PDA

View Full Version : Today's News,Friday,Apr.23



denime
04-23-2010, 05:26 AM
Mornin'


Sanyang hurt, Brazilian winger on trial (http://www.torontofc.ca/news/2010/04/toronto-fc-practice-update)


Academy To Play At BMO Field (http://www.torontofc.ca/news/2010/04/attakora-no-flash-pan%22]Attakora%20No%20%22Flash%22%20In%20The%20Pan[/url]%3Cbr%20/%3E%0A%3Cbr%20/%3E%0A%3Cbr%20/%3E%0A[url=%22http://www.torontofc.ca/news/2010/04/academy-play-bmo-field)


'Stupid, silly goals' have TFC in the hole (http://www.nationalpost.com/todays-paper/story.html?id=2941043)


TFC: Ones that got away (http://www.torontosun.com/sports/soccer/2010/04/23/13688921.html)


MLS set to add Montreal (http://www.torontosun.com/sports/soccer/2010/04/22/13682981.html)



SUNSHINE (http://www.torontosun.com/sunshinegirl/)_:yum:

keem-o-sabi
04-23-2010, 06:02 AM
coed 1 (http://coedmagazine.com/2010/04/22/miss-coed-cecilia-quintana/) and 2 (http://www.brobible.com/story/13156649/10-volcanically-hot-girls-iceland)

CretanBull
04-23-2010, 06:04 AM
Mornin' D

dupont
04-23-2010, 06:15 AM
I can't wait to have my morning tea. Does anyone else drink tea or has coffee completely taken over the world?

gtaguy
04-23-2010, 06:30 AM
Morning D

Yup Java has taken over the world..

Anyone see the Strike from Montero 41 yards out last night. Amazing..

Wish Mo could find us a player like him.

Petor
04-23-2010, 06:35 AM
Interesting read, been already talked about here at length.

http://www.thestar.com/sports/article/799540--perkins-toronto-sports-fans-patience-could-be-running-out

ensco
04-23-2010, 06:59 AM
(ahem)

Check out second post in this thread, compare to Steven Sandor story.
http://www.redpatchboys.ca/forums/showthread.php?t=21635

Amazing that we are only in our fourth year, a list of our rejects would win the MLS Cup, and all we have received in return for that list of players, is Labrocca.... and grass at BMO

Ossington Mental Youth
04-23-2010, 07:08 AM
Oh cmon, would they really win the MLS cup?
Wouldnt we need an incredible manager to manage those egos (Cunny? Buddle?)?
You telling me Goldthwaite is MLS cup material?
That we could have changed Ronnie Obrien and Casey's minds?
Yes we have been mismanaged by Mo, theres absolutely no doubting that but lets not start to make claims that we cant back up.

gtaguy
04-23-2010, 07:09 AM
Interesting read, been already talked about here at length.

http://www.thestar.com/sports/article/799540--perkins-toronto-sports-fans-patience-could-be-running-out

Love the last part:

Still, anyone should be able to detect a pattern here: Whatever the intentions of upper management and the board, or whatever they have done lately to reverse the flow of these statistics, the supply of patience simply cannot be endless. Maybe Johnston has figured out it won’t necessarily be granted his team any longer; the soccer fans, having seen the proprietor’s blueprint from hockey and basketball, have an idea of what’s coming and wish to register their protest early.


http://www.assembly.gov.nt.ca/_live/images/rad/symbols/gold.jpg :hurray:

ensco
04-23-2010, 07:37 AM
Oh cmon, would they really win the MLS cup?
Wouldnt we need an incredible manager to manage those egos (Cunny? Buddle?)?
You telling me Goldthwaite is MLS cup material?
That we could have changed Ronnie Obrien and Casey's minds?
Yes we have been mismanaged by Mo, theres absolutely no doubting that but lets not start to make claims that we cant back up.

off your meds this morning? :)

Oldtimer
04-23-2010, 07:42 AM
Morning D

Yup Java has taken over the world..

Anyone see the Strike from Montero 41 yards out last night. Amazing..

Wish Mo could find us a player like him.

Montero is not represented by First Wave Sports, that's why Toronto would never sign him.

Parkdale
04-23-2010, 07:43 AM
FYI --------- The Don Valley Parkway will be CLOSED this weekend,
so if you're driving to BMO from that general direction, you might want
to leave extra early and plan for your alternate route. Luckily a 1:00pm
kickoff might mean lighter traffic. Good luck!

Shaughno
04-23-2010, 07:49 AM
Montero is not represented by First Wave Sports, that's why Toronto would never sign him.


I know it's become a running joke, but probably close to a third of the MLS is represented by First Wave... It's not just us.

koryo
04-23-2010, 07:50 AM
FYI --------- The Don Valley Parkway will be CLOSED this weekend,
so if you're driving to BMO from that general direction, you might want
to leave extra early and plan for your alternate route. Luckily a 1:00pm
kickoff might mean lighter traffic. Good luck!


2pm kickoff?

Velvet Elvis
04-23-2010, 07:50 AM
Yeah, it's listed as a 2pm Kickoff.

McBrace
04-23-2010, 07:51 AM
^^ That's what I thought?

Shaughno
04-23-2010, 07:51 AM
Yep, 2pm... Sparky's on crack again!

spark
04-23-2010, 07:52 AM
Not hard to find positives when things have spiraled so low, but if you had to choose Mo or Preki (as it seems some want both gonzo) it could be argued Preki has actually done some things to improve the team ...

WHEN IT CAN'T GET ANY WORSE, THINGS ARE LOOKING UP (http://www.rednationonline.ca/When_It_Cant_Get_Any_Worse_Things_Are_Looking_Up_a pr_23_10_column.shtml)

tfcleeds
04-23-2010, 07:57 AM
Yeah, that Steven Sandor article really served to brighten my mood this morning...:rolleyes: Wait a sec, it's Friday!

koryo
04-23-2010, 08:03 AM
Yep, 2pm... Sparky's on crack again!

