PDA

View Full Version : Pre game smoke/confetti setting bad precedent?



H Bomb
04-24-2009, 02:55 PM
Hey all, I was thinking it might be time to stop doing the pregame smoke machine confetti gun thing. Firstly I think it sets a bad precedent as we are not allowed to bring in anything like that and then they set it off right away. I think it sets up a monkey see monkey do scenario.

Secondly we are always kicking off towards the north end meaning our keeper is about 10 feet away from two smoke machines. Chances are slim but I'd be mighty upset if it distracted him in any way. Lastly I just thing it's unnecessary, we create a great atmosphere without smoke and mirrors. It seems like the last piece of novelty we've yet to dismantle :D

thoughts? MLSE could save a few bucks, we all know they need em.

RealG-TFC
04-24-2009, 03:02 PM
I think you are thinking too much into this. It really is harmless.

Roogsy
04-24-2009, 03:03 PM
I think you are thinking too much into this. It really is harmless.

Agreed. It's about moderation. This is just as extreme as those who want free reign to do what they want in the south end, flares, smoke etc.

By the team doing this...they are saying they will help add atmosphere, but under their terms. I am ok with that.

UltraFootyKWC
04-24-2009, 03:03 PM
Personally, I like the smoke. And since we're not allowed to bring in our own smoke bombs, I think they should keep doing it. I mean they aren't doing it all game long, just at the beginning. That's just my opinion though.

Ageroo
04-24-2009, 03:04 PM
It is done in a controlled environment though....big difference than the stands. I am ok with it....

KRO
04-24-2009, 03:09 PM
Hey all, I was thinking it might be time to stop doing the pregame smoke machine confetti gun thing. Firstly I think it sets a bad precedent as we are not allowed to bring in anything like that and then they set it off right away. I think it sets up a monkey see monkey do scenario.




Bang on. It's such a pointless exercise and sends out a message that smoke and fire are a good fun thing at soccer games.
If I stood behind the net and had my view obliterated for the start of every game I would be pissed.

Ageroo
04-24-2009, 03:12 PM
Bang on. It's such a pointless exercise and sends out a message that smoke and fire are a good fun thing at soccer games.
If I stood behind the net and had my view obliterated for the start of every game I would be pissed.

I am first row behind the net and I find it harmless. It can be annoying at times, but it does not last that long. But.... I see where you are coming from.

flatpicker
04-24-2009, 03:12 PM
so what about hockey and basketball games?
They often have smoke and laser shows.
How much trouble have we seen with smoke-bombs or rampant use of laser pointers?

mighty_torontofc_2008
04-24-2009, 03:13 PM
Bang on. It's such a pointless exercise and sends out a message that smoke and fire are a good fun thing at soccer games.
If I stood behind the net and had my view obliterated for the start of every game I would be pissed.


they are a pain thats for sure...the pyrotechnic guys can leave...we are
ar BMO for a football match not a concert.

AL-MO
04-24-2009, 03:13 PM
Hey all, I was thinking it might be time to stop doing the pregame smoke machine confetti gun thing. Firstly I think it sets a bad precedent as we are not allowed to bring in anything like that and then they set it off right away. I think it sets up a monkey see monkey do scenario.

Secondly we are always kicking off towards the north end meaning our keeper is about 10 feet away from two smoke machines. Chances are slim but I'd be mighty upset if it distracted him in any way. Lastly I just thing it's unnecessary, we create a great atmosphere without smoke and mirrors. It seems like the last piece of novelty we've yet to dismantle :D

thoughts? MLSE could save a few bucks, we all know they need em.


Bang on. It's such a pointless exercise and sends out a message that smoke and fire are a good fun thing at soccer games.
If I stood behind the net and had my view obliterated for the start of every game I would be pissed.

