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View Full Version : Onward! - Honduras again



Ben Knight
07-19-2009, 03:47 PM
Three screw jobs in five years.

http://onwardsoccer.com/2009/07/19/honduras-again/

Yohan
07-19-2009, 03:56 PM
I hate Honduras as much as I hate Columbus, and that's a lot of hate

Only consolation this time's screw job is that Canada didn't get Benito'd again. Worse ref ever

Shakes McQueen
07-19-2009, 05:38 PM
Great article Ben. Your opinion echoes mine exactly.

Yes, Canada should have done better on their set pieces. Yes, we should have done more with our chances. But that doesn't change the fact that the fix was in yet again, and Honduras were unfairly handed a one goal advantage on an absolute non-call.

Aguilar should be ashamed of himself, and if the CSA had a pair of testicles bigger than milk duds, they would be publicly complaining about the result. Seriously, I said this before - Aguilar should be forced to issue a televised apology to the nation of Canada, for arguably one of the worst calls in soccer history. And he should be a short-order cook at some greasy spoon by the end of the week, not a licensed FIFA official.

And Honduras' dishonourable, utterly embarrassing diving play-acting bullshit speaks for itself. Part of me wanted one of our players to just walk up and kick Escobar as hard as they could, when he was laying on the ground with the entire Red Cross attending to him in the 89th minute.

And maybe foot stomp that asshole that got hit in the leg by Gerba, and fell to the ground clutching his leg at first, then his head - for which the referee stopped the game while Canada were on the attack!

And the idiot Honduras fans cheering that shit on, and booing our players because we refused to kick the ball out for their goofy, cheating douchebaggery.

The Canadian players should have just walked immediately into the tunnel after the final whistle. That referee, and those embarrassing players, didn't deserve an honourable handshake, after that dishonourable exhibition on the field.

- Scott

Nerepis
07-19-2009, 06:24 PM
Great article Ben. Your opinion echoes mine exactly.

Yes, Canada should have done better on their set pieces. Yes, we should have done more with our chances. But that doesn't change the fact that the fix was in yet again, and Honduras were unfairly handed a one goal advantage on an absolute non-call....

- Scott

There are two sides to that coin, with Canada down and needing to push forward for the equalizer, Honduras still couldn't do better with their set pieces or their other chances. Leaving the shameless antics aside, without the Ref in their pocket, Honduras does not win that game. Penalty Kicks seems the likely outcome.

I'm sure I would feel better if we lost with that coin toss then what we saw last night. I feel sick for Football today.

Shakes McQueen
07-19-2009, 06:26 PM
There are two sides to that coin, with Canada down and needing to push forward for the equalizer, Honduras still couldn't do better with their set pieces or their other chances. Leaving the shameless antics aside, without the Ref in their pocket, Honduras does not win that game. Penalty Kicks seems the likely outcome.

I'm sure I would feel better if we lost with that coin toss then what we saw last night. I feel sick for Football today.

And who knows what would have happened, if Honduras weren't put in a position where they were able to just sit back and defend. Maybe some of our attacks would have been more effective.

At the end of the day, it doesn't change the fact that we got fucked.

- Scott

Nerepis
07-19-2009, 06:37 PM
^^^
Yes Sir, Royally!

RealG-TFC
07-19-2009, 10:53 PM
I still think it is our fault we lost...that call could have just easily have gone for us had it happened in the Honduran box...

RealG-TFC
07-19-2009, 10:53 PM
PS: What was up with the hate mongering from Forrest?

Yohan
07-19-2009, 10:54 PM
PS: What was up with the hate mongering from Forrest?
lol. he's been the GK at the end of CONCACAF screw ups way too often

Shakes McQueen
07-19-2009, 11:19 PM
I still think it is our fault we lost...that call could have just easily have gone for us had it happened in the Honduran box...

That's a completely theoretical assumption, though. And if we did get a complete phantom call that altered the outcome of the game like that, I'd expect folks in Honduras to be absolutely livid about it too.

- Scott

Heathen
07-20-2009, 08:18 AM
PS: What was up with the hate mongering from Forrest?

