Attakora Out vs. KKKrew

[Lucky Strike]

http://toronto.fc.mlsnet.com/news/team_news.jsp?ymd=20090723&content_id=6016930&vkey=news_t280&fext=.jsp&team=t280

Why does this merit its own thread? Not only is he an important player but the injury occurred during the River Plate friendly.

Is there really any doubt about how counter-productive friendlies are during the MIDDLE OF THE SEASON?!? I do find it enjoyable to see teams that we normally wouldn't play against ever, but not at this price (and I don't mean the cost of a ticket to see these matches). Do we have any recourse on this? The team is sabotaging its own efforts to win a championship; this is mental.

[TFC07]

Why did Attakora even play this game? Blame coaching staff for this injury.

[TFC Tifoso]

we should just be lucky that we get to see world class teams!........stop your complaining!........who cares if our players get hurt in games that don't mean dick on a stick......we got to see River Plate!!!!!!......and next Real Madrid too!!!!!! REJOICE!!!!!.....these friendlies will save the sport in Canada, didn't you know that??!! :rolleyes::rolleyes::rolleyes::facepalm::facepalm: :facepalm:

[Stouffville_RPB]

we should just be lucky that we get to see world class teams!........stop your complaining!........who cares if our players get hurt in games that don't mean dick on a stick......we got to see River Plate!!!!!!......and next Real Madrid too!!!!!! REJOICE!!!!!.....these friendlies will save the sport in Canada, didn't you know that??!! :rolleyes::rolleyes::rolleyes::facepalm::facepalm: :facepalm:

Are you for real?

Do you think RP gave a shit about the game? We lose a piece againist our biggest league rivals so you could blow your load over RP?

[TFC Tifoso]

Are you for real?

Do you think RP gave a shit about the game? We lose a piece againist our biggest league rivals so you could blow your load over RP?

sarcasm much???....that post was a joke.....wooooosh!

[Stouffville_RPB]

^ alright then

[Redpunkfiddle]

Are you for real?

Do you think RP gave a shit about the game? We lose a piece againist our biggest league rivals so you could blow your load over RP?

I think the hundred rolleyes and facepalms were a clue to this question is my hunch.

Looks like Serioux will be back at CB, unless he is really still feeling it. Otherwise its back to Velez.

[dal524]

and serioux might not play either...whats this looking like in the back then...brennan, garcia, velez and wynne :( our chances of winning on sat just took a huge hit. at least schelotto isnt playing.

[Hitcho]

oh for fuck's sake. fucking MLS(E?) cashing in on this shit. you wanna grow the sport in canada? then fucking win the league you wankers, stop trying to milk the fan base with all this pointless mid-season friendly crap. no-one really cares about them, most of the season ticket holders i know just sold the tickets on for the game even though it was a half decent side. even if we'd had the chavski here i would have sold the tickets because I SUPPORT TORONTO FC not some fucking team from overseas so STOP PLAYING THESE POINTLESS CASH IN GAMES AND GETTING PLAYERS INJURED.

now we've lost nana for weeks on end most likely with a hamstring injury at a time when serioux was already injured and we have no decent cover at either fullback slot, and in addition to the play off run in we've got CL games coming up as well. how fucking brainless was that?!

I AM FUCKING PISSED OFF ABOUT THIS TFC FO

and there's more of this shit to come when real fucking madrid pitch up here to fill up on namerican dollars as well. who are we prepared to lose to injury then to line the accounts with more cash?

GET IT THROUGH YOUR FUCKING HEADS - YOUR CORE FAN ABSE DOESN'T GIVE A SHIT ABOUT THESE GAMES.

Fucking idiots.

[Belfast_Boy]

I like the friendlies but think the timing sucked. we're playing for the league and Concacaf. but we're not going to get teams like Real to show up during their off season. what's the solution? we need them to build the game but it can cause shitty injuries like this one.

[KrazyKanadian]

From the "MLS improvements thread" earlier today:


8. Eliminate mid-season friendlies
They do nothing but tire out the over-worked starters and give opportunities for injuries. If they're so critical to the success of this league, move the games to the pre- or post-season. The schedule is busy enough with all the little "cup" games and qualifiers.

[trane]

I never liked friendlies. They are necessary in pre-season, in the midle of the season, they make no fucking sense. This has to be stoped.

[Parkdale]

GET IT THROUGH YOUR FUCKING HEADS - YOUR CORE FAN ABSE DOESN'T GIVE A SHIT ABOUT THESE GAMES.


well that poses a new question.... define "core fan base"

is it the hardcore supporters, or the majority of ticket holders?

[Darlofletch]

Magnificent.

