DeGuzman Says Yes to TFC - Footyblog

[ArmenJBX]

Looks like Robbo's the way to go then.

[Lucky Strike]

Oh no, dude, you may just be about to get lit up for that by some Gala lovers on this board LOL.

I'm fairly certain Gala doesn't make 80K anyway, so the point may be moot.

EDIT: Someone beat me to the punch.

[TFCtoMUFC]

Id rather see Vitti go, the extra 12k on Robbo is worth it.

[CretanBull]

But it is relevant.

We do not know how much room we have nor do we know if there is allocation money in the bank. That info is not made public.

We do know that:

a) the team is within the cap (with allocation money) now since it continues to operate
b) at most, De Guzman's cap hit this year would be $80k per the Beckham concession (6 games left after tonight or 20% of the season, 20% of $400k is $80k)

Worst case scenario, we have no allocation money left and are at our max. TFC has 2 choices:

1) Trade a player for no salary in return or at least a net $80k difference

Or:

2) Appeal to the MLS under their allocation rules which allow for allocations to be made under "exceptional circumstances as approved by the Competition Committee." http://web.mlsnet.com/about/league.jsp?section=regulations&content=overview

Again, option 1) is a worst case scenario and at most, we have to move $80k off the roster. This isn't a roster gutting of Guevara, Robinson, Vitti, Barrett, etc. It's likely a single move.... at least for this season.

We're over the cap by a lot (like $1 miilion over the cap). I just read the MLS rules and allocation money can't be applied to buy-down the cap hit of a DP. So we have to find $80k in cap space, that's if the MLS is willing to pro-rate his contract to 20%.

[Chevy]

^^ But when you are looking for a salary do drop, wouldn't you have to pro-rate that as well. So to drop 80K you would need to drop a player making 300-400k??

[rocker]

What if he's not a DP on this season's contract?

Think of Schellotto -- he started on a 175K contract if you check the union docs.
But then every release of the salary report, it went up. Then finally last season they made him a DP. Is it possible they give him some low front end for this season, prorated for 6 games??
but then his subsequent seasons are much higher.....?

[Pookie]

We're over the cap by a lot (like $1 miilion over the cap). I just read the MLS rules and allocation money can't be applied to buy-down the cap hit of a DP. So we have to find $80k in cap space, that's if the MLS is willing to pro-rate his contract to 20%.

True but you aren't going to buy down the cap hit with allocation money. What you are going to argue for is that this is an exceptional circumstance and therefore MORE allocation money is needed.

Again, this is route if there is no allocation money left to apply against the 80k. Of course, I'm assuming $80k would be the number given the Beckham situation.

[Cashcleaner]

Exactly bang on. This is too little too late. He isn't a miracle worker. Given a whole season, JDG can dominate this league. But step in and help us win 3 maybe 4 games out of 6? With no time to gel with the team? That's a tall order.

I wanted to see JDG in TFC red as much as anyone, and hopefully this does work out, but the rational side of me just doesn't see it happening.

Well, as far as I know nothing has been confirmed so I'm definitely not hold my breath. I think there is going to be a lot of shuffling in the roster to accommodate him, so my guess is that it will all happen over the off-season.

[wzhxvy]

Is it beyond MO to create a story about JDG to deflect the attention from the fiasco brewing...No...but this involves another party who is trying to find a job in Europe, so to assume that JDG conspired with MO to release this story is really stretching it.

In my opinion, this is pretty simple, JDG is a dreamer and thought he could get a deal in Europe in the same universe as TFC's offer...then he found out the reality of the situation in Europe and the money was still there from TFC, so he is going after it. He is not going to sit there for months to start next season, he wants the money NOW and MO will do it to sign him...pretty simple.

[Kaz]

Barret, Vitti, and Robo are really the major cap space we have right now..

at this point in the season we should just pass on him.
I'm sorry, but lets wait till we see if the cap is raised next year.. and make the choices in the winter months, and let JDG train with us of a while and get him fit... send him to TFC academy next year.. we'll see if he is ready for MLS play (I'm kidding of course about the academy)

[Shakes McQueen]

Exactly bang on. This is too little too late. He isn't a miracle worker. Given a whole season, JDG can dominate this league. But step in and help us win 3 maybe 4 games out of 6? With no time to gel with the team? That's a tall order.

I wanted to see JDG in TFC red as much as anyone, and hopefully this does work out, but the rational side of me just doesn't see it happening.

One positive, is that JDG has lots of experience with Gerba and DeRo from the CMNT. Perhaps those three guys would interact well out of the gate. And if anyone can give Gerba good service in the box, it's JDG.

- Scott

[Chevy]

Is it beyond MO to create a story about JDG to deflect the attention from the fiasco brewing...No...but this involves another party who is trying to find a job in Europe, so to assume that JDG conspired with MO to release this story is really stretching it.

In my opinion, this is pretty simple, JDG is a dreamer and thought he could get a deal in Europe in the same universe as TFC's offer...then he found out the reality of the situation in Europe and the money was still there from TFC, so he is going after it. He is not going to sit there for months to start next season, he wants the money NOW and MO will do it to sign him...pretty simple.

This makes sense. Can't we sign him for the rest of this season then loan him to a Euro club in January? He would return (we hope) for the start of the 2010 season. ?

[Yohan]

This makes sense. Can't we sign him for the rest of this season then loan him to a Euro club in January? He would return (we hope) for the start of the 2010 season. ?
why the heck would an Euro team take JDG for only a 3 month loan?

[Pookie]

This makes sense. Can't we sign him for the rest of this season then loan him to a Euro club in January? He would return (we hope) for the start of the 2010 season. ?

My own feeling is that his open criticism of the "way he was treated" by his old club has him on a bit of a blacklist.

[mighty_torontofc_2008]

Barret, Vitti, and Robo are really the major cap space we have right now..

at this point in the season we should just pass on him.
I'm sorry, but lets wait till we see if the cap is raised next year.. and make the choices in the winter months, and let JDG train with us of a while and get him fit... send him to TFC academy next year.. we'll see if he is ready for MLS play (I'm kidding of course about the academy)


doubt if the cap will be raised. Isn't MLS starting CBA with the players after this season..and a few clubs will use their "POOR" attendances
as a reason not to raise the cap?

[Cashcleaner]

^ Almost all signs point to a cap increase with the re-negotiated CBA.

[Chevy]

why the heck would an Euro team take JDG for only a 3 month loan?

See - Beckham, David.

[Dirk Diggler]

There is a difference between David Beckham and JDG ... the latter of whom has not been able to find a suitor to play for on a permanent basis let alone a 3 month loan.

[Manutd #1]

he will be in a bad situation much like gerba when he came, he wont be match fit for a couple games he wont play up to the hype and fans will start to turn on him before he gets a chance to make an impact

[kaos197O]

seems the announcers on Sportsnet believe that this is a done deal....just waiting to make salary cap space and he's good to go. Hmmmmmm.....

[barticusz]

I dont' get the hype surrounding De Guzman. Watching him in the Gold Cup he did not look good at all. Especially in our final game against Honduras. He made so many mistakes on the field it was painful to watch. Hopefully he's better than that normally.

[TFCtoMUFC]

I dont' get the hype surrounding De Guzman. Watching him in the Gold Cup he did not look good at all. Especially in our final game against Honduras. He made so many mistakes on the field it was painful to watch. Hopefully he's better than that normally.

Can't be worse than watching Barrett yesterday or even Vitti.

[kaos197O]

I dont' get the hype surrounding De Guzman. Watching him in the Gold Cup he did not look good at all. Especially in our final game against Honduras. He made so many mistakes on the field it was painful to watch. Hopefully he's better than that normally.

He's a good player and will do alright in MLS but I don't think he's worth what they offered him initially and truly believe that what he gets paid compared to what he delivers, will affect the locker room fairly quickly.

As for those who think MLSE is looking at capitalizing on re selling him to a european club at a later date........I think we'd need a whole new coaching staff in order to develop him any further or make him more appealing to any of those leagues. We needn't look past Marvell Wynne to see that we are only capable of developing talent to a certain level and from that point on, it's all retrogression.

I'm not sure that this signing will have a positive ROI for MLSE! He is not the saviour and he will not have a huge impact on seat sales or merch sales. Signing him is not the answer as this club's problems run deep and they could be making it worse by signing him for so much money!

I hope they make him wait till next season to sign....he made us wait and we should now return the favour. He's not match ready, hasn't played with the squad and signing him now as a DP would be a complete waste of $$$$$

Anyone figured out what our record was since the JDG drama began? I am certain that all this has had an abysmal effect on the club during a period where the team needed stability in the dressing room. We need cohesion and we needed it a couple of months ago but all MO and company have done is is created drama which has resulted in another spiral downward for our boys.

I look forward to seeing JDG play in a TFC kit but when this is all said and done, I know I'll walk away from it with a really bad taste in my mouth for a long time to come.

PLEASE RESIGN MO! DO THE CLUB RIGHT FOR ONCE AND GET OUT NOW!

[ensco]

Well, last year from the following players found new homes through the transfer window out of the MLS:

Carlos Ruiz (age 30) to Olimpia Asuncion (PAR)
Hunter Freeman (age 24) to IK Start (NOR)
Scott Sealy (age 29) to Mac. Tel Aviv (ISR)
Fransisco Lima (age 38) to Taranto (ITA)
Kenny Duechar (age 29) to Hamilton (SCO)
Michael Parkhurst (age 25) to Nordsjaelland (DEN)
Kenny Cooper (age 25) to 1860 Munich (GER)
Duilio Davino (age 33) to Puebla (MEX)
Gonzalo Peralta (age 29) to Un. Santa Fe (COL)
Marcelo Gallardo (age 33) to River Plate (ARG)
Roberto Nurse (age 26) to Veracruz (MEX)
Francisco Mendoza (age 24) to Chivas (MEX)
Tomasz Frankowski (age 35) to Jagiellonia (POL)
Bakary Soumare (age 24) to Boulogne (FRA)

... sort of all over the map but of that list, 8 of the 14 were over 29 and arguably non of the talent of De Guzman.

I should have been more clear. Are there any examples that anyone knows of players 29 or older with multiyrar, multimillion dollar contracts who have been sold at a profit. Big club examples (eg Henry to Barca) don't count.

[SilverSamurai]

I dont' get the hype surrounding De Guzman. Watching him in the Gold Cup he did not look good at all. Especially in our final game against Honduras. He made so many mistakes on the field it was painful to watch. Hopefully he's better than that normally.
Look up his highlite reel on youtube.
He did really well in the Brazil friendly last year, except for that horrible passback...
In the 2007 GC he was a marked man.

This year in the GC they had him marked really well. Double teamed usually and he's the engine of the team. Their really is no 1 else on the squad at his level. It's why the loss of his brother really hurt, since supposedly he's better than Julian. Atleast JDG2 didn't say yes to Canada only to change his mind like Hargreaves and Begovic. Although Begovic is by far worst...

In any case after last night's performance I wouldn't be surprised if JDG changed his mind... :rolleyes:

[Carts]

If JDG gets whats reported ($3-Million or whatever) and dosen't dominate play and become our out and out best player by far - it will kill the locker room...

For a DP to work, he must be head-and-shoulders above his team, or put up team leading goals - otherwise the range of salary between the top & bottom becomes an issue...

Its a tough call, and can be a slippery slope. When it works, the GM looks like a genious - when it fails, everyone looks bad...

I'm just unsure if JDG is what we need... But then again, I'm unsure about alot of things with the club right now :(

Carts...

[Krasno.pL.]

Is this actually happening? or is it just smoke right now? ..
im lost on this issue.