What did he say?

rocker
07-20-2009, 08:20 AM
all canada needed was one measly goal and they would have taken it to extra time and perhaps kicks.

you can't complain about the ref when you don't score at all. you're leaving yourself open to these kinds of things unless you put some goals in the net.

Jamaicanadian
07-20-2009, 09:31 AM
rocker: I agree with your sentiments....You cant win if you dont score....

Ageroo
07-20-2009, 09:41 AM
PS: What was up with the hate mongering from Forrest?

Forrest has definitely had some bad experiences against playing Honduras. It is etched into his mind forever.....Canada has been burned many times by Honduras' match tactics.......

One of the instances he brought up was from a previous Gold Cup that he was involved in.....

Suspected injured Honduran lying on the ground....Canada kicks the ball into touch.....On the restart, instead of playing the ball back to Canada in the spirit of fair play...the Hondurans take the ball and almost score a goal...the Canadians caught off guard because they were expecting to get the ball back. That is why Forrest has no love for Honduras, and I think that is why the Canadians did not play the ball out right away when the Honduran man was down......

It is all about respect, and from Canada's perspective...the Honduran team has not shown it to them in the past...so why should they.

redcard
07-20-2009, 09:43 AM
I was actually pleased that Canada was not playing the ball out when the fish were flopping around...that was the best tactic to play against these teams...

if the US also did this i would bet the flopping around would stop once those teams get scored on.

Ageroo
07-20-2009, 09:47 AM
I was actually pleased that Canada was not playing the ball out when the fish were flopping around...that was the best tactic to play against these teams...

if the US also did this i would bet the flopping around would stop once those teams get scored on.

That is what I love about the Canadian and for the most Part the U.S. team as well.....fouls happen and instead of rolling around like a wounded seal...they get right back up and try to win back the ball they lost....

But, as we know...this is CONCACAF, and is a part of most of these teams tactics......it is sad, but you are right. It will stop when these teams get scored on while lying on the pitch.

Heathen
07-20-2009, 10:47 AM
rocker: I agree with your sentiments....You cant win if you dont score....

Not really true though, in a knock-out competition. I don't see what difference it makes whether we scored or not when there's a bad penalty decision. What if the score was 4-3 to Honduras in the same game with the penalty being the decider would you instead say you can't win if you don't defend

Shakes McQueen
07-20-2009, 11:11 AM
Not really true though, in a knock-out competition. I don't see what difference it makes whether we scored or not when there's a bad penalty decision. What if the score was 4-3 to Honduras in the same game with the penalty being the decider would you instead say you can't win if you don't defend


Exactly. Or if the score was 7-6, would you say "well, it's our fault for not scoring seven goals!"

The bottom line is Honduras were awarded a one goal advantage for not doing anything.

- Scott

Jamaicanadian
07-20-2009, 11:36 AM
Not really true though, in a knock-out competition. I don't see what difference it makes whether we scored or not when there's a bad penalty decision. What if the score was 4-3 to Honduras in the same game with the penalty being the decider would you instead say you can't win if you don't defend

It's a basic football addage that's all.
Generally, if you do not score you dont have a chance of winning.
If Canada had scored yesterday; Canada has an opportunity to win the game. As simple as that........

Shakes McQueen
07-20-2009, 11:40 AM
It's a basic football addage that's all.
Generally, if you do not score you dont have a chance of winning.
If Canada had scored yesterday; Canada has an opportunity to win the game. As simple as that........

This is a huge logical fallacy. If the score ends 0-0 and goes to extra time, Canada has a chance to win the game too.

It isn't reasonable to just shrug your shoulders and say "well, the team should have overcome the free goals being awarded to their opponents!"

Yeah, we should have done more with our chances. That doesn't make what happened any more reasonable or fair. We lost a game, based on a fraudulent goal.

- Scott

Jamaicanadian
07-20-2009, 11:54 AM
This is a huge logical fallacy. If the score ends 0-0 and goes to extra time, Canada has a chance to win the game too.

It isn't reasonable to just shrug your shoulders and say "well, the team should have overcome the free goals being awarded to their opponents!"

Yeah, we should have done more with our chances. That doesn't make what happened any more reasonable or fair. We lost a game, based on a fraudulent goal.