So in other words, it's business as usual around here :D

Chevy
04-23-2010, 08:08 AM
Love the last part:

Still, anyone should be able to detect a pattern here: Whatever the intentions of upper management and the board, or whatever they have done lately to reverse the flow of these statistics, the supply of patience simply cannot be endless. Maybe Johnston has figured out it won’t necessarily be granted his team any longer; the soccer fans, having seen the proprietor’s blueprint from hockey and basketball, have an idea of what’s coming and wish to register their protest early.


http://www.assembly.gov.nt.ca/_live/images/rad/symbols/gold.jpg :hurray:

What it looks like is that our ability to (loudly) voice our concerns with team play and management is contagious. Raptors and Leafs supporters also seem to be much less patient than in previous years.

Parkdale
04-23-2010, 08:08 AM
yeah yeah yeah.... 2:00pm.

ManUtd4ever
04-23-2010, 08:09 AM
I know it's become a running joke, but probably close to a third of the MLS is represented by First Wave... It's not just us.

Interesting...well that makes some of our player transactions a little easier to digest.

Nuvinho
04-23-2010, 08:15 AM
This is too funny!!! He lost the bet with NER. But a nice dig at the Revs by cutting the grass they don't have.

http://nikonizer.yfrog.com/Himg517/scaled.php?tn=0&server=517&filename=fm5.jpg&xsize=640&ysize=640

Shaughno
04-23-2010, 08:15 AM
Interesting...well that makes some of our player transactions a little easier to digest.


This probably won't turn out well with the formatting and such, but here's their client list along with positions and teams.



Clients


Name Club Position
Boss, Terry (http://www.firstwavesports.com/firstwave/clients?athlete_id=187)Seattle Sounders Goalkeeper
Ceus, Steward (http://www.firstwavesports.com/firstwave/clients?athlete_id=157) Colorado Rapids Goalkeeper
Conway, Jon (http://www.firstwavesports.com/firstwave/clients?athlete_id=208) Toronto FC Goalkeeper
Dufty, Alec (http://www.firstwavesports.com/firstwave/clients?athlete_id=159) AC St. Louis Goalkeeper
Hall, Tally (http://www.firstwavesports.com/firstwave/clients?athlete_id=123)Houston Dynamo Goalkeeper
Hesmer, William (http://www.firstwavesports.com/firstwave/clients?athlete_id=151)Columbus Crew Goalkeeper
Johnson, Sean (http://www.firstwavesports.com/firstwave/clients?athlete_id=197)Chicago Fire Goalkeeper
Kitson, Neal (http://www.firstwavesports.com/firstwave/clients?athlete_id=164)Rochester Raging Rhinos Goalkeeper
Perkins, Troy (http://www.firstwavesports.com/firstwave/clients?athlete_id=81)DC United Goalkeeper
Sutton, Greg (http://www.firstwavesports.com/firstwave/clients?athlete_id=152)New York Red Bulls Goalkeeper
Beitashour, Steve (http://www.firstwavesports.com/firstwave/clients?athlete_id=193) San Jose Earthquakes Defender
Borchers, Nat (http://www.firstwavesports.com/firstwave/clients?athlete_id=73)Real Salt Lake Defender
Goldthwaite, Kevin (http://www.firstwavesports.com/firstwave/clients?athlete_id=95)New York Red Bulls Defender
Griffin, Leonard (http://www.firstwavesports.com/firstwave/clients?athlete_id=43) Austin Aztex Defender
Harden, Ty (http://www.firstwavesports.com/firstwave/clients?athlete_id=219)Toronto FC Defender
Jazic, Ante (http://www.firstwavesports.com/firstwave/clients?athlete_id=88)Chivas USA Defender
Joseph, Nane (http://www.firstwavesports.com/firstwave/clients?athlete_id=220)Toronto FC Defender
Kinney, Steven (http://www.firstwavesports.com/firstwave/clients?athlete_id=198)Chicago Fire Defender
Phelan, Pat (http://www.firstwavesports.com/firstwave/clients?athlete_id=132)New England Revolution Defender
Ream, Tim (http://www.firstwavesports.com/firstwave/clients?athlete_id=200)New York Red Bulls Defender
Schuler, Chris (http://www.firstwavesports.com/firstwave/clients?athlete_id=214)Real Salt Lake Defender
Sinovic, Seth (http://www.firstwavesports.com/firstwave/clients?athlete_id=216)New England Revolution Defender
Sturgis, Nathan (http://www.firstwavesports.com/firstwave/clients?athlete_id=60) Seattle Sounders Defender
Thomas, Shavar (http://www.firstwavesports.com/firstwave/clients?athlete_id=92)Philadelphia Union Defender
Ward, Tim (http://www.firstwavesports.com/firstwave/clients?athlete_id=59) Chicago Fire Defender
Alexandre, Jean (http://www.firstwavesports.com/firstwave/clients?athlete_id=176)Real Salt Lake Midfield
Bedoya, Alejandro (http://www.firstwavesports.com/firstwave/clients?athlete_id=174)Örebro SK - Sweden Midfield
Birchall, Chris (http://www.firstwavesports.com/firstwave/clients?athlete_id=186)Los Angeles Galaxy Midfield
Brennan, Jim (http://www.firstwavesports.com/firstwave/clients?athlete_id=115) Toronto FC Midfield
Corrales, Ramiro (http://www.firstwavesports.com/firstwave/clients?athlete_id=63)San Jose Earthquakes Midfield
Gavin, Blair (http://www.firstwavesports.com/firstwave/clients?athlete_id=195)Chivas USA Midfield
Gjertsen, Joey (http://www.firstwavesports.com/firstwave/clients?athlete_id=207) San Jose Earthquakes Midfield
Henderson, Craig (http://www.firstwavesports.com/firstwave/clients?athlete_id=196)Mjällby AIF - Sweden Midfield
Husidic, Baggio (http://www.firstwavesports.com/firstwave/clients?athlete_id=163)Chicago Fire Midfield
Jasseh, Omar (http://www.firstwavesports.com/firstwave/clients?athlete_id=221)San Jose Earthquakes Midfield
Jewsbury, Jack (http://www.firstwavesports.com/firstwave/clients?athlete_id=111)Kansas City Wizards Midfield
Lambe, Reggie (http://www.firstwavesports.com/firstwave/clients?athlete_id=212)Ipswich Town Midfield
Loyd, Zach (http://www.firstwavesports.com/firstwave/clients?athlete_id=199) FC Dallas Midfield
Miglioranzi, Stefani (http://www.firstwavesports.com/firstwave/clients?athlete_id=35) Philadelphia Union Midfield
Namoff, Bryan (http://www.firstwavesports.com/firstwave/clients?athlete_id=83)D.C. United Midfield
Navas Cobo, Francisco (http://www.firstwavesports.com/firstwave/clients?athlete_id=210)Houston Dynamo Midfield
Palmer, Lovel (http://www.firstwavesports.com/firstwave/clients?athlete_id=211)Houston Dynamo Midfield
Pause, Logan (http://www.firstwavesports.com/firstwave/clients?athlete_id=79)Chicago Fire Midfield
Peterlin, Anton (http://www.firstwavesports.com/firstwave/clients?athlete_id=183)Everton FC - England Midfield
Peters, Jaime (http://www.firstwavesports.com/firstwave/clients?athlete_id=47)Ipswich Town - England Midfield
Richards, Dane (http://www.firstwavesports.com/firstwave/clients?athlete_id=119)New York Red Bulls Midfield
Sanyang, Amadou (http://www.firstwavesports.com/firstwave/clients?athlete_id=179)Toronto FC Midfield
Shipalane, Tiyi (http://www.firstwavesports.com/firstwave/clients?athlete_id=218)DC United Midfield
Stahl, Toni (http://www.firstwavesports.com/firstwave/clients?athlete_id=201)Philadelphia Union Midfield
Stephenson, Khari (http://www.firstwavesports.com/firstwave/clients?athlete_id=94)Ålesund FK - Norway Midfield
Thompson, Wells (http://www.firstwavesports.com/firstwave/clients?athlete_id=127)Colorado Rapids Midfield
Ubiparovic, Sinisa (http://www.firstwavesports.com/firstwave/clients?athlete_id=213) New York Red Bulls Midfield
Akpan, Andre (http://www.firstwavesports.com/firstwave/clients?athlete_id=191)Colorado Rapids Forward
Arnoux, Cody (http://www.firstwavesports.com/firstwave/clients?athlete_id=190) Everton FC - England Forward
Barrett, Chad (http://www.firstwavesports.com/firstwave/clients?athlete_id=58)Toronto FC Forward
Bunbury, Teal (http://www.firstwavesports.com/firstwave/clients?athlete_id=194)Kansas City Wizards Forward
Cummings, Omar (http://www.firstwavesports.com/firstwave/clients?athlete_id=122)Colorado Rapids Forward
Dimitrov, Stefani (http://www.firstwavesports.com/firstwave/clients?athlete_id=217)Chicago Fire Forward
Dube, Mkhokheli (http://www.firstwavesports.com/firstwave/clients?athlete_id=188)New England Revolution Forward
Findley, Robbie (http://www.firstwavesports.com/firstwave/clients?athlete_id=118)Real Salt Lake Forward
Fucito, Mike (http://www.firstwavesports.com/firstwave/clients?athlete_id=160)Seattle Sounders Forward
Glen, Cornell (http://www.firstwavesports.com/firstwave/clients?athlete_id=185)San Jose Earthquakes Forward
Jaqua, Nate (http://www.firstwavesports.com/firstwave/clients?athlete_id=67)Seattle Sounders Forward
J (http://www.firstwavesports.com/firstwave/clients?athlete_id=215)ohn, Collins (http://www.firstwavesports.com/firstwave/clients?athlete_id=215)Chicago Fire Forward
Mansally, Kenny (http://www.firstwavesports.com/firstwave/clients?athlete_id=146) New England Revolution Forward
Moreno, Alejandro (http://www.firstwavesports.com/firstwave/clients?athlete_id=51)Philadelphia Union Forward
Movsisyan, Yura (http://www.firstwavesports.com/firstwave/clients?athlete_id=72)Randers FC - Denmark Forward
Weaver, Cam (http://www.firstwavesports.com/firstwave/clients?athlete_id=180) Houston Dynamo Forward
White, O'Brian (http://www.firstwavesports.com/firstwave/clients?athlete_id=167)Toronto FC Forward

