's that?". If we win the MLS Cup, most people in Toronto would say "Well we finally have a winning team in Toronto". Sorry but the reality is most people who are going to watch TFC on TV are gonna be way more impressed and are going to associate way more with TFC going far into the playoffs then the Champions League.


I think its just great to play against teams from countries where football is the life and passion of the nation. At this point in time, the MLS needs to take this competition seriously because its the only way to prove that the league and the teams in the league are the most competitive in the region. As it stands I would argue that the Mexican Primera is still ahead by some distance of the MLS but thats gradually changing.

Put simply, saying you're the best in the region has way more appeal than best in MLS.

These are both equally valid and interesting points.

Based on all the comments above, I think it's now clear that the poll has to be closed. The ONLY option is for TFC to win the SS, the MLS Cup and the CCL.

Better tell Anselmi to start building a bigger trophy cabinet... :scarf:

[pdogg]

My biggest problem with the CCL is how it stretches into two different seasons for TFC because MLS is a summer league, so if TFC makes the finals they'd be playing in late April. Guess who always wins the attention of the Canadian media in late April

The timing of the FIFA Club World Cup is odd too because of the summer/winter schedule. The CONCACAF champion for this year's tournament doesn't play in the club world cup until NEXT december (2011.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2011_FIFA_Club_World_Cup

That means that the team we take to the FCWC could be drastically different than the team that made it out of the prelimary stage (17 months difference). We'll actually have completed another season, NCC, and a group stage of CCL well on it's way..

It's a shame we couldn't get the CCL started earlier in the year so that it all wrapped up before the year end.

[Fort York Redcoat]

The timing of the FIFA Club World Cup is odd too because of the summer/winter schedule. The CONCACAF champion for this year's tournament doesn't play in the club world cup until NEXT december (2011.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2011_FIFA_Club_World_Cup

That means that the team we take to the FCWC could be drastically different than the team that made it out of the prelimary stage (17 months difference). We'll actually have completed another season, NCC, and a group stage of CCL well on it's way..

It's a shame we couldn't get the CCL started earlier in the year so that it all wrapped up before the year end.


Wow. This will be a problem in the future. Right now I'm happy as hell we have an opportunity to play the best club competition in the world. If we have to do it on their schedule that's fine for now. First lets get everyone on board with the existence of the tourney then we'll have the numbers to change something about it.

[tfcleeds]

The irony is, as much as it would be a great accomplishment for TFC to participate in the World Club Cup someday, usually the European representative couldn't care less. For them, it's anti-climactic. They've won the UEFA Champions League, which for them is the be-all and end-all.

Yes, we would play some top teams from other confederations, the matches would be "meaningful", but for some teams that participate, it's nothing but a glorified friendly. I'm not saying that we shouldn't take it seriously because other teams may not, I'm just saying that winning the CONCACAF CL might be a better yardstick/achievement than winning the World Club Cup itself when some of the participants treat it as an afterthought.

[Oldtimer]

The irony is, as much as it would be a great accomplishment for TFC to participate in the World Club Cup someday, usually the European representative couldn't care less. For them, it's anti-climactic. They've won the UEFA Champions League, which for them is the be-all and end-all.

Yes, we would play some top teams from other confederations, the matches would be "meaningful", but for some teams that participate, it's nothing but a glorified friendly. I'm not saying that we shouldn't take it seriously because other teams may not, I'm just saying that winning the CONCACAF CL might be a better yardstick/achievement than winning the World Club Cup itself when some of the participants treat it as an afterthought.

I agree that the UEFA CL is the biggest prize, but it's more than a friendly to them.

http://www.redpatchboys.ca/forums/picture.php?albumid=114&pictureid=2518

These guys seem to care that they won. ;)

[tfcleeds]

^In all fairness, the European clubs have been on a nice little run in the competition in recently. Hasn't always been that way though.

[ManUtd4ever]

The irony is, as much as it would be a great accomplishment for TFC to participate in the World Club Cup someday, usually the European representative couldn't care less. For them, it's anti-climactic. They've won the UEFA Champions League, which for them is the be-all and end-all.

