Flare at supporters?

[tfc007]

I looked over and saw someone throw 2 flares,one hit the field and the other went into the supporters section of U-Sector,Anyone know who this guy is? He should be banned for the rest of the season, its one thing to throw the flares on to the field but to be throwing them at supporters/fans,not right.If someone had a better view please clarify?

[TorontoBlades]

It happened right by me. My girl got a great view but I was taking a dump.

[trail]

We were 4 rows behind them. They were two young kids, 17-18old +/_. They were caught. Sitting down wind from them getting all the hot ash and sparks with my pregnant wife at my side was not cool. I think at one point they tried to put them out but couldn't and that is when they through them. One landed on the field melting the grass and the other went into the south stands. I hope everyone over there was okay. I have to say that was the most dangerous and scariest thing I have seen take place a sporting event.

[boban]

^^ So I guess it didn't happen by you then.
Unless he threw it in the crapper lol

[phonzo]

I saw them get tossed and was wondering what happened to the dbags for that one. Some ideas are just a whole lot of not smart.

Also to the guy that tossed the beer from upper 104...not impressed (saw it whack some girl off the head). Don't think security figured it out but jesus people..stop throwing shit..

[Toronto_Bhoy]

^^ So I guess it didn't happen by you then.
Unless he threw it in the crapper lol

Wouldn't be the first time someone let off a flare in the crapper…

[TorontoBlades]

We were 4 rows behind them. They were two young kids, 17-18old +/_. They were caught. Sitting down wind from them getting all the hot ash and sparks with my pregnant wife at my side was not cool. I think at one point they tried to put them out but couldn't and that is when they through them. One landed on the field melting the grass and the other went into the south stands. I hope everyone over there was okay. I have to say that was the most dangerous and scariest thing I have seen take place a sporting event.

That's what my girl told me too.

[sully]

One guy got kicked out of my section in lower 111, and he deserved it...the police even gave him a chance to shut-up (he was throwing insults at them) and sit down but he wouldn't listen..

never saw him in my section before...and hope I never do again.

[mastermixer]

i saw the first one get thrown, and then when i saw the second one I thought it was one of those canonball firecrackers that shoots like 10 times and I thought oh no this is not good.

[sully]

I looked over and saw someone throw 2 flares,one hit the field and the other went into the supporters section of U-Sector,Anyone know who this guy is? He should be banned for the rest of the season, its one thing to throw the flares on to the field but to be throwing them at supporters/fans,not right.If someone had a better view please clarify?

He/They should be banned for good and charged by the police in my opinion. We're lucky somebody wasn't seriously hurt.

[Section225]

did they throw the second flare at 112/113 deliberately? Or was it the wind? I hope they are banned for life, either way.

[stretchthetruth]

did they throw the second flare at 112/113 deliberately? Or was it the wind? I hope they are banned for life, either way.


not that it justifies anything but it looked like wind hooked one flare into the supporters section - i'm in upper 110. when they lit them up, we all knew it was going to be bad news, and yes they did appear to be trying to put them out... nevertheless, stupid and dangerous.

[drewski]

I looked over and saw someone throw 2 flares,one hit the field and the other went into the supporters section of U-Sector,Anyone know who this guy is? He should be banned for the rest of the season, its one thing to throw the flares on to the field but to be throwing them at supporters/fans,not right.If someone had a better view please clarify?


those things are dangerous and can cause some serious damage to somebody.

forget the season, the people who threw it should be banned for life

[Ageroo]

What row did it come out of.....was it the partial pack section...or a season ticket holder's seats. I can't see a season ticket holder being that dumb.

[Redcoe15]

I will be :hulk: if some media douchebag (Cathal Kelly) tries and paints all TFC supporters as flare throwing retards. Those "fans" need to be banned for life.

[daner90]

I had a good view and I believe that it came from mid level of 110...

[denime]

I hope that was scalpers season ticket seat and he will short for those 2 seats from now on.
The trow was deliberate,he was aiming for 112-113,wind wasn't so strong.

[UltraFootyKWC]

I saw that from 117. I saw the first one hit the field, and the second one, which looked like a roman candle or something, shot over in to 112/113, and then I saw two guys bolt from their seats and down the tunnel. I really hope these guys were caught, and are never allowed at BMO again.

[Chevy]

not that it justifies anything but it looked like wind hooked one flare into the supporters section - i'm in upper 110. when they lit them up, we all knew it was going to be bad news, and yes they did appear to be trying to put them out... nevertheless, stupid and dangerous.

Yes, it looked like the wind took the first one. But no friggin excuse for that shit - ban the bastard.

[MrHawk]

The wind did pick up the flare a little bit and it carried it. Either way, strong wind or not, it's not cool what he did.

He promptly ran, and I hope he was caught. He sat next to the fence in 110 (above the tunnel), and he was being confronted by someone else for throwing a beer that hit someone a few rows above in 110.

I picked the best time not to be in 110 :(

[FluSH]

There is a hit out on us...

We need protection from these "regular fans"... it was clearly an assasination attempt!

[Parkdale]

did they throw the second flare at 112/113 deliberately? Or was it the wind?


the wind was super strong last night, so I'm sure that's it.


throwing a flare is an absolute UNFORGIVABLE action and they should be banned from BMO (and the ACC) for life.

[FluSH]

did they throw the second flare at 112/113 deliberately? Or was it the wind? I hope they are banned for life, either way.

nevermind... see parky

[MrHawk]

He's paid by the Columbus Crew fans to eliminate us.

[MrHawk]

nevermind... see parky

It wasn't strong Flush, but that's a light flare. Doesn't take that strong of a wind to carry it.

[Hitcho]

Head Honcho - any update on whether the flare thrower was caught and will now be banned fopr life? I think it's fair to say that pretty much everyone on here would like to see that happen. If that flare had hit someone in the face then this would be a full scale disaster, with criminal and civil law suits in flow. The fact this idiot got lucky doesn't mean he shouldn't be tracked down and banned for life.

[trail]

I dont think they had tickets there, they moved in from some other seat. We were in row 18 and they were about 5 rows below us. They were right next to the tunel entry. After they through them, they ran down in the tunel. I was talking to the guest services lady after the game and she said the were caught.

[ACSertL]

It looked like he just tried to get rid of it in haste and instead of tossing it onto the pitch it made its way into the stands. Not trying to justify it by any means though. Silly thing to do and I am sure that the proper punishments will be doled out.

[Eastend]

I guess those pat downs at the gates aren't working????

[T.Reis]

That's why I don't bother going to games anymore and am now selling my season tickets game by game, I've just got fead up and annoyed with some of the fans and the shit hit the fan with me while walking down to BMO in the FC Dallas game.

It's the shit that happens walking to BMO, the shit that happens on the GO train, and the "cool kids" at the game.

And I agree that it's not fair that people/media automatically assume these douchbags are part of the RPB or another supporters group. For the most part u guys are awesome. The annoying part, it's this young generation and what they deem to be funny/acceptiable.

Fuck it, ohhhhh and if these dick heads had these flares around my pregnant wife then the flares would have never even found the field or another stand. It would have been shoved up there ass before my woman even knew what the flair looked like.

That is all!

[Parkdale]

That's why I don't bother going to games anymore and am now selling my season tickets game by game, I've just got fead up and annoyed with.....


sorry dude, but last night was one hell of a game, and even some pricks with flares couldn't ruin it for me.

I'd rather put up with the occasional douchebag (there are lots of them) over missing out on a GREAT game that had us earing 3 points of the first ranked team in the league.

[ACSertL]

I guess those pat downs at the gates aren't working????

I don't remember being patted down at a game since season one...maybe for the All Star game last year??

[C.Ronaldo]

i was sitting on the west side, and it seemed deliberate

it was in the direction of the south supporters from the get go, the wind just carried it further in.

[Ageroo]

I guess those pat downs at the gates aren't working????

There are pat downs at the gates? :noidea:

[Hitcho]

I dont think they had tickets there, they moved in from some other seat. We were in row 18 and they were about 5 rows below us. They were right next to the tunel entry. After they through them, they ran down in the tunel. I was talking to the guest services lady after the game and she said the were caught.

Can anyone confirm this? I don't want to see them publicly lynched, but I would like to know that they have been caught, identified and banned from BMO Field for life. After the negative press recently I think it's key that this kind of thing is cracked down on really hard.

Paul - any update? :)

[JDG]

I was told at the end of the game that the flare that flew into 113 hit a woman, and she was burned by it.
The guys that threw the flares should not just be banned from BMO for life; they should have been arrested, and charged for the assault on the woman, and the willful damage to private property(the pitch).
If indeed, they were trying to put them out, and just wanted rid of them, pitching them over the side would have been better than throwing them into a crowd.

[Jack]

The guys who threw the flares were definitely not RPBs. They are people I've not seen before.

They were caught by security and will be dealt with. I'm sure they will be charged and will be stripped of their tickets (if they hold seasons seats) and certainly they will be banned from the stadium.

Good on the rest of the supporters for pointing these dicks out. Who throws a flare into the crowd? Wind or no wind, that throw was terrible!

Anyway, the sooner all these kinds of douchebags are caught and banned, the sooner we can go about the business of supporting our team without these kinds of hassles and distractions.

I just don't get the desire people have to shit on our house.

[Ageroo]

i was sitting on the west side, and it seemed deliberate

it was in the direction of the south supporters from the get go, the wind just carried it further in.

Yeah I am not so sure what his intention was....I saw it out of the corner of my eye sitting in 115 when it was first sparked. The one throw to the field seemed to be aimed that way, but the one to the stand looked a little more deliberate as from my vantage point, it looked like his arm released directed towards the south stands.....

[Wagner]

Anyone that disregards the safety of fellow supporters like that does not deserve to ever enter BMO again.

Mr. Paul, throw the book at him.

The "Tosser" was lucky that the flare didn't hit someone in the Eye/face. He should be penalized as if he had.

Thinking about it.
I assume the second tosser just panicked and threw it without thinking...but he should be punished as if he meant to throw it at people.

Zero tolerance for that garbage.

[Tezza]

Crazy night in 110. First the guy that tossed the beer on the pitch was nailed and then this guy standing on the aisle of the same row who was pinned well before the game even started, was mouthing off to the cops. They told him to shut up and gave him enough warnings until they dragged him out. He was annoying.

A few mins later (I'm guessing these guys were in row 12) I was about 5 rows from them lit up the flares. I thought they were just gonna hold onto them and then all of a sudden they threw them out. I think they were both aiming for the field but one got into the wind and went straight into the south end stands...Pretty freakin scary to see.

They took off down the tunnel but the cops were on them. I doubt they even got to the bottom of the stairs before they were caught...the cops were right on them.

So basically I was in between all the incidents and I hope those guys are banned for life. I've never seen any of them before in that section so I'm guessing they were either holding a partial game pack or just picked up tickets for the game.

[Mikey]

If that flare had ignited the alcoholic fumes coming off U-sector, it could have turned CNE into a moon crater......

I hope the guys gets six months jail time and a size eleven asshole while he's in there.

[MFBODD]

sorry dude, but last night was one hell of a game, and even some pricks with flares couldn't ruin it for me.

I'd rather put up with the occasional douchebag (there are lots of them) over missing out on a GREAT game that had us earing 3 points of the first ranked team in the league.

My thoughts exactly! We owned last night and I did not expect that at all.