icecoldbeer
04-23-2010, 08:26 AM
This is too funny!!! He lost the bet with NER. But a nice dig at the Revs by cutting the grass they don't have.

http://nikonizer.yfrog.com/Himg517/scaled.php?tn=0&server=517&filename=fm5.jpg&xsize=640&ysize=640

Well Played PB.

icecoldbeer
04-23-2010, 08:31 AM
Morning D

Yup Java has taken over the world..

Anyone see the Strike from Montero 41 yards out last night. Amazing..

Wish Mo could find us a player like him.

...and Cunny's 2 PK's :rolleyes:

Oldtimer
04-23-2010, 08:32 AM
Not hard to find positives when things have spiraled so low, but if you had to choose Mo or Preki (as it seems some want both gonzo) it could be argued Preki has actually done some things to improve the team ...

WHEN IT CAN'T GET ANY WORSE, THINGS ARE LOOKING UP (http://www.rednationonline.ca/When_It_Cant_Get_Any_Worse_Things_Are_Looking_Up_a pr_23_10_column.shtml)



Plus, I harbour an optimism regarding TFC's future that many people would consider insane

No argument there. :D

rocker
04-23-2010, 08:56 AM
This probably won't turn out well with the formatting and such, but here's their client list along with positions and teams.

So, with a little Excel Spreadsheet sorting, I discover that 16 of 16 MLS teams have First Wave Sports Clients.

I know people talk about Mojo's tightness with First Wave, but what's the deal with Chicago?

TFC - 7
Chicago - 7
NJSB - 5
SJ - 5
Seattle - 4
Dynamo - 4
Colorado - 4
NE - 4
Philly - 4
RSL - 4
DC - 3
Chivas - 2
KC - 2
C-Bus - 1
Dallas - 1
LA - 1

Shaughno
04-23-2010, 08:57 AM
See! It's not so bad after all. ;)


Plus I'm pretty sure a lot of those clients are new(ish) draft picks who end up signing with First Wave because of the team they join. I'm sure FW aims to grab any and every player without a big agency behind them.

scooter
04-23-2010, 09:05 AM
mornin d

just finished my morning tea

icecoldbeer
04-23-2010, 09:09 AM
So, with a little Excel Spreadsheet sorting, I discover that 16 of 16 MLS teams have First Wave Sports Clients.