[TorCanSoc]

He'll tear the league a new one. Its not like he's some fly-in-fly-out overpaid mercenary. This is his home, and home town. DeRo's excitement about being here was palpable on and off the field. I believe JDG would have the same attitude. Between the two of them, and an "on" Guevarra, we'd hit the post 10 maybe 12 times a night ...:hide:


:)

[jabbronies]

If JDG gets whats reported ($3-Million or whatever) and dosen't dominate play and become our out and out best player by far - it will kill the locker room...

For a DP to work, he must be head-and-shoulders above his team, or put up team leading goals - otherwise the range of salary between the top & bottom becomes an issue...

Its a tough call, and can be a slippery slope. When it works, the GM looks like a genious - when it fails, everyone looks bad...

I'm just unsure if JDG is what we need... But then again, I'm unsure about alot of things with the club right now :(

Carts...

I'm hoping he comes in and just controls the whole game. Right now we need someone like Zidane. A guy who can come in and just control the game. All balls go through him. He makes sure everyone is where they need to be (positional) and he keeps everyone calm. AND HE NEEDS TO BE VOCAL.

I'm not saying JDG is of Zidane quality. but with his skill coming to this league, I hope he can shine in a similar fashion as zidane did in Europe by being able to control the game and make it work in his favour.

I don't know if he is that type of player, but if he is, I hope he does what I've said above. I think that is one thing this team needs.

[Beach_Red]

I consider the timing of this story strange.

I'm not convinced that TFC has ever made a bona fide offer to JDG. More precisely, I am suspicious that MLSE won't pay the money it would take to get JDG in for more than 7 games.


I haven't read the whole thread. But if TFC's offer wasn't bona fide, then what happened to the European offers? Surely his gaent wuld have made sur ethe offer in hand from TFC was firm before trying to get more out of other teams. When he couldn't get more.....

JDG and TFC are only two of the players in this - a bunch of European teams were mentioned as interested parties. They certainly play an important part in this.

[Shakes McQueen]

I'm hoping he comes in and just controls the whole game. Right now we need someone like Zidane. A guy who can come in and just control the game. All balls go through him. He makes sure everyone is where they need to be (positional) and he keeps everyone calm. AND HE NEEDS TO BE VOCAL.

I'm not saying JDG is of Zidane quality. but with his skill coming to this league, I hope he can shine in a similar fashion as zidane did in Europe by being able to control the game and make it work in his favour.

I don't know if he is that type of player, but if he is, I hope he does what I've said above. I think that is one thing this team needs.

This is exactly why I think JDG should be a top priority signing for this club. JDG's position is such that most balls forward and backward would go through him.

A player with his passing skill could be integral in getting good scoring opportunities started - that one killer pass into the heart of defense. His history of playing with DeRo and Gerba could be key to unlocking the scoring potential of those two guys, since they have some chemistry together from the CMNT.

His defensive skills also mean less pressure on our defense, and given our clubs defensive history, that could be pivotal for us.

A class central midfielder could really grease the wheels on any team. Plus, there's the factor of him being a Canadian to boot, which is always nice.

- Scott

[Redpunkfiddle]

I'm hoping he comes in and just controls the whole game. Right now we need someone like Zidane. A guy who can come in and just control the game. All balls go through him. He makes sure everyone is where they need to be (positional) and he keeps everyone calm. AND HE NEEDS TO BE VOCAL.

I'm not saying JDG is of Zidane quality. but with his skill coming to this league, I hope he can shine in a similar fashion as zidane did in Europe by being able to control the game and make it work in his favour.

I don't know if he is that type of player, but if he is, I hope he does what I've said above. I think that is one thing this team needs.

He has the skills, but is not that vocal leader.

[Pookie]

I'm for anyone that can bring leadership qualities.

I'm not convinced that the players are horrible, even by MLS standards. Player's we've run out of town (ie. Jeff Cunningham) have gone on to score more goals than anyone on our current team. In fact, Cunningham's struggles appear limited to Toronto. Scoring well before he got here and after he left.

We can run the current squad out of town and replace them with others that we will run out of town a year from now. But in the end, we will have done nothing to address what is wrong.

We have no leadership. Brennan is fine at barking at the Ref but doesn't appear to rally the boys. He rarely jumps out in front of the media.

De Rosario certainly tries but I could see how people would resent the ball hogging tendencies he displays.

The coach quit on the team and the new one still has the "interim" label on him.

Where are the veterans? Where is the discipline? Where are the game plans? Where is the sense of team?

It was there in Montreal which feels like a dream.

[tfc2008]

We always joke about retiring at Toronto FC together, but we'll see. First he wants to play in Spain, but he’s followed by Chelsea and Arsenal. Once Richard Moar asked about him, but it’s difficult for Deportivo to sign him".

[Pachuco]

We always joke about retiring at Toronto FC together, but we'll see. First he wants to play in Spain, but he’s followed by Chelsea and Arsenal. Once Richard Moar asked about him, but it’s difficult for Deportivo to sign him".

I don't get this post, is this a quote from somewhere?

[Oldtimer]

After seeing the match at Colorado, I'm in a very unsentimental mood. I'd trade almost any one on the team (except Frei, DeRo and DD) to bring in JDG.

[WHITEY]

After seeing the match at Colorado, I'm in a very unsentimental mood. I'd trade almost any one on the team (except Frei, DeRo and DD) to bring in JDG.

I'd add Gerba to that list, but ya I'd be ready to ship any one of them out of town.

[SilverSamurai]

He has the skills, but is not that vocal leader.
He's also not the captain. IMO he should be the captain of the CMNT. He's level headed and leads by example. Stalteri is hot head and hasn't been playing 1st league footy. But that's a topic for a different thread.

JDG would come and help out big time. He's used to playing w/ DeRo, Gerba, Serioux and Brennan. Hell get Sutton back and with Attakora who's obviously a future CMNT player and we essentially have 1/2 the starting lineup for the CMNT.

[Baggio2TFC]

I'd add Gerba to that list, but ya I'd be ready to ship any one of them out of town.

:picard: He was terrible! But then again, so was everyone else excet DeRo and Frei!!

[andyc]

I'm sure that this won't go down well, but I'm really not comfortable with TFC becoming a big part of the CMNT... I know that we are the only Canadian MLS team but we need to sign the right players for the squad, not just strong Canadian players.

JDG is a good player who would be very good in the MLS but I don't believe he is the final piece in the puzzle for our existing team. We have big gaps in the squad that a DP should be filling and midfield really isn't one of them. JDGs skills are great but if he puts in a defense splitting pass and Barrett is 20 yards behind or worse misses as usual then it's just another wasted chance...

I don't see JDG as a true leader of the team. Let's be honest the CMNT hasn't set the world alight with JDG being front and centre. I watched him in the Jamaica game at BMO and while his skills were great to see, he didn't make the game changing difference that a DP has to regularly... BTW I have seen him on TV many times just this was the only time in person.

In addition he clearly doesn't want to play for us at this point in his career. If he comes it will be because he couldn't get another deal he liked. Maybe we'd be better off with an older player that is ready to fully commit to TFC, not one continually missing Europe and waiting for a call.

My 2 cents...

[ensco]

^andyc, he hit the crossbar in the 86th minute in that game. I know it didn't, but if that shot goes in....

[Shakes McQueen]

After seeing the match at Colorado, I'm in a very unsentimental mood. I'd trade almost any one on the team (except Frei, DeRo and DD) to bring in JDG.

Gomez and Sanyang are still relative kids, and both have shown flashes of brilliance. We are going to have to be patient with them - you'd have to be crazy to send them packing. Attakora and Cronin are still learning too.

But yes, almost anyone else could go, and I wouldn't lose too much sleep over it right now. That goes for the coach and GM also.

Paul Winsper is just about the only coach whose job should be safe right now, in my opinion.

- Scott

[Yeoman]

i still say he isn't as amazing as what seems to believe
good? yes i don't deny that
if this does indeed happen (which i'm suspecting it won't already) first game i'm back to see and he's playing? i will be yelling at him on principal for dog fucking us this long

[Shakes McQueen]

^andyc, he hit the crossbar in the 86th minute in that game. I know it didn't, but if that shot goes in....

...suddenly we are having a completely different discussion, despite his actual performance not being much different.

- Scott

[wzhxvy]

^andyc, he hit the crossbar in the 86th minute in that game. I know it didn't, but if that shot goes in....

I am sure there are other things to be critical about JDG, but the Jamaica game aint it. He was heads and shoulders the best player, scored once and almost scored twice...the fact that Pat Onstand is a douche and score for the Jamaicans does not reflect on JDG or his leadership.

[Shakes McQueen]

i still say he isn't as amazing as what seems to believe
good? yes i don't deny that
if this does indeed happen (which i'm suspecting it won't already) first game i'm back to see and he's playing? i will be yelling at him on principal for dog fucking us this long

I don't think he's amazing - but he's a perfect TFC DP target. He's got lots of talent, he's not over the hill, and he's a Canadian.

His age means we could build a team around him, his nationality means he will already have chemistry with a few of our players from the CMNT, and his skill will provide us with a premium box to box midfielder.

I'd love to see Gerba unleashed, with service from a player like JDG.

- Scott

[Yeoman]

i still think 'eh' personally
my more main concern is loosing how many players to the CMNT because we know that call up problem will happen again

[andyc]

^andyc, he hit the crossbar in the 86th minute in that game. I know it didn't, but if that shot goes in....

But how many f*cking near misses have TFC had??? I really don't want to tally the number of posts, crossbars, great saves, near misses or even penalties missed that we've witnessed. I think that I would have to puke and being a Leeds fan believe me I've been disappointed more than most...

As I said his skills were great to watch and he was clearly one of the best players on the Canadian team that and many other nights but we don't need anymore heartbreak nearly could woulda shoulda moments. We need either a fast clinical finisher or a defensive leader.

Not another talented midfielder that will get frustrated with our lack of finishing.

:noidea:

[billyfly]

Still waiting for any of this to be confirmed....

[Shakes McQueen]

The sad truth is, 1 good season in MLS and JDG is back in Europe. Contracts mean nothing these days.

That's certainly possible, but the reality is you could say that of any of our players - if they really break out, they will be gone to Europe before we know it.

Hard to say if JDG would leave again or not, though, since he isn't getting any younger - and if this rumour is true, he must not be garnering a ton of attention right now. And if he gets settled in, likes the money he's getting, living at home, etc. - maybe he won't be as interested in taking a short term offer in Europe again, knowing that he's getting towards the end of his career.

I suspect if he signs a multi-year deal with TFC, he will likely consider it his "last big contract" - sort of like the one DeRo signed.

- Scott

[Bobo]

:picard: He was terrible! But then again, so was everyone else excet DeRo and Frei!!

What was Gerba supposed to do, take the ball from mid, dribble the team and score? I don't fault Gerba at all for the start he's had. Coincidence that Gerba's best has been shown when making plays with DeRo? I blame TFC's creative failures but most of all, Cummins.

As for JDG, might as well leave him unemployed at this point. Too little too late I fear. He should have signed when the playoffs were well attainable.

[WHITEY]

What was Gerba supposed to do, take the ball from mid, dribble the team and score? I don't fault Gerba at all for the start he's had. Coincidence that Gerba's best has been shown when making plays with DeRo? I blame TFC's creative failures but most of all, Cummins.

Cummins is useless and it is showing game by game. It is obvious he can't adjust tactics in-game because it seems as though he as a playbook of one tactic that being kick and run. And his utilization of his player personel is a joke.

[Cashcleaner]

I dont' get the hype surrounding De Guzman. Watching him in the Gold Cup he did not look good at all. Especially in our final game against Honduras. He made so many mistakes on the field it was painful to watch. Hopefully he's better than that normally.