- Scott

Actually the logical fallacy is not as huge as you've suggested :)
Canada scores and Canada has a chance to win the game.

Unfortunately Canada did not score......

Yohan
07-20-2009, 11:57 AM
Actually the logical fallacy is not as huge as you've suggested :)
Canada scores and Canada has a chance to win the game.

Unfortunately Canada did not score......
if Canada scored in the game, it would have been a 1-0 Canada win, not a 1-1 draw and going into extra time

either way, it doesn't change the fact that it was a terrible call that completely changed the dynamic of the game

Shakes McQueen
07-20-2009, 11:57 AM
Actually the logical fallacy is not as huge as you've suggested :)
Canada scores and Canada has a chance to win the game.

Unfortunately Canada did not score......

Yes, they would have had a chance, because the game would have been tied 1-1. And if Honduras isn't awarded a free goal, the game would have been tied 0-0. Same difference.

- Scott

Nerepis
07-20-2009, 11:59 AM
On the other hand, Honduras also failed to score, other than the "gift", even with Canada pushing forward, and vulnerable to the counterattack. The main problem is the matter of fairness. An unjust decision was the difference in the game. The matter of winning or losing, scoring or not is all rendered moot by the fact that we were not, for the last couple of Gold Cups, playing on a level playing field.

Ageroo
07-20-2009, 12:00 PM
if Canada scored in the game, it would have been a 1-0 Canada win, not a 1-1 draw and going into extra time

either way, it doesn't change the fact that it was a terrible call that completely changed the dynamic of the game

Well.....I think that the fact that Canada did not score is an important point to make..and you can't win if you can't score......but I am with Yohan on this. The whole dynamic of the game and Canada's approach had to change because of this botched call. I thought that the Canadians were doing a pretty good job defending up to this point and creating chances....that all went down the drain with that call.

rocker
07-20-2009, 12:09 PM
either way, it doesn't change the fact that it was a terrible call that completely changed the dynamic of the game

all goals change the dynamic of a game.

If Canada had scored 2 goals before then, if might have changed the dynamic to the point where Honduras doesn't even try a kick like that. Who knows.

but this one came early, so Canada had LOTS of time to score at least 1 fricken goal.

I want to hear the refereeing complaints stop now, and Canadian players look within themselves and just start playing better (by that, I mean scoring some goals).

It's like when I hear students complain to their parents about their grade.... "ohhh, I have such a bad teacher! she's a bitch! she plays favourites" meanwhile the student never studied and did their work at the last minute.

Look within for the source of one's problems.....

refereeing will always cause problems in every league (ask Didier Drogba). The point is to take the referee out of the game. Don't depend on a 0-0 score so you can squeak into extra time or maybe win on penalty kicks. Win the game outright so a ref's bad call, which will always happen, doesn't matter.

The reason Canada has faced so many of these bad calls is cuz they continually put themselves in the situation to have these calls matter.

Shakes McQueen
07-20-2009, 12:11 PM
Normally I agree with a lot of what you say rocker, but I think you're wayyy off base on this one.

- Scott

Dunc
07-20-2009, 12:13 PM
I'm fucking sick of this... really that about sums it up. There's really nothing we can do about it, either. The powers that be in the game are rotten to the highest levels. Regardless of whether it was a deliberate screwjob or not, you can guarantee that there will be no repercussions against that shit ref.

I hope we break some legs next time we take the pitch against Honduras. It may sound harsh, but they pollute the fabric of the game with their utter bullshit, and they do it at our expense.

And Ben Knight, I appreciate you trying to stay level headed but:


To his slight credit, at least Aguilar wasn’t buying the sickening dive-and-die tactics. Hondurans were hitting the deck in appalling numbers, refusing to rise even after it was abundantly clear the ref wasn’t buying any of it. Canada was getting calls, in other words.

He should be giving out bookings for that. That is not Canada getting calls, that is Honduras getting away with things that should be calls. very little irritates me more than seeing a ref just ignore diving when it should be a booking.

Dunc
07-20-2009, 12:18 PM
all goals change the dynamic of a game.

If Canada had scored 2 goals before then, if might have changed the dynamic to the point where Honduras doesn't even try a kick like that. Who knows.

but this one came early, so Canada had LOTS of time to score at least 1 fricken goal.