To all those who stayed home because of the weather:
Your loss! Also, you allowed my friend and I to ditch our season seats for one match and have some fun in 127. Who wouldn't want to stand with supporters? I guess the flip side is the scalpers couldn't unload their seats.

There are a bunch of morons at every game, but the large majority are civil. Simply, there is no comparison to a Reds match in this town and I love it. Lighting a flare does draw the attention of the crowd, but it is not cool and tossing the thing is plain stupid. I saw it happen and couldn't believe when it flew into the stands.

[I_AM_CANADIAN]

We were 4 rows behind them. They were two young kids, 17-18old +/_. They were caught. Sitting down wind from them getting all the hot ash and sparks with my pregnant wife at my side was not cool. I think at one point they tried to put them out but couldn't and that is when they through them. One landed on the field melting the grass and the other went into the south stands. I hope everyone over there was okay. I have to say that was the most dangerous and scariest thing I have seen take place a sporting event.
I hope they get the book thrown at them. People have to stop throwing stuff on the pitch or we're going to get in trouble from the league. As I've brought up before, Inter were banned from UEFA competitions for a year for throwing flares on the pitch.

[Cas87]

I hope this shit doesn't happen on Sunday, I am bringing my mum for her birthday (because she has never been to a TFC or any soccer match) and I don't want her to get the wrong image painted of my fellow RPBs, because we are all good fans that stick up for each other, and the team, when we are in trouble.

Damn douchebags support the awful thought of supporters (mobs, fighting) that we are trying to change.

Two other things,
Any one think a banner regarding this crap is in order? maybe a "f**k you Cathal" or "We are all not douchebags"? Just a thought

and, if you want to say happy birthday to my mum, come over to 116 row 6 (I just think she would really love it if some RPBs did this!)

Thanks Guys

[Hitcho]

Ok good, sounds like the guys were caught. Really cannot see them avoiding a ban for this, and being stripped of any tickets they might own.

Finally, some good news on the douchebags getting caught and punished and not having it blanmed on the SG front!

[mlsintoronto]

Michael's guys got the guys. They were (past tense) partial season holders. They'll not set foot in BMO Field again.

As I understand it the Police are pressing charges, and I understand that one person in 112 suffered burns.

I'm happy that there seems to be a better security relationship with all this year...and I'm really happy to see the (generally) strong support they're getting on the boards. Thanks for your patience as we figure out how to deal with eachother.

[I_AM_CANADIAN]

I hope this shit doesn't happen on Sunday, I am bringing my mum for her birthday (because she has never been to a TFC or any soccer match) and I don't want her to get the wrong image painted of my fellow RPBs, because we are all good fans that stick up for each other, and the team, when we are in trouble.

Damn douchebags support the awful thought of supporters (mobs, fighting) that we are trying to change.

Two other things,
Any one think a banner regarding this crap is in order? maybe a "f**k you Cathal" or "We are all not douchebags"? Just a thought

and, if you wnat to say happy birthday to my mum, come over to 116 row 6 (I just think she would really love it if some RPBs did this!)

Thanks Guys
Just my two cents, but a banner might make it look like we're getting defensive about it, and get us in the news for the wrong reasons again. Better to just keep doing what we always do, which is support in an insane but non-douchebaggy manner. ;)

[Jack]

Ok good, sounds like the guys were caught. Really cannot see them avoiding a ban for this, and being stripped of any tickets they might own.

Finally, some good news on the douchebags getting caught and punished and not having it blanmed on the SG front!
Both things will happen and probably police charges as well.

[Cas87]

Just my two cents, but a banner might make it look like we're getting defensive about it, and get us in the news for the wrong reasons again. Better to just keep doing what we always do, which is support in an insane but non-douchebaggy manner. ;)

That makes sense, but like i said, it was just a thought

[ACSertL]

Michael's guys got the guys. They were (past tense) partial season holders. They'll not set foot in BMO Field again.

As I understand it the Police are pressing charges, and I understand that one person in 112 suffered burns.

I'm happy that there seems to be a better security relationship with all this year...and I'm really happy to see the (generally) strong support they're getting on the boards. Thanks for your patience as we figure out how to deal with eachother.

Cheers Paul, thanks for the update.

[Jack]

Michael's guys got the guys. They were (past tense) partial season holders. They'll not set foot in BMO Field again.

As I understand it the Police are pressing charges, and I understand that one person in 112 suffered burns.

I'm happy that there seems to be a better security relationship with all this year...and I'm really happy to see the (generally) strong support they're getting on the boards. Thanks for your patience as we figure out how to deal with eachother.
Thanks Paul.

[Wagner]

Security has been a lot smoother this year.
i guess it's one of those things...when they aren't mentioned, they're doing a good job.

Mr. Paul, thanks for the update.

[windsorlad111]

row 12 section 110 confirmed. we are in 111 right opposite. never seen those guys before, but we see alot of transients in those seats. maybe scalpers hold the tickets.

anyway, they lit the flares, were approached by the little security lady. it looked like they stupidly tried to put them out, realised that wasn;t going to happen so threw then and ran. I doubt the one into the crowd was deliberate, and was caught by the wind, but that's no excuse.

they bolted for the tunnel and my mate ran after them and said they got grabbed by security.

they had no TFC gear on that I could see, they were dressed in white shit... couple of gormless chavs.

[adamdz]

If that flare had ignited the alcoholic fumes coming off U-sector, it could have turned CNE into a moon crater......

I hope the guys gets six months jail time and a size eleven asshole while he's in there.

LOL good one. Seems weeknight games bring out the best and the worst in people.

[Carts]

Michael's guys got the guys. They were (past tense) partial season holders. They'll not set foot in BMO Field again.

As I understand it the Police are pressing charges, and I understand that one person in 112 suffered burns.

I'm happy that there seems to be a better security relationship with all this year...and I'm really happy to see the (generally) strong support they're getting on the boards. Thanks for your patience as we figure out how to deal with eachother.

Great news that they are caught, and dealt with (hopefully Toronto Police charges them with everything possible)...

Paul, the security have been excellent - we're all moving forward together which is great... Hats off to you & your staff...

Great win & a great night last night...!!!

Carts...

[FluSH]

I hope they indeed press charges... you need to send a clear message that we won't put up with that at BMO Field.

Now, the question is how do you send this message to those avg fans who don't read these boards and want to try this stunt some other time...

[mclaren]

Michael's guys got the guys. They were (past tense) partial season holders. They'll not set foot in BMO Field again.

As I understand it the Police are pressing charges, and I understand that one person in 112 suffered burns.

I'm happy that there seems to be a better security relationship with all this year...and I'm really happy to see the (generally) strong support they're getting on the boards. Thanks for your patience as we figure out how to deal with eachother.

That is good news - good job by security to catch them.

[Carts]

Michael's guys got the guys. They were (past tense) partial season holders. They'll not set foot in BMO Field again.

As I understand it the Police are pressing charges, and I understand that one person in 112 suffered burns.

I'm happy that there seems to be a better security relationship with all this year...and I'm really happy to see the (generally) strong support they're getting on the boards. Thanks for your patience as we figure out how to deal with eachother.

How long before Paul gets a PM asking to buy those tickets...? :D

Carts...

[windsorlad111]

and, if you want to say happy birthday to my mum, come over to 116 row 6 (I just think she would really love it if some RPBs did this!)

contact TFC, they can put a birthday message on the screen for her!

[Yohan]

If that flare had ignited the alcoholic fumes coming off U-sector, it could have turned CNE into a moon crater......

lol. quote of the day

[Roogsy]

I hope they indeed press charges... you need to send a clear message that we won't put up with that at BMO Field.

Now, the question is how do you send this message to those avg fans who don't read these boards and want to try this stunt some other time...


Good question.

[Hitcho]

Michael's guys got the guys. They were (past tense) partial season holders. They'll not set foot in BMO Field again.

As I understand it the Police are pressing charges, and I understand that one person in 112 suffered burns.

I'm happy that there seems to be a better security relationship with all this year...and I'm really happy to see the (generally) strong support they're getting on the boards. Thanks for your patience as we figure out how to deal with eachother.

Excellent news - thanks for the update Paul. And really good to read the posts about other fans trying to make sure these idiots were pointed out and caught.

[Hitcho]

I hope they indeed press charges... you need to send a clear message that we won't put up with that at BMO Field.

Now, the question is how do you send this message to those avg fans who don't read these boards and want to try this stunt some other time...

Drag them naked through Nathan Phillips Square with flares stuck up their arse?

[Suds]

I was talking to the guest services lady after the game and she said the were caught.

I hope this is the case and an example is made of them!

Thousands come to BMO to create a great atmosphere and support our team. You get a couple of douches do something that could have taken away from a great night for our team and supporters.

[Parkdale]

Michael's guys got the guys. They were (past tense) partial season holders. They'll not set foot in BMO Field again.


how about banning them from the ACC too?

hell.... let's just ship them off to Columbus!

[Pigfynn]

Someone was burned?? Jesus! What an absolute disgrace.

I seriously feel for these idiots' parents...try explaining that to mom you fucking douche bags.

[joel]

This happened when I was in Greece at AEK Athens vs. Paok. The paok fans are crazy, they had their own section with multiple sections on each side empty. They start lighting flares, and were firing them roman candle style at the AEK fans, the flares made it all the way into the crowds, it was pretty crazy! This flare didn't look big, in Greece it was huge and making tons of smoke. Very dangerous, Paok had to play a game in front of no fans for that one.

[Martin Groove]

I hope they indeed press charges... you need to send a clear message that we won't put up with that at BMO Field.

Now, the question is how do you send this message to those avg fans who don't read these boards and want to try this stunt some other time...

i think the only way really, is to place a blunt message on the team site (torontofc.ca), stating that throwing objects onto the field and in any direction period, is strictly prohibited and has its consequences, being thrown out, for the game, for the year or for life.

[jabbronies]

My personal opinion and view from 110 is that it was thrown into the south stands on purpose. It wasn't tossed and picked up by the wind, it was launched and the wind actually pushed it back....but that neither here nor there, the guy was caught and was dealt with. So good ending.

[Suds]

i think the only way really, is to place a blunt message on the team site (torontofc.ca), stating that throwing objects onto the field and in any direction period, is strictly prohibited and has its consequences, being thrown out, for the game, for the year or for life.

It is on the web site, although not on the main page, and announced every game.

Once these idiots are made an example of hopefully it will deter any future incidents.

[Oblio2]

Wouldn't be the first time someone let off a flare in the crapper…

LOL

As a side note, a guy in England just got a 3 year BAN from all stadiums for throwing GUM!!!!
(it was downgraded from a coin)

[wzhxvy]

As an aside, how does being banned from BMO for life work ? Not being a smart ass but you can prevent someone from having seasons but how do you actually prevent them from coming into the stadium by just buying a ticket from a scalper for example ?

[Jack]

As an aside, how does being banned from BMO for life work ? Not being a smart ass but you can prevent someone from having seasons but how do you actually prevent them from coming into the stadium by just buying a ticket from a scalper for example ?

If their photo is circulated to the gate staff before the game, that's a pretty good start. That's what they did in Columbus with the racist guy.

[Brooker]

the reaction by most of the fans in the south end to the beer being thrown was great. nobody liked it at all and were angry.

not to mention when the flare's were tossed. from 112 i could see the guys run into the tunnel and figured they'd get caught. fuck 'em.

[Sonny Cheeba]

maybe it was those kids who started that hooligan group on facebook last year.