I kinda agree to a point. De Guzman is not the sort of player I'd like to see us make an effort to sign, but considering that without grass or a large enough stadium to offset the costs, I think our list of DP candidates is fairly small right now. He's definitely not the "World XI" player guys like Paul talked about in the first and second season. With the prospect of JDG coming here, I'm both glad to see some changes being made, but also kinda disappointed in that we're still not thinking big enough as a club.

[K1nG]

Him coming at this point in the season is pointless. He should have come when he could have actually made a difference.

[Fort York Redcoat]

Him coming at this point in the season is pointless. He should have come when he could have actually made a difference.

Yes if we can sign him now we should make him wait till next year to play for the hottest team in the league!:rolleyes:

I feel the frustration watching the same team you all are but to let an opportunity like this pass by would be a mistake IMO.

Who would you prefer?

[Chevy]

Sign him, then loan him out after the season to a Euro Club.

[Fort York Redcoat]

^That works with Becks but not with lesser known talent. Most euro clubs in the mix would choose all or nothing.

[kaos197O]

Sign him, then loan him out after the season to a Euro Club.

Yeah so he can come back injured and miss our entire next season. :rolleyes:

[Shakes McQueen]

Him coming at this point in the season is pointless. He should have come when he could have actually made a difference.

How is it ever pointless to bring in a better player? For all we know right now, he could be integral in helping us get a win or two, to limp into the post-season. We have no idea.

- Scott

[Bobo]

Cummins is useless and it is showing game by game. It is obvious he can't adjust tactics in-game because it seems as though he as a playbook of one tactic that being kick and run. And his utilization of his player personel is a joke.

Adjust tactics? He doesn't begin with tactics. Like with Carver, we're second best tactically EVERY SINGLE GAME....against MLS coaches. Kind of puts things in perspective.

[Roogsy]

How is it ever pointless to bring in a better player? For all we know right now, he could be integral in helping us get a win or two, to limp into the post-season. We have no idea.

- Scott

When we have a 1 in 10 chance to make the playoffs? Of course it's pointless Scott! We're not bringing in Pele here...he is no saviour and there is no saving our playoffs chances with one player. We are almost mathematically eliminated, we literally need 4 wins in 6 games to make it...and bringing in someone where we have to dump a senior player to make room will only hurt this team in the long run, especially since JDG will likely have an "out clause" to make sure if a European team comes along, he can bolt. We will have let go (presumably pushed) a senior player, other players who may sign with us will think twice about signing with us and in the meantime, we may have only signed JDG for a handful of games. What a debacle.

Make a push without JDG and if we don't make it, reset for next year and make the moves BEFORE THE SEASON, not during. Gawd...2 off-seasons now I have been screaming for Mo to make the necessary moves during the offseason instead of tinkering with this team in the middle of the campaign and now 2 seasons I have realized we have gone into the season half-prepared.

This team is killing me.

[Shakes McQueen]

When we have a 1 in 10 chance to make the playoffs? Of course it's pointless Scott! We're not bringing in Pele here...he is no saviour and there is no saving our playoffs chances with one player. We are almost mathematically eliminated, we literally need 4 wins in 6 games to make it...and bringing in someone where we have to dump a senior player to make room will only hurt this team in the long run, especially since JDG will likely have an "out clause" to make sure if a European team comes along, he can bolt. We will have let go (presumably pushed) a senior player, other players who may sign with us will think twice about signing with us and in the meantime, we may have only signed JDG for a handful of games. What a debacle.

Make a push without JDG and if we don't make it, reset for next year and make the moves BEFORE THE SEASON, not during. Gawd...2 off-seasons now I have been screaming for Mo to make the necessary moves during the offseason instead of tinkering with this team in the middle of the campaign and now 2 seasons I have realized we have gone into the season half-prepared.

This team is killing me.

If dumping a senior player to make room for JDG will "hurt us in the long run", then it's pointless to bring in JDG, regardless of where in the season we are. Of course, I don't believe that.

And you're also making the assumption that he would have a player-directed out clause at the end of this season. Do you not think it's unlikely the team would sign him, if he seriously had the ability to just walk after a handful of games?

If JDG commits to this team for at least one full season, then I absolutely support bringing him in now, and I don't care if we have to dump some deadbeat salary to do it. Why would that hurt our ability to sign players? It's a reality of salary capped North American sports leagues.

What do we have to lose right now? Disrupting our obviously amazing team chemistry? Hurting our playoff chances?

- Scott

[Roogsy]

If dumping a senior player to make room for JDG will "hurt us in the long run", then it's pointless to bring in JDG, regardless of where in the season we are. Of course, I don't believe that.

When there is a reasonable chance to make the playoffs, then this works. Moves like dumping Ricketts at the halfway point of the season makes sense if you are bringing in someone who can make a difference. We didn't do it then, and now we are looking to do it when that big signing doesn't have a snowball's chance in hell to make a difference?


And you're also making the assumption that he would have a player-directed out clause at the end of this season. Do you not think it's unlikely the team would sign him, if he seriously had the ability to just walk after a handful of games?

How likely do you think it is that JDG would even think of signing without that clause? If a player like Gerba has one...and he isn't anywhere near the calibre of player that JDG is...how likely do you think is that Julian wouldn't ensure it's in there as well?


If JDG commits to this team for at least one full season, then I absolutely support bringing him in now, and I don't care if we have to dump some deadbeat salary to do it. Why would that hurt our ability to sign players? It's a reality of salary capped North American sports leagues.

A hail mary effort that in the end has consequences down the road where decent, inexpensive players pass on us because they aren't sure about the loyalty this team will show them in crunch time will make sure we continue to have problems signing players in the future. That isn't a concern for you?


What do we have to lose right now? Disrupting our obviously amazing team chemistry? Hurting our playoff chances?

If you only knew how this sounds so much like the rationale of Leaf fans when our GM was selling out our future for last-ditch efforts to secure that final playoff spot only to make sure we'd miss out on the next 4 seasons. I will not accept that again. Around here we have to start looking at this team rationally. We suck. We can't score. What was at some point vaunted as a league-best midfield is completely invisible and can't hold possession and our defenders panic. Dumping Robbo or Dichio to make room for JDG signing for us so that we can watch the team struggle to fit him in the final 4 or 5 games this season and not make the playoffs and in the meantime the team has secured a reputation as heartless and a crappy place to sign...that is too high a price to pay for a desperation move that barely has a chance to work.

[Shakes McQueen]

How likely do you think it is that JDG would even think of signing without that clause? If a player like Gerba has one...and he isn't anywhere near the calibre of player that JDG is...how likely do you think is that Julian wouldn't ensure it's in there as well?

I suspect his deal probably would have a clause. But I also suspect the team wouldn't sign him if that clause took effect after the balance of this season, and not the end of next season.


A hail mary effort that in the end has consequences down the road where decent, inexpensive players pass on us because they aren't sure about the loyalty this team will show them in crunch time will make sure we continue to have problems signing players in the future. That isn't a concern for you?

Again - loyalty doesn't enter into it, when you're operating under a salary cap. Players get moved all the time, and teams can't afford to keep unneeded players, out of loyalty to them - except for the odd special case (i.e. Dichio).

Plus, we don't even know who necessarily would be moved to make space for JDG, so how do you even know it would be players worthy of any loyalty from the club? Suppose Garcia is on the block? Or Barrett? Or Wynne? Do we owe those guys loyalty?


If you only knew how this sounds so much like the rationale of Leaf fans when our GM was selling out our future for last-ditch efforts to secure that final playoff spot only to make sure we'd miss out on the next 4 seasons. I will not accept that again. Around here we have to start looking at this team rationally. We suck. We can't score. What was at some point vaunted as a league-best midfield is completely invisible and can't hold possession and our defenders panic. Dumping Robbo or Dichio to make room for JDG signing for us so that we can watch the team struggle to fit him in the final 4 or 5 games this season and not make the playoffs and in the meantime the team has secured a reputation as heartless and a crappy place to sign...that is too high a price to pay for a desperation move that barely has a chance to work.

Again, you're operating under the ASSUMPTION that a) JDG's contract would have an out-clause after these last seven games, and that b) he would exercise that clause, if it did exist.

Why would dumping a player like Robbo ensure we suck for the next four years? How is selling a player like Robbo "selling out our future", when he's one of the oldest players on our team, and we have two young and promising potential replacements in Cronin and Sanyang?

Like I said - if JDG commits to stay for at least next season, in addition to these last few games, then I think it's a good move to make. If he insists on having the option to bolt after this season, then it probably isn't a good deal. Simple.

This isn't analogous to the Leafs at all. JFJ would have traded for a player like JDG, by offering all of the Leafs' draft picks and prospects, then signed him to a horrible $300 mlllion dollar 12 year deal. I'm not advocating that we do that - in fact, most of our most promising players, are among our lowest cap hits.

- Scott

[rocker]

We suck. We can't score.

Actually, TFC's problem isn't really scoring. Right now TFC has a per game goal scoring rate that puts them in 7th of 15 teams. That's about average. TFC has scored more per game than LA, Houston, Chivas and Seattle.

The problem is team play and defense.

[Roogsy]

First of all, I am tired of all our "promising players" argument. Do you know what happens to promising players? They get sold a-la Mo Edu. That by definition means we need solid, veteran role players.

But what do these possible role players have to look forward to when they are considering signing for Toronto FC? That if a young stud comes along looking for a mercenary contract in the final weeks of a season, that they will be tossed aside without a second thought.

To not recognize that Toronto is not a desireable location to begin with and then to add another layer of excuses for players not to come...you don't think that won't affect our ability to bring in quality players? Which means the only way we can actually bring them in is to overpay...and in a salary cap environment, that is a roster killer.

I am not trying to be analogous to the Leafs organization, I was referring to the general attitude of Leaf fans and organization of being all to willing to sacrifice the future for that coveted final playoff spot, regardless of the mitigating factors that may or may not make it palatable.

I never said dumping Robbo would ensure we suck for the next 4 years. Please don't attribute statements to me I did not make. I said dumping Robbo would earn the team a reputation making it harder to sign good players. Whether or not we suck falls upon the management overcoming these obstacles and whether the players we are able to sign can play well together. But if you don't think that adding more obstacles to our team's success won't affect our chances of becoming a contender, then I can't really provide more evidence than our current condition as a team. If that gives you hope for the future, you are a more hopeful man than I.

[Roogsy]

Actually, TFC's problem isn't really scoring. Right now TFC has a per game goal scoring rate that puts them in 7th of 15 teams. That's about average. TFC has scored more per game than LA, Houston, Chivas and Seattle.

The problem is team play and defense.

Most of those goals came from the first half of the season. I repeat my statement that this team can't score. How many goals have we had in the last 10 games vs the rest of the league?

We can't score is a direct statement as to this team's intended style of play. Chivas for example has less goals than we do, but their intended style of play is defensive. They choose to play that way. They are making it a goal to have low-scoring games. We actually TRY to score goals and can't. We don't have that same dedication to a defensive game. If that is our goal...then that is a massive fail as well since we are 11th in the league in that regard. (Average that out and you get no playoffs as well by the way. Sort of a rough way to guesstimate if a team can make the playoffs. For example, Chivas is 2nd last in goals scored, but is 5th in goals against, LA is 12th in goals scored but is 2nd in goals against. View that compared to the Pink Cows who are last in both categories.)

If we're going to be crap on defence, then make it a purpose to get more goals. If we're not going to score goals, then make it our intention to play a solid defensive game.

As it stands, we suck at both. And that is no recipe for a winner. If anything I guess it demonstrates the lack of direction this team has. We have no identity. And that falls on coaching and on management. End of story.

[Beach_Red]

Actually, TFC's problem isn't really scoring. Right now TFC has a per game goal scoring rate that puts them in 7th of 15 teams. That's about average. TFC has scored more per game than LA, Houston, Chivas and Seattle.