I want to hear the refereeing complaints stop now, and Canadian players look within themselves and just start playing better (by that, I mean scoring some goals).

It's like when I hear students complain to their parents about their grade.... "ohhh, I have such a bad teacher! she's a bitch! she plays favourites" meanwhile the student never studied and did their work at the last minute.

Look within for the source of one's problems.....

refereeing will always cause problems in every league (ask Didier Drogba). The point is to take the referee out of the game. Don't depend on a 0-0 score so you can squeak into extra time or maybe win on penalty kicks. Win the game outright so a ref's bad call, which will always happen, doesn't matter.

The reason Canada has faced so many of these bad calls is cuz they continually put themselves in the situation to have these calls matter.

So you're saying that it's our fault we couldn't overcome the ref gifting Honduras a free goal early in the match, after which all Honduras had to do was turtle and ride out the 1-0 win.

lol.

maninb
07-20-2009, 12:28 PM
Guaranteed if that ref had given Canada a similar call and we'd have won 1-0 he wouldn't be allowed to ref any Honduran game EVER AGAIN for fear of his safety...Canada is regarded as patsies in Concacaf.

Toronto Ruffrider
07-20-2009, 03:52 PM
Forrest has definitely had some bad experiences against playing Honduras. It is etched into his mind forever.....Canada has been burned many times by Honduras' match tactics.......

One of the instances he brought up was from a previous Gold Cup that he was involved in.....

Suspected injured Honduran lying on the ground....Canada kicks the ball into touch.....On the restart, instead of playing the ball back to Canada in the spirit of fair play...the Hondurans take the ball and almost score a goal...the Canadians caught off guard because they were expecting to get the ball back. That is why Forrest has no love for Honduras, and I think that is why the Canadians did not play the ball out right away when the Honduran man was down......

It is all about respect, and from Canada's perspective...the Honduran team has not shown it to them in the past...so why should they.

Honduras is absolutely the worst at diving, play acting, time wasting and, in general, sportsmanship. Nothing would give me more pleasure than to see Honduras get expelled from FIFA. Naturally, that will never happen.

Honduras and Canada epitomize what I refer to as 'Amrak' - i.e. reverse Karma. Honduras plays classless football, then gets rewarded for it - whether in the Gold Cup or WCQ. Meanwhile, Canada plays well within the spirit of the game, only to get shafted on absurd calls that wouldn't be made in house league. There is no justice in international football in CONCACAF, unless Amrak is considered some perverse form of justice.

Brooker
07-20-2009, 04:09 PM
Honduras played a classy game and Canada lost fair and squa.... hah couldn't even get it all out.

CONCACAF = JOKE

Cannon
07-20-2009, 04:26 PM
I was half-way done thinking out the tirade I was about to unleash on you until I read the second part :D

TorontoBlades
07-20-2009, 04:30 PM
I don't know how this is TFC related in any way

Blizzard
07-20-2009, 05:36 PM
all goals change the dynamic of a game.

If Canada had scored 2 goals before then, if might have changed the dynamic to the point where Honduras doesn't even try a kick like that. Who knows.

but this one came early, so Canada had LOTS of time to score at least 1 fricken goal.

I want to hear the refereeing complaints stop now, and Canadian players look within themselves and just start playing better (by that, I mean scoring some goals).

It's like when I hear students complain to their parents about their grade.... "ohhh, I have such a bad teacher! she's a bitch! she plays favourites" meanwhile the student never studied and did their work at the last minute.

Look within for the source of one's problems.....

refereeing will always cause problems in every league (ask Didier Drogba). The point is to take the referee out of the game. Don't depend on a 0-0 score so you can squeak into extra time or maybe win on penalty kicks. Win the game outright so a ref's bad call, which will always happen, doesn't matter.

The reason Canada has faced so many of these bad calls is cuz they continually put themselves in the situation to have these calls matter.

Where's Barbarez when you need him. He'd know how to reply to this post. :canada:

Blizzard
07-20-2009, 05:37 PM
I don't know how this is TFC related in any way

Ali G was on the field. Nuff said!