Seriously? :rolleyes:

Ageroo
04-24-2009, 03:14 PM
If you want to see a real smoke show....step outside the stadium at half time....;)

H Bomb
04-24-2009, 03:17 PM
so what about hockey and basketball games?
They often have smoke and laser shows.
How much trouble have we seen with smoke-bombs or rampant use of laser pointers?

we've seen some (at acc, etc). And why bother when you don't gain anything, like this case with the smoke/confetti.

Ageroo
04-24-2009, 03:18 PM
we've seen some (at acc, etc). And why bother when you don't gain anything, like this case with the smoke/confetti.

Just a slippery field when all the confetti hits it.......:)

Dale_Rojo
04-24-2009, 03:19 PM
TBH the smoke is horrible , its so lame trying to copy smoke bombs , get rid of that crap NOW it looks soo amateur. Most of you guys pride yourself on being the best SG in the MLS, yet you have machines to try and immitate europe and South america. Also on a windy day it wrecks havok with shit'all remember last year at a couple games the smoke drifted and thw whole east side could'nt see the play because of the glare+the smoke...... that lasted for like 5 mins. The smoke should go . If i want smoke ill bring my own. As it stands right now , that smoke is just mlse trying to copy other places in the world in a "safe" enviroment. Fake smoke machines are a joke..... Facepalm anyone? yeah ............

Pachuco
04-24-2009, 03:33 PM
I personally like the smoke. It creates an atmosphere. People that I've taken to the games that have only been once or twice will comment after the game on how cool the smoke thing is. I don't think it promotes the use of smoke bombs in the stadium. Didn't we have parashuters at the All Star Game or something? Doesn't mean they are promoting people parachuting into the stadium. It's controlled so there should be no problem with it.

I feel bad for the fans behind the net if anything, seems like this year it's been blowing it right in their face.

FluSH
04-24-2009, 03:41 PM
Hey all, I was thinking it might be time to stop doing the pregame smoke machine confetti gun thing. Firstly I think it sets a bad precedent as we are not allowed to bring in anything like that and then they set it off right away. I think it sets up a monkey see monkey do scenario.

Secondly we are always kicking off towards the north end meaning our keeper is about 10 feet away from two smoke machines. Chances are slim but I'd be mighty upset if it distracted him in any way. Lastly I just thing it's unnecessary, we create a great atmosphere without smoke and mirrors. It seems like the last piece of novelty we've yet to dismantle :D

thoughts? MLSE could save a few bucks, we all know they need em.

If in the U.S. they use fireworks at little league baseball games, I am sure people can restrain themselves HERE from taking a part-time pyro job because they think it's cool...

Don't they have these flame throwers at Raptors games? I can recall feeling the heat during a playoff game a long time ago from the flames...

FluSH
04-24-2009, 03:45 PM
TBH the smoke is horrible , its so lame trying to copy smoke bombs , get rid of that crap NOW it looks soo amateur. Most of you guys pride yourself on being the best SG in the MLS, yet you have machines to try and immitate europe and South america. Also on a windy day it wrecks havok with shit'all remember last year at a couple games the smoke drifted and thw whole east side could'nt see the play because of the glare+the smoke...... that lasted for like 5 mins. The smoke should go . If i want smoke ill bring my own. As it stands right now , that smoke is just mlse trying to copy other places in the world in a "safe" enviroment. Fake smoke machines are a joke..... Facepalm anyone? yeah ............

You ever been to a game in Latin America? Do you want a fence at BMO Field as well...

I'll take the smoke machine any day over a caged fence... You need to stop looking at youtube clips and worry about how we do our thing...

H Bomb
04-24-2009, 03:46 PM
If in the U.S. they use fireworks at little league baseball games, I am sure people can restrain themselves HERE from taking a part-time pyro job because they think it's cool...

Don't they have these flame throwers at Raptors games? I can recall feeling the heat during a playoff game a long time ago from the flames...

yeah but these example are much more extreme that ours. people see murder on tv but dont kill, they see fight club and they fight. They see smoke, relate it to soccer smoke (common in many places), and then bring their own stuff. I dont think it's too far of a stretch....and again I only bring it up because I don't see the smoke/confetti as being a thing people are excited about or even interested in.

