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View Full Version : Post-Game -- TFC vs. Whitecaps



James17930
05-20-2010, 12:04 AM
1 goal given up in 4 games, three of which were on the road.

Very, very good. :scarf:

DichioTFC
05-20-2010, 12:05 AM
posted on one of the other threads


can't be too upset with the result but in truth it was a poor match for us. the boys were tired and it showed, from Gala to DeRo to Gargan. Still, TFC road shoutout streak is 300'+ now and there seems to be more confidence when defending in our final third in the last few minutes.

Still, hope the boys get a chance to rest in advance of Saturday's match.

Brooker
05-20-2010, 12:07 AM
too many games, too tired. let's go impact!

DichioTFC
05-20-2010, 12:08 AM
too many games, too tired. let's go impact!

oh man, didn't think i would ever have to say that...but yes! Vaz-y L'Impact!

H Bomb
05-20-2010, 12:09 AM
boooring. And Preki figured the best way to deal with it was to put out a team of players unable to play football in the 2nd half.

Verdict: at least we played well on Saturday

Super
05-20-2010, 12:09 AM
Team looked terribly tired. There's no getting around it: a salary capped league is especially tough on teams who play more than just league games. Now we have to take care of business at home - unless Montreal helps us out.

Yagbod
05-20-2010, 12:10 AM
The Limpact will wilt like their name. Looking forward to winning the cup at home!!!

:drum::flare::scarf::flare::drum:

TheKing7
05-20-2010, 12:11 AM
Positive: 3 games on the road, 0 goals allowed, 5 pts claimed
Negative: 3 games, 1 goal
Positives outweigh the negatives as long as we collect points

TFC07
05-20-2010, 12:11 AM
Poor game, but still manage to get a point out of it.

Our midfield problem really needs to be address (by getting wingers and AM) ASAP if TFC wins to go far in CONCACAF CL.

James17930
05-20-2010, 12:12 AM
boooring. And Preki figured the best way to deal with it was to put out a team of players unable to play football in the 2nd half.

Verdict: at least we played well on Saturday

:facepalm::picard::facepalm::picard:

DichioTFC
05-20-2010, 12:13 AM
Another positive, Garcia playing 45' as CB without screwing up.

Nice to know that if need be we can play 5 in the back with a bit of confidence

DichioTFC
05-20-2010, 12:14 AM
:facepalm::picard::facepalm::picard:
+1. I ignored the comment as soon as i saw "booooring"

rocker
05-20-2010, 12:14 AM
pretty ugly, but Vancouver wasn't much better until TFC started tiring last 25 minutes. I still think Haber is overrated. lots of power, not a lot of skill.

Stewart looks like Macoumba Kandji's little bro.

Also, I just realized that the WHITECAPS lettering on the shirts is in white caps... neat!

J .
05-20-2010, 12:15 AM
I dont trust the Limps to do anything, they are pretty useless. But the guys are looking like there is perhaps less pace, but they are not quitting, its pretty clear that our offense really is based on three guys, DeRo, Barrett and OBW. I dont think Gala is an answer out wide, I hope he ends up being it though, he works hard and could be a real threat with improved passing.

Dub Narcotic
05-20-2010, 12:15 AM
Yeah, TFC doesn't give up stupid goals like they used to. Not a lot of highlights, but TFC fans have to be happy at some of the plays where six or seven guys were in the box blocking shots during open play. The level of commitment that has been instilled in this team in such a short time is amazing, and allows the team to get results when they are not at their best, like tonight. Even when the technique disappoints, the organization and discipline of this team has really taken a huge leap forward.


The bad news is that only four, maybe five, TFC players have really acceptable technical skill to make a difference at this level: LaBrocca, DeGuzman, DeRosario and Barrett (maybe Cronin). The rest of the team is mixed at best, with fullback being a particular issue. Sanyang shows lots of promise, but he must be considered an average-at-best player at this point, as he is guaranteed giveaway if he is pressured or doesn't have an obvious pass.


The two really disappointing players in this game, who need to show they can contribute at a MLS level, were Gabe Gala and O'Brien White. Gala, appallingly, had to be subbed because he was gassing at 60 minutes, unacceptable when his main role is to give the starters some relief, and in this case, probably forced De Rosario to play ninety minutes. Even before his subbiing off, he was anonymous against lower-league opposition. White continues to show very little, neither creating nor holding up, and seemed clearly inferior to Marcus Haber, who battled Adrian Cann very well all night. Both these players need to show something more, soon, or be upgraded.

H Bomb
05-20-2010, 12:15 AM
+1. I ignored the comment as soon as i saw "booooring"

stop me when im wrong boys. stop me when im wrong. if this is good enough for yall then yall aint going anywhere

rocker
05-20-2010, 12:17 AM
stop me when im wrong boys. stop me when im wrong. if this is good enough for yall then yall aint going anywhere

I'll take boring road ties every time.

DichioTFC
05-20-2010, 12:18 AM
I dont trust the Limps to do anything, they are pretty useless. But the guys are looking like there is perhaps less pace, but they are not quitting, its pretty clear that our offense really is based on three guys, DeRo, Barrett and OBW. I dont think Gala is an answer out wide, I hope he ends up being it though, he works hard and could be a real threat with improved passing.

Tough to judge Gala based on tonight's performace, but he's shown in the past that he's capable of turning in a good performance from the wing. Whether he's consistent enough to do so on a regular basis is another question.

James17930
05-20-2010, 12:18 AM
stop me when im wrong boys. stop me when im wrong. if this is good enough for yall then yall aint going anywhere

You were wrong a long time time ago.

H Bomb
05-20-2010, 12:19 AM
in mls yeah, not tonight. we win tonight we have 2 meaningful games in 4 weeks or something...and we have to replace a 21 year old for tiredness (Nana not Gala). tonights performance/result makes for more tired legs not less....

H Bomb
05-20-2010, 12:20 AM
You were wrong a long long time ago.

fixed....now shoo fly

BayernTFC
05-20-2010, 12:22 AM
1 goal given up in 4 games, three of which were on the road.

Very, very good. :scarf:
I'm trying to look at it this way too. I think that you have to focus on the positives. TFC spent very little time in Vancouver's box and Garcia was brought on after the half. Some of the guys looked gassed, but we didn't concede. The conditions were there to put Usanov, Hscanovics and Cann to the test, and they did a good job in my opinion. The midfield was even helping out Garcia when he needed it. Improved play from our fullbacks looks promising. Hopefully that can continue when we face stronger opposition.

