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View Full Version : TSN to Broadcast 2009 MLS All-Star in High Definition...



Carts
07-13-2009, 02:13 PM
Although it won't be big on the radar screens for all of us, since we're playing Puerto Rico in the Champions League that night, TSN is dipping its toe into MLS waters...

Wednesday July 29th - 9:30pm/et
MLS All-Stars vs Everton FC
TSN HD

TSN will be picking up the broadcast from ESPN2...

Prior to the All-Star TSN is airing taped programming, so there is no worry the game would be delayed by a longer than scheduled event...

Its a start...

Carts...

Brooker
07-13-2009, 02:44 PM
WOW. I'm stunned.

Shakes McQueen
07-13-2009, 02:46 PM
That's cool!

Glad to see it. TSN might be annoying in a lot of ways, but they would do TFC coverage the most justice, if they were to dive into it.

- Scott

Hitcho
07-13-2009, 02:47 PM
TSN and HD? Interesting. I wish we could get all TFC games in HD, that'd be kick ass.

On another note - if any TFC players get into the AS squad, can we assume they will be excused from duty to play in the CL instead?

Yohan
07-13-2009, 02:49 PM
good to see TSN picking up the game, but just exactly how many viewers will TSN get, since most people will watch the CCL match? Minus Beckham fanbois, of course

zeelaw
07-13-2009, 02:52 PM
Wow. Once again TSN steals whats hot from those that make it big.
Well not yet, but its a sign of things to come?

bee dubya
07-13-2009, 03:03 PM
That's cool!

Glad to see it. TSN might be annoying in a lot of ways, but they would do TFC coverage the most justice, if they were to dive into it.

- Scott

How exactly would TSN do TFC coverage the most justice? TSN doesn't regularly cover soccer/football at the moment and even when they had the Champions League, they didn't have any of their own talent on the show - they simply plug and play whatever ESPN sends down the line. I don't know about you but I'd rather see The Score, Gol or Sportsnet do their own football coverage.

That being said, I'm cool with TSN showing the MLS all-star game. The more exposure for the sport in Canada, the better. Also, I'd love to see more games in HD, even if that means ESPN 2's coverage.

Eastend
07-13-2009, 03:07 PM
TSN and HD? Interesting. I wish we could get all TFC games in HD, that'd be kick ass.

On another note - if any TFC players get into the AS squad, can we assume they will be excused from duty to play in the CL instead?

The starting 11 were announced today and DeRo is amoung them:

http://web.mlsnet.com/news/mls_news.jsp?ymd=20090713&content_id=5860306&vkey=pr_mls&fext=.jsp

Keyman
07-13-2009, 03:10 PM
hahahahaha WTF

Carts
07-13-2009, 03:16 PM
How exactly would TSN do TFC coverage the most justice? TSN doesn't regularly cover soccer/football at the moment and even when they had the Champions League, they didn't have any of their own talent on the show - they simply plug and play whatever ESPN sends down the line. I don't know about you but I'd rather see The Score, Gol or Sportsnet do their own football coverage.

That being said, I'm cool with TSN showing the MLS all-star game. The more exposure for the sport in Canada, the better. Also, I'd love to see more games in HD, even if that means ESPN 2's coverage.

That's not the case if they were to sign a deal with Toronto FC, as there are CRTC regulations on what must be produced as Canadian Content...

The CRTC has a million and one rules about Canada content as compared to international content (both in production, news, advertising, promotion etc)...

A one-time game that is played in the United States, between an All-Star team of American teams (except for one) vs a team from England, would easily be classified as International, allowing for a "plug in" broadcast from an American or international partner...

A season long deal, with games in Toronto would be classified as Canadian Content, and therefor would need to be produced in Canada, using the local workers...

The Score's limited availablilty (limited compared to CBC / TSN etc) allows them to do a hybrid broadcast, where they must produce a certain amount of minutes by themselves, while being allowed to use the plug in for the event...