Pachuco
04-24-2009, 03:50 PM
yeah but these example are much more extreme that ours. people see murder on tv but dont kill, they see fight club and they fight. They see smoke, relate it to soccer smoke (common in many places), and then bring their own stuff. I dont think it's too far of a stretch....and again I only bring it up because I don't see the smoke/confetti as being a thing people are excited about or even interested in.

How did you come to the conclusion that people aren't interested in it though? In general, people that I associate with seem to like it. I don't know, maybe we need a poll on the TFC site to really find that out.

grizzle
04-24-2009, 03:51 PM
I like it, I think they just need more of it and a bigger show... thats the problem imo ;)

Gobi
04-24-2009, 04:27 PM
I like it.

Just keep it exactly as is; no stupid music, dancing or doing it more than the one time at kickoff.

Frank Costanza
04-24-2009, 04:38 PM
For a second there with the title i thought the red patch boys did an honourary pre game blunt that maybe ppl were catching on to

AL-MO
04-24-2009, 04:40 PM
I would prefer that the Supporters be able to use smoke @ BMO in a responsible manner. But that won't happen so its not allowed. And I respect that. But I don't have much of an issue with the stuff they let off. No skin off of my back.

bhoybobby
04-24-2009, 05:03 PM
I'd prefer the massive banner prior to kick off, a different one every couple of games, or maybe one in each section, that looked very cool

FluSH
04-24-2009, 05:08 PM
How did you come to the conclusion that people aren't interested in it though? In general, people that I associate with seem to like it. I don't know, maybe we need a poll on the TFC site to really find that out.


exactly... and even people that don't associate with Pachuco like it... :D

H Bomb
04-24-2009, 05:10 PM
So you guys like it, or just don't dislike it? I know a few around me (right behind the net) find it a pain before most matches.

FluSH
04-24-2009, 05:16 PM
So you guys like it, or just don't dislike it? I know a few around me (right behind the net) find it a pain before most matches.


I love it...

It should be the entire South End if you ask me... not just that one section@!

H Bomb
04-24-2009, 05:17 PM
^^ Well lets talk to paul, maybe we can get it moved over to 112:D

David
04-24-2009, 05:24 PM
I like seeing it, good atmosphere booster. Tbh i thought people were continuously bringing smoke bombs each game...

Pachuco
04-24-2009, 10:19 PM
I love it myself. But H Bomb, if you are behind the net I completely understand. It looks awesome from further away, but man I would hate to have that in my face.

Pachuco
04-24-2009, 10:19 PM
exactly... and even people that don't associate with Pachuco like it... :D

Actually, those people like it because they WANT to associate with me :D

Cashcleaner
04-24-2009, 10:35 PM
I agree with H Bomb. I don't see it as a huge deal, but more like an unnecessary expense and a bit of a distraction. The confetti going off at kick-off is kinda cool, but the smoke is probably a little overboard.

Whatever, though. No big deal if they drop it or keep it.

Inswingingwingman
04-24-2009, 10:57 PM
LeMaitre, based in London Ontario, provide special effects for all kinds of major parades, Disney, concerts, etc.

They have their head office and plant there, and should be consulted about this.

They can make coloured smoke, vanilla flavour smoke, and lots of other special effects.

Find them on Google. I had 3 of their smoke machines when I bought them for the Fire Department, and later helped 2 bars buy some of their stuff. Great service and 'local' guys.

As to weather, you need to move the machines to compensate for wind directions, and the settings allow you to send smoke up, down, linger, of dissipate, depending on the fluid. Haze with lazers is cool, smoke with lights is cool, and with the right people and products it adds to the atmosphere.

Any good production includes all kinds of support services, from PA to sound, to visual.


Anyone wanting to get rid of pizzaz and special effects should stay home and watch lawn bowling. Fun and creative use of effects go hand in hand. More is better.

Get with the program...eh?

