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Batman
04-11-2009, 06:47 AM
Toronto the rowdy

The city's sports fans are showing an aggression not seen before at games, reports Michael Grange. Blame booze, hockey or European traditions

MICHAEL GRANGE
April 11, 2009

There was a time when the primary criticism levelled at Toronto sports fans was that they were boring.
Those traditions run deep. Legendary Leafs owner Conn Smythe patrolled the stands at Maple Leaf Gardens to ensure ticket holders met the dress code. The Blue Jays' long run of success in the mid-1980s to the early 1990s meant that the 50,000 fans at the Rogers Centre, née SkyDome, were known for their cavalier "wake me up when the playoffs start" attitude. Then there was the unforgettable moment when the Leafs opened the Air Canada Centre in 1999 and TV cameras captured swaths of empty seats in the platinum section - the season-ticket-holding swells were still finishing wine and cheese in the lounges.
Dull and detached isn't looking so bad these days if the alternative is drunk, angry louts misbehaving in the name of fandom. Conn Smythe wouldn't have tolerated it.
On Monday night, the Blue Jays' home opener was marred as paper airplanes and beer cups kept making their way to the field of play. Eventually, Detroit Tigers manager Jim Leyland had to pull his team off the field briefly when one of his players was nearly hit by a baseball.
Print Edition - Section Front

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It's believed to be the first time a game was halted at Rogers Centre because of fans.
Last Saturday, fans of the Toronto FC welcomed comedian Drew Carey - co-owner of the Seattle Sounders of Major League Soccer - to BMO Field with a beer shower. The week before, an estimated 2,000 TFC fans followed the team on the road to Columbus, Ohio, for the season opener. The game featured smoke bombs. Someone threw a broken banner railing over the edge. There were scattered fights and chest-thumping afterward. One Toronto fan was subdued by police with a taser.
And, as the attachment between Toronto fans and the National Football League's Buffalo Bulls deepens - the team now plays one "home" game a year at the Rogers Centre - police in Orchard Park, N.Y., can only smack their foreheads: A disproportionate number of arrests they make at true Bills home games are of drunk fans from Southern Ontario.
"Maybe things have changed," said Dustin Parkes, 28, a lifelong baseball aficionado, Rogers Centre regular and co-founder of the popular baseball blog titled - ironically, he insists - Drunk Jays Fans. "Maybe now people think the only way to enjoy a sporting event is to get plastered."
As a punishment for a series of liquor-related offences last season at the Rogers Centre, the stadium has to "go dry" for three events this year, the first of which was the Jays-Tigers game on Tuesday. Detroit outfielder Josh Anderson said, "That's good. These people can't handle it."
Mario Coutinho, the Blue Jays vice-president of operations and security, says his staff eject about 50 fans a game over the course of the season, for reasons ranging from drunkenness to ticket violations. The trend, he says, is toward heavy drinking outside the park before the game, leaving Rogers Centre staff to deal with the fallout.
According to Bob Hunter, executive vice-president of venues and entertainment for Maple Leaf Sports and Entertainment - owner of BMO Field, Toronto FC, the Air Canada Centre, the Toronto Maple Leafs and the Toronto Raptors - there were "no more than five ejections" from the TFC game on Saturday and only six or seven at the Leafs game against the visiting Montreal Canadiens Saturday night.
The least unruly fans among the major Toronto sports teams belong to the Raptors, who have recorded only 20 fan ejections this season, says Mr. Hunter. That's 50 ejections a game for the Jays versus 20 fan ejections all season for the Raptors.
Coincidentally or not, the beer sales at Raptors gamers are lower than TFC and Leafs games.
Is fan behaviour getting worse? If it is, it's only by degrees, says Mr. Hunter. Nevertheless, MLSE updated its security procedures last year.
Mr. Parkes's premise is that, as Canadians are weaned on hockey, their tendency is to perk up at the game's big moments: fights, big hits or close plays, of which hockey provides plenty. Other sports, by comparison, don't have the same excitement level, so fans are tempted to make their own fun.
Certainly, Chris Gould of 2000 Tours, based in London, Ont., has taken thousands of football fans from Southern Ontario to Buffalo Bills games since he began running bus trips in 1999, and handfuls of his customers have been arrested. The story rarely changes: The bus arrives hours before kickoff, the tailgating begins and bad judgment soon follows. "I think it might be because Canadian laws are more conservative about open liquor," says Mr. Gould. "They get to Buffalo, the tailgate party starts and the cops are high-fiving you ...Canadians lose their minds."
On Nov. 30, 2008, the Bills hosted the San Francisco 49ers and Canadian fans accounted for nearly two-thirds of the 33 people arrested at the game, no small feat considering Canadians made up only 15 to 20 per cent of the crowd.
Nowhere is that habit more ingrained than in the fervent following that European soccer teams engender, where chants and loyalties are passed on through generations. The explosion in popularity of Toronto FC, the local entry in the MLS just beginning its third season, borrows from those traditions. Every game at BMO Field has been a sellout; the waiting list for season tickets stands at 14,000.
The home games are special, in part because of the 2,000 or so over-the-top supporters such as the Red Patch Boys, North End Elite and the U-Sector. They gather at bars near BMO Field and congregate at nearby Lamport Stadium to march en masse to the game. The chanting, singing and never-sit-down enthusiasm is part of the entertainment for the suburban soccer families that fill out the crowd.
But the line between fun and loutishness is a blurry one. "They do ride on the edge. There's no doubt," says Duane Rollins, a TFC season ticket holder and member of the U-Sector, whose blog, The 24th Minute, covers "the world game from a Canadian perspective."
"No one would ever argue that we're all angels...," says Mr. Rollins. "It's difficult to justify to someone raised on the more traditional North American fan experience. It's loud, it's crude, but that's the point. Six days a week I'm a normal guy, but for games your inner id comes out."
But foolish fans are hardly the preserve of soccer.
A year ago the Jays home opener featured a 500 upper-deck melee, captured on YouTube via cellphone cameras. This year the team has cancelled the popular $2 Tuesdays promotion after it became associated with fighting and excessive drinking.
"It was not one of our better promotions," says Mr. Coutinho. "It was a cheap cover charge, basically. If you did something stupid and got thrown out, who cares?"
The underlying reason why a small segment of Toronto sports fans present themselves as vulgar and occasionally violent is open to speculation, of course. And it's hardly a made-in-Toronto habit. While opening night at the Rogers Centre was marked by fans throwing objects, in Anaheim, Calif., police are trying to solve a murder after a fan was killed in a fight while leaving the stadium after an Angels game.
But alcohol is a common theme.
The irony, says Kent State University sociologist Jerry M. Lewis - author of a book on North American fan violence - is that teams encourage fans to be rowdy, be it with cheerleading scoreboards or by distributing noisemakers and the like. Alcohol sales - beers in Toronto sports venues average about $10 a cup - are a major source of revenue.
Conn Smythe died in 1980, having led the Leafs to eight Stanley Cups during his ownership tenure. He wouldn't recognize sports in Toronto today and not just because his old team is among the league's dregs.
A lifelong teetotaller, he never sold a drop of beer at Maple Leaf Gardens. The Leafs were winning and his nattily dressed patrons didn't seem to miss it.

