PDA

View Full Version : Global News piece on the "hooligans"



MUFC_Niagara
03-31-2009, 04:48 PM
It's 5:46, it'll be on in a few mins!

James Oliphant
03-31-2009, 04:49 PM
Don't expect anything good from Global National.

Rob Leth is doing a report for the local at 6.

Bloor West FC
03-31-2009, 04:53 PM
Wow hudson st hollies are getting bigger LOL :)
Were footy fans everything that goes wrong is related to Hooligans. Whatever. The more media the stronger our fans base gets. Thats the way I think. Good or bad. Its media we live with it everyday.

Blizzard
03-31-2009, 04:58 PM
Don't expect anything good from Global National.

Rob Leth is doing a report for the local at 6.

Duane Rollins was interviewed for the story earlier today.

Torcida
03-31-2009, 04:58 PM
My response to any of these "peaces" about us. Who cares?

ilikemusic
03-31-2009, 05:00 PM
Piece people, it is piece.

I swear I knew the difference between piece and peace when I was like 10.

http://i41.photobucket.com/albums/e293/MarsNova/GrammarNazi.jpg

dantdot
03-31-2009, 05:02 PM
There will be peace when these pieces are peaced.

djking2
03-31-2009, 05:04 PM
I swear i read that all wrong.

Peace on ya

bhoybobby
03-31-2009, 05:07 PM
It was talked about on cbc "there & now" All this negative shit due to a few inbred fuckwits who claim to be TFC supporters.

MUFC_Niagara
03-31-2009, 05:09 PM
"soccer brawl" lol.....what idiots.

MUFC_Niagara
03-31-2009, 05:11 PM
wow....who is that matt thomas guy.....in an effort to show "police brutality" he has been responsible for the catergoric classification of TFC fans because of his stupid youtube video

billyfly
03-31-2009, 05:14 PM
wow....who is that matt thomas guy.....in an effort to show "police brutality" he has been responsible for the catergoric classification of TFC fans because of his stupid youtube video

This made the "news" b/c of the youtube video.

James Oliphant
03-31-2009, 05:15 PM
Duane Rollins was interviewed for the story earlier today.

He was interviewed by Rob Leth for the local. National may have used some segments of it, but I'm the one who sent Rob in Duane's direction.

Jack
03-31-2009, 05:15 PM
We have a team coming home with 4 of 6 on the road! Including against the champs!

Time to start looking forward instead of backwards. Learn the lessons from this past weekend and move on.

TFCREDNWHITE
03-31-2009, 05:21 PM
We have a team coming home with 4 of 6 on the road! Including against the champs!

Time to start looking forward instead of backwards. Learn the lessons from this past weekend and move on.

Exactly!!

Workie
03-31-2009, 05:22 PM
We have a team coming home with 4 of 6 on the road! Including against the champs!

Time to start looking forward instead of backwards. Learn the lessons from this past weekend and move on.


Yea kick anyone filming. :D

mlsintoronto
03-31-2009, 05:32 PM
We have a team coming home with 4 of 6 on the road! Including against the champs!

Time to start looking forward instead of backwards. Learn the lessons from this past weekend and move on.

AMEN

jloome
03-31-2009, 05:39 PM
We have a team coming home with 4 of 6 on the road! Including against the champs!

Time to start looking forward instead of backwards. Learn the lessons from this past weekend and move on.

A healthy perspective.

I think, as the team ages, you'll see proactive communications from them to counter some of this stuff -- not because the team would ever want to wade in, but because the nature of media cutbacks is such that sensationalism is going to become more common, not less. Sometimes they'll simply have to send out a press release of relevant facts to put the issue in its proper context. This isn't a big enough deal to warrant that, which says something about the "incidents" themselves.

I'm writing a piece on this for tomorrow, just pointing out that it would be a lot less likely for media to draw such overblown conclusion if they were actually there to cover the event. That may seem self-evident, but in an era when coverage is being cut to the bone, it bares repeating that media who are grotesquely sensational or inaccurate inevitably cut off their nose to spite their face. Saving money on staff won't do you much good as a newspaper if no one trusts you enough to read it.

