Preki Approval Rating - August 2010

[DichioTFC]

How do you feel at the current moment about Preki...


Just some guidelines to those who are on the fence:
1. Its how you feel at the moment, not a final assessment. Like a marathon, this is just a snapshot of our support at this point in time. A low approval rating does not rate him as an overall failure, just like a high approval rating does not mean he's Sir Alex Ferguson.
2. Whatever factors or metrics your feel are most important to you in the coaching position, use those to guide you (i.e. if you wish for Preki to be judged on the long-term, then the question is "Do you approve of the job Preki has done thus far?")


For the sake of context, this is how he / TFC have preformed since the World Cup break:
June 26 - D vs. LA Galaxy 0-0
July 1 - D vs. Houston 1-1
July 10 W vs. Rapids 1-0
July 17 L @ Philidelphia 2-1
July 21 D vs. Bolton 1-1 (Friendly)
July 24 D vs. Dallas 1-1
July 27 W vs. Motagua 1-0 (CONCACAF)
July 31 L @ KC Wizards 1-0

Preki Approval Rating April 2010 - 67.2% (127 yes / 189 total) http://www.redpatchboys.ca/forums/sh...Preki+Approval
Preki Approval Rating May 2010 - 69.8% (155 yes / 222 total) http://www.redpatchboys.ca/forums/sh...Preki+Approval
Preki Approval Rating June 2010 - 96.3% (208 yes / 216 total)
http://www.redpatchboys.ca/forums/showthread.php?t=22918

Preki Approval Rating Season To-Date - 78.1% (490 yes / 627 total)

[H Bomb]

I really dont like Preki. I cant say that in any other way that includes good language of unoffensive material. Guy is a problem. Hurray for another crap season with TFC. At least we are consistent.

[Heathen]

I really dont like Preki. I cant say that in any other way that includes good language of unoffensive material. Guy is a problem. Hurray for another crap season with TFC. At least we are consistent.

I was trying to work out who he reminds me of when he's sitting on the
bench and his heads rolling around all over the place, finally I got it....

http://archiv.rhein-zeitung.de/on/98/02/25/topnews/hawking1.jpg

[King Jeff]

At the risk of stating the blatantly obvious, I don't think we're going to be anywhere near a 96% approval rating this time around.

I'm still voting "yes" but I'm getting tired of watching this team's negative style of play.

[Stouffville_RPB]

Preki's system and attitude is fine as long as you pull out results. Cutting players and bringing in scraps of other mediocre MLS clubs (Colorado) is ok if you keep playing a system effectively.

Not including the Bolton game TFC has 6 goals in 7 games. That isn't going to be enough to win when it counts. Frei can't be expected to get a clean sheet every game but that is what TFC need from him.

DeRo has cooled off and Preki has not shown any ability to manipulate the attack to offset this. Instead he just signs more players and plugs them in to the same system. I'm not getting on Santos and Mista as they both look like decent footballers but a coach's answer shouldn't be to just bring another guy in.

Preki doesn't even have enough confidence in some of the guys he's brought in (Hscanovics and Usanov) to play them over an out of position, slow Nick Garcia who gets raped by anyone with speed.

Sanyang continues to see alot of time on the pitch when Cronin was clearly the better player.

I'm happy TFC has looked solid defensively this year and I attribute some of that to Preki's system but there are far too many dropped point because there aren't enough goals. TFC doesn't have the ability to put teams away and you would think that a former striker would be able to teach the team how to do that.

[rocker]

Sanyang continues to see alot of time on the pitch when Cronin was clearly the better player.

Well, Cronin was also 5 years older than Sanyang and making more $$$.
I'm also not sure that Cronin was showing he was "clearly the better player" even if at totally different stages of career, he should naturally be better than Sanyang.

Cronin was not contributing more than Sanyang. Cronin was contributing about nothing this season, actually. At least Sanyang can tackle. Cronin would never leave his feet.

San Jose fans are ripping Cronin these days for being "invisible."

[Darlofletch]

I'm still yes, it's been frustrating recently, and we're clearly still far from the finished product, but I think we're on the right track still.

[canadian_bhoy]

Preki sends out a snoozefest every week.

Would much prefer an attacking style.

[Toronto_Bhoy]

zzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzz zzzzzzzzzzzzz...

[v00d00daddy]

I voted yes because its about results and a plan for me.

Preki has a plan: Get sound defensively and you're more than halfway there.

Some of you guys would rather see year 1,2 or 3 TFC that oozed goals against every game?

And for what? A few more goals for.

Personally I'd rather tie 0-0 every game then lose 4-3 every game. I know that's an extreme but you get my drift.

The best teams in the world (both club and country) are ones that insist on being sound defensively. You can't be successful without being able to keep people from scoring on you.

I honestly believe that people who are bored with TFC and are missing the good ole days of seasons 1-3 are crazy.

Put it this way. If Chad Barrett didn't suck balls at finishing and our captain didn't go into a slump we'd be doing just fine.

We're a couple of missed chances on goal from being in a solid playoff spot and on the way up.

And......that shit will come. We just need to figure out the right combo of attacking players that allows us to score. Hopefully Santos and Mista help in that regard.

I've given up hope that Barrett can get better at converting his chances. I fucking hate his game.

Preki is doing well..imo.

for those of you who pine for the old days:

2009 46 ga in 30 games
2008 43 ga in 30 games
2007 49 ga in 30 games

2010 19 ga in 17 games

You do the math.

[jabbronies]

for a guy who was an offensive threat in his playing days, his coaching style is as boring as moldy bread.

Given the players he has to work with, I say he's doing a pretty decent job. I've given him the yes, only because there isn't a "On the fence" option. He still hasn't gotten the road game to where it needs to be in order for this team to be a serious contender. But at least we're pulling in ties.

[torontocelt]

I voted yes because its about results and a plan for me.

Preki has a plan: Get sound defensively and you're more than halfway there.

Some of you guys would rather see year 1,2 or 3 TFC that oozed goals against every game?

And for what? A few more goals for.

Personally I'd rather tie 0-0 every game then lose 4-3 every game. I know that's an extreme but you get my drift.

The best teams in the world (both club and country) are ones that insist on being sound defensively. You can't be successful without being able to keep people from scoring on you.

I honestly believe that people who are bored with TFC and are missing the good ole days of seasons 1-3 are crazy.

Put it this way. If Chad Barrett didn't suck balls at finishing and our captain didn't go into a slump we'd be doing just fine.

We're a couple of missed chances on goal from being in a solid playoff spot and on the way up.

And......that shit will come. We just need to figure out the right combo of attacking players that allows us to score. Hopefully Santos and Mista help in that regard.

I've given up hope that Barrett can get better at converting his chances. I fucking hate his game.

Preki is doing well..imo.

for those of you who pine for the old days:

2009 46 ga in 30 games
2008 43 ga in 30 games
2007 49 ga in 30 games

2010 19 ga in 17 games

You do the math.

Agreed although Barrett is better than White who truly sucks balls although Chad has had more playing time.

[Carts]

Preki sends out a snoozefest every week.

Would much prefer an attacking style.

Agreed...

Goals win games...

If you never score, you can never win...

I'd rather see the team go out and shoot for 3pts, and if they fail at least they went for it...

This playing for a 0-0 draws, and if we score/win is a bonus is no way to go into matches in my opinion...

Carts...

[Stouffville_RPB]

I voted yes because its about results and a plan for me.

Preki has a plan: Get sound defensively and you're more than halfway there.

Some of you guys would rather see year 1,2 or 3 TFC that oozed goals against every game?

And for what? A few more goals for.

Personally I'd rather tie 0-0 every game then lose 4-3 every game. I know that's an extreme but you get my drift.

The best teams in the world (both club and country) are ones that insist on being sound defensively. You can't be successful without being able to keep people from scoring on you.

I honestly believe that people who are bored with TFC and are missing the good ole days of seasons 1-3 are crazy.

Put it this way. If Chad Barrett didn't suck balls at finishing and our captain didn't go into a slump we'd be doing just fine.

We're a couple of missed chances on goal from being in a solid playoff spot and on the way up.

And......that shit will come. We just need to figure out the right combo of attacking players that allows us to score. Hopefully Santos and Mista help in that regard.

I've given up hope that Barrett can get better at converting his chances. I fucking hate his game.

Preki is doing well..imo.

for those of you who pine for the old days:

2009 46 ga in 30 games
2008 43 ga in 30 games
2007 49 ga in 30 games

2010 19 ga in 17 games

You do the math.


I don't disagree with your take on the defense. In fact I agree 100%. You need to be defensivly sound in order to really contend.

The thing is that Preki doesn't seem to know any other plan than the one he's implimented every game this season. When TFC goes down a goal (like Saturday for example) there really is no coming back. TFC hasn't won a game under Preki when they have conceeded first.

Also, without Frei's play this season the 19 ga in 17 gp stat may look alittle more like 25 or 26 ga and that puts us right on par with seasons 1-3.

The defensive plan has been great this year but when it counts you may have to come from behind. There has been no indication that Preki knows how to send this team out on the offensive.

[Roogsy]

I don't understand why disapproving of Preki is necessarily a wish for the "old days". When we did away with Cummins at the end of last season it was an opportunity to start clean. It should have started with doing away with Mo Johnston. We didn't. It should have caused us to bring in a quality coach that was going to implement not only an effective system but one that was going to help the team grow, we didn't. Preki coming in had one good positive effect, a return to fundamentals and a better dedication to defending, particularly in the final 15 where we had major problems last year. But that is where the positive ends. It's ugly football, it's stunted the team's growth, we are actually scoring less and it all may still result in the same finish as last year. I don't see us any further ahead than we were last year. We just look different is all. A great month of May is all that differentiates us from previous seasons.

[CoachGT]

Agreed Roogsy. This has nothing to do with wanting previous seasons back or anything of the sort. I believe we need a balanced attack to go with solid defence. For the first half of the year, our overall play has been very physical, beyond many other teams. We have a defensive set up that has almost every player in card trouble.

All I'd like to see is a more consistent offensive output. We need to be dnagerous in the attacking zone more often. If our objective is 30 games at 0-0, we will not make the playoffs. And that is not acceptable to most people, fans, players and owners included.

[azorean10]

His 'grind it out' defensive style may be working in terms of keeping TFC in the playoff hunt BUT it is absolutely brutal to watch. Do we play this way because it's Preki and this is the way he does things? or is it because he feels he does'nt have the players right now to play any differently? I am hoping it's the latter because, my god, i don't think i can stand watching a couple more years of this style of play. My concern is what does this boring type of play do to the prospects of acquiring any new fans? or , even worse, keeping those you had already made. I don't know, I'm a little uneasy, i want to believe that TFC 'has made it' on the Toronto sporting landscape but i would much prefer to have an exciting, attacking squad to watch that would also help in attracting new fans and grow the sport / team. If we keep playing this way i think it can only hurt the popularity of TFC in my opinion.

[Pookie]

His 'grind it out' defensive style may be working in terms of keeping TFC in the playoff hunt BUT it is absolutely brutal to watch. Do we play this way because it's Preki and this is the way he does things? or is it because he feels he does'nt have the players right now to play any differently? I am hoping it's the latter because, my god, i don't think i can stand watching a couple more years of this style of play. My concern is what does this boring type of play do to the prospects of acquiring any new fans? or , even worse, keeping those you had already made. I don't know, I'm a little uneasy, i want to believe that TFC 'has made it' on the Toronto sporting landscape but i would much prefer to have an exciting, attacking squad to watch that would also help in attracting new fans and grow the sport / team. If we keep playing this way i think it can only hurt the popularity of TFC in my opinion.


Fair points execpt that when has TFC ever had an "exciting attacking squad" ?

MLS goals per game under each of our coaches:

Mo - 0.833 goals per game
Carver - 1.17 goals per game
Cummings - 1.2 goals per game
Preki - 1.12 goals per game

So, the fuss is over 0.08 goals per game?

I think if anything we are in more games that we were in the past. The Goals Against per game for the same coaches:

Mo - 1.63
Carver - 1.49
Cummings - 1.48
Preki - 1.12

Close to a 1/2 goal per game improvement.

[Roogsy]

Nope...we've never had an exciting "attacking squad". And that argument would hold weight if people here were pining for the "old days". Let's get rid of this strawman argument please. Nobody wants a return to the old days. But with the fresh start we should have had, what we've wound up with is an improvement yes, but just barely.

This is like having to choose between getting kicked in the balls and getting slapped in the face. I'd much rather get slapped in the face than kicked in the balls but what I would REALLY prefer is neither.

[torontocelt]

Fair points execpt that when has TFC ever had an "exciting attacking squad" ?

MLS goals per game under each of our coaches:

Mo - 0.833 goals per game
Carver - 1.17 goals per game
Cummings - 1.2 goals per game
Preki - 1.12 goals per game

So, the fuss is over 0.08 goals per game?

I think if anything we are in more games that we were in the past. The Goals Against per game for the same coaches:

Mo - 1.63
Carver - 1.49
Cummings - 1.48
Preki - 1.12

Close to a 1/2 goal per game improvement.

I have to agree. TFC do not have great players but they are doing pretty well so far this season, the last I checked we were 3rd in the Eastern standings. I am pretty sure Preki realises we need more goals hence why we have signed two attackers in Mista and Maicon.

[torontocelt]

So what TFC fans want is an attacking team who plays attractive, free flowing, high scoring football as well as one who can defend and not concede many goals. Well that would be the same wish as every football fan in the world for their own team. The problem is how the hell do you manage to do that or even part of it with players with limited skills? Players who are not great at passing, cannot take people on, dont have great movement and are not great at finishing? This is the MLS and any coach here is limited by the skill set of his players, these guys are not Barcelona quality. Even Arsenal who can play attacking football to the highest level do not defend well at the moment. Every team can do better, so can TFC but they are doing pretty well with the players we have and on top of that we have just signed two guys who hopefully will be able to take us to a higher level if they are giving a chance to settle in. Judge Preki at the end of the season, so far I would argue he is the best manager we have had, not difficult but an improvement.