The problem is team play and defense.


No, I don't think you can break it down like that. Per game average is really meaningless. Look at the last two games where even one goal would have made a huge difference.

TFC's problem is scoring when it matters.

[Beach_Red]

First of all, I am tired of all our "promising players" argument. Do you know what happens to promising players? They get sold a-la Mo Edu. That by definition means we need solid, veteran role players.


If we're talking abut JDG that could be exactly what we're (maybe) getting.

If there was a deal for him in Europe he'd take it right now. His agent has been walking around for what, a month, with TFC's offer looking for a better one and now it looks like he couldn't get one. Why will there be one next year?

This looks like a good gamble to take.

[UltraSuperMegaMo]

According to Dobson, JDG has is in the city:

http://www.sportsnet.ca/soccer/blogs/2009/09/07/dobson_de_guzman/

[FluSH]

According to Dobson, JDG has is in the city:

http://www.sportsnet.ca/soccer/blogs/2009/09/07/dobson_de_guzman/

The way that I see it... we should have been prepared to take on Colorado with Conor Casey regardless of his "status" with the USMNT....

I think the only lies are the ones made to ourselves...

[Roogsy]

The way that I see it... we should have been prepared to take on Colorado with Conor Casey regardless of his "status" with the USMNT....

I think the only lies are the ones made to ourselves...

Exactly.

We obviously had trouble with Cummings as well. Was he on international duty? No. Nigel Reed made a good point. He said Toronto made an average team like Colorado look good. That's on us...not Casey fooling us into thinking he was in town. And once Casey was known to be playing...where was our adjustment? There was none. That's management. And the team coming out flat and playing with no intensity? That had nothing to do with Casey. They are making Casey to sound like the 2nd coming of Pele. The man missed a penalty and we couldn't get our act in gear. Then we left him WIDE OPEN in the box to take a free header at goal. That's on us.

Can JDG solve these problems? No. So what is his signing going to do except disrupt this team even further? I dont' see any good in this. It's too little too late. We needed him in July.

[Dirk Diggler]

No, I don't think you can break it down like that. Per game average is really meaningless. Look at the last two games where even one goal would have made a huge difference.

TFC's problem is scoring when it matters.

Exactly. Saying stuff like "TFC is 7th in the league in so and so category" is absolutely meaningless. Reminds me of all the people who kept on bashing John Molinaro for suggesting that we are poor on the road.

[Shakes McQueen]

First of all, I am tired of all our "promising players" argument. Do you know what happens to promising players? They get sold a-la Mo Edu. That by definition means we need solid, veteran role players.

Yes, we do. But we need solid veteran players that will perform. I'm not advocating dumping our good veteran players overboard - I'm advocating getting rid of guys who aren't doing the job. Keeping a player, solely because you know he won't leave you for greener pastures, is not in and of itself a good reason to hang on to a player that isn't doing the job we need them to do - and we have a lot of "veteran" players that aren't playing well enough to get us where we want to be.

And yes, promising players will likely eventually leave. But that doesn't necessarily mean in a year, or even two. The trick is to take advantage of those good young players while we still have them.


But what do these possible role players have to look forward to when they are considering signing for Toronto FC? That if a young stud comes along looking for a mercenary contract in the final weeks of a season, that they will be tossed aside without a second thought.

If they aren't doing their job well enough? Sure. Every player should be operating under that pressure. No professional athlete should ever be able to assume their position on a team is safe - particularly if they aren't getting the job done.

And if they are getting the job done, chances are they won't be sent packing, right?


To not recognize that Toronto is not a desireable location to begin with and then to add another layer of excuses for players not to come...you don't think that won't affect our ability to bring in quality players? Which means the only way we can actually bring them in is to overpay...and in a salary cap environment, that is a roster killer.

This is a really weird argument. So... we should show more loyalty to our players (even the ones who aren't performing), because Toronto is a shitty place to play, and we need to show players that we will hang on to them, hence giving them a reason to sign here?


I never said dumping Robbo would ensure we suck for the next 4 years. Please don't attribute statements to me I did not make. I said dumping Robbo would earn the team a reputation making it harder to sign good players. Whether or not we suck falls upon the management overcoming these obstacles and whether the players we are able to sign can play well together. But if you don't think that adding more obstacles to our team's success won't affect our chances of becoming a contender, then I can't really provide more evidence than our current condition as a team. If that gives you hope for the future, you are a more hopeful man than I.

And I still say that trading away players that aren't performing, veteran or not, is part of the business of pro sports in North America. That doesn't necessarily have to mean Robbo - it could mean any one of the stiffs we have on our bench right now, as I have said repeatedly.

- Scott

[FluSH]

I felt that Dobson's "Not looking good" article was dead on about JDG:


De Guzman is a solid player, one of Canada's best, but is investing this much in a defensive midfielder a wise move for a team which has never been able to score enough goals? Three games and counting without one last time I checked. At a critical time of the season no less.


Let's hope all of our doubts are wrong...

[werewolf]

I felt that Dobson's "Not looking good" article was dead on about JDG:

Let's hope all of our doubts are wrong...

When it comes to JDG, I think it could be a similar case to Essien with Ghana. He gets moved to a more offensive role, despite being more of a defensive player, because he has so much more skill in the necessary categories.

[Shakes McQueen]

I felt that Dobson's "Not looking good" article was dead on about JDG:

Let's hope all of our doubts are wrong...

I think the argument of "could this money be better spent on an offensive weapon?" is a valid one, but that argument is as valid three months ago as it is today, this late in the season.

I personally think we actually have some decent offensive threats, but that our passing is so pathetic, they can't produce. Gerba is one such player suffering from this problem, in my opinion. I also think JDG has been effective as an attacking midfielder for the CMNT, and hence, could also provide us some offensive punch anyway.

- Scott

[FluSH]

When it comes to JDG, I think it could be a similar case to Essien with Ghana. He gets moved to a more offensive role, despite being more of a defensive player, because he has so much more skill in the necessary categories.

One of the things that worried me after the CLR game was that noone was talking to each other out there on the pitch... noone... there was no team cohesion...

We need someone that is vocal... from everything that I've read... JDG is not the vocal leader on the pitch...

We looked like a headless chicken running around with no direction...

[FluSH]

I think the argument of "could this money be better spent on an offensive weapon?" is a valid one, but that argument is as valid three months ago as it is today, this late in the season.

I personally think we actually have some decent offensive threats, but that our passing is so pathetic, they can't produce. Gerba is one such player suffering from this problem, in my opinion. I also think JDG has been effective as an attacking midfielder for the CMNT, and hence, could also provide us some offensive punch anyway.

- Scott

I think the CMNT should have made the WCQ's... was JDG effective enough there? I don't know what to say... I saw the Honduras game and the Jamaica game live... and we know how those two games went...

[Shakes McQueen]

I think the CMNT should have made the WCQ's... was JDG effective enough there? I don't know what to say... I saw the Honduras game and the Jamaica game live... and we know how those two games went...

He's only one guy though. DeRo is a great player too, but that hasn't allowed him to carry some of the stiffs on our team to victory every week.

I personally though Julian was fantastic in the Jamaica WCQ game. Don't remember the Honduras match as well.

- Scott

[Roogsy]

And I still say that trading away players that aren't performing, veteran or not, is part of the business of pro sports in North America. That doesn't necessarily have to mean Robbo - it could mean any one of the stiffs we have on our bench right now, as I have said repeatedly.

At the end of the season? Half way through the season you can say it's business and a team seeing a need. Now it just looks desperation and a team selling out on their own. And if it had a chance to work...then I might agree. But when you're doing it as a last ditch effort that will likely not produce any gains, you haven't reached your objective AND you've pissed off senior players...you're ended up worse off than before. Especially when the team has extended contacts for the likes of Barrett (DEFINITELY not producing) and reportedly Vitti as well (as much as I like him, definitely has not produced either).

You sell out on a player like Robbo or Dichio for a boneheaded crapshoot move and how do you think the rest of the senior players on the team will feel going forward let alone any future players we'd want to bring in?

[Rudi]

I think the CMNT should have made the WCQ's... was JDG effective enough there? I don't know what to say... I saw the Honduras game and the Jamaica game live... and we know how those two games went...
JDG was by far and away the best player on the pitch in the Jamaica game. He scored one, hit the crossbar on another shot, and bossed the midfield.

Honduras was able to contain JDG, but they are far better than Jamaica, and no one else on Canada stepped up to take the pressure off De Guzman.

MLS teams aren't as good as either Jamaica or Honduras, so the point is really moot.

[H Bomb]

:lol::rofl:

there was a time where this board was where you went for intelligent worthwhile conversations about TFC. It's not that place anymore.

[Roogsy]

Thanks for the comments form the peanut gallery. Since there is no conversation here worthwhile of your superior intelligence, perhaps you will see your way out and go to Big Soccer, perhaps more suited to your liking?

[H Bomb]

Im already there...right now as i type...see what I'm saying. Enjoy this guys....you've made it...so hold on tight to it, be proud of it...its who you are...

[Shakes McQueen]

At the end of the season? Half way through the season you can say it's business and a team seeing a need. Now it just looks desperation and a team selling out on their own. And if it had a chance to work...then I might agree. But when you're doing it as a last ditch effort that will likely not produce any gains, you haven't reached your objective AND you've pissed off senior players...you're ended up worse off than before. Especially when the team has extended contacts for the likes of Barrett (DEFINITELY not producing) and reportedly Vitti as well (as much as I like him, definitely has not produced either).

You sell out on a player like Robbo or Dichio for a boneheaded crapshoot move and how do you think the rest of the senior players on the team will feel going forward let alone any future players we'd want to bring in?

Why do you keep mentioning Robbo and Dichio? I don't support moving Dichio for anyone, and would be quite upset if Dichio did get moved a month or two before he likely retires. I mentioned a few posts ago that I consider Dichio to be one of those special, rare "exceptions" teams should make when it comes to loyalty.

Robbo? I know you like him, but I personally wouldn't lose any sleep moving him for a player like JDG. However, I think there are other players I would move first.

If TFC have a window of opportunity to sign JDG, and keep him here for at least a year, then I would advise that they take it. It sounds like they might have that window right now, and while it's not the most helpful time of the season to bring him in, it will still presumably give us a a better team next season. And perhaps even a way, way outside shot at salvaging this season.

I really don't think you and I are that far off in our opinions on this. I don't support signing JDG, if he's just some last ditch rental for this season, and requires us to sell off a couple of quality players in the process. I do support signing him, if his contract commits him to us for at least next season, if not longer. If that's the case, then it makes sense to me, to take advantage of this rumoured window of opportunity.

- Scott

[Roogsy]

If you support this move, then you support Dichio as the most obvious answer. That's why I bring him up. And it may explain the Dichio saga of the past few weeks.

This point is pretty moot though. If they are signing JDG, then someobody is gone we just dont know who yet. And JDG will come in and in my opinion not influence much at all. We will miss the playoffs and we will back at square one. I just don't think JDG would be willing to sign without some assurance he'd be able to leave as soon as a team from Europe comes calling. That is where he wants to play and I doubt he's willing to give up a year in his prime here. He wasn't before, he isn't now.