SuperTCP
05-20-2010, 12:23 AM
The guys were pretty pissed off when walking towards the change rooms.

"We will get them at home boys!" I shouted, "we will get them at home..."

BTW

I ran into EVIL BERT while I was there as well.

T.Reis
05-20-2010, 12:23 AM
Oh...here we go!

If your going to be a team that's going to be fighting in every competition your in you got to have some of the results like the one tonight.

I'm sure Preki knows that better then anyone here, and his team is starting to get the results.

Shakes McQueen
05-20-2010, 12:23 AM
Maintained our road defensive streak, though the result wasn't quite what we wanted.

The team look tired and depleted, and played like it. Still, it isn't a loss, and it looks like we have this tournament all but sewn up now.

- Scott

DichioTFC
05-20-2010, 12:23 AM
stop me when im wrong boys. stop me when im wrong. if this is good enough for yall then yall aint going anywhere

you should have stopped before you started.

300'+ of shutout soccer on the road.

Three straight results on the road. All in very unfriendly environments (two Canadian and the LA game was against the best team and the sending off of Donovan & Buddle, clearly making the crowd more passionate).

Good MLS position (third in the East with 9 of the next 13 at home) and great NCC position.

Nobody said this is good enough, I don't think anyone is satisfied, but we'll take this result.

TFC07
05-20-2010, 12:24 AM
The two really disappointing players in this game, who need to show they can contribute at a MLS level, were Gabe Gala and O'Brien White. Gala, appallingly, had to be subbed because he was gassing at 60 minutes, unacceptable when his main role is to give the starters some relief, and in this case, probably forced De Rosario to play ninety minutes. Even before his subbiing off, he was anonymous against lower-league opposition. White continues to show very little, neither creating nor holding up, and seemed clearly inferior to Marcus Haber, who battled Adrian Cann very well all night. Both these players need to show something more, soon, or be upgraded.

Agreed.

Gala needs to get in shape and hit the weight room. He's very weak physically who gets pushed around a lot.

H Bomb
05-20-2010, 12:26 AM
you should have stopped before you started.

300'+ of shutout soccer on the road.

Three straight results on the road. All in very unfriendly environments (two Canadian and the LA game was against the best team and the sending off of Donovan & Buddle, clearly making the crowd more passionate).

Good MLS position (third in the East with 9 of the next 13 at home) and great NCC position.

Nobody said this is good enough, I don't think anyone is satisfied, but we'll take this result.

so your point is i'm wrong right......

seriously what was even half wrong about my first post....pissy little people

SuperTCP
05-20-2010, 12:27 AM
Montreal will play their reserves and the Caps will walk over them. We need to win at home. It will be glorious

DichioTFC
05-20-2010, 12:30 AM
Montreal will play their reserves and the Caps will walk over them. We need to win at home. It will be glorious

That's what I'm worried about. Montreal's coach Dos Santos is so overconfident he thinks he's Mourinho Jr.

He will gladly let his team bend over and assume the position against Vancouver.

James17930
05-20-2010, 12:34 AM
you should have stopped before you started.

300'+ of shutout soccer on the road.

Three straight results on the road. All in very unfriendly environments (two Canadian and the LA game was against the best team and the sending off of Donovan & Buddle, clearly making the crowd more passionate).

Good MLS position (third in the East with 9 of the next 13 at home) and great NCC position.

Nobody said this is good enough, I don't think anyone is satisfied, but we'll take this result.

I'm satisfied -- these are good results.

Brooker
05-20-2010, 12:34 AM
stop me when im wrong boys. stop me when im wrong. if this is good enough for yall then yall aint going anywhere

we've played a shitload of games. i'm tired from just watching all of them.

i won't give them any flack tonight.

DichioTFC
05-20-2010, 12:37 AM
I'm satisfied -- these are good results.

I'm not completely satisfied, I would've liked more offensive pressure, more control, less long ball BS; but this was a positive result nonetheless.

Still, if we were playing a better team, we would've lost that point today. Thank god the Craps suck.

DichioTFC
05-20-2010, 12:38 AM
we've played a shitload of games. i'm tired from just watching all of them.

i won't give them any flack tonight.

can't wait for Saturday! driving four hours to BMO :D

James17930
05-20-2010, 12:40 AM
I'm not completely satisfied, I would've liked more offensive pressure, more control, less long ball BS; but this was a positive result nonetheless.

Still, if we were playing a better team, we would've lost that point today. Thank god the Craps suck.

No offence to you, but this is starting to annoy me a bit. Sometimes you have to hoof it up the field -- that's just the way it is. Espeically when you're playing a physical, pressuring team who double or triple team our strikers every time they get near the ball.

I would say today we were about 70% on the ground and 30% in the air, and against L.A. and Montreal and Chicago we kept it on the deck even more.

We are a passing team now, no doubt, but that doesn't mean we can't throw a long ball out every once in a while to see what happens.

But it's like people get pissed off if even one long pass happens.

greatwhitenorf
05-20-2010, 12:42 AM
No complaints here about tonight's result. Lot of rain before the game tonight, leaving a wet, heavy pitch that does tired legs no favors. Guys scrapped and battled and ground out a result. No one obviously badly hurt.

A whole week of working the grinder and the grunts with excellent results. Very positive now about how Preki is getting his base built. It isn't always pretty, but most of MLS isn't pretty, is it? Pretty much a, ahem, triumph of the will.

A tie does it for us in last NCC match. If Montreal tank big time again, might as well rename their barn Place des Tapettes.

Just hope there's something in the tank for the New England game.

DichioTFC
05-20-2010, 12:48 AM
No offence to you, but this is starting to annoy me a bit. Sometimes you have to hoof it up the field -- that's just the way it is. Espeically when you're playing a physical, pressuring team who double or triple team our strikers every time they get near the ball.

I would say today we were about 70% on the ground and 30% in the air, and against L.A. and Montreal and Chicago we kept it on the deck even more.

We are a passing team now, no doubt, but that doesn't mean we can't throw a long ball out every once in a while to see what happens.

But it's like people get pissed off if even one long pass happens.

No offense taken. It's much better than last year (hell, better than earlier this season), but tonight there were a few too many long balls. I liked what Preki had going with controlled counter-attacking led by possession and quick passes. I understand we were playing more defensively so more long balls were in order, but I wished tonight had more attacking flow, even with a defensive posture.

GuelphStorm2007
05-20-2010, 01:04 AM
They have played 4 games in 11 days that is a lot Soccer so I am not to upset with the result . But I kind of wish they would finished it off tonite.