I know people talk about Mojo's tightness with First Wave, but what's the deal with Chicago?

TFC - 7
Chicago - 7
NJSB - 5
SJ - 5
Seattle - 4
Dynamo - 4
Colorado - 4
NE - 4
Philly - 4
RSL - 4
DC - 3
Chivas - 2
KC - 2
C-Bus - 1
Dallas - 1
LA - 1

Look how many ex-TFC players are 1st Wave though...

NYSB - 2 (Goldthwaite, Sutton)
Seattle - 1 (Jaqua)
NER - 1 (Phelan)

Interesting that Teal Bunbury signed with them.

Check out this testimonial

Marco Reda, Toronto FC - Canadian International
"Barry MacLean of First Wave Sports Marketing has been fantastic. Not only do I owe a lot to him, but there are a lot of other guys who do as well. He has been good for the whole game of soccer in Canada." :rolleyes:

Krasno.pL.
04-23-2010, 09:12 AM
Look how many ex-TFC players are 1st Wave though...

NYSB - 2 (Goldthwaite, Sutton)
Seattle - 1 (Jaqua)
NER - 1 (Phelan)

Interesting that Teal Bunbury signed with them.

Check out this testimonial

Marco Reda, Toronto FC - Canadian International
"Barry MacLean of First Wave Sports Marketing has been fantastic. Not only do I owe a lot to him, but there are a lot of other guys who do as well. He has been good for the whole game of soccer in Canada." :rolleyes:


Its True... Super Agent in Canada

reggie
04-23-2010, 09:14 AM
FYI --------- The Don Valley Parkway will be CLOSED this weekend,
so if you're driving to BMO from that general direction, you might want
to leave extra early and plan for your alternate route. Luckily a 1:00pm
kickoff might mean lighter traffic. Good luck!
i wish you never mentioned that... i probs would missed the first half,which i think is a good thing...:D

Shaughno
04-23-2010, 09:27 AM
Its True... Super Agent in Canada


It's not like he has any REAL competition in Canada LOL

Whoop
04-23-2010, 09:28 AM
Don't let GM hear you say that!

Beach_Red
04-23-2010, 09:36 AM
See! It's not so bad after all. ;)


Plus I'm pretty sure a lot of those clients are new(ish) draft picks who end up signing with First Wave because of the team they join. I'm sure FW aims to grab any and every player without a big agency behind them.


It's not the players that's really an issue - it's the management. Or really, the players and management combination. And, yes, that's not just TFC, it's also Columbus wth both GM and coach repped by FW.

mastermixer
04-23-2010, 09:40 AM
FYI --------- The Don Valley Parkway will be CLOSED this weekend,
so if you're driving to BMO from that general direction, you might want
to leave extra early and plan for your alternate route. Luckily a 1:00pm
kickoff might mean lighter traffic. Good luck!

I think we will see a lot of empy seats for the first part of the game with people trying to get downtown.

Oldtimer
04-23-2010, 09:48 AM
3 agents own most of the players in MLS. First Wave is one of them.

[NBF]
04-23-2010, 09:57 AM
SSG: Shes a hot MILF, and pic 7, 15 and 22 are just mouth watering:)

I clicked on the link for the Practice Update with Sanyang injured and the new winger on trial. I read and pretty much learned everything I read on the forum, but than I saw a story about Nana Attakora called "Nana No 'Flash' In The Pan". Quite literally, the entire article is dedicated to a young kid with a future on team Canada with the help of players like DeGuzman, and Robinson.

Nana, was originally one of the 9 youngsters TFC signed in 2007.

1. Andrea Lombardo (19)
2. Nana Attakora (18)
3. Gabe Gala (17)
4. Cristian Nunez (18)
5. Joey Melo (18)
6. Tyler Hemming (18)
7. Stephen Lumley (18)
8. David Guzman (18)
9. David Monsalve (18)

If only TFC was allowed to keep players or send them out on loan. Some of these players might of been on Attakora's level now.

Another thing i picked up from the article about Nana is that he's the only person holding the entire backline together and if something happens to Nana, We are masterfully fucked and anally whorrrred

Shaughno
04-23-2010, 10:14 AM
I'd take Hemming, Lumley and Monsalve back on Dev contracts. They were all decent prospects from what I remember.

Ossington Mental Youth
04-23-2010, 10:15 AM
off your meds this morning? :)

HAHA nah just tired of the 'what ifs'

Whoop
04-23-2010, 10:16 AM
3 agents own most of the players in MLS. First Wave is one of them.

Who are the other two?

Maybe the other two have better clients. LOL

Beach_Red
04-23-2010, 10:28 AM
Who are the other two?

Maybe the other two have better clients. LOL


Yeah, did they also submit bids for the sub-contracting job to run the team? Were their bids too high?

:D

Shaughno
04-23-2010, 10:36 AM
Global Pro Management - founded by former Fire and Wizards player Diego Gutierrez.

and

ProActiveSports aka JamesGrant Media Management.

Whoop
04-23-2010, 10:40 AM
Global Pro Management - founded by former Fire and Wizards player Diego Gutierrez.

and

ProActiveSports aka JamesGrant Media Management.


Global Pro website under construction.

James Grant - http://www.jgg.co.uk/ (they rep more than just athletes)
Client list - http://www.jamesgrantsports.com/clients_all.php

Pachuco
04-23-2010, 10:41 AM
Ok, I'm an idiot. Who is First Wave and why is it a concern that there is a connection there?

Whoop
04-23-2010, 10:43 AM
http://www.firstwavesports.com/firstwave/clients

http://www.firstwavesports.com/coaches/coaches

ginkster88
04-23-2010, 10:47 AM
That "Ones that got Away" article must have been lifted directly from the thread that started here two or three days ago.

ManUtd4ever
04-23-2010, 10:49 AM
That "Ones that got Away" article must have been lifted directly from the thread that started here two or three days ago.