[Lennon]

Ask this question in 48 hours and we'd see a 30% swing in votes on way or another .. haha

[Roogsy]

So what TFC fans want is an attacking team who plays attractive, free flowing, high scoring football as well as one who can defend and not concede many goals. Well that would be the same wish as every football fan in the world for their own team. The problem is how the hell do you manage to do that or even part of it with players with limited skills? Players who are not great at passing, cannot take people on, dont have great movement and are not great at finishing? This is the MLS and any coach here is limited by the skill set of his players, these guys are not Barcelona quality. Even Arsenal who can play attacking football to the highest level do not defend well at the moment. Every team can do better, so can TFC but they are doing pretty well with the players we have and on top of that we have just signed two guys who hopefully will be able to take us to a higher level if they are giving a chance to settle in. Judge Preki at the end of the season, so far I would argue he is the best manager we have had, not difficult but an improvement.


Well of course as fans we want the best of both worlds. The trick is to have a balanced team and you don't have to be FC Barcelona to be a "balanced" team, all you need is to create the team with tools available that is competitive relative to the other teams in your league. We should be able to do that shouldn't we? We haven't.

A good example of that is the LA Galaxy, they have been able to put together a team that is dangerous on the scoring front but is more than competent on the defensive front. And yet nobody is claiming they are Barcelona. If the Galaxy can do it, is it really so far-fetched that we can't? The difference? Management. Period. And how long does it take? Two words...Red Bulls.

[Pookie]

. If the Galaxy can do it, is it really so far-fetched that we can't? The difference? Management. Period. And how long does it take? Two words...Red Bulls.

Interesting that when citing "management", you picked 2 markets that the MLS, a single entity league, wants and needs to succeed in order for it to be profitable.

I'll buy the fact that MLSE hasn't surrounded Mo (or another GM) with competent football minds in the way that Vancouver is building itself.

But as long as there are undisclosed amounts of allocation money being handed out for "exceptional circumstances as approved by the competition committee" (MLS.com), I am going to scream league bias when it comes to propping up New York and LA with talent that allows them to exceed the cap.

Toronto just doesn't need propping up at this point. They have TV contracts. They have gate revenue. They have merchandise sales. There is no close geographical rival (in a major TV market) that could benefit from a strong Toronto franchise.

[Roogsy]

Interesting that when citing "management", you picked 2 markets that the MLS, a single entity league, wants and needs to succeed in order for it to be profitable.

Yes...and MLS doesn't want any other teams to be successful? Of course NY and LA are vital for the league's survival and success, but that doesn't mean the other teams can't take advantage of the same rules and allowances given to those teams. The DP rule is one for example that one could argue was custom-made for LA to bring in Beckham...but unless you prove that other teams cannot get their own "DP", then the paranoia of the league giving preferential treatment to other teams doesn't fly.


I'll buy the fact that MLSE hasn't surrounded Mo (or another GM) with competent football minds in the way that Vancouver is building itself.

But as long as there are undisclosed amounts of allocation money being handed out for "exceptional circumstances as approved by the competition committee" (MLS.com), I am going to scream league bias when it comes to propping up New York and LA with talent that allows them to exceed the cap.

Toronto just doesn't need propping up at this point. They have TV contracts. They have gate revenue. They have merchandise sales. There is no close geographical rival (in a major TV market) that could benefit from a strong Toronto franchise.This is just tin-foil hat stuff. Unless you can prove that LA and NY are exceeding the salary cap by such a substantial margin that it's creating a markedly superior product and giving them access to players that Toronto and other teams can't get themselves because it's out of our price-range, then this is just make-believe stuff and simply giving MLSE and TFC an excuse to underperform.

And let's remember that the two teams I quoted...neither have actually won a championship in the last few years but have been contenders, pointing to the obvious fact that other teams have won instead. Teams that have obviously benefited from good "management".

[jimiv]

I think I would have voted differently if I took the "Garcia factor" out of my decision...

[denime]

Thread should be renamed as RPB monthly :deadhorse:.

[Roogsy]

Maybe we should close the boards down and open them when the season ends? :noidea:

[Pookie]

Yes...and MLS doesn't want any other teams to be successful? Of course NY and LA are vital for the league's survival and success, but that doesn't mean the other teams can't take advantage of the same rules and allowances given to those teams. The DP rule is one for example that one could argue was custom-made for LA to bring in Beckham...but unless you prove that other teams cannot get their own "DP", then the paranoia of the league giving preferential treatment to other teams doesn't fly.



This is just tin-foil hat stuff. Unless you can prove that LA and NY are exceeding the salary cap by such a substantial margin that it's creating a markedly superior product and giving them access to players that Toronto and other teams can't get themselves because it's out of our price-range, then this is just make-believe stuff and simply giving MLSE and TFC an excuse to underperform.

If highlighting the published process for MLS Allocation Money distribution is equivalent to wearing a tin foil hat, then ignoring said rules is akin to wearing blinders.

A club receives allocation money for:

(1) poor performance during the preceding MLS regular season;
(2) the transfer of a player to a club outside of MLS for value;
(3) roster purposes due to expansion status; and/or
(4) exceptional circumstances as approved by the Competition Committee.

Each year the MLS Competition Committee determines the allocation amount to be made available to each team.

^ these amounts, outside of transfers, are never disclosed.

So, the amounts are not disclosed and the reasons for handing them out are never published. Yep, everything is above board and nothing funny could ever go wrong.

Tell me, how does a team like the Red Bulls that have an operating loss of over $5M annually and attendance of under 13,000 manage to afford 3 DPs?

BTW, what was the transfer fee paid to get Henry?

$0

What a deal for a player of his stature and who still owed a year to Barcelona. Great deal really for a team that is broke.

Further, considering that Barcelona are looking to establish themselves with an MLS franchise this $0 fee is a curious one. Was a deal reached that would enable Barcelona to gain a share of an existing club or an expansion club in exchange for this?

Consider the recent signing of Rafael Marquez also by the Red Bulls.

The MLS Commissioner commented “If we can bring in Marquez, the captain of the Mexican national team, a guy who had a great World Cup, a long time Barcelona player, if we could have him in MLS, it would really give us a big boost of credibility and I think would be exciting for our fans,” he told reporters.

Consider that".. according to multiple overseas reports, the Spanish super-club would only release Marquez from his contract if he signed with the Red Bulls. Otherwise, Barcelona would have demanded a transfer fee of about $6.5 million – a number that’s been viewed as prohibitive in MLS."

Read more (http://theoriginalwinger.com/2010-08-01-defender-rafael-marquez-released-from-barcelona-contract-will-join-the-red-bulls)

So, another $0 transfer set up specifically to involve only the Red Bulls and the league's commissioner is gushing about the impact for the "credibility of the league."?

Wow.

And why NY?

LA had a neat side effect for the league. Beckham comes in and then not so coincidentally expansion fees explode and we see teams in Portland, Seattle and Vancouver paying the fee. All within a west coast geography.

NY? What could the league gain here? TV ratings? Increased interest in DC? Another east coast team? A second team in NY? Yep. All of the above.

To think that Columbus or KC or Dallas had a shot at Henry and Marquez is silly.

[ilikemusic]

Im still alright with Preki so I voted yes.

He is doing what he can with what he is given.

It is still blatantly obvious that Mo is the problem and this team isnt going to really improve until he is fired.

[Gazza_55]

Agreed...

Goals win games...

If you never score, you can never win...

I'd rather see the team go out and shoot for 3pts, and if they fail at least they went for it...

This playing for a 0-0 draws, and if we score/win is a bonus is no way to go into matches in my opinion...

Carts...

Bang on. I'll give Preki a pass on the Galaxy & Salt Lake away matches but going into Philly and Kansas City praying for Nil-Nil is a joke.

[Gazza_55]

If highlighting the published process for MLS Allocation Money distribution is equivalent to wearing a tin foil hat, then ignoring said rules is akin to wearing blinders.

Tell me, how does a team like the Red Bulls that have an operating loss of over $5M annually and attendance of under 13,000 manage to afford 3 DPs?

BTW, what was the transfer fee paid to get Henry?

$0

What a deal for a player of his stature and who still owed a year to Barcelona. Great deal really for a team that is broke.



Red Bull New York is broke? Red Bull sold 2 billion cans of their product in 2009. They paid cash for the $200m RBA in New Jersey. Every stadium they build, race car they promote, footy club they own comes out their annual advertising budget. That's how they can afford 3 DPs.

[torontocelt]

all you need is to create the team with tools available that is competitive relative to the other teams in your league. We should be able to do that shouldn't we? We haven't.


But the team is competitive, they are third in their league?

It is not as easy as you think to produce attacking teams who don't concede goals. In recent years at Celtic Tony Mowbray and John Barnes attempted exactly the same thing in Scotland and each of them lasted just over half a season as they flopped badly. It must be noted that they flopped with players of a higher caliber than TFC. They also had way more money to spend than anything Preki could ever hope for and certainly way more money than the other clubs in the SPL. In the case of Mowbray he also had premiership playing and management experience and experience of both in scotland also.

I think Preki has come into the job, realised that TFC conceded far too many goals and basically decided that was the area that he needed to concentrate on the most. When you consider all of the new faces that arrived at the club also it was imperative to go back to basics and shut up shop as best as you can. Stability was key for TFC upon his arrival and I believe he has managed to do that plus take us to third in our own conference, that is not bad really? Rangers made it to the uefa cup final a few years ago with a blend of anti football that drew much criticism around the world however at the end of the day they made it to the final of a european competition and none of their fans were complaining. If Preki leads TFC into the play offs then ask yourself if you can be unhappy with his performance as manager as I would not be. I couldn't give a toss how they play as long as they make the play offs, if they dont then I will start calling him out.

[Pookie]

Red Bull New York is broke? Red Bull sold 2 billion cans of their product in 2009. They paid cash for the $200m RBA in New Jersey. Every stadium they build, race car they promote, footy club they own comes out their annual advertising budget. That's how they can afford 3 DPs.

I see, so in 2006 2007, 2008 and 2009 they opted to do what... just let the brand suffer and now in 2010 with no assistance from the league whatsoever they have opted to open their pockets and have completely and without any help or assistance from the league managed to snag 2 high profile DPs for $0 in transfer fees?

MLSE has deep pockets too but without allocation money help to buy down the DP salary cap hit or league assistance to waive transfer fees, I'm afraid there will be no superstars coming this way.

It would be nice to think this is an equal opportunity league and the MLS as a league had nothing to do with the details of the transfers and the end location for these players. But then again, this is reality and not a dream.

[ag futbol]

But the team is competitive, they are third in their league?
Not in this league : http://www.settingthetable.info/home.asp

The point thats being made here is that at the time negative tactics stop being effective his team is left with nothing. No entertainment, no points, and really not much developmental value either. Systems like the one we`ve implemented are often short-run handy, long-term stupid.

If we make the playoffs I will begrudgingly tip my hat and would be fine with it going forward providing we continue to show improvement. However, it`s questionable whether things are going to work out that way. We have the remainder of the season to find out... but as far as i`m concerned both Preki and Johnston are all in and I have no time for negative football unless its accompanied by points.

[Gazza_55]

I see, so in 2006 2007, 2008 and 2009 they opted to do what... just let the brand suffer and now in 2010 with no assistance from the league whatsoever they have opted to open their pockets and have completely and without any help or assistance from the league managed to snag 2 high profile DPs for $0 in transfer fees?

MLSE has deep pockets too but without allocation money help to buy down the DP salary cap hit or league assistance to waive transfer fees, I'm afraid there will be no superstars coming this way.

It would be nice to think this is an equal opportunity league and the MLS as a league had nothing to do with the details of the transfers and the end location for these players. But then again, this is reality and not a dream.

From 2006 to now they were building Red Bull Arena plus they had 2 DPs (Angel, Reyna). They have allocation money from sucking and from the selling Altidore for $10m. There is no conspiracy from the league. The fact that Henry and Marquez were acquired for zero transfer fees is because they are way past their primes and Barca is trying dump salary.

[ag futbol]

Interesting that when citing "management", you picked 2 markets that the MLS, a single entity league, wants and needs to succeed in order for it to be profitable.

There are plenty of examples out there. Maybe RSL is the most applicable to our situation as they were stuck in the basement until they got rid of their conically under-performing manager.

MLS might be a little big-brotherish with it`s actions but it doesn`t stop you from making quality signings, winning, or playing attractive soccer.

[Pookie]

From 2006 to now they were building Red Bull Arena plus they had 2 DPs (Angel, Reyna). They have allocation money from sucking and from the selling Altidore for $10m. There is no conspiracy from the league. The fact that Henry and Marquez were acquired for zero transfer fees is because they are way past their primes and Barca is trying dump salary.

^ really?

Barcelona said that the fee for Marquez was only waived if he went to the Red Bulls. Otherwise, the price was supposed to be in the $6.5M range.

"Marquez is another example of the cozy relationship between MLS and Barcelona. According to multiple overseas reports, the Spanish super-club would only release Marquez from his contract if he signed with the Red Bulls. Otherwise, Barcelona would have demanded a transfer fee of about $6.5 million – a number that's been viewed as prohibitive in MLS."

Read more: http://www.nydailynews.com/sports/more_sports/2010/07/31/2010-07-31_new_york_red_bulls_bound_defender_rafael_marque z_to_leave_barcelona.html#ixzz0vU1pRDhY

[Pachuco]

But the team is competitive, they are third in their league?

It is not as easy as you think to produce attacking teams who don't concede goals. In recent years at Celtic Tony Mowbray and John Barnes attempted exactly the same thing in Scotland and each of them lasted just over half a season as they flopped badly. It must be noted that they flopped with players of a higher caliber than TFC. They also had way more money to spend than anything Preki could ever hope for and certainly way more money than the other clubs in the SPL. In the case of Mowbray he also had premiership playing and management experience and experience of both in scotland also.

I think Preki has come into the job, realised that TFC conceded far too many goals and basically decided that was the area that he needed to concentrate on the most. When you consider all of the new faces that arrived at the club also it was imperative to go back to basics and shut up shop as best as you can. Stability was key for TFC upon his arrival and I believe he has managed to do that plus take us to third in our own conference, that is not bad really? Rangers made it to the uefa cup final a few years ago with a blend of anti football that drew much criticism around the world however at the end of the day they made it to the final of a european competition and none of their fans were complaining. If Preki leads TFC into the play offs then ask yourself if you can be unhappy with his performance as manager as I would not be. I couldn't give a toss how they play as long as they make the play offs, if they dont then I will start calling him out.