James17930
05-20-2010, 01:17 AM
No offense taken. It's much better than last year (hell, better than earlier this season), but tonight there were a few too many long balls. I liked what Preki had going with controlled counter-attacking led by possession and quick passes. I understand we were playing more defensively so more long balls were in order, but I wished tonight had more attacking flow, even with a defensive posture.

But we did have a lot of possession oriented attacks -- we had some really nice passing plays, and very often when the mids got into trouble they passed it back to the D line and they started building again from the back.

But you have to give Van credit -- they disrupted a lot of our midfield play really well, put on a lot of pressure. We squeaked out of it a fair number of times, but sometimes the only thing to do was to try a long pass.

I'm not going to fault them for a style of play that at times was necessary just because it might be considered by some to be a little boring.

IMO, of course.

bgnewf
05-20-2010, 01:29 AM
TFC v Vancouver V-Blog

I take a few moments to reflect on the draw tonight in Vancouver, why three games on the road without conceding a goal is a great accomplishment and why I don't expect to hear a lot of whining from Whitecaps fans next week when the Impact runs out the scrubs.

http://viewfromthesouthstands.com/2010/05/toronto-fc-v-whitecaps-video-blog/

James17930
05-20-2010, 03:36 AM
you should have stopped before you started.

300'+ of shutout soccer on the road.

Three straight results on the road. All in very unfriendly environments (two Canadian and the LA game was against the best team and the sending off of Donovan & Buddle, clearly making the crowd more passionate).

Good MLS position (third in the East with 9 of the next 13 at home) and great NCC position.

Nobody said this is good enough, I don't think anyone is satisfied, but we'll take this result.

My mouth is watering at this.

Shakes McQueen
05-20-2010, 03:57 AM
I don't know why anyone is getting ornery about this. We still have the tournament by the horns, and the conditions for this match were less than ideal. It's a draw on the road - I'll take it.

I think this group has earned a little slack for their performances in the past few weeks. The defense continued to be stout, despite the offense not connecting. It happens.

On to the next one.

- Scott

twistedchinaman
05-20-2010, 04:34 AM
+1, Shakes.

But one gets the feeling that should have been finished off tonight with a bit more effort -- if we had pulled it off, we'd have closed off the series, ended all debate.

Yohan
05-20-2010, 05:14 AM
I wonder if TFC misses Winsper yet

Ossington Mental Youth
05-20-2010, 06:37 AM
doesnt look like it

koryo
05-20-2010, 08:01 AM
From the outset we didn't look like we were going to win, but then neither did Vancouver. The result was a fair one.

So, Montreal will roll over against the Vancouver to spite us and we set up the crucial home date. Could be worse... especially considering Vancouver has squandered their best chance of taking three points from us.

bgnewf
05-20-2010, 08:04 AM
Three road games in 8 days with no goals against is a huge achievement for this club. And not having our DP on the pitch for two of those matches makes it even more significant.

I said in my video blog this morning that the only true winner last night was Rogers Sportsnet. At least one more game means something in this tournament.

And Preki needs to be given a lot of credit here. TFC struck me in these last three games as a club that other players would absolutely hate to play against. If we have blue collar players we have to play in a blue collar fashion.

Fort York Redcoat
05-20-2010, 08:12 AM
We had a couple chances in front of net that didn't amount to shots, great effort by Sanyang but I'd have to give Vanny the vote for midfield play. They controlled passes far easier whereas our boys were rushed to chip passes that went awry after a couple touches.

As to the longball, I see a purpose for it. I also see how frustrating it is since at its best works 1/4 of the time. Anybody remember who it was that took that longball of his head to actually direct it, head it on, forward, to an onside OBW!? That was magic since we've seen it attempted so often in the last couple of years.

Darlofletch
05-20-2010, 08:25 AM
Not really an exciting match by any stretch of the imagination, but another tough draw battled out, another game without a goal, so I'm still quite positive about the team.

We've become very difficult to play against and break down, and become a very determined organised team, all of which has happened much quicker than I would have thought, now we just need to add some more quality to help us be more potent going forward.

Another good game form CanNana, nana covering well for Cann when he was struggling early against Haber, but then Cann recovering to play really well. Good for nana to get some rest and garcia played alright as well when he came on. Hscanovics didn't have a great game though.

We never really got much going in midfield or up front, Gala and White in particular were very ineffective, When barrett came on he at least caused the defence some problems, even if it never quite worked out for him.

Disappointing not to have the championship wrapped up before the last game, I was looking forward to a game of arrogantly and obnoxiously celebrating our superiority without having to wait for the game to be played, but oh well, I shouldn't complain.

Roogsy
05-20-2010, 08:26 AM
Exactly the result I expected. No surprises here, no complaints.

REDJUVE
05-20-2010, 08:27 AM
Lifting the cup at BMO will be so much sweater! The boys looked drained but still played hard. Gotta give them credit... not just for this game but the whole month !!

TFC Cityboy
05-20-2010, 08:40 AM
can't wait for Saturday! driving four hours to BMO :D
make sure you allow additional travel time tho I'm sure you would anyway ...construction on the Gardiner at Jameson ...pain in the ass.
:)

2freedom
05-20-2010, 08:52 AM
The boys played well for how tired they were, like each person says before me here. No goals against in all those road games is extremely impressive for TFC. Preki is doing a great job with this team so far. TFC was very lucky right at the end of the game, Garcia (who has played better lately) could of been called for a foul in the box pulling that guy down, that would of been the goal for sure. I'm just glad the ref didn't call it.

Pachuco
05-20-2010, 09:00 AM
Boring game, but that's exactly what we wanted tonight. I don't mind watching a an ungly game like that every once in a while so long as we accomplish our mission. Now all we should need is a win or tie at home and we take the cup. We're in the driver's seat, that's all we could have asked for.

Oh, what can we do to get Marcus Haber on our team? I continue to be impressed by him.

rocker
05-20-2010, 09:05 AM
So Vancouver has only 1 option: win both games.
TFC has 3 options: Vanny loses at Montreal, TFC wins the cup... Vanny wins at Montreal but loses in Toronto, TFC wins the cup... Vanny wins at Montreal, but ties in Toronto, TFC wins the cup.

I like having multiple options this year.

jaxul
05-20-2010, 09:11 AM
So Vancouver has only 1 option: win both games.
TFC has 3 options: Vanny loses at Montreal, TFC wins the cup... Vanny wins at Montreal but loses in Toronto, TFC wins the cup... Vanny wins at Montreal, but ties in Toronto, TFC wins the cup.