[Keyman]

Why do we keep fooling ourselves? Everytime the club is on the cusp of signing another player, optimism seems to be ubiquitous. It almost as if we're all stuck in a mindset that says we're always one more player away. We're not. Our backline can't contain anyone, even with the addition of Serioux and the emergence of Attakora, we're still far too unorganized, slow, and frankly, untalented at the back. Our midfield can't seem to do anything well with consistency. De Rosario always seems to be attempting to carry the team on his back, and whether it's out of necessity or not, it's not working. Amado Guevara is far from a well-rounded player. Pablo Vitti is only getting a free ride because he's from South America, he's underperformed all season. Chad Barrett, well, I don't feel I need to elaborate. Carl Robinson has begun his steady decline as a player, his tackling, marking and distribution is now mediocre. And on the flanks, well, the cupboards are bare. Up front, it's tough to really blame players like Ali Gerba. He has no service whatsoever. But I still cannot confidently say that Gerba is a reliable striker. Dichio, I'm not even going to start, I can't fathom his legendary status among the TFC faithful. If we make the playoffs it'll be as a result of pure luck, and nothing else. The advent of Julian De Guzman will just create another smokescreen, and overshadow the truth. Julian should not be looked at as a solution, he's not the final piece to the puzzle, in fact, I feel as though he should be looked at as a one of the first pieces in a brand new puzzle.

[Roogsy]

I sort of agree.

JDG is not the answer. His skills would be wasted on a team that has no direction.

[wzhxvy]

I would have no issue if DD was "released" for JDG. But that only means he is no longer playing (and the team announces that Sept 12 is his last game), they they also announce that he has been offered and accepted a job for the team. I would be OK with that and I think DD would be.

My issue is that I dont think this is what is being contemplated...they wanted to release him and have his ass on the street. That is unacceptable, for JDG or anyone they bring in.

[Roogsy]

If they release DD for JDG, then they'd better honour him properly.

Whatever DD asks (within reason) they owe it to him.

If they are willing to drop a mint on a hail mary with JDG, they should be able to afford giving DD the kind of position and control within the Academy that I think he deserves.

[Beach_Red]

^ There are a lot of assumptions here about what everyone involves wants - and what other offers are really on the table.

If this was just between the team and the player it would likely work out fine, but there are a lot of other factors.

[Roogsy]

Nobody but the parties involved know the details, that is true.

But what we have inferred is that they have asked Danny to fall on his sword.

This from a group of people that have done nothing to earn that devotion, instead quite the opposite.

[Kaz]

the answer is simple, get new staff not players, Serioux, Attakora, DeRo, Guevera, and Cronin, are all decent players, and should be having a much better effect, the fact that they aren't is a result of coaching staff. if you add White, Gerba, and the team should be in a play off spot. The coaching staff is where the sword should be falling.

JDG coming here is a bad thing until that is changed.

[DangerRed]

Haven't there been stat analyses done that showed a team with a DP historically doesn't perform markedly better than a team without one? I mean don't get me wrong, I want JDG to come here, but I don't see him as The Chosen One who will save our season and drag us into the playoffs.

Someone above me made a good point -- Danny being released right now would be fine. Yes, it's sad, but if they offered him an Academy position or a coaching spot of some sort.

I think JDG will help us next season if we secure him for all of it, but we're still missing the playoffs this year unless everything the team has been doing changes (obviously with the exception of Stefan Frei's great goalkeeping).

[TFCREDNWHITE]

They can't score because the whole team is basically SHIT! they piss me off so much!!

[Oblio2]

JDG is not the answer to our prayers. If he was really was, do you not think he'd be signing in Europe....I didn't see the offers flowing in. He's NOT a DP player...No way. I watched the CMNT play and didn't rate him as "Special". Dont get me wrong, I'd welcome him but on crazy money...no way.
Again, Id welcome him but I think if you think he's going to come here and be "The Answer"...you are dead wrong and I am sure there will be a spot in his contract that allows him to bolt as soon as a Euro team offers him a deal.

[Oldtimer]

JDG is not the answer to our prayers. If he was really was, do you not think he'd be signing in Europe....

He's been blackballed in Europe because of speaking out about unpaid wages. That is the sad reality...

[Beach_Red]

Nobody but the parties involved know the details, that is true.

But what we have inferred is that they have asked Danny to fall on his sword.

This from a group of people that have done nothing to earn that devotion, instead quite the opposite.

I thought this started when a blog post suggested that other teams were interested in hiring Dichio? That sounded to me like an agent trying to get a better deal than what was offered. There was nothing in the post at all about hat the offer from TFC was.

It's interesting because TFC have been used by many players (among them JDG) as negotiating tools with other teams. I'm sure the management of TFC are fine with the tactics, it's all business and they've seen them all before.

[jloome]

He's been blackballed in Europe because of speaking out about unpaid wages. That is the sad reality...

He has offers on the table from at least two clubs, including his old home, Hannover 96. In fact, the very fact that DeGuzman left Hannover to increase his professional challenges may be why the possibility of him coming back here is reconsiderable, if that's also where the best Euro offer is coming from (and well short of what TFC would give him as a DP).

Any contract discussion will be around release, bonus discussions etc., if the money discussed so far is even remotely accurate.

[Shaughno]

So is there any truth or facts on this? I haven't kept up with the news all weekend. :lol:

[SilverSamurai]

So is there any truth or facts on this? I haven't kept up with the news all weekend. :lol:
Seems he's in TO, so I guess we should hear something soon...

[Ageroo]

So is there any truth or facts on this? I haven't kept up with the news all weekend. :lol:

Well....according to Dobson.....his plane landed in Toronto on Sunday. So he is in the city....and I assume it is because of the news.

[SilverSamurai]

Well....according to Dobson.....his plane landed in Toronto on Sunday. So he is in the city....and I assume it is because of the news.
That or he forgot a pair of shoes from the last time he was here. If he doesn't sign then that's what my excuse as to why he's here. :rolleyes:

[Nuvinho]

You figure that IF there is news it will be either today or tomorrow. All offices were closed yesterday, and you know how long the MLS office takes to do stuff....haha!!!

[Ageroo]

That or he forgot a pair of shoes from the last time he was here. If he doesn't sign then that's what my excuse as to why he's here. :rolleyes:

I think he flies home to get his hair braided for weekdays......and then he flies back when he goes Afro....because he can just do that himself. :D

[Chevy]

^^ Ahh...the slippery slope that is the discussion boards. :)

[Ageroo]

^^ Ahh...the slippery slope that is the discussion boards. :)

ha ha......sometimes hair is a big decision.....:rolleyes:

[ManUtd4ever]

So this rollercoaster of a negotiation is actually going to materialize? JDG just might be the perfect tonic to turn the season around for TFC...

[joel]

If he can be the key to link up play between the D and strikers, I'm all for it.

[Ageroo]

So this rollercoaster of a negotiation is actually going to materialize? JDG just might be the perfect tonic to turn the season around for TFC...

For tonic to be any good it has to be mixed with the right Gin.......Hopefully we have the right Gin.

[SilverSamurai]

If he can be the key to link up play between the D and strikers, I'm all for it.
That's his role for the CMNT. At Deportivo he played a DM role.

[Ageroo]

That's his role for the CMNT. At Deportivo he played a DM role.


In my opionion he can do it all....but I am a JDG fan. So you can take it or leave it. I think this is an element of what has been missing at TFC.....Robbo is a strong defender and tackler, but lacks the passing ability. Sanyang is young and a good passer and a strong tackler. In JDG I feel you are getting a superior version of the 2 of them combined X 100.

[FluSH]

JDG was by far and away the best player on the pitch in the Jamaica game. He scored one, hit the crossbar on another shot, and bossed the midfield.

Honduras was able to contain JDG, but they are far better than Jamaica, and no one else on Canada stepped up to take the pressure off De Guzman.

MLS teams aren't as good as either Jamaica or Honduras, so the point is really moot.

Alright... I will give you the Jamaica game... However the CMNT is also (on paper) better than TFC... I would argue... so yeah Jamaica and Honduras are better than MLS teams, but so was the team that JDG was playing in for the CMNT.

Listen, JDG is talented... I am not argueing that... is it the right talent for our team? I do hope so...

[Manutd #1]

I think he will help alot, whether you agree with the money he is going to get or not. Right now our defence does not link up with our strikers at ALL, Deguzman has shown on the world stage that he is very good at holding the ball up and distributing it, him and Dero will link up so good you will see

[TOBOR !]

It'll be interesting to see how this turns out. What with Cummins' tactical limits and the quality of the play in the league. JDG may regret this. Hopefully we can ship him off on a loan deal somewhere until next season, once the playoffs start, so he can keep his edge.

[TFC OZZ]

I'm torn.

Part of me is ecstatic that we could have JDG on our roster, while the other part is slapping my forehead saying "WE NEED A STRIKER NOT ANOTHER MIDFIELDER"...

[Ageroo]

I'm torn.

Part of me is ecstatic that we could have JDG on our roster, while the other part is slapping my forehead saying "WE NEED A STRIKER NOT ANOTHER MIDFIELDER"...

Maybe we just need someone who can properly service the strikers........;)

[TFC OZZ]

Our strikers have been given more than enough opportunities to score.

-----------------Frei--------------------
Wynne--Attakora--Serioux----Brennan
------Cronin--------------Robbo--------
-----------JDG----Guevera-------------
------------De Rosario-------------------
--------------------Gerba-------------

Christmas tree formation.

This formation's a little crowded, but Sanyang and Gomez can be interchanged with any of the backs. I think De Ro should be an out and out stirker with Gerba, because he's the only guy on the team that you can actually count on to score when given the chance.

[FluSH]

believe it or not... I would rather have Barrett instead of Gerba in there...

[Ageroo]

believe it or not... I would rather have Barrett instead of Gerba in there...

Cue the chaos...in 5, 4, 3, .........:D

[TOBOR !]

Hey, not really on topic, but Barrett was shit against Colorado, eh ? Didn't manage to win a single ball sent to him by Frei - couldn't adjust his position - the defender got everything... got to thinking of that because of this talk for needing a striker over a MF. But not just a striker, a quality striker that can play in our system (ha ha ha "our system" ha ha ha)... where was I ?

[Nazzer]

De Guzman will be useless to the team as long as Cummins as defence that are too unimaginative to do anything but boot the ball upfield.... over the midfielders heads.

[AL-MO]

believe it or not... I would rather have Barrett instead of Gerba in there...

I thought you told me because of your life insurance plan you could no longer smoke. Has something changed?

:stogey: :p

[Ageroo]

believe it or not... I would rather have Barrett instead of Gerba in there...

While Barrett does work his tail off he has not been putting the ball in the net....why, I am not sure. Gerba in my opinion has not been given proper opportunity to prove himself as the main striker...why again, I don't know. What I do know, and what everyone knows is that he scores for Canada.

If JDG comes in.....I believe this is the perfect situation to start him as the main striker. You have players in Brennan, Serioux, JDG & DeRo who know how to utilize him and where he likes the ball, etc....

[AL-MO]

As trane said in his thread, Barrett is no longer a viable option @ striker.

He needs to be transitioned to play in the midfield (wing). Continually putting him up front is not helping this process.

[SilverSamurai]

Has he been announced yet?
I'm getting impatient!

[backbeat]

i've been away for the past 10 days and am shocked to see the JDG option coming back again.

if it's really true i would take him in a flash - trade Amado for a striker (if at all possible but maybe that's a pipe dream at his age and focus on the world cup) and move on - also i would demand in the contract that JDG stays with no options out for all of 2010 otherwise i don't see the point.

[Ageroo]

i've been away for the past 10 days and am shocked to see the JDG option coming back again.

if it's really true i would take him in a flash - trade Amado for a striker (if at all possible but maybe that's a pipe dream at his age and focus on the world cup) and move on - also i would demand in the contract that JDG stays with no options out for all of 2010 other wise i don't see the point.

You missed a lot....:) He is back in Toronto...so we shall see what develops since everyone is talking about it again.

[jloome]

Im already there...right now as i type...see what I'm saying. Enjoy this guys....you've made it...so hold on tight to it, be proud of it...its who you are...

I believe you meant "it's", genius.

