What's going on with Sutton

[kdzb]

Is he sick or something?
I know Frei is becoming the # 1 now but is Sutton going to play the role of the backup keeper all season?
I hope MO can ship him somewhere where he is needed as a 1st keeper.
He is a waste to be sitting in the bench all season. Just my thought

[mighty_torontofc_2008]

this is where the reserve league would have help, he would have got playing time, but Garber want to reduce expences so the reserve league went. No hes not sick, Frei is just a better Keeper

[CenturySam]

i really thought he was going in against Vancouver. i guess not, maybe against Montreal next week?

[mighty_torontofc_2008]

i really thought he was going in against Vancouver. i guess not, maybe against Montreal next week?


No Cummins said he will play his best...so no Sutton for the near furure.
Even edwards must be itching for playing time!!

[kdzb]

I guess he can be a good fit to replace Onstad in Houston.
I believe Onstad is 41 or something.
The problem is if he doesn't play enough minutes, the National Team coach will not call him for international games. I don't know what are the requirements to be called to the Canadian National Team.

[TFC Cityboy]

Sutts will be lucky to displace Stefan at this rate. Hope we keep him but with no reserve league it's a challenge to keep him and the other squad players matchfit

[drewski]

I don't know what are the requirements to be called to the Canadian National Team.

a pulse??

[wzhxvy]

If I was to guess...I would guess Suttin starts this weekend against DC

[Carts]

I keep waiting for Sutton to get a start soon too - but Frei keeps saving games for us, how do you take him out...

He may need his rest, but he's a young kid - if he's hot, keep it going...

Frei is 10-times better than I thought a rookie netminder was going to be...

Carts...

[Detroit_TFC]

Frei is not signing any mortgages in Toronto, we'd be sorry if we got rid of Sutton. Problem is he's not going to be match fit when we need him. Cummins may want to think about a reasonable rotation plan.

[olegunnar]

If I was to guess...I would guess Suttin starts this weekend against DC

I agree

then Frei again on wednesday

Frei's on a roll no need to subject him to RFK stadium and our annual ass kicking there.

We've played there 3 times in our history....two 4-1 losses and the Sutton softy 3-2 loss

[SteeltownBhoy]

Is he sick or something?
I know Frei is becoming the # 1 now but is Sutton going to play the role of the backup keeper all season?
I hope MO can ship him somewhere where he is needed as a 1st keeper.
He is a waste to be sitting in the bench all season. Just my thought

When we PIMP Frei out to Europe to pay for our grass and roof, there will be plenty of playing time for Sutton.

[torontocelt]

Based on what I have seen of him Frei is going to be our biggest asset in the years to come if we can keep him that long. He undoubtedly has a lot of talent and I would be surprised if no one in Europe picks him up in the next two years if he continues to play like this. I was thinking the other day how much it would take for a European club to buy him at the end of the season, I reckon $2m would get him as he is still a rookie although it could be more of less.

[Up The TFC]

When we PIMP Frei out to Europe to pay for our grass and roof, there will be plenty of playing time for Sutton.

I absolutely believe this will happen.

In the meantime we ride him as hard as we can. We need wins.

[iansmcl]

Loan Sutton with a recall clause.

[kitchener-TFC]

Frei's on a roll no need to subject him to RFK stadium and our annual ass kicking there.

This is the year when all of this stops! If we can get past the mental aspect of being on the road, we'll get a win:scarf:.

[FluSH]

Did anyone watch Cummins' post game interview?

Reporter: Did you think at any one time to start Sutton for this game?

CC: Absolutely not. (followed by how great Frei has played and that he's earned his paycheque)

[bhoybobby]

this is where the reserve league would have help, he would have got playing time, but Garber want to reduce expences so the reserve league went. No hes not sick, Frei is just a better Keeper

I liked Sutton, but you're spot on, Frei is in a different class. If he keeps this up, he'll be sold for huge profit & rightly so

[shaggingscot]

Based on what I have seen of him Frei is going to be our biggest asset in the years to come if we can keep him that long. He undoubtedly has a lot of talent and I would be surprised if no one in Europe picks him up in the next two years if he continues to play like this. I was thinking the other day how much it would take for a European club to buy him at the end of the season, I reckon $2m would get him as he is still a rookie although it could be more of less.


If Edu fetched 5 million then Frei would be at least that if not more. If he can learn to commend his 6 yard box a little better on crosses some team in Europe will pay handsomely for a keeper with that sort of shot stopping ability.

I have a bad feeling this is the only season we'll get the chance to enjoy watching him in TFC's kit.

[J .]

Frei is way better than Sutton. Sutton has always been a good MLS backup never a top notch starter in the league.