I like having multiple options this year.

Vanny ties at Montreal I think is a likely scenario :)

Kaz
05-20-2010, 09:21 AM
I think this shows the flaw in Preki's coaching style in that he put out basicly a b squad, every where he could. And again stuck DeRo in a place that isn't great for him. Preki is very Defensive minded is always thinking 2 games ahead. In this case I don't disagree, but it's not going to win trophies out side of the NCC (this year)

The officiating was a little brutal, and TFC played for a draw and little more.

rocker
05-20-2010, 09:28 AM
Vanny ties at Montreal I think is a likely scenario :)

yeah.. they tied recently too in USSF play.

Vancouver getting 2 road wins is a tall order, going by the odds. It's tough to win this tourney without getting at least a win at home. They haven't scored now in a long time either. They haven't beaten Montreal in over a year I believe (even after being so offended by Montreal's lineup in the Voyageurs cup last year they still turned around and lost to Montreal).

Montreal may rest some guys against Vancouver, but I'm not so sure Vancouver can take advantage.

bgnewf
05-20-2010, 09:29 AM
I think this shows the flaw in Preki's coaching style in that he put out basicly a b squad, every where he could. And again stuck DeRo in a place that isn't great for him. Preki is very Defensive minded is always thinking 2 games ahead. In this case I don't disagree, but it's not going to win trophies out side of the NCC (this year)

The officiating was a little brutal, and TFC played for a draw and little more.

Three games in eight days away, living out of a suitcase, with a league game on essentially no rest coming on Saturday.

Jeez... Squad rotation HAS to happen for both the Cup and the League!

Oldtimer
05-20-2010, 09:39 AM
So Vancouver has only 1 option: win both games.
TFC has 3 options: Vanny loses at Montreal, TFC wins the cup... Vanny wins at Montreal but loses in Toronto, TFC wins the cup... Vanny wins at Montreal, but ties in Toronto, TFC wins the cup.

I like having multiple options this year.



Vanny ties at Montreal I think is a likely scenario :)

If Vanny ties in Montreal, TFC also wins the cup, even if Vancouver wins in Toronto. TFC has 4 options! :)

Inswingingwingman
05-20-2010, 10:40 AM
"Pissy little people" , geez I got a yellow card for using the word moron, which is a compliment in many circumstances and did only criticize their intelligence.

The PLP comment includes body secretions and diminutive size not a valid observation of ones intellect therefore I predict a red card for that derogatory comment, not that I really care, someone come and sit with me at chemo today and Ill forgive your invective and diminutive size, be it physical and mental, just for the support.

I managed to watch the 1st half and it looked like a) everyone going through the motions, and b) no enthusiasm.

The crowd seemed like it just p'd down rain little people, why are the spread about in tents and squatting in corners instead of stands? Do they let the downtown sleep outdoors people in to jack up attendance?

jloome
05-20-2010, 11:24 AM
Frankly, I thought we sucked for much of that game.

People are getting too caught up in the idea that playing aggressive, pressure defense constantly is the be-all, end all. It prevents the other guy from scoring but it also makes it very hard to maintain shape and play at the offensive end.

In fact our team shape in the second half was frequently dreadful, with few supporting runs, few options in space. We can't just be chippy. Some patience in just containing opponents and marking them out without diving in would've really helped us last night, because Vancouver's not a good enough team, generally to break down good containment and is a team we should beat.

Pachuco
05-20-2010, 11:33 AM
Frankly, I thought we sucked for much of that game.

People are getting too caught up in the idea that playing aggressive, pressure defense constantly is the be-all, end all. It prevents the other guy from scoring but it also makes it very hard to maintain shape and play at the offensive end.

In fact our team shape in the second half was frequently dreadful, with few supporting runs, few options in space. We can't just be chippy. Some patience in just containing opponents and marking them out without diving in would've really helped us last night, because Vancouver's not a good enough team, generally to break down good containment and is a team we should beat.

Oh I completely agree. And other people probably do as well. We sucked last night, no doubt about it. I think most people are letting it slide though because 1. the circumstances (how tired the players are) and 2. because we got a result away from home which is hard enough to do with this team.

EDIT: BTW- I think it's crap these players can't play 2 games a week for a couple of weeks. If NHL players can play every other day for 2 months then I see no reason why soccer players can't play 4 games in two weeks.

Fort York Redcoat
05-20-2010, 11:38 AM
"Pissy little people" , geez I got a yellow card for using the word moron, which is a compliment in many circumstances and did only criticize their intelligence.

The PLP comment includes body secretions and diminutive size not a valid observation of ones intellect therefore I predict a red card for that derogatory comment, not that I really care, someone come and sit with me at chemo today and Ill forgive your invective and diminutive size, be it physical and mental, just for the support.

I managed to watch the 1st half and it looked like a) everyone going through the motions, and b) no enthusiasm.

The crowd seemed like it just p'd down rain little people, why are the spread about in tents and squatting in corners instead of stands? Do they let the downtown sleep outdoors people in to jack up attendance?

Ahhh the difference being you didn't speak in general of morons but a specific moron. Now if I was called a pissy little person...well I'd probably laugh at the accuracy but many of we pissy people act differently and are a diverse group. Now what was this thread about...

This game was painful to watch as Preki obviously tried to save players in a so-so important game where we could win later.

Boring? At times but it showed a lack killer instinct that I hope we don't come to regret later. I also hope the Impact hate the caps as much as they hate us.

dawkins
05-20-2010, 11:45 AM
That's what I'm worried about. Montreal's coach Dos Santos is so overconfident he thinks he's Mourinho Jr.

He will gladly let his team bend over and assume the position against Vancouver.


Totally agree, Montreal doesnt care and is not going to waste thier players on a game that they dont give a crap about.

I am reading mixed emotions here. how can anyone gripe about how the boys played... they are allowed to get tired too... they did the best they could with this stupid schedule. Only opinion.... Barrett should have started!:drum:

Lucky Strike
05-20-2010, 12:00 PM
Totally agree, Montreal doesnt care and is not going to waste thier players on a game that they dont give a crap about.

I am reading mixed emotions here. how can anyone gripe about how the boys played... they are allowed to get tired too... they did the best they could with this stupid schedule. Only opinion.... Barrett should have started!:drum:

This is why to me, Preks and the guys better get right away in the mindframe that they will have to perform at home against Vancouver because I'm counting the Caps game in Montreal as an auto-win for them. We don't want Vancouver to be coming with the gear through the rear, neither in TFC's nor the tournament's.