Man this is so deceiving it's not even funny. You've said like 3 times today that we are third in the league. Who's gives a shit if you're third in the league if you aren't sitting in the playoffs? have you looked at the standing lately? we are tied for 8th with San Jose except they have a game in hand. So technically, we are out. Chicago is 3 points behind us but they have 2 games in hand.

Sorry to bring you down to earth but Cummins had us to the point where all we needed to do was beat NY (the worst team in the league at the time) to make the playoffs. Preki doesn't have us in any better of a position. In fact, if you ask me it's worst if we were going into the last game of the season.

[Gazza_55]

^ really?

Barcelona said that the fee for Marquez was only waived if he went to the Red Bulls. Otherwise, the price was supposed to be in the $6.5M range.

"Marquez is another example of the cozy relationship between MLS and Barcelona. According to multiple overseas reports, the Spanish super-club would only release Marquez from his contract if he signed with the Red Bulls. Otherwise, Barcelona would have demanded a transfer fee of about $6.5 million – a number that's been viewed as prohibitive in MLS."

Read more: http://www.nydailynews.com/sports/more_sports/2010/07/31/2010-07-31_new_york_red_bulls_bound_defender_rafael_marque z_to_leave_barcelona.html#ixzz0vU1pRDhY




Yes really. The fee if he goes to MLS is zero because our league doesn't pay transfer fees to any great extent. If Barca could get $6.5m from some other club they should have done so. Since they couldn't ofcourse Marquez is going to be 'sold' to NY. They want to dump his salary. If you want to question their methods then rail on Barcelona. How they run their business has nothing to do with MLS. Put the tin foil hat away.

[azorean10]

I couldn't give a toss how they play as long as they make the play offs, if they dont then I will start calling him out.

This may work for you but it does'nt work for all fans. I am not saying i would'nt be happy with making the playoffs because i would be of course BUT at the same time i would like to see some entertaining football along the way. I am not expecting EPL, or La Liga quality of course, but some attractive, 'go forward' thinking type of soccer would be nice. Apart from that, i think another problem this team has is a lack of players that the fans can identify with. Maybe that is the wrong expression BUT there seems to be something lacking, I don't mean to sound like i am 'pining for the good old days' like someone suggested earlier but before we had guys like Dichio, Guevera, Brennan, Robinson, etc whom the fans latched onto and the players had some personality to them and in their play. I think the only player we have like that now is probably Dero.It is just so drab. Maybe it is the style of play that does'nt allow us to see what these players can do, I am hoping though that Santos and Mista can bring a little more excitement to the team.

[DichioTFC]

Ask this question in 48 hours and we'd see a 30% swing in votes on way or another .. haha

Unfortunately true. But in the middle of the congested schedule with crucial matches, there's no opportune time to put up the thread. Hate to do it on the heels of a disappointing loss, but it would be worse to put it right after the Motagua match.

That being said, the poll is open for another 4 or 5 days lol.


Thread should be renamed as RPB monthly :deadhorse:.

The thread is being used to measure the year long opinion of Preki by using monthly increments. Disappointing to see that the only person who feels that this thread isn't necessary / warranted / worthy of being commented on is a mod. I would expect a comment like that from a "Registered (L)user", not a mod.
:facepalm:


Bang on. I'll give Preki a pass on the Galaxy & Salt Lake away matches but going into Philly and Kansas City praying for Nil-Nil is a joke.

Preki got a yes from me. The concerns mentioned are valid, but we're still in the playoff hunt, we're on the verge of earning our first birth to the CONCACAF group stage, we play classy defensive football, and at times there is pure brilliance on the pitch with the passes and creative work being put together.

Those positives outweigh the glaring negatives for me. However, more nil-nil draws, especially at home, will ruin it for me. Also, Preki has put his team in a position that they *need* road results, considering the long home stretch was a wasted opportunity.

[torontocelt]

Not in this league : http://www.settingthetable.info/home.asp


They are still only 4 points adrift of 4th place. TFC might make it, they might not but I will wait and see at the end of the season before judging Preki. He is doing just as well as other teams outwith the top three so far.

[DichioTFC]

1. If highlighting the published process for MLS Allocation Money distribution is equivalent to wearing a tin foil hat, then ignoring said rules is akin to wearing blinders.

2. So, the amounts are not disclosed and the reasons for handing them out are never published. Yep, everything is above board and nothing funny could ever go wrong.

Tell me, how does a team like the Red Bulls that have an operating loss of over $5M annually and attendance of under 13,000 manage to afford 3 DPs?

3. Further, considering that Barcelona are looking to establish themselves with an MLS franchise this $0 fee is a curious one. Was a deal reached that would enable Barcelona to gain a share of an existing club or an expansion club in exchange for this?

So, another $0 transfer set up specifically to involve only the Red Bulls and the league's commissioner is gushing about the impact for the "credibility of the league."?

Wow.

4. And why NY?

LA had a neat side effect for the league. Beckham comes in and then not so coincidentally expansion fees explode and we see teams in Portland, Seattle and Vancouver paying the fee. All within a west coast geography.

NY? What could the league gain here? TV ratings? Increased interest in DC? Another east coast team? A second team in NY? Yep. All of the above.

Excellent points, all. Just want to comment on a select few.

1. MLS is run like a mafia. But the anti-competitive laws really are difficult to adjudicate against a private entity from engaging in these practices. Also, nobody is complaining as the shady activities are generally in the best interests of the league proper.

2. Nothing is above board and I've suspected that for a long time. How did we get Jimmy Brennan / JDG? How did LA get Beckham? How did Seattle get Ljungberg? How did KC get Teal Bunbury (father a KC legend)? How did we get OBW (from Toronto, obviously)? How did NYRB get Henry and Marquez? I could go on and on, but its clear that there are shady things happening. But that being said, what's good for the goose is good for the gander. If getting Bunbury is good for KC, then it must be good for MLS. If getting OBW is good for TFC, then it must be good for MLS. Not saying its right, but it does appear to be the way things are now.

Sidenote about NYRB's operating loss: It's okay to be a loss leader for such a large entity. And in the grand scale of things, the $5M operating loss is a small amount doesn't really account for the investing opportunities that are available for Red Bull / MLS (i.e. getting stars, new stadium, establishing fan base, growing revenues a la Toronto & Seattle & Philly).

3. Credibility of the league is more of a public policy than an active practice. But that being said, the activities that aren't credible are in the best interests of the league proper.

4. If the league gains greater revenue from a better NYRB team, and the impact correlate to TFC receiving long-term benefits (more money divided to the teams, like the NFL structure), then why not? Sure our team might suffer in the short-term, especially directly when we might be subject to two troubling results against NYRB in a couple weeks, but the league's ability to compete long-term against the world's best leagues (and accordingly get the world's best / most effective players) is in TFC's best interests as well, if we can acquire that talent (with Toronto being an internationally known cosmopolitan Euro-style city, the odds are good).

IMO, What's good for the goose is good for the gander. So what's good for the MLS is good for TFC.

[Roogsy]

They are still only 4 points adrift of 4th place. TFC might make it, they might not but I will wait and see at the end of the season before judging Preki. He is doing just as well as other teams outwith the top three so far.

It's so sad that we've come to be satisfied with mediocrity.

If supporters were satisfied with mediocrity ourselves, TFC supporters would never have kicked off the wave of support for MLS teams that they now enjoy. We'd never accept that mediocrity of ourselves, I don't understand why we'd be ok with it from our team.

[torontocelt]

Man this is so deceiving it's not even funny. You've said like 3 times today that we are third in the league. Who's gives a shit if you're third in the league if you aren't sitting in the playoffs? have you looked at the standing lately? we are tied for 8th with San Jose except they have a game in hand. So technically, we are out. Chicago is 3 points behind us but they have 2 games in hand.


They are 4 points adrift of fourth place in the overall league. It is a tight league outside of the top three, there are still many games to play and I would argue 5 play off positions up for grabs amongst 10 teams. TFC have went through a bad patch the past couple of months, this happens to most teams over the course of the season, they still have a great chance of a play off place and there are still many matches to be played. We also have Mista and Maicon still to make a contribution, it is not all doom and gloom. Is a four point difference from being in fourth place really that deceiving? Seattle have two games on us also. You are spinning the league position just as much as me, at the end of the day we are very much still in a play off spot and I am not going to state everything is terrible when four points is easy to make up.

[DichioTFC]

It's so sad that we've come to be satisfied with mediocrity.


I'm more content than satisfied with the mediocrity, but if the mediocrity leads to a playoff spot, even if its 8th, I'll be content. Playoffs and CONCACAF qualification were my hopes at the beginning of the season, and if we reach those two goals, I'll be content.

While I'm not satisfied, I'm not dissatisfied either..... yet.

[torontocelt]

It's so sad that we've come to be satisfied with mediocrity.

If supporters were satisfied with mediocrity ourselves, TFC supporters would never have kicked off the wave of support for MLS teams that they now enjoy. We'd never accept that mediocrity of ourselves, I don't understand why we'd be ok with it from our team.

Oh jeez, a play off position for TFC would be a fantastic result after not doing it for the previous three years, if you find yourself unhappy if we manage to just scrape to get into the play offs then I cannot say anything else to you, each to their own.

[Pachuco]

Oh jeez, a play off position for TFC would be a fantastic result after not doing it for the previous three years, if you find yourself unhappy if we manage to just scrape to get into the play offs then I cannot say anything else to you, each to their own.

Once again, Preki does NOT have us in a playoffs position if the season ended today. This thread is about discussing your satisfaction with Preki up to this point. So by your standards, you shouldn't be satisfied with Preki right?

If you are going to wait until the end of the season to judge then fine, but those that have an opinion now, are making that opinion based on our current standings.

[Roogsy]

Once again, Preki does NOT have us in a playoffs position if the season ended today. This thread is about discussing your satisfaction with Preki up to this point. So by your standards, you shouldn't be satisfied with Preki right?

If you are going to wait until the end of the season to judge then fine, but those that have an opinion now, are making that opinion based on our current standings.


Not only that, but there is nothing about this team that gives us any "hope" for the future. Who is going to take the mantle when DeRo is too old and JDG goes back to Europe? We're back at square one. If there is anything obvious about this team it's that it's thrown together ad-hoc. There is no plan. Nobody who makes personnel decisions has shown any ability to build a winner, neither Mo nor Preki. So while a playoff spot is still something that is 50/50 for us this year, there is nothing that points to a team that can build on this year for next year so regardless if we make it or not, at least we know that we can expect better things next year as a way to see this year as a success regardless of where we wind up in the standings.

That makes TFC supporters dupes twice-over. As we go through yet another year of "will we make it" right up until the last weeks of the season, we are also facing a team that going into next season we have no idea who and what will show up.

Unlike teams like Houston and Clownbus who have shown consistency. The only consistency we have shown is a dedication to doing just barely enough not to be the worst team. There is nothing that points to excellence and a dedication to winning.

[torontocelt]

Once again, Preki does NOT have us in a playoffs position if the season ended today. This thread is about discussing your satisfaction with Preki up to this point. So by your standards, you shouldn't be satisfied with Preki right?

If you are going to wait until the end of the season to judge then fine, but those that have an opinion now, are making that opinion based on our current standings.

I will say it, I am happy that we are four points off fourth place at this stage, I am happy with Preki at this point. I do not judge him on 'what if the league ended today' scenarios, anyone that does can do that if they wish but I do not see it a as realistic way to judge someone. There are still many games to play.

[Pachuco]

I will say it, I am happy that we are four points off fourth place at this stage, I am happy with Preki at this point. I do not judge him on 'what if the league ended today' scenarios, anyone that does can do that if they wish but I do not see it a as realistic way to judge someone. There are still many games to play.

You are only fooling yourself. We are 4 points away from being in 13th place as well and if we didn't have two games in hand on Philadelphia (that's right, the expansion team we lost to) then it could be worst. So how you can judge Preki based on your statement that we are 4 points from 4th place is crazy to me.

One more thing, Preki hasn't done much to improve our road record, September and October (the last two months of the season) we will be on the road quite a bit. Meaning we should be making up those points now if we want to stand a chance at making the playoffs.

I'll also add that the teams we are competing against are getting better, look at what Seattle, Chicago and NY have done. We haven't been getting better, we've been getting worse.

[dow117]

Im still alright with Preki so I voted yes.

He is doing what he can with what he is given.

It is still blatantly obvious that Mo is the problem and this team isnt going to really improve until he is fired.

Hey Preki is in on the player acquisitions; maybe even calling the shots on this - give Mo some credit at least - Mista and Santos are credible additions .. we need additional quality to them. Preki has brought in Harden, Peterson and stuck with Garcia ( all ex MLS teams ) and quite frankly, they have been dissapointing. No wing play and yet we have 2 solid potentials in Barrret and Peterson. Sanyang is good defensively. but his distribution is horrible. He continues to play and replaced Cronin, a developing smart player..These are coaching issues.

Sorry, Mo may be a problem but not the problem

[v00d00daddy]

Once again, Preki does NOT have us in a playoffs position if the season ended today. This thread is about discussing your satisfaction with Preki up to this point. So by your standards, you shouldn't be satisfied with Preki right?

If you are going to wait until the end of the season to judge then fine, but those that have an opinion now, are making that opinion based on our current standings.

And if the season had ended 2 weeks ago TFC would be in a playoff spot. So what?

Does TFC perform better now, under Preki, than they have in the past?

I would say yes.

Does TFC perform to the standards that I expect of this team?

This is a personal question and totally subjective. For me...yes and no. I'm happy that we aren't giving up goals in the last 10 minutes of every game, but I wish we could score a little more.

Who gets credit for the improvement in defensive play?

Both the players and Preki. It's a combination of better defensive players (Cann, Attakora in the middle, JDG, LaBrocca, Frei one year better) and Preki's tactics.

Who gets faulted for the lack of goal production?

Both the players (Barrett blows 5/6 chances, OBW has shown nothing, Mista is new, Santos is new, DeRo scores...but not lately) and Preki's negative tactics.

So....it's just a matter of opinion and preference again. There are those who don't want to see us go on the road and play for a tie. I don't mind it. I would prefer if we scored more often but again, we need to ensure we don't give up goals FIRST.

Preki is not perfect, by any stretch...but I still approve of him because I think he's pointing this team in the right direction.

As for Mo....wrong thread. Mo's ineptitude has nothing to do with Preki's approval rating...so I dont' know why it was brought up.

[Pachuco]

And if the season had ended 2 weeks ago TFC would be in a playoff spot. So what?