I read several newspaper articles every week that basically regurgitate issues brought forth in this forum...

Pachuco
04-23-2010, 10:51 AM
http://www.firstwavesports.com/firstwave/clients

http://www.firstwavesports.com/coaches/coaches

Ok, now I now who firstwave is, why is it a concern that they are linked to MLS players and coaches?

Ossington Mental Youth
04-23-2010, 10:52 AM
I read several newspaper articles every week that basically regurgitate issues brought forth in this forum...

yep, hysteria building hysteria.

Whoop
04-23-2010, 10:53 AM
Mind you... the more I think about it though, it's the same in hockey. While there are a ton of sports agents out there (as long as the NHLPA certifies you, you're okay), the NHL is dominated by a handful of agencies, who also rep coaches and management, being...

Newport Sports - http://www.thehockeyagency.com/index2.html - they are the biggest agency when it comes to hockey
CAA - http://www.caa.com/ - mainly a Hollywood agency, but getting involved in sports now too - they took Pat Brisson and JP Barry from IMG, have been getting a number of high profile players
Orr Hockey Group

IMG - http://www.imgworld.com/sports/ - used to be a player but I think they've pulled out of hockey

ginkster88
04-23-2010, 10:54 AM
Ok, now I now who firstwave is, why is it a concern that they are linked to MLS players and coaches?

Some people think that Mo only signs First Wave players/coaches because of his relationship with them. Of course there's no way to know anything beyond speculating, but I hadn't known that our entire coaching staff is represented by First Wave until now. Beyond speculation though, there is no real issue to be concerned about.

Roogsy
04-23-2010, 10:56 AM
I know it's become a running joke, but probably close to a third of the MLS is represented by First Wave... It's not just us.


A large number yes. A third? I think that is a bit much.

Pachuco
04-23-2010, 10:59 AM
Some people think that Mo only signs First Wave players/coaches because of his relationship with them. Of course there's no way to know anything beyond speculating, but I hadn't known that our entire coaching staff is represented by First Wave until now. Beyond speculation though, there is no real issue to be concerned about.

Really though, who cares? Recruitment companies in the real world work their ass off to build relationships with clients so that they become the preferred and sometimes the only recruitment agency their client will use. I don't see any difference here.

Whoop
04-23-2010, 11:00 AM
The way I see it, those agencies have carved out a niche representing MLS players. No different than most other leagues.

I guess you don't see more agents/agencies probably because there is no money to be made repping MLS players. LOL

I see it in hockey all the time. Unless you're with one of the big players, it's tough to make it. You have to get lucky with a couple of your clients, and hope they don't get poached by the bigger agencies. You can do well if you have 3-4 high end clients (guys like M5 Sports, Pulver Sports, Topshelf), but you're not making huge money. And the bigger your roster gets the more people you have to employ.

Roogsy
04-23-2010, 11:05 AM
I think the problem here isn't the association with First Wave, it's the suspicious closeness to them, including most new players signing with them almost immediately.

In addition to that, the lack of scouting from this team only makes observers wonder if the close association with First Wave has made them the default resource TFC uses to bring in new players instead of doing their own due diligence. THAT is the problem I have with the association.

Krasno.pL.
04-23-2010, 11:06 AM
It's not like he has any REAL competition in Canada LOL

Soooo Trueee Shaug.. LOL
Bastard FUCK hate him.

Pachuco
04-23-2010, 11:10 AM
I think the problem here isn't the association with First Wave, it's the suspicious closeness to them, including most new players signing with them almost immediately.

In addition to that, the lack of scouting from this team only makes observers wonder if the close association with First Wave has made them the default resource TFC uses to bring in new players instead of doing their own due diligence. THAT is the problem I have with the association.

Ummm...but Roogsy, there is nothing wrong with outsourcing your scouting division if that's what you wanted to do. You could argue that First Wave probably has more connections and a bigger network to tap into then a new scout would anyways. I really see nothing wrong with using agencies to do what they do best.

Roogsy
04-23-2010, 11:15 AM
Except First Wave has no scouting ability. They are exclusively a Canada/US outfit. They have no contacts, scouts or knowledge of markets outside of North America, and even then it's limited to professional players, not even college-level players. Shoot...I bet Werewolf on our boards has better contacts in Africa than First Wave.

If you're going to outsource your scouting, do it properly.

Whoop
04-23-2010, 11:21 AM
I think the problem here isn't the association with First Wave, it's the suspicious closeness to them, including most new players signing with them almost immediately.

In addition to that, the lack of scouting from this team only makes observers wonder if the close association with First Wave has made them the default resource TFC uses to bring in new players instead of doing their own due diligence. THAT is the problem I have with the association.

Well yeah, I didn't say it wasn't suspicious. LOL

The default resource aspect would be a big concern, but in reality we would have no way of knowing though.

I would be more comfortable if I knew who was scouting for TFC. Even if we knew the name of the "Chief Scouting" or "Director of Scouting", at least we could kind of point a finger at him just to ask "who are you looking at?"

Fuck during the season I'm on the road 4-5 nights a week looking at players and a) I'm just a local guy and b) it's for junior hockey for crying out loud.

I mean you hope that MLSE would give TFC a scouting budget and say "Here is $1 million. Use it to find players." Then a) you could travel the world looking for players, b) or say pay a couple of guys in different parts of the world to find you players, c) use some money to access world scouting databases, d) or pay guys a finder's fee... i.e. you recommend a player, the player signs, the guy who recommended the player gets say $5,000.

Yet... who is the person doing the scouting? If they are just taking First Wave recruits... that's a problem.

I mean I would like to see Mo Johnston's face at League Championship game, for example or a Mexican league game, or at Colombian league game, etc. Or even at other MLS games. In reality... even to me that's asking too much... so you figure they would have people hired TFC or representing TFC doing that stuff.

That's why when I said earlier it's sports, it's not that hard... yes they're all different, but they're also the same. I can call up a list of Maple Leafs scouts and Raptors scouts... but who's doing that for TFC?

The organizational flow chart shouldn't be that hard.