[Roogsy]

Hmmm...that would explain the knock-off "Burberry" clothing on them. :)

[jabbronies]

maybe it was those kids who started that hooligan group on facebook last year.

real hooligans start facebook pages

[Nuvinho]

I hope the person who got burned is okay.

You go to a sporting event, to enjoy your team, the atmosphere, hang out with your friends, get away from everyday stresses........and you have to worry about idiots throwing stuff that leads to injuries.

I am glad they were caught, and will be made examples off.

[Hitcho]

I hope the person who got burned is okay.

You go to a sporting event, to enjoy your team, the atmosphere, hang out with your friends, get away from everyday stresses........and you have to worry about idiots throwing stuff that leads to injuries.

I am glad they were caught, and will be made examples off.

Me too. That's really the most important thing here, and then to make sure it doesn't happen again.

As for making an example of these guys, the fact they are caught and banned isn;t making an example of them unless that fact is publicised. A carefully worded press release put on the website and released to the media should do the trick, although there's a fine line between making an example of these guys and drawing more bad press. We'd need guys like cathater kelly on board and agreeing not to make another shit storm out of it.

[flatpicker]

well, considering the idiots were caught and disciplined... I guess this is a bad news to good news story.

At least now, folks who are considering such stupidity will be aware that their actions will not go unpunished.

[Hitcho]

well, considering the idiots were caught and disciplined... I guess this is a bad news to good news story.

At least now, folks who are considering such stupidity will be aware that their actions will not go unpunished.

But that's the point though - these guys are not RPBs. If you don't come on here and read through threads like this (or other SG forums) then how the hell would you know? Nothing in the media, no announcement about it at the game after the event, nothing on the website about catching and banning these guys.

I'd really like to see it publicised to let everyone know not to try that shit again, but after the KK shitstorm it puts the club in a really difficult position.

[BoltonTFC]

Kudos to security for catching these morons. Nothing should be thrown at a soccer match. Flares, streamers, nothing. You don't see players and fans getting showered with crap at a Premier league match.

[Yohan]

Me too. That's really the most important thing here, and then to make sure it doesn't happen again.

As for making an example of these guys, the fact they are caught and banned isn;t making an example of them unless that fact is publicised. A carefully worded press release put on the website and released to the media should do the trick, although there's a fine line between making an example of these guys and drawing more bad press. We'd need guys like cathater kelly on board and agreeing not to make another shit storm out of it.
i prefer a public flogging in the middle of the field. it would make halftime interval so much more interesting

stupidity. dont tolerate that shit

[Sonny Cheeba]

i prefer a public flogging in the middle of the field. it would make halftime interval so much more interesting

stupidity. dont tolerate that shit

yeah let's shove flares up their asses, nothing says embarrassment like a good public display of sodomy.

[sully]

Should this thread be moved to members private area? - ..not intending to annoy non-members but I wouldn't be surprised if people like Mr. Kelly are lurking and decide to write a front page story on how a visit to BMO is a life threatening undertaking and how everybody is a violent anarchist etc..

[Sonny Cheeba]

well if he is lurking he really has nothing other than a flare was thrown and that it hit somebody in the U-Sector section.

but if it needs to be moved i don't see a problem.

[flatpicker]

But that's the point though - these guys are not RPBs. If you don't come on here and read through threads like this (or other SG forums) then how the hell would you know? Nothing in the media, no announcement about it at the game after the event, nothing on the website about catching and banning these guys.

I'd really like to see it publicised to let everyone know not to try that shit again, but after the KK shitstorm it puts the club in a really difficult position.


well, there are a lot of folks that visit this forum on a casual basis who aren't members or frequent posters.
and there are always a few bad apples in a good bunch... we are no exception.
so this is a good message for those few who visit here and contemplate such action.

[Toronto_Bhoy]

Someone has mentioned this on the board before but I think the charges for this comes under "firearms" and hopefully are stiff penalties.

Night games tend to bring out the loonies…there were a lot of assholes out last night. I had to tell a couple of guys in 108 to chill out…as the night wore on and the beer flowed the racial and ethic cracks started…sad.

[Hitcho]

^ agree with that for sure Flats.

my concern was really about getting the message out to the wider idiots who may not follow football much but have heard about the BMO atmosphere and want to come down for some kicks of an afternoon or evening by throwing flares, beer, abuse or whatever just for the hell of it. that is NOT the kind of crowd we want at our house, and if they know they will be jumped on by security, charged and banned from the ground, then it may stop them from even trying.

[Hitcho]

Someone has mentioned this on the board before but I think the charges for this comes under "firearms" and hopefully are stiff penalties.

Night games tend to bring out the loonies…there were a lot of assholes out last night. I had to tell a couple of guys in 108 to chill out…as the night wore on and the beer flowed the racial and ethic cracks started…sad.

Gah! not the R word... that's terrible. I have a mate who has been a seaosn ticket holder at Highbury/Emirates since he was a kid and last season some hulking great bloke started chukcing racist abuse around. no-one said anything so my mate turned round and told him to stop despite being worried about taking a beating for it. the stewards came over, the rest fo the crowd backed my mate up and the idiot was removed from the crowd. I'd like to think the same thing would happen at BMO Field too. If i ever hear racist abuse near me in 118 i will immediately turn round and say something. there's no fucking place for that anywhere.

[James17930]

So the field got burned again? FFS!!!

[Toronto_Bhoy]

They were (past tense) partial season holders.

Hey! Isn't Canadian_Bhoy a self proclaimed "partial" supporter?

[Rudi]

If that flare had ignited the alcoholic fumes coming off U-sector, it could have turned CNE into a moon crater......
LOL :D

Let's just put it this way. Those flare-throwing bastards were lucky they were caught by security instead of us. Some of our guys were out for blood after that BS.

[Roogsy]

LOL :D

Let's just put it this way. Those flare-throwing bastards were lucky they were caught by security instead of us. Some of our guys were out for blood after that BS.

I was thinking the same thing. I was more worried about what the guys in 113 would do rather than what would happen if the cops got their hands on them. They're lucky the cops got them first.

[Ageroo]

LOL :D

Let's just put it this way. Those flare-throwing bastards were lucky they were caught by security instead of us. Some of our guys were out for blood after that BS.

As they should be......I can just imagine that some of you guys were booking it towards the exit when you saw those guys bolt.....good thing the security got them....:p

[Jack]

Someone has mentioned this on the board before but I think the charges for this comes under "firearms" and hopefully are stiff penalties.

Night games tend to bring out the loonies…there were a lot of assholes out last night. I had to tell a couple of guys in 108 to chill out…as the night wore on and the beer flowed the racial and ethic cracks started…sad.

This is saddening to hear.

I hope we can get this kind of crap completely removed from the stadium. I have no problem turning racists over to security.

[yellowfellow]

Now, the question is how do you send this message to those avg fans who don't read these boards and want to try this stunt some other time...

I think that's what the media should do, instead of bashing supporters group.

[Nuvinho]

Night games tend to bring out the loonies…there were a lot of assholes out last night. I had to tell a couple of guys in 108 to chill out…as the night wore on and the beer flowed the racial and ethic cracks started…sad.

I heard those guys as well (I think I even heard you tell them to chill out). They were bad, even were making bad comments at the women walking up and down the aisles. It was very tasteless.

[Toronto_Bhoy]

Gah! not the R word... that's terrible. I have a mate who has been a seaosn ticket holder at Highbury/Emirates since he was a kid and last season some hulking great bloke started chukcing racist abuse around. no-one said anything so my mate turned round and told him to stop despite being worried about taking a beating for it. the stewards came over, the rest fo the crowd backed my mate up and the idiot was removed from the crowd. I'd like to think the same thing would happen at BMO Field too. If i ever hear racist abuse near me in 118 i will immediately turn round and say something. there's no fucking place for that anywhere.

It was veiled but I pick up on it right away. I just turned and said "Okay guys, ENOUGH!"

They knew they had crossed the line. Christ, they were in their forties. My niece was sitting with me last night, she's cool but when you start screaming "cunt" and "cocksucker" at the top of your lungs…enough already.

The weren't regulars but I'll mention it to the STH who owns the seats. My daughter was in the South End last night and your gonna hear that language in there, that's cool but not where I sit.

[jabbronies]

I pulled a guy standing on his seat off twice. The second time I had to yell at him. He got the point and didn't do it again. he wasn't a dick about it, just drunk off his rocker.

[JDG]

Hey! Isn't Canadian_Bhoy a self proclaimed "partial" supporter?

LOL - I think it's Part Time Supporter.


LOL :D

Let's just put it this way. Those flare-throwing bastards were lucky they were caught by security instead of us. Some of our guys were out for blood after that BS.


Workie said he saw the guys get caught. His view from the 20th row was pretty good, and he said they were thrown face first into the fence pretty forcefully before they were cuffed.

[Wagner]

LOL - I think it's Part Time Supporter.




Workie said he saw the guys get caught. His view from the 20th row was pretty good, and he said they were thrown face first into the fence pretty forcefully before they were cuffed.

I hope they were locked up with "Avocado" (Prison Break Reference) for the evening.
http://gfx.filmweb.pl/p/62/36/76236/218037.1.jpg

[Rudi]

Workie said he saw the guys get caught. His view from the 20th row was pretty good, and he said they were thrown face first into the fence pretty forcefully before they were cuffed.
Still better than what would have happened had some of our guys caught them... ;)

[JDG]

Still better than what would have happened had some of our guys caught them... ;)


No doubt - I would've liked to have seen you get your chance.

[cosmos]

how about banning them from the ACC too?

hell.... let's just ship them off to Columbus!

My friend was the usher in the section (same girl that got hit with a flying beer a few games back - yes I have told her to get a new job!) Anyway... Like some others have said, they did catch the guys and unfortunately someone was hurt by the flare. My friend cleared the row as fast as she could but the person was directly hit. I understand now that the person that was hurt is not only sueing the guys who threw the flare but MLSE as well. She is saying that a proper process was not in place to protect her and other fans from objects brought into the stadium. If indeed MLSE is sued, I am sure they will make damn sure that these people do not set foot in any of their properties - BMO ACC etc.

[AL-MO]

Sounds like a couple of guys who got some 'ideas' after Columbus....

[Yohan]

My friend was the usher in the section (same girl that got hit with a flying beer a few games back - yes I have told her to get a new job!) Anyway... Like some others have said, they did catch the guys and unfortunately someone was hurt by the flare. My friend cleared the row as fast as she could but the person was directly hit. I understand now that the person that was hurt is not only sueing the guys who threw the flare but MLSE as well. She is saying that a proper process was not in place to protect her and other fans from objects brought into the stadium. If indeed MLSE is sued, I am sure they will make damn sure that these people do not set foot in any of their properties - BMO ACC etc.
this will just mean more strict searches before getting in the gates.

few morons always ruin it for everyone

[cosmos]

this will just mean more strict searches before getting in the gates.

few morons always ruin it for everyone

You think the lines are long to get in now...just wait...with strick searches I will have to get to the game the night before...that actualy could be cool...an all night tail gate...hmmmmm

[Sonny Cheeba]

I pulled a guy standing on his seat off twice. The second time I had to yell at him. He got the point and didn't do it again. he wasn't a dick about it, just drunk off his rocker.

why? were you worried he was gonna hurt himself?

or was he in your way....

i've seen people standing on seats and no issues seemed to come from it. as long as they're not ready to fall over or aren't blocking someone's view then big deal.