Blizzard
03-31-2009, 05:51 PM
He was interviewed by Rob Leth for the local. National may have used some segments of it, but I'm the one who sent Rob in Duane's direction.

Cool.

Boondaddy
03-31-2009, 05:52 PM
"that video" was just top story on CTV news sports with Lance Brown....

Waggy
03-31-2009, 05:56 PM
A healthy perspective.

I think, as the team ages, you'll see proactive communications from them to counter some of this stuff -- not because the team would ever want to wade in, but because the nature of media cutbacks is such that sensationalism is going to become more common, not less. Sometimes they'll simply have to send out a press release of relevant facts to put the issue in its proper context. This isn't a big enough deal to warrant that, which says something about the "incidents" themselves.

I'm writing a piece on this for tomorrow, just pointing out that it would be a lot less likely for media to draw such overblown conclusion if they were actually there to cover the event. That may seem self-evident, but in an era when coverage is being cut to the bone, it bares repeating that media who are grotesquely sensational or inaccurate inevitably cut off their nose to spite their face. Saving money on staff won't do you much good as a newspaper if no one trusts you enough to read it.


Awesome. Just awesome.

ensco
03-31-2009, 05:58 PM
A healthy perspective.

I think, as the team ages, you'll see proactive communications from them to counter some of this stuff -- not because the team would ever want to wade in, but because the nature of media cutbacks is such that sensationalism is going to become more common, not less. Sometimes they'll simply have to send out a press release of relevant facts to put the issue in its proper context. This isn't a big enough deal to warrant that, which says something about the "incidents" themselves.

I'm writing a piece on this for tomorrow, just pointing out that it would be a lot less likely for media to draw such overblown conclusion if they were actually there to cover the event. That may seem self-evident, but in an era when coverage is being cut to the bone, it bares repeating that media who are grotesquely sensational or inaccurate inevitably cut off their nose to spite their face. Saving money on staff won't do you much good as a newspaper if no one trusts you enough to read it.

Think of the money this group spends, just on away support. It's hundreds of thousands.

Somehow we need to get to a place where the supporters can support the journalists who know what they're doing. Ives, Ben, yourself, to name three. Clicks isn't enough.

loconet
03-31-2009, 06:04 PM
I caught a piece of an interview with Duane/Dwayne(?sp) from U-Sector on CBC this morning regarding this mess. He had some well thought out points, hopefully it helps clear this silliness a bit.

jloome
03-31-2009, 07:32 PM
Think of the money this group spends, just on away support. It's hundreds of thousands.

Somehow we need to get to a place where the supporters can support the journalists who know what they're doing. Ives, Ben, yourself, to name three. Clicks isn't enough.

Unfortunately, all three of us are rare in soccer coverage, in that we all actually have media training. And the cases of both Ives and myself we've worked for newspapers for years.

Most of the writers on this beat have minimal experience with complex news issues, and I'm including most of the specialty publications online. And unfortunately, I believe we're still some time from soccer in North America being big enough to profitably support its own daily outlet.

One thing people can do to help accuracy, though, is to politely write to those reporters with whom they disagree, and point out why. Politely is key; if you rant, they won't listen. If you point out mild factual errors that badly skewed a piece's them...well, they're as prone to lacking humility as most people nowadays, unfortunately, so they probably won't acquiesce. But they're also less likely to make the same mistake next time.

ensco
03-31-2009, 07:57 PM
Unfortunately, all three of us are rare in soccer coverage, in that we all actually have media training. And the cases of both Ives and myself we've worked for newspapers for years.

Most of the writers on this beat have minimal experience with complex news issues, and I'm including most of the specialty publications online. And unfortunately, I believe we're still some time from soccer in North America being big enough to profitably support its own daily outlet.

One thing people can do to help accuracy, though, is to politely write to those reporters with whom they disagree, and point out why. Politely is key; if you rant, they won't listen. If you point out mild factual errors that badly skewed a piece's them...well, they're as prone to lacking humility as most people nowadays, unfortunately, so they probably won't acquiesce. But they're also less likely to make the same mistake next time.