[Pigfynn]

i've been away for the past 10 days and am shocked to see the JDG option coming back again.

if it's really true i would take him in a flash - trade Amado for a striker (if at all possible but maybe that's a pipe dream at his age and focus on the world cup) and move on - also i would demand in the contract that JDG stays with no options out for all of 2010 otherwise i don't see the point.

This I am 100% in favour of, but who could we get?

[Shaughno]

Unfortunately I doubt Guevara would command much on the open market anymore...

[FluSH]

While Barrett does work his tail off he has not been putting the ball in the net....why, I am not sure. Gerba in my opinion has not been given proper opportunity to prove himself as the main striker...why again, I don't know. What I do know, and what everyone knows is that he scores for Canada.

If JDG comes in.....I believe this is the perfect situation to start him as the main striker. You have players in Brennan, Serioux, JDG & DeRo who know how to utilize him and where he likes the ball, etc....

Maybe Gerba can score against little Concacaf teams like El Salvador, Honduras, Guatemala etc... you know teams he can muscle his way with... but in the MLS the size is much bigger and at times faster...

I would take Barrett over Gerba...

[FluSH]

Unfortunately I doubt Guevara would command much on the open market anymore...

I agree...he'll probably go back to Honduras to retire... they still love him over there and after scoring a goal in the WCQ's his ultimate desire wold be to see Honduras through in the WC....

[Roogsy]

Unfortunately I doubt Guevara would command much on the open market anymore...

That is unfortunate. I mean, look at him for his national team. Totally dedicated. I am wondering if he is just going through the motions here at Toronto FC at this point. He has the ability, I am just not sure about the desire. Because as it shows with his national team, when he wants to play, he is still a dominant player.

[Shaughno]

Maybe Gerba can score against little Concacaf teams like El Salvador, Honduras, Guatemala etc... you know teams he can muscle way with... but in the MLS the size is much bigger and at times faster...

I would take Barrett over Gerba...


In the current system being used by TFC, yes I would agree. If the system actually caters towards the strikeforce we have, Gerba is definitely a much better option. Problem being we're forcing him to run around like a chicken with his head cutoff trying to track down long balls. Let Gerba batter the backline. Put the ball to his feet or chest and let him work. Unfortunately, I think I've only seen TFC do that with Gerba... once.

[Roogsy]

In the current system being used by TFC, yes I would agree. If the system actually caters towards the strikeforce we have, Gerba is definitely a much better option. Problem being we're forcing him to run around like a chicken with his head cutoff trying to track down long balls. Let Gerba batter the backline. Put the ball to his feet or chest and let him work. Unfortunately, I think I've only seen TFC do that with Gerba... once.

I totally agree.

[Pachuco]

Still waiting for the news of a trade. let's go Mo, you have a chance to redeem yourself.

[Shaughno]

I agree...he'll probably go back to Honduras to retire... they still love him over there and after scoring a goal in the WCQ's his ultimate desire wold be to see Honduras through in the WC....

I agree.


That is unfortunate. I mean, look at him for his national team. Totally dedicated. I am wondering if he is just going through the motions here at Toronto FC at this point. He has the ability, I am just not sure about the desire. Because as it shows with his national team, when he wants to play, he is still a dominant player.

Yeah... unfortunately I think this is his payday. It allows him to stay competitive and still compete with Honduras. He's never really looked happy in the MLS though, even back in his MVP days...

[FluSH]

That is unfortunate. I mean, look at him for his national team. Totally dedicated. I am wondering if he is just going through the motions here at Toronto FC at this point. He has the ability, I am just not sure about the desire. Because as it shows with his national team, when he wants to play, he is still a dominant player.

Well,

If the team has a locker room problem and they aren't gelling together... I don't think we can blame Amado for concentrating on the WC...

Amado is a leader over there in Honduras... but here with the communication problems... he's probably the guy they make fun of the most...

[Flipityflu]

Maybe we just need someone who can properly service the strikers........;)

and that is why i think this is a good move. our strikers get a lot of flak, and while some of it is justified, its my belief that the real problem has been the service provided, and not the strikers themselves. how many strikers have we had play for us in three years, with only one of them having any kind of success.

actually, it is my belief that we shouldn't use any strikers at all just for the reason that it will stop this unsuccessful long ball tactical joke we have become.

[Shaughno]

and that is why i think this is a good move. our strikers get a lot of flak, and while some of it is justified, its my belief that the real problem has been the service provided, and not the strikers themselves. how many strikers have we had play for us in three years, with only one of them having any kind of success.

actually, it is my belief that we shouldn't use any strikers at all just for the reason that it will stop this unsuccessful long ball tactical joke we have become.

But... we're Canadian, and we play in Canada. Therefore we must play longball. It's a fact, look it up. :D

[RedRum]

I don't get why everyone was willing to give Ricketts a full year in MLS yet Gerba is already being compared to Colin Samuel. He's coming off an injury, he needs a bit of time. A bit of service wouldn't hurt either...

[Shaughno]

I don't get why everyone was willing to give Ricketts a full year in MLS yet Gerba is already being compared to Colin Samuel. He's coming off an injury, he needs a bit of time. A bit of service wouldn't hurt either...

Gerba was/is successful with Canada because they adapt to play to his style. They work the ball up the pitch and then use Gerba (with his back to the net) to dish the ball or create a chance himself. It works, but TFC doesn't seem to realize he doesn't run very well... and never has.

[Rudi]

Maybe Gerba can score against little Concacaf teams like El Salvador, Honduras, Guatemala etc... you know teams he can muscle his way with... but in the MLS the size is much bigger and at times faster...

I would take Barrett over Gerba...
He's also scored against Jamaica and Mexico. And he owned that monster Wesley Charles in Canada's series versus St. Vincent, so the size thing is a non-starter.

Maybe if he wasn't forced to chase through balls, or receive passes at head height (for Dichio) while all alone up top, he'd have more goals this year. He has proven that he can score against any types of defenders while playing for Canada, as long as he receives passes to his feet and chest.

Those are his limitations, but his considerable strengths are not being utilized at TFC.

[Billy the kid]

Guevarra has scored more goals than all of our strikers, in spite of missing games for international duty. Why would we get rid of him over one of our many non producing strikers.

And might I add, yes there would be a market for him.

[Roogsy]

I don't get why everyone was willing to give Ricketts a full year in MLS yet Gerba is already being compared to Colin Samuel. He's coming off an injury, he needs a bit of time. A bit of service wouldn't hurt either...

Try ZERO service. It's hard to watch Gerba hoping a play will develop that he can take advantage of. He must be incredibly frustrated.

Let's be honest here, Gerba is a poacher. He doesn't create plays, he finishes them. But if a play is not created in the first place, can we really blame him for not finishing???

[Shaughno]

Try ZERO service. It's hard to watch Gerba hoping a play will develop that he can take advantage of. He must be incredibly frustrated.

Let's be honest here, Gerba is a poacher. He doesn't create plays, he finishes them. But if a play is not created in the first place, can we really blame him for not finishing???

See Ruud Van Nistelrooy. Last time I checked, he scored one goal... ONE FUCKING GOAL, outside the 18. Gerba is much the same style, but with a few long range bullets tossed in the mix.

[SilverSamurai]

He's also scored against Jamaica and Mexico. And he owned that monster Wesley Charles in Canada's series versus St. Vincent, so the size thing is a non-starter.

Maybe if he wasn't forced to chase through balls, or receive passes at head height (for Dichio) while all alone up top, he'd have more goals this year. He has proven that he can score against any types of defenders while playing for Canada, as long as he receives passes to his feet and chest.

Those are his limitations, but his considerable strengths are not being utilized at TFC.
You could say the same about Friend who is better then Gerba.

I find it strange how pretty much every other team would have 2 forwards, yet "Oh fearless leader" would not change tactics nor toss another striker up front.
Yet when he did, their was a goal! That goal was Gerba against Mexico.

Anyhoo, getting off track here...

I'd only trade Guevara because he's going to be gone next year for a good chunk of the season because of the WC.

[Shakes McQueen]

Try ZERO service. It's hard to watch Gerba hoping a play will develop that he can take advantage of. He must be incredibly frustrated.

Let's be honest here, Gerba is a poacher. He doesn't create plays, he finishes them. But if a play is not created in the first place, can we really blame him for not finishing???

Exactly. The game in Seattle was excruciating to watch after Gerba got subbed on, because they just kept hoofing it up the field, expecting Gerba to chase it down.

Cummins so clearly doesn't understand Gerba's strengths, it's painful. He doesn't start plays, and he isn't going to be sent into the box on blazing runs - he's good at collecting the ball in the box, and shoveling it into the net. That's it. Put it at his chest, or his feet, and he will find a way to put it in.

Instead, they fire in errant, high crosses, and send him after through balls all game. It's painful.

- Scott

[mastermixer]

and that is why i think this is a good move. our strikers get a lot of flak, and while some of it is justified, its my belief that the real problem has been the service provided, and not the strikers themselves. how many strikers have we had play for us in three years, with only one of them having any kind of success.

actually, it is my belief that we shouldn't use any strikers at all just for the reason that it will stop this unsuccessful long ball tactical joke we have become.

This may be part of it, but it also has to do with player positioning and TFC sorely lacks in that department. In most games and especially last game, I saw DeRo dribbling the ball near the 18 yard box and receiving no support and finally losing it to a Colorado defender. If a player is being doubled you have to make yourself available! Basic tactics!

[Shaughno]

This may be part of it, but it also has to do with player positioning and TFC sorely lacks in that department. In most games and especially last game, I saw DeRo dribbling the ball near the 18 yard box and receiving no support and finally losing it to a Colorado defender. If a player is being doubled you have to make yourself available! Basic tactics!


That's a major problem in the MLS, not just TFC. Movement off the ball is nearly non existant.

[FluSH]

This may be part of it, but it also has to do with player positioning and TFC sorely lacks in that department. In most games and especially last game, I saw DeRo dribbling the ball near the 18 yard box and receiving no support and finally losing it to a Colorado defender. If a player is being doubled you have to make yourself available! Basic tactics!

I remember this play... had I been DeRo I would have been like WTF guys...

[Chevy]

True, but DeRo hasn't given up the ball much lately. Maybe the others quit trying to get open.

[Manutd #1]

on the tpic of our bad tactics, bad sub and the canadian mens team, would anyone welcome Hart as our coach he brought the best out of Canada in 2 gold cups he knows half our team and knows how to get a team like Canada who for YEARS was all about defence to play some exciting attacking football.

[Ageroo]

on the tpic of our bad tactics, bad sub and the canadian mens team, would anyone welcome Hart as our coach he brought the best out of Canada in 2 gold cups he knows half our team and knows how to get a team like Canada who for YEARS was all about defence to play some exciting attacking football.

Yes......but will never happen as he is the technical director for the CSA. I don't think he will even take the head coach of the Men's program full time. I would much rather him stay as technical director over there and focus on the Canadian program.....but that is now off topic.....no chance he is coming to TFC.

[Pigfynn]

Kristian Jack saying on the footy show podcast that the deal is almost done and it's not supposed to have an "opt out" clause and it's a appartrently a long term deal.

Also Mo has been shopping guys all weekend with NO TAKERS.

[Ageroo]

Kristian Jack saying on the footy show podcast that the deal is almost done and it's not supposed to have an "opt out" clause and it's a appartrently a long term deal.

Also Mo has been shopping guys all weekend with NO TAKERS.

Well this is good news...about the no opt-out clause...Wow...was no really expecting this.

NOW...how do we clear cap space!!!!

[Roogsy]

Nice...a no "opt out clause" makes sure this isn't a quick rental just for this year.

As a long-term signing this is good. JDG is quality, there is no doubt.