[AL-MO]

why? were you worried he was gonna hurt himself?

or was he in your way....

i've seen people standing on seats and no issues seemed to come from it. as long as they're not ready to fall over or aren't blocking someone's view then big deal.

Agreed. Trying doing that in 112 last night and see the reaction. ;)

[Sonny Cheeba]

You think the lines are long to get in now...just wait...with strick searches I will have to get to the game the night before...that actualy could be cool...an all night tail gate...hmmmmm

well i missed last night's game. but i got in to the two games before that in under 30 seconds. even Gate 3 wasn't that packed.

gate 3b is basically empty from lines. and searching or patting someone down adds 30 seconds to the entry. i'd rather that than hear about someone getting hit with a flare, or STILL have streamers on corner kicks>> these gotta stop.

[Yohan]

why? were you worried he was gonna hurt himself?

or was he in your way....

i've seen people standing on seats and no issues seemed to come from it. as long as they're not ready to fall over or aren't blocking someone's view then big deal.
it was pretty slippery on the stands... can't imagine being a good idea to stand on a seat when you're drunk

[Sonny Cheeba]

it was pretty slippery on the stands... can't imagine being a good idea to stand on a seat when you're drunk


well that's why i asked. i couldn't make it last night.

[ACSertL]

it was pretty slippery on the stands... can't imagine being a good idea to stand on a seat when you're drunk

Easy: Don't get drunk :)

[Mikey]

As an aside, how does being banned from BMO for life work ? Not being a smart ass but you can prevent someone from having seasons but how do you actually prevent them from coming into the stadium by just buying a ticket from a scalper for example ?

You can start with an old school uk solution. 12-60 month court order requiring the person to sign in at their local cop shop whenever TFC plays a public game (home or away) and not being signed out of the cop shop until the game has ended.

Obviously, failing to appear results in an arrest warrant...

[flatpicker]

You can start with an old school uk solution. 12-60 month court order requiring the person to sign in at their local cop shop whenever TFC plays a public game (home or away) and not being signed out of the cop shop until the game has ended.

Obviously, failing to appear results in an arrest warrant...


wow! that's hardcore! but effective.

[wzhxvy]

Oh so there is a lawsuit againt MLSE...interesting. I guess it will be the read the back of your ticket argument vs. you should have reasonably been able to secure my well being...bla bla bla bla. I would personally sue those guys as they are but not MLSE. I woyld however presume those guys dont have money however. What I would die to know is if those people arrested were actually the partial season holders or if they sat in the seats of partial season holders. And hence I would be even more excited about the season tickets being revoked.

[cosmos]

You can start with an old school uk solution. 12-60 month court order requiring the person to sign in at their local cop shop whenever TFC plays a public game (home or away) and not being signed out of the cop shop until the game has ended.

Obviously, failing to appear results in an arrest warrant...


WOW heavy but I am sure it works...that is what I call a deterrent

[wzhxvy]

You can start with an old school uk solution. 12-60 month court order requiring the person to sign in at their local cop shop whenever TFC plays a public game (home or away) and not being signed out of the cop shop until the game has ended.

Obviously, failing to appear results in an arrest warrant...

Wow...yes I can see how that would be effective.

[cosmos]

why? were you worried he was gonna hurt himself?

or was he in your way....

i've seen people standing on seats and no issues seemed to come from it. as long as they're not ready to fall over or aren't blocking someone's view then big deal.

I think you mean as long as they don't slip and spill your beer

[Canadian Blue]

I saw security in front on 112 look up at the guy when the flare was lit and all he did was shake his head. He didn't use his radio or make any attempt to have the flares put out or even look long enough to get a good mental picture of who they were....maybe BMO staff need more training??

[Sonny Cheeba]

I think you mean as long as they don't slip and spill your beer

i'd be more worried about them hurting themselves and the whole situation of paramedics and first aid after and interfering with the game than a spilled beer.

spilled beer would piss me off no doubt, especially at those prices, but BMO staff seemed to be pretty cool about that shit last year, i saw some refills for beers that were spilt unintentionally or knocked out of someone's hand.
well as long as the person wasn't hammed.

[Rocco]

Easy: Don't get drunk :)


The fact that most kids don't know how to handle any form of alcohol is true. It's more obvious in the suburbs. I have to admit, I drink a fair bit before some games yet I never recall doing anything as stupid as throwing a beer... let alone a flare. I just find it really easy to believe that someone so damn drunk would do something as stupid as throwing an object burning at least 300*F.

Look, I don't know how you can ban people from being drunk but I do know one thing: zero tolerance to public intoxication is not inforced and maybe the security staff should implement that. Why they allow intoxicated fans remain in the game is beyond me. There is a difference between being drunk and responsible for ur actions (i.e. happy drunk) and being damn silly drunk (i.e. intoxicated).

IT WILL continue to escelate. As supporters, the only thing we can do is point out this stupidity but we can't enforce any rules. It's really up to the staff. I hope this kid gets charged/sued. I want him made an example of, publicly. I think this is a great learning opportunity for the "fans" that wish to repeat similar actions in the future.

[MUFC_Niagara]

Someone has mentioned this on the board before but I think the charges for this comes under "firearms" and hopefully are stiff penalties.

Night games tend to bring out the loonies…there were a lot of assholes out last night. I had to tell a couple of guys in 108 to chill out…as the night wore on and the beer flowed the racial and ethic cracks started…sad.

It doesn't qualify as a firearm. On the more serious end they will likely be charged with assault. If the burns are bad enough that they require surgery, that is to say the body cannot heal itself, they would be charged with assault causing bodily harm. While they likely will not see any jailtime, its a conviction that closes doors for employment and international travel. Pretty good way to alter your life and what a stupid way to do it!

[Oblio2]

You cant entirely blame alcahol. All it does is intensify the retarded thoughts these nob gobblers already had.
Look, at the first home game I was blitzed out of my tree...it only happens once a season...yet, I didn't throw anything. These muppets should be banned from BMO for life

[Sonny Cheeba]

wow those posts disappeared fast. well done.

[denime]

wow those posts disappeared fast. well done.

What posts :rolleyes:

[wzhxvy]

I presume that the policy is people should get a PM when their post is removed ?

[Angelo1405]

woah...

[Steve]

Oh so there is a lawsuit againt MLSE...interesting. I guess it will be the read the back of your ticket argument vs. you should have reasonably been able to secure my well being...bla bla bla bla. I would personally sue those guys as they are but not MLSE. I woyld however presume those guys dont have money however. What I would die to know is if those people arrested were actually the partial season holders or if they sat in the seats of partial season holders. And hence I would be even more excited about the season tickets being revoked.

I don't know if the lawsuit against MLSE is going to fly (though they might just settle instead of submitting to a possibly public lawsuit). In Canada, it's much harder to get the kinds of outrageous settlements you can get in the states. Plus, I don't know what else MLSE could be reasonably expected to do to prevent something like this from happening. You have 20,000 people in a relatively confined space, how can you be expected to protect them from each other if someone does something stupid? It's not like they allow flares into the stadium, and can you imagine the kind of security you'd need to have to prevent a flare from getting in? Full pat downs on everyone, and even then if you were creative you could probably sneak one in. Essentially, I understand this girl is upset, but I have no idea how she is holding MLSE responsible for it (other than the fact they are a large corporation with tons of money, but even then punitive damages rarely get awarded in Canada to the same extend).

Anyway, to the question of how are people going to know, I agree it's a problem. The best two ideas for me are:

1) Use the TFC Email list. This has everyone with season's, half season's, and on the waiting list on it. Don't half ass it either with generalities (throwing will get you removed), use examples. If you're legally allowed, use names. If now, descriptions. For example "2 individuals who threw flares from section 110 were arrested and charged, as well as having their tickets taken away, and being banned for life. 1 individual from section 116 was removed for throwing a beer and has had his tickets for the next 5 games removed" etc. By using as much detail as possible, it becomes a real possibility and not just something that could happen "in theory" (like jaywalking tickets).

2) Make an announcement at the game. Every time someone has charges pressed, is removed, or has tickets taken away make an announcement at the next game and put something up on the board. Make sure people know that not only does this happen, but it's continuously happening. This will keep the possibility of punishment at the forefront of people's brains, which will hopefully ensure it isn't forgotten in a drunken haze.

[ACSertL]

Alcohol fuelled or not people need to be responsible for their actions and should be punished accordingly if they are stepping over the line. I understand that most are responsible enough to abide by the rules and use common sense even when they've had a few, its just a little disheartening to see something like that happen.

[Oblio2]

or, paint their seats yellow and have nobody sit in them for the season so everyone can see who they were?
This lawsuit wont go anywhere

[brad]

this will just mean more strict searches before getting in the gates.

few morons always ruin it for everyone

Security seems pretty lax on searches this year. They haven't even asked to look in my bag at two games this year.

[wzhxvy]

or put two huge nipples there Oblio...since you are a fan of nipples :-)

[Oblio2]

or put to huge nipples there Oblio...since you are a fan of nipples :-)


LOL


.

[MUFC_Niagara]

or put to huge nipples there Oblio...since you are a fan of nipples :-)

Is this true Oblio?

[Oblio2]

I cannot lie....I enjoy a good Nipple

or as they say in Seinfeld....Gipple

[Carefree]

1) Use the TFC Email list. This has everyone with season's, half season's, and on the waiting list on it. Don't half ass it either with generalities (throwing will get you removed), use examples. If you're legally allowed, use names. If now, descriptions. For example "2 individuals who threw flares from section 110 were arrested and charged, as well as having their tickets taken away, and being banned for life. 1 individual from section 116 was removed for throwing a beer and has had his tickets for the next 5 games removed" etc. By using as much detail as possible, it becomes a real possibility and not just something that could happen "in theory" (like jaywalking tickets).

I was thinking the exact same thing. Those generic announcements just sound like background noise and I don't think anyone takes them too seriously. Give real-life examples of people getting punished for bad behaviour and people may think twice before doing something stupid like bringing flares to a game.

[Carefree]

I hope they indeed press charges... you need to send a clear message that we won't put up with that at BMO Field.

Now, the question is how do you send this message to those avg fans who don't read these boards and want to try this stunt some other time...
That's a very good point. I would suggest posting on some mainstream websites like the Star to let everyone know that supporters don't condone this behaviour, and that the morons who did this were punished.

[Hitcho]

or, paint their seats yellow and have nobody sit in them for the season so everyone can see who they were?
This lawsuit wont go anywhere

Well a lawsuit against the idiots is pretty much concrete to the extent of any medical costs and some amount of pain and suffering, although typically the courts don't give much for that.

The lawsuit against MLSE (if brought) will have enough merit to get the claim lodged and go through the preliminary procedures. Most lawsuits settle before they make it to court, and the terms/impact of any settlement on MLSE could have a major bearing on how they approach fans and fan behaviour going forward in terms of security at the gates, what you can bring into the stadium, access to alcohol, etc.

So in my view, as far as we're concerned as fans this really could go somewhere, although it will take time. I wouldn't dismiss it so easily if I were you.

[Toronto_Bhoy]

It doesn't qualify as a firearm. On the more serious end they will likely be charged with assault. If the burns are bad enough that they require surgery, that is to say the body cannot heal itself, they would be charged with assault causing bodily harm. While they likely will not see any jailtime, its a conviction that closes doors for employment and international travel. Pretty good way to alter your life and what a stupid way to do it!