Shakes McQueen
05-20-2010, 02:57 PM
Frankly, I thought we sucked for much of that game.

People are getting too caught up in the idea that playing aggressive, pressure defense constantly is the be-all, end all. It prevents the other guy from scoring but it also makes it very hard to maintain shape and play at the offensive end.

In fact our team shape in the second half was frequently dreadful, with few supporting runs, few options in space. We can't just be chippy. Some patience in just containing opponents and marking them out without diving in would've really helped us last night, because Vancouver's not a good enough team, generally to break down good containment and is a team we should beat.

No doubt the game was ugly, and not one of our finest performances. My perspective was just "it happens", and deciding to look at the positives from this match - we continued our defensive shutout streak, and we still have a really easy path to winning the tournament.

Sometimes shit games just happen, and at least we got a draw from it. I think they've earned some slack based on the good performances they've put in the past few weeks.

- Scott

Whoop
05-20-2010, 07:29 PM
Forgot to mention yesterday that I thought Zourab Tsiskaridze had a strong game for Vancouver.

James17930
05-20-2010, 08:32 PM
Oh I completely agree. And other people probably do as well. We sucked last night, no doubt about it. I think most people are letting it slide though because 1. the circumstances (how tired the players are) and 2. because we got a result away from home which is hard enough to do with this team.

EDIT: BTW- I think it's crap these players can't play 2 games a week for a couple of weeks. If NHL players can play every other day for 2 months then I see no reason why soccer players can't play 4 games in two weeks.

1 -- Right. Is it really possible for us (or any team) to play great, wonderful, perfect, every single game? No, of course not, and as you say, given the circumstances surrounding this game and the whole road trip, I'm more than satisfied with that result.

As for your 'EDIT' -- Remember that the average NHL player only plays and actual 15 - 20 mins of every game -- the rest of the time he's just sitting on the bench (and don't forget two intermissions and numerous commercial breaks).

Soccer players, obviously, put in way more effort per game than that.

Shakes McQueen
05-20-2010, 08:44 PM
Soccer players, obviously, put in way more effort per game than that.

I'm not sure if "effort" is the right word for it, because while hockey players only generally play 15-20 minutes per game, those 15-20 minutes are insanely fast paced compared to soccer, which is more of a slow burn.

- Scott

James17930
05-20-2010, 08:57 PM
I'm not sure if "effort" is the right word for it, because while hockey players only generally play 15-20 minutes per game, those 15-20 minutes are insanely fast paced compared to soccer, which is more of a slow burn.

- Scott

Yeah, but they're gliding on ice -- they don't even have to move their legs half the time ;)

jazzy
05-20-2010, 09:09 PM
Oh I completely agree. And other people probably do as well. We sucked last night, no doubt about it. I think most people are letting it slide though because 1. the circumstances (how tired the players are) and 2. because we got a result away from home which is hard enougo ,h to do with this team.

EDIT: BTW- I think it's crap these players can't play 2 games a week for a couple of weeks. If NHL players can play every other day for 2 months then I see no reason why soccer players can't play 4 games in two weeks.

guys...it's not like they walked down the street and played.... they basically covered the coasts of 2 countries....and not like a sunday drive in Europe....plane flights for those with slight injuries can wreak havoc.....see no, JDG.....and they are playing above their heads......getting the most out everyone....who would of thought we'd be near this successful.....Moe's streching the limits of cap space is now and will show itself under any undo stress......thats it, there's no more to the story. They're playing their hearts out....but our thin base of talent will at one point push against the wall........and Moe may call that a successful season under the circumstances.....will we?

Shakes McQueen
05-20-2010, 09:11 PM
Yeah, but they're gliding on ice -- they don't even have to move their legs half the time ;)

Oy, so not true, haha. And I think you know it. :D

- Scott

Blizzard
05-20-2010, 09:50 PM
I'm not sure if "effort" is the right word for it, because while hockey players only generally play 15-20 minutes per game, those 15-20 minutes are insanely fast paced compared to soccer, which is more of a slow burn.

- Scott

Hockey is comparable to a series of 400 meter dashes separated by a minute or so of recovery time and then boom, off you go again.

It's apples and oranges. It's not directly comparable.

That said, they can compliment each other wonderfully.

Blizzard
05-20-2010, 09:51 PM
Yeah, but they're gliding on ice -- they don't even have to move their legs half the time ;)

... and don't they have little motors built into those things they wear on their feet! :crazy:

ag futbol
05-20-2010, 10:00 PM
Frankly, I thought we sucked for much of that game.

People are getting too caught up in the idea that playing aggressive, pressure defense constantly is the be-all, end all. It prevents the other guy from scoring but it also makes it very hard to maintain shape and play at the offensive end.

In fact our team shape in the second half was frequently dreadful, with few supporting runs, few options in space. We can't just be chippy. Some patience in just containing opponents and marking them out without diving in would've really helped us last night, because Vancouver's not a good enough team, generally to break down good containment and is a team we should beat.
Agree with this completely. There were many times last night where the shape looked terrible and a good zonal marking system would have done us wonders.

But in many ways i can understand why it turned out the way it did given the amount of games we've played lately.

James17930
05-21-2010, 12:26 AM
... and don't they have little motors built into those things they wear on their feet! :crazy:

You realize I was joking?

Blizzard
05-21-2010, 01:34 AM
You realize I was joking?

Uhhh, ya! You realize I was joking?

LesH
05-21-2010, 02:54 AM
Frankly, I thought we sucked for much of that game.

People are getting too caught up in the idea that playing aggressive, pressure defense constantly is the be-all, end all. It prevents the other guy from scoring but it also makes it very hard to maintain shape and play at the offensive end.

In fact our team shape in the second half was frequently dreadful, with few supporting runs, few options in space. We can't just be chippy. Some patience in just containing opponents and marking them out without diving in would've really helped us last night, because Vancouver's not a good enough team, generally to break down good containment and is a team we should beat.

+1

At least I found a single post in this thread which has it all right.

Yes, we had a bad game Wednesday.
And geez, why is almost everyone so satisfied just because we kept a clean sheet against a much inferior opposition, who happens to have big problems scoring lately in all official games? :rolleyes:

Shakes McQueen
05-21-2010, 03:24 AM
+1

At least I found a single post in this thread which has it all right.

Yes, we had a bad game Wednesday.
And geez, why is almost everyone so satisfied just because we kept a clean sheet against a much inferior opposition, who happens to have big problems scoring lately in all official games? :rolleyes:

I haven't seen many people say this game was a tour de force - I've seen people say that the game was a bad one, but that the team deserves some slack for a bad game based on the mitigating circumstances, and their play over the past few weeks.