Bloor West FC
04-11-2009, 06:50 AM
I stopped reading when he mentioned Buffolo Bulls. LOL

Batman
04-11-2009, 06:52 AM
This was in today's Globe.

I forgot to include the link:
http://www.theglobeandmail.com/servlet/story/LAC.20090411.HOOLIGAN11ART1759/TPStory/?query=michael+grange

I thought it merited it's own discussion thread. I believe Grange normally sticks to basketball and his column normally wouldn't be picked up in our daily news section.

Some rehashed item's, but definitely not as bad as Kelly's article.

Too bad they had to have a big picture of MASKED TFC Supporters to sensationalize it.
Also note, Blue Jays eject approx. 50 fans a game. I didn't see how many for TFC. Any guesses?

Anyway, I like Michael Grange as a reporter and don't feel this article is that bad... It just continues the piling on a bit.

GrimsbyTown
04-11-2009, 06:56 AM
My opinion is that in reality, Toronto fans in general are among the lamest, quietest boring fans ever in the history of sports fans.

Bloor West FC
04-11-2009, 06:57 AM
Maybe 2 or 3 fans at a TFC game get ejected for too much drinking. Not sure if that would be near. But thats my guess. Also look for more ejections as the season goes on people will continue to throw projectiles on the pitch, you will be kicked out and possibly expelled from attending BMO Field.

I am just tired of reading this crap over and over again.

Batman
04-11-2009, 07:01 AM
My opinion is that in reality, Toronto fans in general are among the lamest, quietest boring fans ever in the history of sports fans.

Ya, I agree. Until TFC, or unless Leafs of Raps get into the playoffs there's not much atmosphere.

I welcome what we've brought to the community sporting texture, and if a few guys get the heave ho each game, so be it. They've got about 100 security people at a game, they have to have something to do, don't they?

Shakes McQueen
04-11-2009, 07:05 AM
At least he didn't single out Toronto FC games. I don't agree with his premise though - these kinds of drunken shenanigans happen at sporting events everywhere. The only difference is this year, Toronto has had a few high profile incidents.