Sorry, thought I read on here that "discharging a flare in public" was an offence under the firearms act.

I differ to those who know for sure…thanks

[Oblio2]

Well a lawsuit against the idiots is pretty much concrete to the extent of any medical costs and some amount of pain and suffering, although typically the courts don't give much for that.

The lawsuit against MLSE (if brought) will have enough merit to get the claim lodged and go through the preliminary procedures. Most lawsuits settle before they make it to court, and the terms/impact of any settlement on MLSE could have a major bearing on how they approach fans and fan behaviour going forward in terms of security at the gates, what you can bring into the stadium, access to alcohol, etc.

So in my view, as far as we're concerned as fans this really could go somewhere, although it will take time. I wouldn't dismiss it so easily if I were you.

Dont you give up all liabilty, as stated on the back of the ticket?

[MUFC_Niagara]

Sorry, thought I read on here that "discharging a flare in public" was an offence under the firearms act.

I differ to those who know for sure…thanks

Hmmm...it might be...i'll check it out because now I am curious! Probably a summary offence if it is.

[Hitcho]

Dont you give up all liabilty, as stated on the back of the ticket?

I'm not sure what it says on the ticket, but you cannot exclude the law of negligence through a contract. In the UK there's a statute called the Unfair Contract terms Act which prevents this. I'd be surprised if Canada doesn't have something very similar given that the legal system was basically imposed by England and still refers to House of Lords cases on a regular basis. Otherwise, if MLSE lets the stadium fall into disrepair and a section of supporters crash through the floor and get crushed, no-one can sue MLSE for damages.

[pubboy]

I'm sure MLSE have insurance coverage specifically to cover liability lawsuits (as has become more widespread), the decision to settle or not would therefore likely fall into the hands of the insurers lawyers.

Really angry someone got hurt by the actions of these idiots. I think it can be safely stated that the vast majority of fans MLSE and TFC will not condone this type of action, and people who do so will be dealt with. Hopefully the MLSE lawsuit isnt pursued over and above coverage of medical bills and reasonable ex-gratia (on assumption that the scumbag chavs dont have any cash or inclination to pay compensation to the victim).

[Gixmo]

Clearly unfortunate

The offenders were caught (Thank you Paul, Another reason You and your team have our support is by chiming in..) and dealt with accordingly. It's clearly a poor decision on the part of those who threw them. I would hope it was not intentional to direct towards the supporters, but it appears witness accounts are of the contrary. That being said, support to the individual(s) hit and a speedy recovery.

Side note : I've never met anyone form Usector, I don't think at least.. That being said (and I mean this in the most polite terms possible) I don't think I would want to cross them... Good on the cops for getting to the perp's first :).. Although, a little street justice is never wrong!

[Oblio2]

Nope. On the back of the ticket, and I quote:

The holder voluntarily assumes all risk and danger of personal injury (inc. death) and all other hazards arising from or related in anyway to this event whether occuring prior to, during or after the event.
More specifically, the holder hereby assumes all risk of injury resulting from or in connection with the event, including without limitation the risk of injury due to the negligence or misconduct of other spectators and agrees that MLSE , TFC, Board of Govs. of exhibition place, City of Toronto, employeess, players officials, directors, members, L.L.Cm ....shall not be responsible or liable for any loss, damage or injury resulting form such causes.

(its bolded on the back of the ticket)

So...I believe the lawsuit against MLSE will go nowwhere

[JDG]

I'm not sure what it says on the ticket, but you cannot exclude the law of negligence through a contract. In the UK there's a statute called the Unfair Contract terms Act which prevents this. I'd be surprised if Canada doesn't have something very similar given that the legal system was basically imposed by England and still refers to House of Lords cases on a regular basis. Otherwise, if MLSE lets the stadium fall into disrepair and a section of supporters crash through the floor and get crushed, no-one can sue MLSE for damages.


From the back of the ticket:


... THE HOLDER VOLUNTARILY ASSUMES ALL RISK AND DANGER of personal injury (including death) and all other hazards arising from or related in any way to this Event, whether occuring prior to, during, or after the Event.
MORE SPECIFICALLY, THE HOLDER HEREBY ASSUMES ALL RISK OF INJURY RESULTING FROM, OR IN CONNECTION WITH THE EVENT, INCLUDING WITHOUT LIMITATION THE RISK OF INJURY DUE TO THE NEGLIGENCE OR MISCONDUCT OF OTHER SPECTATOR, AND AGREES THAT MAPLE LEAF SPORTS & ENTERTAINMENT LTD., TORONTO FC, THE BOARD OF GOVENORS OF EXHIBITION PLACE, THE CITY OF TORONTO, MAJOR LEAGUE SOCCER, LLC., SOCCER UNITED MARKETING, LLC., AND EACH OF THEIR REPECTIVE EMPLOYEES, PLAYERS, OFFICERS, DIRECTORS, MEMBERS, PARTNERS, OWNERS, AFFILIATES, SPONSORS, AND OTHER AGENTS SHALL NOT BE RESPONSIBLE OR LIABLE FOR ANY LOSS, DAMAGE, OR INJURY RESULTING FROM SUCH CAUSES.

[JDG]

Nope. On the back of the ticket, and I quote:

The holder voluntarily assumes all risk and danger of personal injury (inc. death) and all other hazards arising from or related in anyway to this event whether occuring prior to, during or after the event.
More specifically, the holder hereby assumes all risk of injury resulting from or in connection with the event, including without limitation the risk of injury due to the negligence or misconduct of other spectators and agrees that MLSE , TFC, Board of Govs. of exhibition place, City of Toronto, employeess, players officials, directors, members, L.L.Cm ....shall not be responsible or liable for any loss, damage or injury resulting form such causes.

(its bolded on the back of the ticket)

So...I believe the lawsuit against MLSE will go nowwhere

LOL - you clearly type faster than I do :D

[Hitcho]

Ok, I'm not going to get into a legal thesis on this, but there are some key points to bear in mind on this ticket wording matter:

1. there will be legislation in place that categorically rules out unfair exclusion of liability and, to the extent that the ticket wording goes past that, it will be deemed to be of no force and effect by law. it is probably standard to word the ticket small print as widely as possible to ensure that the maximum coverage possible is obtained, but once you go past that it matters not. the ticket is not god, the supreme court of canada is.

2. depending on the facts, it is entirely possible to hold that MLSE, through its staff, was negligent in this case. someone has already posted that security saw the flares and did nothing, and that they were not patted down at the gates. the negligence of the idiots is not something MLSE will be held accountable for. their own negligence in failing to reasonably forsee the damage that occured to the injured person, whether through lax security, not acting sooner once the flare had been spotted, or whatever, is not excluded by the wording on the ticket (and probably couldn't be by law anyway, see my earlier post). there's more than one way to construe the facts.

3. in this kind of case, it probably doesn't matter too much where liability is deemed to fall through a strict interpretation of the law. MLSE is not going to let this get to court for obvious reasons. if proceedings are commenced and get past the initial (easy to meet) hurdles of showing that there is a serious issue to be tried, then the most likely outcome is settlement. How MLSE reacts to that going forward, to try and protect themselves in future, is the key issue for fans.

Where it goes from here really depends on how badly injured the person was, how much stomach that person has for commencing legal proceedings and taking on a giant adversary in MLSE (rather than accepting free raptors tickets or something which is offered by way of apology) and how badly they want/need any money they think theyc an recover from this. What the ticket says doesn't really matter all that much, certainly beyond a given point.

[Sally Mack]

Hmm I see everyone meshing general alcoholic consumption and this incident together, treating them as one.

Nobody really knows if these tools were drinking or not. I think these idiots were gonna throw these flares regardless, seeing as they must have had to purchase them in advance (presumably while sober). I think this is a case of buffoonery, rather than intoxication.

Moral of the story: don't blame the booze :D

[RedMAN127]

My friend was the usher in the section (same girl that got hit with a flying beer a few games back - yes I have told her to get a new job!) Anyway... Like some others have said, they did catch the guys and unfortunately someone was hurt by the flare. My friend cleared the row as fast as she could but the person was directly hit. I understand now that the person that was hurt is not only sueing the guys who threw the flare but MLSE as well. She is saying that a proper process was not in place to protect her and other fans from objects brought into the stadium. If indeed MLSE is sued, I am sure they will make damn sure that these people do not set foot in any of their properties - BMO ACC etc.


It unfortunate but the failure of BMO/MLSE to maintain thier own rules .. not allowing supporters (drums, standing, flags, etc.,) outside of the supporters section (i.e NEE) has lead to a broadening disregard for the rules. IF BMO fails to enforce thier own rules for two years, then modify's supporter sections to contain the result ... how can they expect a reasonable degree of order to be maintained, thereafter.

The real problem is security and BMO allowing people outside of the southend to carry on like 'holigans' or 'ultra's' you can't turn a blind eye to one section and then expect control in another.

[Jack]

It unfortunate but the failure of BMO/MLSE to maintain thier own rules .. not allowing supporters (drums, standing, flags, etc.,) outside of the supporters section (i.e NEE) has lead to a broadening disregard for the rules. IF BMO fails to enforce thier own rules for two years, then modify's supporter sections to contain the result ... how can they expect a reasonable degree of order to be maintained, thereafter.

The real problem is security and BMO allowing people outside of the southend to carry on like 'holigans' or 'ultra's' you can't turn a blind eye to one section and then expect control in another.

Cathal? :D

[RedMAN127]

why? were you worried he was gonna hurt himself?

or was he in your way....

i've seen people standing on seats and no issues seemed to come from it. as long as they're not ready to fall over or aren't blocking someone's view then big deal.

some guy was paralized recdently by a drunk falling on his head from the upper row in a stadium ... are you serious?

[Sally Mack]

Good post Hitcho, saved me the trouble of typing... I even had a case precedent lined up! ;)

[Hitcho]

One other related issue on this topic - some people have been calling for the ticket owners to have their tickets taken away if the idiots who threw the flares are not the actual ticket holders.

I hope this doesn;t happen. I have sold my SS tickets for individual games to people on these forums. if someone bought them through the forum, got drunk and did something stupid, I don;t see why i should lose my seats. if that kind of precedent is set, then every time I can;t make a match, I will just let the seats go empty to avoid the risk os someone doing something out of my control, and boat loads of other people will start doing the same thing. The result - lots more empty seats in BMO Field.

[Sally Mack]

some guy was paralized recdently by a drunk falling on his head from the upper row in a stadium ... are you serious?
From an 18 inch drop off his chair? Or by doing something stupid like leaning over the guard rail and falling onto a lower section?

[Hitcho]

Good post Hitcho, saved me the trouble of typing... I even had a case precedent lined up! ;)

heh - well without a legal background there's no reason for people to realise that what the ticket says is not necessarily definitive. Oblio's post basically says "nope, the ticket says this, therefore it must be right", which in a legal sense is a very blinkered view, but how would you know? This is why lawyers make a lot of money - they tell people what the courts consider to be public knowledge but no-one actually knows unless it is explained to them!

[Sonny Cheeba]

some guy was paralized recdently by a drunk falling on his head from the upper row in a stadium ... are you serious?

read my post again there brick city. i was asking a question. you mention a drunk falling.... i clearly alluded to a person falling which is fair reason to ask them to get down.


i've seen people standing on seats and no issues seemed to come from it. as long as they're not ready to fall over or aren't blocking someone's view then big deal.