The Score uses almost 7-hours of their international broadcast hours a week on the WWE - to avoid those counting as LIVE International Plug Ins, they tape-delay by 15-minutes, so it counts as 'Taped Programming" - thus dodging a bit of the rule...

Its confusing, and a mess at times. But if the day ever came that TSN had a broadcast deal with TFC, the home game would be produced by TSN for sure, road game would have at least a preview studio show & halftime show to allow for a plug in...

There's a huge financial difference in producing an MLS game from Chicago, being shown in prime-time, to producing a game from England across the Atlantic Ocean being shown in the middle of the day...

Comparing those two to see what the coverage would be like is not a fair comparioson at all...

Carts...

bee dubya
07-13-2009, 03:25 PM
^ Carts I'm not saying TSN wouldn't do a good job of broadcasting soccer. I was simply questioning Shakes' post as to the legitimacy of his claim that TSN would be a great thing for MLS/TFC. It simply isn't proven.

I think TSN would do a good job on soccer and I'd be interested to see how it's done as they don't really have a "soccer crew" - Maybe Vic Rauter and Dick Howard to host but who would do the Play by play call?

You're right that this is a different situation as they aren't producing the game and they're simply re-broadcasting the ESPN 2 feed. Again, I applaud the move. I'm glad to see the exposure. In fact, I'll likely set up my PVR to record the game to watch when I get home from our game with the PR Islanders.

TFC07
07-13-2009, 03:31 PM
This game is going to be on main network or TSN2?

Carts
07-13-2009, 03:36 PM
This game is going to be on main network or TSN2?

Main network...

Carts...

Shakes McQueen
07-13-2009, 03:38 PM
^ Carts I'm not saying TSN wouldn't do a good job of broadcasting soccer. I was simply questioning Shakes' post as to the legitimacy of his claim that TSN would be a great thing for MLS/TFC. It simply isn't proven.

I think TSN would do a good job on soccer and I'd be interested to see how it's done as they don't really have a "soccer crew" - Maybe Vic Rauter and Dick Howard to host but who would do the Play by play call?

You're right that this is a different situation as they aren't producing the game and they're simply re-broadcasting the ESPN 2 feed. Again, I applaud the move. I'm glad to see the exposure. In fact, I'll likely set up my PVR to record the game to watch when I get home from our game with the PR Islanders.

I use TSN and the CFL as an example of what TFC coverage COULD be like.

TSN secured exclusive access to CFL games, and poured tons of money into promoting the game, having a professional post and pre-game show, and good production values during game broadcasts.

I'd love to see TSN do the same thing with TFC. They are a wealthier channel than Sportsnet, so they would likely offer all games in HD, create some sort of pre/post game coverage show, and my guess is you'd see them try to hire (at that point) former TFC guys like Dichio or Brennan to do analysis on those shows, or in the booth. Much like they have former CFL guys doing CFL analysis and colour commentary.

When TSN owns the TV rights to a team/league, they market the shit out of it, to get the max return on their investment. This would benefit everyone involved - TSN, MLS, and TFC.

This All-Star Game broadcast will be nothing like that, since it's just airing ESPN's feed - but I'm just hoping it's the first small step in TSN eventually getting involved in TFC telecasts.

I appreciate what Sportsnet and The Score have done for us, in letting us watch our team play, but their broadcasts have absolutely no polish whatsoever - bad camerawork, bad sound, standard definition, the list goes on. TSN even covers niche bullshit events like "Red Bull Crashed Ice" with a level of polish not seen on most Sportsnet shows, besides Jays games, and maybe Sportsnet Connected.

- Scott

Hitcho
07-13-2009, 03:44 PM
The starting 11 were announced today and DeRo is amoung them:

http://web.mlsnet.com/news/mls_news.jsp?ymd=20090713&content_id=5860306&vkey=pr_mls&fext=.jsp

Thanks Eastend. I take it that means that De Ro is gone for the CL game then? If so, that's bullshit. This is nothing more than a marketing gig for the league, whereas the CL qualifier is a HUGE deal for TFC. I'll be pissed if he's taken away for a meaningless friendly, and even mroe pissed if one of those bitter hacks injures him...