GM/Director of Football Operations - reports to the President

Head Coach - reports to the GM/Director
Director of Player Personnel/Development/Recruitment/etc - reports to the GM/Director
Ass't GM - reports to the GM/Director

Ass't Coaches - report to Head Coach
Scouts/Bird Dogs/etc - report to the Director of Player Personnel/Development/Recruitment/etc.

All I know about TFC's football operations staff is that it's Mo and now Jim Brennan. Wow.

Roogsy
04-23-2010, 11:25 AM
Considering the investment and potential returns MLSE is getting out of TFC, I am shocked...SHOCKED that they have not invested in a true scouting team. For football, it is vital. Certainly more vital than a "Director of Soccer Operations".

This is like a hospital having a surgeons without anaesthesiologists. You can't have one without the other. But MLSE has decided to go that route. :rolleyes:

Whoop
04-23-2010, 11:25 AM
Except First Wave has no scouting ability. They are exclusively a Canada/US outfit. They have no contacts, scouts or knowledge of markets outside of North America, and even then it's limited to professional players, not even college-level players. Shoot...I bet Werewolf on our boards has better contacts in Africa than First Wave.

If you're going to outsource your scouting, do it properly.

Bingo.

If you want to find players from outside of North America... it doesn't sound like First Wave does that.

Looks like they get a) players that come from the NCAA ranks, if they have any players that play in Europe they came through MLS first and b) if a player comes from overseas, they end up being their NA representation, if they had any representation in the first place.

Football agents from around the world probably don't want to send their clients to the MLS because they'd make jack shit on commissions, usually 3%, sometimes as high as 5%.

Shaughno
04-23-2010, 11:25 AM
Except First Wave has no scouting ability. They are exclusively a Canada/US outfit. They have no contacts, scouts or knowledge of markets outside of North America, and even then it's limited to professional players, not even college-level players. Shoot...I bet Werewolf on our boards has better contacts in Africa than First Wave.

If you're going to outsource your scouting, do it properly.


Umm... they also have players in Norway, Sweden and England. Just off the top of my head, there may have been more, but I do agree we need more scouting outside of the NA based players/teams.

Whoop
04-23-2010, 11:30 AM
Considering the investment and potential returns MLSE is getting out of TFC, I am shocked...SHOCKED that they have not invested in a true scouting team. For football, it is vital. Certainly more vital than a "Director of Soccer Operations".

This is like a hospital having a surgeons without anaesthesiologists. You can't have one without the other. But MLSE has decided to go that route. :rolleyes:

Even the scope of football alone demands that you need more people.

It's not like you're only looking at Aussie Rule Football players and have to concentrate on one part of the world.

Football is a global game. Even as much as we hate Mo, he can't do it alone.

Going with just three agencies for example (First Wave, plus the other two) is a lazy man's way of doing things.

It might cost you more money but the return is so much greater. Problem is I think as a whole other MLS teams don't do it either. If they did, I think they could improve the quality of play immensely. You improve the quality of play, it becomes more attractive, etc.

At the end of the day, the players are the product. People come to see the players... or hope to see quality football. But if you're not investing in getting better players... how is the quality going to improve?

TFCRegina
04-23-2010, 11:30 AM
I'd take Hemming, Lumley and Monsalve back on Dev contracts. They were all decent prospects from what I remember.

I'd take Hemming back on at least the league minimum...probably would pay as high as 60,000 for him. Same with Monsalve. Then I'd cut Garcia.

Roogsy
04-23-2010, 11:31 AM
Umm... they also have players in Norway, Sweden and England. Just off the top of my head, there may have been more, but I do agree we need more scouting outside of the NA based players/teams.

Jay. Come on. I know you like to argue with me but this one is nonsensical.

On their webpage they have a list of 70 clients. 4....FOUR are in Europe between Norway, Sweden and Denmark. That's it.

That's 0.57%. That's not a statistic, that's an anomaly. That's the margin for error. That screams "North American outfit".

And who are these players? Former MLS players. First Wave probably holds their MLS rights, but I highly doubt they were primary agents for them in their move to Europe. I am not even sure First Wave is licensed in Europe.

*Sorry...they also have Jamie Peters in England, makes it 5 or 7.1%.*

Whoop
04-23-2010, 11:33 AM
Umm... they also have players in Norway, Sweden and England. Just off the top of my head, there may have been more, but I do agree we need more scouting outside of the NA based players/teams.

But Shags if you look at the players playing Norway, Sweden, and England... a) where did they get their start and b) where are they from?

a) MLS
b) North America

It's not like they are representing Norwegians in Norway.

Sweden - Craig Henderson, Alejandro Bedoya
Norway - Khari Stephenson
England - Anton Peterlin, Jamie Peters , Cody Arnoux
Denmark - Yura Moysisyan

Beach_Red
04-23-2010, 11:37 AM
Except First Wave has no scouting ability. They are exclusively a Canada/US outfit. They have no contacts, scouts or knowledge of markets outside of North America, and even then it's limited to professional players, not even college-level players. Shoot...I bet Werewolf on our boards has better contacts in Africa than First Wave.

If you're going to outsource your scouting, do it properly.

You have to wonder how big a factor the agency was in Mo's getting the job in the first place. Did MLSE interview a few guys for the job and ask them, "How big a scouting budget will you need?" And then they gave the job to the guy who said, "Oh, we don't need a scouting budget."

Roogsy
04-23-2010, 11:38 AM
Whoops my bad...that's 7. I missed a couple.

That makes it a full 1% of their clients are in Europe and 99% are in USL or MLS.

TFCRegina
04-23-2010, 11:38 AM
Except First Wave has no scouting ability. They are exclusively a Canada/US outfit. They have no contacts, scouts or knowledge of markets outside of North America, and even then it's limited to professional players, not even college-level players. Shoot...I bet Werewolf on our boards has better contacts in Africa than First Wave.

If you're going to outsource your scouting, do it properly.

I'd largely agree with this.

MLS scouting of the lower leagues in North America is weak, if there at all.

Our club should be scouring the PDL for players...but we're not.

PDL has sent more domestic players to Europe over the past 3 years than MLS...

Roogsy
04-23-2010, 11:41 AM
I'd largely agree with this.

MLS scouting of the lower leagues in North America is weak, if there at all.

Our club should be scouring the PDL for players...but we're not.