Attakora's emergence as our best cb over the last few games could have given us the opportunity to rest Serioux if he wasn't fully fit, now, he'll be all strapped up and thrown back in there, and fingers crossed it doesn't get worse. I love that he's willing to play through pain to help the team, but we shouldn't keep playing him if he's unfit. Now i guess we'll have to.

[Don Julio]

I'm guessing that they are forced to do this by MLS.. Seems like every team has 2 mid-season friendlies every year. Coincidence?

The Real Madrid friendly I'll buy as a cash grab, but not this one.

[Ageroo]

well that poses a new question.... define "core fan base"

is it the hardcore supporters, or the majority of ticket holders?

I am withyou on this one Parky....core fanbase is definitely not the majority of the seat holders.....So if you are going by the general fan...they want to see these type of matches.

I for one hate them for all the reasons people have already said. But...I don't see them going away anytime soon....

[Stouffville_RPB]

From the "MLS improvements thread" earlier today:

Pre or post-season for us is during the european seasons. They wouldn't play friendlies during their season.

[Lucky Strike]

Pre or post-season for us is during the european seasons. They wouldn't play friendlies during their season.

Because they are sane. We are not.

[TFC Tifoso]

I like the friendlies but think the timing sucked. we're playing for the league and Concacaf. but we're not going to get teams like Real to show up during their off season. what's the solution? we need them to build the game but it can cause shitty injuries like this one.

easy solution.....get rid of the friendlies....if the FO is truly interested in building a successful team, then TFC will have enough extra tournaments in the season to play (ie. CCL). They could do a lot more building the sport in this country by putting a consistently winning team that people will follow.

[Parkdale]

Pre or post-season for us is during the european seasons. They wouldn't play friendlies during their season.


considering we can't play our season opener at home because of weather, I don't think it's possible to play a friendly before that.


I suggested this in another thread:

The MLs should have a two week 'all star break' with the ASG in the middle,
and a week on either side. Then put all friendlies into that space, and it would
make for a great week of football. Plus most big Internationals would tour and
hit up a few cities, so it would help keep the costs manageable for other clubs.

[TFC Tifoso]

I'm guessing that they are forced to do this by MLS.. Seems like every team has 2 mid-season friendlies every year. Coincidence?

The Real Madrid friendly I'll buy as a cash grab, but not this one.

why not? the tickets to this costed more than a regular game too.....

[Darlofletch]

Pre or post-season for us is during the european seasons. They wouldn't play friendlies during their season.

And we shouldn't either. For me this is similar to the whole Beckham thing right now in LA. Too many teams, and the league as a whole, are bending over backwards and taking it up the hoop to accomodate big name players and teams who don't give a shit about MLS but just want to expand their brand into North America.

people in Europe and eurosnobs over here who look down at MLS but come out to watch this kind of thing (yes i know RP aren't european, but still) see MLS as a joke league not worthy of their attention. By effing over our schedule to play this sort of game or letting Beckham come and go as he pleases, in an effort to try and attract these people, we're just proving them right.

It's time for supporters, teams and the leaguie as a whole to grow a pair and have some self respect.

I saw a NEE banner at the RP game which said something along the lines of "against meaningless friendlies". good for whoever did that, I'd love to see some kind of organised protest at one of these games.

[Darlofletch]

considering we can't play our season opener at home because of weather, I don't think it's possible to play a friendly before that.


I suggested this in another thread:

The MLs should have a two week 'all star break' with the ASG in the middle,
and a week on either side. Then put all friendlies into that space, and it would
make for a great week of football. Plus most big Internationals would tour and
hit up a few cities, so it would help keep the costs manageable for other clubs.

Great idea if we have to do this shit, but this wouldn't stop people from getting injured would it?

[Hitcho]

well that poses a new question.... define "core fan base"

is it the hardcore supporters, or the majority of ticket holders?

Well to me it's the supporters who care more about the team than they do about seeing some semi-fancy side pitch up for a needless friendly. Exactly where the line falls between hardcore SG members and soccer moms I can't tell you.

Two other points though:

The fact that a bunch of people want to come along and see Madrid or River does not automatically mean that TFC or the sport in general will experience any material growth at any level. In fact, there may be none at all since kids who care enough to see Madrid already know and like football and probably already play the game. if they;re not alreadt TFC fans they are ulikely to become fans, especially if they turn up to support madrid.

Also, TFC winning the MLS Cup would have more impact on growing the club and the sport in Canada than even real madrid could muster. The press coverage from a successful play off run would push the club's profile through the stratosphere compared to what it is now and nothing, and I do mean nothing, generates new fans or a higher profile more than success does.