Shakes McQueen
07-13-2009, 03:50 PM
Thanks Eastend. I take it that means that De Ro is gone for the CL game then? If so, that's bullshit. This is nothing more than a marketing gig for the league, whereas the CL qualifier is a HUGE deal for TFC. I'll be pissed if he's taken away for a meaningless friendly, and even mroe pissed if one of those bitter hacks injures him...

Ives is reporting that DeRo won't be available for the ASG due to our CCL game.

- Scott

bee dubya
07-13-2009, 03:50 PM
Just because TSN may spend more money on CFL doesn't mean that they would spend the same amount of money on MLS. CFL consistently gets good ratings for TSN, which justifies the amount of money spent on the games (which btw aren't all in HD - just because something's 16x9 doesn't mean it's HD).

I don't think TSN is ready to test the waters for MLS beyond the All-Star game at this point. TSN has lots of rights packages already, NHL, NBA, NASCAR, PGA, etc to fill both TSN and TSN2. I think TSN will sit back and observe MLS a little longer before they move into that market. They'll only do it if it makes sense for them to do so.

As an aside, I think the Red Bull Crashed Ice thing was produced by Red Bull - they produce the Red Bull Air Race stuff themselves (or through a secondary production company).

I realize that I'm starting to sound like a TSN hater though, so I'll stop. I don't hate TSN. I think they'd be great for the sport. I just don't see them wanting to be involved with full production at this point.

Stryker
07-13-2009, 03:52 PM
Thanks Eastend. I take it that means that De Ro is gone for the CL game then? If so, that's bullshit. This is nothing more than a marketing gig for the league, whereas the CL qualifier is a HUGE deal for TFC. I'll be pissed if he's taken away for a meaningless friendly, and even mroe pissed if one of those bitter hacks injures him...

If he stands by what he said earlier about focusing on the club then he'll be taking the field in a TFC kit that night.
Which I expect he will.

Shakes McQueen
07-13-2009, 04:03 PM
Just because TSN may spend more money on CFL doesn't mean that they would spend the same amount of money on MLS. CFL consistently gets good ratings for TSN, which justifies the amount of money spent on the games (which btw aren't all in HD - just because something's 16x9 doesn't mean it's HD).

I don't think TSN is ready to test the waters for MLS beyond the All-Star game at this point. TSN has lots of rights packages already, NHL, NBA, NASCAR, PGA, etc to fill both TSN and TSN2. I think TSN will sit back and observe MLS a little longer before they move into that market. They'll only do it if it makes sense for them to do so.

As an aside, I think the Red Bull Crashed Ice thing was produced by Red Bull - they produce the Red Bull Air Race stuff themselves (or through a secondary production company).

I realize that I'm starting to sound like a TSN hater though, so I'll stop. I don't hate TSN. I think they'd be great for the sport. I just don't see them wanting to be involved with full production at this point.

It's entirely possible, which is why I qualified my statement that it's what their TFC broadcasts COULD be like.

I don't expect TSN to be broadcasting TFC games next season, but this is a first step in testing the waters. They didn't broadcast the ASG last season - CBC did. And they aren't burying it on TSN2, so my guess is they want to see what kind of numbers the game draws.

One correction though: I think TSN produces the Crashed Ice things, because I've watched them before, and Jay Onrait was hosting it, complete with standard TSN graphics and stuff.

CFL gets decent ratings for TSN, but TFC games could potentially do equally as well, and would require them to only invest in one timeslot, per week, as opposed to four for CFL games.

I firmly believe TFC could pull better TV numbers, if their broadcasts were produced a lot better, and the marketing was there. It isn't on Sportsnet, and most casual sports fans don't even know GolTV exists.