Does TFC perform better now, under Preki, than they have in the past?

I would say yes.

Does TFC perform to the standards that I expect of this team?

This is a personal question and totally subjective. For me...yes and no. I'm happy that we aren't giving up goals in the last 10 minutes of every game, but I wish we could score a little more.

Who gets credit for the improvement in defensive play?

Both the players and Preki. It's a combination of better defensive players (Cann, Attakora in the middle, JDG, LaBrocca, Frei one year better) and Preki's tactics.

Who gets faulted for the lack of goal production?

Both the players (Barrett blows 5/6 chances, OBW has shown nothing, Mista is new, Santos is new, DeRo scores...but not lately) and Preki's negative tactics.

So....it's just a matter of opinion and preference again. There are those who don't want to see us go on the road and play for a tie. I don't mind it. I would prefer if we scored more often but again, we need to ensure we don't give up goals FIRST.

Preki is not perfect, by any stretch...but I still approve of him because I think he's pointing this team in the right direction.

As for Mo....wrong thread. Mo's ineptitude has nothing to do with Preki's approval rating...so I dont' know why it was brought up.

What do you mean so what? this thread is subject to all games up to this point, not as of two weeks ago. Why do people like you have such a hard time understanding the concept of the thread? If we win the next 2 games and every one on top of us loses the next two games then the next thread would have different opinions.

Regardless, you say Preki has us in a better position then years before. And all I'm saying is that right now we aren't in the playoffs. If the season was ending today then we would be in a worst off situation then we were at the end of last season. I don't know how else to prove it that this team isn't performing any better then last year. Never mind the fact that I went on to say that our road record still stinks and we are going to finish off the last two months of the season with lots of road games. If you were to do some sort of forecasting I can guarantee you we'd be out of a playoffs spot.

[Beach_Red]

The only consistency we have shown is a dedication to doing just barely enough not to be the worst team. There is nothing that points to excellence and a dedication to winning.


It's frustrating to see this because it's true. And because it shouldn't surprise us. This company is consistent, that's for sure.

[Shakes McQueen]

I'm still yes, it's been frustrating recently, and we're clearly still far from the finished product, but I think we're on the right track still.

Agreed 100% with you. I'll even go so far as to say that, if this team doesn't even make the playoffs, I don't want Preki fired - I wan't Mo fired.

I think Preki has this group on the right track, and we need to finally have some consistency at the coaching level. I think Preki advocates a more "boring" brand of football, but I will accept that if it brings results.

I try to remember how bad we thought this team was going to be at the beginning of the year, and how, against all odds, Preki has actually made this team a slightly better unit than in any previous year (at least to this point). With a proper general manager who can actually manage the cap, and get us some real offensive/wing players, who knows what Preki could do.

For now, this is the stoutest defense TFC has ever had in it's short history, and that's enough for me to continue voting "Yes". If the team collapses down the stretch, my opinion might change, but barring that I'm happy with the job Preki has done.

Eventually we need to stop the coaching merry-go-round every year, and look elsewhere to solve our problems. I suggest starting with a certain unnamed Scotsman.

- Scott

[torontocelt]

You are only fooling yourself. We are 4 points away from being in 13th place as well and if we didn't have two games in hand on Philadelphia (that's right, the expansion team we lost to) then it could be worst. So how you can judge Preki based on your statement that we are 4 points from 4th place is crazy to me.


That's because it is a tight league outwith the front three...

[v00d00daddy]

What do you mean so what? this thread is subject to all games up to this point, not as of two weeks ago. Why do people like you have such a hard time understanding the concept of the thread? If we win the next 2 games and every one on top of us loses the next two games then the next thread would have different opinions.

Regardless, you say Preki has us in a better position then years before. And all I'm saying is that right now we aren't in the playoffs. If the season was ending today then we would be in a worst off situation then we were at the end of last season. I don't know how else to prove it that this team isn't performing any better then last year. Never mind the fact that I went on to say that our road record still stinks and we are going to finish off the last two months of the season with lots of road games. If you were to do some sort of forecasting I can guarantee you we'd be out of a playoffs spot.


So your approval or disapproval of Preki is solely dependent on where TFC are in the standings when the question is posed to you?

Okay...but that's not how I based my opinion.

This team is nowhere near to perfect but if they can score a little more they can be successful.

Mista and Santos are just getting their feet wet. DeRo is in a slump that I hope he gets out of and Preki has started using JDG in a bit more advanced role with the emergence of Nane/Saric/Sanyang (none of whom I'm overly happy with, but will do).

I still hold out hope for this team because Preki's plan can still work out. I think he set out to make TFC better defensively. Done. He's also made them a bit deeper at most positions. (i know they're still lacking at LB and on the wings). If he can figure out a way to get the boys scoring TFC will be just fine.

If you, or any other people think that this team is just as bad as the previous 3 incarnations, all I can say is that I disagree and the end of the season will settle that debate.

For now, I think Preki's approach is working (albeit slowly) and I think it's exactly what we need going into tomorrow's match in Honduras.

First priority against Motagua= Don't concede
Second priority= score.

Get that done and we're off to the next round.

[v00d00daddy]

Agreed 100% with you. I'll even go so far as to say that, if this team doesn't even make the playoffs, I don't want Preki fired - I wan't Mo fired.

I think Preki has this group on the right track, and we need to finally have some consistency at the coaching level. I think Preki advocates a more "boring" brand of football, but I will accept that if it brings results.

I try to remember how bad we thought this team was going to be at the beginning of the year, and how, against all odds, Preki has actually made this team a slightly better unit than in any previous year (at least to this point). With a proper general manager who can actually manage the cap, and get us some real offensive/wing players, who knows what Preki could do.

For now, this is the stoutest defense TFC has ever had in it's short history, and that's enough for me to continue voting "Yes". If the team collapses down the stretch, my opinion might change, but barring that I'm happy with the job Preki has done.

Eventually we need to stop the coaching merry-go-round every year, and look elsewhere to solve our problems. I suggest starting with a certain unnamed Scotsman.

- Scott

+1

Wish I would have seen this before putting up my post.
Well said.

[torontocelt]

For now, I think Preki's approach is working (albeit slowly) and I think it's exactly what we need going into tomorrow's match in Honduras.

First priority against Motagua= Don't concede
Second priority= score.

Get that done and we're off to the next round.

I dont have much hope for TFC tomorrow, prepare for certain people to be throwing your above statement back in your face and telling you they were right.

I too dont base my opinion of Preki on where we are positioned in the league on the day that someone decides to ask, there is much more to consider than that in a league that is so tight. You have at least managed to break some of that down and I agree for the most part.

[torontocelt]

Agreed 100% with you. I'll even go so far as to say that, if this team doesn't even make the playoffs, I don't want Preki fired - I wan't Mo fired.

I think Preki has this group on the right track, and we need to finally have some consistency at the coaching level. I think Preki advocates a more "boring" brand of football, but I will accept that if it brings results.

I try to remember how bad we thought this team was going to be at the beginning of the year, and how, against all odds, Preki has actually made this team a slightly better unit than in any previous year (at least to this point). With a proper general manager who can actually manage the cap, and get us some real offensive/wing players, who knows what Preki could do.

For now, this is the stoutest defense TFC has ever had in it's short history, and that's enough for me to continue voting "Yes". If the team collapses down the stretch, my opinion might change, but barring that I'm happy with the job Preki has done.

Eventually we need to stop the coaching merry-go-round every year, and look elsewhere to solve our problems. I suggest starting with a certain unnamed Scotsman.

- Scott

Pretty much what I said but I didn't mention Mo.

[H Bomb]

I think firstly we need to stop considering other peoples opinions an insult to whatever our stances are. if you like the job prekis doing, fine, cool, I dont, it doesnt matter what either of us think really. For me though Preki is hurting the team. We have more talent and balanced ability on this team than any other year. and we are only a tiny bit better in the standings than in the past. and we play like a bunch of pussies who are afraid to lose. With this team and a decent manager we'd be taking names IMO, and thats what i think,

[Pachuco]

So your approval or disapproval of Preki is solely dependent on where TFC are in the standings when the question is posed to you?

Okay...but that's not how I based my opinion.

This team is nowhere near to perfect but if they can score a little more they can be successful.

Mista and Santos are just getting their feet wet. DeRo is in a slump that I hope he gets out of and Preki has started using JDG in a bit more advanced role with the emergence of Nane/Saric/Sanyang (none of whom I'm overly happy with, but will do).

I still hold out hope for this team because Preki's plan can still work out. I think he set out to make TFC better defensively. Done. He's also made them a bit deeper at most positions. (i know they're still lacking at LB and on the wings). If he can figure out a way to get the boys scoring TFC will be just fine.

If you, or any other people think that this team is just as bad as the previous 3 incarnations, all I can say is that I disagree and the end of the season will settle that debate.

For now, I think Preki's approach is working (albeit slowly) and I think it's exactly what we need going into tomorrow's match in Honduras.

First priority against Motagua= Don't concede
Second priority= score.

Get that done and we're off to the next round.

Not it's not. I was responding specifically to your statement that Preki has us in a better position then we were in last year. I was pointing you to the only fact that can back your statement up, and the fact is, we aren't in a better position.

My dissaproval of Preki has more to do with things such as his absolute massacre of our offense, even though we have players on the team that should be putting the ball in the net. His inability to improve our road record. His continous love for Garcia. Letting go of some of the best players TFC has had and replacing them with some ridicolously bad players who no one identifies with. His ridicolous defensive mentality that doesn't work away from home and makes for some horrible home games to watch.

The most important thing though is that I don't believe we are a team that is improving and lots of teams around us are improving. I believe we are on our way down, and by Sept is all said and done I think we'll be in trouble.

[torontocelt]

I think firstly we need to stop considering other peoples opinions an insult to whatever our stances are. if you like the job prekis doing, fine, cool, I dont, it doesnt matter what either of us think really. For me though Preki is hurting the team. We have more talent and balanced ability on this team than any other year. and we are only a tiny bit better in the standings than in the past. and we play like a bunch of pussies who are afraid to lose. With this team and a decent manager we'd be taking names IMO, and thats what i think,

Agreed, some people need to chill out. If people dont agree, well who gives a toss?

[Pachuco]

Agreed, some people need to chill out. If people dont agree, well who gives a toss?

I think this thread is pretty chill no?

[Stryker]

I think Preki's done a great job in changing the team's mentality and culture.
Can't say I care for the type of players he's brought in though with the exception of Cann.
Except for a handful of times we've seen some nice strings of passes put together this team is boring as hell.

[Brooker]

We don't give up weak goals in the last 20 minutes every other game... that in itself is huge.

[torontocelt]

I think this thread is pretty chill no?

Compared to some other previous threads then yep this one is pretty chilled out, still no threats of violence or people telling others about their hot wives, ha, ha.

[Fort York Redcoat]

Is Preki looking like he's the to make the most of our squad and take to the cup(s)? Not so far for me. I think he's got the team the farthest up the standings this far in the regular season. I'm happy with that but it's not enough. I prefer to leave it till the end of season to talk about his future with the club.

But yeah, this is mid season and opinions are just that. Opinions.

[Pookie]

Yes really. The fee if he goes to MLS is zero because our league doesn't pay transfer fees to any great extent. If Barca could get $6.5m from some other club they should have done so. Since they couldn't ofcourse Marquez is going to be 'sold' to NY. They want to dump his salary. If you want to question their methods then rail on Barcelona. How they run their business has nothing to do with MLS. Put the tin foil hat away.

Right. So, they put the price tag at $6.5M for anyone but the Red Bulls and you think that's just fine. They weren't trying to dicate where he landed at all with that move.

Right.

Screw the fact that MLS has paid for transfers before, including over $4M for Luis Hernadez a decade ago, why would Barcelona dictate that the $0 transfer fee applied only to the Red Bulls?

Why do they care which team they "dump his salary" to?
If they were truly "dumping salary" why was it so important to limit the options to NY? Why not open the door to KC? Columbus? Dallas? Houston? Chivas? New England?

I mean why would one business want to help the Red Bulls, specifically?

Doesn't make sense unless you remember the Commissioner's words that stated that helping the Red Bulls would be terrific for the MLS business.

But why would one business (Barcelona) want to help another business (the MLS)?

I guess that's what partners do:

Barcelona signs five-year deal with MLS
Associated Press
May 15, 2008


http://soccernet.espn.go.com/news/story?id=535599&&cc=5901 (http://soccernet.espn.go.com/news/story?id=535599&&cc=5901)


No sir, nothing going on here. Everyone had a fair and square chance to sign Henry & Marquez. The league isn't doing anything at all to help them succeed in the stands or on TV. It would have absolutely no benefit for the league as a whole and their partners.

No sir. Nothing to see here. Move along.

[Fort York Redcoat]

You know Pook, I'm no stranger to sarcasm...

Gazza's disbelief aside, do you think MLS is shooting itself in the foot with this breach of parity? I'm not sure the majority of NA fans want to hear any other word to descibe their league. If this is indeed a way to circumvent parity I'm all for it.

Do we believe the trade for DeRo was black and white, above board transparency?

How's Julius James doing? I assume he has the armband...:D

Anyway, we're getting away from the management question which, so far as I'm aware has no budgetary restraints, correct? Is it not up to ownership to purchase the best they can and hope the single entitiy monster approves the deal(s)?

[Pookie]

You know Pook, I'm no stranger to sarcasm...

Gazza's disbelief aside, do you think MLS is shooting itself in the foot with this breach of parity? I'm not sure the majority of NA fans want to hear any other word to descibe their league. If this is indeed a way to circumvent parity I'm all for it.

Do we believe the trade for DeRo was black and white, above board transparency?

How's Julius James doing? I assume he has the armband...:D

Anyway, we're getting away from the management question which, so far as I'm aware has no budgetary restraints, correct? Is it not up to ownership to purchase the best they can and hope the single entitiy monster approves the deal(s)?

Breach of parity, eh? Interesting concept actually.

Your comment about it being up to ownership is where I think the root of the issues are found. Ownership is the league and NA fans don't really get this concept.

In the hockey world, if Toronto wants to sign a player, they go out and compete with other cities to do so.

In the MLS world, what if Toronto wanted to sign Marquez? The "set up" would have effectively killed that. The league didn't want Marquez in Toronto, they needed him in NY so that's where he goes.