In fact, madrid coming here and spanking TFC could actually damage the club's profile because it just underlines what a backwards league we're in compared to "real" football teams. There's definitely a danger of that image being projected, enough to cancel the few new fans who are turned after these pointless mid season friendlies.

[Parkdale]

Great idea if we have to do this shit, but this wouldn't stop people from getting injured would it?


the only way to avoid the injuries is to stop playing.
unfortunately that's just how it works. the best way to be in 'game shape'
is to be actively playing, but then you subject yourself to injury.
that's part of being a professional athlete I suppose.

[Hitcho]

Great idea if we have to do this shit, but this wouldn't stop people from getting injured would it?

Agreed. If the league forces this crap on us then Parky's suggestion is a brilliant one. It doesn't remove the core underlying problem though, but it's not a bad compromise if we are forced to take part in this circus.

Having said that, if teams just played their under 18 side for all these games then the league would stop this crap pretty quickly. it would take all the teams to unite in protest of course, but i bet it would be mightily effective.

[Hitcho]

the only way to avoid the injuries is to stop playing.
unfortunately that's just how it works. the best way to be in 'game shape'
is to be actively playing, but then you subject yourself to injury.
that's part of being a professional athlete I suppose.

This is basically true, but the friendlies present an added injury risk because A) players try harder to impress (see Vitti's comments pre RP, and look at ROB in the Villa game in season one), and B) often the visiting teams are fitter and more physically imposing and play a far mroe aggressive brand of football which means the likes of West Ham can take lumps out of the likes De Ro, Vitti etc without even realising it.

So yeah, any game is an injury risk but friendlies are more so in my book. And that's a double whammy ebcause an injury in a mid season friendly is a total waste. AT elast if a player gets injured making an important tackle or scoring a goal or whatever in an important league game, it's for a worthy cause.

[mmmikey]

ugh.. hamstring too :(

[Derko]

Well that sucks, Attakora has been one of our best defenders thus far.

[Yohan]

fuck me. i knew this was going to happen.

im going to lose it if we start dropping points because of this

[Stouffville_RPB]

considering we can't play our season opener at home because of weather, I don't think it's possible to play a friendly before that.


I suggested this in another thread:

The MLs should have a two week 'all star break' with the ASG in the middle,
and a week on either side. Then put all friendlies into that space, and it would
make for a great week of football. Plus most big Internationals would tour and
hit up a few cities, so it would help keep the costs manageable for other clubs.

Sounds like a good idea. I understand the money making point but there are better ways to do it.

[FluSH]

devastating...

[olegunnar]

It's only just started too.
We have 5 more games in the next 15 days. 4 of them on turf. KKrew, PRx2 NER and RM

We've seen last night that with a 21 man roster, starters HAVE to play in these games. There's no choice.

I said it before, I hope by the time the Aug 15th DCU game comes along we're able to field a team that does not include CSL players and scouts.

It'd be nice too if we had a full roster...ahem cough MO!?!?!

[Stouffville_RPB]

This is basically true, but the friendlies present an added injury risk because A) players try harder to impress (see Vitti's comments pre RP, and look at ROB in the Villa game in season one), and B) often the visiting teams are fitter and more physically imposing and play a far mroe aggressive brand of football which means the likes of West Ham can take lumps out of the likes De Ro, Vitti etc without even realising it.



Guys like Gala and Vitti who are trying to impress have to go full out. I think your not giving the MLS enough credit though in saying that West Ham would come here and take lumps out of DeRo. MLS is a pretty physical league. Hence why you saw so many RP players lying on the pitch.

Best thing for everyone involved would be to have a scheduled break of some sort. Having friendlies put you in a position to play 7 games in 20 days is detremental to the league.

[Hitcho]

Guys like Gala and Vitti who are trying to impress have to go full out. I think your not giving the MLS enough credit though in saying that West Ham would come here and take lumps out of DeRo. MLS is a pretty physical league. Hence why you saw so many RP players lying on the pitch.

Best thing for everyone involved would be to have a scheduled break of some sort. Having friendlies put you in a position to play 7 games in 20 days is detremental to the league.

hehe, no, that was because they're a team of schelotto's...

[boban]

http://toronto.fc.mlsnet.com/news/team_news.jsp?ymd=20090723&content_id=6016930&vkey=news_t280&fext=.jsp&team=t280

Why does this merit its own thread? Not only is he an important player but the injury occurred during the River Plate friendly.