[rocker]

Edwards must be bored out of his mind... at least Sutton got to play in a game.
Edwards doesn't have anything. What a waste. they better get that reserve league back next year.

[Sonny Cheeba]

If Edu fetched 5 million then Frei would be at least that if not more. If he can learn to commend his 6 yard box a little better on crosses some team in Europe will pay handsomely for a keeper with that sort of shot stopping ability.

I have a bad feeling this is the only season we'll get the chance to enjoy watching him in TFC's kit.

^as am i. visions of Zaluska.

[jloome]

Based on what I have seen of him Frei is going to be our biggest asset in the years to come if we can keep him that long. He undoubtedly has a lot of talent and I would be surprised if no one in Europe picks him up in the next two years if he continues to play like this. I was thinking the other day how much it would take for a European club to buy him at the end of the season, I reckon $2m would get him as he is still a rookie although it could be more of less.

Not a chance.

He's got euro status as a swiss citizen, so they don't even have to worry about a work permit. Given what Edu went for and this kid's potential -- which is truly, truly frightening; he looks like a young schmeichel -- I can see MLS asking for $5 million easy.

[Gazza_55]

Not a chance.

He's got euro status as a swiss citizen, so they don't even have to worry about a work permit. Given what Edu went for and this kid's potential -- which is truly, truly frightening; he looks like a young schmeichel -- I can see MLS asking for $5 million easy.

Toronto and MLS should set the price at $10m and only after it is met ask Stefan if HE WANTS TO LEAVE. The salary cap is going up alot next year so he'll get a hefty raise and you never know ...... maybe he likes it here. Sure the transfer fee is nice but I'd rather have a great keeper for the next ten years.

[ExiledRed]

Id up his pay to the max. Goalies have longer careers, and sometimes it's better to be the first keeper at a team at this level than a backup keeper on a euro team.
I'd hope we can keep him another season.

Sutton did great when he came on for Frei, and I'm comfortable with him on the bench.

[torontocelt]

Toronto and MLS should set the price at $10m and only after it is met ask Stefan if HE WANTS TO LEAVE. The salary cap is going up alot next year so he'll get a hefty raise and you never know ...... maybe he likes it here. Sure the transfer fee is nice but I'd rather have a great keeper for the next ten years.

Frei is still an untested rookie playing in a league where finishing isn't exactly the best in the world. If a big club came in for him it would be wrong of the MLS to even consider wanting $10m for him, that is ridiculous. How much did Guzman go for wasn't it $1.2? He was going out of contract but still they were only looking for $4m originally. Guzman had played for three years in the MLS and also played for the US ten times or so, that record is way better than Frei who has played 7 games or so in the MLS.

I like Frei as much as the next man, he has a lot of potential however he is a long way off a $10m player. I stand by what I say, if the MLS are offered in the region of $2m - $3m that would be a fair estimation for his current ability. Also he is a long way off Peter Schmichael and I mean a long, long way.

[ensco]

Frei may go to Europe, but he ain't worth even a fraction of $5 million right now

1) Edu had featured for a FIFA top 20 MNT. This was 100% responsible for Edu's transfer value, his TFC performance was almost irrelevant. Frei hasn't even had a sniff to even be a backup for the lesser Swiss MNT.
2) Edu was sold pre credit crisis, at the top of the market
3) The market for GKs is never as bubbly as the market for field players

Sutton has to do what any pro would - stay sharp in practice, and be ready to step in at any time. I'm not sure if he'll be here long term - $150K is a lot for a backup GK in the cap system.

[SanStarko]

I would be very surprised if Cummins decided to bring Sutton in for a game in place of Frei. Unless Frei is injured there is no reason to drop him for any game. He's playing well, his confidence is high and the more games he plays the more used to him our defenders will become meaning the better our defence will get.

Even just based on the few games he's played for us it seems quite clear that Frei is a far better keeper than Sutton. Suttons a great shot stopper, but is lacking in so many other areas.

[loyola]

Loan Sutton with a recall clause.

RSL have already loaned their back up keeper, Chris Seitz, twice this season.

He played one game with the Cleveland City Stars and two games with Portland in the USL.

I would like to see a similar deal for Sutton with a recall clause in case of a possible Frei injury. You keep Edwards on the bench while Sutton is away.

[Pookie]

7 games and 25 saves into a pro career and it's time to ask for $10M and a place in history next to Schmeichel?

I thought my fellow Leaf fans were bad.

[Gazza_55]

Frei is still an untested rookie playing in a league where finishing isn't exactly the best in the world. If a big club came in for him it would be wrong of the MLS to even consider wanting $10m for him, that is ridiculous. How much did Guzman go for wasn't it $1.2? He was going out of contract but still they were only looking for $4m originally. Guzman had played for three years in the MLS and also played for the US ten times or so, that record is way better than Frei who has played 7 games or so in the MLS.