- Scott

Hitcho
07-13-2009, 04:03 PM
Ives is reporting that DeRo won't be available for the ASG due to our CCL game.

- Scott

Sweet. I was speaking to Paul B at the V-Cup wlecome home party and he was hinting that any TFC players picked for the AS game would play int he CL regardless, but thatw as more along the lines of paying in games on consecutive days, as some players did last year after the Houston match and floodlight outage. So if De Ro just doesn't show because the dates clash then so much the better! :scarf:

twistedchinaman
07-14-2009, 12:13 AM
Um...finally?

MLS ASG on TSN vs. CCL game on CBC/RSN -- the ultimate clash.

Ossington Mental Youth
07-14-2009, 12:15 AM
id imagine the few people that follow this league in canada are prob TFC fans and wont be watching this. too bad, id watch in the future but they dont get me this time

loconet
07-14-2009, 08:35 AM
That's cool, although they should (http://tsn.ca/soccer/feature/?id=10991) probably start by getting our roster right..

TicTacTabarnack
07-14-2009, 10:08 AM
Um...finally?

MLS ASG on TSN vs. CCL game on CBC/RSN -- the ultimate clash.

I'm predicting an MLS ASG flop on TSN ... They'll use it as an indication to why they shouldn't broadcast MLS games and forget that that majority of the people that would have watched the game come from a market that actually has a team in the MLS this year and have no players playing in the ASG b/c we're more concerned about another more important game.

Redcoe15
07-14-2009, 10:30 AM
Um...finally?

MLS ASG on TSN vs. CCL game on CBC/RSN -- the ultimate clash.
Duh, no contest: :scarf:

JonO
07-14-2009, 10:41 AM
Yeah - I hope they're not expecting too much in terms of ratings for this match considering the scheduling conflict...

menefreghista
07-14-2009, 10:59 AM
Yeah - I hope they're not expecting too much in terms of ratings for this match considering the scheduling conflict...

If the Champions League match ends up on Gol TV, the All-Star game will get a much better rating.

By the way, there may be very little over-lap with the two games. If I recall from last year's All-Star game, the match didn't start till well after the supposed real start time written on the ticket. After all the intros and anthems and whatever the game started almost half an hour later.

I'm sure people at home will be able to watch both games without missing much.

ForestGlade
07-14-2009, 09:29 PM
I may be wrong here, but I thought I read a while ago about TSN owning more than the broadcast rights to the CFL, but also a huge sharehold in the league.

TSN's commitment to the CFL has them broadcasting 3-4 games a week, all in hi-definition. Couple that in with their NHL playoff coverage and you'd see a majority of games relegated to TSN2 and lucky if they're in hi-definition, imo

ilikemusic
07-15-2009, 01:07 AM
Wow!

TSN seemed the least likely network to pick it up.

Glad to hear anyway.

TSN2 is still garbage though. They should be showing MLS on that stupid network instead of just running what was on TSN 3 hours ago. :facepalm:

twistedchinaman
07-15-2009, 01:56 AM
I'm predicting an MLS ASG flop on TSN ... They'll use it as an indication to why they shouldn't broadcast MLS games and forget that that majority of the people that would have watched the game come from a market that actually has a team in the MLS this year and have no players playing in the ASG b/c we're more concerned about another more important game.

Yep, sounds like TSN logic.

Ossington Mental Youth
07-15-2009, 02:02 AM
will this be on the innernets?
whats the time for kick off again?

Pookie
07-15-2009, 05:10 AM
Yep, sounds like TSN logic.

I too think it will flop given our game on the same night.

Speaking of which, who is carrying that? GolTV?

ensco
07-15-2009, 07:15 AM
All this is, is an interesting poke in the eye at whoever is showing that TFC Concacaf game (RSN or GolTV or whomever)

When one of the networks has a legitimately big game, and the other doesn't have a contractual commitment to show something (ie a Jays/Raptors/Leafs game), that's when they counterprogram (ie put the cheapest show possible on that has the lowest possible overlap, such as poker).