Captain Croatia
04-25-2009, 01:42 AM
It should be red and white, not just white... but it is better then nothing.

And the South-End should be able to use smoke bombs. Maybe one day, one day where we can have a Smoke Bomb/Flare (! Dont Flame Now) TIFO that spells out TFC or TORONTO across the whole south end.

Lennon
04-25-2009, 04:40 AM
It should be red and white, not just white... but it is better then nothing.

And the South-End should be able to use smoke bombs. Maybe one day, one day where we can have a Smoke Bomb/Flare (! Dont Flame Now) TIFO that spells out TFC or TORONTO across the whole south end.

I would love to see that ... maybe in 50 years?

James Oliphant
04-25-2009, 05:39 AM
I love it myself. But H Bomb, if you are behind the net I completely understand. It looks awesome from further away, but man I would hate to have that in my face.

I'm in 115 and I have no problem with it. Doesn't make me cough, wince, sneeze...nothing like that. I can see through it fairly easily, and it's almost always completely gone before kickoff.

I see no issue with keeping it. I wouldn't be sad to see it go, either, but it doesn't create any issues that make me WANT it gone.

Pookie
04-25-2009, 06:33 AM
And the South-End should be able to use smoke bombs. Maybe one day, one day where we can have a Smoke Bomb/Flare (! Dont Flame Now) TIFO that spells out TFC or TORONTO across the whole south end.

Now there's a good idea.

This thread started on the idea as to whether this sets a bad precedent and here we have the idea that an entire section be allowed to bring their own pyrotechnics into the stadium.

It works on so many levels because:

a) we are 100% certain that everyone would be satisfied with just using smoke bombs. There is 0% chance it would escalate into other items.

b) we are absolutely certain that no one would use it to interfere with the outcome of a match or be tempted to use other items for similar purpose. Which is fortunate because FIFA has set a precedent in which the net effect could be decision to play our home games in front of empty stands. It would never happen to us.

c) There is a 0% chance that massive amounts of smoke bombs would ever catch fire if thrown towards combustible materials such as flags, banners, jackets... hey, is our pitch combustible?

d) People with asthma wouldn't mind a bit. It surely isn't a life threatening or even slightly uncomfortable prospect to have to breathe in the amount of smoke released by an entire section.

e) In our post 9/11 world, security will easily be able to determine that a smoke bomb is just a smoke bomb with the simple question, "hey, is that a smoke bomb or another kind of bomb? In you go."

f) Toronto FC, BMO, the city would bear no legal responsibility whatsoever in the 0% chance that something would go wrong.

This is such a great idea, I don't know why we can't use it at other sports too.

Erkan16
05-04-2009, 08:39 PM
every home game the smoke lets go, and every game we embarrass ourselves.

YOU DON'T SMOKE OUT YOUR OWN GOALIE!

james
05-04-2009, 10:04 PM
man this is a stupid thread, i cant believe i wasted time reading H Bombs complaint!

EastYork
05-04-2009, 10:09 PM
man this is a stupid thread, i cant believe i wasted time reading H Bombs complaint!
QFT!

AL-MO
05-04-2009, 10:17 PM
This thread was a waste of time to begin with (sorry H-Bomb) and then pookie commented on it and made it so much worse! :lol:

Stencils
05-04-2009, 10:34 PM
I agree that it looks a little silly behind the net. Put it in the four corners of the pitch, I say!

james
05-04-2009, 10:56 PM
actually problem is we dont use enough smoke and confetti behind the net, we need something more like this:

http://i227.photobucket.com/albums/dd189/James_David_Champken/Boca.jpg

james
05-04-2009, 11:01 PM
or this :

http://i227.photobucket.com/albums/dd189/James_David_Champken/Columbia2.jpg

:scarf::p:drum:

J .
05-04-2009, 11:43 PM
It would be great if we were able to bring smoke in.

Inswingingwingman
05-05-2009, 06:00 AM
You can't bring smoke in. Never. Pyrotechnics requires a Federal Licence.