[MUFC_Niagara]

It unfortunate but the failure of BMO/MLSE to maintain thier own rules .. not allowing supporters (drums, standing, flags, etc.,) outside of the supporters section (i.e NEE) has lead to a broadening disregard for the rules. IF BMO fails to enforce thier own rules for two years, then modify's supporter sections to contain the result ... how can they expect a reasonable degree of order to be maintained, thereafter.

The real problem is security and BMO allowing people outside of the southend to carry on like 'holigans' or 'ultra's' you can't turn a blind eye to one section and then expect control in another.

Alrighty then, on that note its back to the member's section for me!

[Stencils]

Just heard this on CBC radio.

Two teenagers from stoneycreek who lit flares at BMO were charged with possession of a dangerous weapon and assault causing bodily harm.

[MUFC_Niagara]

Just heard this on CBC radio.

Two teenagers from stoneycreek who lit flares at BMO were charged with possession of a dangerous weapon and assault causing bodily harm.

So obviously the lady needed some sort of medical attention to repair her wounds....

[Red CB Toronto]

Here is the link from thestar.com

http://www.thestar.com/GTA/Crime/article/623324

[Gixmo]

For those lazy...

Apr 23, 2009 02:52 PM

Daniel Girard
Sports Reporter
Two teenagers are facing charges, including possession of a dangerous weapon and assault causing bodily harm, after a woman was burned by a flare fired in the stands at Wednesday's Toronto FC game.
Toronto police allege two young men from Stoney Creek were sitting in the stands at BMO Field during the TFC-Chivas USA game when they each ignited a flare torch and threw them toward the soccer pitch.
"One flare landed on a woman's thigh, burning through her pants and causing a burn to her thigh," said a news release issued Thursday. "The second torch landed on the artificial turf, causing a section to ignite, causing approximately $2,000 damage."
After the incident, which happened in the second half of Toronto's 1-0 victory, "the two accused attempted to flee but were apprehended by police and security officers assigned to the game," according to the news release.
While play continued, fans identified the two young men and appeared to even help restrain them, leading to a quick arrest.
Andjelo Franjic, 18, and a 17-year-old who cannot be identified under the Youth Criminal Justice Act, face four charges:
- possession of a weapon for a dangerous purpose;
- assault with a weapon;
- assault causing bodily harm;
- mischief under $5,000.




Serves 'em right..
Andjelo looks hardcore on FB (Sarcasm..)

[Parkdale]

Alrighty then, on that note its back to the member's section for me!


hahaha. good call!

[Vinny Dichio]

Not sure if this is a duplication or not, but I found this on the star.
They were in fact teenagers.
http://www.thestar.com/news/gta/article/623324

[Red CB Toronto]

I was at game in Paris two months ago, saw PSG, I could not believe how many flares there were, one entire end was a red sea of fire, boy was it smokey too and security just shrugged their shoulders to it, did not once try to stop it, it was crazy.

Did not see really any flares in England except in Burnley where in flare landed at mid field , it was shot from a flaregun from outside the stadium, it just came out of nowhere.

[rocker]

Andjelo looks hardcore on FB (Sarcasm..)

ya.. nice tough guy sweater he wears in his facebook pic. hahah

[Whoop]

Relating to the possible lawsuit, hockey teams have been sued as a result of pucks flying into crowds.

That's why the nets came up across arenas in North America.

In reality those lawsuits rarely pan out and this case I doubt it would either.

But I can see BMO imposing stricter searches in the future.

[Red CB Toronto]

Relating to the possible lawsuit, hockey teams have been sued as a result of pucks flying into crowds.

That's why the nets came up across arenas in North America.

In reality those lawsuits rarely pan out and this case I doubt it would either.

But I can see BMO imposing stricter searches in the future.

They do pan out, the girl died in Columbus, her family sued and the NHL made every team in the league put up nets

[Gixmo]

They do pan out, the girl died in Columbus, her family sued and the NHL made every team in the league put up nets

A similar situation occurred in my home town when the Sting first played at Sarnia Arena. People getting smoked with pucks were an almost nightly occurrence. I do not think there was any suing involved, but the team quickly put nets up (Anyone who's played at the Brock Street Barn knows how that sitting in the ends is asking for trouble) This was prior to the Columbus incident too IIRC.

[Don Julio]

I imagine if they were intoxicated they would've been charged with that as well, especially considering the age. Don't jump to conclusions.

[RedRum]

It unfortunate but the failure of BMO/MLSE to maintain thier own rules .. not allowing supporters (drums, standing, flags, etc.,) outside of the supporters section (i.e NEE) has lead to a broadening disregard for the rules. IF BMO fails to enforce thier own rules for two years, then modify's supporter sections to contain the result ... how can they expect a reasonable degree of order to be maintained, thereafter.

The real problem is security and BMO allowing people outside of the southend to carry on like 'holigans' or 'ultra's' you can't turn a blind eye to one section and then expect control in another.

If you hate what NEE brings to 127 why did you not make use of the seat relocation appointments?

Cry all you want, the great support in 127 is here to stay.

:dita:

[TFC-4-Life]

Here is an article on the incident if it hasn't been posted yet

http://www.thestar.com/GTA/Crime/article/623324

[Gixmo]

Folks, The link to the article has been posted 3 times now in this thread alone, plus the entire article copied over..

Read the thread!!!

[cosmos]

They do pan out, the girl died in Columbus, her family sued and the NHL made every team in the league put up nets

Just imagine a clear plastic bubble or net around the pitch with all of us looking in from the outside. That would totally ruin the game feel.

http://tbn0.google.com/images?q=tbn:lcfE54aX6_g9TM:http://www.thefarleygroup.com/graphics/soccer_divider_net.jpg (http://images.google.com/imgres?imgurl=http://www.thefarleygroup.com/graphics/soccer_divider_net.jpg&imgrefurl=http://www.thefarleygroup.com/accessories.html&usg=__-E8lZ3tUv1e3abRk7rjhdvKa8iQ=&h=263&w=350&sz=7&hl=en&start=1&um=1&tbnid=lcfE54aX6_g9TM:&tbnh=90&tbnw=120&prev=/images%3Fq%3Dsoccer%2Bdivider%26hl%3Den%26sa%3DN%2 6um%3D1)http://www.incord.com/sportsphotos/FSA/indoor-soccer-net-sm.jpg (http://javascript<b></b>:;)http://www.incord.com/sportsphotos/FSA/court-divider.jpghttp://www.incord.com/sportsphotos/FSA/knotted-netting-blk.jpg

[Hitcho]

First of all - I hope the woman's thigh is not badly burned and she makes a quick and full recovery.

Secondly - great to see Girard mention the fan involvement in getting the wankers nabbed. That at least makes it look as though it's just two idiots and not some kind of fan warfare taking place.

Thirdly - nail those fuckers, and nail em good, with every charge possible. They definitely deserve to be made a pubic scapegoat out of to stop this happening again. They knew what they were doing. You don't just "find" some flares in your pocket and then light them in a crowd of people.

[fetajr]

though irresponsible at bmo..that flare was nothing compared to...

iFTYlw9xPIo

[Sally Mack]

bahaha, i played against that kid in soccer this past summer... they're team was a bunch of kids, so naturally we owned them :)

[dupont]

- possession of a weapon for a dangerous purpose;
- assault with a weapon;
- assault causing bodily harm;
- mischief under $5,000.

awesome! I'm glad they are getting criminal charges and not just a stadium ban. This is a great way to send the message that this will not be tolerated.

I hope the woman isn't burned too badly.

[Jack]

though irresponsible at bmo..that flare was nothing compared to...

iFTYlw9xPIo
You should see the videos I saw in Mexico of the guy whose eye was destroyed by a firecracker at a football match. (I searched, but can't find them. This was about 5 years ago)

No question that display is impressive, but no question that the things can be dangerous, especially when they get in the hands of people who don't know how to handle them.

[Yohan]

You should see the videos I saw in Mexico of the guy whose eye was destroyed by a firecracker at a football match. (I searched, but can't find them. This was about 5 years ago)

No question that display is impressive, but no question that the things can be dangerous, especially when they get in the hands of people who don't know how to handle them.
drunk people and fireworks.

eeeesh

[cosmos]

No question that display is impressive, but no question that the things can be dangerous, especially when they get in the hands of people who don't know how to handle them.

I was going to post a picture of what happens to your eye and hand but did not want to offend - here is the eye link

www.cehjournal.org/extra/55_03_03.html (http://www.cehjournal.org/extra/55_03_03.html)

[Jack]

Just get grass so they can be thrown onto the field.

Hope the one who got hit with the flare is OK, bad throw from the kid.
Right...throw them on the pitch! Perfect solution :noidea:

[s2cazz]

I'm all for flares in tifo's...some of the most berautiful Tifos done by the ultras in Italy use flares. I'm really borderline on what these guys did... I mean I don't agree with anyone getting hurt in any way...just that i think flares can actually make the tifos look so much better and i'm sorry these idiots have really ruined things

[Captain Croatia]

Right...throw them on the pitch! Perfect solution :noidea:

Better then at the people i would say.

[Jack]

Better then at the people i would say.

Aren't there people on the pitch?

Anyway, throwing flares anywhere is just a dumb idea. As evidenced last night when the throw doesn't go where you want it to.

[cosmos]

Better then at the people i would say.

I say we take the kids and shove the flares up their a**
http://tbn2.google.com/images?q=tbn:VIUeDjL2ivvzhM:http://i426.photobucket.com/albums/pp348/blee45/firecracker.jpg (http://images.google.com/imgres?imgurl=http://i426.photobucket.com/albums/pp348/blee45/firecracker.jpg&imgrefurl=http://www.powersellersunite.com/post-240960.html&usg=__x9h0ynbG0uynX50qtPZbqHbbsac=&h=337&w=600&sz=34&hl=en&start=16&um=1&tbnid=VIUeDjL2ivvzhM:&tbnh=76&tbnw=135&prev=/images%3Fq%3Dfirecracker%2Bhand%26ndsp%3D18%26hl%3 Den%26sa%3DN%26um%3D1)

[RedMAN127]

If you hate what NEE brings to 127 why did you not make use of the seat relocation appointments?

Cry all you want, the great support in 127 is here to stay.

:dita:

It's akin to the broken window theory .. whether I am part of the sg or not .. the point is BMO/MLSE have been condoning violations of the Code of Conduct in many area's including 127 by not stopping them, they have created an atmosphere where people believe it is okay to have flares, stand on seats, use racist epithates, and maybe even throw stuff at opposing teams .. and as such are very liable to any injury caused by racous behaviour.

[Jack]

It's akin to the broken window theory .. whether I am part of the sg or not .. the point is BMO/MLSE have been condoning violations of the Code of Conduct in many area's including 127 by not stopping them, they have created an atmosphere where people believe it is okay to have flares, stand on seats, use racist epithates, and maybe even throw stuff at opposing teams .. and as such are very liable to any injury caused by racous behaviour.

Where do people condone these actions? :noidea:

Not around here.

[Captain Croatia]

Aren't there people on the pitch?

Anyway, throwing flares anywhere is just a dumb idea. As evidenced last night when the throw doesn't go where you want it to.

They are all around the pitch, not likely to get hit.

Im done, dont want to start anything stupid here.