PDL has sent more domestic players to Europe over the past 3 years than MLS...


Very interesting point raised here.

Whoop
04-23-2010, 11:42 AM
That too.

Is anyone looking at CSL, USL, PDL players?

I know it's not glamourous but I'm sure if you have the right system in place you could get 2-3 players to at least look at.

Shaughno
04-23-2010, 11:43 AM
Fuck man, they can hire me and I'll scout for them... I know of 2-3 players that given the chance would make the jump from CSL/PDL/KDSL up the the MLS and would probably fare better than some of the lower/mid players in the MLS.

Roogsy
04-23-2010, 11:46 AM
Fuck man, they can hire me and I'll scout for them... I know of 2-3 players that given the chance would make the jump from CSL/PDL/KDSL up the the MLS and would probably fare better than some of the lower/mid players in the MLS.


The funny thing is that it's not a bad idea. There are many people on this board (not myself, I know nothing about player development other than it is necessary) that has been paying attention to Canadian development to be able to provide good input in searching for players. You wouldn't even have to pay a guy that much but the fact that they don't even HAVE that position is what is disappointing and a glaring mistake on their part. It's just bad business.

Roogsy
04-23-2010, 11:47 AM
That too.

Is anyone looking at CSL, USL, PDL players?

I know it's not glamourous but I'm sure if you have the right system in place you could get 2-3 players to at least look at.

My guess is that TFC thinks they can get all the benefits they need from the Academy, and that simply is a mistake.

Beach_Red
04-23-2010, 11:47 AM
Fuck man, they can hire me and I'll scout for them... I know of 2-3 players that given the chance would make the jump from CSL/PDL/KDSL up the the MLS and would probably fare better than some of the lower/mid players in the MLS.

That's really the point, though, they can hire lots of people, but they don't.

There are some good questions in this thread about scouting an the org chart - let's hope someone in the media picks up on it, these are the questions MLSE should be asked.

It would be interesting to compare TFC's org chart to other MLS teams. Even to Vancouver and Montreal.

TFCRegina
04-23-2010, 11:49 AM
My guess is that TFC thinks they can get all the benefits they need from the Academy, and that simply is a mistake.

All those academy benefits...like signing all those youth players to fill out our roster... :facepalm:

I hope that's not the logic. Our team is totally screwed on the youth talent front if that's the case.

Pachuco
04-23-2010, 11:51 AM
Whoops my bad...that's 7. I missed a couple.

That makes it a full 1% of their clients are in Europe and 99% are in USL or MLS.

Their clients are here, but where did their clients come from? I'm seeing names there that didn't originate in MLS. Sanyang is there, so the question is who found him? Did TFC scouts find him and refer him to FirstWave for representation? that's possible. Did Firstwave have him signed first and referred him to TFC, that's possible too. At the end of the day, we trialed Sanyang, we liked him, we signed him.

There is no exclusivity deal with TFC and Firstwave (obviously) so what's the big issue? This conspiracy theory has too many holes. FirstWave seems to be a resource to tap into but there is no evidence at all that suggests we are signing guys simply because they are FirstWave clients.

Whoop
04-23-2010, 11:51 AM
You wouldn't hire people like that. They would be throwing money away.

What you do is pay a finder's fee.

i.e. Shags recommends a player. Player signs a contract. Shags gets a cut or a flat fee say $2000.
If it works out, and Shags recommends another player and he works out... all of a sudden they have Shags looking at/recommending players and there is a relationship.

It's a little different with hockey and basketball where there aren't as many players to look at so you can hire full-time scouts and part-time scouts.

Whoop
04-23-2010, 11:53 AM
Their clients are here, but where did their clients come from? I'm seeing names there that didn't originate in MLS. Sanyang is there, so the question is who found him? Did TFC scouts find him and refer him to FirstWave for representation? that's possible. Did Firstwave have him signed first and referred him to TFC, that's possible too. At the end of the day, we trialed Sanyang, we liked him, we signed him.

There is no exclusivity deal with TFC and Firstwave (obviously) so what's the big issue? This conspiracy theory has too many holes. FirstWave seems to be a resource to tap into but there is no evidence at all that suggests we are signing guys simply because they are FirstWave clients.

Agreed.

But aside from Mo... who else is looking for players for TFC?

Like I said as much as I hate Mo, I would never expect him to be the sole person looking for talent. That is way too big of task for one person.

Pachuco
04-23-2010, 11:53 AM
That too.

Is anyone looking at CSL, USL, PDL players?

I know it's not glamourous but I'm sure if you have the right system in place you could get 2-3 players to at least look at.

You are asking if TFC is looking at USL players? I think we've signed enough of those :)

Roogsy
04-23-2010, 11:54 AM
Their clients are here, but where did their clients come from? I'm seeing names there that didn't originate in MLS. Sanyang is there, so the question is who found him? Did TFC scouts find him and refer him to FirstWave for representation? that's possible. Did Firstwave have him signed first and referred him to TFC, that's possible too. At the end of the day, we trialed Sanyang, we liked him, we signed him.

There is no exclusivity deal with TFC and Firstwave (obviously) so what's the big issue? This conspiracy theory has too many holes. FirstWave seems to be a resource to tap into but there is no evidence at all that suggests we are signing guys simply because they are FirstWave clients.


What it creates is an environment of suspicion Pachuco. If they're dealing with many agents, then there is less likelihood or opportunity for collusion or backdoor deals. There is less likelihood for undue pressure or influence. That is not the case here. Barry McLean might as well have a TFC business card and that is not the way things should work. It doesn't in other truly professional leagues.

rocker
04-23-2010, 11:54 AM
But aside from Mo... who else is looking for players for TFC?.

I can only think of one on permanent staff: Tim Regan.

Pachuco
04-23-2010, 11:55 AM
Agreed.

But aside from Mo... who else is looking for players for TFC?

Like I said as much as I hate Mo, I would never expect him to be the sole person looking for talent. That is way too big of task for one person.

Oh I don't disagree with you at all. We sure as hell better have scouts. I thought I read two years ago that we had scouts. In fact, we've trialed alot of players in our 4 years, so we haven't had a problem bringing in players. Someone other then Mo/Preki is obviously looking. Are they doing a good job? that's up for debate :)

TFCRegina
04-23-2010, 11:57 AM
Agreed.