You might get around parity in that the Red Bulls now have 3 aging DPs on their roster (the 3rd DP being a new rule this year and the Red Bulls are the only team to take advantage of it so far... curious). That could serve them well in the quest for the Cup.

But they aren't there based on the strength of the Red Bulls' ownership, fan support or player development. They are there based the league wanted them there to inject cash into a major market that ownership (MLS) needs to grow and could eventually be parlayed into a 2nd NY based team, complete with expansion fees.

So, do you really support this as a way to create dynasties in the MLS?

Nothing based on internal resources, talent development or fan support. Simply a function of your location and proximity to major TV deals? Sort of like "Professional Wrestling" with the acting and drama but the outcome is already pre-determined.

[Fort York Redcoat]

^The problem we will face in the future is when will it be decided our league is stable enough to break up single entity?

If Toronto does its part to create better management and leadership by purchasing the best available to us it's just a question of patience.

Like I'll give Preki till the end of season I'll give our next GM time to turn this team to a cup contender. It goes to the league level as well. I'll give the league time to fill their stadiums and until they do I expect to see the wheeling dealing backdeals and midseason friendlies, All star games, Superligas etc.

[Gazza_55]

Right. So, they put the price tag at $6.5M for anyone but the Red Bulls and you think that's just fine. They weren't trying to dicate where he landed at all with that move.



Barca put a price tag of $6.5m for Marquez and there were no takers who also wanted to assume his contract. MLS said they would take on the monthly terms but not the fee. Again, it is up to the club and the player what offer they accept. Blaming MLS for acquiring very good international players for little or no transfer fee is interesting.

[Juanito]

Prekiball, as I've "seen" it being describes as, has not been consistently working. If we were grinding out victories on the road, then I would "drink from the kool-aid".

However, we've been really struggling and we've been losing (and drawing) matches because we play too conservatively. We have swung the other way and we haven't found that balance.

Would it kill guys to attack with urgency a bit more?

[LesH]

Also, without Frei's play this season the 19 ga in 17 gp stat may look alittle more like 25 or 26 ga and that puts us right on par with seasons 1-3.



+1.000!

Don't ever forget this guys, when analyzing the success of FTC's defense this year. Preki has zero merit in Frei's good play, and Frei is a keeper clearly over the MLS average.

I also voted yes, but just because there is no undecided option. And IMO at least 1/3 of those who are voting "yes" are in the same situation.

[Pookie]

^The problem we will face in the future is when will it be decided our league is stable enough to break up single entity?

If Toronto does its part to create better management and leadership by purchasing the best available to us it's just a question of patience.

Like I'll give Preki till the end of season I'll give our next GM time to turn this team to a cup contender. It goes to the league level as well. I'll give the league time to fill their stadiums and until they do I expect to see the wheeling dealing backdeals and midseason friendlies, All star games, Superligas etc.

You are probably right. My guess is that they are aiming for the kind of national TV deal enjoyed by the NFL. It may not be as rich but if they could score a significant one, their revenues take off. Which is why I think there is a focus on developing strong coasts and virtually ignorning the middle of the continent.

Until that time, they are like the NHL in that they are a gate driven league. Success depends on bums in the seats and how much they spend at the stadium. You live and breathe attendance numbers.

[Juanito]

The league wants more solid clubs. Clubs that can n sell soccer to its masses. I can see the Columbuses and KCs of the league vanish sooner rather than later. There will come a time in which its not financially viable to keep them around.

[jabbronies]

Remember that in order for Garber to get his second team into NY, the Red Bulls need to become a financially successful team. I'm sure it will be at all costs.

[Beach_Red]

Breach of parity, eh? Interesting concept actually.

Your comment about it being up to ownership is where I think the root of the issues are found. Ownership is the league and NA fans don't really get this concept.




I think NA fans get this concept better than anyone and that's why the league needs to keep owners in line.

NA fans get a lot of grief on this board because, it seems, they want a competitive league where all the teams follow the same rules. Certainly everyone agrees that the same rules apply on the field - the only question is when does that concept of the same rules applying to every team end?

NA fans long ago accepted the concept of a league with the same teams that play only one another. So a few things about the soccer world are new and will take a little while to be accepted. Or, the sport and it's set-up may not be accepted at all.

[P-NUTZ]

i don't like missing out on the points that have been ours for the taking, but at some point these players need to play hungrier and finish, and help their coach out.

it is a defensive system, which im fine with as a low GA is awesome.
but there is little excuse for the current squad to not produce more goals.
it's BS and it's the players fault in my mind.

[KdotOdot]

You can't blame Preki for DeGuzman sucking ass.

[P-NUTZ]

or peterson wasting balls

[trane]

This is the bottom line for me. I have seen us play be more competitive and play game in and game out this season. We look like a proper footy team, most of the time. Sure it has not been perfect, and it has been ugly at times. BUT this has been far less then past seasons. At first I had no idea what he was doing. But now I support him. We have not won against Matnagua a year ago. That in my eyes was the best game we have played from fron to back ever.

[Juanito]

This is the bottom line for me. I have seen us play be more competitive and play game in and game out this season. We look like a proper footy team, most of the time. Sure it has not been perfect, and it has been ugly at times. BUT this has been far less then past seasons. At first I had no idea what he was doing. But now I support him. We have not won against Matnagua a year ago. That in my eyes was the best game we have played from fron to back ever.

I agree. We at least look organized. This is a step up from seasons previous.

[ManUtd4ever]

Although I disagree with Preki's tactical approach on the road, I still believe he has done a credible job overall considering the roster he had to work with at the beginning of the season. I am somewhat baffled as to why TFC has struggled in recent weeks against inferior clubs just as offensive reinforcements such as Santos and Mista were acquired. Nontheless, considering that the majority of games the rest of the way are on the road, I hope Preki will implement an attack oriented approach away from BMO Field in the stretch run...

[Fort York Redcoat]

I think NA fans get this concept better than anyone and that's why the league needs to keep owners in line.

NA fans get a lot of grief on this board because, it seems, they want a competitive league where all the teams follow the same rules. Certainly everyone agrees that the same rules apply on the field - the only question is when does that concept of the same rules applying to every team end?

NA fans long ago accepted the concept of a league with the same teams that play only one another. So a few things about the soccer world are new and will take a little while to be accepted. Or, the sport and it's set-up may not be accepted at all.

and if they don't accept it I will blame you alone BR.:D

BTW-nice assessment. Should the same rules apply? Certainly. Do they? Even on the field? Saturday's game. JDG got hauled down in a way Espinoza. One earned a card while the other didn't.

[Roogsy]

Although I disagree with Preki's tactical approach on the road, I still believe he has done a credible job overall considering the roster he had to work with at the beginning of the season.

See this is where I have a problem.

Is Preki a capable manager? I think so. He has the pedigree, knowledge and experience.

Is he a great manager, not in the least. And that is what I wanted.

So I guess it comes down to what I was hoping for vs what I got in the offseason. What we have now is certainly an improvement from last year. I don't think I could live through another season of dropping games in the final 15 minutes of play. But then again, we are scoring less, making an already boring team even more boring and less capable than before.

And even moreso when you think of teams that retooled after a season and came out and burned a path into the playoffs and even the finals. In the short time that TFC has been in the playoffs we have seen a team like NY make it to the finals, become the worst team in the league and now blaze a path again into the playoffs again. But in the meantime, we tinker and tool with TFC and never see any extended moments of brilliance. And when supporters are using words like he's done a "credible" job...that inspires absolutely no confidence in me when I look over at NY and see what a new coach who had almost the shit to deal with has completely overhauled the team into contention in the same amount of time. And they're not the only example.

We get a "credible" job, NY gets a super-fantastic job. Are we not worth what NY got?

[Yohan]

I find it surprising that some people are bringing the axes out already. Well, not really but this is Toronto after all

TFC has been in need of a coach who can organize the team and we finally got one. Half season later, and in a bit of slump, and somehow changing coaches now would turn things around?

More likely more confusion in the locker room and even less confidence in the management, I'd think. Unless Mo brings in Guus Hiddink or Jose Mourinho or something.

MLS is a funny league. You would have thought Schellas Hyndman or Frank Yallop would have gotten the axe after a rather shitty season last year, but this year, Dallas and SJ are doing pretty good.
Steve Nicol and Dominic Kinnear's teams have been struggling this year. Despite their record and experience, should they get the axe now too?

We're stuck with Preki for now, for the better or worse. He has shown to be far better manager than JC or Cummins or Mo. I think he deserves more patience than some of you have been showing him right now.

[Yohan]

We get a "credible" job, NY gets a super-fantastic job. Are we not worth what NY got?
I think every MLS supporter asks that from their team... What makes us so special compared to others that we should always get the best?

[KdotOdot]

See this is where I have a problem.

Is Preki a capable manager? I think so. He has the pedigree, knowledge and experience.

Is he a great manager, not in the least. And that is what I wanted.

So I guess it comes down to what I was hoping for vs what I got in the offseason. What we have now is certainly an improvement from last year. I don't think I could live through another season of dropping games in the final 15 minutes of play. But then again, we are scoring less, making an already boring team even more boring and less capable than before.

And even moreso when you think of teams that retooled after a season and came out and burned a path into the playoffs and even the finals. In the short time that TFC has been in the playoffs we have seen a team like NY make it to the finals, become the worst team in the league and now blaze a path again into the playoffs again. But in the meantime, we tinker and tool with TFC and never see any extended moments of brilliance. And when supporters are using words like he's done a "credible" job...that inspires absolutely no confidence in me when I look over at NY and see what a new coach who had almost the shit to deal with has completely overhauled the team into contention in the same amount of time. And they're not the only example.

We get a "credible" job, NY gets a super-fantastic job. Are we not worth what NY got?

The way I look at TFC is like a bowl of soup someone took a giant shit into. Now you got Preki to come in their and take all of the shit ouf the soup. Which he did.

Are you still going to eat the soup Roogsy?

[DichioTFC]

Let's not forget, this is a team in a transition. Of course it's always been in a state of flux, but at least the stability has now arrived with Preki and I'm sure he's doing the best with the tools he has at his disposal

If we see results like these next season, once the cancer in the FO is removed this off-season, then harder criticisms on Preki will be warranted. But until then, considering the quality of the results, he still gets a pass from me

[Oldtimer]

I think every MLS supporter asks that from their team... What makes us so special compared to others that we should always get the best?

$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$

[Gobi]

Down with Preki!

Up with Pants!

[ArmenJBX]

I like Preki, I dislike some player choices, but as a coach he's brought stability and consistency, especially in defense.

[ManUtd4ever]

See this is where I have a problem.

Is Preki a capable manager? I think so. He has the pedigree, knowledge and experience.

Is he a great manager, not in the least. And that is what I wanted.

So I guess it comes down to what I was hoping for vs what I got in the offseason. What we have now is certainly an improvement from last year. I don't think I could live through another season of dropping games in the final 15 minutes of play. But then again, we are scoring less, making an already boring team even more boring and less capable than before.

And even moreso when you think of teams that retooled after a season and came out and burned a path into the playoffs and even the finals. In the short time that TFC has been in the playoffs we have seen a team like NY make it to the finals, become the worst team in the league and now blaze a path again into the playoffs again. But in the meantime, we tinker and tool with TFC and never see any extended moments of brilliance. And when supporters are using words like he's done a "credible" job...that inspires absolutely no confidence in me when I look over at NY and see what a new coach who had almost the shit to deal with has completely overhauled the team into contention in the same amount of time. And they're not the only example.

We get a "credible" job, NY gets a super-fantastic job. Are we not worth what NY got?

We are worth more than what NY got and it infuriates me as well. The reality though is that Preki was probably the best coaching candidate available at the time. As for the DP acquisitions, Toronto does not have the allure abroad of NY or LA when it comes to high profile athletes even though I think we live in the greatest city in the world.

[Roogsy]

The way I look at TFC is like a bowl of soup someone took a giant shit into. Now you got Preki to come in their and take all of the shit ouf the soup. Which he did.

Are you still going to eat the soup Roogsy?

Apparently we all are.

And he did take the shit out...only he added his own as well. :D

[Roogsy]

I think every MLS supporter asks that from their team... What makes us so special compared to others that we should always get the best?

Always get the best? How about we start with not being shit first.

As for what we deserve, it may sound like a sense of entitlement, but the way we have influenced the league, the way things are supported and how the league starts up new teams? Yeah...I think we deserve a little credit and reward.

[TFCtoMUFC]

If we win tonight all is forgiven. I would like to see Preki focus on the CCL and mail it in with regards to the MLS schedule. That way we get meaningful games and Mo goes.

[KdotOdot]

Preki taught these fucking monkeys how to keep posession. Are you people so short sighted? Seriously?

Before Preki we couldn't string together 3 passes! 3 fucking passes. I don;t give a fuck if the special one himself was the manager, the team we have, the way they play, the lack of fundamentals, they're utterly hopeless.

We have 1, count'em 1 good player. A midfielder who scored more goals than our strikers. who's fault is that?

Jesus.

[Roogsy]

We have 1, count'em 1 good player. A midfielder who scored more goals than our strikers. who's fault is that?

Um...funny enough a big part of that actually falls on Preki. In fact, if it were up to Preki we probably wouldn't even have DeRo. Where would be we be then?

[denime]

Preki taught these fucking monkeys how to keep posession. Are you people so short sighted? Seriously?

Before Preki we couldn't string together 3 passes! 3 fucking passes. I don;t give a fuck if the special one himself was the manager, the team we have, the way they play, the lack of fundamentals, they're utterly hopeless.

We have 1, count'em 1 good player. A midfielder who scored more goals than our strikers. who's fault is that?

Jesus.
^ Agree 100%

v Apparently Preki's :rolleyes:


Um...funny enough a big part of that actually falls on Preki. In fact, if it were up to Preki we probably wouldn't even have DeRo. Where would be we be then?

Lets face it Roogsy,you don't like Preki from day one ,I don't know why or what he did to you that you to dislike him so much ,but the way I see TFC improved in every aspect.