Yes, we would play some top teams from other confederations, the matches would be "meaningful", but for some teams that participate, it's nothing but a glorified friendly. I'm not saying that we shouldn't take it seriously because other teams may not, I'm just saying that winning the CONCACAF CL might be a better yardstick/achievement than winning the World Club Cup itself when some of the participants treat it as an afterthought.

The problem is that the television/media exposure for the FIFA Club World Cup is practically non existent in North America. I suspect that will continue to be the case until an MLS club earns a berth in the tournament...

[DavydMT]

voted for CL, but this year MLS Playoffs because we have the final.

[Oldtimer]

The problem is that the television/media exposure for the FIFA Club World Cup is practically non existent in North America. I suspect that will continue to be the case until an MLS club earns a berth in the tournament...

... then maybe we'll see it on CBC. If it's on GOL TV, I'd still count the exposure as practically non existent.

[RPB_RED_NATION_RPB]

I picked the CL.....

But i'd love the day to see us PLAY the CREW for the MLS CUP ...in our backyard!! :)

[RPB_RED_NATION_RPB]

but it is a shame..the uneducated TFC fan...will not know that Cruz Azul... will be the biggest team we have ever faced in a meaningful game!......

A win on the 17th.....will absolutely be stunning!!

[ArmenJBX]

For me, playoffs. If we make playoffs, we can actually have a realistic chance at winning it, because any MLS team can beat the other in this parity filled league, and it's in Toronto this year, so to win it at home would be incredible.

That being said, if it comes down to a playoff game or an elimination round champions league game, I'd much rather be at the CCL game.

[Super]

Judging by how little other teams seem to care about the CCL, I guess I'll have to say the MLS play-offs are more important ... but the CCL is a hell of a lot more fun though.

[Macksam]

Playoffs for the JimmyBald's reason above. However, getting far in the knockout rounds of the CCL would be swell.


Judging by how little other teams seem to care about the CCL, I guess I'll have to say the MLS play-offs are more important ... but the CCL is a hell of a lot more fun though.
Yeah, CCL is a lot more exciting and open compared to MLS games.

[Shway]

my goal for this team is to get further than Montreal, and my theory is ..........
Montreal is shite, was shite, and they made it to the quarter finals(shouldve made it the semis)

But yea TFC should go for the Champions League!

[razor787]

Champions League without a doubt. Playoffs is something that only gets us noticed in the US + Canada. Champions League gets exposure through several countries, and is followed somewhat in Europe. A solid showing in CONCACAF bolsters the prestige of the team, and league

[Beach_Red]

Getting to the next round in the Champions League would mean games pretty much through the winter, wouldn't it? That would be the best.

[T_Mizz]

Champions league for this reason, not included in the season ticket package, meaning there's less of those people that are there for the novelty of it. Its all hardcore supporters in the south end. At least that's what it's sounded like during the games.

[ManUtd4ever]

^^ I agree about the enhanced atmosphere at CCL games. Even though attendance was down at BMO Field for the Motagua and Cruz Azul matches, the supporter groups and the crowd in general were rocking the stadium all night!

[Carts]

Getting to the next round in the Champions League would mean games pretty much through the winter, wouldn't it? That would be the best.

A home game in February would be EPIC...!!!

Carts...

[Super]

A home game in February would be EPIC...!!!

Carts...

This would then have to be played at the Rogers Centre, wouldn't it?

I don't mind that actually. Would be fun to have 50k at a TFC game. Also, with that roof on top, I'm sure it would get pretty loud in there.

[Heart of Stone]

What about DeRo? He's done it all in MLS ... won cups, league MVP, multiple-time all-star, etc., etc. .... do you think Champions League is more important for him now?

[Mikey]

In the bigger scheme of things I think CCL is more important for the development of Canadian national players in terms of playing crunch games under pressure, in potentially hostile overseas stadiums than any CMNT friendly. Yes I know they still need the friendlies for team building and defining a national squad etc, but CCL is real pressure games on a big stage for some of these younger players.

[razor787]

This would then have to be played at the Rogers Centre, wouldn't it?