Is there really any doubt about how counter-productive friendlies are during the MIDDLE OF THE SEASON?!? I do find it enjoyable to see teams that we normally wouldn't play against ever, but not at this price (and I don't mean the cost of a ticket to see these matches). Do we have any recourse on this? The team is sabotaging its own efforts to win a championship; this is mental.
:cryin::cryin::cryin::cryin::cryin::cryin::cryin:: cryin:

[Jack]

Great job on the friendlies again! NOT!

Now we go into another tough stretch of the season without a key defender.

Injuries happen all the time, I know, but I'd prefer them to happen in a game that means something, not a useless friendly.

I hope the lesson is now learned and these useless games will be dropped from our schedule for good.

We have a TON of important games over the next little while and these extra meaningless matches once again rear their ugly heads and affect meaningful games.

Shameful.

Never again. No more mid-season friendlies!

[Nuvinho]

We have 21 players on our roster - 1 backup keeper (hopefully we don't need to use him) - Sammy Cronin - Sanyang - Nana = VERY DEPLETED ROSTER

[flatpicker]

I too have had enough of friendly games.
I don't mind inviting international clubs to town and including tickets in our season tickets,
or maybe first dibs on tickets for STH...

But these friendlies should not include TFC!
Let two foreign clubs face each other.
Perhaps get two clubs with that have a long rivalry...

I am fine with promoting footie in North America... but don't do it at the expense of our own talent!

[Dub Narcotic]

Sometimes those hamstring injuries can really linger. What a freakin disaster. Velez cannot play 90 effective minutes.

[H Bomb]

hhhhahahahahahahahahahahaahHAAHAHAHAHAHAHahahahaha AAHAHAHAHAHAHAAHa


anybody even slightly surprised?

anyone want to back MLSE on this one?

There is no common sense in that company. They always fuck up.

[Roogsy]

Friendlies for European teams (or South American teams) coming up here to play is necessary for a successful season. It's a part of their training. But something that this front office has not caught onto (or refuses because there are dollar signs in the way) is that friendlies IN THE MIDDLE OF A SEASON are from a tactical point of view (not a business point of view) just plain stupid. End of story.

This was my problem with Real Madrid. For the sake of earning a few bucks, so much is being sacrificed. Rest for the players. Injury risks. And for a game that wasn't even televised. (In the case of RP of course, Real Madrid is being televised on the much less viewed GolTV so the offsetting advantage doesn't really mitigate the disadvantages in my opinion.)

The goal of a team should be to draw fans and revenue through a winning attitude. These mid season friendlies are simply side shows that carry many disadvantages and risks to a team's ultimate goals. Unless you are pulling in boatloads of cash that can offset any disadvantages, then I recommend re-evaluating the need for these friendlies. There are other means to generate revenue.

[KrazyKanadian]

I saw a NEE banner at the RP game which said something along the lines of "against meaningless friendlies". good for whoever did that, I'd love to see some kind of organised protest at one of these games.

There was, back on June 6th. NEE walked after the anthem and left BMO for the match.

[Hitcho]

^ I think he meant a protest at a friendly, not an MLS game, unless that's what you're referring to.

On another ntoe, I made this point above but I'm making it again, as others already have:

If you want to improve the TFC/soccer draw in Canada, then WIN THE FUCKING LEAGUE, don't hamstring us (literally) with mid-season friendlies designed to generate cash. Watching Real madrid whip the crap out of TFC is not likely to inspire many new fans (who's going to start supporting a team based on attending one game when that game was a 12-0 hammering?!).

Nothing generates media and public love like a big shiny trophy. Win the MLS Cup, win the GTA crowd. Someone needs to put this in 6 foot high lettering in the TFC FO.

[nascarguy]

I fell sorry for all the players that have to put up with all the bull shit that mlse makes them do.

Mo better fix this fast

[Kevvv]

I fell sorry for all the players that have to put up with all the bull shit that mlse makes them do.

Mo better fix this fast


Have the players said they don't like playing mid-season friendlies against clubs they would otherwise never play against?

I definitely agree we have too many games in the next couple weeks, and don't need an extra one that doesn't count for anything, but speaking for the players is a bit presumptious, methinks.

[TFC Tifoso]

^ I think he meant a protest at a friendly, not an MLS game, unless that's what you're referring to.

NEE was not at last nights game either....

[jimmyjazz]

[quote=Parkdale;635454]considering we can't play our season opener at home because of weather,

I have been thinking about this point. Why do we have to concede that we cannot open our season at home? I watched the weather, and think the game time conditions actually would have been more enjoyable on March 21, than they were on April 4 this year.

According to the historical data I looked up for this year:

High on March 21 was 5.6 C

High on April 4 was 6.7.

Not a material difference for the players or fans.

Let's open the season at home sometime soon!

Jim