Unless you will blame him for players individual mistakes or blind forwards that can not score from 100% chances.
We have 13 games left and we are 4 points behind 2nd place in the east,with a tie or win tonight we will be in CL group stage,is that so bad that he should get fired?:facepalm:

Roogsy TFC is not Barca, MLS is not La Liga and CCL is not UEFA CL and will never be,you have to settle here for less otherwise you will go nuts.:crazy:

[Whoop]

Regardless of what I think Preki is here only temporary. As much as I hate the style of play, the team had to be stripped down in terms of playing fundamental football. After a season or two of adequate results, possibly a playoff spot or two, someone else will have to be brought in to take TFC over the hump. However that goes in hand with the bigger issue, which is - What core is being built by Mo and co. for the future? That's more concerning to me than the coaching.

[Whoop]

Come on denime it's easy.

Roogsy loves DeRo, Preki didn't/doesn't like DeRo, therefore Roogsy dislikes Preki.

LOL

[Jeffro]

I've backed Preki every step of the way until recently. At first I knew he was laying down a solid system and getting the team to keep a great defensive shape instead of the sloppy play we'd seen in past years. The offense would come next, or so I thought. There have been some brief signs of promise along the way, but over the past month I've become quite frustrated with the negative tactics employed in very winable games especially at home, but also road games like Philly. It has seemed like every game for at least a month we've been out there looking for a 0-0 draw and I think our team is better than that.

We have the players now to keep the possession and bring the game to most teams in MLS. Play to win games. If you score a goal, go after another, keep the ball, make the opposition work. Don't just think "job done" pack it in let them have the ball and try to defend.

I voted no for how I feel at this moment, but I'm hoping the home game against Motagua is an indication of how we may approach more games in the near future.

[J .]

I said at the beginning of the year to expect a lot of 1-0, 1-1 games and I was right. I like what Preki is doing in his first year. We really have grown in some respects and we have definaely sacrificed some offense to improve our defending. Sadly, JDG has contributed little to our offense and I was hoping he would really help carve up backlines with his passing. Defensively, (aside from the game in colorado) he has been pretty good.

[denime]

Come on denime it's easy.

Roogsy loves DeRo, Preki didn't/doesn't like DeRo, therefore Roogsy dislikes Preki.

LOL


WOW so true :D

It was written all over the wall all this time and I didn't see it.

Roogsy is DeRo in disguise !

[Roogsy]

I am...look at my avatar. It's a self-picture. :D

[Roogsy]

Lets face it Roogsy,you don't like Preki from day one ,I don't know why or what he did to you that you to dislike him so much ,but the way I see TFC improved in every aspect.

Unless you will blame him for players individual mistakes or blind forwards that can not score from 100% chances.
We have 13 games left and we are 4 points behind 2nd place in the east,with a tie or win tonight we will be in CL group stage,is that so bad that he should get fired?:facepalm:



OK...for one, this argument that has popped up recently of being 4 points behind whatever is ridiculous. The fact is we're not there and in fact we are once again sitting out of a playoff spot and facing down teams that have signed new DPs that are making a real push for the playoffs.

Second...yes, I don't like Preki. At first when he was first brought in I wasn't particularly thrilled but was willing to give him a shot. Like everyone else around here, I do want consistency with this team and unlike most people here who do have a bias one way or another, I am at least willing to recognize the good that Preki has done. But unlike some on here who have raised Preki to genius-level, he actually hasn't improved the team more than what most coaches should have done to begin with, which is recognize that the team needed to concentrate on the basics of footbal defending.

What Preki-defenders have chosen to ignore is that Preki took an average scoring team and made it less than average. So yeah, we are letting in fewer goals but we are also scoring fewer, and playing ugly football while we're at it. I could care less if the team is now able to string 3 passes together when in the end, we are even less able than ever to put it in the back of the net. My Preki-bias withstanding or not, these are facts not opinions. Add that to the shenanigans he caused at the beginning of the season and he left a bad taste in my mouth yeah, so forgive me if I am going to have to insist that he actually do something to impress me before I anoint him TFC's saviour.

[rocker]

The question of the poll simply asks:

Do you approve of the job Preki has done as head coach of Toronto FC?

I answered yes.

I don't think he's happy with anything, to be honest. Preki always looks pissed off. It's not like things are coming together perfectly. I think coaching isn't a problem with this team now. I'd rather have Preki than Carver or Cummins.

[SirBobSaget]

I voted "no" for giving 17 yo central defender his first pro start ever at RB in HONDURAS.

[Darlofletch]

yeah. approve that bitches!

well to be fair, this match wasn't preki's finest hour, i was a bit over exited when coming home from the bar. but hey we won.

[Shakes McQueen]

I voted "no" for giving 17 yo central defender his first pro start ever at RB in HONDURAS.

Oh, you mean that CCL series we just won? Bwahahahaha!

- Scott

[Yohan]

Always get the best? How about we start with not being shit first.

As for what we deserve, it may sound like a sense of entitlement, but the way we have influenced the league, the way things are supported and how the league starts up new teams? Yeah...I think we deserve a little credit and reward.
how about NY, Dallas, New England and Colorado sticking around since founding days of MLS?

my point is that any sense of entitlement and asking for some reward because of it is kinda silly

let the best team (or the luckiest team) win

[Shakes McQueen]

As for what we deserve, it may sound like a sense of entitlement, but the way we have influenced the league, the way things are supported and how the league starts up new teams? Yeah...I think we deserve a little credit and reward.

We deserve no more "credit" or "reward" than any of the other teams that came years before us, and helped found and drag this league through it's earliest and most trying years.

- Scott

[Roogsy]

Being here "before" us has nothing to do with teams that have supporters that live and breathe for their team and show it game in and game out. If you guys think the half-empty stadiums in Dallas and Colorado deserve the same as the perpetually full BMO Field, then I weep for this league.

If a half-empty stadium in Clownbus receives an MLS championship and Supporters Shield, then TFC should at least be good enough to be in contention. That's all I am saying.

[Yohan]

Being here "before" us has nothing to do with teams that have supporters that live and breathe for their team and show it game in and game out. If you guys think the half-empty stadiums in Dallas and Colorado deserve the same as the perpetually full BMO Field, then I weep for this league.

If a half-empty stadium in Clownbus receives an MLS championship and Supporters Shield, then TFC should at least be good enough to be in contention. That's all I am saying.
we should award extra goals to whichever teams has better and louder supporters then

and force Henry, Donovan and JPA to play for Toronto just because we have better supporters

[DichioTFC]

Oh, you mean that CCL series we just won? Bwahahahaha!

- Scott

Plus. Fucking. One.

[Pachuco]

Oh, you mean that CCL series we just won? Bwahahahaha!

- Scott

Pretty childish post. The man is talking about Preki's horrible decision to play an Academy player and all you can do is rub it in his face that TFC won. The two don't have to be connected. Preki fucked up with that starting lineup. No doubt about it. He got away with one today.

[Azerban]

no shit

if you think starting the academy player tonight was a good choice, no matter the result, you're a fucking ijit

get over yourself

[Stryker]

Pretty childish post. The man is talking about Preki's horrible decision to play an Academy player and all you can do is rub it in his face that TFC won. The two don't have to be connected. Preki fucked up with that starting lineup. No doubt about it. He got away with one today.
Agreed. We won in spite of Preki tonight. Don't fool yourselves.

[ManUtd4ever]

Preki acknowledged his error in judgement to start the match by making the necessary adjustments to the lineup and formation during the match. If Preki is to be criticized for his initial flawed strategy than he should also be lauded for correcting his errors tonight and guiding TFC to new heights...

[DichioTFC]

Preki took risks. One failed, the others worked. Net gain.

Focusing solely on positives or negatives is stupid. Look at the whole picture.

[Stryker]

The whole picture is that we finally had a little luck tonight.
Praise be to Preki. :frown2:

[Azerban]

no

you can't go WELP LOOK AT THE WHOLE PICTURE WE WON and ignore the fact that the starting lineup was silly and that we just threw a kid to the wolves

sorry

[TFCtoMUFC]

no

you can't go WELP LOOK AT THE WHOLE PICTURE WE WON and ignore the fact that the starting lineup was silly and that we just threw a kid to the wolves

sorry

To quote Herm Edwards "YOU PLAY TO WIN THE GAME!". We tied, but that resulted in an overall win. Doneil Henry got experience, it wasn't like he was at fault for 5 goals or anything. 30 minutes of footy might help him age almost a year mentally. This could help us in the future.

[Carts]

To quote Herm Edwards "YOU PLAY TO WIN THE GAME!". We tied, but that resulted in an overall win. Doneil Henry got experience, it wasn't like he was at fault for 5 goals or anything. 30 minutes of footy might help him age almost a year mentally. This could help us in the future.

It could also go the other way...

He lasted 30-mins, and was at direct fault for a goal against...

With some players, that'll kill their confidence, not inspire it...

Dealing with kids is tough - I personally think it was a silly move to put him in for this one...

Throw him on at BMO when we're 2-0 up (if that ever happens LOL), and he plays out the 20-mins - the opponents are deflated, we win, and the confidence is "hey I can do this"...

Throw him out in a huge match, in a foreign country, with a tired team from travelling and 6-minutes in he has Frei and the entire squad looking at him with "WTF?" written all over their faces, then subbed 24-mins later - and the confidence is killed...

Something like this can often cause a player to regress, not progress...

Carts...

[Shakes McQueen]

The whole picture is that we finally had a little luck tonight.
Praise be to Preki. :frown2:

So when we lose it's directly because of the horrors of "Prekiball", and when we manage to beat a good team away from home in a really important game, it's luck. I can't imagine why Toronto has burned through coaches at the rate we have...

Our team has generated a few great chances in every game we've lost or drawn - the difference tonight was that the players we rely on to score goals, actually did when presented with the opportunity. Shockingly, us winning a big game coincided with DeRo finally getting out of his scoring drought, for example.

- Scott

[Shakes McQueen]

Pretty childish post. The man is talking about Preki's horrible decision to play an Academy player and all you can do is rub it in his face that TFC won. The two don't have to be connected. Preki fucked up with that starting lineup. No doubt about it. He got away with one today.

He put together a a group of guys, and a strategy that managed to extract two goals and a win from a team and a setting where many of the users here expected us to draw at best, and get pounded at worst.

Yeah, I had some fun at his expense, because we won the game, and that's what matters. I laughed at him, because he voted "No" in his approval of Preki, due to one bloody lineup choice he made - IN A GAME WE ULTIMATELY WON. He openly stated that he cast his vote based on a single lineup change in a game we won. Know what's childish? That is.

If we are going to get into this lose-lose circular logic nonsense where every time we lose it's because Preki's a lousy strategizer, and every time we win it's clearly because "we got away with one", then we might as well fire him now.

- Scott

[Yohan]

scott, stop making sense. you're scaring me

[torontocelt]

He put together a a group of guys, and a strategy that managed to extract two goals and a win from a team and a setting where many of the users here expected us to draw at best, and get pounded at worst.

Yeah, I had some fun at his expense, because we won the game, and that's what matters. I laughed at him, because he voted "No" in his approval of Preki, due to one bloody lineup choice he made - IN A GAME WE ULTIMATELY WON. He openly stated that he cast his vote based on a single lineup change in a game we won. Know what's childish? That is.

If we are going to get into this lose-lose circular logic nonsense where every time we lose it's because Preki's a lousy strategizer, and every time we win it's clearly because "we got away with one", then we might as well fire him now.

- Scott

Agreed. the win had nothing to do with Preki, he did not work on the tactics, he did not pick the players, he has not been working with them this season, he did not change the personnel when it was going wrong, he has not been responsible in identifying or at least agreeing to some of the signings like Cann and Maicon. Really when you think about it he has done nothing since he came to this club, we would have been much better if we had kept Carver or Cummings. I mean yeah we lost a lot of experience and some decent players from last season (Dichio, Robinson, Guaverra, Wynne and dare I say Vitti), some because of Preki and really we could have struggled to replace these guys and find any consistency and be pumped in every game we have played in but that has not happened. That is nothing to do with Preki though, nothing. Are we are stronger team than last season despite losing these aforementioned players, well I would say yes but not due to Preki, he is such such a lucky bastard that he has Mo, thank god for Mo!

[v00d00daddy]

Pretty childish post. The man is talking about Preki's horrible decision to play an Academy player and all you can do is rub it in his face that TFC won. The two don't have to be connected. Preki fucked up with that starting lineup. No doubt about it. He got away with one today.


no shit

if you think starting the academy player tonight was a good choice, no matter the result, you're a fucking ijit

get over yourself


Agreed. We won in spite of Preki tonight. Don't fool yourselves.

Sorry boys (or girls...not sure) but I agree with the Henry choice being wrong...but Preki gambled and lost early...but redeemed himself with the formation/tactic/personnel changes that followed.



Preki acknowledged his error in judgement to start the match by making the necessary adjustments to the lineup and formation during the match. If Preki is to be criticized for his initial flawed strategy than he should also be lauded for correcting his errors tonight and guiding TFC to new heights...


Preki took risks. One failed, the others worked. Net gain.

Focusing solely on positives or negatives is stupid. Look at the whole picture.

+1 for these posts.

[Shakes McQueen]

Preki took risks. One failed, the others worked. Net gain.

Focusing solely on positives or negatives is stupid. Look at the whole picture.

I didn't even notice this post until v00d00 quoted it. Well said, and I agree. It's essentially the reason I was laughing at the dude who voted "No" because of a single lineup selection.

Preki fielded a lineup, then made the necessary changes when it wasn't clicking at first. Bully for him.

- Scott

[Beach_Red]

Preki fielded a lineup, then made the necessary changes when it wasn't clicking at first. Bully for him.

- Scott

It's not something we're used to. It used to be easy to play against TFC - use the first half of the game to see what they're doing, make adjustments at the half and win in the second half. Happened all the time before Preki got here because TFC never made any adjustmets.

[koryo]

I'm sorry, but starting a 17-year-old - who has next to no league experience never mind CCL - is asking for it. Okay, you can say Preki subbed him after 30 minutes. BUT NO MANAGER WORTH HIS PAY SHOULD PUT HIS TEAM IN THE POSITION WHERE HE HAS TO USE ONE OF HIS SUBS SO EARLY IN THE GAME. And Garcia, again. That first goal happened because he was nowhere to be found as the Motagua player crossed it in. Stupid bastard was 20 yards behind the play. Who the fuck in their right mind plays him game in game out? Last week the fucking eejit kept drifting in to play central defender and this week he fancied himself a winger. HAS NO ONE PULLED HIM ASIDE AND TOLD HIM HE'S A FUCKING LEFT BACK - EVEN IF A SHIT ONE AT THAT?