[Yohan]

I'm all for flares in tifo's...some of the most berautiful Tifos done by the ultras in Italy use flares. I'm really borderline on what these guys did... I mean I don't agree with anyone getting hurt in any way...just that i think flares can actually make the tifos look so much better and i'm sorry these idiots have really ruined things
i think everyone should swallow red food colouring prior to game and unleash a massive fart at same time, hoping that the fart will have a red tinge and it will envelop BMO Field

it might smell really bad and some people might choke on the smell, but it'd still be a pretty cool tifo

[RedMAN127]

From an 18 inch drop off his chair? Or by doing something stupid like leaning over the guard rail and falling onto a lower section?


read my post again there brick city. i was asking a question. you mention a drunk falling.... i clearly alluded to a person falling which is fair reason to ask them to get down.


40-year-old Edmonton man broke his neck when another man fell on him in the midst of a skirmish over a spilled drink at a Bon Jovi concert. He is paralysed from the neck down.

... the guy fell from one row above, other guy is f'd for life? Sonny maybe your right only drunk people should have to follow the rules.

[spezz44]

i think everyone should swallow red food colouring prior to game and unleash a massive fart at same time, hoping that the fart will have a red tinge and it will envelop BMO Field

it might smell really bad and some people might choke on the smell, but it'd still be a pretty cool tifo

works for me haha

[Jack]

40-year-old Edmonton man broke his neck when another man fell on him in the midst of a skirmish over a spilled drink at a Bon Jovi concert. He is paralysed from the neck down.

... the guy fell from one row above, other guy is f'd for life? Sonny maybe your right only drunk people should have to follow the rules.
I fail to see what this has to do with what's being discussed here. You've got an agenda you're pushing lately, both here and over on the NEE boards.

[Blazer]

He/They should be banned for good and charged by the police in my opinion. We're lucky somebody wasn't seriously hurt.

Burns to a woman’s lap are serious. Scars for the rest of her life because she wanted to watch a football game? Silly.

[AL-MO]

I was at game in Paris two months ago, saw PSG, I could not believe how many flares there were, one entire end was a red sea of fire, boy was it smokey too and security just shrugged their shoulders to it, did not once try to stop it, it was crazy.



I think its pretty obvious why they didn't.

Security going in there would cause more problems than just leaving them alone.

[AL-MO]

I'm all for flares in tifo's...some of the most berautiful Tifos done by the ultras in Italy use flares. I'm really borderline on what these guys did... I mean I don't agree with anyone getting hurt in any way...just that i think flares can actually make the tifos look so much better and i'm sorry these idiots have really ruined things

I hear what you are saying, but its against the rules @ BMO.

[RedMAN127]

I pulled a guy standing on his seat off twice. The second time I had to yell at him. He got the point and didn't do it again. he wasn't a dick about it, just drunk off his rocker.


I fail to see what this has to do with what's being discussed here. You've got an agenda you're pushing lately, both here and over on the NEE boards.


jabbronies (http://www.redpatchboys.ca/forums/member.php?u=19) part of the "conspiracy" too, Jack?

[Inswingingwingman]

I maintain that MLSE should take charge of the pyro stuff. It's done in the Dome for the Jays and I can't comment on Raptors games or Leaf Games, but done right it's good for the atmosphere. I checked and my pyro licence is expired, but I can still light the BBQ.

Supporters groups could pitch in to purchase signature stuff that would be safely fired off at the appropriate time.

The following is true.

John I need you to work undercover tonight, no fire inspectors uniform, at 9 o'clock they are planning to set of some pyrotechnics at this address.

Me: Um chief you know this is a strip club right?

Yes John, that's why you are going undercover.

Me: Chief I need at least 20 bucks for beer.

Chief: NO.

Me: I'm gonna stick out, they won't let me stay I gotta buy a beer.

Chief: Here's 5 bucks get a coke.

Next Day.

Chief: What happened?

Me: No pyros, they had no licence for powder and stuff but the fire show was ok.

Chief: Fire show, under what conditions?

Me: Someone qualified on stage with a fire extinguisher?

Chief: That's good isn't it?

Me: Ya, but you owe me for the whole night....just kidding I made a doorman do it.

[RedMAN127]

jabbronies (http://www.redpatchboys.ca/forums/member.php?u=19) part of the "conspiracy" too, Jack?


What seems to be at issue here is whether the problem was having the flares or that someone got hurt.

same with standing on seats, is it condoned until someone gets hurt or do we prevent someone getting hurt, by being resonsible in our support.

[flatpicker]

I fail to see what more can be gained by continuing this thread.

The topic of flares has been discussed ad nauseam!

Let this one die along with all the past "flare" threads... please!

[Rochdale]

Well l wonder if the supporter groups will now stop throwing flares on the field of play when we go back to Columbus.

[Jack]

Well l wonder if the supporter groups will now stop throwing flares on the field of play when we go back to Columbus.
"The supporters groups"?

Good question.

[GabrielHurl]

What seems to be at issue here is whether the problem was having the flares or that someone got hurt.

same with standing on seats, is it condoned until someone gets hurt or do we prevent someone getting hurt, by being resonsible in our support.

Alright Steve calm down :rolleyes:

[Don Julio]

I fail to see what more can be gained by continuing this thread.

The topic of flares has been discussed ad nauseam!

Let this one die along with all the past "flare" threads... please!

I disagree. Keeping this thread active will help casual people that lurk realize that there are consequences to actions like these. The reason beer throwing has gone on so long is people get away with it, or at least seem to. Publicizing stadium bans, loss of tickets and (in this case) prosecution is a good thing. Even those who love flares should realize that every time ANYTHING gets thrown on the pitch it's a step back for their argument.

[flatpicker]

I disagree. Keeping this thread active will help casual people that lurk realize that there are consequences to actions like these.


What more could possibly be said that doesn't already make the point that stupidity will be punished?

[InTheCrowd]

I was in 112 and this fool chucks one into 113! What a cunt! Everyone in like 112, 113 and 111 were giving him the finger and cursing at him. He was just standing there with his hand close to his ear gesturing like "keep saying it" like a dumbshit.

[mlsintoronto]

One other related issue on this topic - some people have been calling for the ticket owners to have their tickets taken away if the idiots who threw the flares are not the actual ticket holders.

I hope this doesn;t happen.

This exists as a current policy...although we've never done it yet. This year our security is far more effective (we've never caught a flare thrower before) than in 07 or 08. We will enforce this for repeat offenders. We're not after people who don't break the rules...but we also won't let people hide behind "another name on the account".

[boban]

This exists as a current policy...although we've never done it yet. This year our security is far more effective (we've never caught a flare thrower before) than in 07 or 08. We will enforce this for repeat offenders. We're not after people who don't break the rules...but we also won't let people hide behind "another name on the account".
Clarify please.

[Batman]

I think that means the ticket owner is also responsible if someone else is using their ticket.

[boban]

I think that means the ticket owner is also responsible if someone else is using their ticket.
Fuck that shit.

[Blizzard]

I hope that was scalpers season ticket seat and he will short for those 2 seats from now on.
The trow was deliberate,he was aiming for 112-113,wind wasn't so strong.

If it is, they should remove all the season tickets that are in his account! If it's 10, take all 10 away!

[Jack]

Fuck that shit.
Make sure you give your tickets to someone who isn't going to fuck you over. :noidea:

[grizzle]

Nope. On the back of the ticket, and I quote:

The holder voluntarily assumes all risk and danger of personal injury (inc. death) and all other hazards arising from or related in anyway to this event whether occuring prior to, during or after the event.
More specifically, the holder hereby assumes all risk of injury resulting from or in connection with the event, including without limitation the risk of injury due to the negligence or misconduct of other spectators and agrees that MLSE , TFC, Board of Govs. of exhibition place, City of Toronto, employeess, players officials, directors, members, L.L.Cm ....shall not be responsible or liable for any loss, damage or injury resulting form such causes.

(its bolded on the back of the ticket)

So...I believe the lawsuit against MLSE will go nowwhere

Hahaha... I didn't believe this at first, so I decided to check... its true. No wonder they print it so microscopic.

[boban]

Make sure you give your tickets to someone who isn't going to fuck you over. :noidea:
Easier said than done.
Yo can't make a blanket policy on that.
For example. I have 1 pair of tickets. I can't make a game and call my buddy if he wants to go. he says ok and he takes someone. Now I don't have a clue who this other person is. He decides to throw a flare and I get screwed on that. I don't think so.

[grizzle]

Make sure you give your tickets to someone who isn't going to fuck you over. :noidea:

What if you sell your tickets because you can't make it to a game. Come on, put the blame the guilty not someone who had nothing to do with it.

[mlsintoronto]

Clarify please.

Bob Jones owns fictional section 315 row 8. on May 10, Fred sits in those seats gets wasted, aggressive with police, and eventually booted from the building. He may or may not get charged.

On May 12 Bob will get a letter from me re-iterating the policy, letting him know the incident that occurred, and a warning that he's responsible for the actions of the people in his seats. just like in football it is a caution.


June 1 a guy named Stan tosses a beer and gets caught... and he is also in Bob's seats....a trend emerges.

Bob gets another letter letting him know that his season ticket purchase privileges (for all 8 seats that he has at BMO Field) have been revoked.


Now...this is an extreme example. If Bob is a scalper...no problem. done and done. If Bob calls me after the first incident and we talk and I understand that some judgment is required based on the circumstances...then of course we'll show good judgment. but the rules are stacked in our favour. Not so we can kill the atmosphere but so that we can ensure the safety and enjoyment of all our supporters, players and officials. This isn't a new policy, but we haven't felt the need to use it until recently. I think you'll all agree that we need a few uneventful games in a row to get past the image issues that exist (despite your and our best efforts).

If the problems (isolated I know but attention getting) persist, then we're going to be forced to dial up the enforcement. No one wants that - not you guys and not us.

I hope that's clear. I know it reads heavy handed but thats not the intent... we want to carry a big stick but not use it.

[wzhxvy]

I agree with the policy that the STH should be held responsible for actions of the people in their seats. As a matter of fact, I think the warning policy described above almost ensures that unless you are completely negligent or a scalper, you should be OK.

I dont understand why people are even complaining about this. If you get a warning once, then you know. The seats are supposed to be for you to sit in them...not use them as some sort of asset that you can do with as you please.

Now I am getting an allergic reaction to defending MLSE...so WHERE IS OUR F'ING DP ? lol...hmmm that feels better

[Red CB Toronto]

Paul,

Just to follow, a service you off is the ability to sell tickets through account manager, would that be delt with any differently, I am just curious since the person used your service.

[mlsintoronto]

Now I am getting an allergic reaction to defending MLSE...so WHERE IS OUR F'ING DP ? lol...hmmm that feels better

Try this as an alternative: "Fire Mo!" works for me when I'm feeling down.

[flatpicker]

This could cause issues with the RPB Ticket Trader forum.

How many people will still be willing to sell tickets to other RPB (whom they may not know)?

There is always a risk... the best way to be sure is only give tickets to those you know and trust.
But there are a lot of people who use the Ticket Trader and don't know each other.

[mlsintoronto]

Paul,

Just to follow, a service you off is the ability to sell tickets through account manager, would that be delt with any differently, I am just curious since the person used your service.

Great question. I think you're right. Only existing customers can use account manager. But we will need to make it explicit. This is why I like the boards. Thanks.

[mlsintoronto]

This could cause issues with the RPB Ticket Trader forum.