I mentioned in another thread that I was at the Jays home opener last season, and it was just as rowdy and ridiculous as this year - if not more. Lots of fights, and stuff being thrown, etc.

This year the media picks up on a few isolated incidents, and suddenly guys like this are scratching their head saying "wow, what happened".

- Scott

Carter
04-11-2009, 07:10 AM
Shaughno (http://www.redpatchboys.ca/forums/member.php?u=18)!!!!! you made the Toronto ROWDY!!!!

olegunnar
04-11-2009, 07:23 AM
as Canadians are weaned on hockey, their tendency is to perk up at the game's big moments: fights, big hits or close plays, of which hockey provides plenty. Other sports, by comparison, don't have the same excitement level, so fans are tempted to make their own fun.


And here it is....
Compared to the best sport ever...HOCKEY!!...Soccer is so boring people have to get shitfaced and make their own fun"

Bias anyone? How do these idiots get away with printing this stuff?

ensco
04-11-2009, 07:34 AM
We live in a four newspaper town. They all print a lot of useless analysis, on all kinds of things. They have lame theories for everything.

This piece wasn't that bad.

I didn't read every last thing posted on this over the last week, but did Drew Carey actually get a beer shower? If yes, I'll bet he laughed his ass off.

King Jeff
04-11-2009, 07:38 AM
We live in a four newspaper town. They all print a lot of useless analysis, on all kinds of things. They have lame theories for everything.

This piece wasn't that bad.


What he said. The Globe has been extremely fair in its coverage of TFC thus far -- this reminds me of a piece you'd see in Toronto Life or something. No point getting worked up about it.

koryo
04-11-2009, 07:43 AM
^^ seconded. This piece sits comfortably in the realm of fair comment.

JDG
04-11-2009, 07:48 AM
We live in a four newspaper town. They all print a lot of useless analysis, on all kinds of things. They have lame theories for everything.

This piece wasn't that bad.

I didn't read every last thing posted on this over the last week, but did Drew Carey actually get a beer shower? If yes, I'll bet he laughed his ass off.

Apparently, after taunting the fans below him, there was some beer launched at him, but it ddn't hit him.

Carts
04-11-2009, 07:50 AM
I hate seeing articles like this, but he does mention all teams etc...

Its the trendy thing to have in print right now - this is not new, its an attempt to sell more papers I guess...

Carts...

koryo
04-11-2009, 07:52 AM
I hate seeing articles like this, but he does mention all teams etc...

Its the trendy thing to have in print right now - this is not new, its an attempt to sell more papers I guess...

Carts...

You have to stop regarding the media as a source of useful, relevant or accurate information Carts. Take them for what they are and it's all much easier to ignore.

Batman
04-11-2009, 08:01 AM
Apparently, after taunting the fans below him, there was some beer launched at him, but it ddn't hit him.

I was there for that. It was all in fun and he enjoyed it more than anyone.

The highly articulate chants of "Fuck you Drew" were also quite entertaining.

Carts
04-11-2009, 08:03 AM
You have to stop regarding the media as a source of useful, relevant or accurate information Carts. Take them for what they are and it's all much easier to ignore.

Very true...

They're a business trying to make money - and right now ragging on fans is selling papers I guess...

I'm just glad my network didn't jump on the "rag on TFC fans" after Columbus...

Carts...

FluSH
04-11-2009, 08:05 AM
Well, It was a balanced perspective instead of the blatant anti-soccer media we've been getting. Micheal Grance, if you could only teach Cathel Kelly how's it done.

Thanks Globe and Mail


P.S. That picture has to be from Columbus...

Redcoe15
04-11-2009, 09:15 AM
Conn Smythe died in 1980, having led the Leafs to eight Stanley Cups during his ownership tenure. He wouldn't recognize sports in Toronto today and not just because his old team is among the league's dregs.
A lifelong teetotaller, he never sold a drop of beer at Maple Leaf Gardens. The Leafs were winning and his nattily dressed patrons didn't seem to miss it.

Fuck that imperialistic, anti semite Conn Smythe. The creep was a mean spirited piece of shit who'd look down on those who didn't think and act like him. I wish he were around today to see Toronto's sporting scene just so he could have a major stroke.

Cashcleaner
04-11-2009, 09:16 AM
My opinion is that in reality, Toronto fans in general are among the lamest, quietest boring fans ever in the history of sports fans.

Yep, that's pretty much it in a nutshell. We fill the ACC for hockey and basketball but barely make a peep. Same goes for Jays and to some extent the Argos at the Rogers Centre.