I just hope people don't get their hopes up for our chances this year. In my opinion, no player short of someone like Messi, CR9 or Steven Gerrard could help this team get into the playoffs at this point. We needed JDG early in the summer.

[Manutd #1]

Sorry if this is a stupid question, why do we need to clear cap space now but in July we could have signed him?

[Pigfynn]

Nice...a no "opt out clause" makes sure this isn't a quick rental just for this year.

As a long-term signing this is good. JDG is quality, there is no doubt.

I just hope people don't get their hopes up for our chances this year. In my opinion, no player short of someone like Messi, CR9 or Steven Gerrard could help this team get into the playoffs at this point. We needed JDG early in the summer.

I think one of these players guarantees you the playoffs actually. I believe there are lots of players that could help us make the playoffs this year...we just don't have any. DeGuzman certainly won't hurt the cause.

[wzhxvy]

Kristian Jack saying on the footy show podcast that the deal is almost done and it's not supposed to have an "opt out" clause and it's a appartrently a long term deal.

Also Mo has been shopping guys all weekend with NO TAKERS.


No opt out just means that someone has to pay the transfer fee, so its a club option and not a player option which makes sense.

And NO TAKERS huh ? What does that say ? lol....in all seriousness though I would assume clubs are maxed out in terms of their salary cap, and given all contracts are gauranteed, then its almost impossible to do unless MLS help us out through some creativity which I am sure they can if they wanted to.

[Manutd #1]

Well this is good news...about the no opt-out clause...Wow...was no really expecting this.

NOW...how do we clear cap space!!!!

I agree with what was said earlier in this thread nobody is gonna take on an older player with a big salary, especially if it potentially helps us make the playoffs possibly over the team buying.....they will want a young player to go along with the salary, our convo should be what young player are you willing to part with..... i would part with wynne, ibrahim, maybe cronin because if we get jdg he plays mid so we may not need cronin

[Roogsy]

I think one of these players guarantees you the playoffs actually. I believe there are lots of players that could help us make the playoffs this year...we just don't have any. DeGuzman certainly won't hurt the cause.

Absolutely he doesn't hurt...but does he improve the chances to a reasonable level where we can get our hopes up? I don't think so.

Before JDG our chances would be somewhere in the low teens I would say. Now they've jumped up to maybe 1 in 4....IF he is able to make the roster before this weekend's game.

[Dbl_D]

absolute cr@p getting JDG now... there should be a clause saying if we make the playoffs he gets paid... otherwise if you wanted the money you should have signed when it was offered and made sense...

[Pigfynn]

...and if you believe that this team and or league has that much say over players like JDG I have some great land in backwater Florida you should see.

We are the tiny mentally challenged brother of soccer leagues and noone gives a shit about any ultimatum the MLS gives to anyone.

[wzhxvy]

absolute cr@p getting JDG now... there should be a clause saying if we make the playoffs he gets paid... otherwise if you wanted the money you should have signed when it was offered and made sense...

I am sure he is getting a signing bonus to tide him over the winter :-) crappy that he signed now I agree but he was getting the bonus anyways...and I do really like him so I can get over all of this...

[OneLoveOneEric]

While I love JDG as a signing, I'm not wild about him as a DP. I don't think he achieves the goals that I believe a DP should achieve.
He is definitely a good player. But is he star quality? I'd say certainly not. Not at this point at least.
Will he generate new support or revenue? Again, I don't think so. JDG is not a household name. The people that know him are the ones that are already committed to TFC as an idea. This doesn't attract a new fan to the team, or attract better broadcasting deals, etc.
I like the player, but I'm a tad disappointed he is our DP.

[James Oliphant]

Just got word that TFC have called a press conference for tomorrow morning at 10:30am. The subject: a player announcement.

[Shaughno]

Kristian Jack saying on the footy show podcast that the deal is almost done and it's not supposed to have an "opt out" clause and it's a appartrently a long term deal.

Also Mo has been shopping guys all weekend with NO TAKERS.


Who was it saying that Guevara still had trade value? :rolleyes:

The guy has max 2 years left in this league, with a large chunk of next season gone due to WC2010. That plus, he's lost a step each season and while his set pieces are still an asset, his in play 'game' has been slowly decaying.

[Rudi]

Just got word that TFC have called a press conference for tomorrow morning at 10:30am. The subject: a player announcement.
Damn you, James! I was here to post the same thing! :D

[Pigfynn]

Word from?

[FluSH]

Just got word that TFC have called a press conference for tomorrow morning at 10:30am. The subject: a player announcement.

I am more interested in which players will be cut... obviosuly JDG is a good addition, but what are we subtracting here...

[Pachuco]

Damn you, James! I was here to post the same thing! :D

OMG - Could this really be happening? I think we must hear about a trade first before we hear DeGuz is signed.

[FluSH]

Who was it saying that Guevara still had trade value? :rolleyes:

The guy has max 2 years left in this league, with a large chunk of next season gone due to WC2010. That plus, he's lost a step each season and while his set pieces are still an asset, his in play 'game' has been slowly decaying.

Didn't Guevara skipout on a trade before... I can see him doing the same thing LOL

[Pachuco]

Who was it saying that Guevara still had trade value? :rolleyes:

The guy has max 2 years left in this league, with a large chunk of next season gone due to WC2010. That plus, he's lost a step each season and while his set pieces are still an asset, his in play 'game' has been slowly decaying.


umm...nobody said anywhere Guevara is being shopped though. Or, maybe Guevara refuses to play anywhere else. It took long enough to convince him to come here, maybe he's attached.

[Pigfynn]

Who was it saying that Guevara still had trade value? :rolleyes:

The guy has max 2 years left in this league, with a large chunk of next season gone due to WC2010. That plus, he's lost a step each season and while his set pieces are still an asset, his in play 'game' has been slowly decaying.

Wasn't me. I said I was in favour of letting him go if we could get something back.

[wzhxvy]

So they are going to announce signing him but he cant play ? :-) lol that will be interesting....I hope they have a solution by tomorrow or this will take away from what I think is a great announcement for the club.

[FluSH]

OMG - Could this really be happening? I think we must hear about a trade first before we hear DeGuz is signed.

The trade might be swept under the carpet.... big soccer day tomorrow with WCQ's and now this...

[James Oliphant]

Word from?

The team. I'm on their presser mailing list.

[FluSH]

I hope we keep Guevara... even if he only has 1yr left in him (because next year he will be tied up with the WC...)

[Pigfynn]

^Cool James :)

[James Oliphant]

I am more interested in which players will be cut... obviosuly JDG is a good addition, but what are we subtracting here...

I'm guessing both announcements will be simultaneous. In attendance tomorrow: Mo, Cummins and a "Toronto FC Player". Singular. So JDG in, some poor schlub out.

Rudi: That's alright...you beat me on USec. ;)

[FluSH]

^^^ are you saying that TFC player will be the one let go?

[wzhxvy]

My guess is Robinson based on prior tweets but could also be DD...if its DD there better be TWO announcements MO....

[James Oliphant]

^^^ are you saying that TFC player will be the one let go?

Not likely. It'll be JDG if anyone, and the player to be released will be given an "unfortunately we've had to cut ____ to make cap space, we're sad to see him go, he was great for us, blah blah blah" kind of moment from Mo and Cummins after the unveiling of JDG.

[tfcmanu]

I wonder who is gone to make room for cap space.

Dichio..eeks
Robinson...who knows

[flatpicker]

well this forum will surely be active after this announcement...

as if it isn't already!

[Pigfynn]

Someone will give this away by tonight is my guess either by facebook, twitter or brother's friend's doorman.

[RPB_RED_NATION_RPB]

wed's should be a great day for me!

Start off with the JDG signing..:)
Followed later in the day with England Qualifying for the WC...
and news that Portugal has FAILED to qualify!

what a great day weds will be! ;)

[wzhxvy]

Sorry to bring the sasquach back but maybe they have been hiding the saquach all along to be able to release him for JDG ?

[Darlofletch]

I agree with what was said earlier in this thread nobody is gonna take on an older player with a big salary, especially if it potentially helps us make the playoffs possibly over the team buying.....they will want a young player to go along with the salary, our convo should be what young player are you willing to part with..... i would part with wynne, ibrahim, maybe cronin because if we get jdg he plays mid so we may not need cronin

yeah, Mo's going to be bent over and have had to give up something good for other clubs to take on enough salary from our aging or underperforming players. I'd definitely part with Wynne, Ibrahim or edwards. I'd be disappointed to see cronin, nana, frei or the gambians go, those are the only ones who I could see being attractive trade bait for this to work (aside from De Ro but I can't imagine mo's offering him up).

as for the big salary players, Guevara makes most sense as the player other teams might want. I'd be reluctant to see Robbo get traded, but if we've got jdg and cronin and sanyang, it doesn't make much sense to be paying robbo so much, so in a cold hearted way that would make sense.

Should be interesting to see what Mo's got to say tomorrow, but I'm definitely happy that he's coming and doesn't have an opt out clause.

[RPB_RED_NATION_RPB]

yeah, Mo's going to be bent over and have had to give up something good for other clubs to take on enough salary from our aging or underperforming players. I'd definitely part with Wynne, Ibrahim or edwards. I'd be disappointed to see cronin, nana, frei or the gambians go, those are the only ones who I could see being attractive trade bait for this to work (aside from De Ro but I can't imagine mo's offering him up).

as for the big salary players, Guevara makes most sense as the player other teams might want. I'd be reluctant to see Robbo get traded, but if we've got jdg and cronin and sanyang, it doesn't make much sense to be paying robbo so much, so in a cold hearted way that would make sense.

Should be interesting to see what Mo's got to say tomorrow, but I'm definitely happy that he's coming and doesn't have an opt out clause.

have to agree one of our biggest prospects will be apart of the deal!..

I cant see frie..being a part of it..cause i dont see him in the MLS in a year or 2...so it would be a waste of a pick up!..

O'brien white..NANA...GAMBIANS..WYNNE...most likely if a deal is struck!

[Section 117]

If this is true IMO this is going to rock the changing room....

I can see a player being upset at giving DeGuzman that amount of money...

[Shakes McQueen]

Well, if it's a long term deal without an out clause, then it appears the worries of a lot of folks may end up being unfounded.

Depending on who is out, this could end up being a tremendous signing.

- Scott

[AL-MO]

I hope this is a commitment to TFC and not "I'll play here until something better comes up in Europe".

Which now that I think about it, I don't see JDG going back to Europe as he'll be 29 next year. But stranger things have happened.

[AL-MO]

Well, if it's a long term deal without an out clause, then it appears the worries of a lot of folks may end up being unfounded.

Depending on who is out, this could end up being a tremendous signing.

- Scott

That's what I want to find out!

[English Rachel]

I am excited for JDG, man, I think believing was the most typed word for me in that thread but I am still super pissed off with his timing. This season would have had a very different outcome if he had not waited for a European offer. I do hate him a little for that.


wed's should be a great day for me!

Start off with the JDG signing..:)
Followed later in the day with England Qualifying for the WC...
and news that Portugal has FAILED to qualify!

what a great day weds will be! ;)

AGREED!!! are you in my head? lol <3

[AL-MO]

If this is true IMO this is going to rock the changing room....

I can see a player being upset at giving DeGuzman that amount of money...

What are you hearing 117? Is Dichio on the way out? *hope not!*

[Ageroo]

While I love JDG as a signing, I'm not wild about him as a DP. I don't think he achieves the goals that I believe a DP should achieve.
He is definitely a good player. But is he star quality? I'd say certainly not. Not at this point at least.
Will he generate new support or revenue? Again, I don't think so. JDG is not a household name. The people that know him are the ones that are already committed to TFC as an idea. This doesn't attract a new fan to the team, or attract better broadcasting deals, etc.
I like the player, but I'm a tad disappointed he is our DP.