This is the opposite of counterprogramming. This is TSN saying "we're coming after you that night because we think, especially outside of Toronto, more people will care about Beckham than will care about TFC". Which is probably true.

The HD bit costs them squat, as the cost of that is already being born by their minority shareholder, ESPN.

I think it means nothing in the greater scheme of things. CFL comparison is meaningless, as CFL always has been able to get Jays-type ratings (200K-300K a night), and CFL has the Grey Cup, one of the 10 biggest ratings events of the year in Canada. The Grey Cup is what keeps the CFL alive.

Once TFC starts doing those kind of numbers, TFC will have value and TSN will want them.

greatwhitenorf
07-15-2009, 07:45 AM
If TSN aren't showing Champions League games any more, who now has the Canadian rights for these games? Won't mind this change as seeing curling pre-empt soccer was frustrating.

Fort York Redcoat
07-15-2009, 08:02 AM
All this is, is an interesting poke in the eye at whoever is showing that TFC Concacaf game (RSN or GolTV or whomever)

.

I'm tired of TSNs eye poking. They take the Grey Cup (production-meh). They take the hockey song (production-inferior). Now they take the All-star game (I enjoyed what our tax dollars produced).

I'm purchasing anti-TSN safety goggles.

Shakes McQueen
07-15-2009, 08:04 AM
All this is, is an interesting poke in the eye at whoever is showing that TFC Concacaf game (RSN or GolTV or whomever)

When one of the networks has a legitimately big game, and the other doesn't have a contractual commitment to show something (ie a Jays/Raptors/Leafs game), that's when they counterprogram (ie put the cheapest show possible on that has the lowest possible overlap, such as poker).

This is the opposite of counterprogramming. This is TSN saying "we're coming after you that night because we think, especially outside of Toronto, more people will care about Beckham than will care about TFC". Which is probably true.

The HD bit costs them squat, as the cost of that is already being born by their minority shareholder, ESPN.

I think it means nothing in the greater scheme of things. CFL comparison is meaningless, as CFL always has been able to get Jays-type ratings (200K-300K a night), and CFL has the Grey Cup, one of the 10 biggest ratings events of the year in Canada. The Grey Cup is what keeps the CFL alive.

Once TFC starts doing those kind of numbers, TFC will have value and TSN will want them.

My optimism at TSN's move to show the ASG, is as baseless as your pessimism that this is just an elaborate middle finger to another network.

This is Beckham's third year in the league, and yet to my knowledge, this is the first time TSN has ever bothered to broadcast an MLS ASG, or any MLS content period. I also see TFC stories are starting to turn up more frequently on TSN.ca's main page.

Based on previous posts from McCartney here, we know that TFC games have pulled in nearly 200K before on the CBC. They aren't routinely that high though.

Most post stated that I hope this is a sign of TSN taking a little notice of TFC/MLS, and hopefully down the road getting involved in broadcasting their games. And if TFC's TV numbers hopefully get a bit stronger and consistent over the next few seasons, to the point where they draw numbers comparative to CFL games on a consistent basis, perhaps TSN will dive in.

Ultimately analyzing moves like these just comes down to reading tea leaves, and you could see it any number of ways. My point wasn't to compare the CFL's numbers to TFC's numbers - my point was that I'd love to see the same production values come to TFC games.

- Scott

JonO
07-15-2009, 08:08 AM
If the Champions League match ends up on Gol TV, the All-Star game will get a much better rating.

By the way, there may be very little over-lap with the two games. If I recall from last year's All-Star game, the match didn't start till well after the supposed real start time written on the ticket. After all the intros and anthems and whatever the game started almost half an hour later.

I'm sure people at home will be able to watch both games without missing much.
People at home yes, but there are 20,000+ who were likely to watch the allstar that will be at BMO when the all-star game starts (and since we're talking about a typical viewership of less that 100K, that's a pretty big chunk...)