I like Frei as much as the next man, he has a lot of potential however he is a long way off a $10m player. I stand by what I say, if the MLS are offered in the region of $2m - $3m that would be a fair estimation for his current ability. Also he is a long way off Peter Schmichael and I mean a long, long way.

That is not a fair offer for Toronto FC. No way MLSE would agree to that. We want to win titles and giving away our best players and counting on backups because we want a short term cash injection of what 2/3 of $3m?
We get in the Concacaf Champions League quarters or semis and finals and MLSE makes $3 million a match if they are played at Skydome.

[Pookie]

7 games
25 saves

That's what you are selling...

[torontocelt]

That is not a fair offer for Toronto FC. No way MLSE would agree to that. We want to win titles and giving away our best players and counting on backups because we want a short term cash injection of what 2/3 of $3m?
We get in the Concacaf Champions League quarters or semis and finals and MLSE makes $3 million a match if they are played at Skydome.

I would say that is fair to Toronto considering they got him a few months ago for nothing. He has potential but that is it so far and the MLS and Toronto FC should be seen as selling club for players who have aspirations to play at a higher level. To ask a ridiculous amount of money for a player with no pedigree and potentially stopping a career enhancing move would be morally wrong of the MLS. Anyway it is all hypothetical, I just think he will possibly be the next to leave if he keeps up his good performances. Players of his current calibre move for peanuts at the moment in Europe. Lets not forget Celtic signed Arthur Boruc for $1m only a few seasons ago.

[mighty_torontofc_2008]

If I was to guess...I would guess Suttin starts this weekend against DC


No chance....

[mighty_torontofc_2008]

I liked Sutton, but you're spot on, Frei is in a different class. If he keeps this up, he'll be sold for huge profit & rightly so

i like Sutton too....but Frei has been our player of the year up to this point in the season...Greg can go and help Canada out at the Gold Cup,
he should start there. Edwards is also young and should be the back up,
TFC should try and deal Sutton...Philly?Columbus? FC Dallas, teams that
need help badly in that position.

[olegunnar]

That is not a fair offer for Toronto FC. No way MLSE would agree to that. We want to win titles and giving away our best players and counting on backups because we want a short term cash injection of what 2/3 of $3m?
We get in the Concacaf Champions League quarters or semis and finals and MLSE makes $3 million a match if they are played at Skydome.

As a point of reference
MLS got 1.2 million for selling Guzan to Villa

I'm the worlds biggest Frei fan...for his abilities, and most importantly for keeping Sutton on the bench (my anger management coach appreciates frei for this reason as well). He's my hero. I wouldn't sell him for anything

Still in relation to prior sells, I don't think we could expect much more than 1.5-2 million for him.

edit: I think he'd be worth more than Guzan because of Frei's age and passport.

[Limani_Ole]

I dont think Frei is better than Sutton.. but im sure he has a huge upside... and Sutton is peaking or has peaked..


I would be more concerned if TFC becomes a "Selling" team..

[SteeltownBhoy]

I would be more concerned if TFC becomes a "Selling" team..

It's not that TFC is a selling team, with the poverty level wages MLS is a selling league,
will continue to be until salary cap is increased.

[Steve]

I dont think Frei is better than Sutton.. but im sure he has a huge upside... and Sutton is peaking or has peaked..


I would be more concerned if TFC becomes a "Selling" team..

In the short term (10-20 years) this is exactly what we should become. In fact, that's what every team in MLS should strive to become Why? Because by being known as a selling league, we get players to play who could have a great future, because they know it's a stepping stone (and not the death of their aspirations). Plus, MLS starts pulling in a lot of money by selling players, which allows them to pay players more, and grow the league. It's really a great business model, since top players are so highly valued in other leagues. We should try to use their inflated transfer fees to fund the growth of our league.

[Pookie]

It's only been... 7 games
It's only been... 7 games

Twenty Five saves, is all that he's made
Walking in a Toronto Fantasy Land

:drum:

[Jack]

I'm with Pookie on this one.

Let's wait until he's had a couple of seasons under his belt and been called up to Switzerland before we get dreams of huge payouts for Frei.

No question he's been good, but I think perhaps we forget that sometimes MLS can make people look better than they are.

[Yohan]

No question he's been good, but I think perhaps we forget that sometimes MLS can make people look better than they are.
*cougheddiejohnsoncough*

[bhoybobby]

I dont think Frei is better than Sutton.. but im sure he has a huge upside... and Sutton is peaking or has peaked..


I would be more concerned if TFC becomes a "Selling" team..

Any team that's not got huge telivision revenues, or participating in Champions league footie every year is a selling team if the price is right.