In my opinion I don't want a DP that is a household name or going to put fans in the seats...why would that be of use to us. We have a problem transitioning from Defending to attacking. He could possibly be the missing link.

TFC does not need to generate any revenue from a DP signing. The stadium is full, mechandise is falling off the rack....no need for a big name...but that is my opinion.

[Chevy]

They can also put Robinson on the Injured Reserve for the rest of the season. His salary does not count toward the cap if he's on IR.

Save the dirty work (i.e. trade, release) for after the season is over.

[billyfly]

Could this be the official word finally after a bunch o days of this thread speculating and speculating and speculating and ....

[Shakes McQueen]

That's what I want to find out!

I'm listening to the Footy Show podcast as I type this, and Kristian Jack is saying it's a long term deal without an out clause. I suppose we will find out.

Really excited! :)

- Scott

[RPB_RED_NATION_RPB]

Well, if it's a long term deal without an out clause, then it appears the worries of a lot of folks may end up being unfounded.

Depending on who is out, this could end up being a tremendous signing.

- Scott


Either way its a tremendous signing.....its JDG!

NO young prospect will ever be as good...and even if there is the slightiest chance there is....They would jump ship to europe anyway!!
BEcause of the way the league is...it will never keep onto rising stars!

We are getting a player who can basically play in any league in the would and not feel out of place...and 28 to boot!



:drinking:

[AL-MO]

wed's should be a great day for me!

Start off with the JDG signing..:)
Followed later in the day with England Qualifying for the WC...
and news that Portugal has FAILED to qualify!

what a great day weds will be! ;)

Yes finally England can make a deep run in the WC, now that Portugal won't be around to beat them in penalties.

[Shakes McQueen]

Continuing to listen to the podcast - KJ is saying the teams JDG was interested in, weren't as interested in him, and they were only willing to offer him a max of a one year deal.

- Scott

[wzhxvy]

They can also put Robinson on the Injured Reserve for the rest of the season. His salary does not count toward the cap if he's on IR.

Save the dirty work (i.e. trade, release) for after the season is over.

Can a MLS salary cap expert confirm this ? That would make sense if they can do that.....

[James Oliphant]

Can a MLS salary cap expert confirm this ? That would make sense if they can do that.....

We did it last season with Todd Dunivant. Shut him down for the season and freed up his cap hit.

[Broadview]

If this is true IMO this is going to rock the changing room....

I can see a player being upset at giving DeGuzman that amount of money...

I'm thinking Dero...of course that's 100% speculation on my part.

[RPB_RED_NATION_RPB]

Yes finally England can make a deep run in the WC, now that Portugal won't be around to beat them in penalties.

AMEN!...

NOw back on topic!! :D

[Billy the kid]

Who was it saying that Guevara still had trade value? :rolleyes:

The guy has max 2 years left in this league, with a large chunk of next season gone due to WC2010. That plus, he's lost a step each season and while his set pieces are still an asset, his in play 'game' has been slowly decaying.

I said he has outscored all our strikers despite missing games. I would keep him over some of those strikers. I stand by that.:)

[Ageroo]

Looks like I may be sporting my CMNT De Guzman Jersey and rockin' the RPB scarf and TFC hat this weekend. :) All my worlds collide!

[WHITEY]

Looks like I may be sporting my CMNT De Guzman Jersey and rockin' the RPB scarf and TFC hat this weekend. :) All my worlds collide!

But George Costanza says worlds can not collide! LOL

[Darlofletch]

If this is true IMO this is going to rock the changing room....

I can see a player being upset at giving DeGuzman that amount of money...

Do you (or anyone really, but you seem to have some sort of source)have an idea of how much money is involved? is it the same deal he was being offered before? and how much guaranteed vs bonuses?

[UltraSuperMegaMo]

Presser tomorrow to announce the signing:
http://www.tsn.ca/soccer/story/?id=290402

[fetajr]

nice move. You think JDG made sure grass is coming to BMO before signing? ...if i were him, that condition would be right at the top of my list.

[James Oliphant]

Presser tomorrow to announce the signing:
http://www.tsn.ca/soccer/story/?id=290402

As mentioned a couple pages ago. :)

[UltraSuperMegaMo]

As mentioned a couple pages ago. :)

Sorry:(

[Shakes McQueen]

nice move. You think JDG made sure grass is coming to BMO before signing? ...if i were him, that condition would be right at the top of my list.

With TFC's two biggest locker room power-brokers calling for grass, there is no way it doesn't happen now. JDG and DeRo will be calling for it loudly.

- Scott

[billyfly]

AMEN!...

NOw back on topic!! :D

No, no, not yet. I want to explore more how you rejoice in Portugal not going to WC.

Please enlighten us.

[Darlofletch]

Looks like I may be sporting my CMNT De Guzman Jersey and rockin' the RPB scarf and TFC hat this weekend. :) All my worlds collide!

definitely need to finally get my arse in gear and get a number 6 put on my canada jersey.:canada:

I'm very excited by this, not for this year so much, but definitely for next season.:hump:

[Roogsy]

They can also put Robinson on the Injured Reserve for the rest of the season. His salary does not count toward the cap if he's on IR.

Save the dirty work (i.e. trade, release) for after the season is over.

If they can do it this way, it would be the best for everyone involved. It's the least disruptive and would leave the team to sort out the mess during the offseason where it won't affect the product on the pitch.

[ArmenJBX]

I wonder what number he will take? 4,12,13,21,23,25,26-31, 33+ are available.

[English Rachel]

http://photos-h.ak.fbcdn.net/hphotos-ak-snc1/hs260.snc1/10717_272962180170_681975170_8712647_7687443_n.jpg

I know the photoshop nazis will have a field day with me but I couldn't resist!!!!!

[Shakes McQueen]

If they can do it this way, it would be the best for everyone involved. It's the least disruptive and would leave the team to sort out the mess during the offseason where it won't affect the product on the pitch.

Is Robbo's injury really that long-term?

- Scott

[James Oliphant]

I wonder what number will he take?

6.

Sorry Nick....pick another number.

[Manutd #1]

would anybody be upset if the announcement was in 3 parts, cummins our dichio in for the remainder of the season and de guzman signed?????????

[Roogsy]

In my opinion I don't want a DP that is a household name or going to put fans in the seats...why would that be of use to us. We have a problem transitioning from Defending to attacking. He could possibly be the missing link.

TFC does not need to generate any revenue from a DP signing. The stadium is full, mechandise is falling off the rack....no need for a big name...but that is my opinion.


Yes and no. A functioning DP is much better than a useless one that sells T-shirts only. As long as he gets us results, I don't care if he sells T-Shirts.

However...from a business and marketing perspective, you can never say "TFC does not need" more revenue. Manchester United and Real Madrid are the biggest clubs in the world and they don't sit back and say "we're the biggest, we don't need to up the ante on the marketing front"...in fact, they do the opposite.

To me, the issue of revenue from a DP is secondary to product on the pitch. But it's a little naive to say that it's not a necessary consideration to make when looking at a DP. Much like some Toronto fans even now still buy Galaxy "Beckham" jerseys, the goal of Toronto management and Adidas is to get people outside of Toronto to buy TFC jerseys as well.

[AL-MO]

Continuing to listen to the podcast - KJ is saying the teams JDG was interested in, weren't as interested in him, and they were only willing to offer him a max of a one year deal.

- Scott

Listening to the podcast now myself.

[ArmenJBX]

6.

Sorry Nick....pick another number.

I swear you're not allowed to do that unless the player chooses to relinquish it. Ronaldinho wasn't allowed the number 10 and his whole brand was based on 10.

[Broadview]

Goff twittered those three lovely initials:

http://twitter.com/SoccerInsider/status/3846730864

edit: Actually he spelled the whole name. I guess I just read it as three letters.

[RPB_RED_NATION_RPB]

my question is...if it a done deal by tomorrow.......can we have him in the lineup by the 12th! :)

And if he signs tomorrow ..this has to mean a trade has already been made and is just getting finalized as we speak!??

[SilverSamurai]

JDG is coming home!! WHOO!!

I'm excited about next season.
He'll be a huuuge help next season going into the Champions League. Montreal and Vancouver won't know what hit them!

Still this seems like a dream of sorts... I won't believe it till I see him stepping onto the pitch.

[Roogsy]

http://photos-h.ak.fbcdn.net/hphotos-ak-snc1/hs260.snc1/10717_272962180170_681975170_8712647_7687443_n.jpg

I know the photoshop nazis will have a field day with me but I couldn't resist!!!!!


LMAO!

OMG Rachel...that's rubbish!

[Ageroo]

6.

Sorry Nick....pick another number.


Ummmm yes! Maybe Garcia will be hitting the bricks......:D

[ArmenJBX]

my question is...if it a done deal by tomorrow.......can we have him in the lineup by the 12th! :)

And if he signs tomorrow ..this has to mean a trade has already been made and is just getting finalized as we speak!??

Yeah, someone's definately on the outs tomorrow or thursday. Probably Robbo.

[James Oliphant]

I swear you're not allowed to do that unless the player chooses to relinquish it. Ronaldinho wasn't allowed the number 10 and his whole brand was based on 10.

...and #14 was occupied when De Rosario took it from Tyrone Marshall (De Ro was signed 2 months before Marshall was traded).

There is precedent.

[AL-MO]

AMEN!...

NOw back on topic!! :D

I wasn't agreeing with your happiness.

[ArmenJBX]

DeRo wore number 28 till ty left though didn't he? Or am I remembering things wrong :D

[WHITEY]

Ummmm yes! Maybe Garcia will be hitting the bricks......:D

LOL thats what happened when DeRo was brought in...DeRo in one door Marshall out the other and #14 opens up

[Manutd #1]

Ummmm yes! Maybe Garcia will be hitting the bricks......:D

oh please let that be true Garcia SUCKS and we need his number 6 back

[Ageroo]

JDG is coming home!! WHOO!!

I'm excited about next season.
He'll be a huuuge help next season going into the Champions League. Montreal and Vancouver won't know what hit them!

Still this seems like a dream of sorts... I won't believe it till I see him stepping onto the pitch.

You and me both! :flare: Alright...time to breath.......I get to see him every week as opposed to on TV and CMNT duty....yes, I am the ultimate fanboy of JDG. So give me a break! :)

[RPB_RED_NATION_RPB]

I wasn't agreeing with your happiness.

I know...but i was agreeing with you!!

[James Oliphant]

DeRo wore number 28 till ty left though didn't he? Or am I remembering things wrong :D

Actually, he wore no number. My mistake. He had a jersey at the unveiling, but there was no number on it. And his practice jersey may have had 28 on it.

[AL-MO]

I know...but i was agreeing with you!!

:lol:

[English Rachel]

LMAO!

OMG Rachel...that's rubbish!

Lol shut it, made you laugh, didn't it?

I'm changing my facebook pic to it, lol.

[ArmenJBX]

If Robbo leaves (I doubt Nicky is, it's too soon.) who will take the VC role.

I vote DeRo.

[Darlofletch]

I swear you're not allowed to do that unless the player chooses to relinquish it. Ronaldinho wasn't allowed the number 10 and his whole brand was based on 10.

Garcia could be getting himself a nice expensive present some time soon.

or ideally, he'd be part of a trade to clear space.

[Roogsy]

Garcia will likely not be back next season. So my guess is JDG will take a temporary number and then choose again next season. Unless Garcia relinquishes the number voluntarily.

I wouldn't get JDG's number on a jersey just yet. LOL! Not until he starts a season for us as opposed to joining us at the tail end of one.

[Broadview]

Now Atiba please :)

http://graphics8.nytimes.com/images/2007/06/22/sports/soccer/canada.600.jpg