Apologize for Preki all you like but I've seen enough. Keep him for the rest of the year but not beyond that. He's taken us as far as he can.

[jabbronies]

Last week the fucking eejit kept drifting in to play central defender and this week he fancied himself a winger. HAS NO ONE PULLED HIM ASIDE AND TOLD HIM HE'S A FUCKING LEFT BACK - EVEN IF A SHIT ONE AT THAT?


I know this isn't a "dump on Garcia" thread, but this guy has no positional sense what-so-ever. I've been at BMO watching the back line as the ball comes down the opposite flank, only to see Garcia drifting closer and closer the opposite side. Thank god Cann told him (yelled) to get his ass back in position.

But what are Preki's other options? - Usanov? The guy is a walking red card. Hseconajsadkajda whatever his name is? That guy is just as bad positionally.

I think Preki picked the best of the worst. Starting that young kid was a desperation move for the future IMO. Lets get some of these kids the experience they need in order to get them on the first team sooner rather than later.

[DangerRed]

I'm sorry, but starting a 17-year-old - who has next to no league experience never mind CCL - is asking for it. Okay, you can say Preki subbed him after 30 minutes. BUT NO MANAGER WORTH HIS PAY SHOULD PUT HIS TEAM IN THE POSITION WHERE HE HAS TO USE ONE OF HIS SUBS SO EARLY IN THE GAME. And Garcia, again. That first goal happened because he was nowhere to be found as the Motagua player crossed it in. Stupid bastard was 20 yards behind the play. Who the fuck in their right mind plays him game in game out? Last week the fucking eejit kept drifting in to play central defender and this week he fancied himself a winger. HAS NO ONE PULLED HIM ASIDE AND TOLD HIM HE'S A FUCKING LEFT BACK - EVEN IF A SHIT ONE AT THAT?

Apologize for Preki all you like but I've seen enough. Keep him for the rest of the year but not beyond that. He's taken us as far as he can.

You realize you've given Preki about 20 games to decide that "he's taken us as far as he can?"

If there was management turnover every time a coach wasn't blowing the lights out after 20 games, then the revolving door would never stop at very many successful clubs, nevermind middle-roaders like TFC.

Preki is the best, most experienced manager this team has had. I'm well aware that that's not saying much, but we're at least on track to have the same kind of shot at the playoffs as we did last year and we're in the CCL group stage.

I'm just as schizophrenic about this team and its manager as everyone here -- one day up, next day down, etc -- but you can't argue with results.

We just beat the 11-time champion of the Honduran league in a home-and-away series and scored two goals on their home turf. Fuckin' A. How about a cheer or two for that?

[Roogsy]

we should award extra goals to whichever teams has better and louder supporters then

and force Henry, Donovan and JPA to play for Toronto just because we have better supporters


Ah the slippery slope argument...the most popular of logical fallacies.

[Pachuco]

He put together a a group of guys, and a strategy that managed to extract two goals and a win from a team and a setting where many of the users here expected us to draw at best, and get pounded at worst.

Yeah, I had some fun at his expense, because we won the game, and that's what matters. I laughed at him, because he voted "No" in his approval of Preki, due to one bloody lineup choice he made - IN A GAME WE ULTIMATELY WON. He openly stated that he cast his vote based on a single lineup change in a game we won. Know what's childish? That is.

If we are going to get into this lose-lose circular logic nonsense where every time we lose it's because Preki's a lousy strategizer, and every time we win it's clearly because "we got away with one", then we might as well fire him now.

- Scott

I was calling you out for how childish your post was, the way you handled your post, as opposed to your thoughts around Preki. Therefore, I could care less what your opinion is of Preki, I just think posts like that are childish and are out to start a heated debate.

Hey Mr. Scott, you still think Seattle's shit show of a season proves that last year was a fluke? BAWAHAHAHAWHAHAHA. Looks at the standings in the MLS and look at the Champions League groups stage qualifiers.

[denime]

I'm sorry, but starting a 17-year-old - who has next to no league experience never mind CCL - is asking for it. Okay, you can say Preki subbed him after 30 minutes. BUT NO MANAGER WORTH HIS PAY SHOULD PUT HIS TEAM IN THE POSITION WHERE HE HAS TO USE ONE OF HIS SUBS SO EARLY IN THE GAME. And Garcia, again. That first goal happened because he was nowhere to be found as the Motagua player crossed it in. Stupid bastard was 20 yards behind the play. Who the fuck in their right mind plays him game in game out? Last week the fucking eejit kept drifting in to play central defender and this week he fancied himself a winger. HAS NO ONE PULLED HIM ASIDE AND TOLD HIM HE'S A FUCKING LEFT BACK - EVEN IF A SHIT ONE AT THAT?

Apologize for Preki all you like but I've seen enough. Keep him for the rest of the year but not beyond that. He's taken us as far as he can.

Yeah and than what?
Hire a new coach and start from scrap.:picard:

[Pachuco]

He put together a a group of guys, and a strategy that managed to extract two goals and a win from a team and a setting where many of the users here expected us to draw at best, and get pounded at worst.

Yeah, I had some fun at his expense, because we won the game, and that's what matters. I laughed at him, because he voted "No" in his approval of Preki, due to one bloody lineup choice he made - IN A GAME WE ULTIMATELY WON. He openly stated that he cast his vote based on a single lineup change in a game we won. Know what's childish? That is.

If we are going to get into this lose-lose circular logic nonsense where every time we lose it's because Preki's a lousy strategizer, and every time we win it's clearly because "we got away with one", then we might as well fire him now.

- Scott

I just realized how horribly wrong this post is. I think you lost sight of the score last night :facepalm:

[Pachuco]

BTW - I give Preki credit for the game we played at home in Motagua. It was the tactics in that game that put us in a position to tie in Honduras and steal the spot in the Champions league. Havind said that, yesterday's defensive display and team cohesiveness was one of the worst I've seen this year. We won the game because of individual players who stepped out, Dero, Frei, Barrett and Maicon. That was not the typical Preki team unit though, it really wasn't.

There are games we've tied, such as the LA game away from home where I thought it was all Preki's tactics that worked well in the game. Yesterday Preki put this team at a disadvantage and they pulled through, credit goes to the players who stepped up in this one.

[KdotOdot]

Yeah and than what?
Hire a new coach and start from scrap.:picard:

:flare::flare::flare:


Matter fact lets get a whole new team together!

[rocker]

Havind said that, yesterday's defensive display and team cohesiveness was one of the worst I've seen this year. .

well, it's hard to blame Preki for that. It's not like his style *causes* that kind of play. The team played on Saturday, then travelled by plane and bus to a foreign country to play on two days rest. Then they played a team with its back against the wall, a team that is going to push forward and try its best. Inevitably, an MLS team is going to have some breakdowns in these kinds of situations. Seattle didn't look like Seattle last night against Metapan. They even went down a goal at one point.

My father always makes this point: the opposition, if it has any quality, is always going to make a run in a game. Unless you have an excess of quality in the right situation, you cannot expect to play your game for 90 minutes. The opposition is going to come at you.

I give a lot of credit to TFC for scoring 2 goals and winning this thing in that kind of environment.

[Parkdale]

:flare::flare::flare:


Matter fact lets get a whole new team together!


I'd start by trading you to Kansas City, then blame in on a 'rebuilding year'.

[__wowza]

The way I look at TFC is like a bowl of soup someone took a giant shit into. Now you got Preki to come in their and take all of the shit ouf the soup. Which he did.

Are you still going to eat the soup Roogsy?

is it weird that this metaphor makes so much sense?

[TFC USA]

I approve. Even if we lost last night I still think he's doing a fine job considering the shit players we have on defense + Jacob Peterson and OBW.

Preki needs a competent GM.

[ArmenJBX]

http://img842.imageshack.us/img842/5826/soup.jpg

[Shakes McQueen]

I just realized how horribly wrong this post is. I think you lost sight of the score last night :facepalm:

I suggest looking at the time of the night I posted that, haha (I hadn't gone to bed yet). I meant to refer to us winning the SERIES, but my mind must have been fading.

- Scott

[denime]

I approve. Even if we lost last night I still think he's doing a fine job considering the shit players we have on defense + Jacob Peterson and OBW.

Preki needs a competent GM.

agree 100%

[Pryu]

been the best coach Toronto has had so far.

[Shakes McQueen]

I approve. Even if we lost last night I still think he's doing a fine job considering the shit players we have on defense + Jacob Peterson and OBW.

Preki needs a competent GM.

This is my perspective. Eventually the revolving door of coaches needs to stop, and the GM needs to accept accountability for once.

- Scott

[P-NUTZ]

after reading the last few pages i think there is something fair in identifying that our coach gambles with the starting line up at times - and it may be unnecesarily risky.

It baffles me some games, annoys me others and then pays off some as well. either way he admits his mistakes when they happen, and appears to have some belief/agenda that the more players he can mix and match at any given time or position, the better.

I would like him to start our best 11 always and regardless. but i understand he is still exploring the potential in his depth for various reasons i'm sure, and trust him with that.

He gets my vote.

[ochos]

Anyone who can't see how much better we are defensively/tactically (even with Garcia!) is blind. He's built a system with a backbone that we can now build off of, and eventually replace with better players.

- We could add a proper winger
- We could stick in 2DM's and move to a 4-2-3-1

With actual structure and discipline in our team now we have many options. Now we need to build with better players.

[v00d00daddy]

so now we've just won a game....do people's opinions now change on this thread?

lol

[Oldtimer]

Preki needs a competent GM.

Word.

[Shakes McQueen]

so now we've just won a game....do people's opinions now change on this thread?

lol

I was going to post something similar:

"So, does this mean Preki isn't a bad coach anymore? Or did we just get lucky and steal points again?"

- Scott

[rocker]

I was going to post something similar:

"So, does this mean Preki isn't a bad coach anymore? Or did we just get lucky and steal points again?"

- Scott

all our wins are luck; all our losses are fully earned. ;)

[Pachuco]

It's more like, all our wins are due to Preki. All our losses are Mo's fault.

[ilikemusic]

Im still alright with Preki so I voted yes.

He is doing what he can with what he is given.

It is still blatantly obvious that Mo is the problem and this team isnt going to really improve until he is fired.

Im glad that I voted 'yes' and posted it before the Champions League victory so I cant be accused of shortsightedness. :D

I fully expected a loss in KC and was fully okay with it so long as we came out of Motagua with the agg victory; And fortunately, they appear to have actually taken some 'momentum' from the game in Motagua. I wonder if the fixture congestion couldnt help the team. We have seen what TFC can do with 7-10 days between games. Maybe with 4-7 days between games the opposite will hold true. I wonder if it is possible that the light MLS schedule has hurt the squad more than it has helped.

Theyre not running away with anything, and they are still dangerously succeptable of going on their annual second half swoon, but as it stands now, they are in a decent position. We are in a playoff spot, two of the teams we are chasing and one of the teams we are most closely competing with is also dealing with the same fixture congestion as us.

And regardless of anyone's opinion, or the results on the pitch, Preki will not be the next person fired. He cant be. It has to be Mo. If this team fails, it has to be on Mo's head. No manager deserves this many kicks at the can.

IMO, what needs to happen (at a minimum) for Mo to keep his job...either...

A) Playoff appearance + Champions League Quarter Finals

B) MLS Conference Final

Anything less and Mo has to go. I think you reevaluate Preki's status at that time, but I think Mo needs to be fired before anybody else if the team doesnt see some level of success this year.

[Shakes McQueen]

One thing Preki deserves credit for, despite perhaps a couple of more draws than we might like, is turning BMO Field into a legitimate fortress for once in our existence. Now undefeated in 17 straight home games!

- Scott

[LesH]

IMO, what needs to happen (at a minimum) for Mo to keep his job...either...

A) Playoff appearance + Champions League Quarter Finals

B) MLS Conference Final

Anything less and Mo has to go. I think you reevaluate Preki's status at that time, but I think Mo needs to be fired before anybody else if the team doesnt see some level of success this year.

Sorry, but from this point on IMO just a simple playoff appearance will suffice the TFC FO to keep Mo in position. And the sad thing is that will happen most likely.
So we'll be "blessed" with Mo for at least another season. :facepalm:

[Brooker]

Radosavljevic's all red army!

[ArmenJBX]

I can't believe there's a topic on this. How can Preki even be doubted right now, when he's made us into a competitive, title contending team. We have been consistently 6-7 place in the entire league, better then any other year, and on top of that, we're playing solid, winning football. Sure, it may be ugly, but games we would normally have lost or drawn we are now winning and at worst drawing 0-0 or 1-1. I think we should keep Preki around for the longterm, so that the fruits of his labour can actually begin to show.

[Gazza]

Radosavljevic's all red army!

No more of this "Preki" business. The man has earned enough respect to have his last name shouted from the rafters!

Radosavljevic 'till i die
Radosavljevic 'till i die
He brought in Hscanovics
I'm still wondering why
But Radosavljevic 'till i die!...and so on...

[Oldtimer]

I can't believe there's a topic on this. How can Preki even be doubted right now, when he's made us into a competitive, title contending team. We have been consistently 6-7 place in the entire league, better then any other year, and on top of that, we're playing solid, winning football. Sure, it may be ugly, but games we would normally have lost or drawn we are now winning and at worst drawing 0-0 or 1-1. I think we should keep Preki around for the longterm, so that the fruits of his labour can actually begin to show.

It does make some sense to keep Preki around... a coach generally should get a couple of seasons when they are rebuilding (and its incredible that DC United fired their coach - what poor decision-making there!). I'm still not totally decided about Preki, his record at Chivas was so-so, however he had quite a lot of interference there so it's hard to say if its his fault. My doubts are probably the same as a lot of people's doubts -- replacing solid players like Serioux with dodgy Eastern Europeans like Hsfhfhjffvic. His methods are still unproven.


Sorry, but from this point on IMO just a simple playoff appearance will suffice the TFC FO to keep Mo in position. And the sad thing is that will happen most likely.
So we'll be "blessed" with Mo for at least another season. :facepalm:

Bang on the money. Anselmi set 3 goals (1) win the V-Cup (2) Get into the CCL (3) Make the playoffs. So at this point, all Mo needs is for TFC to finish top 8 and he keeps his job. He doesn't need to advance in the CCL, he doesn't need to make the conference final. MLSE has set the bar low enough that one would have to be a totally incompetent manager not to accomplish it in 4 years in a parity league.