You can contact MLSE as a supporter's group and organize special events where your group sponsors something, or just plain start working on them to kick it up a notch.

It works very well elsewhere.

I still note that a Raptors Game on Tele always includes the player intros, pyros, etc. and it's always on tv. We are lucky if the game is joined in progress. And don't let on you are live at the stadium when the segment is taped 30 minutes before kickoff. That's embarassing.

MLSE has control over the TV contracts and it should stipulate that the game include the players coming out, the anthems, and the game with at least a 2 or 3 minute wrap.

And the camera positions need re-thinking. Showing the empty stands against the CN tower is demoralizing. I'd talk to the supporter's sections and see about moving them into the line of sight, after all there is going to be a renovation.

Last game on CBC 90 percent of the camera work was one rain blotched camera lens covering the game, and about 10 percent hand held at field level. I got the impression they brought 2 moth balled low def cameras from the NDP convention in 66. If there are shadows and the sun comes out yer screwed with 2 cameras.

Kick up the atmoshphere, bigger speakers, more pyros, better tele coverage, it's all positive. Stuff to build on.

Ultra & Proud
05-05-2009, 09:53 AM
You can't bring smoke in. Never. Pyrotechnics requires a Federal Licence.

They do have non-combustion smoke available at military supply stores but the FO will never allow it. As for the smoke we do use, I did think it "smoked out" Frei a bit in the KC game but it dissipates pretty quickly and looks fairly good. I would like to see some red smoke (as someone else mentioned already) and some more in other spots beside behind the net. How about in front of 111 to 113? Or up top in 212-219 so the smoke lowers down over the supporters sections and starts to break up when getting down to the pitch? The confetti I am so-so on but who cares really.

FluSH
05-05-2009, 10:34 AM
actually problem is we dont use enough smoke and confetti behind the net, we need something more like this:

http://i227.photobucket.com/albums/dd189/James_David_Champken/Boca.jpg

Excatly!!!

Fort York Redcoat
05-05-2009, 10:36 AM
It's better than nothing but only a little better.

Nomad
05-05-2009, 10:50 AM
I don't care either way, i just find it stupid they always do it in our end with our keeper. I have always thought it could be distracting...

We should have the other team start on that end always!

alexintoronto
05-05-2009, 11:01 AM
You can't bring smoke in. Never. Pyrotechnics requires a Federal Licence.

They do have non-combustion smoke available at military supply stores but the FO will never allow it. As for the smoke we do use, I did think it "smoked out" Frei a bit in the KC game but it dissipates pretty quickly and looks fairly good. I would like to see some red smoke (as someone else mentioned already) and some more in other spots beside behind the net. How about in front of 111 to 113? Or up top in 212-219 so the smoke lowers down over the supporters sections and starts to break up when getting down to the pitch? The confetti I am so-so on but who cares really.


What is that exactly? Is it considered a pyrotechnic?

Laurignano
05-05-2009, 11:02 AM
From going to games in Europe I believe that smoke bombs and flares do add to the atmosphere of the match, but since people here are immature and don't know how to use them properly I don't suggest anyone in our stands using them.

But with that said I think that if we were to have smoke bombs in our supporters sections I don't think it would be that big of a deal... but anyways to get back on track I think that the smoke show b4 the game is nothing....actually nothing at all compared to what other stadiums do before a match. I think it just kind of adds a boost to the atmosphere b4 kick off.

Yohan
05-05-2009, 11:24 AM
But with that said I think that if we were to have smoke bombs in our supporters sections I don't think it would be that big of a deal... but anyways to get back on track I think that the smoke show b4 the game is nothing....actually nothing at all compared to what other stadiums do before a match. I think it just kind of adds a boost to the atmosphere b4 kick off.
two smokes + confetti we got so far?

meh. does nothing for me.

i'm not a big fan of smoke or othe pyro, but go big or go home ;)

C.Ronaldo
05-05-2009, 11:35 AM
we need more of it, in other sections to.