And regardless of how we "should" play against teams like Vancouver, it hasn't stopped us from conceding goals to them in previous NCC's, so another clean sheet DOES matter.

- Scott

LesH
05-21-2010, 03:44 AM
EDIT: BTW- I think it's crap these players can't play 2 games a week for a couple of weeks. If NHL players can play every other day for 2 months then I see no reason why soccer players can't play 4 games in two weeks.

+1

I already said this a few weeks ago...
In Europe in almost almost all countries the majority of teams have stretches of 2-3 weeks when they are playing 4-6 official games, because they are in the national championships, national cups and plus European cups too.
Still they have no problems doing it.
Please do not give me the reason of bigger commute distances in North America, it doesn't fully stands IMO.
------------

PS: but your comparison with NHL doesn't stands: there players can rest many minutes between effective playing time in the course of a single game.

Shakes McQueen
05-21-2010, 05:23 AM
In Europe in almost almost all countries the majority of teams have stretches of 2-3 weeks when they are playing 4-6 official games, because they are in the national championships, national cups and plus European cups too.
Still they have no problems doing it.

And we technically had no problem doing it either. But do those teams feature the same 11 players in all of those games? No. Do they typically maintain the same quality of play over all of those games? No.

The teams that do, are the teams that can afford bench depth we simply don't have - the Man Utd's and Barcelona's of the world.

Preki isn't just looking at the physical status of our players in this moment - he's looking down the road, too. Like any competent manager would.

And the travel absolutely factors hugely into the equation. Most European teams don't have to deal with thousands of miles of travel, across mutliple time zones, to get to away fixtures - then do it again to come back and play a game in Montreal a few days later. It matters.

- Scott

James17930
05-21-2010, 06:08 AM
Uhhh, ya! You realize I was joking?

Did you realize that I realized you were joking?




























Okay, sorry -- enough of that. :flare:

James17930
05-21-2010, 06:09 AM
And we technically had no problem doing it either. But do those teams feature the same 11 players in all of those games? No. Do they typically maintain the same quality of play over all of those games? No.

The teams that do, are the teams that can afford bench depth we simply don't have - the Man Utd's and Barcelona's of the world.

Preki isn't just looking at the physical status of our players in this moment - he's looking down the road, too. Like any competent manager would.

And the travel absolutely factors hugely into the equation. Most European teams don't have to deal with thousands of miles of travel, across mutliple time zones, to get to away fixtures - then do it again to come back and play a game in Montreal a few days later. It matters.

- Scott

^^+1 Correct.

I've come to realize that there are some people who simply would not be satisfied unless we finished the season with 90 points, won the NCC, CCL and Club World Cup, and scored 5 goals in every game.

It's making me quite tired trying one of the voices of reason around here.

LesH
05-21-2010, 08:28 AM
^^+1 Correct.

I've come to realize that there are some people who simply would not be satisfied unless we finished the season with 90 points, won the NCC, CCL and Club World Cup, and scored 5 goals in every game.

It's making me quite tired trying one of the voices of reason around here.

If you're referring to me as one of those people too, I'm not one.

But for me being realistic means qualifying the team's performances not comparing to and influenced by the first 3 years, because in the first 3 years the performance was generally bad, not even average.

If we would do that (comparing), we always would say about average performances that they are good. Many many times last year I saw that people were saying on these forum's threads that we are an average team, having average performance, when in fact we were a bad team having bad product on the field for 3 straight years.

...Probably the fact that I was raised on European football (I'm living in the USA only since 2002) matters too seeing things this way.

DichioTFC
05-21-2010, 08:42 AM
^^+1 Correct.

I've come to realize that there are some people who simply would not be satisfied unless we finished the season with 90 points, won the NCC, CCL and Club World Cup, and scored 5 goals in every game.

It's making me quite tired trying one of the voices of reason around here.

Absolutely true. Fairweather fans gotta complain no matter what.

As much as I was saying earlier about it being a poor match and the long ball thing, I'm still glad that we left Vancouver with a point and put a stranglehold on the situation. Winners don't always happen with a Joe Carter come-from-behind World Series winning home run. Winners put themselves in the position to potentially succeed with multiple options, so if one situation fails, there are several alternative scenarios that will allow them to be successful.

And in the soccer context, particularly in the MLS, its to win at home and draw on the road. Look at our recent fixture history and Preki has done exactly that.

Good on the boys to get through a rough stretch.

DichioTFC
05-21-2010, 08:44 AM
make sure you allow additional travel time tho I'm sure you would anyway ...construction on the Gardiner at Jameson ...pain in the ass.
:)

lol i got into Mississauga last night, thanks for the headsup about the Jameson construction, I wasn't aware of that.

Darlofletch
05-21-2010, 09:28 AM
Absolutely true. Fairweather fans gotta complain no matter what.

As much as I was saying earlier about it being a poor match and the long ball thing, I'm still glad that we left Vancouver with a point and put a stranglehold on the situation. Winners don't always happen with a Joe Carter come-from-behind World Series winning home run. Winners put themselves in the position to potentially succeed with multiple options, so if one situation fails, there are several alternative scenarios that will allow them to be successful.

And in the soccer context, particularly in the MLS, its to win at home and draw on the road. Look at our recent fixture history and Preki has done exactly that.

Good on the boys to get through a rough stretch.

I've noticed this before with you, but dude, people that always complain aren't "fairweather fans".

If they were fairweather fans, they'd just disappear when the teams not doing well, they certainly wouldn't have gone to the trouble of registering for and continually visiting and commenting on a forum such as this.

Overly negative or cynical, they may be, and in some respects, i'd certainly count myself in that group. unrealistic with their expectations of an mls team, they may be, just as you're overly positive at times, but fairweather fans is a very unfair accusation and not accurate in this case. being critical doesn't mean you've stopped being a supporter.

DichioTFC
05-21-2010, 10:08 AM
I've noticed this before with you, but dude, people that always complain aren't "fairweather fans".

If they were fairweather fans, they'd just disappear when the teams not doing well, they certainly wouldn't have gone to the trouble of registering for and continually visiting and commenting on a forum such as this.

Overly negative or cynical, they may be, and in some respects, i'd certainly count myself in that group. unrealistic with their expectations of an mls team, they may be, just as you're overly positive at times, but fairweather fans is a very unfair accusation and not accurate in this case. being critical doesn't mean you've stopped being a supporter.

My man, majority of complaining, as seen from the beginning of the season, were from people who enjoyed dumping on the team's lack of results / success.