Understood.

My real point is that, for most people on here, what the papers are writing is pretty much stuff they already know, or misinformed drivel.

This is a huge issue for the FO. Our interests are unusually aligned on this. The coverage of TFC is hurting the acceptance/growth of the game/team.

Somehow the team and the supporters groups together need to identify the right people, like yourself. Who they work for is irrelevant. They could be on their own, like Ben or Ives, or work for a major outlet, like you. What do we care?

Together, somehow, the team and supporters funnel a few dollars to the selected journos (I haven't quite figured this rather critical part out yet!), say by subsidizing, or paying for, airfare to away games.

I think something along those lines has to happen. The current situation is untenable, for the supporters, for the team, and for the journos.

Manutd #1
03-31-2009, 09:10 PM
I have seen too many of these reports making it seem to people who weren't there that the TFC fans were hooligans, all i heard at work were stupid jokes like did u get in a fight, did you throw smoke bombs on the field. I was there yes there were like 10 people supporting BOTH teams who were acting stupid but like that is less then 1% it is so bad they are reporting on this shit when they werent there, you can see the guy who got tasered didn't deserve it, 9 cops one tfc supporter like wow. Real reporters who actually investigate stuff should look into the lack of security look at any real soccer stadium in the world supporters are seperated by cops/security and the away supporters leave like 20 mins after the home team to avoid fights, this is not the first trip it is time for the crew to wake up.

tfcmanu
03-31-2009, 09:22 PM
I have seen too many of these reports making it seem to people who weren't there that the TFC fans were hooligans, all i heard at work were stupid jokes like did u get in a fight, did you throw smoke bombs on the field. I was there yes there were like 10 people supporting BOTH teams who were acting stupid but like that is less then 1% it is so bad they are reporting on this shit when they werent there, you can see the guy who got tasered didn't deserve it, 9 cops one tfc supporter like wow. Real reporters who actually investigate stuff should look into the lack of security look at any real soccer stadium in the world supporters are seperated by cops/security and the away supporters leave like 20 mins after the home team to avoid fights, this is not the first trip it is time for the crew to wake up.

I heard it today ...Are u Alive...Are u In Jail...did you destroy there stadium..and the best one Are you a Hooligan my response watch Football factories if you don't know what a Hooligan is. LOL....:noidea:

Manutd #1
03-31-2009, 09:26 PM
football factories the mini series on the score was great, i think people should watch that and see what hooligans really are, which tfc fans are not except for liek 5 wannabes who they focus on. Is it me or is there no negative press about the fact that 3/4 of their police force was at a game with very little going on or the columbus fans who were causing trouble

tfcmanu
03-31-2009, 09:30 PM
It's funny how no mention of the Positive things, However bad media could make for good media TFC Fanatics love it.

Manutd #1
03-31-2009, 09:37 PM
yea like where was the mention of the fact that over 1500 people travelled on bus and in cars for over 7 hours to support the team they love, i mean where was the video of the majority of the people like myself who were talking to the crew fans, who for the most part were good people. Also i may be wrong but has anybody seen actual footage of good stuff like the great atmosphere or the newspaper thing?

jloome
03-31-2009, 09:42 PM
Understood.

My real point is that, for most people on here, what the papers are writing is pretty much stuff they already know, or misinformed drivel.

This is a huge issue for the FO. Our interests are unusually aligned on this. The coverage of TFC is hurting the acceptance/growth of the game/team.

Somehow the team and the supporters groups together need to identify the right people, like yourself. Who they work for is irrelevant. They could be on their own, like Ben or Ives, or work for a major outlet, like you. What do we care?

Together, somehow, the team and supporters funnel a few dollars to the selected journos (I haven't quite figured this rather critical part out yet!), say by subsidizing, or paying for, airfare to away games.

I think something along those lines has to happen. The current situation is untenable, for the supporters, for the team, and for the journos.