I don't mind that actually. Would be fun to have 50k at a TFC game. Also, with that roof on top, I'm sure it would get pretty loud in there.

Ohhh man! How amazing would that be. 50k In there, 10k of them singing (really pushing it, but it's possible) that place would be fucking pumping

[Heart of Stone]

Do you remember Wrestlemania at Sky Dome with 70 000+ people shouting "you suck!"? That was awesome!

[prizby]

Do you remember Wrestlemania at Sky Dome with 70 000+ people shouting "you suck!"? That was awesome!

70,000 ppl watching fixed matches

LOL

[Heart of Stone]

70,000 ppl watching fixed matches


You mean the FIFA World Cup...

[Macksam]

70,000 ppl watching fixed matches

LOL
That's nothing, over 10,000,000 people watch 2 and a half men every week.

[razor787]

Do you remember Wrestlemania at Sky Dome with 70 000+ people shouting "you suck!"? That was awesome!

Not a wrestling fan anymore, but man, I can just imagine. The electricity in that place when people start chanting and singing would be amazing. I really hope we advance, just so I can go to a game there this winter :P

[Pachuco]

I don't know, I'm skeptical TFC could sell out the Sky Dome. We can't sell out BMO field for these games. yes I know we would be further along, I'm still really skeptical that you'll get 43,000 more people to show up. Plus, the Skydome atmosphere for football is just terrible.

[McBrace]

I don't know, I'm skeptical TFC could sell out the Sky Dome. We can't sell out BMO field for these games. yes I know we would be further along, I'm still really skeptical that you'll get 43,000 more people to show up. Plus, the Skydome atmosphere for football is just terrible.

I agree, you just to far from the pitch, and the surface usually sucks balls.

Play it in the snow fuckers, you have a heated pitch...LOL

[MartinUtd]

I think the novelty of a game in the Rogers Centre would draw the masses. I have a feeling that was the primary motivator for 50k in Montreal.

[Yohan]

yes. people would come to see pre season and not match fit TFC shit the bed against most likely a Mexican squad. lol

[Pachuco]

I think the novelty of a game in the Rogers Centre would draw the masses. I have a feeling that was the primary motivator for 50k in Montreal.

Nope, I think it had more to do with the 5$ price tag Saputo put on alot of those tickets. Forget about MLSE doing anything like that. They'll try and rape everyone for the game and they'll get a sad atmosphere that will resemble watching the Blue Jays at the SkyDome

[Darlofletch]

hopefully they paid attention to the bills game to see what happens with high prices. a half full dome would be a monumentally wasted opportunity.

[ManUtd4ever]

If TFC progresses that far in the tourney and MLSE promotes the match properly with affordable tickets in the 500 level, TFC supporters could rock the Rogers Centre without a doubt. The ManUtd-Celtic match had a great atmosphere despite ridiculous ticket prices...

[denime]

Forget Rogers center,I rather have a real home field advantage by playing at BMO in cold winter with 20K fans who really want to watch the game.

20K crazy fans in full hose is better than 40K-50K in Rogers center.

[Yohan]

Forget Rogers center,I rather have a real home field advantage by playing at BMO in cold winter with 20K fans who really want to watch the game.

20K crazy fans in full hose is better than 40K-50K in Rogers center.
our home field advantage will come from the other teams being solid frozen and can't even kick the ball in -20 blizzard. lol

[Oldtimer]

Forget Rogers center,I rather have a real home field advantage by playing at BMO in cold winter with 20K fans who really want to watch the game.

20K crazy fans in full hose is better than 40K-50K in Rogers center.

lol, no way we'd get 20,000 people in winter, if we did though it would be fantastic!

[deltox]

i know people say to play at BMO>.....its not realistic.

the first game last yr, it was about 5 degrees. it was too cold to be in the stands.

you cant play when its minus 10 and you have weather warnings.

[razor787]

No way would they play in the winter. Way too cold for the players, not healthy at all. Not to mention, there would be less fans because of the cold, and many that do come, would leave at half if they are frozen.

Rogers center is the only realistic venue. The supporters groups would be able to get a lot more people in, and they would be making much more noise. That place would be rocking.