I think you're mistaken with your train of thought that "going to the trouble of registering / continually visiting / commenting" makes them less of a fairweather fan. It doesn't take much effort to register and agitate. Check out the postgame threads from bad losses, these guys were practically reveling at the team's ineptitude. And now that the team is enjoying relative success, they've disappeared. Just because they're here now doesn't mean that they will be later.

Overly critical as some are or overly positive as I am are ultimately of no consequence because even with these pessimistic / optimistic mindsets, there is a sense of fairness from the majority of comments and posters. I don't call all critical people fairweather fans, but the ones that complain for the sake of complaining I see having a frontrunner attitude. I acknowledge that I am overly positive but I make no apologies for it, as I feel that I am critical when appropriate (i.e. last match I felt was a poor match for us).

Contrary to what you think, i think the accusation is fair and apt in light of saying things like the boys were "unable" to play two halves of football, and completely disregarding the result we obtained. In light of the factors (tired legs, rough game, long roadtrip, injuries) I see that as a fairweather / frontrunner statement.

Darlofletch
05-21-2010, 10:49 AM
So you're saying it's people who only show up when the team is (in their minds) shit.
Isn't that the opposite of a fairweather fan. I guess it's just the flip side of the same coin when i think about it. Shitweather fans?

also

in your earlier post, you said
Fairweather fans gotta complain no matter what

"no matter what" is the exact opposite of a fairweather/shitweather fan, who would only show up when conditions are favourable to them, as you suggest in your later post


And now that the team is enjoying relative success, they've disappeared

Those people, sure, but anyone who is always complaining no matter what is definitely not a fairweather fan.

Anyway, i agree unrelenting negativity, or unrelenting positivity are both annoying, I'm just arguing semantics at this stage, not sure why.

I'm being pedantic and critical all over the place recently, I think it's because the team's doing well for weeks now, and the FO isn't being too obviously evil and commercial and money obsessed recently, so my cynical grumpy old man negativity needs to come out somewhere. My apologies.

DichioTFC
05-21-2010, 10:52 AM
So you're saying it's people who only show up when the team is (in their minds) shit.
Isn't that the opposite of a fairweather fan. I guess it's just the flip side of the same coin when i think about it. Shitweather fans?

also

in your earlier post, you said

"no matter what" is the exact opposite of a fairweather/shitweather fan, who would only show up when conditions are favourable to them, as you suggest in your later post

Those people, sure, but anyone who is always complaining no matter what is definitely not a fairweather fan.

Anyway, i agree unrelenting negativity, or unrelenting positivity are both annoying, I'm just arguing semantics at this stage, not sure why.

I'm being pedantic and critical all over the place recently, I think it's because the team's doing well for weeks now, and the FO isn't being too obviously evil and commercial and money obsessed recently, so my cynical grumpy old man negativity needs to come out somewhere. My apologies.

Accepted. Moving on.

jloome
05-21-2010, 11:17 AM
My man, majority of complaining, as seen from the beginning of the season, were from people who enjoyed dumping on the team's lack of results / success.

I think you're mistaken with your train of thought that "going to the trouble of registering / continually visiting / commenting" makes them less of a fairweather fan. It doesn't take much effort to register and agitate. Check out the postgame threads from bad losses, these guys were practically reveling at the team's ineptitude. And now that the team is enjoying relative success, they've disappeared. Just because they're here now doesn't mean that they will be later.

Overly critical as some are or overly positive as I am are ultimately of no consequence because even with these pessimistic / optimistic mindsets, there is a sense of fairness from the majority of comments and posters. I don't call all critical people fairweather fans, but the ones that complain for the sake of complaining I see having a frontrunner attitude. I acknowledge that I am overly positive but I make no apologies for it, as I feel that I am critical when appropriate (i.e. last match I felt was a poor match for us).

Contrary to what you think, i think the accusation is fair and apt in light of saying things like the boys were "unable" to play two halves of football, and completely disregarding the result we obtained. In light of the factors (tired legs, rough game, long roadtrip, injuries) I see that as a fairweather / frontrunner statement.

Yes, that's right, everyone who doesn't agree that a professional sports team deserves a break due to schedule and travel distance is "fairweather."

Jesus, what a bunch of ridiculous shit there is in this thread. Life isn't always binary opposites, people.

And James, really, declaring yourself the voice of reason? Check the superego at the door, pal. Yes, there are a lot of idiots who follow sports teams just to dump on them. But it's just as easy for homers to dump on any criticism without offering valid, objective counterpoints themselves.

So, perhaps the experts on human anatomy here could explain to me how a combined 360 minutes of soccer in 11 days is supposed to be so mentally exhausting that professionals who practice that stuff daily can't remember where they're supposed to stand on a pitch?

Yes, the season is a marked improvement so far. But we're still under 500, we haven't won anything yet, and we no more deserve to act like we have than they players deserve "a break" nine weeks into the season.

DichioTFC
05-21-2010, 11:49 AM
Yes, that's right, everyone who doesn't agree that a professional sports team deserves a break due to schedule and travel distance is "fairweather."

Jesus, what a bunch of ridiculous shit there is in this thread. Life isn't always binary opposites, people.

And James, really, declaring yourself the voice of reason? Check the superego at the door, pal. Yes, there are a lot of idiots who follow sports teams just to dump on them. But it's just as easy for homers to dump on any criticism without offering valid, objective counterpoints themselves.

So, perhaps the experts on human anatomy here could explain to me how a combined 360 minutes of soccer in 11 days is supposed to be so mentally exhausting that professionals who practice that stuff daily can't remember where they're supposed to stand on a pitch?

Yes, the season is a marked improvement so far. But we're still under 500, we haven't won anything yet, and we no more deserve to act like we have than they players deserve "a break" nine weeks into the season.

A bit self-righteous Jeremy for someone who attacks others for having "flecks of criticisms" that are horseshit :facepalm:

I assume you factored in the jet lag of transcontinental travel, the accumulation of injuries and the fact that the opponent had not traveled recently (they last time they left BC was Portland on April 29, road games in Victoria and Abbotsford are like TFC going to Waterloo and Hamilton) hence being well-rested and able to attack with greater efficiency. Do you really have no idea how exhaustion correlates to the short-term decline of mental aptitudes, such as positioning and decision-making?

Its quite easy for armchair commentators / bloggers to oversimplify and disregard certain aspects to justify their train of thoughts. But I guess opinions are like assholes, everybody's gotta have one.