I see where you're going with this Ensco and it's admirable, but problematically, the only way to fund good journalism is by buying the product. You can't fund journalists directly in any way, as it immediately throws their objectivity into question.

In fact, that's what the junket circuit for promo and travel writing used to be: various states, towns and cities would pay journos to come write about them for travel pages. But the only people who'd be invited were the ones willing to never criticize, for fear of losing their free ticket. So their "critiques" of those locations became useless, because they weren't objective.

It's one of the reasons you pretty much never see a travel section in daily papers anymore. Papers won't pick up the bill themselves, because most are now owned by companies that have little to no interest in good journalism, and, quite the contrary, would rather have malleabale, compliant staff who'll write whatever they think benefits their other businesses.

Coupled with the lack of willingness to change the product to suit the market (the web) versus trying to change the market to suit the old product, it's one reason why half the newspapers out there won't exist in five years. The quality is gone, the public no longer sees an advantage over broadcast (which has always been crap) and they're simply no longer definitive, in any way.

james
03-31-2009, 09:45 PM
football factories the mini series on the score was great, i think people should watch that and see what hooligans really are, which tfc fans are not except for liek 5 wannabes who they focus on. Is it me or is there no negative press about the fact that 3/4 of their police force was at a game with very little going on or the columbus fans who were causing trouble

i must say whenever someone gets in trouble at a TFC game or gets in a fight people say they are wannabe hooligans. Thats kind of bullshit, sometimes people just get way to drunk and then shit happens even tho they might not of ment to. Or like when i was in Montreal the impact fans came running at me, so i got in a fight, but i wasnt the one who went looking for that fight. I dont know how this fight started in Columbus, i was there but i didnt even see this fight, i was off taking a piss or something. But seems Columbus came at us. What you exspect us to run away? difference between defending yourself and getting stuck in the middle then being a hooligan.

ensco
03-31-2009, 10:02 PM
I see where you're going with this Ensco and it's admirable, but problematically, the only way to fund good journalism is by buying the product. You can't fund journalists directly in any way, as it immediately throws their objectivity into question.

In fact, that's what the junket circuit for promo and travel writing used to be: various states, towns and cities would pay journos to come write about them for travel pages. But the only people who'd be invited were the ones willing to never criticize, for fear of losing their free ticket. So their "critiques" of those locations became useless, because they weren't objective.

It's one of the reasons you pretty much never see a travel section in daily papers anymore. Papers won't pick up the bill themselves, because most are now owned by companies that have little to no interest in good journalism, and, quite the contrary, would rather have malleabale, compliant staff who'll write whatever they think benefits their other businesses.

Coupled with the lack of willingness to change the product to suit the market (the web) versus trying to change the market to suit the old product, it's one reason why half the newspapers out there won't exist in five years. The quality is gone, the public no longer sees an advantage over broadcast (which has always been crap) and they're simply no longer definitive, in any way.

Yes it's true, I oversimplified the great issue in media and journalism.

If I paid you something to cover the team, and you told me to go to hell, I'd be honoured! But that's just me.

I guess we'll have to wait for the cybercash model. Where people pay a cent or two to read a story done by someone they respect. I know it's been the holy grail of the internet, and for a bunch of reasons has never happened.

These hooligan stories are a subset of a bigger problem. I just won't read TFC stories written by people that I know have no history with or knowledge of the sport.

Manutd #1
03-31-2009, 10:08 PM
i must say whenever someone gets in trouble at a TFC game or gets in a fight people say they are wannabe hooligans. Thats kind of bullshit, sometimes people just get way to drunk and then shit happens even tho they might not of ment to. Or like when i was in Montreal the impact fans came running at me, so i got in a fight, but i wasnt the one who went looking for that fight. I dont know how this fight started in Columbus, i was there but i didnt even see this fight, i was off taking a piss or something. But seems Columbus came at us. What you exspect us to run away? difference between defending yourself and getting stuck in the middle then being a hooligan.