Shakes McQueen
07-15-2009, 08:13 AM
People at home yes, but there are 20,000+ who were likely to watch the allstar that will be at BMO when the all-star game starts (and since we're talking about a typical viewership of less that 100K, that's a pretty big chunk...)

My guess is that viewership for the ASG will be a lot higher than usual, just because it's on TSN, and a lot of people will say "hey, doesn't that Beckham guy play in this league? Maybe I will watch for a while..."

Plus, since the game will be involving mostly talented players, perhaps the level of play will be good enough to keep casuals tuned in. I thought last year's game was actually pretty good, once the crowd started to warm up to the largely TFC-less "All-Stars".

- Scott

ForestGlade
07-15-2009, 08:41 AM
If TSN aren't showing Champions League games any more, who now has the Canadian rights for these games? Won't mind this change as seeing curling pre-empt soccer was frustrating.

Sportsnet has been airing promos saying they've acquired the rights to the UEFA Champions League and unlike TSN, will be showing all games in HD, not just the Final

Fort York Redcoat
07-15-2009, 08:45 AM
Sportsnet has been airing promos saying they've acquired the rights to the UEFA Champions League and unlike TSN, will be showing all games in HD, not just the Final

A network that likes the sport?

:yum:

bee dubya
07-15-2009, 11:48 AM
I think TSN broadcast the MLS All-Star game (vs Chelsea) in 2006. I remember watching the game and I'm 95% certain that TSN was the network that broadcast the game (again, probably a simulcast of ESPN's feed).

It's good to see that TSN is showing this year's game as well. It'll make for some decent PVR material anyway.

ensco
07-15-2009, 06:59 PM
Scott, TSN will have nothing to do with the ASG production. It'll all be ESPN. That's a big part of the attraction of the event - it would be uneconomic if they had to lay out production dollars.

Shakes McQueen
07-15-2009, 09:15 PM
Scott, TSN will have nothing to do with the ASG production. It'll all be ESPN. That's a big part of the attraction of the event - it would be uneconomic if they had to lay out production dollars.

I know that the production of the ASG this year is costing TSN nothing, essentially.

My point is that they are choosing to air it, and on the main network no less. I assume it would have been equally economically attractive in years past, when they chose not to air it, despite ESPN doing most of the legwork.

I don't know if it's a sign of anything - I'm just hoping it is. And if it pulls pretty good numbers, perhaps they will rethink their nonexistent relationship with both MLS and TFC.

- Scott

ensco
07-15-2009, 09:46 PM
The past two year the ASG was on CBC, so I doubt TSN had any shot at the game. I guess we'd have to understand better how the rights work. Do CBC and RSN get "right of first refusal" as a part of their TFC deal?

Here's my guess as to how this went down.

I'm guessing that CBC/RSN (i) chose not to go head to head against their TFC broadcast partner on GolTV or (ii) maybe they contractually couldn't....what's interesting is that it seems both CBC and Sportsnet could have picked the ASG up this year (there is no obvious reason why not - the Jays play an afternoon game that day). I also wonder if the fact that TFC are putting Real Madrid on GolTV instead of CBC/RSN is part of what's going on. CBC and RSN can't be happy about that.

I think, for all these reasons, TFC wanted the PRI game on the 28th (that was the date that was floating around until PRI cried foul because they play in Vancouver on the 25th). If the PRI game had been on the 28th, then one of CBC/RSN could have had the ASG on the 29th, with no head-to-head problem against TFC....

TFC USA
07-15-2009, 09:50 PM
Enjoy our American commentators!

mr k
07-16-2009, 12:48 PM
TSN is also showing lacrosse all star game tonight at 10.

Cas87
07-16-2009, 12:55 PM
I too think it will flop given our game on the same night.

Speaking of which, who is carrying that? GolTV?

Yup Gol Canada has both (home and away).
With that I am assuming that they (or RSN) are going to show group stage matches, if we get that far