James17930
05-21-2010, 12:48 PM
Yes, that's right, everyone who doesn't agree that a professional sports team deserves a break due to schedule and travel distance is "fairweather."

Jesus, what a bunch of ridiculous shit there is in this thread. Life isn't always binary opposites, people.

And James, really, declaring yourself the voice of reason? Check the superego at the door, pal. Yes, there are a lot of idiots who follow sports teams just to dump on them. But it's just as easy for homers to dump on any criticism without offering valid, objective counterpoints themselves.

So, perhaps the experts on human anatomy here could explain to me how a combined 360 minutes of soccer in 11 days is supposed to be so mentally exhausting that professionals who practice that stuff daily can't remember where they're supposed to stand on a pitch?

Yes, the season is a marked improvement so far. But we're still under 500, we haven't won anything yet, and we no more deserve to act like we have than they players deserve "a break" nine weeks into the season.

I believe I offered a lot of objective counterpoints to back up my arguments -- I still contend that playing 5 games in a week and a half is draining to any soccer player, professional or amateur, no matter where it was. But then factor in the immense travel involved -- you realize just how much travel that is, right? (not to mention this Saturday's game) -- and to me, two nil-nil draws is a good result. And anyone who's going to start nit-picking about shape and all that -- especially in the Vancouver game where they were pressuring like crazy (double and triple teaming De Ro, for example), yeah, I'm going to argue the point with them (DichioTFC makes a lot of good points in the post above, as well).

Also, by 'superego' I'll assume you meant 'large ego' and not actually 'superego (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Superego#Super-ego),' because of course that wouldn't make sense.

DichioTFC
05-21-2010, 12:52 PM
Also, by 'superego' I'll assume you meant 'large ego' and not actually 'superego (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Superego#Super-ego),' because of course that wouldn't make sense.

Or he meant that you have "such a big ego"... in which case he would be envious

aB9W179Sz3M

Brooker
05-21-2010, 03:09 PM
where's that guy gambiac or whatever his name was?

and I miss Kenny. :/

BayernTFC
05-21-2010, 03:50 PM
A bit self-righteous Jeremy for someone who attacks others for having "flecks of criticisms" that are horseshit :facepalm:

I assume you factored in the jet lag of transcontinental travel, the accumulation of injuries and the fact that the opponent had not traveled recently (they last time they left BC was Portland on April 29, road games in Victoria and Abbotsford are like TFC going to Waterloo and Hamilton) hence being well-rested and able to attack with greater efficiency. Do you really have no idea how exhaustion correlates to the short-term decline of mental aptitudes, such as positioning and decision-making?

Its quite easy for armchair commentators / bloggers to oversimplify and disregard certain aspects to justify their train of thoughts. But I guess opinions are like assholes, everybody's gotta have one.

I found an interesting blog, posted today by Jamie Smith of the Colorado Rapids, pertaining to the rigors of travel in NA on players:

A big issue for John, when he first arrived, was the amount of time we spent traveling to and from away games. Back in Scotland, traveling to away games was just a case of jumping on the team bus and after a few hours, we were at our destination.
When we play away games in the MLS, we fly to every game. That method of transport really does take it out of your body, especially when we train almost every day.

To counteract all the travelling, days spent in airports and on planes, John struck a deal with a company who are a major player in the world of professional cycling. He brokered a deal where each of the players were provided with high performance, state of the art, Australian Institute of Sport approved - wait for it - compression tights. No, its not a misprint, the entire Rapids squad are all wearing tights.
http://sport.stv.tv/football/178892-colorado-rapids-merry-men-step-out-in-their-tights/


It comes from the perspective of a player who has recently crossed the pond to play in NA. Insightful and a good read imho.

Shakes McQueen
05-21-2010, 06:12 PM
I'm shocked to discover that Keyboard Kommandos really don't have the foggiest clue about the toll long distance travel can have on an athletes body. Shocked, I tell you.

- Scott

jloome
05-21-2010, 07:55 PM
I believe I offered a lot of objective counterpoints to back up my arguments -- I still contend that playing 5 games in a week and a half is draining to any soccer player, professional or amateur, no matter where it was. But then factor in the immense travel involved -- you realize just how much travel that is, right? (not to mention this Saturday's game) -- and to me, two nil-nil draws is a good result. And anyone who's going to start nit-picking about shape and all that -- especially in the Vancouver game where they were pressuring like crazy (double and triple teaming De Ro, for example), yeah, I'm going to argue the point with them (DichioTFC makes a lot of good points in the post above, as well).

Also, by 'superego' I'll assume you meant 'large ego' and not actually 'superego (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Superego#Super-ego),' because of course that wouldn't make sense.


Apologies for the tone boys, I had a shit morning. I just think the arguments are a little more finely honed than would be required to simply camp all people dissatisfied with Vancouver into the "fairweather camp." That's just insulting.

And James, your superego determines positions of moral judgment, so yeah, ranking yourself superior to a significant chunk of people on the basis of alleged fairness would be a facet of that.

jazzy
05-21-2010, 09:13 PM
A bit self-righteous Jeremy for someone who attacks others for having "flecks of criticisms" that are horseshit :facepalm:

I assume you factored in the jet lag of transcontinental travel, the accumulation of injuries and the fact that the opponent had not traveled recently (they last time they left BC was Portland on April 29, road games in Victoria and Abbotsford are like TFC going to Waterloo and Hamilton) hence being well-rested and able to attack with greater efficiency. Do you really have no idea how exhaustion correlates to the short-term decline of mental aptitudes, such as positioning and decision-making?

Its quite easy for armchair commentators / bloggers to oversimplify and disregard certain aspects to justify their train of thoughts. But I guess opinions are like assholes, everybody's gotta have one.

bingo.......swoosh all net

James17930
05-21-2010, 09:24 PM
Apologies for the tone boys, I had a shit morning. I just think the arguments are a little more finely honed than would be required to simply camp all people dissatisfied with Vancouver into the "fairweather camp." That's just insulting.

And James, your superego determines positions of moral judgment, so yeah, ranking yourself superior to a significant chunk of people on the basis of alleged fairness would be a facet of that.

But this discussion has nothing to do with morality -- to me, it's an intellectual debate . . .

And just to be clear, when I think the team is playing like shit, I will definitely say so. I'm not homer to the point of blindness (I've ranted and raved against Garcia with the best of them, and back in years one and two when they couldn't even string three passes together I bemoaned along with the rest). It's just now, I actually don't think they're playing badly.

But anyway, probably best we just drop it. We've got a whole other game coming up real soon that we can argue about ;)