When i say hooligans i am not talking about people defending themselves i am talking about the ones more that started it, like columbus idiots who had the nerve to come to the south section when they were winning like that is just stupid i wouldnt go into their section and expect to be greated with a hug. sorry should have clarified that earlier i totally agree with u

Rhapido
03-31-2009, 10:44 PM
I heard it today ...Are u Alive...Are u In Jail...did you destroy there stadium..and the best one Are you a Hooligan my response watch Football factories if you don't know what a Hooligan is. LOL....:noidea:

I loved how the hockey pucks at work who never showed any interest in talking TFC came running in to my office this morning to talk about TFC tazer-guy.

And let's not forget that a fan had to get tazered (allegedly) in order for the word "TFC" to appear over the front page pic. I mean, seriously, when was the last time TFC led on the Sun? Crappy paper - only redeeming quality is the SSG (and even there, they can't get it right most of the times). Glad I don't ever read/buy it.

james
03-31-2009, 11:13 PM
anyone find it kind of Ironic that Columbus fans have stupid T-Shirts that say HUDSON STREET HOOLIGANS yet TFC fans are the ones called the Hooligans from this weekend! :p

jloome
03-31-2009, 11:57 PM
anyone find it kind of Ironic that Columbus fans have stupid T-Shirts that say HUDSON STREET HOOLIGANS yet TFC fans are the ones called the Hooligans from this weekend! :p

Or that two of the three arrested (and as far as I know the only two charged) were both American. Not that that's any reflection Crew fans who, all the bullshit between us aside, were obviously no worse than our guys.

It's all perspective. It's a stupid nickname, because it personifies everything everyone involved claims to want to avoid, and perhaps they should change it, rather than gamely-but-naively assuming they'll be able to claim the word "hooligan" as something fun and jokey.

StandUpIfYouHateChelsea
04-01-2009, 12:12 AM
This day of shit News Shit Reporting is OLD Montreal wins they riot burn cars ect. and ..... nothing one minor fight at an away match and wham front page of the Shit Sun !:D

RedWookie
04-01-2009, 12:35 AM
taken from :http://www.thestar.com/sports/article/611015 (http://www.thestar.com/sports/article/611015)



Geoff Miller, the away game organizer for the Red Patch Boys, the best known of TFC's supporters groups, said "there's no doubt that it's a bit of a black and eye and it doesn't look good."
But he rejected suggestions that TFC fans were out of control.
"For the amount of fans and the amount of people that we had down there it was really, really minor," said Miller, who said he watched the post-game incidents from a railing above the ground.
Miller said problems began when security mixed TFC supporters, who had been in their own area of the stadium, and Columbus Crew fans together at the end of the game. A few Crew fans – "just trouble-makers" – came from one end of the stadium and started mingling with Toronto supporters.
"Of course, words go back and forth, people have had too much to drink" and then a fight broke out.
Miller said he saw one fight where a couple of punches were thrown and then the police jumped in. The fan being subdued by police thought he was being attacked by another fan – and fought back only to be Tasered.
"Now, people with cellphones and stuff they take a couple of things and the next thing it's on the Internet and it gets blown way out of proportion," Miller said.
Miller said he bought about 1,000 tickets for the game that were given to TFC supporter groups. That means up to 1,000 others had no club affiliation but asked to be seated with those from Toronto.
"Ninety nine per cent of those guys were all fantastic as well," Miller said. "But it's that 1 per cent that has too much to drink or thinks that the proper way to support is by getting in fights.
"Anybody who spends any amount of time on any supporters groups' websites will find out very quickly when the members are talking, that that stuff is shunned.
"We travel so much and the last thing we want to do is walk into a stadium or a situation where it's going to turn into a fight."


nicely done man.

ginkster88
04-01-2009, 12:37 AM
This day of shit News Shit Reporting is OLD Montreal wins they riot burn cars ect. and ..... nothing one minor fight at an away match and wham front page of the Shit Sun !:D

A very good point. I remember the Edmonton and Montreal riots being pointed to as evidence for how awesome hockey was because we're so goddamned passionate in the playoffs.

If TFC fans tore up the downtown there would be calls to fold the club.