[Roogsy]

I can't believe there's a topic on this. How can Preki even be doubted right now, when he's made us into a competitive, title contending team. We have been consistently 6-7 place in the entire league, better then any other year, and on top of that, we're playing solid, winning football. Sure, it may be ugly, but games we would normally have lost or drawn we are now winning and at worst drawing 0-0 or 1-1. I think we should keep Preki around for the longterm, so that the fruits of his labour can actually begin to show.


See this is where I have a problem.

Nobody on this board is able to find a moderate middle ground. It's either love a player or coach or hate him. It's not like we can admit when someone is average or just plain good. They're either the worst of the worst, or the salvation of this team.

So Preki has done some very good things with this team. Back to basics football. We refuse to let in goals becoming very stingy. Etc. I would never deny Preki the good he has done with TFC.

But come on, title-contending? Jeeeeezus...I need a vacation from this board. Thankfully, the next few weeks, I think I am going to get it.

[Roogsy]

It is interesting however to see the poll head in a particular direction after a game. LOL!

[Shakes McQueen]

Nobody on this board is able to find a moderate middle ground. It's either love a player or coach or hate him. It's not like we can admit when someone is average or just plain good. They're either the worst of the worst, or the salvation of this team.

I can't speak for the people who think Preki has done a terrible job, but I can certainly say I don't think Preki is the "salvation" of this team.

Like any coach, Preki has certainly made mistakes, and had errors in judgment. However, any discussion of this nuanced grey area is drowned out, because I personally spend most of my time pushing back against the people who think he's terrible, and should be fired based on what I see as weak evidence, and specious arguments.

Personally, I believe Mo is still at the heart of this team's problems, and Preki has simply done the best job of working with what he has been given, of all of our coaches. As you may recall, before this season started many people expected Toronto FC to actually regress from last season - not get better.

Preki managed to take a bunch of budget-priced defensive acquisitions, and make us into one of the stingier defensive teams in the league. He managed to take a lopsided roster with no bench depth or wingers, as well as enormous cap problems, and actually make us into a somewhat better team than last season.

This is why I maintain that, if this team fails down the stretch, it is at long last time to look elsewhere for a target to sack. We can start with the guy in charge of player acquisitions, as well as maintaining our cap situation.

Does that mean Preki hasn't made mistakes along the way? Of course not. He has occasionally put forth a defensive strategy when we needed to create offense, and he has occasionally made questionable lineup decisions (such as the 17yo kid last week in Honduras).

But I personally believe these mistakes have been heavily outweighed by the good he has done. He has instilled a healthier character in this team. Guys leave it all on the pitch, and there are no more rumblings of locker room politics. He has managed to take a shambolic defense, and turn it into one that typically sacrifices one goal or less per game. He has eliminated the chronic problem of late defensive collapses. He appears to have made Barrett less of a headcase. He appears to have turned Nick Garcia, of all people, into a decent on-field contributor.

Put this in contrast to a guy like Carver, who never seemed to use all of our substitutions, and never until ridiculously late in the game. Or Cummins, a guy who did nothing to make the team tangibly better - the defense was sketchy, the offense was inconsistent, the off-field problems were numerous, and the team had no character (those of you who went to that Red Bulls game agree? Or the two dismal Puerto Rico games?)

I wish our team was a little more offensively proficient, but I'm not convinced, after four years, that doesn't boil down to a personnel issue, instead of a coaching one.

Preki has taken control of an unbalanced, shallow roster, and managed to make them decent. I think he deserves a shot with a better GM.

And I will be the first one to give Mo some credit, if we manage to stagger to the MLS Cup - even though I think our successes this season have been in spite of him, not because of him.

- Scott

[DichioTFC]

See this is where I have a problem.

Nobody on this board is able to find a moderate middle ground. It's either love a player or coach or hate him. It's not like we can admit when someone is average or just plain good. They're either the worst of the worst, or the salvation of this team.


Can't really speak for anyone else, but I love the people on the squad whose positive fingerprints show day after day (Preki, DeRo, CanNana, Frei). Preki moreso than the rest has made changes in the club that make people believe again.

He isn't the best coach in the league. But he does suit our purpose. Considering the results we've had (NCC / CCL/ BMO streak), until he starts screwing up majorly I'll continue to believe in him.

[CoachGT]

^^ I agree with most of what you've said, Shakes. My only point of contention with what you've said above is that I believe that Preki has had more to do with player personnel than Mo since he's been here. I think that he's been calling the shots about the acquisitions to some extent, and there has been some influence from MLSE management about some things too. Mo is just the guy pulling the levers right now, and only the ones he's told to pull.

My main concern is that with the players on staff we've really only got one style of play that we can handle. Should another coach be called upon, whenever that happens (as you know it will, the question is when - next year, the year after or somewhere beyond that) it will mean another complete change in personnel. I didn't think a complete overhaul of the team was required after last year.

Stability has to be the key to having this team move forward in a positive light.

[DOMIN8R]

I agree with Coach. I think that we can get to the playoffs. But our style of play and tactics won't get us all the way to the final. Comand and control strategies fail to integrate the human dynamic. Players need to develop a deep understanding of each other to play well together. We're years away from that place.

[Pookie]

Is stability a reasonable expectation in a developmental league?

Good players move on, the aging vets that are playing out their careers are replaced with other aging vets. I have no stats to back this up but I'd wager that turnover in this league is reasonably high.

Don't forget that there will be expansion drafts in the next 2 upcoming seasons.

I also believe that Preki is calling the shots with respect to player movement which sounds to me like Mo has accepted that he (Mo) will be moving on in the near future.

[CoachGT]

Is stability a reasonable expectation in a developmental league?


Look at the teams that have been perennially near the top of the league - Houston, New England, Columbus. Their core has remained unchanged or they make calculated changes, one at a time, and they compete year in year out. This year, New England has seen a fair bit of change, including an assistant coach and a few players and they are experiencing their worst year in a while. I still expect Houston to make a good run this year. But teams that have had revolving doors (LA a couple of years ago, DC lately) have struggled.

[Cashcleaner]

Preki gets my YES vote for a number of reasons. Most importantly, we soundly triumphed in the Voyageurs Cup competition and made our way past the preliminary round for CONCACAF Champions League. Many of us agreed toward the start of the season that beating Vancouver and Montreal and getting past the first round in Champions League was a high priority for the club, and here we are now checking all those off the "to-do" list.

Our second priority was to make the MLS playoffs. Now at the moment we're third in the East (YAY!) but due to a strong Western conference, 8th overall (M'EH). If the season ended today, we would just squeak into the playoffs. Yes, we're barely in, but nevertheless, we'd be crossing off another priority on our list. Unfortunately, because the season ISN'T ending today, we're just going to have to work harder and bring in the wins. Draws just won't cut it. A win against New York will certainly go a long, long way for us so the real question for the moment is, can Preki pull the team together and earn the points when it's crunch time?

Lastly, while I'll agree with some people's assessment that Preki's overall style and choice of tactics has been somewhat boring to watch; are we still not looking markedly improved over previous seasons? 2007 we finished dead-last with 25 pts. 2008 we finished 3rd from the bottom with 35 pts. Last year we were 4th from the bottom with 39 pts. This season, we're sitting 8th overall with 26 pts. and still have 12 games to go! There's a lot we can do with that number of games - especially when you consider that 5 of them are at home and acknowledge the record we are enjoying at BMO Field.

Now, because it's the black-and-white results that people tend to remember and measure success by, let's recap what we have so far:

Win the Nutrilite Canadian Championship.............................[X]
Get past preliminary round of CONCACAF Champions League...[X]
Make the League Playoffs.......................................... ......[PENDING]

So the only issue right now is the outlook on the playoffs, but I think most agree that barring any disastrous collapse, it's within easy reach. And because two outta three ain't bad - I gotta cast my vote for Preki.

[ArmenJBX]

Yes, title contending. :D We are currently in a playoff position, as well as a CCL group stage. Therefor, at this very point and time, we are contending for trophies, thus making us title contenders. This time last year we were out of a playoff spot and lost to Puerto Rico Islanders.

[Pachuco]

Next 5 league games will be very telling for me. We've had somewhat of an easy schedule June and July and didn't do much with it. Losing to teams like the Union and KC away from home while tying lots of games at home.

This is the real test, this is where Prekiball either sinks or swims. We could easily find ourselves in 12th place by the end of these games or we can find ourselves near the top of the league. Where I think we need to be after these games is somewhere around 6th or 7th if we want to end up making the playoffs. I say that because last 3 out of 4 games are away from home.

[ArmenJBX]

This next game we should aim for a win, for a lot of reasons. Firstly, it's New York, who are 2 points ahead of us. A win would make us second in the east, and maintaining that would give us an automatic playoff berth. Secondly, we've had more rest then them. New York just came off a really tough game against Chicago, and now in 2 days they play us.

Finally, Henry has a groin strain. It seems like the stars are aligning. I really hope we win this next game.

[Pachuco]

This next game we should aim for a win, for a lot of reasons. Firstly, it's New York, who are 2 points ahead of us. A win would make us second in the east, and maintaining that would give us an automatic playoff berth. Secondly, we've had more rest then them. New York just came off a really tough game against Chicago, and now in 2 days they play us.

Finally, Henry has a groin strain. It seems like the stars are aligning. I really hope we win this next game.

Actually, the biggest reason is they'll be missing 5 players, including Rafa Marquez who I thought completely organized the team in the first half last night. It's funny but it's almost like they are already depending on him. They looked really disorganized in the middle once he came off.

[craz11]

With the exception of CONCACAF, we're not doing any better than we did last year under Cummins.

Only difference is we're boring as all hell to watch.

No improvement, boring style. Where are the positives?

In fact, we qualified for CL Group Stage in spite of Preki.
Reason #1 - Guevarra almost single handedly beat us in Honduras. He'd still be wearing TFC red if Preki were not hired.

Reason #2 - Starting Henry and watching our 1-0 aggregate lead vanish 6 minutes in because of it.

I have to say we're a better team than we have showed this season. The blame for that must rest on the coach's shoulders.

[rocker]

Only difference is we're boring as all hell to watch.


Saturday's game was quite fun to watch, not boring as all hell.

[Shaughno]

First 45 minutes on Saturday was the best football I've seen ANY Toronto FC squad play. Ever. Great movement, off the ball runs, good marking, positive creative passing and confidence in each other as a team.

If that's not Preki's doing, I don't know what is. He's built a hard working, fairly talented team. More than I can say any other former TFC manager has done.

[Pachuco]

Saturday's game was quite fun to watch, not boring as all hell.

So 45 minutes of good soccer erases all the terrible soccer we've watched at BMO field this year. Even if that 45 minutes if followed up by some not so good soccer in the second half?

There's nothing wrong with what he said. I've watched way more poor soccer then good soccer this year at BMO. Doesn't mean Preki sucks, doesn't mean he should be fired, it's just an observation.

[McBrace]

First 45 minutes on Saturday was the best football I've seen ANY Toronto FC squad play. Ever. Great movement, off the ball runs, good marking, positive creative passing and confidence in each other as a team.

If that's not Preki's doing, I don't know what is. He's built a hard working, fairly talented team. More than I can say any other former TFC manager has done.

And I missed the 1st half...FFS!!!! I hate traffic.

[Lennon]

How do you like me now?


http://blogs.mirror.co.uk/movies-mark-adams/css/Scarface%2016.08.09.jpg

[TFCRegina]

How do you like me now?


http://blogs.mirror.co.uk/movies-mark-adams/css/Scarface%2016.08.09.jpg

To be honest, I've been making this connection since he was signed...It looks like him...it sounds like him...and it acts like him.

Tony Montana deserves a 100% rating as TFC's coach.

[Pachuco]

Preki's coaching display last night was an absolute master piece and he deserves alot of credit for it. This team came out hungry and came out to ATTACK! We came out guns blazzing and scored two goals in the first half. I think it put Cruz Azul in a state of shock. 2nd Half I was actually hoping to see Preki-Ball and that's exactly what happened. We shut them down, disrupted their game and survived the last 45 minutes without giving them too much to go on. Their free kick was the best we've seen at BMO since Guevara so no shame in a goal like that.

[rocker]

So 45 minutes of good soccer erases all the terrible soccer we've watched at BMO field this year. Even if that 45 minutes if followed up by some not so good soccer in the second half?

There's nothing wrong with what he said. I've watched way more poor soccer then good soccer this year at BMO. Doesn't mean Preki sucks, doesn't mean he should be fired, it's just an observation.

umm, he characterized TFC as boring to watch. That's an absolutist statement, which is clearly incorrect if he had attended the Chicago game... and the Motagua game... and the Montreal game... and I could go on (and now we have the Cruz Azul game to add to that).

So I basically shot down his assertion with one exception. It has NOTHING to do with "erasing" anything. YOU are the one who modified what he said. If someone wants to say there have been some boring games at BMO Field, that's fine. But that's *very different* than saying TFC "is boring to watch."

[ochos]

Preki was man of the match - perfect selection given the circumstances and great subs. If not for the refs silly decision it would have been a clean sheet.

Great hustle by the boys and overall our best team effort of the year (and dare I say all time?)

[ManUtd4ever]

How do you like me now?


http://blogs.mirror.co.uk/movies-mark-adams/css/Scarface%2016.08.09.jpg

LOL!

I don't think I've ever heard Preki sound as proud of the boys as he was during last night's post game press conference. I hope some of this magic rubs off them in league play!

[Pachuco]

Since this is the Preki thread, I'll ask the question here.

I genuinely want to know. What possessed Preki to give Garcia his spot back today after the performances we saw from the two wide backs against Cruz Azul. If there was ever a time to reward someone for good play it would've been by starting Usanov and Hsvanovic today. Now I'm not saying we lost because of this. Just asking what goes into a coaches head when he makes a decision like this.

My thought process would be that these guys look hungry as hell right now and you want to keep that momentum going. Instead I'm afraid they were let down by a coach who doesn't reward them for their good play.

[Oldtimer]

The whole Nick Garcia thing has me puzzled.
Why is he even on this team? Why isn't he retired? Does he have a file on Mo, and Mo forces Preki to play him?

It just doesn't make sense.

[ecantona7]

The only possible explanation is squad rotation. Hsvanovic deserved to play today after the performance he put in on tuesday.