[counterattack]

Stephen has played surprisingly well in the 7 games so far, but hasn't had to make a lot of saves. This is due partly to the bad quality of finishing around the league but also because of the success of the 2 dmid formation we've played in the last few games.
A lot of his saves have made highlight reels, but really only 1 was eye popping special (the lower right hand push away against KC). Most importantly, he's made no eye popping blunders; a couple of missed crosses & errant clearances did not cost him.
Sutton isn't a long term backup - he is too expensive and really not good enough. He held the starting job last year because it is conventional soccer management to stay with a goal keeper unless he is a disaster. From what I hear, he hasn't looked sharp in training and has had knocks keeping him out at times. I don't think they can trade him except to a Canadian team; maybe Montreal would be interested.
Edwards is being devalued and wasted. Without a reserve league, he's getting no game work ---- they need to either trade him or begin grooming him as Stephan's replacement.
I'm not familiar with the Swiss Nat Team roster, but I would think they would give him a look very soon.... it's a tiny country!

[Gazza_55]

I would say that is fair to Toronto considering they got him a few months ago for nothing. He has potential but that is it so far and the MLS and Toronto FC should be seen as selling club for players who have aspirations to play at a higher level. To ask a ridiculous amount of money for a player with no pedigree and potentially stopping a career enhancing move would be morally wrong of the MLS. Anyway it is all hypothetical, I just think he will possibly be the next to leave if he keeps up his good performances. Players of his current calibre move for peanuts at the moment in Europe. Lets not forget Celtic signed Arthur Boruc for $1m only a few seasons ago.

If we sell him for $2m who is our keeper? Sutton? Edwards? Can we win anything with either of them?

[Jack]

Guys, Frei would need to perform consistently well at a high level for a while before getting picked up. If he gets a call up to Switzerland, that might change.

For now he's a rookie with 7 games under his belt. Let's enjoy his performances and not worry about it.

[Pookie]

^ don't rain on the parade.

Reading sports forum, we all know that the Leafs are going to acquire Tavares in exchange for Jason Blake. Baring that, surely a 5th and 6th round pick would get the deal done.

If that is possible, $10M for Frei is a slam dunk.

[Detroit_TFC]

In the short term (10-20 years) this is exactly what we should become. In fact, that's what every team in MLS should strive to become Why? Because by being known as a selling league, we get players to play who could have a great future, because they know it's a stepping stone (and not the death of their aspirations). Plus, MLS starts pulling in a lot of money by selling players, which allows them to pay players more, and grow the league. It's really a great business model, since top players are so highly valued in other leagues. We should try to use their inflated transfer fees to fund the growth of our league.

Isn't this the case in Brazil? IMHO the export of quality players has hurt the domestic league there over the long run because so many players look to leave.

(not saying that No. America would in any way produce the output of quality as Brazil, just looking at Brazil as a comparison)

[Tezza]

For me the biggest difference between Frei and Sutton is the command of his line and distribution of the ball. Sutton just hoofs the ball up the field or makes dodgy decisions and gives the ball away. I'm not at the point of suggesting he has done enough to command big fees to go to Europe yet...but as a Spurs fan watching Gomes against Everton today...Frei looks a lot more composed on the ball already.

It's not just his shot-stopping that makes him look great is my point. He so far is exibiting all of the fundementals of a great future keeper. I'm with those that think that we may only get one season with him as our keeper.

[poppamidnight]

If we sell him for $2m who is our keeper? Sutton? Edwards? Can we win anything with either of them?

Sutton we could, Edwards, likely not...

Here's the problem:
How long do you (or 'can you') hold Frei before moving him (without upsetting him),

It's no longer a 'rumor' or a 'theory' that he wants to go to europe (I sat beside his gf at the whitecaps game, and we discussed his ambitions to go there)...

2 years might be stretching it. But the fact the Swiss NT experience would help his value should be noted.

At the same time, Sutton is a older vet.... Sitting on the bench for an extended period of time could both effect his shelf-life and performance.


Another thing you could look at IF you decide to deal Sutton: The goalie prospects for upcoming MLS drafts. If you want to hold Frei through the entirety of next season, maybe you could nab a younger keeper via 2010 or 2011 drafts to replace Frei when you sell him (instead of holding sutton to the bench for another 1-1/2 yrs)

[Pookie]

I do think that if you have a taker for Sutton, you do it.

I think Frei is on the roster for this season at least.

Some compare the Edu situation to this one. Note that Edu played in 38 MLS games, won Rookie of the Year and played on the US National team.

Frei has a resume that includes just 7 games.

If we got 2 seasons out of any young potential "export" then we are doing good. This isn't hockey where you build a franchise around a player or two. Players will come and go. It is the nature of what is essentially a developmental league.

MLS is really about playing for the moment. Long term team building is really not practical.