How many people will still be willing to sell tickets to other RPB (whom they may not know)?

There is always a risk... the best way to be sure is only give tickets to those you know and trust.
But there are a lot of people who use the Ticket Trader and don't know each other.

I have to believe we can navigate this. It's where the judgement comes in.

[Yohan]

This could cause issues with the RPB Ticket Trader forum.

How many people will still be willing to sell tickets to other RPB (whom they may not know)?

There is always a risk... the best way to be sure is only give tickets to those you know and trust.
But there are a lot of people who use the Ticket Trader and don't know each other.
and potentially creating more hesitation

enough people not willing to let others have their tickets and cant come to a game, means more empty seats every game

basically what I understand is that STH is being held responsible for their seats, and vet every person that uses their seats, but how is this going to be really possible?

I fail to see how punishing the orig STH for someone being a moron (STH = accomplice?) is going to be productive

punish the guilty

[eustacchio]

This could cause issues with the RPB Ticket Trader forum.

How many people will still be willing to sell tickets to other RPB (whom they may not know)?

There is always a risk... the best way to be sure is only give tickets to those you know and trust.
But there are a lot of people who use the Ticket Trader and don't know each other.

Anytime that I've bought a ticket from the Ticket Trader (which has been a few times now) it has always been from someone whose face I don't know. I've noticed that the seller has always checked out my profile (not that there's much information there). Besides if I sell my tickets to an RPB and something stupid goes down, I'll be able to report him/her to our fellow RPBs and things will most likely get sorted out.

[sully]

what if you re-sell your ticket to MLSE in the account page..I assume in that case we are not responsible for who sits in the seat?

[Bloor West FC]

One guy got kicked out of my section in lower 111, and he deserved it...the police even gave him a chance to shut-up (he was throwing insults at them) and sit down but he wouldn't listen..

never saw him in my section before...and hope I never do again.

The first guy which was in row 3 in 111 near the 111-112 border was throwing peanuts at the cop. Finally after 5 or so he got pissed and kicked him out. Thats when the other guy started insulting the cops and got kicked out himself.

[dantdot]

Someone on BS called us Milwonto, now that's a keeper :smilielol5:

[mighty_torontofc_2008]

Fuck that shit.


no way...if you silly enough to give your tickets to idiots the season ticket holder should be held with being somewhat responsible...

If they do find the seat holder....

a) give him/her a warning one a first offence...stating anymore incidents
by the ticket holder, seat owner or not will result in loss of season
tickets

simple as that....Becareful who you give you tickets too....

[Yohan]

no way...if you silly enough to give your tickets to idiots the season ticket holder should be held with being somewhat responsible...

yeah, but you dont know if the person you're giving the tickets is an idiot, esp an online transaction

normal people act under assumption that the other dude is not a jerk.

this rule will only create suspicion, and less trust among Toronto FC fans

[mighty_torontofc_2008]

yeah, but you dont know if the person you're giving the tickets is an idiot, esp an online transaction

normal people act under assumption that the other dude is not a jerk.

this rule will only create suspicion, and less trust among Toronto FC fans


true..if you cant go to a match for what ever reason give the ticket (s) to a family member....that way you should be able to trust them!!:eek:

[alexintoronto]

A person should be held accountable for their own actions.

I shouldn't have to do a background check on people before selling them a ticket.

Is MLSE going to absolve STHs of their responsibility if they sell the tickets through the TFC Ticket Trader instead of on message boards or via craigslist? How much do you guys make on each transaction there? Just wondering how much transferring responsibility is going to cost us and how much more revenue it's going to generate for you.

[Yohan]

true..if you cant go to a match for what ever reason give the ticket (s) to a family member....that way you should be able to trust them!!:eek:
you do also realize that enforcing this rule is going to deny a lot of opportunities for other TFC fans who don't have season tickets from enjoying a match at BMO?

deny accessibility to BMO. not the smartest marketing strategy

[MUFC_Niagara]

Guys this isn't rocket science, just use due diligence before you give/sell your tickets. It's like anything else you own, take care of your investment.

[grizzle]

I've never seen so many idiotic responses. How can anyone agree that you are responsible for your seat if you sell your tickets. That is absolute BS. People should be held accountable for their OWN actions. Any other way basically says that the people making the rules only have half a brain and have no idea where to point the blame. Here's a clue: THE PEOPLE DOING THE ACTION THAT IS CAUSING YOU TO TAKE ACTION!

Life is about choices and people can make their own choices, but, if they make a bad choice they should be willing to deal with the consequences. Punishing someone that had NOTHING to do with something is absurd. The only way I could see this kind of thing apply was if BMO did background checks on EVERY SINGLE PERSON that they sold tickets too... yea, as I thought, will NEVER happen.

[flatpicker]

Lance Brown just went off on TFC fans on this evenings CTV news.

In a nutshell he said:

- TFC fans have a reputation for bad behaviour
- many still think this is the "old world", and some of them should go back to the "old world".
- MLS should take a page from UEFA and make Toronto play in front of an empty stadium.


man... I'm getting sick and tired of this shit!!!

[wzhxvy]

Life is about choices and you make your choices based on the rules. If the rule is you will be held accountable for your seats, then you need to assess the risk of selling your tickets.

I love all the people arguing against this. You do not have the god given right to those seats people nor the right to do with them as you please. Its not an asset that you can transfer at your whim.

Oh and btw, lets not get into the many examples of how we are held responsible for the actions of others. That happens in every avenue of life. Its called being an adult.

[grizzle]

Lance Brown just went off on TFC fans on this evenings CTV news.

In a nutshell he said:

- TFC fans have a reputation for bad behaviour
- many still think this is the "old world", and some of them should go back to the "old world".
- MLS should take a page from UEFA and make Toronto play in front of an empty stadium.


man... I'm getting sick and tired of this shit!!!

Lance Brown should take a trip outside of Toronto. This is one of the reasons why I don't watch or read the news. The only reason he is taking this stance is because this story will sell more than the story that says "Toronto FC has the best supporting fans in the MLS". The majority unfortunately only want to hear the bad stuff. Stop supporting these idiots by watching or buying their crap.

[wzhxvy]

Lance should focus his efforts on finding another family member a job (after his brother for those of you who dont know what my reference is about).

[flatpicker]

Lance Brown should take a trip outside of Toronto. This is one of the reasons why I don't watch or read the news. The only reason he is taking this stance is because this story will sell more than the story that says "Toronto FC has the best supporting fans in the MLS". The majority unfortunately only want to hear the bad stuff. Stop supporting these idiots by watching or buying their crap.


well, I always enjoyed Lance Brown prior to today.
CTV is usually my first choice of news broadcaster.
Perhaps I will have to become more of a Citytv or CBC news viewer...

[grizzle]

well, I always enjoyed Lance Brown prior to today.
CTV is usually my first choice of news broadcaster.
Perhaps I will have to become more of a Citytv or CBC news viewer...

You could always write to them and complain. Also be sure to write the sponsors that they share with the TFC (CCing CTV of course) and mention how they are trashing their investment. Probably overkill but it may piss them off enough that they will think more next time.

[MUFC_Niagara]

I've never seen so many idiotic responses. How can anyone agree that you are responsible for your seat if you sell your tickets. That is absolute BS. People should be held accountable for their OWN actions. Any other way basically says that the people making the rules only have half a brain and have no idea where to point the blame. Here's a clue: THE PEOPLE DOING THE ACTION THAT IS CAUSING YOU TO TAKE ACTION!

Life is about choices and people can make their own choices, but, if they make a bad choice they should be willing to deal with the consequences. Punishing someone that had NOTHING to do with something is absurd. The only way I could see this kind of thing apply was if BMO did background checks on EVERY SINGLE PERSON that they sold tickets too... yea, as I thought, will NEVER happen.

It's quite simple. You know that friend you have that likes to get to really drunk and do dumb shit? Probably not the best guy to give your tickets to. You know the people on here that are always fighting with people and sticking up for people doing dumb shit? Probably not the best person to give your tickets to. It's not a hard concept.

[Yohan]

It's quite simple. You know that friend you have that likes to get to really drunk and do dumb shit? Probably not the best guy to give your tickets to. You know the people on here that are always fighting with people and sticking up for people doing dumb shit? Probably not the best person to give your tickets to. It's not a hard concept.
and what about online transactions?

i hardly know any of you people. and i rely on this forum (well, a friend too) for tix
i'm mildly annoyed because if i cant get TFC tickets because of this, well, i might have to go beat up some punk kids or something

[tfc110]

Honestly, this is beyond a joke.

Security doesn't need to be stepped up, but idiots need to be filtered out.

Life ban, ticket holders, and seat owners if they are related or scalpers.

I would have laid those two kids out if I was close enough.

[Blizzard]

Lance Brown just went off on TFC fans on this evenings CTV news.

In a nutshell he said:

- TFC fans have a reputation for bad behaviour
- many still think this is the "old world", and some of them should go back to the "old world".
- MLS should take a page from UEFA and make Toronto play in front of an empty stadium.


man... I'm getting sick and tired of this shit!!!

Lance Brown? The guy who was beat up Dave Keon Jr. during a hockey scrimmage game a few years back? That Lance Brown? Hmmmmmm.

[Inswingingwingman]

On the issue of accountability, MLSE has way more at stake than you do. If you get drunk and fall out of the stands quess who's liable. Check that stuff that happened to the Golf Course in Muskoka. If you give your ticket to Joe and Jill Blow and they sneak in a mickey each, drink 5 or 6 beers each, light a flare and hurt themselves Paul and MLSE are responsible. And if they hurt someone else who wins a lawsuit against both Joe and Jill for a 3 millon bucks and they only have 2.00 in the bank then under joint and several liability MLSE is on the hook for 1,999,998.00. And their liquor licence is in peril cause they are responsible to have a safe environment.

It's easy to say here's my car, but if you hurt yourself it's your problem. Same things goes if you signed for the tickets and it says they can revoke them. I'm sure if they find out it wasn't you, and you won't do it again they would be reasonable. But it is not an excuse.

[Lennon]

Sigh ... they'll never allow flares at BMO if we're throwing them at each other ...

[Blizzard]

It's quite simple. You know that friend you have that likes to get to really drunk and do dumb shit? Probably not the best guy to give your tickets to. You know the people on here that are always fighting with people and sticking up for people doing dumb shit? Probably not the best person to give your tickets to. It's not a hard concept.

Exactly. Sell your tickets to people you feel you can trust. It's the responsible thing to do.

Think of it as the equivalent of allowing a friend to drive your car. If you don't trust them, you're not going to do it.

[mighty_torontofc_2008]

A person should be held accountable for their own actions.

I shouldn't have to do a background check on people before selling them a ticket.

Is MLSE going to absolve STHs of their responsibility if they sell the tickets through the TFC Ticket Trader instead of on message boards or via craigslist? How much do you guys make on each transaction there? Just wondering how much transferring responsibility is going to cost us and how much more revenue it's going to generate for you.


Ok i own a gun i give the gun to someone who kills someone else im not responsible cause i was not there? Wrong...im responsible....a flare is a weapon like a gun...it can hurt, burn etc...a flare purpose is for cars trucks on roads...no for sporting events... the excuse its done in europe ( someone will mention this sooner or later) is not valid....Europe has also started may wars and killed millions of people so we really dont want to follow their example at anything...your ticket your responsibility if you give it to someone and they act up...