To be completely honest, the sort of things we do at BMO Field on gameday are almost par for the course for many American college stadiums in terms of atmosphere and internationally speaking, we're still growing. But compared to every other team and their fans here in TO, we're something completely off the scale.

sidvan
04-11-2009, 09:27 AM
The Leafs are not making their traditional end of year failed run to make the playoffs and the Raptors are non starters in terms of media attention. The scribes have nothing to write about.

There is a game today...GO REDS

Toronto_Bhoy
04-11-2009, 10:08 AM
I like Michael Grange. I think this a fair commentary on Toronto fans in general...the Blue Jays come away as knobs.

We are loud, rowdy and at times...offside and in the traditionally conservative "Toronto the Good" that gonna ruffle the feathers of the establishment.

By our own admission, we are changing the "fan" landscape in this market...be prepared to get a couple of scrapes and bruises along the way.

You don't need to like it or agree with it but toughen up...keep it up...and keep moving forward.

dupont
04-11-2009, 11:09 AM
I don't feel like this is a necessary article in any way.. but at least it doesn't show bias towards any one sport. So in that way it's an improvement.

About Toronto fans. I actually think this city has a lot of loyal fans for all the sports but I think years of the management not caring about winning would take its toll on any city.

flatpicker
04-11-2009, 12:05 PM
Not a terrible article.
As folks above said, at least it doesn't focus on TFC.
It uses statistics to show the severity of drunkenness at Jays games.
TFC numbers are extremely low in comparison.

But in reality, it's not a new issue.
This stuff has been going on for ages, and it happens in most cities.
It's what happens when sports and alcohol are mixed... just look at Montreal, Vancouver and Calgary.
Those cities have been very explosive in the past.

The article wouldn't likely have been written if not for the poor coverage TFC fans have received.
But at least this one has a fair and unbiased perspective.

sully
04-11-2009, 12:39 PM
agreed this article has some balance...but essentially this article is about nostalgia for an idealised past..

jloome
04-11-2009, 12:47 PM
We live in a four newspaper town. They all print a lot of useless analysis, on all kinds of things. They have lame theories for everything.

This piece wasn't that bad.

I didn't read every last thing posted on this over the last week, but did Drew Carey actually get a beer shower? If yes, I'll bet he laughed his ass off.

It was fairly lame. Let's face it, there's no context, because there are no statistical comparisons to other jursidictions, no academic level review of crowd behaviour in pro sports beyond someone with a book to sell on one side of the issue, and little balance from the supposed drunken rowdies -- or even the police, which any piece like this would require in order to be taken in the least bit seriously.

In fact, the latter is somewhat deceivingly glossed over by the "police in Buffalo are smacking their foreheads," comment, which is unattributed and, most likely, paraphrastic.

It's filler, fluff. At least it tars all sports with the same brush.

J .
04-11-2009, 08:31 PM
I dont like his insinuations against Duane Rollings for one. I think its a waspy view on the sporting scene. That anything but a golf clap is too much.

50 People being ejected out of 30-50,000 is a tiny number.


Maybe if booze wasnt so fucking expensive, people would not binge before hands.

Jack
04-11-2009, 08:46 PM
Funny...finally the pickle is falling out of peoples' asses and this dude wants to ram it back up there.

Fort York Redcoat
04-12-2009, 07:50 AM
" I want entertainment, excitement, but for the love of God, NOT TOO MUCH!"

Better written then some.

Message redundant by now.

Shakes McQueen
04-12-2009, 07:56 AM
Funny...finally the pickle is falling out of peoples' asses and this dude wants to ram it back up there.

Is this the official RPB stance on this issue? :D

- Scott

Jack
04-12-2009, 09:17 AM
Is this the official RPB stance on this issue? :D

- Scott
That's the official "Jack" stance on this issue.

The official RPB stance on this issue can be found at BMO Field on gameday. :D

Toronto_Bhoy
04-12-2009, 12:11 PM
Touche Jacques

A Stick
04-12-2009, 01:23 PM
Fuck that imperialistic, anti semite Conn Smythe. The creep was a mean spirited piece of shit who'd look down on those who didn't think and act like him. I wish he were around today to see Toronto's sporting scene just so he could have a major stroke.

Conn Smythe was a racist asshole. He was actually quoted in a Toronto newspaper that he would pay anyone $10,000.00 if he or she could turn Herb Carnegie into a white person!:mad:

trane
04-12-2009, 03:01 PM
Funny...finally the pickle is falling out of peoples' asses and this dude wants to ram it back up there.

Fuck, I hope that you are not talking about the pickle I was served with my sandwich last night? I did feel kind of funny after I ate it.

FluSH
04-12-2009, 03:02 PM
Conn Smythe was a racist asshole. He was actually quoted in a Toronto newspaper that he would pay anyone $10,000.00 if he or she could turn Herb Carnegie into a white person!:mad:

just fucking wrong.