But aside from Mo... who else is looking for players for TFC?

Like I said as much as I hate Mo, I would never expect him to be the sole person looking for talent. That is way too big of task for one person.

Just another sign of incompetence though.

He is director of soccer operations. At the very least, he could have went above to TA and asked for the money to hire someone to help him out.

Pachuco
04-23-2010, 11:59 AM
What it creates is an environment of suspicion Pachuco. If they're dealing with many agents, then there is less likelihood or opportunity for collusion or backdoor deals. There is less likelihood for undue pressure or influence. That is not the case here. Barry McLean might as well have a TFC business card and that is not the way things should work. It doesn't in other truly professional leagues.

I can see that there is a relationship there and that sometimes can create suspision. But I'll go with the conspiracy theory that Mo is getting kickback for referring clients to FirstWave :). After all, we have no idea what came first, the player or the representation.

Roogsy
04-23-2010, 12:02 PM
He is director of soccer operations. At the very least, he could have went above to TA and asked for the money to hire someone to help him out.


Which brings up another interesting point.

If he is "Director of Soccer Operations" why is it has has almost nothing to do with "Soccer Operations"?

Preki and his staff now seem to do all the scouting, player selection, soccer tactics, roster picking, assignments etc.

It seems to me that all Mo is there to do is to sign the contract and work out the CBA/Salary Cap issues. Am I missing something? If that's the case, then maybe I will comment in the "Should Paul Bierne be Director of Soccer" and give my :thumbsup: ! Because if Mo does nothing more than that, you don't need to know anything about soccer, you just need to be able to work out the mathematics of the CBA/Salary Cap issues.

The fundamental question here is:

What does Mo do??? :noidea:

Whoop
04-23-2010, 12:06 PM
Another conspiracy.

Mo lets Preki take care of all the player selections, etc so if it fails he can say "See? Not my fault."

And when you ask well what are you doing? "I'm going to Brazil, looking for players."

Whoop
04-23-2010, 12:09 PM
I can only think of one on permanent staff: Tim Regan.

Is he still part of the staff? Other than when TFC signed him to play that one game and is was mentioned that he was a "scout' for them, I haven't heard him speak and/or heard about him since then.

Which leads me to another point? If he is... why isn't he, or anyone else in football operations, listed as part of the staff?

Krasno.pL.
04-23-2010, 12:09 PM
Fuck man, they can hire me and I'll scout for them... I know of 2-3 players that given the chance would make the jump from CSL/PDL/KDSL up the the MLS and would probably fare better than some of the lower/mid players in the MLS.


+100000000000000000
Soo Much Talent.. Not Enough Opportunity

Whoop
04-23-2010, 12:15 PM
Just give me something like this... just using it for information purposes... I know we're not a big club like Chelsea...

But it gives you an idea.

http://www.chelseafc.com/page/TheManagementIndex/0,,10268,00.html

Michael Emenalo - Head scout (http://www.chelseafc.com/page/TheManagement/0,,10268%7E859057,00.html)
Michael Emenalobecame well acquainted with Avram Grant when a player at Maccabi Tel-Aviv where Grant was manager.

Frank Arnesen - Sporting director (http://www.chelseafc.com/page/TheManagement/0,,10268%7E904062,00.html)
Continues with his previous roles relating to the Reserves and Academy but now also takes on responsibilities relating to the co-ordination of first team activity and supporting the first team manager.

http://www.chelseafc.com/page/TheManagement/0,,10268~1185191,00.html

Hans Gillhaus
In charge of Chelsea's international scouting network having worked as an international scout for PSV Eindhoven. Played for Holland at the 1990 World Cup and won the European Cup with PSV in 1988.

Gary Worthington
UK and international scout, formerly with Manchester United and Leeds United Academies.

Pachuco
04-23-2010, 12:15 PM
Is he still part of the staff? Other than when TFC signed him to play that one game and is was mentioned that he was a "scout' for them, I haven't heard him speak and/or heard about him since then.

Which leads me to another point? If he is... why isn't he, or anyone else in football operations, listed as part of the staff?

Yes, looks like Tim Regan is head of scouting at TFC. You can even take a course where he is a guest speaker :). Now the question is, does anybody work for him, or is this a one man show? and how many of the players that we've signed in the last 2 years were Tim Regan finds? who knows.

http://www.sportsmanagementworldwide.com/courses/soccer-management

Whoop
04-23-2010, 12:16 PM
Grant it... I know it's a lot tougher to scout for a MLS club given the quirks of the MLS... but it can't be that difficult, can it?

Whoop
04-23-2010, 12:18 PM
Yes, looks like Tim Regan is head of scouting at TFC. You can even take a course where he is a guest speaker :). Now the question is, does anybody work for him, or is this a one man show? and how many of the players that we've signed in the last 2 years were Tim Regan finds? who knows.

http://www.sportsmanagementworldwide.com/courses/soccer-management

SMWW.... is a huge ripoff.

Beach_Red
04-23-2010, 12:32 PM
Just another sign of incompetence though.

He is director of soccer operations. At the very least, he could have went above to TA and asked for the money to hire someone to help him out.


How do you know he didn't?

Look, until the contract extension last fall, the GM was on short-term contracts with a company known to be more interested in profits than in inning championships. He wants to keep his job, he wants to get a longer-term contract, what does he do? Keep asking them for money or keep the team's expenses down and the profits up?

jloome
04-23-2010, 03:20 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by spark
Not hard to find positives when things have spiraled so low, but if you had to choose Mo or Preki (as it seems some want both gonzo) it could be argued Preki has actually done some things to improve the team ...

WHEN IT CAN'T GET ANY WORSE, THINGS ARE LOOKING UP (http://www.rednationonline.ca/When_It_Cant_Get_Any_Worse_Things_Are_Looking_Up_a pr_23_10_column.shtml)

Originally posted by OldTimer
Quote:
Plus, I harbour an optimism regarding TFC's future that many people would consider insane
No argument there.
__________________

Oh, nyuk, nyuk. Age before wisdom, I guess!:D